VNTR Polymorphism of the DRD4 Locus in Different Pakistani Ethnic Groups. Genet Test. 2008 Jun;12(2):299-304. Mansoor. Et. Al
“The Mohanna have been included in such a study for the very first time. This ethnic group resides in the Sindh province (NOTE FROM EVERGREEN: This is the Indus Valley region…i.e. Mohenjo-Darro, etc.), and their livelihood is fishing; in fact, the word Mohanna in Sindhi means fishermen. Not much is known about this population, but it is believed that the Mohanna were the original inhabitants of the subcontinent, who were then replaced by the Aryans, when they invaded this area. However, little pockets of this ethnic group were left over after the Aryan invasion. In Pakistan this pocket exists in the south around the river Indus, where the Mohanna presently reside.”
“Mohanna grouped with the Ethiopian Jews (Falaasha), Biaka, Somali, and the Mbuti.”
“Although the Mohanna share the seven-repeat allele with the Dravidians, the multidimensional scaling analysis does not place Mohanna close to the Dravidian population, thus precluding any common ancestry between these two groups…”
“Multidimensional scaling analysis places the Mohanna close to the African data of Chang et. al. (1996) and the Somali data obtained in the current study.”
Evergreen Writes:
Crucianni notes E3b1-delta cluster in Pakistan. The evidence from the Early Mehrgarh Neolithic is indicative of a spread from SW Asia (Natufians?).
mentu Member # 14537
posted
Mohanna grouped with the Ethiopian Jews (Falaasha), Biaka, Somali, and the Mbuti.”
“Although the Mohanna share the seven-repeat allele with the Dravidians, the multidimensional scaling analysis does not place Mohanna close to the Dravidian population, thus precluding any common ancestry between these two groups…”
------------------------------------ This is very interesting,
A final proof of the ethiopia stretching from africa to the Indus valley that ancients spoke of?
Evergreen, any more information on the 'age' of these african haplotypes i.e when they were introduced introduced from africa?
Ausarian. Member # 14778
posted VNTR Polymorphism of the DRD4 Locus in Different
... Not much is known about this population, but it is believed that the Mohanna were the original inhabitants of the subcontinent, who were then replaced by the Aryans, when they invaded this area...
“Mohanna grouped with the Ethiopian Jews (Falaasha), Biaka, Somali, and the Mbuti.”
“Although the Mohanna share the seven-repeat allele with the Dravidians, the multidimensional scaling analysis does not place Mohanna close to the Dravidian population, thus precluding any common ancestry between these two groups…”
“Multidimensional scaling analysis places the Mohanna close to the African data of Chang et. al. (1996) and the Somali data obtained in the current study.”
At this state, there's mot much to work with here, given that:
— this study seems to focus on a single marker [DRD4 gene] located on the short arm of chromosome no. 11, which is a...
— 7 repeat-allele shared between the Mohanna and the Dravidians, while the...
— Multidimensional scale clusters the former with the African samples,...
And given that the Mohanna are believed to be:
— "the original inhabitants of the subcontinent, who were then replaced by the Aryans".
One can assume that the 7-tandem repeat allele itself is of limited use herein, as it could be one that was attained from a distant common ancestor as opposed to the most recent common one.
This then begs the questions:
What variables entailed the multidimensional scaling, which allowed identification of sharper differences between the the Mohanna and the Dravidians, than between the Mohanna and the said African groups?
Do the said African groups bear the very same 7-repeat allele?
Would the Y chromosome and mitochondrial markers reflect the results of the multidimensional scaling...or will they simply tell us, like the 7-repeat allele, that the Mohanna and Dravidians derive from a common distant ancestral source, but not necessarily the most recent common one?
What can be said for certain at this point—i.e. without additional material, is that relying on a singular bi-parental marker is of little informational value.
xyyman Member # 13597
posted
Maybe we can stay focused and keep the discussion civil. . Yonis/Habari
quote:Originally posted by Evergreen: Evergreen Posts:
VNTR Polymorphism of the DRD4 Locus in Different Pakistani Ethnic Groups. Genet Test. 2008 Jun;12(2):299-304. Mansoor. Et. Al
“The Mohanna have been included in such a study for the very first time. This ethnic group resides in the Sindh province (NOTE FROM EVERGREEN: This is the Indus Valley region…i.e. Mohenjo-Darro, etc.), and their livelihood is fishing; in fact, the word Mohanna in Sindhi means fishermen. Not much is known about this population, but it is believed that the Mohanna were the original inhabitants of the subcontinent, who were then replaced by the Aryans, when they invaded this area. However, little pockets of this ethnic group were left over after the Aryan invasion. In Pakistan this pocket exists in the south around the river Indus, where the Mohanna presently reside.”
“Mohanna grouped with the Ethiopian Jews (Falaasha), Biaka, Somali, and the Mbuti.”
“Although the Mohanna share the seven-repeat allele with the Dravidians, the multidimensional scaling analysis does not place Mohanna close to the Dravidian population, thus precluding any common ancestry between these two groups…”
“Multidimensional scaling analysis places the Mohanna close to the African data of Chang et. al. (1996) and the Somali data obtained in the current study.”
Evergreen Writes:
Crucianni notes E3b1-delta cluster in Pakistan. The evidence from the Early Mehrgarh Neolithic is indicative of a spread from SW Asia (Natufians?).
Is there access to this article on-line?
.
Ausarian. Member # 14778
posted
^Not without subscription or a password...the downside to most new publications. At any rate, there are obviously more markers involved, in association with the locus in question; it simply has to be the case, or else little makes sense.
xyyman Member # 13597
posted
I downloaded the paper.. . on another PC. Will upload in a few days when I am that PC, that' where I got the chart from.
xyyman Member # 13597
posted
Figured how to remotely get the file. . .here it is
Maybe the experts can break this down for us less knowledgeable. Sounds to me they are saying that this Indian ethnic group are closely related, genetically, to the East Africans.
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: I downloaded the paper.. . on another PC. Will upload in a few days when I am that PC, that' where I got the chart from.
xyyman Member # 13597
posted
Pages 1 and 2. 3-6 to come
Ausarian. Member # 14778
posted
— The authors note the obvious hint of selective pressure acting on this locus, as made apparent from the fact that the 4-repeat allele appears to be the most frequent in all populations examined, to be followed by the 2-repeat and/or the 7-repeat allele.
— It appears that the Mohanna share a particularly high frequency of the 7-repeat allele with the Dravidian speaking groups, as the second most frequent intra-ethnic allele, when compared to other groups in and around the Indian sub-continent. But stronger heterozygosity likely accounts for Dravidians clustering with other Indian and Eurasian groups, than the case is for the Mohanna.
— Notwithstanding that the Mohanna cluster closer to the African groups, it appears to be relatively closer to the "hunter-gatherer" groups of central Africa [Biaka and Mbuti] and southern Africa ["Bushmen"], along with east African groups ["Falasha" and Somali], than the undesignated "Bantu" groups; this falls in line with the notion that a segment of African population migrated from the east corner of the continent to inhabit Eurasia prior to the divergence of the PN2 clade into sister clades - E3a and E3b. The Mohanna, according to the authors' multidimensional plot, seems to be relatively closer to the "Falasha" and the "Bushmen" [with the "Bushman" slightly further to the right on the horizontal cord.] — which likely contain some deep clade-bearing elements found in the Biaka and Mbuti — than the other African groups, indicating that Mohanna likely derived from a population "temporally" intermediate between the deepest-clade groups and the DE [PN2 clade, probably up to the M35 mutation sans E3a (M2)] groups. As I said, the Y-DNA and mtDNA should prove to be interesting, given what this study reveals to us about this Indian group.
xyyman Member # 13597
posted
Sounds like you are saying that the Mohanna are further apart geneticaly than the so called Bantu E3a and East Africans E3b. So they are as African as any other groups that left the continent prior to the brother clades (E3a and E3b) split.
Ausarian. Member # 14778
posted
quote:xyyman writes:
Sounds like you are saying that the Mohanna are further apart geneticaly than the so called Bantu E3a and East Africans E3b.
^Not quite; since I don't really know what the Y-DNA study will reveal, as noted. But based on the clustering-nature of the single locus analysis, it raises the very likelihood that they derived from a group which fitted in between the deepest-clade lineages and the then *newly emergent* DE lineage. It could well be that they are YAP carriers, who could turn out to be positioned somewhere between the rare African haplotype DE [lacking known downstream mutations] and the downstream lineages of both the Hg D carriers in south-east Asia and the Hg E carriers in Africa. Or, it could turn out, that they are M168 carriers; the same could be true of Hg CF (P 143). Given that the Bantu-speaking groups are overwhelming characterized by the M2/P1 clade [E3a; or now supposedly called Hg E1b1a], and given the Mohanna's somewhat sharper polarization away from the Bantu-designated sample, relative to the other mentioned African groups, the indication here is that the Mohanna very likely derived from a population that left the continent prior to the divergence(s) of E1b1a (E3a) and possibly E1b1b (E3b). Only actual Y-DNA tests on this group will tell us this for sure.
posted 
