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Theophile Obenga's "Negro-Egyptian" linguistic phylum
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Amun-Ra The Ultimate: [QB] What is important to understand is that languages are usually not spread by a single lineage but by populations which are usually composed of many different lineages (for example, many different SNPs, many different STR alleles). African people are the people with the greatest genetic diversity in the world. [QUOTE]Originally posted by Swenet: What multi-disciplinary evidence is there for Negro-Egyptian? We know all pristine Afro-Asiatic speakers (including relict and at times excluded Omotic speakers) had/have a group of NRY E-M35 and mtDNA M1 sublineage carriers as their [b]signature[/b] common ancestors, so we know they descent from the same proto-language speaking community at some point in the terminal pleistocene. [/QUOTE]That's certainly a strange way to look at things. The genetic distance between people who speak languages derived from the Negro-Egyptian phylum is much shorter than between Semitic speakers and African Cushitic and Chadic speakers (that is the "Afro" branch of the debunked Afro-Asiatic language phylum). Only Berbers and Semites are closer to each other probably due to recent (7th Century Muslim conquest) or past back migration. You can refer for example to the Tishkoff study on STR for example or the DNA tribes SNPs distance tree. Those trees are not like haplogroups which use only one SNP (very tributary to "recent" or past genetic drift) but on the contrary use multiple SNPs (or STRs): [IMG]http://i1079.photobucket.com/albums/w513/Amunratheultimate/Misc/EucledianDistanceTreeofGeneticWorldRegions.jpg[/IMG] People who speaks the Negro-Egyptian languages are those from the labelled "Sub-Saharan African" groupings (even if many of them actually live in North Africa and the Sahara). People who speaks the Semitic language are those from the groups labelled "North Africa" and "Arabian". So the genetic basis for the Negro-Egyptian language phylum is solid. [QUOTE] We know all Afro-Asiatic speakers have/had specific cultural traits like henotheism in common. We know the Berber language is strongly correlated with NRY E-M81, which branches off the same Y chromosome that unites all Afrasan speakers (E-M35). We know Afrasan speakers have words for specific inventions like grindstones in common. [/QUOTE]All speakers of Negro-Egyptian languages also have in common traditional religion practices. For example, Ancient Egyptian and African Traditional religions are very much similar. They are too many common cultural trait to name but we can note the presence of Headrest in all Negro-Egyptian descendant populations. From the Somali to the Zulu passing by the Yoruba and the Beja including Ancient Egyptians of course. Yes, E-M35 and E-M78 are ancient African haplogroups (while E-M81 is recent in Berbers and is mostly limited to them) which then spread in Africa and some neighboring places around the world. That is they are SNPs (single nucleotide events) which happened in Africa among speakers descendants of the Negro-Egyptian languages. Many of them were E-P2. E-P2 is the most dominant Y-Chromosome lineage in Africa and exists at lower frequencies in the Middle East and Europe. It combined and is ancestral to both E-M2 and E-m35(E-M78). It's also important to note that ancestral E-M35(E-M78) are present in Nilo-Saharan speaking people for example (even if that fact is only skimmed over by Cruciani with the 'Nilo-Saharan from Kenya' with their 16.7% frequency of the M-35 mutation (11.1+5.6) ( [URL=http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1181964/]ref. Table 1[/URL] ). Also note in the same table the presence of the E-M35* paragroup in South African !kung, Khwe and Bantu populations. Since they have no E-M78 in their population they likely acquired the M35 mutation within a population which didn't have the M78 mutation yet. A population close to the E-P2* who just got introduced the M35 mutation. The Khwe got the highest frequency of E-M35* haplogroup in the world. Obviously none of the Kenyan Nilo-Saharans or the South Africans were from the former Afro-Asiatic family. Even more significantly: [IMG]http://i1079.photobucket.com/albums/w513/Amunratheultimate/Misc/PhylogeneticdistributionoftheY-chromosomehaplotypesandtheirfrequenciesin15sudanesehassan2008phylo.jpg[/IMG] From [URL=http://www.researchgate.net/publication/5233268_Y-chromosome_variation_among_Sudanese_restricted_gene_flow_concordance_with_language_geography_and_history/file/d912f5059afde691ca.pdf]Y-Chromosome Variation Among Sudanese (Hassan 2008)[/URL] The whole graph is interesting but you can note among other things that Masalit and Fur people have some of the highest frequency of E-M35 (E-M215+E-M78 on the graph). Masalit got a frequency of 72% (23/32) and the Fur got 59% (19/32). Easily some of the highest frequencies of M35 in the world!! You can also note that Masalit and Fur don't have much "foreign" haplogroup such as J. So they derive their M35 directly from the ancestral population in which the M35 mutation was birth. They are not admixed. Obviously the fact that the Masalit and Fur are not admixed can easily be seen visually as well. They look like typical un-admixed black African people (they are Nilo-Saharans). In comparison, Semitic speakers like Bedouins got only 10.7% of M35, Omanite 7.7%, United Emirate Arab 7.3% (taken from Table 1). Bedouins and United Emirate Arab even got 3.6% and 7.3% respectively of E(xE3b) (E excluding E3b). Pale in comparaison of the Masalit 72% of the M35 mutation. Obviously all those haplogroups trees and analysis derived from them always changes when new samples and populations are added (even site of origin changes). A fact noted by Cruciani in the above study (see the conclusion to the introduction). At the moment they are based on too few ethnic groups and sample size. The Masalit and Fur example (ignored by Cruciani) is a prime example. Many more important ethnic groups (for population structure study) may be ignored yet as well. Hopefully this will change in the future. [QUOTE] What are such fundamental, unlikely to have been acquired by simple borrowing/liaisons, but rather, common ancestry indicating multi-disciplinary unifying traits within ''Negro-Egyptian''? [/QUOTE]All the contrary, the linguistic analysis and the archaeological analysis (which I posted a graph before) demonstrate that all Negro-Egyptian languages comes from Sudan and neighboring area. The genetic analysis show that they have a short genetic distance between one another (compared to Semitic and Chadic/Cushitic speakers). They are from the E and E-P2 haplogroups. Which can be found elsewhere in the world in lower frequency but is mainly found in Africa among Negro-Egyptian speakers. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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