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Of course there were 'Horner' pharaohs
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by tropicals redacted: [QB] @cass [QUOTE] I think that is a silly answer. You just have to look at regions at the same latitude (e.g. India) to get the range of clinal pigmentation there: most Egyptians would be light brown in Lower Egypt while grading into a medial brown and dark brown/black in Upper Egypt and Nubia. [/QUOTE]In Lower Egypt, do you mean light brown like some of the Amhara behind this link? https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=amhara&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=tZkFVPD2IOOy7AbwmIGYBg&sqi=2&ved=0CAYQ_AUoAQ&biw=849&bih=550 Do we need to remember that most of the country is demarcated as Upper Egypt, and that most of the ancient population lived in the Valley? Hence Keita's use of the term modal throughout most of the country? [QUOTE] They are 'black' or 'black african' in modern folk race taxonomy. That is what I thought you meant. [/QUOTE]It was, yes. [QUOTE] I think there is a quote that says something like "if ancient egyptians are to categorized in modern social race theory, they would be black africans". Keita has made that point also. I don't disagree at all. [/QUOTE]Where did Keita say that? Regarding the other quote you mentioned on social categorization, I think you might mean this one: Dr Stuart Tyson Smith The Oxford Encyclopedia of Ancient Egypt Vol 3 (2001) ed Donald Redford “Far from being absolute, genetic traits are distributed in clines, or continuously varying distributions of traits inconsistent with racial categories. Modern physical anthropology has demonstrated that 94 percent of human variation is found within human populations, rather than between the major populations traditionally labelled races. Biological characteristics affected by natural selection, migration, or drift are distributed in geographic gradations. These encompass all the features used to define racial physical “phenotypes,” including facial form, hair texture, blood type, and epidermal melanin (the chemical determining darkness of skin). These physical features cross alleged racial boundaries as if they were non-existent, leading to the inevitable conclusion that there are no biological races, just clines. Physical anthropologists are increasingly concluding that racial characteristics are the culturally defined product of selective perception and should be replaced in biological terms by the study of populations and clines. Consequently, any characterization of the race of the ancient Egyptians depends on modern cultural definition, not scientific study. [b]Thus, by modern American standards, it is reasonable to characterize the Egyptians as “black,” while acknowledging the scientific evidence for the physical diversity of Africans”[/b](p28). [QUOTE] The lay-person's concept of race takes no notice of clines. You just have tick-boxes that are 'white', 'black', etc. Egyptians are obviously 'black', they're not white of course, but this is socially constructed, not science at all. [/QUOTE]True, but then as Lioness points out: [QUOTE] I'm not sure if most Americans would call this Indian man "a black man" although they might say he had black skin if asked what color he was Nevertheless if such terms like 'black'and 'white' are unscientific is applying terms like "caucasian" or "negroid" or "mongoloid" to the above man obsolete scientifically ? [/QUOTE]^ [/QB][/QUOTE]
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