"Quick snippet from a paper that will be presented this July at the Society for Molecular Biology and Evolution Conference 2016. Thanks to Matt for posting at Eurogenes.
"The genomic enigma of two Medieval North Africans"
"Both individuals – which represent the first ancient genome sequence data from North Africa – do not exhibit particular genetic affinities to modern North Africans or any other present-day population in published genotype data sets despite relatively extensive data has been produced from many areas of Africa. In fact, the most parsimonious way to model them genetically is as two-source admixture between Mediterranean Europeans and Southern Africans." Let me break this down. Two medieval genomes of North Africa are not immediately akin to Berbers. They appear to be a mixture of something Khoisan-like and something Southern Europe, Mediterranean-like.*
The authors interpret this in the most parsimonious way (at least from the abstract), that the Barbary-Moorish slave trade could have brought together these individuals' ancestries.
But...!
"Both individuals could represent a Medieval African population without population continuity to modern-day populations"
The original inhabitants of the Saharan Early Neolithic 'wet phase' are generally called 'Roundheads' after their abundant rock art. These people inhabited a landscape and an ecology very similar to those of modern San-Khoisan peoples and their theorized ancient domains. Given that fact, I'd expect these people to be more similar to Khoi people than to Pygmy or West African peoples.
Modern San-Khoisan also have Southern Europe (Mediterranean)* admixture somewhere between 14% or more and I'll link to some recent articles below.
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Dawadu of Algiers Oasis?
Swenet Member # 17303
posted
Interesting choice of words. In the context of the absence of modern genomes with similar affinity, they say the following:
"the most parsimonious way to model them . . . ."
They seem to indicate that these genomes aren't consistent with a simple and recent admixture event between a San and EEF-like population. Could it be that these genomes reflect ancestry from an ancient San offshoot that only preserves a distant relationship to modern day San ancestry? Just like southeast African hunter gatherers like the Hadza have very ancient San-like ancestry?
DD'eDeN Member # 21966
posted
I can't say, not knowing at the detailed level.
With +100,000 years of nomadic hunting and gathering, they went everywhere, but the traces of their (genetic, archeological) footsteps show up only in isolated areas and in surprising mixtures in modern folk.
That both the Berbers (19th c war) and KhoiSan use poison arrows might show a past link.
beyoku Member # 14524
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Nice. Sudan and Eritrea do have L0d.
xyyman Member # 13597
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Don't you people get it? Modern west Africans are new to to West Africa. I have been posting on this for YEARS!!!!! Berbers are one of the Oldest Africans after Khoi-San and Pygmies. San ancestry will be found as far as North Africa. Keep in mind y-DNA haplogroup A is also found in Berbers.
Swenet Member # 17303
posted
quote:Originally posted by Xxyman: Keep in mind y-DNA haplogroup A is also found in Berbers.
^If that's what the data ends up pointing to, Clyde Winters deserves some kudos as well for some of his observations. Let's wait and see what this data has to say.
Swenet Member # 17303
posted
One of the first people I thought of other than Clyde when I read the OP. I don't agree with everything he says but Maju has commented on this before:
quote:Notice please that the South Moroccan component is extremely distant to all (Eurasians and Africans alike). I will speculate (as I have done before seeing this) that this component, now almost only restricted to Southern Morocco and heavily admixed, is a residue of the Aterian period and is related to a vaguely “Khoisanid” or equally vaguely “Mongoloid” phenotype found in the region. Component apportions (numerical) at K=11:
posted
Aye... This kinda supports my theory of there being a small number of Northwest Africans, but still NORTHWEST AFRICANS carrying haplogroup A. I believe people in this field should touch base on this.
I never believed the people who created the Aterian culture just vanished without a trace. They were most likely absorbed by migrating people from Eurasia carrying U6 who they were then absorbed by people from East Africa i.e the proto Berbers.
To me this makes sense. Good find op.
beyoku Member # 14524
posted
I remember C-Bass had an audio presentation that talked about ancient remains in North Africa that looked related to Khoisan based on dental analysis.
It was in French. I don't speak French.
xyyman Member # 13597
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google translator......?
beyoku Member # 14524
posted
quote:Originally posted by xyyman: google translator......?
Google Translator can translate Audio? That would be interesting.
Swenet Member # 17303
posted
In my memory that was Asar, not C Bass. I could be wrong, though (or they both could have referenced the same data). I remember the details of the supposed San affinity to certain North Africans (Egyptians[?]) because I emailed the professor in question.
xyyman Member # 13597
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Iphone or android translator apps?
Ish Gebor Member # 18264
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: Iphone or android translator apps?
Google translate. It's in the app-store.
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
quote:Originally posted by BlessedbyHorus: [QB] Aye... This kinda supports my theory of there being a small number of Northwest Africans, but still NORTHWEST AFRICANS carrying haplogroup A. I believe people in this field should touch base on this.
various groups of Southern Sudanese, Dinka, Nuba and others have high frequencies of Haplogroup A
DD'eDeN Member # 21966
posted
DD'eDeN: "That both the Berbers (19th c war) and KhoiSan use poison arrows might show a past link. "
Bone artefacts suggest early adoption of poison-tipped arrow technology in Eastern Africa 17.6.16
Researchers studying bone artefacts discovered in the Kuumbi Cave, Zanzibar, have found evidence to suggest that bone tools were used for hunting, and even as poison arrow tips: bone technology was a central element to the Kuumbi Cave¹s inhabitants over 13 ka. Archaeological Research in Africa <http://dx.doi.org/10.1080/0067270X.2016.1173302>
Bone technology (e.g. arrow tips) was essential to a Stone Age man¹s lifestyle, and has been shown to have been in use 60 ka. The majority of the evidence to support this has been found in sites in S-Africa, but now the artefacts found in the Kuumbi Cave show that this technology was being adopted in E-Africa as well.
Ish Gebor Member # 18264
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^ This technology was fundamental for later coming technologies. Early ritual knifes, weaponry etc... I think most underestimate the importance of this. Back then it was cream of the crop.
mena7 Member # 20555
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The Grimaldi people were Khoisan who live in prehistoric Europe and North Africa
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