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[QUOTE]Originally posted by the lioness,: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Clyde Winters: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Ish Gebor: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by the lioness,: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Ish Gebor: [qb] Clyde, The chart from above by ISOGG is based on older data, not the younger data. [/qb][/QUOTE]What Clyde likes to do is if he doesn't like current information he goes digging in outdated data, articles when the data was brand new and not well understood. That way he can add the "Winter's Spin" However as you point out this is 2017 not 2010 and genetic discoveries have been made since 2010 and they have to update the phylogenetic sequence to reflect reality. [/qb][/QUOTE]I think what Clyde is doing is comparison of old and new data. How it sometimes contradicts, changes or expands. [/qb][/QUOTE]You are correct. For example R-M207 in Africa is given new nomenclatures every time you see new studies, to make it appear that R-M207 is only found in Europe. We have already noted how ISOGG 2010, listed V45 as the same as M207. Interestingly, Scozzari, R., Massaia, A., D’Atanasio, E., Myres, N. M., Perego, U. A., Trombetta, B., & Cruciani, F. (2012). Molecular Dissection of the Basal Clades in the Human Y Chromosome Phylogenetic Tree. PLoS ONE, 7(11), e49170, http://doi.org/10.1371/journal.pone.0049170, notes that another former M207 clade in Cameroon is now named V69 or R1b1a4, as noted in Table S1 (SUPPLEMENT). [/qb][/QUOTE]The oldest human remains carrying haplogroup R are 24,000 years old and located in Siberia, it doesn't mater what number they assign it. R is much more diverse in Eurasia and not only is R1b included there but R1a and R2. The mutations of V88 which are V8, V35, V69, V7 are in a very limited area of Africa. Your video says V88 is 9,200 years old. Where is that figure from, not an even 9,000 but more particular, 9,200. It is from the article by the man who discovered it Fulvio Cruciani [QUOTE] The R-V88 coalescence time was estimated at 9200–5600 kya, in the early mid Holocene. --Human Y chromosome haplogroup R-V88: a paternal genetic record of early mid Holocene trans-Saharan connections and the spread of Chadic languages. Fulvio Cruciani [/QUOTE]So you are getting the figure from Cruciani as referenced by ISOGG. They didn't do the primary research. It was Cruciani. But you didn't reference the source of that date. Additionally it said "9200–5600 kya" meaning they don't know if it's 9,200 years old or 5,600 years old or somewhere in that range. But you want it to be as old as possible so you left that part out and say this newly discovered haplogroup is 9,200 years old as if it's written in stone That is the like of what you routinely. You only pick out information that confirms what you already believe, what you want to believe and if the you don't like all the current information you go back to older information paste that on and play the semantics game and mix old with new to match your preconceived propaganda aka "The Winter's Spin" [/QB][/QUOTE]
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