Not sure the source but URL includes "british museum"
Earthenware, fragment from the palace of Tell el-Yahoudiyeh, in the Nile delta, reign of Rameses III (1184–1153 BC, 20th Dynasty). Louvre Museum 120
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: ^ Wasn't this discussed before?
somewhat at that 2016 link, but I had another thread like this one, with a lot more images so I'm replicating that one. The one you linked was about one item here, how it was labeled differently by different sources. This thread is for just showing good versions of as many of these tiles as possible for future reference or for people who have not seen certain ones
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
Note how some of the Asiatics men either wear head bands or kippas/yamakas.
Hittite prisoner with kippa
As for the men who wear the stranded headdress, some of them are Philistines while others are Shashu. Which is which?
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
You might read some are "Philistines" but that is just guessing and that would also have to coordinate to an Egyptian word, a name for a group.
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wiki:
Philistines
Egyptian sources name one of these implicated Sea Peoples as the pwrꜣsꜣtj, generally transliterated as either Peleset or Pulasti. Following the Sea Peoples' defeat, Ramesses III allegedly relocated a number of the pwrꜣsꜣtj to southern Canaan, as recorded in an inscription from his funerary temple in Medinet Habu,[16] and the Great Harris Papyrus.
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wiki:
Peleset
Today, historians generally identify the Peleset with the Philistines, or rather, vice versa.[5] The origins of the Peleset, like much of the Sea Peoples, are not universally agreed upon - with that said, scholars have generally concluded that the bulk of the clans originated in the greater Southern European area, including western Asia Minor, the Aegean, and the islands of the Mediterranean.[6] Fellow Sea Peoples clans have likewise been identified with various Mediterranean polities, to varying acceptance: the Ekwesh with the Achaens, the Denyen with the Danaans, the Lukka with the Lycians, the Shekelesh with the Sicels, the Sherden with the Sardinians, etc. The geographical confluence of the Sea Peoples' origins in the Aegean area implies the Peleset had similar origins.
Philistine Bichrome pottery Furthering an identification of the Peleset as the Philistines are the Biblical description of the people hailing from Caphtor, generally identified as Crete, and the presence of a distinctly Mycenean ceramic culture found at numerous Philistine archaeology sites.[7] Likewise, a 2019 genetic study performed on a number of skeletons uncovered in a Philistine cemetery in Ascalon found that the city's early Iron Age population was genetically distinct from the local Semitic-speaking Levantine population due to a European-related admixture; this genetic signal became undetectable in the later Iron Age as interbreeding and assimilation of these individuals reached its natural conclusion. According to the authors, the admixture was likely due to a "gene flow from a European-related gene pool" during the Bronze to Iron Age transition, which supports the theory that a migration event occurred.[8]
Older sources sometimes identify the Peleset with the Pelasgians. However, this identification has numerous problems and is usually disregarded by modern scholars. A major issue is the etymological difficulties of the "g" in "Pelasgians" becoming a "t" in the Egyptian translation, especially as the Philistine endonym already corresponded to the form P-L-S-T and therefore required no such modification to be rendered as Peleset in the Egyptian language.[9]
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the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
Not related to this I have also noticed that in the garments of some of them are large circles but some figures have a particular pattern, diamonds mixed with plus-like crosses.
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
^ I think the Peleset are darker-skinned with chin tuft only while the Shashu are lighter with full beards.
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
dotted collars
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: ^ I think the Peleset are darker-skinned with chin tuft only while the Shashu are lighter with full beards.
your previous post shows a Nubian and we see his legs kneeling below. The black glaze has entirely fallen off part of his nose and we see the raw ceramic.
Now before that I posted two figures they both have a very similar yellow cross and a tunic patterns of red and bluish grey diamonds. I think the figure at left looking pale white skinned may just be a result of a skin color glaze that has entirely fallen off, probably a reddish brown. His features look broad as well
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Similarly I am not certain that the upper left figure was pale like that either. Maybe he was brown like the figure to his right with virtually the same hairstyle Or perhaps that yellow color on the lower left. His light color hair also looks like it could have lost color, the whole piece looks like much of the color of the head have fallen off or removed in some way
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti:
Note how some of the Asiatics men either wear head bands or kippas/yamakas.
Do you think they could be ancestors of Hebrews or is a cap like that not particular enough to consider that? Time period is 1186–1155 BC
also comparatively Asiatic foreigners visiting Khnumhotep II circa 1900 BC thought to be Hyksos at Beni Hasan, not looking similar, around 700 years earlier
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
^ This is why 'Asiatics' were themselves diverse comprising many ethne and tribes. As for the kippa, it seemed to be a common headdress among various groups including the Hittites so I think the Hebrews would be just one group among them.
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