quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:
Everything everybody posts is cherry picked. What
a ridiculous phrase. Nobody posts total randomly
selected photo essays. The sources of the images
themselves were cherry picking.

Tell you what. Why don't we try this.

Post images of supposedly white vs non-white Egyptians.

No doubles or repeats of the same image from different angles.

Lte's see how far white supporters can get before they run short.

Of course this exercise is only for those truly interested in such roorag.

That's why other than broaching the thread I won't participate.

AE is so obviously overwhelmingly black founded and populated.

I love black cherry wishniak. I love cherry cola.
Heh heh hah hah ha ha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

---

lol Mi gone to get a plate of food, a coupla coconut water, and some popcorn (for when food is done and this gets really good)- you want some?

oh, and I have some black cake left you're welcome to some of that (you know what that is?), if Brada doesn't come in here and see I have some and beat you to it, lol

dwbcl...this is gonna be good...
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
This site is already like an endless chessboard of dead Egyptians! You really want more of the same? Get a life! Anyway more archaeology survives in the south, both because the north continued to be more populous, so more stone was recycled, and because the north is wetter, so wooden and papyrus objects have survived less well. The north coast has also been prone to destructive earthquakes, and there has been more intensive farming in the Delta. Due to these conditions, the probability is that more dark images will have survived.

Also it would be stupid as we have dark and light images of the same individual, and there is no guarantee any of them were done from life before the time of the Fayum portraits. All they can do is give a general picture.
 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:
Everything everybody posts is cherry picked. What
a ridiculous phrase. Nobody posts total randomly
selected photo essays. The sources of the images
themselves were cherry picking.

Tell you what. Why don't we try this.

Post images of supposedly white vs non-white Egyptians.

No doubles or repeats of the same image from different angles.

Lte's see how far white supporters can get before they run short.

Of course this exercise is only for those truly interested in such roorag.

That's why other than broaching the thread I won't participate.

AE is so obviously overwhelmingly black founded and populated.

I love black cherry wishniak. I love cherry cola.
Heh heh hah hah ha ha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
This site is already like an endless chessboard of dead Egyptians! You really want more of the same? Get a life! Anyway more archaeology survives in the south, both because the north continued to be more populous, so more stone was recycled, and because the north is wetter, so wooden and papyrus objects have survived less well. The north coast has also been prone to destructive earthquakes, and there has been more intensive farming in the Delta. Due to these conditions, the probability is that more dark images will have survived.

Also it would be stupid as we have dark and light images of the same individual, and there is no guarantee any of them were done from life before the time of the Fayum portraits. All they can do is give a general picture.

---

 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
It would be a ridiculous and pointless exercise, pitting dead Egyptian against dead Egyptian. One thing's predictable, they'd average out looking like the average modern Egyptian.
 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
alTakruri has turned into Mike111
 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Here I'll begin first. Old Kingdom only and not some endless spamfest of tomb paintings of Egyptian slaves.


 

---

Posted by alTakruri (Member # 10195) on :
 
WatsonIsPleased already concedes defeat
but will it stop with its white Med AE bs?
 

---

Posted by alTakruri (Member # 10195) on :
 
Oops, I don't see a name or provenance my sweet
and you don't lay down any rules in my thread
I'm the ace boon coon head nigger in charge.

Also label as white, black, colored, clear, ...

Evah boddee haf fun. Bye kids. See yez next week.

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Here I'll begin first. Old Kingdom only and not some endless spamfest of tomb paintings of Egyptian slaves.

---

 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
HAHAHAAHHAAH!!!

Some body is feeling the heat!!! From day one you come here with Cherry picked images and seem to have no problem stating with fact that the images you have represent Ancient Egypt, Now all of a sudden its "a General picture", now all of a sudden you want to question the validity..LOL. What a clown.

Sum Bawdy is Chicken!!! Bawk Bawk!!

HAHAHAHAHA!!!

Ill start first Rahotep, and keep going until you admit defeat!!!

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
This site is already like an endless chessboard of dead Egyptians! You really want more of the same? Get a life! Anyway more archaeology survives in the south, both because the north continued to be more populous, so more stone was recycled, and because the north is wetter, so wooden and papyrus objects have survived less well. The north coast has also been prone to destructive earthquakes, and there has been more intensive farming in the Delta. Due to these conditions, the probability is that more dark images will have survived.

Also it would be stupid as we have dark and light images of the same individual, and there is no guarantee any of them were done from life before the time of the Fayum portraits. All they can do is give a general picture.

---

 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
More for my English Chap!!

Egyptian Reddish Brown..



More Random Images..



Tomb of Antefoquer:...



BTW I used the same image of Tuthmosis but I didnt know the rules when I made it, I wont use the same one again.
 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:


Let's see how far white supporters can get before they run short.

---

he predicts white supporters
will be able to find a certain amount of white ancient Egyptians but they won't get that far
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
I'm not biting. Sorry. I've burdened the site's bandwidth enough of late. What indeed, if you have a wall carving of a thousand generic slaves hauling a collossus along? Can you count every one as a portrait? What about different images of the same individual, giving conflicting impressions? What about gods? Do yellow goddesses count as white women? Jet black gods count with golden eyebrows and caucasoid features as black men? What about ones which don't even take fully human form?

Let's be real. Most Egyptians have a racially ambiguous look. Some have some negroid characteristics, others towards the Mediterranean caucasoid, and could pass for Syrians, Greeks or Italians. The typical Coptic Egyptian has medium brown skin (though some are fair and some are very dark). They have black or dark brown hair which can be straight, wavy or curly, a not-overly-broad nose, with a high nasal bridge and without wide nostrils, sometimes blunt or even slightly bulbous at the tip, medium full lips (but not fleshy and not projecting forward of the nose like a negroid's), rounds cheeks. They have distinctive eyes (usually dark) which are more easily recognized than described. This is true today and it was true in the past.
 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Hemiunu:Engineer of the Great Pyramid in the Old Kingdom.




 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
Tell you what. Why don't we try this.

Post images of Egyptians that are neither white or
black

.
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
AmunhotepIII









For my English Chap
 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Some Lower Egyptians:

Relief representing Kawab son of Kheops and Meritates found in the mastaba of his daughter, Meresankh III




The Tomb of Kagemni at Saqqarah






 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:
Tell you what. Why don't we try this.

Post images of Egyptians that are neither white or
black

.

---

Ok I'll bite...



 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Some images from Tutankhamun Tomb





 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:
Tell you what. Why don't we try this.

Post images of Egyptians that are neither white or
black

.

---

Ok I'll bite...

---

Neither White nor black, Ill play to because Watson admited defeat..


 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
I NEED HELP ARE THESE CAUCASOID OR NEGROID ???




Narmer Palette
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Hemiunu:Engineer of the Great Pyramid in the Old Kingdom.

quote:

---

Originally posted by teacher of osool:

---

---

Same Skin color..This is too easy..
Thanks for providing that one...
 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
so far, a mixture of races
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
Egyptian Facial features..



-Djoser

-Montuhotep

-Pepi

-Sahure

-Sesostris...

The Royal Kings Haminihu the so called Great Pyramid Architect Worshipped as Gods..

FUFUFU...

BTW Lioness I have'nt even warmed up yet, don't count the chickens, as Altaruri said there WERE light skinned Meds but the Dominant phenotype was Black and this will be proven, so Im gonna let the Chickens scurry and take my time...

FUFUFUFFUFUFUFUFU!!
 

---

Posted by Kalonji (Member # 17303) on :
 
Why is there participation from the Non-Eurocentric side? Are you all that addicted to responding that you can't even let them obey the instructions in the OP for a moment?

The low amount of whites in AE art is self defeating, there is no need to counter with darker skinned AE.
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Plus a space alien.
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
And this is supposed to show what exactly?? LOL, Gold Skin??

FUFUFUFUFUFUFU!!!

Come on Muktaba, come harder...

quote:

---

Originally posted by teacher of osool:



Will My Royal Profile Be Enough To Shake Some Afronuts Out Of The Tree Of False Hope And Dreams??


This one is esp. for you!!

---

 

---

Posted by Kalonji (Member # 17303) on :
 
^ran out of pics, didn't you?
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Queen Anne's Dead!
 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Nofret: From the 4th dynasty Old Kingdom.


 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
Rahotep is the only one I want to Image Debate, as Kalonji says it seems they are running out of Images..lol.

And seriously if this is it..LOL..

Rahotep when you decide to step up Ill be waiting for you my English Chap!!

FUFFUFUFUFU!!
 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Rahotep 4th dynasty:


 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Sepa: From the old kingdom.


 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Rahotep 4th dynasty:

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:


Post images of supposedly white vs non-white Egyptians.....


Of course this exercise is only for those truly interested in such roorag.

That's why other than broaching the thread I won't participate.

AE is so obviously overwhelmingly black founded and populated.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kalonji:
Why is there participation from the Non-Eurocentric side? Are you all that addicted to responding that you can't even let them obey the instructions in the OP for a moment?

The low amount of whites in AE art is self defeating, there is no need to counter with darker skinned AE.

---

 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 


WAS THUTMOSE JEWISH ?????????
 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 


Bas-reliefs from the Temple of Satet at Elephantine
New Kingdom, 18th Dynasty, reigns of Hatshepsut and Tuthmosis III (1479-25 BC)
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
I've encountered black American Afrocentrists who would invade Egypt and 'reclaim it', given half a chance, driving out all the 'foreign' Egyptians, so deranged have they become by their cult of black pharaohs and queens. They call it 'our land'. They seem convinced also that modern Egyptians and white Academia are both part of a colossal, eternal conspiracy to deny the truth about Ancient Egyptians and to steal the black man's legacy. It's quite sinister. Useful Idiots like Joel Freeman (a white Canadian feel-good guru who rehashes Afrocentric myth and dishes it up for a willing audience), don't help matters.

Clarence Walker seems to be much more enlightened, advocating an end to the cult of Africa and a pride in the culture that black Americans have created in the new world. Of course far be it from me to tell anyone else how they should identify, as long as they are not trying to usurp another, unconnected people's identity and ancestry.
 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
^What do they have to do with us?

More artwork:


The family of Memphis-Nefer herenptah
Statuette
Fifth Dynasty



Group
Fifth Dynasty



Statue
Vème dynastie



The Tomb of Irukaptah
At Saqqara


The Tomb of Nefer at Saqqara in Egypt




Dark skinned lower Egyptians seemed common...
 

---

Posted by AphRe7 (Member # 18920) on :
 
Some of these white nationalists post pics of Ancient Egyptians that have washed their faces "wit di cake soap".
 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
__________________________






 

---

Posted by TruthAndRights (Member # 17346) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by AphRe7:
..... washed their faces "wit di cake soap".

---

mi raaaaass but ah wha dis fadda ......lol...is wha you know bout di cake soap, eeeeeeeeeh, lol....


dwbcl @ "cake soap"... whey Brada deh now, lol....
 

---

Posted by Brada-Anansi (Member # 16371) on :
 

NYC: Brooklyn Museum - Erotic Scene

Limestone
Ptolemaic Period, 305-30 B.C.
Same period...
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
This one appears somewhat different. And I once show a BBC documentary of Ghana, they had a similar statue. Of a dark-skinned man and light skinned woman. It was like a shrine where they did certain rituals. It was about some ancient tradition. And history from before the colonial time.

Very intrigue.









Ironcly !?


 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
Imhotep







 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Correction. I once saw a tv show ^


Is femininity depicted as light skinned?

Large pic


Large pic


Large pic


Large pic
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
This site is already like an endless chessboard of dead Egyptians! You really want more of the same? Get a life! Anyway more archaeology survives in the south, both because the north continued to be more populous, so more stone was recycled, and because the north is wetter, so wooden and papyrus objects have survived less well. The north coast has also been prone to destructive earthquakes, and there has been more intensive farming in the Delta. Due to these conditions, the probability is that more dark images will have survived.

Also it would be stupid as we have dark and light images of the same individual, and there is no guarantee any of them were done from life before the time of the Fayum portraits. All they can do is give a general picture.

---

...ahaha, the North is wetter.


And the Nile Vellay Delta has "more" farming. It's a delta, concentration. It's a tiny spot out of a whole.

A large part of Luxor is going to be exaveded and transmigration is going to take place.

More has been preserved in the South, because there is were the culture has survived and has been preserved.





 

---

Posted by Kalonji (Member # 17303) on :
 
Very interesting experiment

Even after posting ambiguous colorless statues, making fraudulent use of symbolic artistic conventions, double posts of the same pictures (despite OP whishes), irrelevant cartoons and book covers and help of non-Eurocentric others who comment and post counter pics, we're barely past page 1.

The same amount of non-Eurocentric participators would've reached page four by now, with unique dark to light brown skinned depictions, and no need for Eurocentrics to increase the post count. In fact, we've already demonstrated our ability to fill picture threads with ease, and even with statuettes only, as was done recently in alTakuri's thread. But notice that they will continue to spout the ''Ancient Egypt is the same modern Egypt'' and ''you cherrypicked those images'' bullshit elsewhere, when they can't even help themselves to document their beliefs when given the stage to prove it by way of artwork.

BTW
After re-reading the OP, I'm not sure. alTakruri, did you call for image posting by both sides or only the Eurocentric side?
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Hemiunu:Engineer of the Great Pyramid in the Old Kingdom.

quote:

---

Originally posted by teacher of osool:

---

---

Same Skin color..This is too easy..
Thanks for providing that one...

---

You need to checkout that webpage, these racist whites in South Africa are active in altering history.

Now I understand why some are always bringing up the Zulus.

Some of their drawings are funny, sad and ridiculous at the same time.

http://www.perankhgroup.com/the_art_of_living.htm
 

---

Posted by Brada-Anansi (Member # 16371) on :
 
Brilliant experiment by AlTakuri they are stomped if I were them I'd go rummaging about for Graco Roman era pics but that wouldn't really count now would it..

Hay Brandon is that you ...
 

---

Posted by Kalonji (Member # 17303) on :
 
Its strinking how images of Greeks and Romans contrast with Egyptian images.

Europeans with Egyptian apparel look atrocious, and I'm not even joking around, or attempting to be mean about it. It just looks extremely odd and uncomfortable, like.. you just want to pluck that white crown off his head and replace it with a roman centurion helmet or something.

Several friends have noticed the same feeling when we just so happen to stumble on Europeans with Egyptian type apparel, and they didn't even study Ancient Egypt beyond media coverage.
 

---

Posted by KING (Member # 9422) on :
 
Great Thread.

All I can say is the quietness from the eurocentric.... Egypt is Eurasian, East Africans are mixed blah blah blah is quite resounding.

It seems Rahotep, Perahu and Simple just could not hang with all the TRUE Images of Ancient Egyptians.

Let me Get in on tha FUN:



^Wonder if Tut is Too Black?? Or maybe his color is "Symbolic " Bahahahahahhah.

Really man too easy to school these racists when they have to put up or shut up.....It seems they be stayin shut up.

Next Pic:





Gotta love when TRUTH trumps racist views.

Peace
 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
I think alTakuri meant for us to post dark skinned images and them to post light skinned images because he commented on how long it would take for them to run out and said "we". But then this Simple Girl b!tch came and thought she could set the rules instead of alTakuri. Even when he told her this she just decided to do what she wanted anyways because she knows that painted tomb scenes would harm her ego... I think her posts should be removed until she can follow the rules.

Also, in order to avoid going against alTakuri's rule not to double post, maybe we shouldn't include images when using the quote function.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kalonji:
Very interesting experiment

Even after posting ambiguous colorless statues, making fraudulent use of symbolic artistic conventions, double posts of the same pictures (despite OP whishes), irrelevant cartoons and book covers and help of non-Eurocentric others who comment and post counter pics, we're barely past page 1.

The same amount of non-Eurocentric participators would've reached page four by now, with unique dark to light brown skinned depictions, and no need for Eurocentrics to increase the post count. In fact, we've already demonstrated our ability to fill picture threads with ease, and even with statuettes only, as was done recently in alTakuri's thread. But notice that they will continue to spout the ''Ancient Egypt is the same modern Egypt'' and ''you cherrypicked those images'' bullshit elsewhere, when they can't even help themselves to document their beliefs when given the stage to prove it by way of artwork.

BTW
After re-reading the OP, I'm not sure. alTakruri, did you call for image posting by both sides or only the Eurocentric side?

---

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Why?


https://pmanuelian.wordpress.com/tag/vienna/
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Nefermaat the father^

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Limestone, pigment
Old Kingdom, Dynasty 5, ca 2477 BCE
Tomb of Ny-kau-inpu, Giza
Left: Female Harpist, OIM 10642
H: 8 1/8, W: 4 3/8 D: 6 1/4 (20.7 x 11 x 16.1cm)
Right: Male Dwarf Harpist, OIM 10641
H: 4 3/4, W: 2 3/4 D: 3 3/4 (12.5 x 7.2 x 9.6cm)
(From museum info card):

These two statues are among a group of twenty-five "thought to have come from the tomb of a courtier named Nykauinpu at Giza. According to Egyptian beliefs, food and the pleasurable activities of daily life could be guaranteed in the afterlife by representing them in the tomb. As a result, statues such as these, which show individuals performing everyday tasks, were placed in tombs to perform necessary services for the deceased in the afterlife. Since statues were thought to be able to substitute for actual laborers..." (Photo of card cropped out further info.)


(From _Ancient Egypt: Treasures of the Oriental Institute_, by Emily Teeter, pages 21-24):


"Those stone statuettes evolved into wood models typical of the late Old Kingdom and Middle Kingdom. These were then replaced by ushebtis of the Second Intermediate Period and later."

"Among the most charming of the Ny-kau-inpu statuettes are three harpests, two of which are pictured here. They lean large shovel-shaped floor harps upon their left shoulders and pluck the strings with their right hands."
 

---

Posted by Brada-Anansi (Member # 16371) on :
 
Well in my case I was just trying help out the Eurocentrist but I can't get anything beyond the Greco-Roman era wonder why??? I thought I had better research skillz than than that s rry guys I tried to help out I failed.. u on your own..
 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Some more images:

From The tomb of Amenemhat


Tombs of Aswan Monarchs












 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
This site is already like an endless chessboard of dead Egyptians! You really want more of the same? Get a life! Anyway more archaeology survives in the south, both because the north continued to be more populous, so more stone was recycled, and because the north is wetter, so wooden and papyrus objects have survived less well. The north coast has also been prone to destructive earthquakes, and there has been more intensive farming in the Delta. Due to these conditions, the probability is that more dark images will have survived.

Also it would be stupid as we have dark and light images of the same individual, and there is no guarantee any of them were done from life before the time of the Fayum portraits. All they can do is give a general picture.

---

...ahaha, the North is wetter.


And the Nile Vellay Delta has "more" farming. It's a delta, concentration. It's a tiny spot out of a whole.

A large part of Luxor is going to be exaveded and transmigration is going to take place.

More has been preserved in the South, because there is were the culture has survived and has been preserved.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rahotep:
The 'culture' was preserved in the south no more than in the north. Civilization endured primarily in the north if anything.

---

And yet, civilization began and the south and dominated the north.

The images of lower Egyptians we do have are also relatively dark-skinned. Come on now, you just post images in another thread, but too scared to do it here?

More images:




 

---

Posted by Brada-Anansi (Member # 16371) on :
 
Sooo Rahotep101 where is your pics?? ask Bro Al if it's Ok to go Greco Roman I know I did without asking but that's because we cool like dat.
 

---

Posted by Doug M (Member # 7650) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Hemiunu:Engineer of the Great Pyramid in the Old Kingdom.

quote:

---

Originally posted by teacher of osool:

---

---

Same Skin color..This is too easy..
Thanks for providing that one...

---

You need to checkout that webpage, these racist whites in South Africa are active in altering history.

Now I understand why some are always bringing up the Zulus.

Some of their drawings are funny, sad and ridiculous at the same time.

http://www.perankhgroup.com/the_art_of_living.htm

---

I like the following image from that site:


http://www.perankhgroup.com/the_art_of_living.htm

Which is nowadays called the Maxi dress, but often has the same cut, lines and colors from the ancient Egyptian styles.
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Regarding Hemiunu, the head has obviously been restored. Only the region around the eyes appear to be modern reconstructions, the rest is made from ancient fragments. Whether the head fragments are original to that partiular statue I can't be sure, but I expect so.

Statues of pharaoh Chephren have also been found with the the heads smashed, and surviving in fragments. Hemunu's original head didn't just fall off. I would imagine it was smashed by some zealous early Christian or Muslim who deemed it idolatrous or who wished to deter locals from venerating it. Both the fragmentary and intact statues of Chephren appear caucasoid.





I'm not playing this silly game by the way, I'm just countering the insinuation's about Hemiunu's head.

As for the idea of Tut's tomb depicting any type of people other than Egyptians, the same as modern Egyptians, I think this picture puts pay to that...

 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
^I'm not seeing that those Egyptians have the same skin tone as the depictions. Their skin tone looks more like the color of the wall. I consider it wishful thinking on your part. At most, their skin tone is similar and/or comparable as the ancient Egyptians not identical. No surprise as some modern Egyptians also resemble sub-Saharan Africans, although more distantly that their ancestors. But a closer match to the ancient Egyptians would be to East Africans and Sudanese groups.

quote:

---

I'm not playing this silly game by the way, I'm just countering the insinuation's about Hemiunu's head.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
Regarding Hemiunu, the head has obviously been restored. Only the region around the eyes appear to be modern reconstructions, the rest is made from ancient fragments. Whether the head fragments are original to that partiular statue I can't be sure, but I expect so.

---

Yes the head was found in the tomb with the rest of the statue. There's people on this board that would have others believe it was totally made up by racists whites. Anything that looks too caucasian for their tastes is a forgery.
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Calabozo, being colourblind is one of the symptoms of negrocentric egyptomania, so I'm not surprised.
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Her are all the areas of the same colour range isolated from that photo, just to indicate the depth of denial that Calabozo is in. QED.


 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
^Obviously you are the one in denial just like with everything else that has been demonstrated to you.

Take a closer look:



A clear difference between the depictions and the people. Anybody with eyes should be able to spot this out immediately.
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
I selected colours only from the wall painting skin regions, copied them on to white and that's what came out. Go on denying the obvous if you want. You're a laughing stock.
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Yes the head was found in the tomb with the rest of the statue.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
I selected colours only from the wall painting skin regions, copied them on to white and that's what came out. Go on denying the obvous if you want. You're a laughing stock.

---

Dude, I know what you did LOL! Maybe you are confused. So look at the original then back again so that you are sure of the placement.

My point being, that especially in your photo a clear cut distinction can be made between the color of the artwork vs. that of the people.

You've been a source for entertainment since the day you started posting here.
 

---

Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Ha ah ah aha! I do not see these Caucasoid features Eurocentrics proclaim on Khafra neither have i ever witness a Caucasian bearing a similarity to Khafra but on the other hand...

_

No doubt Africoids like Khafra along with King Tut, Tiye are being incorrectly classified as Caucasoid. Another addition as to why the pure / true negroid theory was created, so they can expand on the phenotypical range of Caucasoids and claim features which can be structurally grouped as Negroid into their own arsenal.

Its just another attempt at justification of psychological and material control. The context to which extent the material here Eurocentrics wish to assert ownership to is black history and its notable figures.
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Calabozo. Still laughing at your self-delusion. The living Egyptians are quite obviously the same colour as the ones painted on the wall behind them. You said they were the same colour as the wall. If so why don't the walls show up but the Egyptians' faces do? Pathetic you are. We don't need to see any foreigners to know what Egyptians looked like.
 

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Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
Yes it is laughable that Eurocentrics like Rahotep would inject a European over Native Egyptian or even a Nubian to compare Tut's Profile to...

Considering how Tut was depicted its even more of a fail.

Here is a reconstruction made on one of the Mummies associated with Tut's and Nefertiti's family..



Notice the features match perfectly with this profile of Nefertit Euroclowns like Winston avoid like the plague.


 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
A full-lipped European with an underbite means that the Habsburgs were black, a thin-lipped black man means the Egyptians were black. This is bloody typical. It's why it's pointless engaging.
 

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Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
^^^
Who the F-ck says the Hapsburgs were black people dumbass. How long have you been on here and how many responses do you see from normal posters on Edgmounds Threads.

Second the whole point is that using Lips is a poor indicator of race. Egyptians ranged from Full Lips like those of Dojser, Huni, etc. to thin like Ramses, Seti etc. You trying to interject a European to prove your point is obsurd, there are plenty of Egyptians and East Africans who have Tut's features.

Third its pointless engaging a fool who makes comments like this..

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist:
''An Examination of Nubian and Egyptian biological distances''
=======

The original egyptians died out thousands of years ago. You must be a simpleton if you believe the modern Arabs/mongrels inhabiting egypt are related to the ancient egyptians.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
A full-lipped European with an underbite means that the Habsburgs were black, a thin-lipped black man means the Egyptians were black. This is bloody typical. It's why it's pointless engaging.

---

quote:

---

This site is already like an endless chessboard of dead Egyptians! You really want more of the same? Get a life! Anyway more archaeology survives in the south, both because the north continued to be more populous, so more stone was recycled, and because the north is wetter, so wooden and papyrus objects have survived less well. The north coast has also been prone to destructive earthquakes, and there has been more intensive farming in the Delta. Due to these conditions, the probability is that more dark images will have survived.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
Yes it is laughable that Eurocentrics like Rahotep would inject a European over Native Egyptian or even a Nubian to compare Tut's Profile to...

Considering how Tut was depicted its even more of a fail.

Here is a reconstruction made on one of the Mummies associated with Tut's and Nefertiti's family..



Notice the features match perfectly with this profile of Nefertit Euroclowns like Winston avoid like the plague.

---

Oh here comes Trout Pout! The reconstructed face is otherwise fully caucasoid. The lips are a joke (and like the skintone are apparently the work of a graphic designer in post-production, not of actual facial reconstruction specialists). The mouth area is damaged on the mummy in question, so the shape of the lips can't be verified. In every other essential respect KV35YL closely resembles the Berlin bust identified as Nefertiti. The more realistic images from Amarna do not have puffed up lips. Quite clearly they are only a feature of the stylized art produced there, during a period of experimentation. Plaster-cast life masks were also found in the sculptor's workshop of Amarna, again showing narrow lips.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us
 

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Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
More Busts of Nefertiti Euroclowns like Rahotep avoid like the plague





if the Images look too Negro just claim its "Stylized"...and Ignore the vast amount of images to its likeness.

Euroclown tactic 101
 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
Calabozo. Still laughing at your self-delusion. The living Egyptians are quite obviously the same colour as the ones painted on the wall behind them. You said they were the same colour as the wall. If so why don't the walls show up but the Egyptians' faces do? Pathetic you are. We don't need to see any foreigners to know what Egyptians looked like.

---

What you are attributing to me is incorrect. I said that their skin color was more like the wall which equates to being similar to the wall. Did you even realize, that some of the faces overlap with the artwork? The significance of this is that you can still distinguish the faces. If they the same skin tone, they would expect them to be indistinguishable. Fact remains, you can distinguish their skin tones.

Then you say "we don't need to see foreigners" but as I have already pointed out to you time after time, latter Egyptians are morphologically distinct from early Egyptians and early Egyptians cluster with Somalis and Sudanese, but modern Egyptians don't. So it stands to reason that Upper Egyptians/Sudanese/East Africans are more representative than lower Egyptians who experienced significant gene flow.

More images following...
 

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Posted by Brada-Anansi (Member # 16371) on :
 
Boyz n Girlz I am heading off to a beach event will holla back Mon ma time peace !!! Btw did the world ended over there ?? nothing happened here !!..
 

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Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
Nefertiti



Notice when all the images of Nefertiti are compiled it looks nothing like the Berlin bust, yet the Euroclowns will claim the Images of Nefertit with thick lips is "stylized" lmao Imagine that a White Woman stylizing herself to look Negriod.

Seems the only Stylized image is the Berlin Bust. Which is why Euroclowns love to claim it.
 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Of course some of the Amarna images look stylized, they look positively alien! The fist image you say I avoid, Jari, is actually an exreme close-up of the first image I showed! The third one you showed is a front view of amother one I showed, which is third along on the second line from the bottom. Clearly you are half blind as well as mad. Look again.


 

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Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
^^^^
Nefertiti's features are no different than the Avereage Ethiopian, Sudanese, Somali woman and other Africans found across the continent. When Compiling all of NEfertit's Images the only stylized and odd image is the Berlin Bust which looks nothing like her other Images.

The only mad person here is you thinking that Armana Art proves your point, Ive battled plenty of Euroclowns including your Overseer Phonecian7 posting under the Moniker "NonProphet" who would swear up and down Armana is Stylized art showing the Egyptians as Darker because of Sun Worship..LOL. Now you Euroclowns want to claim the Armana art proves your point, but when it does'nt its stylized. A bunch of quacks.

I could post more Armana Art but you too ass chicken to dabate on the O.P topic.

English Muffin, Grey Puppon eating Punk...
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
Calabozo. Still laughing at your self-delusion. The living Egyptians are quite obviously the same colour as the ones painted on the wall behind them. You said they were the same colour as the wall. If so why don't the walls show up but the Egyptians' faces do? Pathetic you are. We don't need to see any foreigners to know what Egyptians looked like.

---

What you are attributing to me is incorrect. I said that their skin color was more like the wall which equates to being similar to the wall. Did you even realize, that some of the faces overlap with the artwork? The significance of this is that you can still distinguish the faces. If they the same skin tone, they would expect them to be indistinguishable. Fact remains, you can distinguish their skin tones.

Then you say "we don't need to see foreigners" but as I have already pointed out to you time after time, latter Egyptians are morphologically distinct from early Egyptians and early Egyptians cluster with Somalis and Sudanese, but modern Egyptians don't. So it stands to reason that Upper Egyptians/Sudanese/East Africans are more representative than lower Egyptians who experienced significant gene flow.

More images following...

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
^^^^
Nefertiti's features are no different than the Avereage Ethiopian, Sudanese, Somali woman and other Africans found across the continent. When Compiling all of NEfertit's Images the only stylized and odd image is the Berlin Bust which looks nothing like her other Images.

English Muffin, Grey Puppon eating Punk...

---

It's 'Poupon', dimwit, I told you that before, and it's an American product which I have never sampled.

I seem to recall once an editor of 'Essence' magazine bitching about how Somali model Iman looks like a 'white woman dipped in chocolate'. The same thing could be said about Nefertiti, except she was dipped in nothing darker than caramel. Bitching and dreaming, black Americans seem to excel at that.
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
Everybody:



 

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Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
LOL, Nothing but a Non Sequitor, talking about what some irrelevent random person says has no bearing on the basics of Genetics which proves White people are Chocolate Somalis and other East Africans dipped in Pink or with less Melanin for the scientifically correct. Only a Eurocentric minded fool would believe East Africans derive from whites and not vice versa.

Second you English have the nerve of talking about Dreams, Once the Proud Empire of the Britons Ruling the seven seas now you are destined to become the next Yemen. I Heard that soon a Mosque will be built that will Surpass St. Pauls Cathedral making the Mosque the largest religious building in England..LOL

Seems the "Sun is setting on Union Jack" afterall Huh English McMuffin...

Cherrio or should I say...

Ah-Salaam-Alaykum...

FUFUFUFFUFUFUFUFUFUFUFUFUFUFU!!!

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
^^^^
Nefertiti's features are no different than the Avereage Ethiopian, Sudanese, Somali woman and other Africans found across the continent. When Compiling all of NEfertit's Images the only stylized and odd image is the Berlin Bust which looks nothing like her other Images.

English Muffin, Grey Puppon eating Punk...

---

It's 'Poupon', dimwit, I told you that before, and it's an American product which I have never sampled.

I seem to recall once an editor of 'Essence' magazine bitching about how Somali model Iman looks like a 'white woman dipped in chocolate'. The same thing could be said about Nefertiti, except she was dipped in nothing darker than caramel. Bitching and dreaming, black Americans seem to excel at that.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Sepa: From the old kingdom.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
Calabozo. Still laughing at your self-delusion. The living Egyptians are quite obviously the same colour as the ones painted on the wall behind them. You said they were the same colour as the wall. If so why don't the walls show up but the Egyptians' faces do? Pathetic you are. We don't need to see any foreigners to know what Egyptians looked like.

---

What you are attributing to me is incorrect. I said that their skin color was more like the wall which equates to being similar to the wall. Did you even realize, that some of the faces overlap with the artwork? The significance of this is that you can still distinguish the faces. If they the same skin tone, they would expect them to be indistinguishable. Fact remains, you can distinguish their skin tones.

Then you say "we don't need to see foreigners" but as I have already pointed out to you time after time, latter Egyptians are morphologically distinct from early Egyptians and early Egyptians cluster with Somalis and Sudanese, but modern Egyptians don't. So it stands to reason that Upper Egyptians/Sudanese/East Africans are more representative than lower Egyptians who experienced significant gene flow.

More images following...

---

You are a dick head. A three-dimensional shape and a flat shape will not look the same under the same light. There is no significant morphological distinction between the modern Egyptian men there and their ancient Egyptian ancestors, either. You wish.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
All Joking aside, yes it was a Joke Rahotep, Why cant you admit Nefertit's other images look no different than other East African Women, even when you do you inject some asinine opinion of a person who edits "Essence" as if that magazine is relevent to Africa or African people.

Deep Down you know without that Berlin Bust Nefertiti looks no different than an East African woman but it pains you so to admit it...lol

Hell Ill admit there are images in Egyptian Art that look Eurasian like the seated scribe, but a Euroclown will never admit the Egyptians resemble other Africans, its always the MEditeranian or Asiatics...

Pathetic..

---

Nefertiti

the fact is that there is plenty of crossover between blacks and whites feature-wise so in given example you can't be certain who's who


. _________________________________________
 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
There's no denying that some Egyptians, ancient and modern, have somethign about them reminiscent of other North-East Africans, but there is little or nothing about them that resembles central/West Africans, or the Nehesi negroes painted by the ancient Egyptians. They look more like Indians than negroids.

Carabooz the mid-tones on the 3d objects (the skin of the living people) are the same as the flat-filled flesh areas of the paintigs. They are the same colour and you are being ridiculous to say otherwise.
 

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Posted by Spiralman (Member # 16230) on :
 
Monkeys
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
Squirrels
 

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Posted by Superman (Member # 16230) on :
 
Apes
 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Lemurs FTW!


 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
^I'm not seeing that those Egyptians have the same skin tone as the depictions. Their skin tone looks more like the color of the wall. I consider it wishful thinking on your part. At most, their skin tone is similar and/or comparable as the ancient Egyptians not identical. No surprise as some modern Egyptians also resemble sub-Saharan Africans, although more distantly that their ancestors. But a closer match to the ancient Egyptians would be to East Africans and Sudanese groups.

quote:

---

I'm not playing this silly game by the way, I'm just countering the insinuation's about Hemiunu's head.

---

Yet you continue to post images in other threads, why is this?

---

 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
This nit-picking about variations on a theme of medium brown is pathetic. Within any given population, within nuclear families, indeed, there are greater variations in skin tone than that between the encient and modern Egyptians. The population retains the same racial characteristics as it always had, and the same variety. It's blazingly obvious. The Egyptians went nowhere.
 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Dark red Mediterranean Caucasoids, big deal! Here's another one, Antonio Carluccio from Salerno in S. Italy.


 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
There's no denying that some Egyptians, ancient and modern, have somethign about them reminiscent of other North-East Africans, but there is little or nothing about them that resembles central/West Africans, or the Nehesi negroes painted by the ancient Egyptians. They look more like Indians than negroids.

---

quote:

---

Carabooz the mid-tones on the 3d objects (the skin of the living people) are the same as the flat-filled flesh areas of the paintigs. They are the same colour and you are being ridiculous to say otherwise.

---

You just said that they didn't look the same, make up your mind. I can easily distinguish the people vs. the art as I'm sure anybody can. Nothing you say can change the fact that I can differentiate them.

BTW you guys. Great job at messing up the thread with your animal images instead of responding to the challenge given. Very nice indeed, trolls amaze me
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Jesus wept, Calabozo. Id you flattened them onto the wall with a rolling pin they would look the same... I think they would rather do that to you, though, and they would have good reason.
 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
Jesus wept, Carabozo. Id you flattened them onto the wall with a rolling pin they would look the same...

---

quote:

---

I think they would rather do that to you, though, and they would have good reason.

---

Why would they want to do that to me? My skin tone is the same as them, even lighter really, and my phenotype would likely fit into such a diverse place.
 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Well at any rate I am sure there are many Egyptians who are justifiably pissed off with being told by foreigners whose ancestors never came near Egypt that they- the modern Egyptians- are not the true heirs and descendants of the ancients, or that their look has changed. Especially when 99% of the time these foreign critics are motivated by a racialist ideology dependent on lumping Egypt with black Africa in an attempt to make their own people seem like the founders of civilization.

As for negroids living in Naqada in predynastic times, they evidently shared the neighbourhood with caucasoids. Of the Gebelein sand mummies, one was auburn haired and two brown haired, including a woman who had long, straight, light brown hair (two of said mummies were historically nicknamed 'Ginger' and 'Gingerella'). These mummies also appear to retain areas of light coloured skin.




 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
I agree completely. What I don't understand about the Afrocentric facination with Arabs and Islam is how even modern day Muslims don't hold Africa in high reguard be they Berbers or so called SSA. I have plenty of books in Islamic culture and only one Mentions Timbuctou and the East African Muslim Empires.

Funny thing is I found out about the Islamic movements of the Fulani and other Africans from a non Islamic Western World History book.

Also there seems to be some sort of facination with the Moors, despite evidence that Al Andalus was a Multi-ethnic society.

I honestly don't see anything great about Islam.

As far as Britain goes, its historically signifigant to Western Culture. Places like Chiswick house, St. Martins in the Feild, and London Bridge are the birth place of Modern culture...so to speak.

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
Jari I'm touched that you should be concerned about the integrity of British culture. Be assured it will be over my dead body that Islam takes over the UK. What I really don't get are the NOI movement in the US. Blacks seeming to think that Islam was somehow more suitable creed for the descendants of Africans to embrace. Islam was the religion of slave-traders as cruel as any European Christians, a religion centred on Arabs- people who never held negroes in high regard. Obviously I think Egypt would have been better off without Islam, despite the fact that under Islam Egypt continued to be the most powerful and advanced nation in Africa.

You should be more concerned about Islam spreading across black Africa, leading to the loss of indigenous religions and traditions like that of the Dogon.

---

 

---

Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Depiction of Amenhotep II from the sacred tomb of Amenhotep II



I declare him to be a Mediterranean type.
 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
Well at any rate I am sure there are many Egyptians who are justifiably pissed off with being told by foreigners whose ancestors never came near Egypt that they- the modern Egyptians- are not the true heirs and descendants of the ancients, or that their look has changed. Especially when 99% of the time these foreign critics are motivated by a racialist ideology dependent on lumping Egypt with black Africa in an attempt to make their own people seem like the founders of civilization.

---

quote:

---

As for negroids living in Naqada in predynastic times,

---

quote:

---

they evidently shared the neighbourhood with caucasoids.

---

quote:

---

Of the Gebelein and mummies one was auburn haired and two brown haired, including a woman who had long, straight, light brown hair (two of said mummies were historically nicknamed 'Ginger' and 'Gingerella').

---

1)Mummification effects hair color
2)Straight hair amongst Africans is not the result of gene flow anymore than curly hair in southern Europe. Finally, you should see the studies done on ancient Egyptian hair

quote:

---

These mummies also appear to retain areas of light coloured skin.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kalonji:
Rahotep is debunking himself

Why is there a need for Lower Egyptian comparative material, if he says all Ancient Egyptians are identical to the ancients?

The only way he can use that as an argument is if he is conceding to himself in silence that ancient Upper Egypt was significantly more ''African'' than ancient Lower Egypt

That is where the self defeating part comes in; Rahotep knows that with the exception of several pockets of noticeably darker people in Luxor and Aswan and other modern areas, most people between the 1st cataract (the ancient boundary) and the delta look on ave. like North Africans from Libya and Morocco.

In fact, since Libya and Morocco have darker people as well - on par of those dark remnant Egyptian people I mentioned - there is every reason to believe that modern Egypt as a whole compares favorably to other same lattitude North Africans.

Ancient Upper Egyptians, on the other hand, are distinguishable from Magrebians and Libyans in both depicted skin color and cranio-facial traits.

This is why you don't want to participate, and you know it.

quote:

---

This site is already like an endless chessboard of dead Egyptians! You really want more of the same? Get a life! Anyway more archaeology survives in the south, both because the north continued to be more populous, so more stone was recycled, and because the north is wetter, so wooden and papyrus objects have survived less well. The north coast has also been prone to destructive earthquakes, and there has been more intensive farming in the Delta. Due to these conditions, the probability is that more dark images will have survived.

---

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
As for negroids living in Naqada in predynastic times, they evidently shared the neighbourhood with caucasoids. Of the Gebelein sand mummies, one was auburn haired and two brown haired, including a woman who had long, straight, light brown hair (two of said mummies were historically nicknamed 'Ginger' and 'Gingerella'). These mummies also appear to retain areas of light coloured skin.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
Neither Near Easterners nor Europeans colonized Egypt during the predynastic (Keita, 2005).

---

David Rohl, (1999) a qualified Egyptologist, very much begs to differ. If there were no Eurasians in Egypt, a few things need a lot of explaining... Eg the device on Narmer's Palette of serpent-necked lions with entwined necks, very common in W. Asia. This decoration is often found in Mesopotamia, for example on Elamite cylindrical roll-seals. Such seals were apparently a Sumerian invention, but also appeared in predynastic Egypt. http://www.mazzaroth.com/ChapterFour/NarmersPaletteReverse.htm


Another Sumerian/Susianan roll seal appears to feature the White Crown. I can't find a photo but if this drawing's accurate it's far more compelling than the Qustul incense burner...




From ancient Sumeria and from late-Pre or Early Dynastic Egypt:







Uploaded with ImageShack.us
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kalonji:

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
As for negroids living in Naqada in predynastic times, they evidently shared the neighbourhood with caucasoids. Of the Gebelein sand mummies, one was auburn haired and two brown haired, including a woman who had long, straight, light brown hair (two of said mummies were historically nicknamed 'Ginger' and 'Gingerella'). These mummies also appear to retain areas of light coloured skin.

---

Are you interested in sharing quotations of cranial studies done on Naqadans where they cluster with Ca-cazoids?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Yes the head was found in the tomb with the rest of the statue.

---

Please pray tell where the head was at?? Where is a source saying the head was found. Also why in the Image you provided despite the head being broken at the neck there is no restoration line??

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
Yes the head was found in the tomb with the rest of the statue.

---

Please pray tell where the head was at?? Where is a source saying the head was found. Also why in the Image you provided despite the head being broken at the neck there is no restoration line??

---

The head was found on the statue when it was first found.Thieves had chiseled out the eyes so the area around the eyes have been restored.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
^I'm not seeing that those Egyptians have the same skin tone as the depictions. Their skin tone looks more like the color of the wall. I consider it wishful thinking on your part. At most, their skin tone is similar and/or comparable as the ancient Egyptians not identical. No surprise as some modern Egyptians also resemble sub-Saharan Africans, although more distantly that their ancestors. But a closer match to the ancient Egyptians would be to East Africans and Sudanese groups.

quote:

---

I'm not playing this silly game by the way, I'm just countering the insinuation's about Hemiunu's head.

---

Yet you continue to post images in other threads, why is this?

---

---

 

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Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 
LOL The images displayed by the veterans so far are just the tip of the ice berg. Apparently these Euronuts have gotten so used to their cherry-picking that they have fooled even themselves! LOL
 

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Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lyinass:

---

^ Notice the man on the left corner would be known as a "light-skinned" black man in the West.

Here are more local Luxori Egyptians from that event.






 

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Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 
DaDum1 loves to post portraits from the 18th dynasty as his poster-people like they are somehow proof of cockasian Egpytians.

Let us appeal to his tastes then..





Is there a resemblance with the Maasai? No doubt if a statue were made of Maasai man and placed in Egypt it too would be classified as cockasian.

And what about one of Akhentaten and Nefertiti's daughters?



Very cockasian is she not?
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 




 

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Posted by KING (Member # 9422) on :
 
Ish Gebor

Lovin the pics...You have really beatdown the racists by yourself really.

All the pics you have shown is genuine and shows just how African are the Ancient Egyptians.

Keep em coming.

Peace
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
More Busts of Nefertiti Euroclowns like Rahotep avoid like the plague





if the Images look too Negro just claim its "Stylized"...and Ignore the vast amount of images to its likeness.

Euroclown tactic 101

---

 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by KING:
Ish Gebor

Lovin the pics...You have really beatdown the racists by yourself really.

All the pics you have shown is genuine and shows just how African are the Ancient Egyptians.

Keep em coming.

Peace

---

A sidekick,


web page
web page
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 




 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Dr. Robert Schoch's new geological studies of Egyptian monuments are likely to revolutionize our understanding of ancient history. His team has found evidence of weathering upon "core structures" INSIDE the ancient masonry of the Great Pyramid and of many other early Egyptian edifices. What he has found proves that many of the structures we now see in Egypt were constructed on top of other, more ancient structures which had lain exposed to the elements for THOUSANDS OF YEARS prior to their being covered up by the pyramids of the Old Kingdom.

This implies a radical revision of the history of Egypt. It means an advanced Egyptian culture the one that originally
LOCATED these old structures, that aligned them with great precision to "true north," and that positioned them around
hundreds of square miles of Egyptian desert to mirror the astrological sign of Orion had existed THOUSANDS OF YEARS BEFORE THE OLD KINGDOM, which Egyptologists date to 2500 BC.

Ancient Sumerian civilation's earliest written tablets [which are nothing but agricultural commodity tokens] date to 3300 BC. The new findings by Schoch push the high culture of Egypt back to AT LEAST 5000-7000 BC--vastly older than Sumer. This earlier Egytian culture literally leaves the supposedly "ancient" civilization of Sumer in the dust...

The true date of Egypt may be far older, Schoch says. He indicates that the civilation that laid out these grand monuments so precisely would have alread had a long devleopment time before planning this huge complex of pyramids. Moreover, he feels his weathering estimates could be underestimating the time involved.

There is yet another reason for dating this early Egyptian culture older even than Schoch suspects. Several scholars over the past fifty years have argued that the date for the Egyptian Old Kingdom--from which Schoch's dates are extended back in time--could be off by centuries, or even millennia.
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
All Joking aside, yes it was a Joke Rahotep, Why cant you admit Nefertit's other images look no different than other East African Women, even when you do you inject some asinine opinion of a person who edits "Essence" as if that magazine is relevent to Africa or African people.

Deep Down you know without that Berlin Bust Nefertiti looks no different than an East African woman but it pains you so to admit it...lol

Hell Ill admit there are images in Egyptian Art that look Eurasian like the seated scribe, but a Euroclown will never admit the Egyptians resemble other Africans, its always the MEditeranian or Asiatics...

Pathetic..

---

Nefertiti

the fact is that there is plenty of crossover between blacks and whites feature-wise so in given example you can't be certain who's who


. _________________________________________

---

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Left side



Right side

 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
I always thought this one looked funny:



Benia:








 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 












 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

---

Is that blacktop pottery?
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 




 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kalonji:
Lol.
You turd, the author is comparing Badarians to Naqadans (dynastic race theory), and we all know they were slightly divergent because of divergent evolution for some time.

To get back to the Naqadans; they (as well as the Bad.) had on ave. a smaller head size than Ancient Sudanese, did Douglas Derry include that in that garbage quote of his?

EDIT
A quick glance at the pdf where your quote comes from shows how defunct their methodology is. They didn't use multivariate analysis, as was the case in the studies of most contemporary early anthropologist. Do you not know how to discern the quality of your information, or are you indifferent? Don't know which one is worse.

---

I did't think you'd like that. The quote is given in David Rohl's book 'Legend: the Genesis of Civilization'. It actually compares the types of skull found from people of the Naqada I and II era burials from the same site. Also given is an account of all the material archaeological evidence that supports the arrival of a new foreign elite from Mespotamia (apparently Armeniod Caucasians). Really bad news for those who would like to imagine Egyptian civilization as an entirely indigenous development.
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Rahotep is such a hypocrite. Notice how he will say stuff like "only Egyptians can claim Egyptian heritage" and immediately thereafter goes around spouting dynastic race theories that some elite Armeniod Caucasians colonize Egypt and brought civilization. He claims we try to steal Egyptian history, but just look at his screen name "Rahotep101" after the ancient Egyptian and his outdated and obsolete pseudo Bull.
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
Good Find!!!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Djehuti:
DaDum1 loves to post portraits from the 18th dynasty as his poster-people like they are somehow proof of cockasian Egpytians.

Let us appeal to his tastes then..





Is there a resemblance with the Maasai? No doubt if a statue were made of Maasai man and placed in Egypt it too would be classified as cockasian.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
Rahotep is such a hypocrite. Notice how he will say stuff like "only Egyptians can claim Egyptian heritage" and immediately thereafter goes around spouting dynastic race theories that some elite Armeniod Caucasians colonize Egypt and brought civilization. He claims we try to steal Egyptian history, but just look at his screen name "Rahotep101" after the ancient Egyptian and his outdated and obsolete pseudo Bull.

---

quote:

---

Do you not have a life?

---

No, no I don't
 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
argyle what are some of your recommendations and tips?
 

---

Posted by argyle104 (Member # 14634) on :
 
Obviously. Your dick gets on hard more for racists than for women.

Calabooz' look............


Its P-----, M---------, and D--------


Calabooz' immediately becomes aroused.........<THOING!!!!!!!!!>
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
^^^^
Creepy
 

---

Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Lol argyle I have to say, you make me laugh
 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
[qb] ^^^^Source..Thanks, also provide the image of the condition of the head...

Thanks


Check out a book called The Great Pyramid:Ancient Egypt Revisited by John Romer. It has a picture of the statue when it was first discovered by Hermann Junker. Check page 88 figure 37. You can see the book online through google books.
 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by argyle104:
Obviously. Your dick gets on hard more for racists than for women.

Calabooz' look............


Its P-----, M---------, and D--------


Calabooz' immediately becomes aroused.........<THOING!!!!!!!!!>

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
..Thanks, also provide the image of the condition of the head...

Thanks

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kalonji:
Lol.
You turd, the author is comparing Badarians to Naqadans (dynastic race theory), and we all know they were slightly divergent because of divergent evolution for some time.

To get back to the Naqadans; they (as well as the Bad.) had on ave. a smaller head size than Ancient Sudanese, did Douglas Derry include that in that garbage quote of his?

EDIT
A quick glance at the pdf where your quote comes from shows how defunct their methodology is. They didn't use multivariate analysis, as was the case in the studies of most contemporary early anthropologist. Do you not know how to discern the quality of your information, or are you indifferent? Don't know which one is worse.

---

I did't think you'd like that. The quote is given in David Rohl's book 'Legend: the Genesis of Civilization'. It actually compares the types of skull found from people of the Naqada I and II era burials from the same site. Also given is an account of all the material archaeological evidence that supports the arrival of a new foreign elite from Mespotamia (apparently Armeniod Caucasians). Really bad news for those who would like to imagine Egyptian civilization as an entirely indigenous development.

---

quote:

---

Neolithic contacts between Western Asia and Egypt
include the transmission of lithic technologies such as the
Helwan retouch (Gopher 1993), domesticated plants and
animals sometime after 6000 B.C. (Wetterstrom-1993),
and maceheads (Cialowicz 1989). Chalcolithic contacts
include the transfer of metallurgical technology and raw
materials through the trading entrepot at Maadi (Rizkana
and Seeher 1989, Seeher 1990). Uruk-related material in
Egypt which may be dated to the middle Naqada II horizon
includes the introduction of cylinder seals, lapis lazuli, and
stylistic influences on locally produced knife handles
(Crowfoot-Payne 1968; Boehmer 1974a, b; Midant-Reyes
1987; Smith 1992; Sievertsen 1992; Pittman 1996; Bavay
1997).

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
Like I said earlier Rahotep does'nt care about Modern Egyptians, he only defends the Delta because they resemble him and Eurasians more. Rahotep believes whites created and found Egypt but pretends Afrocentrics are the evil ones when he himself believes the same ish in reverse.

Im gonna save that quote, might even use it in a future video.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
Rahotep is such a hypocrite. Notice how he will say stuff like "only Egyptians can claim Egyptian heritage" and immediately thereafter goes around spouting dynastic race theories that some elite Armeniod Caucasians colonize Egypt and brought civilization. He claims we try to steal Egyptian history, but just look at his screen name "Rahotep101" after the ancient Egyptian and his outdated and obsolete pseudo Bull.

---

---

quote:

---

Where do you see a contradiction? The Normans of Normandy who founded Norman civilization descended from invading Norse. The English substantially descend from Anglo-Saxon and Danish invaders from earlier in the so-called Dark Ages. Just because someone may descends from ancient invaders who fouded a civilization, it doesn't give unrelated parties the right to take credit for the culture in question, or to pretend that the people of a given land descend from later invaders! Whatever the merits of the idea of a foreign elite arriving in predynastic times (and there is much to support such an idea) it doesn't detract from the fact that only modern Egyptians have any right to the legacy of dynastic civilization.

---

quote:

---

Their overlap with other Egyptian samples (in
PC space, Fig. 2) suggests that although their morphology
is distinctive, the pattern does overlap with the other
time periods. These results therefore do not support the
Petrie concept of a \Dynastic race" (Petrie, 1939; Derry,
1956). Instead, the results suggest that the Egyptian
state was not the product of mass movement of populations
into the Egyptian Nile region, but rather that it was
the result of primarily indigenous development combined
with prolonged small-scale migration, potentially from
trade, military, or other contacts.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
Calabooz I never said they didn't descend partially from later invasions, but that doesn't change the fact that the Ancient Egyptians never moved out to make way for any invaders, but rather carried on in their land.

---

quote:

---

The invaders were absorbed, or else remained suffiently distinct that they could depart leaving little genetic legacy, as appears to have been the case with the Hyksos, Persians and Greeks.

---

quote:

---

I don't imagine a wholesale predynastic population replacement either, but enough of an infusion arrived from Mesopotamia to give Egyptian civilization a boost, and to set it on the path towards what it became.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:

Like I said earlier Rahotep does'nt care about Modern Egyptians, he only defends the Delta because they resemble him and Eurasians more. Rahotep believes whites created and found Egypt but pretends Afrocentrics are the evil ones when he himself believes the same ish in reverse.

Im gonna save that quote, might even use it in a future video.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
Rahotep is such a hypocrite. Notice how he will say stuff like "only Egyptians can claim Egyptian heritage" and immediately thereafter goes around spouting dynastic race theories that some elite Armeniod Caucasians colonize Egypt and brought civilization. He claims we try to steal Egyptian history, but just look at his screen name "Rahotep101" after the ancient Egyptian and his outdated and obsolete pseudo Bull.

---

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simpleton:

quote:

---

Neolithic contacts between Western Asia and Egypt include the transmission of lithic technologies such as the Helwan retouch (Gopher 1993), domesticated plants and animals sometime after 6000 B.C. (Wetterstrom-1993), and maceheads (Cialowicz 1989). Chalcolithic contacts include the transfer of metallurgical technology and raw
materials through the trading entrepot at Maadi (Rizkana and Seeher 1989, Seeher 1990). Uruk-related material in Egypt which may be dated to the middle Naqada II horizon includes the introduction of cylinder seals, lapis lazuli, and
stylistic influences on locally produced knife handles (Crowfoot-Payne 1968; Boehmer 1974a, b; Midant-Reyes 1987; Smith 1992; Sievertsen 1992; Pittman 1996; Bavay 1997).

---

---

Okay. And trade of goods is not the same as formative element or influence.

He [Gunther Dreyer] concluded his presentation by noting similarities between specific Egyptian and Mesopotamian objects and suggesting that perhaps there is an initial influence of Egyptian writing on Mesopotamia because there are signs on Mesopotamian objects that are only "readable" from the standpoint of the Egyptian language, but not the Mesopotamian language. - Mario Beatty, "Too Much Stuff": Recent Finds in Predynastic Egypt

By the way, little girl do you not know that the Natufians who began agriculture in the Near East were African immigrants in the first place??
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 








Canopic Jar Lid, New Kingdom, Dynasty 18, late reign of Akhenaten, ca. 1340–1336 B.C.
Egyptian; From KV55, Valley of the Kings, western Thebes
Egyptian alabaster with glass and stone inlays
H. 20 1/2 in. (52.1 cm)

Theodore M. Davis Collection, Bequest of Theodore M. Davis, 1915 (30.8.54)


Source: Canopic Jar Lid [Egyptian; From KV55, Valley of the Kings, western Thebes] (30.8.54) | Heilbrunn Timeline of Art History | The Metropolitan Museum of Art
 

---

Posted by alTakruri (Member # 10195) on :
 
My thanks to everybody who didn't allow the losers
to lead them away from the gist of this thread Cherry
picked IMAGES in the vain hope of covering up their
grand epic saga of a fail.

It's plain as a window pane who's cherry picking images
and who's presenting random samples of AE's population.

Remember: stay on that ass and never chase deflecting
points brought up by your adversary; stay on point and
direct them back to your point whenever they start their
sidewinding attempts at redirection for manipulative control.
.
 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Old Kingdom:

 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Limestone head from the 4th dynasty:


 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Statue of Kaaper from the 5th dynasty:


 

---

Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 
^ Nice portraits. We posted those ourselves years ago, but no doubt you seem to think they are proof of 'white' Egyptians. Sorry but unpainted or paint-lost statues does not equal 'white'! LOL

Ka'aper with color.





Ka'aper's wife


 

---

Posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist (Member # 18853) on :
 
''I suppose these early white Egyptologists were "Afrocentric" as well! LOL''
=======

That's called quote mining and diliberately distorting the context etc of the quote or position of something/someone. You usually however see this in creation vs. evolution literature (both sides) however it seems now afrocentrics do it as well.

Petrie believed the ancient egyptians were Caucasians/mediterraneanoids not negroids. I own much of his literature, so if you want quotes i can give them to you.

No white Egyptologist from the 19th to early 20th century ever claimed the ancient egyptians were black.

You have to remember afrocentrism is a modern invention - a political construct by the far left to attack whites.
 

---

Posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist (Member # 18853) on :
 
''Natufians who began agriculture in the Near East were African immigrants''
======

Never been proven. This claim is based on some flimsy discoveries of 2 or 3 prognathic skulls.
 

---

Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 
^ Incorrect. It was more than just "2 or 3" skulls but various remains including skeletal bodies with tropical proportions. Not to mention genetics shows the presence of African lineages in the Near East that are dated to that very time period!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglophilic_Pyramidiot:

''I suppose these early white Egyptologists were "Afrocentric" as well! LOL''
=======

That's called quote mining and diliberately distorting the context etc of the quote or position of something/someone. You usually however see this in creation vs. evolution literature (both sides) however it seems now afrocentrics do it as well.

Petrie believed the ancient egyptians were Caucasians/mediterraneanoids not negroids. I own much of his literature, so if you want quotes i can give them to you.

---

quote:

---

No white Egyptologist from the 19th to early 20th century ever claimed the ancient egyptians were black.

You have to remember afrocentrism is a modern invention - a political construct by the far left to attack whites.

---

Correction. They were acknowledged as black just not "negro". You see, there is this notion of a Hamitic as in "black-skinned Caucasoid race". Even Egyptologists at that time period were not stupid enough to call them 'white' or fair-skinned as all the preserved color portraits show them as very dark skinned or 'black'.
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
Actually Peitre began to reject the idea that Egypt was the Foundation of a Dynastic Race and began to emphasize the African role in Egypt(Which was largely dismissed by the mainstream).

You realize it was F. Peitrie that introduced the evidence that the 12th Dynasty had direct relations with Ta Seti, Nubians.


A breath of life came from the Sudan.[/b This [b]southern source was likewise the inspiration of . . ." the 1st, 2nd (Anu),
3rd [Sudanese], 4th, 5th, 12th [Sudanese] dynasties.

-Professor William M. Finders Petrie
Sudanese Dynasties

Peitrie obviously believed the First and some of the most important Dynasties were of Sudanese Origin, further backed by direct evidence and by Manetho himself.

Also If Im not mistaken F. Petrie was among the first to advocate the African origin and distinctness of Egyptian religion..

LOL...

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist:
''I suppose these early white Egyptologists were "Afrocentric" as well! LOL''
=======

That's called quote mining and diliberately distorting the context etc of the quote or position of something/someone. You usually however see this in creation vs. evolution literature (both sides) however it seems now afrocentrics do it as well.

Petrie believed the ancient egyptians were Caucasians/mediterraneanoids not negroids. I own much of his literature, so if you want quotes i can give them to you.

No white Egyptologist from the 19th to early 20th century ever claimed the ancient egyptians were black.

You have to remember afrocentrism is a modern invention - a political construct by the far left to attack whites.

---

 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Prince Ankhhaf from the 4th dynasty:


 

---

Posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist (Member # 18853) on :
 
''They were acknowledged as black just not "negro". You see, there is this notion of a Hamitic as in "black-skinned Caucasoid race".''
=======

Not that i'm aware of. I think this is another afrocentric lie. Hardly any white scholars believed in that Hamitic nonsense about 'dark whites'. Just view the history of this on wiki -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamitic

Among the proponents were only guiseppe sergi and some obscure explorer. Basically hardly anyone subscribed to this rubbish.
 

---

Posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist (Member # 18853) on :
 
- Petrie proposed a Caucasian origin for the Badari culture. He found that that wheat-seeds in the lowest layers of egypt were from a source outside of Africa. His view was that the ancient egyptians, including their pre-dyanasties were of the same kindred stock of the Phoenicians - mediterraneanoids. Not blacks.

I'm sure most egyptologists accepted that blacks arrived in ancient egypt at a later time, and in fact if anything they led to the downfall of egypt, just like how Rome fell because of mass oriental immigration.
 

---

Posted by anguishofbeing (Member # 16736) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Djehuti:
They were acknowledged as black just not "negro". You see, there is this notion of a Hamitic as in "black-skinned Caucasoid race".

---

The mythical "dark-skinned Caucasoids"/Hamitic race were not seen as black people, just dark skinned whites. You dont know what the hell you are talking about as usual.
 

---

Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 
^ Nope. The 18th and early 19th century scholars made it clear that these were "extremely dark-skinned, black even" but not the same as negro. Of course I know what I'm talking about since I read the literature first hand. Apparently you haven't! Which is why you've obviously never heard of the phrase "black-skinned whites" [sic]!!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglophile_Pyramidiot:

- Petrie proposed a Caucasian origin for the Badari culture. He found that that wheat-seeds in the lowest layers of egypt were from a source outside of Africa. His view was that the ancient egyptians, including their pre-dyanasties were of the same kindred stock of the Phoenicians - mediterraneanoids. Not blacks.

I'm sure most egyptologists accepted that blacks arrived in ancient egypt at a later time, and in fact if anything they led to the downfall of egypt, just like how Rome fell because of mass oriental immigration.

---

quote:

---

''They were acknowledged as black just not "negro". You see, there is this notion of a Hamitic as in "black-skinned Caucasoid race".''
=======

Not that i'm aware of. I think this is another afrocentric lie. Hardly any white scholars believed in that Hamitic nonsense about 'dark whites'. Just view the history of this on wiki -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamitic

Among the proponents were only guiseppe sergi and some obscure explorer. Basically hardly anyone subscribed to this rubbish.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by A Simpleton:

Prince Ankhhaf from the 4th dynasty:

---

A white man??



I think not.

King Sahura from the 5th dynasty.




 

---

Posted by anguishofbeing (Member # 16736) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Djehuti:
^ Nope. The 18th and early 19th century scholars made it clear that these were "extremely dark-skinned, black even" but not the same as negro.

---

Name the scholar that said they were black people, but not negro.
 

---

Posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist (Member # 18853) on :
 
''"Mediterranean race" was said to originate IN Africa in Ethiopia to be exact as postulated by Sir Grafton Elliot Smith!!''
====

The Med race has its origin in the middle-east:

''... The Mediterranean race, then, is indigenous to, and the principal element in, the Southwest Asia.''
- Carleton Coon, the Story of the Middle East, 1958, pp. 154-157

The Nordic subrace is then said to have sprung from the Med race, hence in some early literature the Nordics are called 'depigmented mediterraneanoids'' as the theory is, as they traveled north they became lighter skinned. The theory however was challenged when Sumerian artforms first came to light in the early 20th century as they depict light skinned racial types with blue eyes. It is therefore probable that the Med and Nord sprung from a predesessor race that contained both phenotypes - which exactly is what the sumerians were. Dark/black haired but light eyed and white skinned.
 

---

Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 
^ Decades before that as stated by Grafton Smith, it was stated to originate in Ethiopia. Only later was it changed to the 'Near East' due to the fact that Mediterraneans Euros felt too uncomfortable with African origins!

Workers from Saqqara 3rd dynasty.







Nobles








 

---

Posted by anguishofbeing (Member # 16736) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Djehuti:
Workers from Saqqara 3rd dynasty.





[img]http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://alain.guilleux.free.fr/abousir_temple_solaire/P7151053.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi%3Fubb%3Dprint_ topic %3Bf%3D15%3Bt%3D000009&usg=__sxATtBO-_D6wXV5RTmdUdTlwO1A=&h=375&w=500&sz=21&hl=en&start=111&zoom=1&tbnid=O4OBeEjT72gcQM:&tbnh=131&tbnw=169&ei=HBbbTZfCKpCltwfiwOTCDw&prev=/search%3F q%3DKem%2BWer%2BAusar%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1024%26bih%3D605%26gbv%3D2%26tbm%3Disch0%2C3078&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=258&vpy=312&dur=439&hovh=131&hovw=169&tx=168&ty=170&sqi=2&page=8&ndsp=18& ved=1t:429,r:1,s:111&biw=1024&bih=605[/img]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist:
- Petrie proposed a Caucasian origin for the Badari culture. He found that that wheat-seeds in the lowest layers of egypt were from a source outside of Africa. His view was that the ancient egyptians, including their pre-dyanasties were of the same kindred stock of the Phoenicians - mediterraneanoids. Not blacks.

I'm sure most egyptologists accepted that blacks arrived in ancient egypt at a later time, and in fact if anything they led to the downfall of egypt, just like how Rome fell because of mass oriental immigration.

---

 

---

Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 
^ Like most trolls he appears to have selective amnesia.
 

---

Posted by anguishofbeing (Member # 16736) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Djehuti:
The notion of black-skinned whites was widespread during the 19th to early 20th centuries. One of the proponents was John Hanning Speke who classified even Bantus like the Tutsi and Bahima as "black-skinned whites"!

---

WTF??

Mary, for the love of god please try to stay focused for once. Name the scholar that called the AEs black people, but not negro.
 

---

Posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova (Member # 15718) on :
 
Ish,
Any idea who is depicted on the jars?
One of the royals or commoner?


 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
Zara I believe its Princess Meritaten/Merytaten..

quote:

---

Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova:
Ish,
Any idea who is depicted on the jars?
One of the royals or commoner?

---

 

---

Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Menkaure from the 4th dynasty:




 

---

Posted by Kalonji (Member # 17303) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
Zara I believe its Princess Meritaten/Merytaten..

quote:

---

Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova:
Ish,
Any idea who is depicted on the jars?
One of the royals or commoner?

---

---

Its Kiya
Some see/saw her as a candidate for being the mother of Tut
 

---

Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
^^^^
Kalonji is right its Kiya...This is Princess Meritaten..


 

---

Posted by Kalonji (Member # 17303) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:



Riverboat
Thebes, tomb of Meketre, early Dynasty 12, ca. 1985 B.C.
Gessoed and painted wood, l. 50 3/8 in.
Rogers Fund and Edward S. Harkness Gift, 1920
20.3.1

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:


Granary
Thebes, tomb of Meketre, early Dynasty 12, ca. 1985 B.C.
Gessoed and painted wood, l. 29 1/8 in.
Rogers Fund and Edward S. Harkness Gift, 1920
20.3.11

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:


herds of cattle are being driven past Mehenkwetre by muscular and active herdsmen, carrying staves. The lord, attended by his son and heir, sits in a sort of grand-stand, surveying his live stock critically while scribes take note of the number and condition of the beasts. The figures of the men are each about eight inches high.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:


Standing Statuette of Lady Tuty

Lady Tuty's statuette was discovered in a communal tomb at Medinet Gurob. The style of Tuty's sculpture is more traditional than a statue of Lady Mi also found at the tomb: the figure is slimmer and the fringed dress is depicted in a plainer, heavier fabric. Certain elements—such as the big gilded earrings and the faint traces of gilded sandals—associate her with the extraordinary wealth of Amunhotep's time. The cone on her head represents a type of perfumed ointment worn by wealthy Egyptians at banquets and other opulent occasions. The cone gradually melted, releasing its fragrance over the hair and clothes.

* Medium: Wood, gilded
* Place Excavated: Medinet Gurob, Egypt
* Dates: ca. 1390-1352 B.C.E.
* Dynasty: XVIII Dynasty
* Period: New Kingdom
* Dimensions: 10 1/8 x 1 7/8 x 5 1/2 in. (25.7 x 4.8 x 14 cm)

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quote:

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Originally posted by Just call me Jari:

Statuette of the Lady Mi Standing
One of the finest wooden sculptures to survive from antiquity, this exquisitely carved figure of Lady Mi shows the elaborate wig and huge gold earrings worn by the great women of King Amunhotep's court. Both Amunhotep III and Queen Tiye allowed themselves to be represented as mature—rather than eternally youthful—individuals. Faithful courtiers followed the royal lead. The carver of this figure indicated the drooping breasts and sagging belly of an older woman beneath the gossamer linen of the dress.

* Medium: Wood, gilded
* Place Excavated: Medinet Ghurob, Egypt
* Dates: ca. 1390-1353 B.C.E.
* Dynasty: XVIII Dynasty
* Period: New Kingdom
* Dimensions: 6 3/16 x 1 3/4 x 2 1/4 in. (15.7 x 4.4 x 5.7 cm) Base: 3/4 in. (1.9 cm)

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Flood protection keeps preventing me from relocating the pics in a faster pace, which makes it time consuming. This will be my last.
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
More old Kingdom:


 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Khaemheset with wife and son from the old kingdom:


 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Nesa and Sepa from the old kingdom:


 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Mummy case for Lady Teshat:


 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Nice. Although the paint looks faded.

Will post old Kingdom tomb images momentarily
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Mummy case for Maritamun:


 

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Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 
^^ LOL The Simpleton shoots herself in the face by posting portraits showing that the original dark paint has faded.
 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Old Kingdom images:

Irukaptah:


Tep-em-Ankh:


Ptah-shepses:



Old Kingdom Scribe:


^It looks like there is some paint left on the cheek, so I posted it.

Family group of Udjankhdjes


Old Kingdom Tomb scenes:




 

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Posted by alTakruri (Member # 10195) on :
 
SG

Decent job. Knowing AE attracted foreigners
I always wondered why so few ever make the
coffee table books selection.

Apparently they were such a small minority
that no scenes of masses of them exist. I'm
counting on you if there any to dig them up.

Just be sure to keep identifying your images
so anyone can do "background checks" on them.
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Plaster mask of an actual person, possibly King Teti 6th dynasty:



 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Shepseskaf 4th dynasty:


 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Woman from the old kingdom:


 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
A 12th dynasty funerary mask:


 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Statue of Memi and Sabu, Old Kingdom, Dynasty 4, ca. 2575–2465 B.C.
Egyptian; Probably from Giza
Painted limestone
H. 24 3/8 in. (62 cm)
Rogers Fund, 1948 (48.111)


Pair statues, usually depicting a husband and wife, were frequently placed in a serdab, the hidden statue chamber often found in nonroyal tomb chapels of the Old Kingdom. The Egyptians believed that the spirit of the deceased could use such a statue as a home and enter it in order to benefit from gifts of food that were brought to the offering chapel of the tomb.

The inscription on the front of this statue identifies these individuals as the Royal Acquaintance Memi and Sabu. Although the text does not specify a relationship, they were probably husband and wife, as is common for pair statues where a relationship is recorded. The pose is unusual because Memi is returning Sabu's embrace by draping his arm around her shoulders. This restricting gesture may account for the fact that he stands with his feet together, rather than striding forward in the normal masculine pose.

Until recently, this statue was dated to Dynasty 5, but the figures have many features in common with Fourth Dynasty statues found in the nonroyal cemeteries surrounding the Great Pyramid of Khufu (Cheops) at Giza. In addition, the pose has only two known parallels, both from Giza and both datable to Dynasty 4.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



King Sahure and a nome god, Old Kingdom, Dynasty 5, reign of Sahure, ca. 2458–2446 B.C.
Egyptian
Gneiss

H. 25 1/4 in. (64 cm), W. 18 1/8 in. (46 cm), D. 16 3/8 in. (41.5 cm)
Rogers Fund, 1918 (18.2.4)

This is the only preserved three-dimensional representation that has been identified as Sahure, the second ruler of Dynasty 5. Seated on a throne, the king is accompanied by a smaller male figure personifying the local god of the Coptite nome, the fifth nome (province) of Upper Egypt. This deity offers the king an ankh (hieroglyph meaning "life") with his left hand. The nome standard, with its double-falcon emblem, is carved above the god's head. Sahure wears the nemes headcloth and straight false beard of a living pharaoh. The flaring hood of the uraeus, the cobra goddess who protected Egyptian kings, is visible on his brow. The nome god wears the archaic wig and curling beard of a deity.

The statue may have been intended to decorate the king's pyramid complex at Abusir, about fifteen miles south of Giza. At the end of the previous dynasty, multiple statues of this type were placed in the temple of Menkaure (Mycerinus) to symbolize the gathering of nome gods from Upper and Lower Egypt around the king. However, since no other statues of this type are preserved from Sahure's reign, it is possible that this statue was a royal dedication in one of the temples in Coptos (modern Qift).
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Archers (detail), Old Kingdom, Dynasty 4, reigns of Khufu to Khafre, ca. 2551–2494 B.C.

Egyptian; Excavated at Lisht, reused in the pyramid of Amenemhat I, probably originally from Giza
Painted limestone

H. 10 in. (25.4 cm), W. 14 3/4 in. (37.5 cm)
Rogers Fund and Edward S. Harkness Gift, 1922 (22.1.23)
ON VIEW: GALLERY 103   Last Updated May 10, 2011

This relief depicts a battle scene in which two rows of archers, one group standing, the other kneeling in front, are shown ready to fire. In the detail illustrated here, the beautifully carved head and shoulders of one archer are partially obscured by the left forearm and right hand of a second man who is drawing a bow. His fingers steady an arrow in the bowstring while his thumb and forefinger clutch two more arrows, which he can flick quickly into place.
The carving is in raised relief, a technique in which the background is carved away, leaving the decoration raised on the surface. The face of the archer has been carefully modeled and details such as the twisted bowstring and the spines on the feathers have been meticulously rendered. Only traces remain of the paint that originally enhanced nearly all Egyptian sculpture.

The fragment was discovered by the Museum's Egyptian Expedition during excavations at Lisht, a site about thirty miles south of Cairo. It had been reused in the pyramid of Amenemhat I (ca. 1991–1961 B.C.), founder of Dynasty 12. However, the style of the carving suggests that this relief originally decorated one of the Fourth Dynasty pyramid temples at Giza. The reuse of building materials is not uncommon in ancient Egypt.
 

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Posted by Kawit (Member # 18945) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Ish Gebor:




Uploaded with ImageShack.us





Canopic Jar Lid, New Kingdom, Dynasty 18, late reign of Akhenaten, ca. 1340–1336 B.C.
Egyptian; From KV55, Valley of the Kings, western Thebes
Egyptian alabaster with glass and stone inlays
H. 20 1/2 in. (52.1 cm)

Theodore M. Davis Collection, Bequest of Theodore M. Davis, 1915 (30.8.54)


Source: Canopic Jar Lid [Egyptian; From KV55, Valley of the Kings, western Thebes] (30.8.54) | Heilbrunn Timeline of Art History | The Metropolitan Museum of Art

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Showing three finished painted and one unfinished. ( what some people don't seem to grasp)



Shawabti box and shawabtis, New Kingdom, reign of Ramesses II, ca. 1279–1213 B.C.
Egyptian; From the tomb of Sennedjem, Deir el-Medina, western Thebes
Painted wood; limestone and ink
H. of box 11 1/4 in. (28.5 cm)


The wooden shawabti box is inscribed for Paremhab, a servant in the Place of Truth who was a son or grandson of Sennedjem and Iineferti. The shawabti figures, from left to right, are inscribed for Iineferti and her eldest son, Khabekhnet; for Khonsu; for Khabekhnet alone; and for a woman named Mesu. Although Khabekhnet had a separate tomb complex near that of Sennedjem, he is depicted with his siblings in the decoration of Sennedjem's burial chamber, and objects inscribed with his name were buried in the family tomb.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Egypt in the Old Kingdom

Wooden model of servants preparing food





From the end of the Old Kingdom until the Twelfth Dynasty (that is, between about 2300 and 1800 BC), it was common practice for small wooden models of servants to be placed in tombs. The figures represented the household attendants and other servants of the deceased, and were supposed to act as magical substitutes for the persons they represented.

Most of the models depict activities connected with the production of food, drink and other basic necessities of life. With a group of these models in his tomb, the dead man was then assured of having everything he might need during the Afterlife. The figures in this group include a man squatting to cook meat on a spit, while another seems to be pouring a libation (a liquid offering to a god) from a jar over a small offering table.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Egypt in the Old Kingdom

Limestone relief from a tomb





During the Old Kingdom, there was a proliferation of relief carving on the walls of tomb chapels, ranging from standard, though important, offering scenes, through to more unusual ones such as those on this relief. Offering scenes were intended to act as a continuation of the actual provisions placed as offerings in the tomb chapel, while scenes of 'daily life' would also help to commemorate and project the personality of the tomb owner into the next world.

The carving is divided into three registers. At the top are representations of boat-builders, while at the bottom are scenes of harvesting at the left and fishing at the right. The central register is more unusual. At the left are musicians and some boys with sticks, one of whom wears a lion mask; at the right seem to be a group of boys wrestling under a shelter. The boy with the mask may represent a forerunner to the lion-maned Bes, Egyptian god of fertility and many other basic human concerns. The scene has been interpreted as a harvest rite, a protective rite, or possibly a rite that took place at the onset of puberty.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 







 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 


  

     

     
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 


Fragment of a battle scene. Thebes, Asasif, Dynasty 18, probably reign of Thutmosis IV (ca. 1400-1390 B.C.)
Painted sandstone, 24 x 45 1/4 in.
Rogers Fund, 1913
13.180.21
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Granary

Thebes, tomb of Meketre, early Dynasty 12, ca. 1985 B.C.
Gessoed and painted wood, l. 29 1/8 in.
Rogers Fund and Edward S. Harkness Gift, 1920
20.3.11



Menna and his family fishing and fowling
Facsimile of a wall painting from the tomb of Menna, Thebes,
Dynasty 18, ca. 1400-1350 B.C., by Nina de Garis Davies, 1924

Tempera on paper, 74 x 39 1/2 in.
Rogers Fund, 1930
30.4.48



Riverboat
Thebes, tomb of Meketre, early Dynasty 12, ca. 1985 B.C.
Gessoed and painted wood, l. 50 3/8 in.
Rogers Fund and Edward S. Harkness Gift, 1920
20.3.1


 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

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quote:

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Originally posted by Calabooz':
Nice. Although the paint looks faded.

Will post old Kingdom tomb images momentarily

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This is another typical statement from the 'black Egypt' possy. Pale Egyptian images are faded, dark ones are never allowed to be grimey or darkened with age (as for example happens with cedarwood). Never an explanation for why the hair is still black and the lips still red...




Not that I'm getting involved...
 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
^What a dumbass.

I said that because you can obviously see traces of the original paint left. It's easy to notice things faded.

There are several explanations as to why paint fades. Anybody knows this. Why the hell would all of these images darken? Hell, you even said the Upper Egyptian ones were preserved earlier.
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 


Either the paint's faded or the color is symbolic
 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by rahotep101:

quote:

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Originally posted by Calabooz':
Nice. Although the paint looks faded.

Will post old Kingdom tomb images momentarily

---

This is another typical statement from the 'black Egypt' possy. Pale Egyptian images are faded, dark ones are never allowed to be grimey or darkened with age (as for example happens with cedarwood). Never an explanation for why the hair is still black and the lips still red...


Not that I'm getting involved...

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Image identification?

Why did you compare the Egyptian coffin to the European woman?
 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Mask of Amenemope 1001 – 992 BC, 21st Dynasty


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Portrait Head of Echnaton (Akhenaten) New Kingdom, Dynasty 18, ca. 1340 BC


 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Siptah:

quote:

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Originally posted by rahotep101:

quote:

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Originally posted by Calabooz':
Nice. Although the paint looks faded.

Will post old Kingdom tomb images momentarily

---

This is another typical statement from the 'black Egypt' possy. Pale Egyptian images are faded, dark ones are never allowed to be grimey or darkened with age (as for example happens with cedarwood). Never an explanation for why the hair is still black and the lips still red...


Not that I'm getting involved...

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Image identification?

Why did you compare the Egyptian coffin to the European woman?

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quote:

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Never an explanation for why the hair is still black and the lips still red

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Seriously?? Are you mentally ill? If you would notice, the images I called faded were also faded on the head i.e., parts are black and faded parts white. Which SUPPORTS my statement that the skin color is faded just like the hair. You can clearly make out original paint. Really man, you are retarded.

Take note, I'm not saying all light images are faded. But you can clearly make out the ones that are.
 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Standing statue of Nefertari 19th dynasty


 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Calabooz':
^What a dumbass.

I said that because you can obviously see traces of the original paint left. It's easy to notice things faded.

There are several explanations as to why paint fades. Anybody knows this. Why the hell would all of these images darken? Hell, you even said the Upper Egyptian ones were preserved earlier.

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Yes but we had a cetain bozo claiming that the Nefertari tomb portrait was faded and the colour of the blushing cheek was residue of colour that had once covered the whole figure, until a dozen other images all with blushing cheeks were shown. My point is that the 'fading' claim is a typical excuse we hear from black egypt advocates.



Not that I'm getting involved.
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
Ramesses II, 19th Dynasty



Ramesses II



Thutmose III, 18th Dynasty



Userkaf 5th dynasty



Amenemhat III 12th dynasty


Akhenaten (Amenhotep IV) 18th dytnasty

 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
.


RARE EXAMPLE OF AN EGYPTIAN MAN
WITH THE PAINT -NOT- FADED:



compare to

severely paint faded formerly dark (aka black) woman:



*or symbolic
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Unidentified couple from the 18th dynasty:


 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Thutmose III 18th dynasty:




 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

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Yes but we had a cetain bozo claiming that the Nefertari tomb portrait was faded and the colour of the blushing cheek was residue of colour that had once covered the whole figure, until a dozen other images all with blushing cheeks were shown. My point is that the 'fading' claim is a typical excuse we hear from black egypt advocates.

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What the hell are you talking about? You were the one who used the blushing cheek thing as an excuse to claim she was non-black. Then when another image showed up you claimed she looked like a dark pink person, whatever the phuck that's supposed to be.


And when I said some of the images simple girl posted were faded, I said so because it was obvious as they were discolored. No excuse necessary. And in case you forgot this entire thread is filled with dark skinned Egyptian depictions
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 


Notice here the darker portions around the cheek nose and chin.

Then notice the lighter portion under the eye on the neck etc.

According to experts if she was the darker color she was of the black race

On the other hand if she was the color of her neck she was of the white race

basically we are dealing with the two races, the black race and the white race. They are different


-Professor Ingbar J. Butteheade
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Thinite period 3100-2700 B.C.:




 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Osiride Head of Hatshepsut 18th dynasty


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Depiction of Thutmose 4 and Osiris from the sacred tomb of Thutmose 4


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Statue of Menkaure 4th dynasty


 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
So far, as we can see from people's postings here, Egypt was multi-racial Pharaohs and Peasants.
 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Depiction of Horemheb from the sacred tomb of Horemheb 18th dynasty


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Kneeling Statue of Pepy 6th dynasty


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Statue of a Queen Ahmes Nefertari 18th dynasty


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Mask of Hatnofer 18th dynasty


 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
^^^
Can you explain to me wherein lies the blackness of the above? Also why a black civilization would represent its goddesses thus?
VVV



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Not that I'm condescending to take part in this thread....
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness:
So far, as we can see from people's postings here, Egypt was multi-racial Pharaohs and Peasants.

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quote:

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Originally posted by A Simple Girl:

quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness:
So far, as we can see from people's postings here, Egypt was multi-racial Pharaohs and Peasants.

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It seems that there were even different depictions of the same person. But it is quite clear that there was more than one ethnic group involved.

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quote:

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Originally posted by rahotep101:
^^^
Can you explain to me wherein lies the blackness of the above?

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quote:

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Also why a black civilization would represent its goddesses thus?
VVV

http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/7525/goddesses.jpg

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You should be asking yourself why they shouldn't represent their Goddesses as such? Who are you, a man living in the 21st century to question a population on how they should represent their Goddesses? From what i know, Yellow was used on their skin color to signify Gold because it was believed to be the flesh of the Gods.
 

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Posted by adrianne (Member # 10761) on :
 
"Originally posted by the lioness:
So far, as we can see from people's postings here, Egypt was multi-racial Pharaohs and Peasants.

It seems that there were even different depictions of the same person. But it is quite clear that there was more than one ethnic group involved. "


thats like saying greece was a multi national nation just because their were blacks there?

show us pharoahs from the dynastic dynasty 1-3 that dont look like black africans
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Woman making beer from the 5th dynasty:


 

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Posted by alTakruri (Member # 10195) on :
 
In fact why don't we start a companion thread
that first of all lists all the pharoahs in
chonological order, as much as possible, and
then post images of each one, again maintaining
chronological order and only of native dynasties
up to Neferkare of Dynasty 23. I suggest using
the king list in Baines & Malek.

quote:

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Originally posted by adrianne:
"Originally posted by the lioness:
So far, as we can see from people's postings here, Egypt was multi-racial Pharaohs and Peasants.

It seems that there were even different depictions of the same person. But it is quite clear that there was more than one ethnic group involved. "


thats like saying greece was a multi national nation just because their were blacks there?

show us pharoahs from the dynastic dynasty 1-3 that dont look like black africans

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Head of Huni 3rd dynasty

 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Pair Statue of Nebsen and Nebet-ta 18th dynasty


 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Siptah:

quote:

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Originally posted by rahotep101:
^^^
Can you explain to me wherein lies the blackness of the above?

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Do you mean Hatnofer? Next time please be specific. As for his features, Hatnofer has a protruding wide mouth and a flat nose. Black features are usually defined by protrusion in the mouth area and their relatively flat noses.

quote:

---

Also why a black civilization would represent its goddesses thus?
VVV

http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/7525/goddesses.jpg

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You should be asking yourself why they shouldn't represent their Goddesses as such? Who are you, a man living in the 21st century to question a population on how they should represent their Goddesses? From what i know, Yellow was used on their skin color to signify Gold because it was believed to be the flesh of the Gods.

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Hatnofer does not have a protruding mouth or a flat nose. You're seeing what you want to see.


As for goddesses, what is yellow about this?



Which set of people do the Egyptian goddesses most resemble, Egyptian Copts or black Sudanese?


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Panting of Naos deity from the Tomb of Nefertari 19th dynasty


 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Siptah:
Panting of Naos deity from the Tomb of Nefertari 19th dynasty

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Nefertari? Oh you mean this Nefertari!


Who in the darker images, much like most of the Egyptians in this thread, manages to be no browner than an Italian conservator...



 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

---

It seems that there were even different depictions of the same person. But it is quite clear that there was more than one ethnic group involved.

---

quote:

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Not that I'm condescending to take part in this thread....

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Al Takuri is right man. You do post an awful lot for someone who isn't participating.

Let it be known, Rahotep is unable to think for himself. He is a sock puppet of phoenician7

More images:

Mentuhotep II:







Nefertiti

 

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Posted by adrianne (Member # 10761) on :
 
alkaturi saya

"In fact why don't we start a companion thread
that first of all lists all the pharoahs in
chonological order, as much as possible, and
then post images of each one, again maintaining
chronological order and only of native dynasties
up to Neferkare of Dynasty 23."


yes lets do that'
the caucasian,mixed egyptian supporters WILL NOT attempt this as their belief system will be destroyed before their eyes.
 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Head of Pepi II or Mentuhotep? Louvre Museum 6th-12th Dynasty


 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by adrianne:
alkaturi saya

"In fact why don't we start a companion thread
that first of all lists all the pharoahs in
chonological order, as much as possible, and
then post images of each one, again maintaining
chronological order and only of native dynasties
up to Neferkare of Dynasty 23."


yes lets do that'
the caucasian,mixed egyptian supporters WILL NOT attempt this as their belief system will be destroyed before their eyes.

---

quote:

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Originally posted by Calabooz':
[QB] [QUOTE]It seems that there were even different depictions of the same person. But it is quite clear that there was more than one ethnic group involved.

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quote:

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How stupid are you? I mean really. I have asked you over 5 times now any evidence to suggest significant non-African gene flow during state formation to support your claim that they were mixed. FIVE TIMES. What makes you confused with race and variation to think that they are synonymous?
[QUOTE]


I suppose you think the light coloring of this predynastic mummy was spray painted on the body?



 

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Posted by adrianne (Member # 10761) on :
 
alkaturi says

"In fact why don't we start a companion thread
that first of all lists all the pharoahs in
chonological order, as much as possible, and
then post images of each one, again maintaining
chronological order and only of native dynasties
up to Neferkare of Dynasty 23."


yes lets do that'
the caucasian,mixed egyptian supporters WILL NOT attempt this as their belief system will be destroyed before their eyes
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
One of two mummies found in Libya. Carbon 14 dated to 6000 years old.
Oldest mummies ever found. As can be seen, it doesn't appear to be that
of a typical black woman.


 

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Posted by adrianne (Member # 10761) on :
 
simple girl says

"I suppose you think the light coloring of this predynastic mummy was spray painted on the body?"

simple girl/rahotep/confirming truth/etc logic

if white mummy found in egypt means
whites helped built egypt

if black mummy found in levant/mesoptamia/greece means
blacks DID NOT build help these civilizatins/countys
 

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Posted by adrianne (Member # 10761) on :
 
"One of two mummies found in Libya. Carbon 14 dated to 6000 years old. Oldest mummies ever found. As can be seen, it doesn't appear to be that of a typical black woman."

the mummys found in libya are known as the black mummy, and was identified as such
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by adrianne:
"One of two mummies found in Libya. Carbon 14 dated to 6000 years old. Oldest mummies ever found. As can be seen, it doesn't appear to be that of a typical black woman."

the mummys found in libya are known as the black mummy, and was identified as such

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No, you obviously have your mummy confused with two other mummies carbon 14 dated to being at least 600 years older than the Uan Muhuggiag mummy. One of which I have provided a picture of.


 

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Posted by adrianne (Member # 10761) on :
 
wheres the details of these new mummys?
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by adrianne:
wheres the details of these new mummys?

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http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=it&u=http://www.archeologia.it/ras_detail.asp%3FIDSezione%3D20%26IDArticolo%3D830&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=4&ct=result&prev=/search %3Fq%3Dmummie%2Bdi%2BTakarkori%26start%3D10%26ndsp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26sa%3DN
 

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Posted by adrianne (Member # 10761) on :
 
how does the women mummy look anything different then the black mummy ?

whats your conclusion?
 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Statue of Ramesses III

 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Ancient Egypt Anatomy of a Civilisation(Paperback) by Barry Kemp (Author) Publisher: Routledge; 2 edition (December 12, 2005) p.54


"Moving to the opposite geographic extremity, the very small sample populations available from northern Egypt from before the 1st Dynasty(Merimda, Maadi and Wadi Digla) turn out to be significantly different from sample populations from early Palestine and Byblos, suggesting a lack of common ancestors over a long time. If there was a south-north cline of variation along the Nile Valley it did not, from this limited evidence, continue smoothly on into Palestine. The limb-length proportions of males from the Egyptian sites group them with Africans rather than with Europeans"


By contrast an excavated set of around 300 burials from Tell el-Dab'a in the northeast delta belonging to a group considered to be Palestinian immigrants living in the late Middle Kingdom/Second Intermediate Period (1750 BC-1550 BC) have physical characteristics which group them more closely with ancient populations from the Near East and at a greater distance from those from Elephantine, although male and female characteristics also show differences"
 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Statue of Mentuhotep II 12th dynasty


 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

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I suppose you think the light coloring of this predynastic mummy was spray painted on the body?

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quote:

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As can be seen, it doesn't appear to be that of a typical black woman."

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quote:

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Originally posted by A Simple Girl:

quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness:
So far, as we can see from people's postings here, Egypt was multi-racial Pharaohs and Peasants.

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It seems that there were even different depictions of the same person. But it is quite clear that there was more than one ethnic group involved.

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quote:

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Originally posted by alTakruri:
This thread shows beyond a doubt a few sprinkles of salt
among droves of dark skinned native African Egyptians and nary a scene of a group of foreign white naturalized Egyptians. Pray tell, why is that?

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Gaul:

quote:

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Originally posted by A Simple Girl:

quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness:
So far, as we can see from people's postings here, Egypt was multi-racial Pharaohs and Peasants.

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It seems that there were even different depictions of the same person. But it is quite clear that there was more than one ethnic group involved.

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How about you show us as described by al-Takruri below:

quote:

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Originally posted by alTakruri:
This thread shows beyond a doubt a few sprinkles of salt
among droves of dark skinned native African Egyptians and nary a scene of a group of foreign white naturalized Egyptians. Pray tell, why is that?

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How about it? Present the bolded to the forum. Thank you.

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What do you mean? You want a group photo of white people? How's this one below? I don't know if they could have been called lilly white, but they sure look alot closer to white than sub-saharan black.


 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Shuroy and his wife








Old Kingdom Ka statue


Nefer-hetepes


Nebreshy and Amenhotep




^The white part was left unpainted
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
^ The images above are too obscure to be considered black or white.
 

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Posted by The Gaul (Member # 16198) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
]What do you mean? You want a group photo of white people? How's this one below? I don't know if they could have been called lilly white, but they sure look alot closer to white than sub-saharan black.

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quote:

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Originally posted by The Gaul:

quote:

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Originally posted by A Simple Girl:
]What do you mean? You want a group photo of white people? How's this one below? I don't know if they could have been called lilly white, but they sure look alot closer to white than sub-saharan black.

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Please spare me the highly ignorant "sub-saharan" black talk. Unless of course you want to display that you truly don't have a clue when it comes to said "blacks", then be my guest.

There are numberous hand carved scenes of daily life which contain 5 to 15 figures of obviously dark-skinned people. I'm sure you've seen them.

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quote:

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Originally posted by DaDumb1_01:

This is another typical statement from the 'black Egypt' possy. Pale Egyptian images are faded, dark ones are never allowed to be grimey or darkened with age (as for example happens with cedarwood). Never an explanation for why the hair is still black and the lips still red...

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quote:

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Not that I'm getting involved...

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quote:

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Yes but we had a cetain bozo claiming that the Nefertari tomb portrait was faded and the colour of the blushing cheek was residue of colour that had once covered the whole figure, until a dozen other images all with blushing cheeks were shown. My point is that the 'fading' claim is a typical excuse we hear from black egypt advocates.

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LOL No doubt I'm the "bozo" you're referring to! Apparently you forgot to explain to me how the remnants of darker paint could be "blush" it is not only found on the cheek, but the chin, nose, and even arms. If this was an indication of realistic ruddiness or redness of her skin, one would think she suffered from a skin disorder like psoriasis or something.

Also what about sections of her tomb where the paint is best preserved??


I suppose here she has a really deep tan. LOL

quote:

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Not that I'm getting involved.

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Of course not, because you know you would be humiliated as you are in practically every other thread.
 

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Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by A Simpleton:

Woman making beer from the 5th dynasty:

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quote:

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I suppose you think the light coloring of this predynastic mummy was spray painted on the body?

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And I suppose you think a human's skin retains its original color, texture, and every other characteristic thousands of years after death in a dried out condition.

If that's the case then I suppose Tut was really this black when he was alive..



Meanwhile his mother must have been gray in color.

quote:

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One of two mummies found in Libya. Carbon 14 dated to 6000 years old.
Oldest mummies ever found. As can be seen, it doesn't appear to be that
of a typical black woman.

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quote:

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What do you mean? You want a group photo of white people? How's this one below? I don't know if they could have been called lilly white, but they sure look alot closer to white than sub-saharan black.

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So you consider limestone statues ---some of whom were obviously painted with dark colors which have faded away-- to be indicative of "white" people?!

And is there no reason why I call you a Simpleton?? LMAO
 

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Posted by Just call me Jari (Member # 14451) on :
 
^^^^
Poor Simple Girl is desperate at this point..LOL...Notice 80% of what she posts is unpainted or faded...LOL.

As the Gaul says Ive got plenty of images with full groups of people with Dark Skin, Ish posted plenty of Images of Large groups with Dark Skin...Simpl Girl has to resort to Unpainted statues..
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
^^^^
Poor Simple Girl is desperate at this point..LOL...Notice 80% of what she posts is unpainted or faded...LOL.

As the Gaul says Ive got plenty of images with full groups of people with Dark Skin, Ish posted plenty of Images of Large groups with Dark Skin...Simpl Girl has to resort to Unpainted statues..

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quote:

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Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
^^^^
what kind of stupid question is that..?? who the f-k do you think. Im not going to dignify that with a response.. Post these large groups of Eurasians or STFU. Stop resorting to fallacy logic and get the posting.

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quote:

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What do you mean? You want a group photo of white people? How's this one below? I don't know if they could have been called lilly white, but they sure look alot closer to white than sub-saharan black.

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quote:

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Originally posted by A Simple Girl:

quote:

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Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
^^^^
what kind of stupid question is that..?? who the f-k do you think. Im not going to dignify that with a response.. Post these large groups of Eurasians or STFU. Stop resorting to fallacy logic and get the posting.

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What's the matter? Why can't you tell us who these people are?

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^^^^
Post the images of Eurasians, Im not going to follow your stupid ass in some Circular Reasoning All Around the Mulberry bush argument.

Post Large Groups of Eurasians or STFU..

Here is a good image of a Eurasian...post a large group like this..





Failure to do so will prove your desperation and numerous attempts to introduce a Red Herring fallacy Argument.
 

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Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by A Simpleton:

The images above are too obscure to be considered black or white.

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What about these:

Egyptian armed forces


another brewer woman




New Kingdom banquet


Old Kingdom priest


Old Kingdom hippopotamus hunt

 

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Posted by Djehuti (Member # 6698) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Calabooz':

You must be blind or mentally ill. The latter makes far much more sense.

You do realize that you can still make out original painting on some of those images, right? The others were probably never painted at all.

I have posted some images, along with a vase majority by Ish Gebor and Siptah and Jari. The vast majority are dark skinned. Almost none of the images you posted are painted or they are faded which is apparent given the discolored look they have.

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quote:

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Originally posted by Just call me Jari:

^^^^
Post the images of Eurasians, Im not going to follow your stupid ass in some Circular Reasoning All Around the Mulberry bush argument.

Post Large Groups of Eurasians or STFU..

Here is a good image of a Eurasian...post a large group like this..





Failure to do so will prove your desperation and numerous attempts to introduce a Red Herring fallacy Argument.

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That portrait of a seemingly pale man was discussed before in a thread started by Takruri. There is actually no evidence that the man was even Eurasian. It was a popular trend during the period of that portrait to use gold or yellowish golden color on mummy masks. No doubt the hue was slightly darker and a little more yellowish at one time.
 

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Posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist (Member # 18853) on :
 
''Which set of people do the Egyptian goddesses most resemble, Egyptian Copts or black Sudanese?''
=====

They still never answered.
 

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Posted by Doug M (Member # 7650) on :
 
Cherry picking is endemic in Egyptology as many artifacts have been taken out of their original places as part of a larger body of work for a temple, tomb or other such structure. Therefore you are only seeing a small part of a larger picture and what gets shown in museums and art books is by definition cherry picked. Since many tombs and temples have art that is in various states of decay, that piece or pieces you see in a museum or book may indeed be quite misleading to say the least.


So which do you pick as representative of the whole body of work? Likewise, given that many famous persons in AE had sometimes hundreds, if not thousands of images of themselves created, many of which do not all currently exist in the same state of preservation or even look the same, which one becomes representative of that individual. The best thing is to view as much of the original work in context as possible, ie the entire tomb or scenes from a tomb and not isolated individual pieces.

For example:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/manna4u/4093414246/in/set-72157614816350619/

From this image you can easily see that some parts of the art are very much faded while other parts have colors that are much better preserved. By taking them all together you get to see this all in its proper surviving context.

And by looking at a large body of work from different periods you can also start to see the patterns and motifs that were common:


http://www.flickr.com/photos/manna4u/3344837671/in/set-72157615083480210


http://www.flickr.com/photos/manna4u/431865017/in/set-72157600018826993

Which makes it clear that the representation of Nefertari in her tomb is not unique or unusual in the sense that women were always painted in yellor or pale brown or even pink and white colors, which does not necessarily reflect their actual complexion.

But then again, we have a whole thread full of such images for people to look at.
http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=000009;p=1
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
I guess the dark paint must have fallen off of this one too.18th dynasty:


 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
Fragmentary lid from the coffin of Wadj-shemsi-su
ca. 1500–1425 B.C.


 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
I think we can see that coffin's usually are symbolic...

Look at Kalonji's thread:

quote:

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Originally posted by Kalonji:
Coffin of Khnum-Nakht below:





Reconstruction of Khnum-Nakht below:





Coffin of Nekht-Ankh below:





Reconstruction of Nekht-Ankh below:

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quote:

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^Well one has to ask the question, if the Egyptians were all black sub-saharan types, then how and why did they represent themselves otherwise in so many instances?

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They didn't. Can you not see the hundreds of images showing dark skinned Egyptians herein?


Black is simply a descriptive of adaption to intense UV rays in the tropics resulting in dark skin. Many Egyptians look like Somali's/Ethiopians/Sudanese and other East African groups. The Badarian in particular had a close morphological affinity to a stereotypical Negro group from East Africa.

"Unsurprisingly, morphological similarities have been found between Upper Egyptians and Nubians, and between Egyptians and southern Africans"--Sonia R. Zakrzewski (2005) Morphological Variation in Egyptian crania


More images:

Old Kingdom:












 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
BTW, what is a black sub-Saharan type?
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
It seems that mummies like this would represent a different phenotype than what you have shown in the reconstruction. I believe this mummified Egyptian head is at least 4,000 years old if I'm not mistaken.


 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
^Where was that mummy found? Exact site please. Also a source.
Reconstructions are far more reliable than eyeballing.
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Calabooz':
^Where was that mummy found? Exact site please. Also a source.
Reconstructions are far more reliable than eyeballing.

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quote:

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I'm not sure where it was found. I'll have to do a little research. I do know it is an Egyptian mummy head.

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quote:

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Reconstructions aren't totally reliable as far as the shape and size of the mouth and lips, ears and nose, nor the color of the skin. I'm not at all saying the reconstructions you've shown aren't accurate though.

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They are reliable but they can't be taken as the god given truth either. No reconstruction can really show us exactly how someone looked, but they can be extremely accurate. I posted the reconstructions from Kalonji's thread to enforce DJehuti's point on funerary masks.
 

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Posted by A Simple Girl (Member # 18316) on :
 
This is where I got the idea that the mummy head was 4,000 years old. Well I'm off to bed.

http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/north-east-news/evening-chronicle-news/tm_objectid=15683744&method=full&siteid=50081&headline=murder-on-the-nile-in-2000-bc--name_page.html
 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
^I will try to find the actual study. As they mention how they will try to discover his origin by comparing it to another population.
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

Mummy head 600 B.C.,


2611 years ago

The Twenty-sixth Dynasty of Egypt (c. 685-525 BC)

the last native dynasty to rule Egypt before the Persian conquest in 525 BC (although others followed). The Dynasty's reign is also called the Saite Period after the city of Sais, where its pharaohs had their capital, and marks the beginning of the Late Period of ancient Egypt.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Head of Amenhotep III, New Kingdom, Dynasty 18, reign of Amenhotep III, ca. 1390–1352 B.C.
Egyptian
Brown quartzite
H. 13 3/4 in. (35 cm)


Amenhotep III, ninth king of Dynasty 18, was heir to the expansionist policies of his predecessors and ruled over an empire at the height of its political, economic, and cultural power. It was also an empire at peace, relying on diplomatic exchanges to ensure the stability and revenues of Egypt. During his long reign, Amenhotep III transformed the religious landscape at Thebes, building a great temple to Amun-Re at Luxor and making major additions to the Temple of Karnak. On the west bank at Thebes, he built an enormous palace complex with an artificial lake at Malqata, where he celebrated three sed or jubilee festivals. His mortuary temple was one of the largest ever built, but little remains today except the famous Colossi of Memnon, actually a pair of colossal statues of Amenhotep III that stood before its pylon.
This almost lifesize head from a standing statue is said to come from the Delta. It displays the very youthful and stylized features of many of his statues, with full lips and elongated, elegantly outlined slanted eyes. He wears the blue crown, which indicates that the statue portrayed the king performing some sort of action, such as making an offering. A break on the left side of the king's head may indicate that a tall standard originally stood to his left.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Vignette on Khonsu's inner coffin lid, New Kingdom, reign of Ramesses II, ca. 1279–1213 B.C.
Egyptian; From the tomb of Sennedjem, Deir el-Medina, western Thebes
Gessoed and painted wood
H. of Khonsu 6 in. (15.3 cm)


This kneeling figure is identified by the two columns of hieroglyphs in front of him as "the Osiris, the servant of the Place of Truth, Khonsu, justified." The image and its text are a graphic expression of Khonsu's hope that his spirit will pass successfully through the trial of judgment in the afterlife and become one with Osiris.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 


Bakers and Brewers from Meketre's model bakery, Middle Kingdom, Dynasty 12, reign of Amenemhat I, ca. 1975 B.C.

Egyptian; From the tomb of Meketre, western Thebes
Plastered and painted wood
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Egyptian; Probably from Meir
Painted plaster, cartonnage (linen and gesso), and plant fibers
H. 21 in. (53 cm)


This woman is represented as if lying flat upon a bier. She wears a long Egyptian-style wig made of flax, papyrus, and other plant fibers. Fine plaster has been molded above the wig to imitate a thick garland of white rose petals tipped in pink, into which is set a red stone. On her ivory-colored skin the features are drawn in deep saturated colors. She wears a deep-red tunic with black clavi (vertical bands) and jewelry, including a crescent pendant and snake bracelets. At the lower edge of the tunic, two holes were used for attaching the mask to the mummy.


The back of the head rests on a support whose sides are elaborately decorated with Egyptian funerary motifs (not seen in this photograph). Directly beneath the top of the head, an elaborate gilded wreath encircles a gilded scarab beetle—symbol of the sun appearing at dawn, a metaphor of rebirth. Below this is a register depicting Egyptian gods, with Osiris (the source of regenerative power) in the center flanked by the goddesses Isis and Nephthys. These deities are accompanied by others as witnesses to the deceased's resurrection. They include Horus (son of Osiris and symbol of his rebirth), Amun (the creator of all life), Thoth (representing time and eternity), Re (symbol of daily life), Tefnut (first female descendant of the creator), Hathor (goddess of birth), and Seshat (recorder of the deceased's deeds).
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Portrait head of the Emperor Augustus, ca. 14–37; Julio-Claudian
Roman
Marble
H. 12 in. (30.5 cm)

In 30 B.C., Gaius Julius Caesar Octavianus became ruler of the empire that Rome had amassed over the previous three centuries. During the next forty-four years, he introduced institutions and an ideology that combined the traditions of Republican Rome with the realities of kingship. In 27 B.C., the Senate conferred on Octavian the honorific title of Augustus, an adjective with connotations of dignity and stateliness, and around this same time, an official imperial portrait was created that embodied the qualities that Augustus wished to project.


Hundreds of versions of this portrait on coins, gems, busts, monumental reliefs, and statues were disseminated throughout the empire during his reign and thereafter. This particular over-lifesize head may have been part of one such statue of the emperor made during the reign of his successor Tiberius (1994.230.7). This kind of imperial image represented a new conception in ruler portraiture—certain features are somewhat individualized, such as the broad forehead with a distinctive arrangement of locks and prominent ears, but the overall effect is one of elevated dignity that recalls Greek Classical statues of the fifth century B.C.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Terracotta Figure of Isis-Aphrodite, Roman period, 2nd–3rd century
Egyptian
Alluvial clay; brown, black, red, and pink paint on white englobe
H. 19 1/2 in. (49.5 cm)


This tall, sensuously modeled and delicately painted terracotta figurine represents Aphrodite-Isis, a goddess combining attributes of the Egyptian goddesses Isis and Hathor and the Greek goddess Aphrodite. Although otherwise nude, she wears elaborate accessories, including an exaggerated calathos (the crown of Egyptian Greco-Roman deities) emblazoned with the sun disk and horns of Isis. Her long corkscrew curls are arranged in the semblance of a traditional Egyptian hairstyle.


Similarly garbed figures of goddesses and female figures associated with marriage, conception, and childbirth are found throughout the Greco-Roman world. The Egyptian version is distinguished by its compressed, frontal, and rather rigidly upright pose, and by its occurrence in burials. These features relate to pharaonic prototypes whose efficacy seems to have extended into the afterlife for women and men alike.
After being formed in a two-part mold, the front of the hollow figurine was dipped in a white engobe (slip), then painted with a white base coat and detailed in stark black, yellow, and a range of reds and pinks, even to an elusive blush over the cheeks.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Statue of Memi and Sabu, Old Kingdom, Dynasty 4, ca. 2575–2465 B.C.
Egyptian; Probably from Giza
Painted limestone
H. 24 3/8 in. (62 cm)


Pair statues, usually depicting a husband and wife, were frequently placed in a serdab, the hidden statue chamber often found in nonroyal tomb chapels of the Old Kingdom. The Egyptians believed that the spirit of the deceased could use such a statue as a home and enter it in order to benefit from gifts of food that were brought to the offering chapel of the tomb.


The inscription on the front of this statue identifies these individuals as the Royal Acquaintance Memi and Sabu. Although the text does not specify a relationship, they were probably husband and wife, as is common for pair statues where a relationship is recorded. The pose is unusual because Memi is returning Sabu's embrace by draping his arm around her shoulders. This restricting gesture may account for the fact that he stands with his feet together, rather than striding forward in the normal masculine pose.
Until recently, this statue was dated to Dynasty 5, but the figures have many features in common with Fourth Dynasty statues found in the nonroyal cemeteries surrounding the Great Pyramid of Khufu (Cheops) at Giza. In addition, the pose has only two known parallels, both from Giza and both datable to Dynasty 4.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 





Fragmentary face of King Khafre, Old Kingdom, Dynasty 4, reign of Khafre, ca. 2520–2494 B.C.
Egyptian
Egyptian alabaster
H. 3 3/8 in. (8.5 cm)


Khafre was the son of Khufu, builder of the Great Pyramid. He built his own pyramid, the Second Pyramid, at Giza just to the south of his father's. Khafre's pyramid complex included a mortuary temple on the east side of the pyramid and a valley temple of monolithic granite blocks connected by a long causeway. To the northwest of the valley temple he constructed the Sphinx and its temple. Many magnificent statues of the king were recovered from the valley temple. This fragment was said to have been found at Giza and its similarity to the faces of the statues from the Khafre valley temple and the traces of a royal beard on the chin identify it as a portrait of Khafre. It displays—even at a small scale—the subtle and very sensitive modeling and finely finished surfaces of these masterpieces of Old Kingdom royal sculpture.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Seated statue of King Menkaure, Old Kingdom, Dynasty 4, reign of Menkaure, ca. 2490–2472 B.C.
Egyptian
Limestone
H. 7 7/8 in. (20 cm)


Menkaure, son of Khafre and grandson of Khufu, built the Third Pyramid at Giza. Unlike the First and Second Pyramids of his father and grandfather which were covered in white limestone, Menkaure planned to case his pyramid in granite. This remained unfinished at his death and was never completed. His pyramid complex was excavated by a joint expedition of Harvard University and the Museum of Fine Arts, Boston, in 1908.


This unfinished statuette of Menkaure was found in a sculptor's workshop associated with the valley temple of his pyramid. It was one of fourteen statuettes of the king found there, all unfinished and in various stages of the sculptural process. It depicts the king in the traditional pose, seated with his left hand flat, palm down on this thigh; his right hand, here broken off, would have been in a fist. The feet of the statuette and the front part of the base on which they rested were destroyed as well. The king is seated on a blocklike throne that, when complete, would have been carved with the sematawy symbol, which represents the unity of Upper and Lower Egypt. He wears the nemes headcloth and false beard, and traces of the uraeus can be seen on the brow.
The statuette is made of a good quality hard limestone and still shows traces of the preliminary blocking-out of the figure, which have been partly obscured by the initial polishing of the surface. The musculature of the torso has been indicated and the statuette shows the outlines of the square mature face of Menkaure displayed in the large statues of greywacke and alabaster found elsewhere in his valley temple.
 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Calabooz':
^Indeed... black and white aren't determined by facial features but by skin tone. The only reason people like Simple Girl and Rahotep will associated black people with broad facial features is because they can see that the majority of the ancient Egyptians have dark skin. Even using their logic of black being synonymous with broad features, there would still be a large amount of "black people"

@ Simple Girl

The last image I posted has unpainted portions per the source.


the other ones still have traces of dark paint. Aside perhaps from Shuroy's wife.

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You do have a fondness for moving the goal-posts. When it suits you negroid features mean black, so you can claim anyone with thick lips. When it suits you skin tone means black, so you can can claim anyone with caucasoid features and a heavy tan. Bullshit. Pure bullshit.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Stele of King Intef II, First Intermediate Period, Dynasty 11, reign of Intef II, ca. 2108–2059 B.C.
Egyptian
Limestone
H. 17 1/8 in. (43.5 cm), W. 17 7/8 in. (45.5 cm)


Horus Wah-ankh Intef II was the third king of Dynasty 11, a period when Egypt was not unified under one ruler. The son of a nomarch (governor) of Thebes, Intef II engaged in numerous battles with the rival rulers of Heracleopolis and eventually secured control over southern Egypt, from Abydos to Aswan. This laid the foundation for the reunification of the country under King Mentuhotep II (07.230.2; 26.3.29)


This stele was probably one of a number of small stela set up in the courtyard of his tomb at Thebes. The king presents a bowl of beer and a jug of milk to the god Re and goddess Hathor and is shown in the posture of an offering bearer. He is wearing a minutely pleated kilt, heavy broad collar and elaborately curled wig. The figure is well carved in very high raised relief and almost gives the impression of a statue. The text of the stele includes a request to Re for protection during the night and a hymn of praise to Hathor as well as a prayer for mortuary offerings.
 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist:
''Which set of people do the Egyptian goddesses most resemble, Egyptian Copts or black Sudanese?''
=====

They still never answered.

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I noticed that...
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 








Head of Tutankhamun, New Kingdom, Dynasty 18, reign of Tutankhamun, ca. 1336–1327 B.C.
Egyptian
Indurated limestone
H. 5 7/8 in. (14.9 cm)


This head is a fragment from a statue group that represented the god Amun seated on a throne and Tutankhamun standing or kneeling in front of him. The king's figure was considerably smaller than that of the god, indicating his subordinate status in the presence of the deity. All that remains of Amun is his right hand, which touches the back of the king's crown in a gesture that signifies Tutankhamun's investiture as king. During coronation rituals, various types of crowns were put on the king's head. The type represented here—probably a leather helmet with metal disks sewn onto it—was generally painted blue, and is commonly called the "blue crown." The ancient name was khepresh.


Statue groups showing a king together with gods had been created since the Old Kingdom, and formal groups relating to the pharaoh's coronation were dedicated at Karnak by Hatshepsut and other rulers of Dynasty 18. The Museum's head of Tutankhamun with the hand of Amun is special because of the intimacy with which the subject is treated. The face of the king expresses a touching youthful earnestness, and the hand of the god is raised toward his crown with gentle care.


Tutankhamun was born at Amarna and originally named Tutankhaten. He was probably the son of Akhenaten and came to the throne as a child. He was married to the third daughter of Akhenaten and Nefertiti, Ankhesenpaaten/Ankhesenpaamun. During his reign, and probably acting through officials such as General Haremhab (23.10.1), he began the extensive restoration of the temples damaged by Akhenaten and abandoned Amarna for Memphis and Thebes. He died young and was buried in the Valley of the Kings in a splendidly furnished tomb, which would lay undisturbed until it was rediscovered by Howard Carter in 1922.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 




Statue of Metjetji


Metjetji, the subject of this statue, is shown in later life, with the long kilt of a senior official and, as viewed from the side, a rather flabby torso. The expensive addition of inlaid stone eyes with copper rims suggests that this one was considered the most important of Metjetji's statues. A large head, big eyes, and very long fingers often appear on statues of this time; here they seem to suggest wisdom and maturity.

Medium: Wood, gessoed and painted; alabaster, obsidian, copper

Possible Place Collected: Saqqara, Egypt
Dates: ca. 2371-2288 B.C.E.
Dynasty: late V Dynasty-early VI Dynasty
Period: Old Kingdom
Dimensions: 24 3/16 in. (61.5 cm) Base: 12 1/2 x 5 1/8 x 2 in. (31.8 x 13 x 5.1 cm)
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Statue of Metjetji
Medium: Wood, painted
Possible Place Collected: Saqqara, Egypt
Dates: ca. 2371-2288 B.C.E.
Dynasty: late V Dynasty-early VI Dynasty
Period: Old Kingdom
Dimensions: 35 1/16 in. (89 cm) Base: 6 15/16 x 16 7/16 in. (17.7 x 41.8 cm)
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



Head of a Nobleman

These two heads from ka-statues (the tomb statue that received food and drink offerings) demonstrate the different properties of granite and limestone. Granite is harder than limestone, so it takes a higher polish and allows the artist to carve finer detail. Though both statues gave the deceased’s ka a place to receive offerings, the granite would have been the more desirable statue.

This text refers to these objects: 77.6; 67.5.1

Medium: Granite
Place Made: Egypt
Dates: ca. 2650-2600 B.C.E.
Dynasty: late III Dynasty-early IV Dynasty
Period: Old Kingdom
Dimensions: 6 3/4 x 8 1/2 x 6 in. (17.1 x 21.6 x 15.2 cm)
 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doug M:

...Which makes it clear that the representation of Nefertari in her tomb is not unique or unusual in the sense that women were always painted in yellor or pale brown or even pink and white colors, which does not necessarily reflect their actual complexion.

---

The tradition of painting women lighter colours didn't come from nowhere. It's still evident that many Egyptian women are lighter coloured than their menfolk. It's also evident that there are often a range of phenotypes within the same family.





Ancient Egyptians were quite capable of drawing actual black women...



The idea of symbolic colour being applied to non-royal or non-divine persons is untenable. That being so, why should we disbelieve the colour of such images as these?








Even if the yellow of goddesses was symbolic, images of Nefertari next to goddesses show that her colouring is not yellow, but more like the pink of those others.


 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 





   

 

Head of a King

Granite is extremely hard, but the sculptor of this statue was able to give the king's plump face and small features a softly natural quality, perhaps suggesting the subject's actual appearance rather than an idealized version. Originally, this fragment surmounted an oversized figure, achieving the same monumental quality as the pyramids being built at this time.

Medium: Granite
Place Made: Egypt
Dates: ca. 2650-2600 B.C.E.
Dynasty: late III Dynasty-early IV Dynasty
Period: Early Old Kingdom
Dimensions: 21 3/8 x 11 7/16 in. (54.3 x 29 cm)
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
I think we can see that coffin's usually are symbolic...

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
I think we can see that coffin's usually are symbolic...

Look at Kalonji's thread:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kalonji:
Coffin of Khnum-Nakht below:





Reconstruction of Khnum-Nakht below:





Coffin of Nekht-Ankh below:





Reconstruction of Nekht-Ankh below:

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http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=006932

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We have a passably realistic coffin portrait of this individual- with pink skin, flat nostrils and narrow lips. Yet you would believe a facial reconstruction that conjures up negroid lips and flared nostrils from nowhere? Why? How can a skull indicate the shape of one's lips or nostrils or one's skin tone, pray tell? Even then there is a hooked nose which is hardly a common feature among black Africans so much as among middle-eastern semites.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



















 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
You do have a fondness for moving the goal-posts. When it suits you negroid features mean black, so you can claim anyone with thick lips

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quote:

---

When it suits you skin tone means black, so you can can claim anyone with caucasoid features and a heavy tan. Bullshit. Pure bullshit.

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What a dumbass you are. I have always maintained that skin tone and descent make someone black or not. Unlike you and your bullshit that claims only west Africans are black people

Now you say something about tans? Don't be a phuckin retard. Here are the reasons why that's impossible.

1)Egyptians had heat adapted limbs

2)Long limbs are seen in the tropics

3)Skin color intensification is correlated with limb elongation

4)The Egyptians were dark-skinned without tanning.

CASE CLOSED.
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 








 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
From the website where the Khnum-Nakht reconstruction comes from:
http://www.ancient-egypt.co.uk/manchester/pages/the%20two%20brothers.htm

'... nose, moth and ears are open to speculation.'

Why didn't you go by the nose, mouth and ears on an actual contmporary portrait then, politically correct boneheads?
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

[/QB]

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These people are ethnic Nubians, not Egyptians. They are a distinct people.
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://billygambelaafroasiaticanthropology.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/egypt-nubian_wedding-copy.jpg&imgrefurl=http://billygambelaafroasiatica nthropology.wordpress.com/2009/04/30/my-moms-mtdna-migration-map-of-haplogroup-l2a1/&usg=__oB0CsXDXY9EMpgcxbwzFGeOT9a0=&h=538&w=717&sz=74&hl=en&start=4&sig2=ow7R2Fy02eRP5KGVf6DejA& zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=OmGVkUWM5ZQO6M:&tbnh=105&tbnw=140&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dnubian%2Bfamily%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:*:IE-SearchBox%26rlz%3D 1I7DSGI_en-GB%26tbm%3Disch&ei=1yPeTcDSJISEswaD2rziBQ
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 






 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
^^^

Bas-reliefs from the Temple of Satet at Elephantine
The king followed by a goddess
New Kingdom, 18th Dynasty, reigns of Hatshepsut and Tuthmosis III (1479-25 BC)

Temple of Satet, Elephantine
Bas-relief, painted sandstone
H. 1.39 m; W. 1.13 m; D. 0.19 m
Gift of the Egyptian government (division of excavation finds), 1908
B 64

Egyptian Antiquities




Large statue of Chancellor Nakhti
Middle Kingdom, Twelfth Dynasty, reign of Sesostris I (1943-1898 BC)
Assiut

Sculpture in the round, inlay, painting, cuprous metal, white stone, blaack stone

H: 1.78 m; W: 0.49 m; D: 1.10 m.
Gift from the Egyptian government as part of the policy of dividing finds, 1903
E 11937

Egyptian Antiquities
On the base: "The blessed with Osiris-master-of-the-Occident- in-all-places, the Chancellor Nakhti, excellent"




Funerary figurine of Ramesses IV
New Kingdom, reign of Ramesses IV, 20th Dynasty (1153-1147 BC)

Painted wood, sculpture in the round
H.: 32.5 cm
N 438




Head of a sphinx of King Djedefre
Old Kingdom, 4th Dynasty, reign of Djedefre (2565-2558 BC)


 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:

quote:

---

---

These people are ethnic Nubians, not Egyptians. They are a distinct people.
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://billygambelaafroasiaticanthropology.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/egypt-nubian_wedding-copy.jpg&imgrefurl=http://billygambelaafroasiatica nthropology.wordpress.com/2009/04/30/my-moms-mtdna-migration-map-of-haplogroup-l2a1/&usg=__oB0CsXDXY9EMpgcxbwzFGeOT9a0=&h=538&w=717&sz=74&hl=en&start=4&sig2=ow7R2Fy02eRP5KGVf6DejA& zoom=1&um=1&itbs=1&tbnid=OmGVkUWM5ZQO6M:&tbnh=105&tbnw=140&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dnubian%2Bfamily%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26sa%3DN%26rls%3Dcom.microsoft:*:IE-SearchBox%26rlz%3D 1I7DSGI_en-GB%26tbm%3Disch&ei=1yPeTcDSJISEswaD2rziBQ [/QB]

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Clown, you don't have to tell me who they are or aren't!


An examination of Nubian and Egyptian biological distances: Support for biological diffusion or in situ development?

K. Goddea, b, Corresponding Author Contact Information, E-mail The Corresponding Author

aDepartment of Anthropology, University of Tennessee, Knoxville, 250 South Stadium Hall, Knoxville, TN 37996, USA

bDepartment of Science, South College, 3904 Lonas Dr, Knoxville, TN 37909, USA


Abstract

Many authors have speculated on Nubian biological evolution. Because of the contact Nubians had with other peoples, migration and/or invasion (biological diffusion) were originally thought to be the biological mechanism for skeletal changes in Nubians. Later, a new hypothesis was put forth, the in situ hypothesis. The new hypothesis postulated that Nubians evolved in situ, without much genetic influence from foreign populations. This study examined 12 Egyptian and Nubian groups in an effort to explore the relationship between the two populations and to test the in situ hypothesis. Data from nine cranial nonmetric traits were assessed for an estimate of biological distance, using Mahalanobis D2 with a tetrachoric matrix. The distance scores were then input into principal coordinates analysis (PCO) to depict the relationships between the two populations. PCO detected 60% of the variation in the first two principal coordinates. A plot of the distance scores revealed only one cluster; the Nubian and Egyptian groups clustered together. The grouping of the Nubians and Egyptians indicates there may have been some sort of gene flow between these groups of Nubians and Egyptians. However, common adaptation to similar environments may also be responsible for this pattern. Although the predominant results in this study appear to support the biological diffusion hypothesis, the in situ hypothesis was not completely negated.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19766993


Biotechnic & Histochemistry 2005, 80(1): 7_/13

"Materials and methods In 1997, the German Institute for Archaeology headed an excavation of the tombs of the nobles in Thebes-West, Upper Egypt. At this time, three types of tissues were sampled from different mummies: meniscus (fibrocartilage), skin, and placenta. Archaeological findings suggest that the mummies dated from the New Kingdom (approximately 1550_/1080 BC)...... The basal epithelial cells were packed with melanin as expected for specimens of negroid origin."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15804821


Am J Phys Anthropol, 2008.

Stature estimation;anatomical method;regression formulae;Egyptians

Abstract

Trotter and Gleser's (Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 10 (1952) 469–514; Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 16 (1958) 79–123) long bone formulae for US Blacks or derivations thereof (Robins and Shute: Hum Evol 1 (1986) 313–324) have been previously used to estimate the stature of ancient Egyptians. However, limb length to stature proportions differ between human populations; consequently, the most accurate mathematical stature estimates will be obtained when the population being examined is as similar as possible in proportions to the population used to create the equations. The purpose of this study was to create new stature regression formulae based on direct reconstructions of stature in ancient Egyptians and assess their accuracy in comparison to other stature estimation methods. We also compare Egyptian body proportions to those of modern American Blacks and Whites. Living stature estimates were derived using a revised Fully anatomical method (Raxter et al.: Am J Phys Anthropol 130 (2006) 374–384). Long bone stature regression equations were then derived for each sex. Our results confirm that, although ancient Egyptians are closer in body proportion to modern American Blacks than they are to American Whites, proportions in Blacks and Egyptians are not identical. The newly generated Egyptian-based stature regression formulae have standard errors of estimate of 1.9–4.2 cm. All mean directional differences are less than 0.4% compared to anatomically estimated stature, while results using previous formulae are more variable, with mean directional biases varying between 0.2% and 1.1%, tibial and radial estimates being the most biased. There is no evidence for significant variation in proportions among temporal or social groupings; thus, the new formulae may be broadly applicable to ancient Egyptian remains.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajpa.20790/abstract
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
^^^

Sennefer, the king's head clerk, and his wife, Hatshepsut New Kingdom, 18th Dynasty, reign of Amenophis II, c. 1427-1401 BC









 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

---

...

The goddess Hathor welcomes Sethos I
New Kingdom, 19th Dynasty, reign of Sethos I (1290-1179 BC)

Thebes, Valley of the Kings, tomb of Sethos I
Thebes, Valley of the Kings, tomb of Sethos I
Bas-relief, painted limestone
H. 2.26 m; W. 1.05 m
Purchased 1829
B 7


 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



 






     


Statuette of Tuy, Superior of the Harem of the god Min
New Kingdom, 18th Dynasty, reign of Amenophis III (1391-1353 BC)

Sculpture in the round; African grenadilla wood, shea wood base
H. 33.40 cm; W. 8 cm; D. 17 cm
Purchased 1895
E 10655
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Akhenaton and Nefertiti

New Kingdom, Eighteenth Dynasty, after year 9 of the reign of Amenophis IV Akhenaton, between 1345 and 1337 BC





 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 




      

Khabekhent's funerary servant and ushabti chest
New Kingdom, 19th Dynasty, reign of Ramesses II, c. 1279-1213 BC

Upper Egypt, Deir el-Medina, tomb of Sennedjem (TT 1)
Painted limestone (figurine), stuccoed and painted wood (chest)

H.: 18.9 cm; W.: 6.3 cm; D.: 3.8 cm (figurine)
H.: 30 cm; W.: 17.8 cm; D.: 18.3 cm (chest)
 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Head of Ramses II 19th dynasty



Statue of Ramses II 19th dynasty



Ramses II Abu Simbel 19th dynasty


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 
Statue of Amenhotep II Turin Muzeo 18th dynasty



Relief of Amenhotep II from the sacred tomb of Amenhotep II 18th dynasty


 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Calabooz':
I think we can see that coffin's usually are symbolic...

---

symbolic of what?

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Coffin of the brother?



 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Amenhotep III Egyptian Pharaoh 18 Dynasty 1400BCE

Quartzite head of a colossal statue from the pharaoh’s mortuary temple in western Thebes. Amenhotep is shown wearing the red crown of Lower Egypt. The prominence of the symmetrical eyes and the accentuated facial features foreshadow physical representations created in the heretical Armana Period at the end of the 18 Dynasty. This head is featured at the left side of the door way to the Egyptian Sculpture room from the Great Court at the British Museum.























 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
From the website where the Khnum-Nakht reconstruction comes from:
http://www.ancient-egypt.co.uk/manchester/pages/the%20two%20brothers.htm

'... nose, moth and ears are open to speculation.'

Why didn't you go by the nose, mouth and ears on an actual contmporary portrait then, politically correct boneheads?

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rahotep101:
'... nose, moth and ears are open to speculation.'

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglohile_Pyramidiot:

''Which set of people do the Egyptian goddesses most resemble, Egyptian Copts or black Sudanese?''
=====

They still never answered.

---

Of course the answer is the Egyptian Copts; however DaDumb1 and yourself fail to realize Egyptian Copt is not an ethnicity but a Christian denomination!! DaDumb1 keeps posting pictures of white Copts from Alexandria but NEVER the more Copts of rural Sa'idi areas.

Which segment of the Coptic population best represents the ancient Egyptians? The Alexandrians of obvious European ancestry or the more pristine Sa'idi who even retain the more accurate pronunciations and slang words of Coptic??
 

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Posted by -Just Call Me Jari- (Member # 14451) on :
 
Don't be stupid the Sudanese are well know for having light as well as Dar Complexions as well as other East African women.

Yellow is a known descriptor within black communities yet very few white people or non blacks even understand the color yellow and its signifigance to the Feminin in Black Communities..



Isis Complexion is not unheard of in the phenotype of people who created her, East Africans and Nilotic blacks.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Djehuti:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Anglohile_Pyramidiot:

''Which set of people do the Egyptian goddesses most resemble, Egyptian Copts or black Sudanese?''
=====

They still never answered.

---

Of course the answer is the Egyptian Copts;

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quote:

---

Originally posted by Djead-from-the-neck-up:

Yes but we had a cetain bozo claiming that the Nefertari tomb portrait was faded and the colour of the blushing cheek was residue of colour that had once covered the whole figure, until a dozen other images all with blushing cheeks were shown. My point is that the 'fading' claim is a typical excuse we hear from black egypt advocates.

LOL No doubt I'm the "bozo" you're referring to! Apparently you forgot to explain to me how the remnants of darker paint could be "blush" it is not only found on the cheek, but the chin, nose, and even arms. If this was an indication of realistic ruddiness or redness of her skin, one would think she suffered from a skin disorder like psoriasis or something.

Also what about sections of her tomb where the paint is best preserved??


I suppose here she has a really deep tan. LOL

---

No deeper a tan than an Italian can obtain, as we have seen... These plain colour images are not ones where the paint has survived better. They are ones where different artist worked on them who did not apply the shading seen on some of the others. Hence the lighter ones have darker areas down one edge of the arms and under the chin indicating shadow regions. This was a rare attempt at 3d painting in Egyptian art, as any expert will acknowledge. There are no faced paintings here.


 

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Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Djehuti:
course the answer is the Egyptian Copts; however DaDumb1 and yourself fail to realize Egyptian Copt is not an ethnicity but a Christian denomination!! DaDumb1 keeps posting pictures of white Copts from Alexandria but NEVER the more Copts of rural Sa'idi areas.

Which segment of the Coptic population best represents the ancient Egyptians? The Alexandrians of obvious European ancestry or the more pristine Sa'idi who even retain the more accurate pronunciations and slang words of Coptic??

---

quote:

---

DaDumbWhore wrote about this picture:



No deeper a tan than an Italian can obtain, as we have seen...

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quote:

---

These plain colour images are not ones where the paint has survived better. They are ones where different artist worked on them who did not apply the shading seen on some of the others. Hence the lighter ones have darker areas down one edge of the arms and under the chin indicating shadow regions. This was a rare attempt at 3d painting in Egyptian art, as any expert will acknowledge. There are no faced paintings here.

---

Again. As has been explained countless times it is the opposite-- the darker paints are the ones best preserved while other paints eroded or faded off!

Of course your dumbass would call the remnants of darker paint "blush" even if it is left on the nose chin, hands and arms as well!



LOL
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 








 

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Posted by Calabooz' (Member # 18238) on :
 
Even when Europeans do tan, they don't look African.

I'll upload some more Nefertari images later from a book I have. Interestingly, Zahi Hawass even said her tomb showed the effects of millenia of wear. Some of the images Rahotep posted also look different from the images in the photographs.....
 

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Posted by Brada-Anansi (Member # 16371) on :
 
Lioness any of those gentlemen Nile valley Africans?
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by the lioness:

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As if time stood still.

Large picture of indignious
 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 




 

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Posted by anguishofbeing (Member # 16736) on :
 
the lioness revealed!


 

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Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Djehuti:
^ LOL First of all wikipedia is not a reliable source, as it is subject to laymen. Second of all "native" is a relative term. The descendants of Greco-Roman families who have settled the Delta centuries before Christ and have adopted the Coptic faith are native but that does not mean they are indigenous let alone represent true indigenous Egyptians!! What about those Copts in rural areas further south who are black?? Who is more native to Egypt or Africa in general-- the whites who live Delta port cities or the isolated blacks in the Nile Valley??

quote:

---

DaDumbWhore wrote about this picture:


No deeper a tan than an Italian can obtain, as we have seen...

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So milk chocolate is the complexion that an Italian can achieve through tanning?? And I suppose Nefertari a royal spent her time outdoors tanning. LOL

quote:

---

These plain colour images are not ones where the paint has survived better. They are ones where different artist worked on them who did not apply the shading seen on some of the others. Hence the lighter ones have darker areas down one edge of the arms and under the chin indicating shadow regions. This was a rare attempt at 3d painting in Egyptian art, as any expert will acknowledge. There are no faced paintings here.

---

Again. As has been explained countless times it is the opposite-- the darker paints are the ones best preserved while other paints eroded or faded off!

Of course your dumbass would call the remnants of darker paint "blush" even if it is left on the nose chin, hands and arms as well!



LOL

---

Greeks did not convert to Coptic Christianity, which had an Egyptian language liturgy. Greeks remained in their own community and were Melkites, with a Greek Orthodox liturgy. The Copts of Northern Egypt have indigenous ancestry, the same as those of the south. No outsider has any right impugning the authenticity of these people.

As for Nefertari, the fact that a pale Nefertari stands hand in hand with a darker Horus shows that the paint on her is not faded (or he would be likewise). You must be a great fool to post an image that debunks your own argument.
 

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Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 



 

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Posted by anguishofbeing (Member # 16736) on :
 
^


 

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Posted by Siptah (Member # 17601) on :
 

quote:

---

No deeper a tan than an Italian can obtain, as we have seen... These plain colour images are not ones where the paint has survived better. They are ones where different artist worked on them who did not apply the shading seen on some of the others. Hence the lighter ones have darker areas down one edge of the arms and under the chin indicating shadow regions. This was a rare attempt at 3d painting in Egyptian art, as any expert will acknowledge. There are no faced paintings here.

---

The quality of this image bearing Nefertari is poor to the point we are unable to observe actual coloring from the overall image due to the strong yellowish casting.

Here is a better image of the same depicted Nefertari from your image excluding the Italian conservator.



Going by my image, we can see the actual coloring of Nefertari and her dark skin color. If anything, the skin color of Nefertari was most likely depicted darker when the tomb was freshly painted at her time.
 

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Posted by Doug M (Member # 7650) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Siptah:

quote:

---

No deeper a tan than an Italian can obtain, as we have seen... These plain colour images are not ones where the paint has survived better. They are ones where different artist worked on them who did not apply the shading seen on some of the others. Hence the lighter ones have darker areas down one edge of the arms and under the chin indicating shadow regions. This was a rare attempt at 3d painting in Egyptian art, as any expert will acknowledge. There are no faced paintings here.

---

The quality of this image bearing Nefertari is poor to the point we are unable to observe actual coloring from the overall image due to the strong yellowish casting.

Here is a better image of the same depicted Nefertari from your image excluding the Italian conservator.



Going by my image (which isn't the same one in the res, we can see the actual coloring of Nefertari and her dark skin color. If anything, the skin color of Nefertari was most likely depicted darker when the tomb was freshly painted at her time.

---

quote:

---

Facing left, she wears a long plain white dress, but without the long red sash tied round her waist. On her head she wears, as usual, the gold nekhbet headdress with the red mortar, but here it does not have the two tall gold feathers.
Immediately in front of her are two stands. The first one, which is golden and has a wide base, holds a large vessel. On top of the second, which resembles the standard pole used for holding the emblems of the nomes of Egypt, are four small mummiform statues of the sons of Horus.

The deities are seated on cuboid chairs, common in the scenes throughout the tomb. They have been shown artistically offset, one slightly behind the other. Osiris is shown closest to Nefertari, but slightly overlapped by Hathor, who is overlapped by Anubis who is shown in full.
Osiris wears his white mummiform garment with the long red sash tied around the waist. He holds a crook and flail in his hands, his symbols of power, and wears the atef crown on his head.
Hathor, dressed in the normal tight fitting red dress, rests her left hand on the shoulder of Osiris. She holds her right hand open, palm uppermost, above her knees. On her head, secured by a red sash, she wears the symbol of the "west".
Finally, Anubis, jackal-headed, wears his pleated gold kilt over a plain white one and a green tunic on his upper torso. In his right hand he holds a ankh sign, whilst he rests his left on the left shoulder of Hathor.

The text at the top of the scene identifies the four participants.

Nefertari has at last completed her journey and stands before Osiris, with two of his companions. She is also once again complete, because the four sons of Horus have protected her internal organs.

---

From: http://www.osirisnet.net/tombes/pharaons/nefertari/e_nefertari_05.htm


 

---

Posted by alTakruri (Member # 10195) on :
 
The two images of Nefertari in Siptah's post are the
exact same tomb wall image. The hieroglyphs that
surround her, the fingers of Anubis at her lips
and chin, and the flaking of the tomb wall at
the collar on her shoulder, Anubis' hand,
and the cartouche are all the precise
details revealing their identity as
one and the same piece of art.



If at all possible it is preferable to refer to
pre-restoration images for the actual colors as
on the tomb walls. This means referencing older
books.

Apparently, the photographed conservator was true
to the original seeing that the watermarked photo
shows Nefertari as dark brown and is obviously
post restoration evidenced by the collar detail.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doug M:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Siptah:


Here is a better image of the same depicted Nefertari from your image excluding the Italian conservator.


Going by my image (which isn't the same one in the res, we can see the actual coloring of Nefertari and her dark skin color.

---

The dark image above is not the same as the one in the restoration photo. The one in the restoration photo is yellowish just like it looks there. But this dark image may be one of the other scenes in the tomb or it may be fake.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:
The two images of Nefertari in Siptah's post are the
exact same tomb wall image. The hieroglyphs that
surround her, the fingers of Anubis at her lips
and chin, and the flaking of the tomb wall at
the collar on her shoulder, Anubis' hand,
and the cartouche are all the precise
details revealing their identity as
one and the same piece of art.



If at all possible it is preferable to refer to
pre-restoration images for the actual colors as
on the tomb walls. This means referencing older
books.

Apparently, the photographed conservator was true
to the original seeing that the watermarked photo
shows Nefertari as dark brown and is obviously
post restoration evidenced by the collar detail.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Doug M:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Siptah:


Here is a better image of the same depicted Nefertari from your image excluding the Italian conservator.


Going by my image (which isn't the same one in the res, we can see the actual coloring of Nefertari and her dark skin color.

---

The dark image above is not the same as the one in the restoration photo. The one in the restoration photo is yellowish just like it looks there. But this dark image may be one of the other scenes in the tomb or it may be fake.

---

---

I cannot tell which is before or after. There is this photo from discovery news that apparently shows the same scene with her in yellow. That was the basis of my comment. So if it is the same, they did a good job altering it.


From http://dsc.discovery.com/news/2007/04/06/egypttomb_slide_06.html

I wonder if we can get a date and provenance for that dark photo?
 

---

Posted by alTakruri (Member # 10195) on :
 

The DSC is the same as Siptah posted but is in a
wash of light. Look how colorless the glyphs are.
Here is an intermediate wash again with dull glyphs.


Siptah's posting with the hieroglyphics in natural color

is the unfiltered unretouched photo taken by Vannini,
or by someone accessing the actual pillar in situ,
and is not the one in need of questioning unlike the
lighter ones whose authenticity you seem to have no
problem with.

Why is that?
 

---

Posted by Doug M (Member # 7650) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:

The DSC is the same as Siptah posted but is in a
wash of light. Look how colorless the glyphs are.
Here is an intermediate wash again with dull glyphs.


Siptah's posting with the hieroglyphics in natural color

is the unfiltered unretouched photo taken by Vannini,
or by someone accessing the actual pillar in situ,
and is not the one in need of questioning unlike the
lighter ones whose authenticity you seem to have no
problem with.

Why is that?

---

I may like posting photos but I am no expert in color correction. So my comments were a word of caution. But yes apparently these guys are up to their same old tricks of photography, so not only is cherry picking in order but also retouched and faked up waxing of the cherries that are picked.

I should have known that something was amiss when the original Getty image showed almost everyone in the picture including real people with a yellow tinge.
 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 
watermarked photo

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:

watermarked photo
shows Nefertari as dark brown and is obviously
post restoration evidenced by the collar detail.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by alTakruri:

If at all possible it is preferable to refer to
pre-restoration images for the actual colors as
on the tomb walls. This means referencing older
books.

---

nobody has shown the photos from older books yet.

Are they darker or lighter than the photos that have already been posted? as if one way or the other this proves something
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
I'm suspicious of the darker image as it does not match the majority that can be seen, and the fact remains that the painting looked the same colour as an Italian woman photographed next to it in the same light. The restoration work did not involve repainting areas where the paint survived (even if it was allegedly faded).

I would contend that this image is truer:
The outline around the lips etc would also be lighter if the skin area had been artificially lightened, and there is no evidence of that. In the dark version the outline is scarcely discernable against the darkened skin tone.
 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
Here is another image from the tomb attributing the queen with such quintessentially negro features as narrow red lips and blushing pink cheeks:



Afrocentrists are funny.
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
That's Ahmose Nefertari, not Nefertari the wife of Ramesses II. The man there is her son, and the way he is shown indicates that the pitch black colour of his mother is symbolic, unless his father was from Sweden.

Back on to Nefertari wife of Ramesses, here are some more images of from the queen's tomb, (from the Getti conservation institute website). Again Nefertari's images can be compared to the Italian conservator, Lorenza D'Alessandro. Anyone who thinks this Nefertari was black must be mad in the head.



Uploaded with ImageShack.us
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 


 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
Repost,

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
All Joking aside, yes it was a Joke Rahotep, Why cant you admit Nefertit's other images look no different than other East African Women, even when you do you inject some asinine opinion of a person who edits "Essence" as if that magazine is relevent to Africa or African people.

Deep Down you know without that Berlin Bust Nefertiti looks no different than an East African woman but it pains you so to admit it...lol

Hell Ill admit there are images in Egyptian Art that look Eurasian like the seated scribe, but a Euroclown will never admit the Egyptians resemble other Africans, its always the MEditeranian or Asiatics...

Pathetic..

---

Nefertiti

the fact is that there is plenty of crossover between blacks and whites feature-wise so in given example you can't be certain who's who


. _________________________________________

---

---

An examination of Nubian and Egyptian biological distances: Support for biological diffusion or in situ development?

K. Goddea, b, Corresponding Author Contact Information, E-mail The Corresponding Author

a Department of Anthropology, University of Tennessee, Knoxville, 250 South Stadium Hall, Knoxville, TN 37996, USA

b Department of Science, South College, 3904 Lonas Dr, Knoxville, TN 37909, USA


Abstract

Many authors have speculated on Nubian biological evolution. Because of the contact Nubians had with other peoples, migration and/or invasion (biological diffusion) were originally thought to be the biological mechanism for skeletal changes in Nubians. Later, a new hypothesis was put forth, the in situ hypothesis. The new hypothesis postulated that Nubians evolved in situ, without much genetic influence from foreign populations. This study examined 12 Egyptian and Nubian groups in an effort to explore the relationship between the two populations and to test the in situ hypothesis. Data from nine cranial nonmetric traits were assessed for an estimate of biological distance, using Mahalanobis D2 with a tetrachoric matrix. The distance scores were then input into principal coordinates analysis (PCO) to depict the relationships between the two populations. PCO detected 60% of the variation in the first two principal coordinates. A plot of the distance scores revealed only one cluster; the Nubian and Egyptian groups clustered together. The grouping of the Nubians and Egyptians indicates there may have been some sort of gene flow between these groups of Nubians and Egyptians. However, common adaptation to similar environments may also be responsible for this pattern. Although the predominant results in this study appear to support the biological diffusion hypothesis, the in situ hypothesis was not completely negated.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19766993


Biotechnic & Histochemistry 2005, 80(1): 7_/13

"Materials and methods In 1997, the German Institute for Archaeology headed an excavation of the tombs of the nobles in Thebes-West, Upper Egypt. At this time, three types of tissues were sampled from different mummies: meniscus (fibrocartilage), skin, and placenta. Archaeological findings suggest that the mummies dated from the New Kingdom (approximately 1550_/1080 BC)...... The basal epithelial cells were packed with melanin as expected for specimens of negroid origin."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15804821


Am J Phys Anthropol, 2008.

Stature estimation;anatomical method;regression formulae;Egyptians

Abstract

Trotter and Gleser's (Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 10 (1952) 469–514; Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 16 (1958) 79–123) long bone formulae for US Blacks or derivations thereof (Robins and Shute: Hum Evol 1 (1986) 313–324) have been previously used to estimate the stature of ancient Egyptians. However, limb length to stature proportions differ between human populations; consequently, the most accurate mathematical stature estimates will be obtained when the population being examined is as similar as possible in proportions to the population used to create the equations. The purpose of this study was to create new stature regression formulae based on direct reconstructions of stature in ancient Egyptians and assess their accuracy in comparison to other stature estimation methods. We also compare Egyptian body proportions to those of modern American Blacks and Whites. Living stature estimates were derived using a revised Fully anatomical method (Raxter et al.: Am J Phys Anthropol 130 (2006) 374–384). Long bone stature regression equations were then derived for each sex. Our results confirm that, although ancient Egyptians are closer in body proportion to modern American Blacks than they are to American Whites, proportions in Blacks and Egyptians are not identical. The newly generated Egyptian-based stature regression formulae have standard errors of estimate of 1.9–4.2 cm. All mean directional differences are less than 0.4% compared to anatomically estimated stature, while results using previous formulae are more variable, with mean directional biases varying between 0.2% and 1.1%, tibial and radial estimates being the most biased. There is no evidence for significant variation in proportions among temporal or social groupings; thus, the new formulae may be broadly applicable to ancient Egyptian remains.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajpa.20790/abstract
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
^
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 
     
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:


     

---

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 



 

---

Posted by rahotep101 (Member # 18764) on :
 
I don't know about Somalis, but Nubians certainly appear have substantial Eurasian ancestry. Pre-medieval Nubians group with Egyptians, Greeks, Anatolians and Maltese before they do with negro Africans. Nefertari was no Nubian, however, but an Egyptian. It would be more relevant to contrast her to an Egyptian woman, especially one of Coptic background like Meriam George. She could also pass for a Greek or an Italian, as many Egyptians evidently could long before the first classical Greek visitor set foot in Egypt. This is what a pure descendant of ancient Egyptians can look like:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
Repost,

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
All Joking aside, yes it was a Joke Rahotep, Why cant you admit Nefertit's other images look no different than other East African Women, even when you do you inject some asinine opinion of a person who edits "Essence" as if that magazine is relevent to Africa or African people.

Deep Down you know without that Berlin Bust Nefertiti looks no different than an East African woman but it pains you so to admit it...lol

Hell Ill admit there are images in Egyptian Art that look Eurasian like the seated scribe, but a Euroclown will never admit the Egyptians resemble other Africans, its always the MEditeranian or Asiatics...

Pathetic..

---

Nefertiti

the fact is that there is plenty of crossover between blacks and whites feature-wise so in given example you can't be certain who's who


. _________________________________________

---

---

An examination of Nubian and Egyptian biological distances: Support for biological diffusion or in situ development?

K. Goddea, b, Corresponding Author Contact Information, E-mail The Corresponding Author

a Department of Anthropology, University of Tennessee, Knoxville, 250 South Stadium Hall, Knoxville, TN 37996, USA

b Department of Science, South College, 3904 Lonas Dr, Knoxville, TN 37909, USA


Abstract

Many authors have speculated on Nubian biological evolution. Because of the contact Nubians had with other peoples, migration and/or invasion (biological diffusion) were originally thought to be the biological mechanism for skeletal changes in Nubians. Later, a new hypothesis was put forth, the in situ hypothesis. The new hypothesis postulated that Nubians evolved in situ, without much genetic influence from foreign populations. This study examined 12 Egyptian and Nubian groups in an effort to explore the relationship between the two populations and to test the in situ hypothesis. Data from nine cranial nonmetric traits were assessed for an estimate of biological distance, using Mahalanobis D2 with a tetrachoric matrix. The distance scores were then input into principal coordinates analysis (PCO) to depict the relationships between the two populations. PCO detected 60% of the variation in the first two principal coordinates. A plot of the distance scores revealed only one cluster; the Nubian and Egyptian groups clustered together. The grouping of the Nubians and Egyptians indicates there may have been some sort of gene flow between these groups of Nubians and Egyptians. However, common adaptation to similar environments may also be responsible for this pattern. Although the predominant results in this study appear to support the biological diffusion hypothesis, the in situ hypothesis was not completely negated.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19766993


Biotechnic & Histochemistry 2005, 80(1): 7_/13

"Materials and methods In 1997, the German Institute for Archaeology headed an excavation of the tombs of the nobles in Thebes-West, Upper Egypt. At this time, three types of tissues were sampled from different mummies: meniscus (fibrocartilage), skin, and placenta. Archaeological findings suggest that the mummies dated from the New Kingdom (approximately 1550_/1080 BC)...... The basal epithelial cells were packed with melanin as expected for specimens of negroid origin."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15804821


Am J Phys Anthropol, 2008.

Stature estimation;anatomical method;regression formulae;Egyptians

Abstract

Trotter and Gleser's (Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 10 (1952) 469–514; Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 16 (1958) 79–123) long bone formulae for US Blacks or derivations thereof (Robins and Shute: Hum Evol 1 (1986) 313–324) have been previously used to estimate the stature of ancient Egyptians. However, limb length to stature proportions differ between human populations; consequently, the most accurate mathematical stature estimates will be obtained when the population being examined is as similar as possible in proportions to the population used to create the equations. The purpose of this study was to create new stature regression formulae based on direct reconstructions of stature in ancient Egyptians and assess their accuracy in comparison to other stature estimation methods. We also compare Egyptian body proportions to those of modern American Blacks and Whites. Living stature estimates were derived using a revised Fully anatomical method (Raxter et al.: Am J Phys Anthropol 130 (2006) 374–384). Long bone stature regression equations were then derived for each sex. Our results confirm that, although ancient Egyptians are closer in body proportion to modern American Blacks than they are to American Whites, proportions in Blacks and Egyptians are not identical. The newly generated Egyptian-based stature regression formulae have standard errors of estimate of 1.9–4.2 cm. All mean directional differences are less than 0.4% compared to anatomically estimated stature, while results using previous formulae are more variable, with mean directional biases varying between 0.2% and 1.1%, tibial and radial estimates being the most biased. There is no evidence for significant variation in proportions among temporal or social groupings; thus, the new formulae may be broadly applicable to ancient Egyptian remains.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajpa.20790/abstract

---

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 







 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

---

Like many of the photos, as you can see from the white background, the photo on the left was taken under dim lighting conditions.
The one on the right was taken under well lit conditions with clearer detail.


______________________________________________________________

Now look at this:






funny how all yall chase the skin tone on the right, like her's more "authentic" or something
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 




 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

---

Like many of the photos, as you can see from the white background, the photo on the left was taken under dim lighting conditions.
The one on the right was taken under well lit conditions.


______________________________________________________________

Now look at this:






funny how all yall chase the skin tone on the right, like her's more "authentic" or something

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
I don't know about Somalis, but Nubians certainly appear have substantial Eurasian ancestry. Pre-medieval Nubians group with Egyptians, Greeks, Anatolians and Maltese before they do with negro Africans. Nefertari was no Nubian, however, but an Egyptian. It would be more relevant to contrast her to an Egyptian woman, especially one of Coptic background like Meriam George. She could also pass for a Greek or an Italian, as many Egyptians evidently could long before the first classical Greek visitor set foot in Egypt. This is what a pure descendant of ancient Egyptians can look like:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
Repost,

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
All Joking aside, yes it was a Joke Rahotep, Why cant you admit Nefertit's other images look no different than other East African Women, even when you do you inject some asinine opinion of a person who edits "Essence" as if that magazine is relevent to Africa or African people.

Deep Down you know without that Berlin Bust Nefertiti looks no different than an East African woman but it pains you so to admit it...lol

Hell Ill admit there are images in Egyptian Art that look Eurasian like the seated scribe, but a Euroclown will never admit the Egyptians resemble other Africans, its always the MEditeranian or Asiatics...

Pathetic..

---

Nefertiti

the fact is that there is plenty of crossover between blacks and whites feature-wise so in given example you can't be certain who's who


. _________________________________________

---

---

An examination of Nubian and Egyptian biological distances: Support for biological diffusion or in situ development?

K. Goddea, b, Corresponding Author Contact Information, E-mail The Corresponding Author

a Department of Anthropology, University of Tennessee, Knoxville, 250 South Stadium Hall, Knoxville, TN 37996, USA

b Department of Science, South College, 3904 Lonas Dr, Knoxville, TN 37909, USA


Abstract

Many authors have speculated on Nubian biological evolution. Because of the contact Nubians had with other peoples, migration and/or invasion (biological diffusion) were originally thought to be the biological mechanism for skeletal changes in Nubians. Later, a new hypothesis was put forth, the in situ hypothesis. The new hypothesis postulated that Nubians evolved in situ, without much genetic influence from foreign populations. This study examined 12 Egyptian and Nubian groups in an effort to explore the relationship between the two populations and to test the in situ hypothesis. Data from nine cranial nonmetric traits were assessed for an estimate of biological distance, using Mahalanobis D2 with a tetrachoric matrix. The distance scores were then input into principal coordinates analysis (PCO) to depict the relationships between the two populations. PCO detected 60% of the variation in the first two principal coordinates. A plot of the distance scores revealed only one cluster; the Nubian and Egyptian groups clustered together. The grouping of the Nubians and Egyptians indicates there may have been some sort of gene flow between these groups of Nubians and Egyptians. However, common adaptation to similar environments may also be responsible for this pattern. Although the predominant results in this study appear to support the biological diffusion hypothesis, the in situ hypothesis was not completely negated.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19766993


Biotechnic & Histochemistry 2005, 80(1): 7_/13

"Materials and methods In 1997, the German Institute for Archaeology headed an excavation of the tombs of the nobles in Thebes-West, Upper Egypt. At this time, three types of tissues were sampled from different mummies: meniscus (fibrocartilage), skin, and placenta. Archaeological findings suggest that the mummies dated from the New Kingdom (approximately 1550_/1080 BC)...... The basal epithelial cells were packed with melanin as expected for specimens of negroid origin."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15804821


Am J Phys Anthropol, 2008.

Stature estimation;anatomical method;regression formulae;Egyptians

Abstract

Trotter and Gleser's (Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 10 (1952) 469–514; Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 16 (1958) 79–123) long bone formulae for US Blacks or derivations thereof (Robins and Shute: Hum Evol 1 (1986) 313–324) have been previously used to estimate the stature of ancient Egyptians. However, limb length to stature proportions differ between human populations; consequently, the most accurate mathematical stature estimates will be obtained when the population being examined is as similar as possible in proportions to the population used to create the equations. The purpose of this study was to create new stature regression formulae based on direct reconstructions of stature in ancient Egyptians and assess their accuracy in comparison to other stature estimation methods. We also compare Egyptian body proportions to those of modern American Blacks and Whites. Living stature estimates were derived using a revised Fully anatomical method (Raxter et al.: Am J Phys Anthropol 130 (2006) 374–384). Long bone stature regression equations were then derived for each sex. Our results confirm that, although ancient Egyptians are closer in body proportion to modern American Blacks than they are to American Whites, proportions in Blacks and Egyptians are not identical. The newly generated Egyptian-based stature regression formulae have standard errors of estimate of 1.9–4.2 cm. All mean directional differences are less than 0.4% compared to anatomically estimated stature, while results using previous formulae are more variable, with mean directional biases varying between 0.2% and 1.1%, tibial and radial estimates being the most biased. There is no evidence for significant variation in proportions among temporal or social groupings; thus, the new formulae may be broadly applicable to ancient Egyptian remains.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajpa.20790/abstract

---

---

Dumb piece of rasict retard, try to comprehend what those studies imply.

As I wrote before, you are not the one who can tell me who is who.... Stick to your British story, you'll be fine there.
 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 







 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

---

Like many of the photos, as you can see from the white background, the photo on the left was taken under dim lighting conditions.
The one on the right was taken under well lit conditions.


______________________________________________________________

Now look at this:






funny how all yall chase the skin tone on the right, like her's more "authentic" or something

---

You are one jealous hag.



 

---

Posted by the lioness (Member # 17353) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:



You as a "black woman", are you familiar with the trick of light?

---

yes but it doesn't apply here where both women are in similar well light outdoor conditions. stop playing games


 

---

Posted by Ish Gebor (Member # 18264) on :
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

---

Like many of the photos, as you can see from the white background, the photo on the left was taken under dim lighting conditions.
The one on the right was taken under well lit conditions.


______________________________________________________________

Now look at this:






funny how all yall chase the skin tone on the right, like her's more "authentic" or something

---

You are one jealous hag. Plus your, "now look at this image" doesn't show details anymore, because it was "over light". This how desperate you white racists are!

The woman I posted is from the same region, and there are many like her in the same region, resembeling Nefertiti. This is o coincidence.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by rahotep101:
I don't know about Somalis, but Nubians certainly appear have substantial Eurasian ancestry. Pre-medieval Nubians group with Egyptians, Greeks, Anatolians and Maltese before they do with negro Africans. Nefertari was no Nubian, however, but an Egyptian. It would be more relevant to contrast her to an Egyptian woman, especially one of Coptic background like Meriam George. She could also pass for a Greek or an Italian, as many Egyptians evidently could long before the first classical Greek visitor set foot in Egypt. This is what a pure descendant of ancient Egyptians can look like:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:
Repost,

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ish Gebor:

quote:

---

Originally posted by the lioness:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Just call me Jari:
All Joking aside, yes it was a Joke Rahotep, Why cant you admit Nefertit's other images look no different than other East African Women, even when you do you inject some asinine opinion of a person who edits "Essence" as if that magazine is relevent to Africa or African people.

Deep Down you know without that Berlin Bust Nefertiti looks no different than an East African woman but it pains you so to admit it...lol

Hell Ill admit there are images in Egyptian Art that look Eurasian like the seated scribe, but a Euroclown will never admit the Egyptians resemble other Africans, its always the MEditeranian or Asiatics...

Pathetic..

---

Nefertiti

the fact is that there is plenty of crossover between blacks and whites feature-wise so in given example you can't be certain who's who


. _________________________________________

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An examination of Nubian and Egyptian biological distances: Support for biological diffusion or in situ development?

K. Goddea, b, Corresponding Author Contact Information, E-mail The Corresponding Author

a Department of Anthropology, University of Tennessee, Knoxville, 250 South Stadium Hall, Knoxville, TN 37996, USA

b Department of Science, South College, 3904 Lonas Dr, Knoxville, TN 37909, USA


Abstract

Many authors have speculated on Nubian biological evolution. Because of the contact Nubians had with other peoples, migration and/or invasion (biological diffusion) were originally thought to be the biological mechanism for skeletal changes in Nubians. Later, a new hypothesis was put forth, the in situ hypothesis. The new hypothesis postulated that Nubians evolved in situ, without much genetic influence from foreign populations. This study examined 12 Egyptian and Nubian groups in an effort to explore the relationship between the two populations and to test the in situ hypothesis. Data from nine cranial nonmetric traits were assessed for an estimate of biological distance, using Mahalanobis D2 with a tetrachoric matrix. The distance scores were then input into principal coordinates analysis (PCO) to depict the relationships between the two populations. PCO detected 60% of the variation in the first two principal coordinates. A plot of the distance scores revealed only one cluster; the Nubian and Egyptian groups clustered together. The grouping of the Nubians and Egyptians indicates there may have been some sort of gene flow between these groups of Nubians and Egyptians. However, common adaptation to similar environments may also be responsible for this pattern. Although the predominant results in this study appear to support the biological diffusion hypothesis, the in situ hypothesis was not completely negated.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19766993


Biotechnic & Histochemistry 2005, 80(1): 7_/13

"Materials and methods In 1997, the German Institute for Archaeology headed an excavation of the tombs of the nobles in Thebes-West, Upper Egypt. At this time, three types of tissues were sampled from different mummies: meniscus (fibrocartilage), skin, and placenta. Archaeological findings suggest that the mummies dated from the New Kingdom (approximately 1550_/1080 BC)...... The basal epithelial cells were packed with melanin as expected for specimens of negroid origin."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15804821


Am J Phys Anthropol, 2008.

Stature estimation;anatomical method;regression formulae;Egyptians

Abstract

Trotter and Gleser's (Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 10 (1952) 469–514; Trotter and Gleser: Am J Phys Anthropol 16 (1958) 79–123) long bone formulae for US Blacks or derivations thereof (Robins and Shute: Hum Evol 1 (1986) 313–324) have been previously used to estimate the stature of ancient Egyptians. However, limb length to stature proportions differ between human populations; consequently, the most accurate mathematical stature estimates will be obtained when the population being examined is as similar as possible in proportions to the population used to create the equations. The purpose of this study was to create new stature regression formulae based on direct reconstructions of stature in ancient Egyptians and assess their accuracy in comparison to other stature estimation methods. We also compare Egyptian body proportions to those of modern American Blacks and Whites. Living stature estimates were derived using a revised Fully anatomical method (Raxter et al.: Am J Phys Anthropol 130 (2006) 374–384). Long bone stature regression equations were then derived for each sex. Our results confirm that, although ancient Egyptians are closer in body proportion to modern American Blacks than they are to American Whites, proportions in Blacks and Egyptians are not identical. The newly generated Egyptian-based stature regression formulae have standard errors of estimate of 1.9–4.2 cm. All mean directional differences are less than 0.4% compared to anatomically estimated stature, while results using previous formulae are more variable, with mean directional biases varying between 0.2% and 1.1%, tibial and radial estimates being the most biased. There is no evidence for significant variation in proportions among temporal or social groupings; thus, the new formulae may be broadly applicable to ancient Egyptian remains.

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajpa.20790/abstract

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Dumb piece of rasict retard, try to comprehend what those studies imply.

As I wrote before, you are not the one who can tell me who is who.... Stick to your British story, you'll be fine there.

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