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I think this is the most important thread I patse There are many religions.
Why do Muslims think that Islam is true. Is there any factual basis? Praise be to Allah.
This is a reasonable enough question for one who has not entered Islam, but one who believes in and practices this religion already knows the blessings which are his because of this religion. There are many reasons for this, which include the following:
(1) The Muslim worships One God, Who has no partner, and Who has the most beautiful names and the highest attributes. Thus the Muslim’s focus and aim is concentrated, focused on His Lord and Creator; he puts his trust in Him and asks Him for help, patience and support; he believes that Allaah is able to do all things, and has no need of a wife or son. Allaah created the heavens and earth; He is the One Who gives life and death; He is the Creator and Sustainer from Whom the slave seeks provision. He is the All-Hearing Who responds to the supplication of His slave, and from Whom the slave hopes for a response. He is the All-Merciful and All-Forgiving, to Whom the slave turns in repentance when he has committed a sin or fallen short in his worship of Allaah. He is the Omniscient and All-Seeing, who knows all intentions and what is hidden in people’s hearts. The slave feels ashamed to commit a sin by doing wrong to himself or to others, because his Lord is watching over him and sees all that he does. He knows that Allaah is All-Wise, the Seer of the Unseen, so he trusts that what Allaah decrees for him is good; he knows that Allaah will never be unjust to him, and that everything that Allaah decrees for him is good, even if he does not understand the wisdom behind it.
(2) The effects of Islaamic worship on the soul of the Muslim include the following: Prayer keeps the slave in contact with his Lord; if he enters it in a spirit of humiliation and concentration, he will feel tranquil and secure, because he is seeking a "powerful support," which is Allaah, may He be glorified and exalted. For this reason, the Prophet of Islaam, Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) used to say: "Let us find relaxation and joy in prayer." If something distressed him, he would hasten to pray. Everyone who finds himself faced with disaster and tries prayer finds strength, patience and consolation, because he is reciting the words of his Lord, which cannot be compared to the effect of the words of a created being. If the words of some psychologists can offer a little comfort, what do you think of the words of the One Who created the psychologist?
Now let us look at zakaat, which is one of the pillars of Islaam. Zakaat purifies the soul from stinginess and miserliness, and accustoms people to being generous and helping the poor and needy. It will bring a great reward on the Day of Resurrection, just like other forms of worship. It is not burdensome, like man-made taxes; it is only 25 in every thousand, which the sincere Muslim pays willingly and does not try to evade or wait until someone chases him for it.
Fasting involves refraining from food and sex. It is a form of worship, and a way in which one can feel the hunger of those who are deprived. It is also a reminder of the blessings of the Creator, and it brings rewards beyond measure.
Hajj is the Pilgrimage to the sacred House of Allaah, which was built by Ibraaheem (Abraham, upon whom be peace). By performing Hajj one is obeying the command of Allaah and the call to come and meet Muslims from all over the world.
(3) Islaam commands all kinds of good and forbids all kinds of evil. It encourages good manners and proper treatment of others. It enjoins good characteristics such as truthfulness, patience, deliberation, kindness, humility, modesty, keeping promises, dignity, mercy, justice, courage, patience, friendliness, contentment, chastity, good treatment, tolerance, trustworthiness, gratitude for favours, and self-control in times of anger. Islaam commands the Muslim to fulfil his duty towards his parents and to uphold family ties, to help the needy, to treat neighbours well, to protect and safeguard the wealth of the orphan, to be gentle with the young and show respect to the old, to be kind to servants and animals, to remove harmful things from the road, to speak kind words, to forgive at the time when one has the opportunity to take revenge, to be sincere towards one’s fellow-Muslims, to meet the needs of the Muslims, to give the debtor time to repay his debt, to prefer others over oneself, to console others, to greet people with a smiling face, to visit the sick, to support the one who is oppressed, to give gifts to friends, to honour his guest, to treat his wife kindly and spend on her and her children, to spread the greeting of peace (salaam) and to seek permission before entering another person’s house, lest one see something private that the other person does not want one to see.
Some non-Muslims may do these things out of politeness or good manners, but they are not seeking reward from Allaah or salvation of the Day of Judgement.
If we look at what Islam has prohibited, we will find that it is in the interests of both the individual and society as a whole. All these prohibitions serve to safeguard the relationship between the slave and his Lord, and the relationship of the individual with himself and with his fellow-man. The following examples demonstrate this:
Islam forbids the association of anything in worship with Allaah and the worship of anything other than Allaah, because this spells doom and misery. Islaam also forbids visiting or believing soothsayers and fortune-tellers; magic or witchcraft that may cause a rift between two people or bring them together; belief in the influence of the stars on events and people’s lives; cursing time, because Allaah is directing its affairs; and superstition, because this is pessimism.
Islam forbids cancelling out good deeds by showing off, boasting or reminding others of one’s favours; bowing or prostrating to anything other than Allaah; sitting with hypocrites or immoral people for the purposes of enjoying their company or keeping them company; and invoking the curse or wrath of Allaah on one another or damning one another to Hell.
Islaam forbids urinating into stagnant water; defecating on the side of the road or in places where people seek shade or where they draw water; from facing the qiblah (direction of prayer) or turning one’s back towards it when passing water or stools; holding one’s penis in one’s right hand when passing water; giving the greeting of salaam (peace) to one who is answering the call of nature; and putting one’s hand into any vessel before washing it, when one has just woken up.
Islaam forbids the offering of any nafl (supererogatory) prayers when the sun is rising, when it is at its zenith, and when it is setting, because it rises and sets between the horns of Shaytaan (Satan); praying when there is food prepared that a person desires; praying when one urgently needs to pass water, stools or wind, because that will distract a person from concentrating properly on his prayer.
Islam forbids the Muslim to raise his voice in prayer, lest it disturb other believers; to continue offering supererogatory prayers at night when one feels drowsy - such a person should sleep then get up; to stay up all night in prayer, especially one night after another; and to stop praying when there is doubt as to the validity of one’s wudoo’ - unless one hears a sound or smells an odour.
Islaam forbids buying, selling and making "lost and found" announcements in the mosque - because it is the place of worship and remembrance of Allaah, where worldly affairs have no place.
Islam forbids haste in walking when the iqaamah (call immediately preceding congregational prayer) is given, and prescribes walking in a calm and dignified manner. It is also forbidden to boast about the cost of building a mosque; to decorate a mosque with red or yellow paint or adornments which will distract the worshippers; to fast day after day without a break; and for a woman to observe a supererogatory fast when her husband is present without his permission.
Islaam forbids building over graves, making them high, sitting on them, walking between them wearing shoes, putting lights over them or writing on them. It is forbidden to disinter the dead or to take graves as places of worship. Islam forbids wailing, tearing one’s clothes or leaving one’s hair unkempt when a person dies. Eulogizing the dead in the manner of the times of Ignorance (Jaahiliyyah) is also forbidden, although there is nothing wrong with informing others that a person has died.
Islaam forbids the consumption of riba (interest); all kinds of selling which involve ignorance (of the product), misleading and cheating; selling blood, wine, pork, idols and everything that Allaah has forbidden - their price, whether bought or sold - is haraam; najash, which is offering a price for something one has no intention of buying, as happens in many auctions; concealing a product’s faults at the time of selling; selling something which one does not own or before it comes into one’s possession; undercutting, outbidding or out bargaining another; selling produce before it is clear that it is in good condition and free of blemish; cheating in weights and measures; and hoarding. A partner who has shares in a plot of land or a date palm tree is forbidden to sell his share without consulting his partners. It is forbidden to consume the wealth of orphans unjustly; to bet or gamble; to take anything by force; to accept or offer bribes; to steal people’s wealth or to consume it unjustly; to take something for the purpose of destroying it; to undermine the value of people’s possessions; to keep lost property which one has found, or to keep quiet about it and not announce it, for it belongs to the one who recognizes it; to cheat in any way; to ask for a loan with no intention of repaying it; to take anything of the wealth of a fellow-Muslim, unless it is given freely, because what is taken because of another person’s shyness is haraam; and to accept a gift because of intercession.
Celibacy and castration are forbidden, as is marrying two sisters, or a woman and her aunt (paternal or maternal), whether he marries the aunt after marrying her niece or vice versa, for fear of breaking the ties of kinship. It is forbidden to make deals in marriage, such as saying "Let me marry your daughter and I will give you my daughter or sister in marriage." Such reciprocal deals are a form of oppression and injustice, and haraam. Islaam forbids mut’ah (temporary marriage), which is a marriage contract for a period of time agreed by the two parties, at the end of which the marriage expires. Islaam forbids intercourse with a menstruating woman, until she has purified herself (by taking a bath after her period ends), and also forbids anal intercourse. A man is forbidden to propose marriage to a woman when another man has already proposed to her, unless the other man withdraws his proposal or gives him permission. It is forbidden to marry a previously-married woman without consulting her, or a virgin without seeking her permission. It is forbidden to wish (a newly married couple) "Bi’l-rafaa’ wa’l-baneen (a joyful life and many sons)," because this is the greeting of the people of Jaahiliyyah, who hated daughters. The divorced woman is forbidden to conceal what Allaah has created in her womb (if she is pregnant). A husband and wife are forbidden to speak (to others) about the intimacies of married life. It is forbidden to turn a woman against her husband or to take divorce lightly. It is forbidden for a woman to ask for another’s divorce, such as asking a man to divorce a woman so that she can marry him. A wife is forbidden to spend her husband’s money without his permission, or to keep away from his bed without good reason, because the angels will curse her if she does that. A man is forbidden to marry his father’s wife, or to have intercourse with a woman who is pregnant from another man. It is forbidden for a man to practise ‘azl (coitus interruptus) with his free wife without her permission. It is forbidden for a man to return home from a journey late at night and startle his family, unless he has previously notified them when he will arrive home. A man is forbidden to take anything of his wife’s mahr (dowry) without her consent, or to keep annoying his wife so that she will give up her wealth.
Islaam forbids women to make a wanton display of themselves (tabarruj). It also forbids extreme forms of female circumcision. Women are forbidden to admit anyone into their husband’s home without his permission; his general permission is acceptable so long as they stay within the limits of sharee’ah. It is forbidden to separate a mother and child (in case of divorce); to let one’s womenfolk behave foolishly (in an immoral fashion) and not say anything; to let one’s gaze wander everywhere; and to follow an accidental glance with an intentional glance.
Islaam forbids the eating of dead meat, regardless of whether it died by drowning, strangulation, shock or falling from a high place; eating blood, pork and anything slaughtered in a name other than that of Allaah or for idols; eating the flesh or drinking the milk of beasts that feed on filth and waste matter; eating the flesh of every carnivorous beast that has fangs and every bird that has talons; eating the meat of domesticated donkeys; killing animals by keeping them and throwing stones at them until they die, or detaining them without food until they die; slaughtering with teeth or nails; slaughtering one animal (for food) in front of another; or sharpening the knife in front of the animal to be slaughtered.
In the area of clothing and adornment, men are forbidden the extravagance of wearing gold. Muslim are forbidden to be naked or to expose their thighs; to leave their clothes long (below the ankles) and trail them on the ground for the purpose of showing off; and to wear clothes that will attract attention.
It is forbidden to bear false witness; to make false accusations against a chaste believing woman; to accuse someone who is innocent; to utter lies; to slander and backbite; to call people by offensive nicknames; to spread gossip and malicious slander; to make fun of the Muslims; to boast about one’s status; to shed doubts on a person’s lineage; to utter slander, insults and obscenities; to speak in an indecent or rude manner; or to utter evil in public, except by one who has been wronged.
Islaam forbids telling lies; one of the worst kinds of lie is to lie about dreams, like fabricating dreams and visions in order to prove one’s virtue, or make some material gains, or to frighten an enemy.
Muslims are forbidden to praise themselves, or to talk in a secret way: two may not converse secretly to the exclusion of a third, because this is offensive. It is forbidden to curse a believer or someone who does not deserve to be cursed.
Islaam forbids speaking ill of the dead; praying for death; wishing for death because of some suffering that one is passing through; praying against one’s self, one’s children, one’s servants or one’s wealth.
Muslims are told not to eat the food that is directly in front of others or to eat from the centre of the dish or platter; rather they should eat from what is directly in front of them or thereabouts, because the barakah (blessing) comes in the middle of the food. It is forbidden to drink from a broken edge of a vessel, because this could cause harm; or to drink from the mouth of a vessel; or to breathe into it. It is forbidden to eat while lying on one’s stomach; to sit at a table where wine is being drunk; to leave a fire burning in one’s house when one sleeps; to sleep with Ghamr in one’s hand, like an offensive smell or the remainder of food (grease); to sleep on one’s stomach; or to talk about or try to interpret bad dreams, because these are tricks of the Shaytaan.
It is forbidden to kill another person except in cases where it is right to do so; to kill one’s children for fear of poverty; to commit suicide; to commit fornication, adultery or sodomy (homosexuality); to drink wine, or even to prepare it, carry it from one place to another, or sell it. Muslims are forbidden to please people by angering Allaah; to offend their parents or even to say "Uff" (the slightest word of contempt) to them; to claim that a child belongs to anyone but his real father; to torture by means of fire; to burn anyone, alive or dead, with fire; to mutilate the bodies of the slain; to help anyone commit falsehood; or to cooperate in wrongdoing and sin.
It is forbidden to obey any person by disobeying Allaah; to swear falsely; to swear a disastrous oath; to eavesdrop on people without their permission; to invade people’s privacy or look at their private parts; to claim something that does not belong to one or that one did not do, for the purpose of showing off; to look into someone’s else’s house without permission; to be extravagant; to swear an oath to do something wrong; to spy on others or be suspicious about righteous men and women; to envy, hate or shun one another; to persist in falsehood; to be arrogant or feel superior; to be filled with self-admiration; to be pleased with one’s arrogance. Islam forbids taking back one’s charity, even if one pays to get it back; employing someone to do a job without paying him his wages; being unfair in giving gifts to one’s children; bequeathing everything in one’s will and leaving one’s heirs poor - in such a case the will should not be executed; writing a will that concerns more than one third of one’s legacy; being a bad neighbour; or changing a will to the detriment of one or some of one’s heirs. A Muslim is forbidden to forsake or shun his brother for more than three days, except for a reason sanctioned by sharee’ah; to hold small stones between two fingers and throw them because this could cause injury to eyes or teeth; to include his heirs in a will, because Allaah has already given heirs their rights of inheritance; to disturb his neighbour; to point a weapon at his Muslim brother; to hand someone an unsheathed sword, lest it harm him; to come (walk) between two people except with their permission; to return a gift, unless there is some shar’i objection to it; to be extravagant; to give money to foolish people; to wish to be like someone to whom Allaah has given more of something; to cancel out his charity by giving offensive reminders of his giving; to wilfully conceal testimony; or to oppress orphans or scold one who asks for help or money. It is forbidden to treat with evil medicines, because Allaah would not create a cure for this ummah which includes something that He has forbidden. It is forbidden to kill women and children in warfare; to boast to one another; or to break promises.
Islaam forbids betraying a trust; asking for charity that one does not need; alarming a Muslim brother or taking away his possessions, whether jokingly or seriously; changing one’s mind after giving a gift, except in the case of a gift from a father to his child; practising medicine without experience; or killing ants, bees and hoopoe birds. A man is forbidden to look at the ‘awrah (private parts) of another man, and a woman is forbidden to look at the ‘awrah of another woman. It is forbidden to sit between two people without their permission; or to greet only those whom one knows, because the greeting is to be given to those whom you know and those whom you do not know. A Muslim is forbidden to let an oath come between him and good deeds; he should do what is good and make expiation for the oath. It is forbidden to judge between two disputing parties when one is angry, or to judge in favour of one party without hearing what the other has to say. It is forbidden for a man to walk through the market-place carrying something - like a sharp weapon - that could harm the Muslims, unless it is properly covered. A Muslim is forbidden to make another person get up, so that he can take his place.
There are more commands and prohibitions which came for the benefit and happiness of individuals and mankind as a whole. Have you ever seen any other religion that can compare to this religion?
Read this response again, then ask yourself: is it not a great pity that I am not one of them? Allaah says in the Qur’aan (interpretation of the meaning): "And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers." [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85]
Finally, I hope that everyone who reads this will be guided to the correct way and to follow the truth. May Allaah protect you and us from all evil.
Islam Q&A Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid (www.islam-qa.com)
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"Islaam forbids urinating into stagnant water; defecating on the side of the road or in places where people seek shade or where they draw water; from facing the qiblah (direction of prayer) or turning one’s back towards it when passing water or stools; holding one’s penis in one’s right hand when passing water; giving the greeting of salaam (peace) to one who is answering the call of nature; and putting one’s hand into any vessel before washing it, when one has just woken up."
quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: Read this response again, then ask yourself: is it not a great pity that I am not one of them?
Actually I'm very grateful I don't have to follow this man's version of religion.
But I'm sure this will convince many women to convert 3alatool ...
quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org:
A wife is forbidden to spend her husband’s money without his permission, or to keep away from his bed without good reason, because the angels will curse her if she does that.
...
It also forbids extreme forms of female circumcision.
...
It is forbidden ... to let one’s womenfolk behave foolishly (in an immoral fashion) and not say anything
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Btw ... here are some excerpts from one of my favourite fatwas by Mr Salih Al-Munajjid
IIbn Katheer (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “Allaah says ‘Men are the protectors and maintainers of women’ meaning that the man is in charge of the woman, i.e., he is the leader and head of the household, the one who disciplines her if she goes astray.
‘because Allaah has made one of them to excel the other’ i.e., because men are superior to women and are better than women. Hence Prophethood was given only to men, as was the position of khaleefah, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, ‘No people shall ever prosper who appoint a woman as their ruler.’ This was narrated by al-Bukhaari from the hadeeth of ‘Abd al-Rahmaan ibn Abi Bakrah from his father. The same applies to the position of qaadi (judge), etc.
‘and because they spend (to support them) from their means’ refers to the mahr and the spending on women’s maintenance that Allaah has enjoined upon men in His Book and in the Sunnah of His Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). So a man is inherently better than a woman, and he is superior to her because he spends on her. So it is appropriate that he should be in charge of her, as Allaah says, ‘but men have a degree (of responsibility) over them’ [al-Baqarah 2:228]. ...
There may be some women who are wiser than some men, but this is not the usual rule and such women are not in the majority. Sharee’ah is based on what is general and most common.
The fact that women are lacking in reason does not mean that they are crazy, rather their reason is often overtaken by their emotions, and this happens to women more often than it happens to men. No one would deny this except one who is arrogant. ... And men are different in intellectual terms, for men are known for their strength of understanding and their memory as compared to women. Women are weaker than men in memory and forget more than men do. This is well known, for most of the reputable scholars in the world are men. There are some women who are more intelligent and have better memories than some men, but this does not cancel out the general rule. Most cases are as we have described above.
With regard to emotions, men speak of them when they get angry or when they are happy, but women are affected by the slightest emotional effects, so their tears flow at the slightest emotional provocation.
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""And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers." [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85]"
Now you understand why I am saying that Allah is a fearful God and Islam is the religion of fear. What happened to the free will that God gave us? Christianity teaches that God made the world because He wanted to do so, the same way you give birth to a child because you wish to. And because of that, He loves man and wants to do what is best for us. But He gave us free will. Why? Because you cannot have a loving relationship without it. If you gave birth to a child who would automatically do anything you commanded it, such as moving an arm upwards or sitting down, without thought, what sort of relationship would that be? Your computer does anything you tell it to do, but do you really love it? Is it your companion? Christians obey God out of love for what He's done for us, not out of fear. When man sinned and was separated from God, God himself came to earth in the form of Jesus Christ to sacrifice Himself, to pay the price for all of our sins, from the beginning of time to the end. Think about it. Isn’t that enormous love for us on his part? Was it really necessary for Him to do that, as far as He was concerned? There was no reason for Him to do it except out of love for us.
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: Islaam forbids the eating of dead meat, regardless of whether it died by drowning, strangulation, shock or falling from a high place; eating blood, pork and anything slaughtered in a name other than that of Allaah or for idols; eating the flesh or drinking the milk of beasts that feed on filth and waste matter; eating the flesh of every carnivorous beast that has fangs and every bird that has talons;
And here is what Jesus had to say on this:
Mark 7:14-23: “Again Jesus called the crowd to him and said, ‘Listen to me, everyone, and understand this. Nothing outside a man can make him unclean by going into him. Rather, it is what comes out of a man that makes him unclean.’ After he had left the crowd and entered the house, his disciples asked him about this parable. ‘Are you so dull?’ he asked. ‘Don't you see that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him `unclean'? For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body.’(In saying this, Jesus declared all foods "clean.") He went on: ‘What comes out of a man is what makes him `unclean.' For from within, out of men's hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly. All these evils come from inside and make a man `unclean.’”
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: Read this response again, then ask yourself: is it not a great pity that I am not one of them?
Not it's not. It would be a great pity-and very unfortunate- if I was born Muslim.
To quote Ioshka Futz, " I do not envy you. I don't have to call a prophet who started 68 wars a perfect guide. Nor do I have to defend a book that orders crucifixion and decapitation a source of wisdom. I and my confreres have been gratefully spared such self-defeating mental calisthenics... and our churches are for the most part run by men of easy smiles and generously forgiving dispositions. We are happier. The basic natural simplicity of the moral messages we have received as opposed to the many numbing and useless rituals of Islam has freed our minds, and our great achievements in the arts, crafts and sciences reflects that freedom."
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quote:Originally posted by l: "And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers." [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85]"
Say: "Shall we inform you of the greatest losers?"
"Those whose efforts in the worldly life were wasted while they thought they were doing good!"
quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: There are more commands and prohibitions which came for the benefit and happiness of individuals and mankind as a whole. Have you ever seen any other religion that can compare to this religion?
Yes it's true, Islam is full of commands and prohibitions. In Islam we are under the authority of a higher spiritual power, so we aren’t free to do whatever we want. Therefore, if we are under an authority, there must be some compelling reason why we should obey the authority. In Islam, there really isn’t. We are told we must obey and love Allah, but it fails to explain why. Do any good feelings come out of that love? Is there a sense of peace, of security? The answer is no.
The laws of Islam are mostly tyranny and oppression. No one has any rights to be secure in their lives and their property. Women are forced to be under the absolute power of their husbands, and even the men are forced to be under the absolute power of the governments, and the governments are forced to be under the absolute power of Allah. If the authority were just and kind, it would be all right, but it isn’t. There is almost no love or kindness in the laws of Islam. The word mercy is used quite a bit, but it doesn’t really explain what mercy brings us. Women getting stoned, children get sent to blow themselves up in the name of Allah, ridding the planet of the unbelievers. Death, fear, and oppression are the result of the laws of Islam. There is not one single reason why anyone would want to follow Allah except through fear. There is a vague promise of blessings on earth, but after all the judgments and commandments, it does not seem very useful. In fact, no one is guaranteed anything at all. Read this passage:
“Whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth is Allah’s; and whether you manifest what is in your minds or hide it, Allah will call you to account according to it; then He will forgive whom He pleases and chastise whom He pleases, and Allah has power over all things.” —The Cow, v.284 M.H. Shakir
And fear is no way to live. Who would really want to live terrified of those in authority over you? Allah can make any decisions to do anything he likes with the people over whom he holds dominion.
In short Allah does not seem to be a very loving god. You begin to wonder where the concept of love came from, or why Allah even made the world at all, under Islam.
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quote:Originally posted by l: "And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers." [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85]"
Say: "Shall we inform you of the greatest losers?"
"Those whose efforts in the worldly life were wasted while they thought they were doing good!" (18:103-104)
Ok. I Say: "Shall we inform you of the greatest losers?"
"Those whose efforts in the worldly life were wasted while they thought they were doing good!"
posted
"And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers." [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85]"
Emphasis on 'and' and on 'Hereafter'
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quote: Actually I'm very grateful I don't have to follow this man's version of religion.
But I'm sure this will convince many women to convert 3alatool ...
You are free to believe or disbleieve. The Emam wasnt making up stories but he is talking with authentic texts originally from the Prophet Muhammed sunnah and Quran.
quote: IIbn Katheer (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “Allaah says ‘Men are the protectors and maintainers of women’ meaning that the man is in charge of the woman, i.e., he is the leader and head of the household, the one who disciplines her if she goes astray.
‘because Allaah has made one of them to excel the other’ i.e., because men are superior to women and are better than women. Hence Prophethood was given only to men, as was the position of khaleefah, because the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, ‘No people shall ever prosper who appoint a woman as their ruler.’ This was narrated by al-Bukhaari from the hadeeth of ‘Abd al-Rahmaan ibn Abi Bakrah from his father. The same applies to the position of qaadi (judge), etc.
‘and because they spend (to support them) from their means’ refers to the mahr and the spending on women’s maintenance that Allaah has enjoined upon men in His Book and in the Sunnah of His Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him). So a man is inherently better than a woman, and he is superior to her because he spends on her. So it is appropriate that he should be in charge of her, as Allaah says, ‘but men have a degree (of responsibility) over them’ [al-Baqarah 2:228]. ...
There may be some women who are wiser than some men, but this is not the usual rule and such women are not in the majority. Sharee’ah is based on what is general and most common.
The fact that women are lacking in reason does not mean that they are crazy, rather their reason is often overtaken by their emotions, and this happens to women more often than it happens to men. No one would deny this except one who is arrogant. ... And men are different in intellectual terms, for men are known for their strength of understanding and their memory as compared to women. Women are weaker than men in memory and forget more than men do. This is well known, for most of the reputable scholars in the world are men. There are some women who are more intelligent and have better memories than some men, but this does not cancel out the general rule. Most cases are as we have described above.
With regard to emotions, men speak of them when they get angry or when they are happy, but women are affected by the slightest emotional effects, so their tears flow at the slightest emotional provocation
We should read the full answer of the emam and then Evaluate it. you cant Quote the phrases you want and discard the other ones that is explainig the Emam's view.
In the Link you gave, The emam said:
Women are like men in some aspects and they differ from them in others. Most of the rulings of Islam apply to men and women equally. In cases where a distinction is made between the sexes, the Muslim regards that as a mercy from Allaah and a sign of His knowledge of His creation, but the arrogant kaafir sees it as oppression and injustice
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quote:Originally posted by Dalia*: Which part of "men are superior to women and are better than women" do you think I misunderstood?
But, sorry, of course I'm just an arrogant kaffira who overlooks the deep wisdom and justice in this fatwa.
Did I say that you are??? i didnt mean that
The emam was explaining a quranic verse that mention that men are better than men and superior than woman. this is in some issues.
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And, yeah, he might be using authentic texts but he interprets them and twists them according to his own bias. And it does take a lot of bias in my opininon to interpret a verse that speaks of men's financial obligations towards women to mean that men are inherently better than women. Likewise, his theories about "the general rule" being that women are "less wiser" and "more easily overtaken by their emotions" (i.e., not capable of making responsible decisions) are just that – theories of a patriarchally thinking brain that have no basis either in reality or in religious texts. I find it very hard to imagine anyone would still take that sort of stuff seriously since we have eyes and a brain to observe the world around us. And btw, women have actually been proven in some scientific studies to be more observant and having better memories than men; so what this guy is writing about "women forgetting things easier than men do" is a load of BS.
And he makes the argument worse by using circular logic in claiming that the "proof" for men's intellectual superiority is the fact that "most of the reputable scholars in the world are men". This statement is not only downright ridiculous, it's also completely ignorant of history and social science.
I have no respect whatsoever for this guy since he has obviously no respect for women – nor for integrity, for that matter.
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Two women are to take the place of one man because women are lacking in reason, as Muslim narrated in his Saheeh… from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “O women, give in charity and seek forgiveness a great deal, for I have seen that you form the majority of the people of Hell.” A wise woman among them said, “Why is it, O Messenger of Allaah, that we are the majority of the people of Hell?” He said, “Because you curse too much, and you are ungrateful to your spouses. I have seen none lacking in common sense and failing in religion but (at the same time) robbing the wisdom of the wise, besides you.” The woman asked: “O Messenger of Allaah, what is wrong with our common sense and our religion?” He said: “Your lack of common sense (can be well judged from the fact) that the evidence of two women is equal to that of one man, that is a proof of the lack of common sense, and you spend some nights (and days) in which you do not offer prayer and in the month of Ramadan (during the days) you do not observe fast, that is a failing in religion.” Posts: 3587 | Registered: Mar 2006
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I won't defend The Emam and say that He didnt mean any insult to the women and the rights of the women. I will let people read the full answer and then Govern him according to his full answer. in the link you gave, http://63.175.194.25/index.php?ln=eng&ds=qa&lv=browse&QR=1105&dgn=4
But I will talk about the Human Rights that Islam gave to muslim women, WOMEN'S LIBERATION THROUGH ISLAM Today people think that women are liberated in the West and that thewomen's liberation movement began in the 20th century. Actually, thewomen's liberation movement was not begun by women but was revealed by Godto a man in the seventh century by the name of Muhammad (peace be uponhim), who is known as the last Prophet of Islam. The Qur'an and theTraditions of the Prophet (Hadith or Sunnah) are the sources from whichevery Muslim woman derives her rights and duties.
I. HUMAN RIGHTS Islam, fourteen centuries ago, made women equally accountable to God inglorifying and worshipping Him - setting no limits on her moral progress. Also, Islam established a woman's equality in her humanity with men.
In the Qur'an, in the first verse of the chapter entitled "Women," Godsays, "O mankind! Be careful of your duty to your Lord Who created youfrom a single soul and from it its mate and from them both have spreadabroad a multitude of men and women. Be careful of your duty toward Allahin Whom you claim (your rights) of one another, and towards the wombs (that bore you). Lo! Allah has been a Watcher over you." (4:1)
Since men and women both came from the same essence, they are equal in their humanity. Women cannot be by nature evil (as some religious believe) or then men would be evil also. Similarly, neither gender can be superior because it would be a contradiction of equality.
II. CIVIL RIGHTS In Islam, a woman has the basic freedom of choice and expression based on recognition of her individual personality. First, she is free to choose her religion. The Qur'an states: "There is no compulsion in religion. Right has been made distinct from error." (2:256)
Women are encouraged in Islam to contribute their opinions and ideas. There are many traditions of the Prophet (pbuh) which indicate women would pose questions directly to him and offer their opinions concerning religion, economics and social matters.
A Muslim woman chooses her husband and keeps her name after marriage. A Muslim woman's testimony is valid in legal disputes. In fact, in areas in which women are more familiar, their evidence is conclusive.
III. SOCIAL RIGHTS The Prophet (pbuh) said: "Seeking knowledge is a mandate for every Muslim (male and female)." This includes knowledge of the Qur'an and the Hadith as well as other knowledge. Men and women both have the capacity for learning and understanding. Since it is also their obligation to promote good behavior and condemn bad behavior in all spheres of life, Muslim women must acquire the appropriate education to perform this duty in accordance with their own natural talents and interests.
While maintenance of a home, providing support to her husband, and bearing, raising and teaching of children are among the first and very highly regarded roles for a woman, if she has the skills to work outside the home for the good of the community, she may do so as long as her family obligations are met.
Islam recognizes and fosters the natural differences between men and women despite their equality. Some types of work are more suitable for men and other types for women. This in no way diminishes either's effort nor its benefit. God will reward both sexes equally for the value of their work, though it may not necessarily be the same activity.
Concerning motherhood, the Prophet (pbuh) said: "Heaven lies under the feet of mothers." This implies that the success of a society can be traced to the mothers that raised it. The first and greatest influence on a person comes from the sense of security, affection, and training received from the mother. Therefore, a woman having children must be educated and conscientious in order to be a skillful parent.
IV. POLITICAL RIGHTS A right given to Muslim women by God 1400 years ago is the right to vote. On any public matter, a woman may voice her opinion and participate in politics. One example, narrated in the Qur'an (60:12), is that Muhammad (pbuh) is told that when the believing women come to him and swear their allegiance to Islam, he must accept their oath. This established the right of women to select their leader and publicly declare so. Finally, Islam does not forbid a woman from holding important positions in government. Abdur-Rahman Ibn Auf consulted many women before he recommended Uthman Ibn Affan to be the Caliph.
V. ECONOMIC RIGHTS The Qur'an states: "By the creation of the male and female; Verily, (the ends) ye strive for are diverse." (92:3-4)
In these verses, God declares that He created men and women to be different, with unique roles, functions and skills. As in society, where there is a division of labor, so too in a family; each member has different responsibilities. Generally, Islam upholds that women are entrusted with the nurturing role, and men, with the guardian role. Therefore, women are given the right of financial support.
The Qur'an states: "Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend of their wealth (for the support of women)." (4:34)
This guardianship and greater financial responsibility is given to men, requires that they provide women with not only monetary support but also physical protection and kind and respectful treatment.
The Muslim woman has the privilege to earn money, the right to own property, to enter into legal contracts and to manage all of her assets in any way she pleases. She can run her own business and no one has any claim on her earnings including her husband. The Qur'an states:
"And in no wise covet those things in which Allah hath bestowed His gifts more freely on some of you than on others; to men is allotted what they earn, and to women, what they earn; but ask Allah of His bounty, for Allah hath full knowledge of all things." (4:32)
A woman inherits from her relatives. The Qur'an states: "For men there is a share in what parents and relatives leave, and for women there is a share of what parents and relatives leave, whether it be little or much - an ordained share." (4:7)
VI. RIGHTS OF A WIFE The Qur'an states: "And among His signs is that He created for you mates from among yourselves that you may live in tranquillity with them, and He has put love and mercy between you; Verily, in that are signs for people who reflect." (30:21)
Marriage is therefore not just a physical or emotional necessity, but in fact, a sign from God! It is a relationship of mutual rights and obligations based on divine guidance. God created men and women with complimentary natures, and in the Qur'an, He laid out a system of laws to support harmonious interaction between the sexes.
"...They are your garments and you are their garments." (2:187)
Clothing provides physical protection and covers the beauty and faults of the body. Likewise, a spouse is viewed this way. Each protects the other and hides the faults and compliments the characteristics of the spouse.
To foster the love and security that comes with marriage, Muslim wives have various rights. The first of the wife's rights is to receive mahr, a gift from the husband which is part of the marriage contract and required for the legality of the marriage.
The second right of a wife is maintenance. Despite any wealth she may have, her husband is obligated to provide her with food, shelter and clothing. He is not forced, however, to spend beyond his capability and his wife is not entitled to make unreasonable demands. The Qur'an states: "Let the man of means spend according to his means, and the man whose resources are restricted, let him spend according to what Allah has given him. Allah puts no burden on any person beyond what He has given him." (65:7)
God tells us men are guardians over women and are afforded the leadership in the family. His responsibility for obeying God extends to guiding his family to obey God at all times.
A wife's rights also extend beyond material needs. She has the right to kind treatment. The Prophet (pbuh) said: "The most perfect believers are the best in conduct. And the best of you are those who are best to their wives." God tells us He created mates and put love, mercy, and tranquillity between them.
Both men and women have a need for companionship and sexual needs, and marriage is designed to fulfill those needs. For one spouse to deny this satisfaction to the other, temptation exists to seek it elsewhere.
VII. DUTIES OF A WIFE With rights come responsibilities. Therefore, wives have certain obligations to their husbands. The Qur'an states: "The good women in the absence of their husbands guard their rights as Allah has enjoined upon them to be guarded." (4:34)
A wife is to keep her husband's secrets and protect their marital privacy. Issues of intimacy or faults of his that would dishonor him, are not to be shared by the wife, just as he is expected to guard her honor.
A wife must also guard her husband's property. She must safeguard his home and possessions, to the best of her ability, from theft or damage. She should manage the household affairs wisely so as to prevent loss or waste. She should not allow anyone to enter the house whom her husband dislikes nor incur any expenses of which her husband disapproves.
A Muslim woman must cooperate and coordinate with her husband. There cannot, however, be cooperation with a man who is disobedient to God. She should not fulfill his requests if he wants her to do something unlawful. A husband also should not take advantage of his wife, but be considerate of her needs and happiness.
VIII. CONCLUSION The Qur'an states: "And it becomes not a believing man or a believing women, when Allah and His Messenger (Muhammad) have decided on an affair (for them), that they should (after that) claim any say in their affair; and whoso is rebellious to Allah and His Messenger, he verily goes astray in error manifest." (33:36)
The Muslim woman was given a role, duties and rights 1400 years ago that most women do not enjoy today, even in the West. These are from God and are designed to keep balance in society; what may seem unjust or missing in one place is compensated for or explained in another place. Islam is a complete way of life.
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[Muhammad said]: O womenfolk, you should give charity and ask much forgiveness for I saw you in bulk amongst the dwellers of Hell. A wise lady among them said: Why is it, Messenger of Allah, that our folk is in bulk in Hell? Upon this the Holy Prophet observed: You curse too much and are ungrateful to your spouses. I have seen none lacking in common sense and failing in religion but (at the same time) robbing the wisdom of the wise, besides you. Upon this the woman remarked: What is wrong with our common sense and with religion? He (the Holy Prophet) observed: Your lack of common sense (can be well judged from the fact) that the evidence of two women is equal to one man, that is a proof of the lack of common sense.
The Prophet (the blessing and peace of Allah be upon him) said: "Isn’t the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?" The women said: "Yes." He said: "This is because of the deficiency of her mind."
Notice that in the first passage, Muhammad justifies his claim that women lack common sense by stating that their testimony is worth half that of a man. Yet, in the second passage, Muhammad justifies his claim that the testimony of women is half as good as men’s testimony by stating that women have deficient minds. Catch-22
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: Islam, fourteen centuries ago, made women equally accountable to God inglorifying and worshipping Him - setting no limits on her moral progress. Also, Islam established a woman's equality in her humanity with men.
So you mean before Islam, women were not equally accountable to God? Muslim women can pray by themselves. Is that the sign of their equality and liberation? Can’t women of other Faiths pray by themselves? Wouldn’t God accept their prayers?
What about the Bible that teach: "Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her."
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: As a general rule ( I'm not talking about exceptions), who is stronger ,more reliable and more reasoning?? man or woman??
You can't be seriously asking this question after reading my post!
Islam is the new and the authentic copy of the original chrsitianity. Prophet Jesus and prophet Muhammed came with the same message. The bible is edited . some parts are true and other are changed and edited.
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quote:Originally posted by l: Notice that in the first passage, Muhammad justifies his claim that women lack common sense by stating that their testimony is worth half that of a man. Yet, in the second passage, Muhammad justifies his claim that the testimony of women is half as good as men’s testimony by stating that women have deficient minds. Catch-22
This hadith has been discussed here before, I think. It doesn't makes sense at all and it actually contradicts the Qur'an.
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"A right given to Muslim women by God 1400 years ago is the right to vote. On any public matter, a woman may voice her opinion and participate in politics."
could muslims vote 1400 years ago?
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Who started Christianity, then? According to Islam, God did. If it was unintentional, then we must conclude that God didn’t realize that he was about to start the largest religion in the world.
If it was intentional, then God is in the business of starting false religions. God is therefore either dreadfully ignorant or maliciously deceptive.
Muhammad’s position also means that Jesus was the greatest failure in the history of the prophets. He spent thirty-three years preaching (again, he began preaching Islamic theology at birth), yet after he died, there wasn’t a single person in the world who even remotely resembled a Muslim. Those who believed his message became Christians, all of whom were guilty of the worst sin imaginable (shirk), while those who rejected his message were guilty of rejecting one of God’s greatest messengers.
Thus, I ask you, why does Islam consider Jesus to be one of the greatest prophets ever? It seems he should have been able to convert at least one person to Islam. But he didn’t. On the other hand, there are roughly two billion Christians on earth at the present moment, so it seems that Jesus and God are responsible for starting the only religion in the world that overshadows Islam.
Needless to say, I think the Islamic view is extremely problematic. It requires us to believe that God either intentionally or unintentionally led billions of people astray. This could have been avoided if God hadn’t been so intent on tricking people into believing that they had killed Jesus.
But why would God want everyone to believe that Jesus was dead when he wasn’t? Why not raise Jesus up without giving his enemies the satisfaction of seeing him suffer and die? This is a difficult pill to swallow,
Yet Islam forces us to view the origin of Christianity in this way. Because this view is at odds with any traditional understanding of God’s nature (including the Islamic understanding), Islam is an incoherent religious system.
Christianity, on the other hand, easily accounts for the rise of Islam. Indeed, Christianity even predicts the formation of such systems. Jesus warned his followers that false prophets would come. He also commanded not to believe them. One of the ways we can spot false prophets is by carefully discerning when their teachings lead to unacceptable beliefs about God. God is Truth, and he is Love.
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: As a general rule ( I'm not talking about exceptions), who is stronger ,more reliable and more reasoning?? man or woman??
You can't be seriously asking this question after reading my post!
I'm confused. which post you mean, Dalia I'm serious about my q. As a general rule ( I'm not talking about exceptions), who is stronger ,more reliable and more reasoning?? man or woman?? Posts: 1007 | From: http://www.sultan.org | Registered: Mar 2006
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quote:Originally posted by l: Notice that in the first passage, Muhammad justifies his claim that women lack common sense by stating that their testimony is worth half that of a man. Yet, in the second passage, Muhammad justifies his claim that the testimony of women is half as good as men’s testimony by stating that women have deficient minds. Catch-22
This hadith has been discussed here before, I think. It doesn't makes sense at all and it actually contradicts the Qur'an.
How it contradicts the Quran? What does the Quran say?
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: As a general rule ( I'm not talking about exceptions), who is stronger ,more reliable and more reasoning?? man or woman??
The Quran makes it very clear who is:
"Men are in charge of women, because Allah hath made the one of them to excel the other, and because they spend of their property (for the support of women). So good women are the obedient, guarding in secret what Allah hath guarded. As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and scourge them. Then if they obey you, seek not a way against them. Lo! Allah is ever High Exalted, Great."
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Muhammad improved the lives of women in Arabia in some ways. However, Muslims sometimes use this fact as evidence of Muhammad’s prophethood. Such an argument is absurd. All that is implied by the improvement in women’s lives is that Islam wasn’t as bad as the culture before it, which says more about the pagans than it does about the Muslims. For as we have seen, Muhammad permitted spousal abuse, stated repeatedly that women have inferior minds, claimed that most of the people in hell are women, and allowed his men to have sex with their captives. This situation was still probably better than that of women prior to the rise of Islam; however, Muhammad was far from being "the greatest champion of women’s rights the world has ever seen."
In the West, the status of women has greatly improved over the past few centuries. We can all be thankful that people in some areas of the Muslim world are seeing the change and are trying to adopt similar policies, in spite of Muhammad’s low opinion of women. Yet many areas, intent on following Muhammad’s guidelines, are still in darkness. We can only hope that those who want to heed the Quran will one day pick up the Bible and read the words of the Apostle Paul:
Husbands, love your wives and do not be harsh with them.
Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her.
You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, for all of you who were baptized into the name of Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
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quote:Originally posted by l: "Islaam forbids urinating into stagnant water; defecating on the side of the road or in places where people seek shade or where they draw water; from facing the qiblah (direction of prayer) or turning one’s back towards it when passing water or stools; holding one’s penis in one’s right hand when passing water; giving the greeting of salaam (peace) to one who is answering the call of nature; and putting one’s hand into any vessel before washing it, when one has just woken up."
very spiritual..
these are manners but I think you don't appreciate that, do you think it is ok to eat in the same place you urinate at ..if you don't think cleaness is spiritual, then go and pray in a public WC .. what is your point?
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quote:Originally posted by l: ""And whoever seeks a religion other than Islam, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers." [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85]"
Now you understand why I am saying that Allah is a fearful God and Islam is the religion of fear. What happened to the free will that God gave us? Christianity teaches that God made the world because He wanted to do so, the same way you give birth to a child because you wish to. And because of that, He loves man and wants to do what is best for us. But He gave us free will. Why? Because you cannot have a loving relationship without it. If you gave birth to a child who would automatically do anything you commanded it, such as moving an arm upwards or sitting down, without thought, what sort of relationship would that be? Your computer does anything you tell it to do, but do you really love it? Is it your companion? Christians obey God out of love for what He's done for us, not out of fear. When man sinned and was separated from God, God himself came to earth in the form of Jesus Christ to sacrifice Himself, to pay the price for all of our sins, from the beginning of time to the end. Think about it. Isn’t that enormous love for us on his part? Was it really necessary for Him to do that, as far as He was concerned? There was no reason for Him to do it except out of love for us.
It is not what you like is what you have I don't understand .. you want god to be on your way of thinking then before doing that please make the world in agree to your preconception, for example change some physical constant make the speed of light 8,000,000 km/h instead of 300,000 .. can you? well you can't and no matter what you did you won't .. that simple. U think we are here in a picnic and you can do whatever and there is no judgement , may be you want that, but simply as before it is not you to say about that, I know that god is most merciful and most graceful, yet I am sure we are not here to play or everything would have been very simple we wouldn't need to do anything to get anything life would have been more simple, and if god wanted to play with his creation then my god wouldn't make his creation suffer, and people do suffer, tell me do you know anyone suffer whom hadn't have a lover whom died or a broken heart in his life, wounds, diseases , depression .. extra extra For sure we suffer and for sure we are not here to play, and in my opnion that my god the most merciful is not playing with us. Consequently there is a reason for our creation which is simply to worship god, for that money you will leave when you die, science will stop for you after your death .. The main reason for life in my opnion is to worship the god, to try to search and find him to seek his truth without living our own fancy and making ourselves our gods or others our gods. I know that my god will judge me for all what I have done right and all what I have done wrong,as I know that my god is fair and just, consequently i am afraid from him any wise man should be, if you fear going to jail for committing some crime then you should fear more god's jail "Hell" .. May god help us to find his way and his road to the truth
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quote:Originally posted by l: Muhammad improved the lives of women in Arabia in some ways. However, Muslims sometimes use this fact as evidence of Muhammad’s prophethood. Such an argument is absurd. All that is implied by the improvement in women’s lives is that Islam wasn’t as bad as the culture before it, which says more about the pagans than it does about the Muslims. For as we have seen, Muhammad permitted spousal abuse, stated repeatedly that women have inferior minds, claimed that most of the people in hell are women, and allowed his men to have sex with their captives. This situation was still probably better than that of women prior to the rise of Islam; however, Muhammad was far from being "the greatest champion of women’s rights the world has ever seen."
In the West, the status of women has greatly improved over the past few centuries. We can all be thankful that people in some areas of the Muslim world are seeing the change and are trying to adopt similar policies, in spite of Muhammad’s low opinion of women. Yet many areas, intent on following Muhammad’s guidelines, are still in darkness. We can only hope that those who want to heed the Quran will one day pick up the Bible and read the words of the Apostle Paul:
Husbands, love your wives and do not be harsh with them.
Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her.
You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, for all of you who were baptized into the name of Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Are you Mrs. doubtfire ? anyway what you are saying is not evdential, how is women in the west better than in the east what is the situation of muslim females on the west that apply islam on themselves, I am sure there are some defencies in woman treatment in the east but this is not in the islam. it is more clear that before islam woman was treated bad everywhere in the world not in the arabic area only .. EVERY WHERE including your europe and islam have changed the way of dealing with women as rival to men ..
Posts: 1022 | From: cairo | Registered: Oct 2005
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: As a general rule ( I'm not talking about exceptions), who is stronger ,more reliable and more reasoning?? man or woman??
You can't be seriously asking this question after reading my post!
well for sure in general men are physically stronger than women, no athelete women's record had beaten the men's one. I dunno about the other issues but for sure women do think about there lookings much more than most of men do .. Posts: 1022 | From: cairo | Registered: Oct 2005
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: As a general rule ( I'm not talking about exceptions), who is stronger ,more reliable and more reasoning?? man or woman??
You can't be seriously asking this question after reading my post!
well for sure in general men are physically stronger than women, no athelete women's record had beaten the men's one.
And the point is? That men should be the ones in charge because they have a higher percentage of muscle mass?!?
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Since men and women both came from the same essence, they are equal in their humanity. Women cannot be by nature evil (as some religious believe) or then men would be evil also. Similarly, neither gender can be superior because it would be a contradiction of equality.
You are contradicting yourself. So do you believe this version or Mr Al-Munajjid's?
Allaah has commanded the testimony of two women so as to be sure that they remember, because the mind and memory of two women takes the place of the mind and memory of one man. (See I’laam al-Muwaqqa’een, part 1, p. 75).
This does not mean that a woman does not understand or that she cannot remember things, but she is weaker than man in these aspects – usually. Scientific and specialized studies have shown that men’s minds are more perfect than those of women, and reality and experience bear witness to that. The books of knowledge are the best witness to that; the knowledge which has been transmitted by men and the ahaadeeth which have been memorized by men far outnumber those which have come via women.
This has to do with gender, i.e., the gender of men is more perfect than the gender of women.
...
Nevertheless, there are some women who are far superior to men in their reason and insight, but they are few, and the ruling is based on the majority and the usual cases.
A woman may compensate for her weaknesses by striving hard, and surpass men when they are negligent. Hence we find that in some colleges, female students surpass male students because of their greater efforts and their keenness to succeed when many of the male students are negligent and are not eager to learn. A man may also excel over a woman in some fields that are basically hers, so we find that some of the most skilled chefs, tailors, cosmeticians and obstetricians on the international level are men. The point is that usually – and no wise person would dispute this – most of the prominent people in the religious sciences, such as fiqh, hadeeth, tafseer, ‘aqeedah and preaching, and in the worldly sciences such as medicine, astronomy, engineering, physics, chemistry, etc. are men.
My point is that Quran said that God make Man More perfect tham women because It's supposed that Men are making more efforts in jobs than women But not more important than what women can do.
Women can do a lot of tasks that man cant do. Women can give mercy and sympathy more than man.
So, God prefer men in doing some issues and give women some issues that Men are unable to do.
I think The Emam is talking about these points.
I'm asking myself a question now. How many men won Noble Prize compared to women?? any one knows?
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its worng idea cause islam belive in all prophets muses and jesus and we belive in all the holy books . that's all why we belive that is islam the true and the " haq " the right religion and i cannot be muslim till belive in all prophet's and books , and if i didnt belive them , then i am not muslim this is simble answer and allah know's salam alikom brother and sisters
Posts: 52 | From: anywhere can find water | Registered: Jul 2006
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Muslims try to convince us that they "accept" all the prophets. What does this acceptance actually mean? How can one accept the teachings of Jesus, which are pacifist, and yet accept the teachings of mohammed, which are violent at the core? Jus accepting Jesus and all the prophets as prophets and nothing more, is pure nonsense.
Posts: 223 | Registered: Jul 2006
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: My point is that Quran said that God make Man More perfect tham women because It's supposed that Men are making more efforts in jobs than women But not more important than what women can do.
I'm sorry, but you're not making any sense to me. You keep changing your arguments, that makes it difficult to understand what exactly your opinion is.
First you say he's using authentic sources, so he must be right about men being superior to women.
Then you say "oh, but only in some issues" - but you fail to explain what those issues might be. Btw, you're contradicting the imam here because his statements say in very clear words that he regards women as being inferior in general:
"Scientific and specialized studies have shown that men's minds are more perfect than those of women, and reality and experience bear witness to that."
the gender of men is more perfect than the gender of women.
Do you actually believe this?
He says that men are "inherently superior" because they are supposed to spend money on women. Does that make sense to you? Why should spending money on someone make you better than them? It does not make any sense to me at all ...
Then you post a text saying that Islam does not make a distinction between genders.
And now you are talking about jobs and apparently you're trying to say that in order to fulfill "mens' jobs" one has to be "more perfect". What's that supposed to mean? You have to be "more perfect" in order to earn money and support a family financially? Why is that? I would assume raising children and running a family requires a lot more "perfect-ness" - at least that's my personal observation. But you seem to attach more value to the money-earning part. Strange.
I personally think that raising children is a much harder job than going out and earning money. And most people - men as well as women - who have experienced both agree on that.
Also, to my knowledge, the Qur'an does not refer to gender-specific jobs or say that one is more important / more valuable than the other, so that the person who does it is "more perfect". I'd really like to know where you get this understanding from and how you arrive at that conclusion.
Something else in regards to using "authentic sources" - the Qur'an itself contains the story of a woman in a position of leadership who clearly stands out as being sensible, powerful, spiritually guided and most definitely capable of ruling others and making important decisions. This story does not match with the claim that women are weak and inferior and should be reduced to their role as mother and wife.
But the imam ignores this story altogether and he choses to refer to a hadith instead that has been declared weak by many sources (the one about women as rulers) in order to "prove" women's inferiority. Now what does that tell you?
You clearly refuse to see his derogatory remarks for what they are and you're trying to find excuses for him and suggesting I'm somehow misunderstanding him. But I think his words speak for themselves.
Posts: 3587 | Registered: Mar 2006
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quote:Originally posted by islamsweden.org: As a general rule ( I'm not talking about exceptions), who is stronger ,more reliable and more reasoning?? man or woman??
You can't be seriously asking this question after reading my post!
well for sure in general men are physically stronger than women, no athelete women's record had beaten the men's one.
And the point is? That men should be the ones in charge because they have a higher percentage of muscle mass?!?
The man was asking "who is stronger" and I just answered with what I think and a reason for that! I didn't mean that men because stronger should be in charge never did I say anything like this anywhere, can u please don't misinterpret my sayings I also stated a second point !
Posts: 1022 | From: cairo | Registered: Oct 2005
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I'm not misinterpreting your words, I think you're overlooking the context.
He was asking "who is stronger, more reliable and more reasoning", after trying to explain that he thinks men are superior to women. So I concluded that a) he thinks men are stronger, more reliable and more reasoning and b) that those attributes determine superiority. Why else would he have referred to strength in this context?
But I'm happy you agree with me that being physically stronger does not make a person superior ... Posts: 3587 | Registered: Mar 2006
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Thanks this website is really enlightning!:-) We all start out as females but at eight weeks little balls of male foeteses start pulling testosteron in the body and you will have a male. So much for the Adam and Eve theory!:-)
Posts: 1419 | From: Amsterdam, Netherlands | Registered: Aug 2003
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Another one: women are brainwise able to achieve the same results as man, they have the same IQ's. Becaus their EQ is a lot higher though then that of men they tend to be more social and get distracted by the care of children and husband and their emotional lives. I knew it, I knew it, I knew it! We had to follow the predicaments of the 70's to get lesbian and have no kids!:-)
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