First, let me introduce myself to you. My name is Haifa and I am an Egyptian Muslim woman living in the USA.
I am a Muslim but at the same time I hold rather peculiar positions on many points.
I think we need to reform Islam make it compatible with the modern world. There are five pillars of Islam and six pillars of faith that cannot be modified. that's all.the rest can be negotiated and must be modernized. Islam is doomed and the fate of the church of england awaits it. But anglicans didn’t leave christianity; they just brought it up to date. There used to be be no female priests but today there are. there used to be some dogmas about wives submission to husbands but today there are many feminists that believe in God and are Christians. Just the same is prepared for Islam and i’m sure of it. Let me comment on some points.
1. ok polygamy is indeed permitted in Islam. But I have got a great example. Tunisia has a constitution based on Sharia law but polygamy is prohibited. I object to implementing Sharia in any countries. Sharia is outdated and as a matter of fact I am sure Allah understands it. Nobody is now burning witches in Great Britain but nobody said Jesus Christ doesn’t exist or anythng. Islam has to be on the background and the secular laws have to be on the foreground.
2. Hijab is not a must for Muslim women. I don’t wear hijab and have never worn it. My daughter is not wearing hijab either. Allah wanted women (as well as men) to be modest. I don’t wear a bikini because it doesn’t agree with my modesty but my daughter likes skirts, tight jeans and t‑shirts. But wearing these clothes doesn’t affect her modesty and doesn’t make her a prostitute. If you feel comfortable wearing hijab, it’s OK, wear it. I have an opinion that hijab is outdated. If you can’t be modest without hijab, wearing hijab won’t make you any better. Hijab doesn’t protect women from rapists or other abusers. If a stranger, or most likely a husband wants to rape a woman, hijab will not stop him from doing it. That is my opinion.
3. Disbelievers will not go to Heaven. Virgins in Heaven? I have nothing to say about it. Who knows? As a modern person, I don’t believe Mohammed (pbuh) knew any of these things. Human beings cannot comprehend such things and we have to just leave it alone and move on with our life on Earth.
4. Killing of disbelievers if they don’t embrace Islam. It is outdated. In the modern world such things should not be tolerated. It was the case in the 7th century but thanks to Allah we are living in the 21st century!
5. What is the problem with Islam? The problem is that people perceive religion as divine therefore it must not be criticized. But we have to adopt the way westerners treated their religions. The example of the church of England is a good one.
6. Killing of apostates. Again it is outdated. It should not be practiced in the 21st century.
7. Men are breadwinners, women are housewives. Men are heads of the family. I earn more than my husband. My husband (Arab Muslim) is a stay at home dad! Women should be able to choose. Some want to have a career and some want to be wives and mothers. I decided to juggle these roles. Christianity also sees women as wives and mothers but I doubt that the head of the Church of England Queen Elizabeth II is an ideal wife and mother. I regard her as a strong woman.
I think we have to modernize Islam. What is going on in the Middle Eastern countries is awful. We have to help with stopping this insanity and modernizing these countries. I am fully aware of the fact that my beliefs would be “attacked” in the middle east and I would be stoned to death. That is why we Muslims in the West have something to do with that. We ought to do it for our sake. I believe in Allah and hope for the afterlife. But I reject any authorities and communicate with God without imams or mullahs, whom I consider to be a threat to humanity.
Finally, at the time of the prophet, the principles perhaps were suitable, but is it really so now? Therefore, let's evaluate, reread. Let's pick the suitable ones. Religion is made for the benefit of humans. That's all for now. I'd love to hear your views.
Posts: 2 | Registered: Oct 2006
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Haifa, I have to agree with everything you said. Islam is outdated, it is bringing about its own decline and moslems are blind to the fact. They need to wake up and start thinking instead of reciting. Quranists seem to have discovered where the faults lie..............
Posts: 1500 | Registered: Dec 2005
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First, let me introduce myself to you. My name is Haifa and I am an Egyptian Muslim woman living in the USA.
I am a Muslim but at the same time I hold rather peculiar positions on many points.
I think we need to reform Islam make it compatible with the modern world. There are five pillars of Islam and six pillars of faith that cannot be modified. that's all.the rest can be negotiated and must be modernized. Islam is doomed and the fate of the church of england awaits it. But anglicans didn’t leave christianity; they just brought it up to date. There used to be be no female priests but today there are. there used to be some dogmas about wives submission to husbands but today there are many feminists that believe in God and are Christians. Just the same is prepared for Islam and i’m sure of it. Let me comment on some points.
1. ok polygamy is indeed permitted in Islam. But I have got a great example. Tunisia has a constitution based on Sharia law but polygamy is prohibited. I object to implementing Sharia in any countries. Sharia is outdated and as a matter of fact I am sure Allah understands it. Nobody is now burning witches in Great Britain but nobody said Jesus Christ doesn’t exist or anythng. Islam has to be on the background and the secular laws have to be on the foreground.
2. Hijab is not a must for Muslim women. I don’t wear hijab and have never worn it. My daughter is not wearing hijab either. Allah wanted women (as well as men) to be modest. I don’t wear a bikini because it doesn’t agree with my modesty but my daughter likes skirts, tight jeans and t‑shirts. But wearing these clothes doesn’t affect her modesty and doesn’t make her a prostitute. If you feel comfortable wearing hijab, it’s OK, wear it. I have an opinion that hijab is outdated. If you can’t be modest without hijab, wearing hijab won’t make you any better. Hijab doesn’t protect women from rapists or other abusers. If a stranger, or most likely a husband wants to rape a woman, hijab will not stop him from doing it. That is my opinion.
3. Disbelievers will not go to Heaven. Virgins in Heaven? I have nothing to say about it. Who knows? As a modern person, I don’t believe Mohammed (pbuh) knew any of these things. Human beings cannot comprehend such things and we have to just leave it alone and move on with our life on Earth.
4. Killing of disbelievers if they don’t embrace Islam. It is outdated. In the modern world such things should not be tolerated. It was the case in the 7th century but thanks to Allah we are living in the 21st century!
5. What is the problem with Islam? The problem is that people perceive religion as divine therefore it must not be criticized. But we have to adopt the way westerners treated their religions. The example of the church of England is a good one.
6. Killing of apostates. Again it is outdated. It should not be practiced in the 21st century.
7. Men are breadwinners, women are housewives. Men are heads of the family. I earn more than my husband. My husband (Arab Muslim) is a stay at home dad! Women should be able to choose. Some want to have a career and some want to be wives and mothers. I decided to juggle these roles. Christianity also sees women as wives and mothers but I doubt that the head of the Church of England Queen Elizabeth II is an ideal wife and mother. I regard her as a strong woman.
I think we have to modernize Islam. What is going on in the Middle Eastern countries is awful. We have to help with stopping this insanity and modernizing these countries. I am fully aware of the fact that my beliefs would be “attacked” in the middle east and I would be stoned to death. That is why we Muslims in the West have something to do with that. We ought to do it for our sake. I believe in Allah and hope for the afterlife. But I reject any authorities and communicate with God without imams or mullahs, whom I consider to be a threat to humanity.
Finally, at the time of the prophet, the principles perhaps were suitable, but is it really so now? Therefore, let's evaluate, reread. Let's pick the suitable ones. Religion is made for the benefit of humans. That's all for now. I'd love to hear your views.
Hi Haifa,
Interesting post. I understand the essence of what you are saying, I can't say I agree with your specific points, but that's what opinions are for
When people (Muslims and Non muslims) say they want to "modernise" Islam, they should first ask themselves what they want to modernise and why. Is it for their own personal gain and satisfaction or for the benefit of Allah and the Deen? Most Muslims will understand and believe that we are here on earth only to worship Allah:
Surah 51 Ayat 56 I have only created Jinns and men, that they may serve Me.
Therefore if any modernisation would aid our submission then why not?
I don't believe in all cases that some Muslims' call for modernisation is for that reason though. They would like to see change so that Islam can be made easier for them and in keeping with western ideals. Many Muslims don't want to fight (Jihad al Nafs) for their beliefs anymore, they would rather roll over and follow the sheep.
In that case a call for building of Taqwa is called for.. not modernisation. If you fear in Allah, the Western world and Modern ways would be nothing but a joke
They would like that they can change Islam to suit themselves and then not be called on for not following the Quran and Sunnah. It should be remembered that in life in general you should not cry ignorance for what you know is plainly wrong. Allah knows what is in our hearts - our real intentions. For example a person may know that one of the pillars of Islam is to pray, yet they don't pray. In that case they should acknowledge such and not find reasons why it's not practical in the modern world to pray.
Using one of your examples regarding Polygamy, it is allowed by the grace of Allah yet we don't always need to use it in todays world. In fact it was never an unquestionable right in the first place... it was and is an EXCEPTION not a RULE.
For hijab (head covering not Niqab), yes IMO it is commanded in the Quran - some agree and some don't. Whether you decide to wear hijab or not shouldn't be up for condemnation. Only the wearer or non wearer will be called to account on the day of judgement. I don't imagine that Allah will ask me on the day of judgement why I didn't "force" Haifa for not wearing Hijab... he will ask me about me and my deeds. Who knows.. a woman on the day of jugdement who did not wear hijab and if questioned says well I believed I was modest and I did guard myself against the unlawful... Allah may accept. On the other hand, there may be a woman who observed the hijab and Allah may ask her why she was not modest in her behaviour, yet tried to fool the people by covering her head ... we just don't know... each person has their own intentions.
In cases such as these Islamic teaching needs updating... i.e. how to clean your own house before casting opinions on your neighbour, how to make dawah to educate about Islam for the sake of Allah and not personal gains.
Some of your examples on the face of it don't make sense to me and they sound like the interpretations of the media. Polygamy, killing of disbelievers, men breadwinners - women housewives. From the way in which you describe them it would seem you just need to read or listen to someone with better understanding of Islam. Yes there are Imams and sheikhs that are living in the 21st Century! There needs to be more education on these subjects, not change. If you read some good sources (Quran would be a good start ) you will see that these subjects are already modernised... it's interpretations which are outdated!
Muslims as a whole will probably never agree on the meanings in the Quran. I *think* Allah knows this and we will only be called to account on what we know, understand and regarding our intentions.
Surah 6 Ayat 165 Say: "Shall I seek for (my) Cherisher other than Allah, when He is the Cherisher of all things (that exist)? Every soul draws the meed of its acts on none but itself: no bearer of burdens can bear of burdens can bear the burden of another. Your goal in the end is towards Allah: He will tell you the truth of the things wherein ye disputed."
Posts: 815 | From: London and the other | Registered: Jul 2005
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Welcome to ES. I enjoyed your post and agree with your views. The example of The Church of England is a good one. Most western religions have moved forward. This has not happened without considerable protest from more conservative believers. There was a time. not so long ago, when rigid religious doctrine dominated western society too.
Human rights issues are now seen to be more important than imposing a mainstream faith in western societies. Until predominantly muslim states recognise the rights of all people, not just followers of a mainstream faith, they are doomed to fail. A secular, democratic nation has the best chance of protecting people of all faiths. Islam will also suffer, if it doesn't recognise,accept and adapt to criticism.
Posts: 2953 | From: Slightly south of Azkaban. | Registered: Aug 2006
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quote:Originally posted by CairoStudent: She is talking about the evolution of the Anglican Church, of course she mentioned the Church of England.
That does not mean she is a troll.
Duh
My comment was that it was strange that all her examples came from the UK!
And if "Haifa" could perhaps explain the meaning of her name in Egypt, you might realise why I had a double reason to question her. Posts: 4576 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2002
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quote:Originally posted by Yana: u can change anyting u want... and it is not islam any more...
I agree with you here Yana; Allah revealed Islam for all time and all people, there are some things that are open to interpretation, but some things that He gave us as laws/rules/principles to be applied as they are. If you accept this, you accept Islam, and you are a Muslim; but if you think He made a mistake or that Islam is outdated and needs modernising then should you really be calling yourself a Muslim? A Muslim is someone who submits to the religion of Allah, Islam.
As human beings we have the right to question and to try to understand what the Creator told us, but to say that what He said was wrong or to try to change what He revealed is implying that you think you know better than Him. As someone once said to me, this is what is Islam is, if you accept that then you are a Muslim, if you don't like it that's ok, that is your choice and no one will try to force you to believe otherwise, but don't try to make it a new religion and still call it Islam.
Posts: 4576 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2002
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But Islam is about his book the Quran isn't it? Moslems recite the quran but dont actually follow it except as CAT says..the 5 pillars!! They think that do the 5 pillars and you are moslem. But moslem is about respecting others, being fair, just, caring, having manners, being less selfish, not stealing, lying and cheating etc etc etc The pillars wont save you and no matter how many rakas you do you wont be saved if you live your life as a thief and cheat and kill!!
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I agree with Toots. If the Qur'an, was given to humanity, from 'God,' why is that not good enough? Wasn't Allah's intention for humanity to follow, as they saw fit? Didn't 'God' intend for human kind to have freedom of thought, as long as the five pillars were followed? Isn't what that which followed the Qur'an not just the work of mistaken meddlers? Has ritual and unnecessary interference spoilt the original message of Islam?
Posts: 2953 | From: Slightly south of Azkaban. | Registered: Aug 2006
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my personal view is that Islam is for all times and all people. The Quran is a book of the words of God, I have no doubts about that. The Quran is THE book that has lessons for a way of life that can be for ALL times without changing anything in it.
The hadith, (ok i know im looking at yet another bashing here) is mans words, not sent from God, not inspired by God, if they were then you are saying He forgot to put them in THE book?
The hadith is what stop Islam and Muslims from being in this century, from growing and going forward in education (religious and otherwise)and the world of today.
The message in Quran is clear and can be used today and in the future, hadith and hadith worshippers are stuck in the past.
Saying that I am not saying hadith are useless. They gave an insight into life in the time of the prophet (pbuh) and we have from them taken documents in how he conducted himself with all people, thats in line with the message in Quran and is also timeless. Again im back to what MY personal view is regarding sunnah, which in my personal view is different to hadith. Sunnah is how the prophets (pbut) ALL of them, conducted themselves with others, and not every word they said. Hang onto every word God said, do not hang onto every word any man said. When God said in Quran that it was complete He didnt say 'apart from what comes after', neither did He miss anything out, after all HE is perfect and man is NOT.
-------------------- If you don't learn from your mistakes, there's no sense making them. Posts: 15090 | From: http://www.egyptalk.com/forum/ | Registered: Jul 2004
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Ayisha: cinders, its not only born muslims that do this, I have had it from other reverts/converts when they get to a point they think they have all the only correct information and I have different information. They too become aggressive and dont (or cant) answer questions without abuse and declare everyone kafir!
funny how its usually the 'brainwashed' tribe who cant (or daren't) form an opinion for themselves and say we are not supposed to as the 'scholars' have done that for us.
Brainwashing is very difficult to escape from, when you don't have the benefit of a decent education or financial security. How do those who can barely read, question so called scholars, without the means to decent resources?
Ayisha's point about scholars is spot on. It's astonishing how many muslims I have met who believe that people can't read the Qur'an, without being properly guided . They are made to feel that they are not capable of forming their own views and opinions. This patronising approach does little to enable free thinking.
There is a difference between wishing to encourage enquiring minds to learn and wanting to control and brainwash. The way Islam is taught in many countries is nothing short of brainwashing.
Even Catholicism has moved away from drilling the Catechism into children as young as five. One religion should not be forced upon school children. It would be much healthier to have classes teaching children about all faiths and none. Faith is a private and personal issue, which can be taught at home. Maybe then, we would learn to have more respect for each other.
Posts: 2953 | From: Slightly south of Azkaban. | Registered: Aug 2006
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quote:Originally posted by SayWhatYouSee: Ayisha's point about scholars is spot on. It's astonishing how many muslims I have met who believe that people can't read the Qur'an, without being properly guided . They are made to feel that they are not capable of forming their own views and opinions. This patronising approach does little to enable free thinking.
If someone said to me Muslims need to be guided to understand the Quran, I wouldn't consider it as brainwashing. Just like you wouldn't study for a degree without a professor (someone considered as "expert" in the field) same way it CAN be good to have a scholar to explain the Quran.
The reason is not because one is not capable of understanding alone, it's because there is more to the Quran then just reading it from Chapter 1 to 114. Understanding the time of the revelation and the reason behind it can help to clear up misunderstandings. Good example is the people who claim they have a right to blow up buildings, innocent women, children - people in general. You probably COULD gather that interpretation from the Quran unless someone explained to you when, where and why the verse was revealed in relation to the events taking place during the times of the Prophet Mohamed PBUH. Scholars are able to do this because they study the Quran, hadith, history of Arabia etc etc. The average Muslim might not have access to studying / reading more than the Holy Quran and therefore may miss some of the wider meanings contained.
I listen to a number of Scholars who surprise me with some of their interpretations of Islam and the Quran. They are a far cry from the ones who may be consider as brainwashers. They discuss Islam in a way they makes it relevant to today but in keeping with the true principles of Islam. They don't compromise their beliefs for the sake of gaining followers. Maybe the fact that I only listen to reverts ( ) would account for that.
Posts: 815 | From: London and the other | Registered: Jul 2005
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If we are all agreed that the Qur’an is the basis of Islam, and that it is Allah’s words and we should follow them, then these are just a few of the verses from the Qur’an where Allah explicitly commands the believers to obey and follow the Prophet (peace be upon him), not just to listen to the Qur’an that was sent to him, but that believers should obey him in addition to obeying Allah. And the only way believers nowadays can obey and follow the Prophet is if they read and study the Hadith to find out what he did and commanded, because we don't have him here to refer to directly.
It seems to me that the believers who are using their intelligence are those who actually read the whole Qur'an and try to understand what Allah wants us to understand, rather than picking on a couple of verses and trying to make their own interpretation without examining all the evidence.
Allah has surely blessed the believers with His favor when He raised in their midst a Messenger from among themselves, who recites to them His verses and makes them pure and teaches them the Book and the Wisdom, while they were, earlier in open error. (3:164)
Obey Allah and His Prophet:
Say: Obey Allah and the Messenger, but if they turn their backs, Allah loves not the disbelievers. (3:32) And obey Allah and the Messenger so that you may be blessed. (3:132) O those who believe, obey Allah and obey the Messenger and those in authority among you. (4:59) And obey Allah and obey the Messenger and beware. (5:92) So fear Allah and set things right between you, and obey Allah and His Messenger if you are believers. (8:1) O those who believe, obey Allah and His Messenger and do not turn away from him, while you are listening. (8:20) And obey Allah and His Messenger and do not quarrel with each other, and so lose heart. (8:46) Say: Obey Allah and obey the Messenger; then, if you turn away, upon him rests what is laid on him, and upon you rests what is laid on you. If you obey him, you will be guided. (24:54) O those who believe, obey Allah and obey the Messenger and do not make your deeds vain. (47:33) So establish salaah and pay zakaah and obey Allah and His Messenger. (58:13) And obey Allah and obey the Messenger but if you turn your backs, Our Messenger has only to deliver the manifest message. (64:12) And whoever obeys Allah and His Messenger, Allah shall admit him in the Gardens underneath which rivers flow. (4:13) And whoever obeys Allah and the Messenger, they are in the company of those who Allah has blessed. (4:69) All that the believers say, when they are called to Allah and His Messenger that he may judge between them, is that they say, “We hear and we obey”: it is these who are successful. Whoever obeys Allah and His Messenger and fears Allah and has awe of Him: it is these who are the winners. (24:52) And whoever obeys Allah and His Messenger, he has won a great success. (33:71) And the believers, men and women, are friends of each other; they bid the fair and forbid the unfair; they establish salaah and pay zakaah and they obey Allah and His Messenger. These are those upon whom Allah shall have mercy; Allah is All-Mighty, All-Wise. (9:71) If you obey Allah and His Messenger, He will not diminish you anything of your deeds. (49:14) And whoever obeys the Messenger, thereby obeys Allah. (4:80) And whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger and transgresses His limits, He shall admit him to Fire where he shall remain forever. (4:14) And whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger has gone astray into manifest error. (33:36) And whoever disobeys Allah and His Messenger, for him there is the fire of Hell. There they shall remain forever. (72:23) And whoever makes a breach with Allah and His Messenger, then Allah is severe in punishment. (8:13) Did they not come to know that whoever opposes Allah and His Messenger, for him there is the fire of Hell? (9:63)
Obey the Prophet:
And establish salaah and pay zakaah and obey the Prophet so that you may be blessed. (24:56) And if you obey him (the Prophet), you shall find the right path. (24:54) On that day those who disbelieved and disobeyed the Messenger will wish that the earth might be levelled with them. (4:42) And whoever makes a breach with the Messenger after the right path has become clear to him, and follows a way other than that of the believers, We shall let him own what he chose and shall admit him in the Hell, and it is evil as a returning place. (4:115) And whoever obeys the Messenger, thereby obeys Allah. (4:80) And he (the Prophet) does not speak out of his own desire. It is not but a revelation revealed (to him). (53:3-4)
Follow the Prophet:
Say, if you love Allah, follow me and Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. (3:31) Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, whom they find written down with them in the Torah and the Injeel… (7:157) Believe, then, in Allah and His Messenger, the unlettered Prophet, who believes in Allah and His words, and follow him so that you may be on the right path. (7:158) O Prophet, sufficient for you is Allah and those who followed you of the believers. (8:64) (The believers say:) Our Lord, we have come to believe in what You revealed and followed the Messenger. So write us among those who bear witness. (3:53) Say: This is my way. I call to Allah with sure knowledge, I and whoever follows me. (12:108) And We did not appoint the Qiblah on which you were earlier, but that We might know the people who follow the Messenger as distinct from those who turn back on their heels. (2:143) He said: My people, follow the messenger! (36:20)Posts: 4576 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2002
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2. A book ( Quran) has been revealed to you, so do not be anguished because of it, for you to warn thereby, and as a reminder to the followers. 3. Follow what has been revealed to you """FROM OUR LORD"""", and do not follow patrons other than him, but you seldom take admonition.
In the above he say's DO NOT FOLLOW patrons other than he himself Allah! Do not follow except his own words in the Quran.
Chapter 31 verse 2 These are the verses of the 'book of wisdom' a guidance and a mercy.
Here Allah says that the Quran is the book of wisdom and the guidance it within it. He does not mention another book to get the guidance required..............
When he talks about following the messenger he means that previous people stopped or did not follow what was revealed ( jews, christians). It means follow what was revealed from the quran not how he dressed in the morning.........purleeeeez!!!
Posts: 1500 | Registered: Dec 2005
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NotSleeplessInCairo, I understand your point about the value of studying, interacting, sharing. That is fine. What is not fine is the assertion that I have heard from many muslims, that no one can understand the qur'an from simply reading it alone. This point is often passionately made. On initial reading, why should anyone need guidance? The guidance is often more harmful than just allowing people to make up their own minds, judging by some of the ridiculous views on Islam expressed by some muslims on ES.
Posts: 2953 | From: Slightly south of Azkaban. | Registered: Aug 2006
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quote:Originally posted by SayWhatYouSee: NotSleeplessInCairo, I understand your point about the value of studying, interacting, sharing. That is fine. What is not fine is the assertion that I have heard from many muslims, that no one can understand the qur'an from simply reading it alone. This point is often passionately made. On initial reading, why should anyone need guidance?
What Are The Requirements To Reflect Over the Qur'an?
We're told to read the Qur'an and ponder its meaning, but we're criticized for talking about it - that is, if we aren't considered qualified to do so.
By Hesham Hassaballa, May 24, 2006
You know, it's funny. I have been told, several times, that I am "not qualified" to make the statements I make about various verses and passages of the Qur'an. I am "not qualified" to do so. Why? What are the qualifications to read the Qur'an? What credentials do I need to possess to make me a "bona fide" certified reader of the Qur'an?
Now, I am not talking about making Qur'anic exegesis, or "tafsir." This is an academic discipline in and of itself. It requires ample knowledge of the Arabic language, not just modern Arabic, but classical Arabic, the language used at the time of the revelation of the Qur'an. It also requires understanding the reasons of revelation, or "asbab ul nuzul." One must also know proper Arabic grammar. Moreover, one has to know the various relevant Prophetic traditions that may surround a particular verse in the Qur'an.
No. I am talking about the reflection of a believer on what a verse of the Qur'an means to him or her. What sort of qualifications does one need to do this? Why do so many Muslims immediately jump to what shaikh so-and-so has said about a verse of the Qur'an before thinking about the verse beforehand?
I mean, did not the Qur'an clearly ask the question: "Will they not, then, ponder over this Qur'an? Or are there locks upon heir hearts?" (47:24)?
In so many places in the Qur'an, God appeals to the intellect of the human being. He wants the believer to think for himself. Take these verses:
"Verily, in the creation of the heavens and the earth, and in the succession of night and day, there are indeed messages for all who are endowed with insight [and] who remember God when they stand, and when they sit, and when they lie down to sleep, and [thus] reflect on the creation of the heavens and the earth: 'O our Sustainer! Thou hast not created [aught of] this without meaning and purpose. Limitless art Thou in Thy glory! Keep us safe, then, from suffering through fire!" (3:190-191)
"... Tell [them], then, this story, so that they might take thought." (7:176)
"... Thus clearly do We spell out these messages unto people who think!" (10:24)
"... in this, behold, there is a message indeed for people who think!" (16:11)
"... so that thou might make clear unto mankind all that has ever been thus bestowed upon them, and that they might take thought." (16:44)
"... In all this, behold, there is a message indeed for people who think!" (16:69)
"... In [all] this, behold, there are messages indeed for people who think!" (39:42)
"... And He has made subservient to you, [as a gift] from Himself, all that is in the heavens and on earth: in this, behold, there are messages indeed for people who think!" (45:13)
"... And [all] such parables We propound unto men, so that they might [learn to] think." (59:21)
These are only a portion of the verses that speak about those who think, those who reflect, those who are endowed with insight, those who ponder, and so on. All these verses point to a theme: that God wants the human being to think and ponder. Why can't we take this theme to the verses of the Qur'an itself?
Why can't we - before consulting a scholar - think about what a particular verse means to ourselves? If we don't understand something after we have reflected upon it ourselves, then we consult those who are more knowledgeable. It seems that many Muslims today have abandoned the first part of this interaction with the Qur'an.
For example, I remember listening to a lecture and hearing the story of Mu'awiyah (r) asking Abdullah ibn 'Abbas (r), the Prophet's (pbuh) cousin, about this verse of the Qur'an:
"And [remember] him of the great fish [Jonah], when he went off in wrath, thinking that We had no power over him! But then heeded out in the deep darkness [of his distress]: "There is no deity save Thee! Limit less art Thou in Thy glory! Verily, I have done wrong!" (21:87)
Mu'awiyah (r) told Ibn 'Abbas (r) that he kept thinking about this verse for a long time before coming to him and asking how Jonah, a Prophet of God, could think that God has no power over him. Ibn 'Abbas (r) told him that the word "yaqdiru" here means "punishment." Yet, the point of this story is that Mu'awiyah (r) reflected on the verse by himself first, then he asked the scholar.
Why can't we do the same thing?
As another example, at the time of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh), 'Amr ibn Al 'As (r) - who was a new Muslim at the time - made ablution with sand instead of water. Typically, a Muslim can make the ritual ablution before prayer with sand or earth if there is no water available. Yet, in this instance, there was water available. People took 'Amr (r) to task for this, including one of the Prophet's (pbuh) closest companions 'Umar ibn Al Khattab (r). When the Prophet (pbuh) later asked him why he did that, 'Amr (r) answered:
"Messenger of God, God said, 'let not your own hands throw you into destruction.' If I had made ablution with water on that cold night, I would have died. Thus, I made 'tayammum,' or ablution with sand." The Prophet (pbuh) accepted his understanding of this verse.
Now, I looked up the whole verse, and I realized that it is talking about spending in God's cause: "And spend [freely] in God's cause, and let not your own hands throw you into destruction, and persevere in doing good: behold, God loves the doers of good." (2:195)
Reading the verse on its surface, I would not think it would have anything to do with making ablution with water on a cold night. Nevertheless, 'Amr ibn Al 'As (r) - again, a new Muslim at the time - read the verse and applied his own understanding, and the Prophet (pbuh) did not correct or rebuke him. 'Amr (r) reflected on the verse on his own.
Why can't we do the same thing? I believe we can.
Now, there are several caveats to my contention. First of all, I am not saying that we should never consult the scholars on the verses of the Qur'an. No. The scholars of Islam - past and present - have dedicated their lives to the study of our faith, and they deserve our admiration and respect. There are many times I have asked scholars about various verses of the Qur'an myself.
In fact, a wholesale abandonment of the scholars may lead to manifestly incorrect religious understanding. For example, one could "reflect" upon this verse of the Qur'an - "O you who have attained to faith! Do not attempt to pray while you are in a state of drunkenness, [but wait] until you know what you are saying..." (4:43) - and conclude that it is allowed to consume alcohol.
Yet, it is well known that this verse was revealed early in the history of Islam. Later on, when the Islamic community was firmly established, alcohol was formally banned for all time: "O you who have attained to faith! Intoxicants, games of chance, idolatrous practices, and the divining of the future are but a loathsome evil of Satan's doing: shun it, then, so that you might attain to a happy state." (5:90). We would not properly understand this without input from the scholars.
Indeed, I myself rely heavily on Muhammad Asad's explanation of the Qur'an, who quotes from various classical commentators of the Qur'an. Yet, still, what is wrong with reflecting over the meaning of the Qur'an before consulting the scholars? I mean, we have been endowed with an intellect by God, and He has clearly said in His sacred text that we should use what He has given us. Despite this, so many Muslims rush to read what various scholars have said about verses of the Qur'an without first reflecting on what the verse means to themselves.
Furthermore, they hold the opinions of various scholars on Qur'anic verses as sacrosanct, beyond all questioning and reproach. Why? Why can't we question the opinion of a scholar? Are these scholars God Himself?
I mean, the whole killing of apostates issue is a perfect example. Like I said before, the Qur'an could not be any clearer freedom of religion and conscience, but still so many Muslims claim that the verse, "Let there be no compulsion in matters of faith." (2:256), is a "one-way door" into the House of Islam. You are free to not come inside the House. But once you come inside, you are stuck there under pain of death. And to prove this, they quote the opinions of various - respected, no doubt - scholars.
Yet, when you simply reflect over the meaning of "Let there be no compulsion in matters of faith," the opinions of those scholars - may God bless them - just make no sense. Why am I "not qualified" to make such a reflection?
Yet, almost without fail, whenever I raise the question of why we Muslims are not allowed to reflect upon the verses of the Qur'an for ourselves, I am rebutted with the analogy of the medical profession: "Can you simply read a medical text book," I am asked, "and then start to practice medicine on your own?"
"No, of course not," I answer.
"Well, the same is true with the Qur'an."
This analogy is fallacious. Medicine - just like Engineering, or Computer Science, or Architecture - is a profession. It has a compendium of knowledge that must be mastered, and after this compendium has been mastered, the newly-graduated doctor of medicine must undergo a 3-7 year apprenticeship, during which he or she practices the trade under the supervision of more experienced physicians. Once this is completed, then, and only then, can one practice medicine on their own.
Is Islam a profession such as this? If someone wants to become a Muslim, is her or she required to go to college for four years, then four years of "Islamic school," then complete a 3-7 year "Islamic residency" in order to be a "board-certified Muslim"? No. We Muslims, in fact, brag about how easy it is to become a Muslim: simply declare "There is nothing worthy of worship except God, and Muhammad is His Messenger."
Yet, after one becomes a Muslim, he or she cannot read the Qur'an and reflect about what the verses mean to him or her. No. This is akin to picking up a pair of scissors and performing coronary bypass surgery after reading a surgical textbook. Does this make any inkling of sense?
The Qur'an, speaking about itself, says: This divine writ - let there be no doubt about it - is [meant to be] a guidance for all the God-conscious (2:2). Who are these "God-conscious"? The Qur'an continues:
Who believe in [the existence] of that which is beyond the reach of human perception, and are constant in prayer, and spend on others out of what We provide for them as sustenance; And who believe in that which has been bestowed from on high upon thee, [O Prophet], as well as in that which was bestowed before they time: for it is they who in their innermost are certain of the life to come! It is they who follow the guidance which comes from their Sustainer; and it is they who shall attain to a happy state! (2:3-5)
These verses seem to tell me that the guidance of the Qur'an is open to any and everyone. All I have to do is open the book and read it. Yet, if I do so, I am told, it is akin to reading a medical textbook and opening a medical practice. Does this make any inkling of sense?
Now, Qur'anic tafsir, or exegesis, is a profession such as medicine. If I, after reading various translations of the Holy Scripture, turned around and published a book of Qur'anic exegesis, then the medicine analogy would make complete sense. Yet, this is not what I do. None of the reflections I have made about various verses of the Qur'an was ever intended to be the " tafsir according to Dr. Hesham A. Hassaballa." As I said above, whenever I speak about various verses of the Qur'an in my writings, I always first consult the explanation of the Qur'an made by Muhammad Asad. I do this because, as correctly pointed out by so many, I am not a scholar of the Qur'an.
But the Qur'an is not the property of the scholars alone. The Qur'an is a book of guidance for all. How could reflecting on a verse of the Qur'an on my own be akin to reading a medical textbook and then practicing medicine? Islam - unlike medicine - is not a profession.
What's more, we Muslims brag that our connection with God is direct, that we Muslims have no priesthood, that there is no intermediary between us and our Creator. Shouldn't this also apply to the Word of our Creator? If we cannot reflect on the Word of God on our own - because we are not scholars - then how is this different from having a priesthood? I remember being told that - before Vatican II - Catholics could not study the Bible without a priest present. Is the same thing occurring with Islam and the Qur'an?
Yet, I must reiterate that I do not advocate a wholesale abandonment of the scholars. They deserve our respect and admiration. What must be remembered, however, is that these scholars are human beings with a ethnic, cultural, social, and political context. This context must be taken into account when analyzing a scholar's opinion about a certain verse of the Qur'an. And the opinion of a scholar must never be confused for the Word of God itself. Moreover, we must make a distinction between making a legal ruling based on the Qur'an and reading and reflecting on the Qur'an, which is something God commands us to do.
So, please, don't tell me that reading the Qur'an and reflecting over what the verses mean to you or me is the same as opening a medical practice after reading a medical textbook. Reading and reflecting over the Qur'an - unlike medicine - is not a profession that requires training. It is obedience to God's command: Will they not, then, ponder over this Qur'an? Or are there locks upon heir hearts?
quote:Originally posted by SayWhatYouSee: NotSleeplessInCairo, I understand your point about the value of studying, interacting, sharing. That is fine. What is not fine is the assertion that I have heard from many muslims, that no one can understand the qur'an from simply reading it alone. This point is often passionately made. On initial reading, why should anyone need guidance? The guidance is often more harmful than just allowing people to make up their own minds, judging by some of the ridiculous views on Islam expressed by some muslims on ES.
Thank you Dalia for the article, I enjoyed reading it and agreed with many of the points.
In response to SayWhatYouSee,
This excerpt from Dalia's article says alot about why it is not recommended for a Muslim to read the Quran without guidance:
Qur'anic exegesis, or "tafsir." This is an academic discipline in and of itself. It requires ample knowledge of the Arabic language, not just modern Arabic, but classical Arabic, the language used at the time of the revelation of the Qur'an. It also requires understanding the reasons of revelation, or "asbab ul nuzul." One must also know proper Arabic grammar. Moreover, one has to know the various relevant Prophetic traditions that may surround a particular verse in the Qur'an.
There is no rule that says a Muslim CANNOT read the Quran alone, but they should be careful regarding the conclusions they draw from it and subsequently preaching or explaining to others. We have been discussing the Quran on ES as if it is only a book.. well it is a book, but it's also a handbook for Muslim life. It contains guidance, morals, principles, parables, examples from history. It's all so easy to read the first 4 Surah for example and start preaching about this that and the other, but there are 110 other Surahs that you must consider. Like the article says with the example of alcohol in the Quran.
I don't agree that you can not question scholars and that you MUST accept their interpretations, but you can consider it and respect the fact that they have studied the Quran, Arabic, Seerah, Arabian History. How many Muslims can say the same? Some of us can't even read Arabic and some Arab speakers can't fully understand classical Arabic. We trust in the people who have taken the time to translate the Quran for us, but yet write off all sheikhs as stupid? How do we know these translations are grammatically correct? Somebody once explained to me that just one missed fatah, damma or qasra on a letter in the Quran can change the complete meaning of the sentence. He gave me an example and it was shocking. Scholars have been trained to notice that!
If there were not scholarly books that we could refer to regarding the events and practices during the times of the Prophet Mohamed, before and after his death some of the stories in the Quran would be meaningless... who were the people of Aad and Thamud? The geographical make up of Arabia has changed in the last hundreds of years, people who have devoted their lives to studying and writing about this for the sake of Allah and for our benefit can not be disregarded. If a person feels they are more knowledgable than one who has studied all or part of Islam and provides their intrepretations objectively then that's just arrogance. That doesn't mean you can not ponder and reflect on the meanings of the Quran alone. Some verses in the Quran are quite clear as to their meaning, however some are clear but you can gain an even clearer understanding with some help, some seem clear but with explanation mean something completely diffferent ... no need to think you know it all!
Again there is no rule saying you can not pick up the Quran and read it alone!
If we were able to understand Allah's messages without the aid of help he would not have sent numerous Prophets. He would have given the first book to Adam and we would still be using this today. However as humans have free will, the message has been corrupted over and over again and each time Allah sends a messenger to deliver "the word" again! Because of this free will many factors can contribute to our understanding, humans have many characteristics including selfishness, pride and arrogance. These things can contribute to our understanding in a negative way!
Another factor to take into consideration is that although in the west today we live in relative isolation, nuclear families and what not, Islam is based on Community. People living together and supporting each other. Just because in the west we wake up (sometimes alone), go to work, speak to colleagues, return home, lock the door, pick up the Quran and read it, in a true Islamic society you would interact more with your family and neighbours. You would have a wise elder in the community who you would seek guidance and advice from. Westerners may consider this backward, but the way we live today has been proven as dangerous to the stablility of society. Tooti finds TV phone in's hilarious, however the people participating in these shows are coming from societies where people may not find it easy to think alone... how else will they know the correct way to perform wudu and what invalidates it? They have enough Taqwa and desire to be in paradise that they will check and double check things which seem silly to others.
The funniest thing of all in these discussions is that despite the main message of the Quran being very clear, people talk about what they have a right to do and not do ... The messages is Submit to Allah and Worship him. If you read the Quran with that message in your heart then you will most probably be fine
With regards to interpretations in ES.. I think that someone is just playing with you
(Edited: Deleted the game... can't be bothered )
Posts: 815 | From: London and the other | Registered: Jul 2005
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NotSleeplessInCairo, do you have a transformer in your head that adjusts all texts to agree with your own views? Dalia's post is very much relevant to the view I had expressed. Your incomprehensible waffle, at the end of the post adds nothing to the message you are trying to convey. No one plays with my views, as thinking for myself is a joy. Maybe you should try reading without a 'NotSleeplessInCairo' windows word filter on?
Posts: 2953 | From: Slightly south of Azkaban. | Registered: Aug 2006
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quote:Originally posted by SayWhatYouSee: NotSleeplessInCairo, do you have a transformer in your head that adjusts all texts to agree with your own views? Dalia's post is very much relevant to the view I had expressed. Your incomprehensible waffle, at the end of the post adds nothing to the message you are trying to convey. No one plays with my views, as thinking for myself is a joy. Maybe you should try reading without a 'NotSleeplessInCairo' windows word filter on?
You have already made up your mind which views you agree with on ES and the ones you don't ... I would never try to convince YOU of anything. Just try to explain to you what I know of Islam from my point of view and in this case YOU asked ME .. take it or leave it. If you read my post properly you would understand that I took A PARAGRAPH from Dalia's post. I didn't state that the WHOLE article was in favour of using scholars opinions - it clearly isn't. I also expressed to Dalia that I agreed with many points in the article, I also refuse to be told I can not think for myself.
My incomprehensible waffle, at the end of the post was a hint to you which you obviously don't wish to take... it makes me laugh to see you running around the board getting upset over something that is a joke on your (and others) behalf... maybe one day soon you will understand.. until then please do consider my words waffle Posts: 815 | From: London and the other | Registered: Jul 2005
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You have a very high opinion of yourself,NotSleeplessInCairo - one I don't share. You also appear to take the board a wee bit to seriously. Quit projecting your fears on to me. I can look after myself and assure you that the opinion of people like you is immediately discarded. This is a forum for debate, nothing more. Your ridiculous ''running around'' point merely confirms that you see intrigue, where none exists. You seem to care a lot about what others think. How curious.
Posts: 2953 | From: Slightly south of Azkaban. | Registered: Aug 2006
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I think you're having a laugh ... none of your reply makes sense. Nothing that you imply has any relevance to me or my post.
I'm not intrigued by the game being played with you at all SWYS... I simply find it funny when I come across it. I don't feel any fear either, people play games on ES all the time - nothing new.
Posts: 815 | From: London and the other | Registered: Jul 2005
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Yeah I'm studying, but I don't think I will join in - watching you guys is much more fun
I've had those laughing cramps, tears and everything in the last few days .. I can not beeeliieeve some of the stuff people are coming out with! Hazzem is classic - reminds me of Frank Spencer (Brit comedian... look him up if you never heard of him!) Posts: 815 | From: London and the other | Registered: Jul 2005
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shes called Irshad Manji, Haifa.look her up. Theres alot of people with your views, they like to call themselves "progressive" muslims. (i guess that makes me a "stagnant"muslim or a "Regressive" one. )
Personally, I believe that the scholars whose madhabs many muslims follow, i.e. hanaf, hanbali, even said themselves that they were just interpreting, and that islam needed to keep on being interpreted. But for some reason, people stopped. That doesnt mean i support rejecting the Quran or the Sunnah though.
Posts: 1967 | From: USA | Registered: Oct 2006
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Yes, strange isn't it how people come in claiming to want to discuss so many issues, but then just disappear in a cloud of smoke Posts: 4576 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2002
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Yes, strange isn't it how people come in claiming to want to discuss so many issues, but then just disappear in a cloud of smoke
LOL........ this means she's not new & just used a fake username becuase she wouldnt dare post this under her own username? she knows that some people would attack
Haifa.... no offence, just curious Posts: 3128 | From: Not Your Heaven | Registered: Sep 2006
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Haifa, welcome to ES. I enjoyed your post and find it so refreshing to hear all you've said coming from a born Egyptian/Muslim...yay...there is hope!
Islam is going through a Reformation...that is the good news..it is already going through the Reformation phase and no one can stop it...the bad news is that it will be a violent and bloody fight...there will be those Muslims like you described ...the ones who would want you stoned for your thinking...that will fight your thinking with all they've got...
The Reformation happened historically in Europe with Christianity and it WILL happen within Islam...
It will take another 50-100 years for the Muslim world to join the modern world and for Islam to be practiced as it should be by most Muslims truth but it will happen...
Posts: 407 | From: USA | Registered: Jan 2007
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I am a Muslim and like all other Muslims, I don’t have a brain. Kafirs may think that living without a brain is difficult, but someone called A.T.M.M (Allah the most merciful) has shown us a way of living without a brain.
We do exactly what a Mullah says and the Mullah says exactly what is written in Qura’n. So, we live on this earth following the words of A.T.M.M. We don’t think of our own. We don’t have our own ideas on anything. When Mullahs tell us something we just obey them. Even though I live in India, I hate India the most, just because Mullahs told me to hate India. I do whatever possible to see the destruction of India. Kafirs may think that living in India and trying to destroy India is something like setting fire to one’s own house. But it has been written in Qura’n that this world is divided into two, dar-ul-islam and dar-ul-harb, and that I should always work for destroying darb-ul-harb. That is what the mullahs taught me. I follow that exactly although it means destroying my own country. Kafirs may think that I am foolish, but they think because they have an additional organ in their body, called brain in which the Satan resides. I am fortunate that I am a Muslimah and I don’t have a brain.
When I was a schoolgirl, my classmates used to sing the national song of India “vande mataram” which means ‘I bow before my motherland’ during the school assembly. But I used to keep quite because being a Muslim I should bow only before A.T.M.M and the mullahs (As per my knowledge, Allah and mullah are brothers and a mullah lives exploiting the faith that people have in Allah). Most of my classmates were Kafirs. Though they loved me more than their lives, I hated them. But I acted as if I loved them. One of my Kafir friends had some strange ideas. She always used to tell me that god doesn’t need mosques, churches or temples to live in. Instead of wasting money on mosques, churches and temples, people should spend money on helping each other. According to her, “humanity” is the greatest religion. Being a Muslimah, I consider humanity as the greatest threat to Islam.
My eldest brother became a smuggler at 22 years of age when I was in sixth grade. All other brothers joined him later. Kafirs say that Muslims can be easily made to join in smuggling gangs and terrorist organizations as Muslims can be easily brainwashed. That makes me laugh. A Muslim can be washed, but not brainwashed, as we Muslims are lucky in not having a brain. Kafirs complain that instead of doing some productive works, Muslims either become smugglers or terrorists. What is wrong in being a smuggler or a terrorist? If you have a brain then you will think it is wrong. But if you remove the evil organ called brain from your head, you will understand how noble these professions are.
I got married at a very young age like most of the other Muslim women. Today I am the wife of a proud jihadi and mother of 9 children. I want to give birth to at least 6 more children. Kafirs may laugh at this but they laugh because they have an additional organ called brain. We Muslims have no brains and we will go on producing children like machines till our Muslim army is big enough to defeat the Kafir army.
All of my eight brothers are smugglers and I help them in all possible ways to destroying the economy of my country, India. My husband is a jihadi leader who gets frequent training from Pakistan. His terrorist organization gets all the money from Saudi Arabia and other countries in the Middle East. He often tells me that Saudi Arabia is the father of jihad and Pakistan is the mother, so we should always respect these two countries. Of course, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia have a special place in the minds of all Muslim children. I have heard them singing “ Jihad, Jihad, everywhere, Saudi Arabia is the father and Pakistan is the mother”. United States of America, our worst enemy claims that Pakistan and Saudi Arabia are its closest allies in the war against terror. Wow, how thrilling! It is better to be a Muslim than being an American as it is better not to have a brain than having a brain and not using it.
My husband was once caught by the police, but thanks to the democratic system that exists in my country. Congress and communist leaders came rushing in to save my husband. They somehow forced the police to let him free even without registering a case against him. Recently, a bullet from the police hit my husband’s leg. Now he is planning to retire from jihad and become a mullah. In the past, the practice was that mullahs became jihadi leaders at the end of their career, but today the practice is that jihadis become mullahs at the end of their career. My husband tells me that mullahs have the “holy license” to lead a luxurious life sucking the blood of common Muslims. That means I can lead a luxurious life along with my husband, his three other wives (I call them co-wives) and our army of children. Our children are also very happy about it (I did not mention the total number of children because I have not counted them till date). My husband knows nothing other than loving Islam, giving hate speeches and killing civilians. Naturally, becoming a mullah becomes his only choice after retirement. He has never even seen the gate of a school or a college. Schools are places where it is taught that earth is round! How stupid! It has been stated in Qur’an that earth is flat. Just by looking down itself one can understand that the earth is flat. The additional organ called brain is really spoiling the Kafirs. In schools, some other stupidities are also taught, like, “theory of evolution” and “solar system”. According to Qur’an, all the human beings are made of dirt. Sun rises from the mud and sets in the mud. So why are schools wasting time teaching “theory of evolution” and “solar system”? I am really tired of these Kafirs.
Mullahs teach the Muslim community the real science called “Miracles of Islam”. Some people who are hesitant in respecting mullahs argue that according to true Islam, mullahs have no place in the religion. But being Allah’s brothers, Mullahs voluntarily came forward to help Allah in establishing his laws of the land. Allah-mullah duo works with great coordination, even better than Ronaldo-Ronaldinjho duo for achieving their goals. I don’t know what Allah gets by establishing his law on the land, but I know exactly what mullahs get. Mullahs attain high social status, political strength as well as economic power through helping Allah. Wow, three birds in one shot! There is no wonder why mullahs came forward to help their brother Allah. Kafirs can’t understand what a common Muslim gains by letting mullahs suck our blood and eat away our freedom. Some of them even say that mullahs lead a ‘shameless’ life by exploiting ordinary Muslim masses. Mullahs are never doing anything ‘shameless’. If a prostitute lives by selling her body, what is wrong in a mullah living by selling his religion?
My husband as well as my brothers can’t live without my assistance. I give them new ideas everyday, be it killing civilians or smuggling drugs. Still I consider myself a less intelligent compared to them just because A.T.M.M has told that we women are less intelligent compared to men. After my death, even if I reach heaven, I well get nothing as nothing is available for a woman in the heaven. But, my husband will get 72 houris with swelling boobs and large eyes. Anyway, I am really afraid of hellfire. I can’t even imagine myself getting burnt in hellfire. I always carry a fire extinguisher along with me so that if I die and reach hell, I can save myself from A.T.M.M’s punishment “hellfire”. We Muslims are ready to turn the whole world into a bloody hell in order to save ourselves from going to hell. Kafirs have no other choice than going to hell according to our great religion. I know why Kafirs never make it to heaven. They have an evil organ in the body, BRAIN. What is this stupid organ all about? It is really making me curious. Is it possible to buy a brain from somewhere? I want to live with a brain just for one day. I just want to know what this thinking process is. I want to know why I would question Qur’an as well as Allah-mullah duo’s supremacy, if I have a brain. Where can I buy a brain? Even if I live with a brain for one day, I may not reach heaven. But I know the solution. With a brain I can THINK and find out some way of reaching heaven without Allah-mullah duo’s knowledge. So I want a brain just for one day.
Where can I buy a brain?
Posts: 173 | From: Sun | Registered: Feb 2007
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We have to help with stopping this insanity and modernizing these countries. I am fully aware of the fact that my beliefs would be “attacked” in the middle east and I would be stoned to death. That is why we Muslims in the West have something to do with that. We ought to do it for our sake. 
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