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Hebrews 5:7-8 confirm Islam's claim about Jesus never got crucified and contradicts the Bible!
The sections of this article are:
1- The Chapter of Hebrews 5, and emphasis on verses 5:7-8. 2- Why in other Chapters of the Bible's NT does it say Jesus died on the cross for our sins? 3- Islam truly confirms GOD Almighty's Perfection. Jesus never got crucified according to Islam and Hebrews 5:7-8. 4- Conclusion.
1- The Chapter of Hebrews 5, and emphasis on verses 5:7-8:
While I was reading my Bible before bed time (sometimes read the Bible and sometimes read the Noble Quran), I stumbled upon Chapter Hebrews 5 in the Bible's New Testament. The following was taken from the New International Version Bible (NIV). Pay attention to Hebrews 5:7:
Hebrews 5
1 Every high priest is selected from among men and is appointed to represent them in matters related to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins. 2 He is able to deal gently with those who are ignorant and are going astray, since he himself is subject to weakness. 3 This is why he has to offer sacrifices for his own sins, as well as for the sins of the people. 4 No one takes this honor upon himself; he must be called by God, just as Aaron was. 5 So Christ also did not take upon himself the glory of becoming a high priest. But God said to him, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father.[1] "[2] 6 And he says in another place, "You are a priest forever, in the order of Melchizedek."[3] 7 During the days of Jesus' life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission. 8 Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered 9 and, once made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation for all who obey him 10 and was designated by God to be high priest in the order of Melchizedek.
Warning Against Falling Away
11 We have much to say about this, but it is hard to explain because you are slow to learn. 12 In fact, though by this time you ought to be teachers, you need someone to teach you the elementary truths of God's word all over again. You need milk, not solid food! 13 Anyone who lives on milk, being still an infant, is not acquainted with the teaching about righteousness. 14 But solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil.
Footnotes
5:5 Or have begotten you 5:5 Psalm 2:7 5:6 Psalm 110:4
Few points to notice:
1- In regards to Hebrews 5:5 above, the foot note refers to Psalm 2:7. However, Psalm 2:7 was given to David when he defeated Goliath. Please visit: The "Son of God" title was given to others before Jesus in the Bible. Also, the "God" title was also given to others before and after Jesus in the Bible (Answering Isaiah 9:6).
2- According to the Hebrew language, "Son of God" literally means "Servant of God". I have provided all of the proofs and resources in the link.
3- In Hebrews 5:7 above, notice how it says that GOD Almighty heard Jesus' cries of not getting crucified because of Jesus' "reverent submission". This not only further proves that Jesus is not the Creator of the Universe, but it also clearly and irrefutably confirms Islam's claims about Jesus never got crucified on the cross, but rather he was saved and lifted by GOD Almighty.
Please visit: Did Isaiah 53 really prophesies about the crucifixion of Jesus? It supports Islam's claims about Jesus peace be upon him never died on the cross. I also addressed John 19:36-37 from the Bible and proved that Jesus never got crucified, since GOD Almighty promised that he will protect Jesus' body and not let even a single bone be broken. My question to all Christians is: How in the world is it possible for the feet to get nailed on the cross without any penetration to the bones by the nails, hence breaking part of the feet's bones?! I also added refutations to Exodus 12:46, Numbers 9:12, Zechariah 12:10 and Psalm 34:20, which supposedly prove the Christians' belief about Jesus crucifixion. I proved that this dogma has no truth what so ever and exposed the wrong Trinitarian English translation of Zechariah 12:10. I also showed in Isaiah 52:13 "...he will be raised and lifted up....", which clearly and perfectly agrees with Islam about Jesus never died on the cross. "Raised and lifted" suggests that Jesus will be picked up right from the cross, or saved right from the cross by Allah Almighty. It suggests that Jesus will not die, nor get crucified, but rather be raised and lifted by GOD Almighty to Heavens.
4- In Hebrews 5:8, "Although he was a son, he learned obedience from what he suffered", it does not at all suggest that Jesus died on the cross. Verse 7 clearly says that GOD Almighty heard Jesus' cries. This means that Jesus was probably put on the cross, but he was never killed on the cross. GOD Almighty heard Jesus' cries before and during Jesus was getting badly beaten before he was put to the cross and GOD Almighty decided to save him. This also means that the "third day resurrection of Jesus" is a false belief, especially that it was never prophecied in the Old Testament. This is further elaborated on in the "Islam truly confirms GOD Almighty's Perfection" section below.
5- In regards to Hebrews 5:9-10, it would've been normal for Jesus to be the salvation of the Jews since he was their "Messiah" (top leader, king and saviour). But since the Jews had utterly failed with Jesus, he no longer was their saviour or even leader:
"Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. (From the KJV Bible, Matthew 21:43)"
"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! (From the KJV Bible, Matthew 23:37)"
Please visit: Jesus told the Jews that GOD Almighty will take His Kingdom from them and give it to the Muslims.
Was Jesus crucified on a tree (according to Peter), cross (according to others), or never got crucified (according to Islam)?
None of Jesus' disciples witnessed the crucifixion. They "all fled" and "deserted" Jesus. This further confirms Islam's claims.
2- Why in other Chapters of the Bible's New Testament does it say Jesus died on the cross for our sins?
Because the Bible was written by many different mysterious authors at different times and different places. For instance, according to the movie "From Jesus to Christ", the time difference between the documentation of the Gospel of Mark and the Gospel of Matthew was 50 years (1/2 century!!). That is a lot of time. And according to the NIV Bible, the Gospel of Mark, which is believed to be 50 years older than the Gospel of Matthew, had been corrupted and tampered with, as well as most of the Bible's Old and New Testament's Books and Gospels.
Please visit: Just who were the real authors of the Bible? Today's Books and Gospels' authors of the Bible are UNKNOWN. See the comments from the NIV Bible itself! Just why in the world should I believe in today's Bible?
3- Islam truly confirms GOD Almighty's Perfection:
As I mentioned above about Jesus never got crucified:
The Early Christians' Doctrine say Jesus never got crucified!
According to the documentary film, "Banned from the Bible", which I watched on the History Channel, some of Saint Peter's apocalypse were banned from the current Bible, and these Epistles contain what Islam claims - that Jesus didn't get crucified on the cross and it only appeared that he was. This banned part also says that Jesus was standing next to the cross laughing. These are the parts of the Bible that only few people in the world know about.
According to the documentary film, the apocalypse was very popular among Christians during the 2nd century. They believed "it was spiritually inspired" by GOD Almighty to Saint Peter. They actually had doubts about "John's apocalypse", which is known today as "the Book of Revelation". Interestingly also, this apocalypse says that after GOD Almighty fills both Heaven and Hell with inhabitants from Mankind, and the people of Hell get tortured for a long period of time, the People of Heaven will ask and Pray to GOD Almighty to Forgive the people of Hell. GOD Almighty will then eventually listen to their Prayers, and will order the "Gates and the Steel Bars of Hell" to be opened and allow the people of Hell to enter Heaven for Good. This apocalypse of Peter seems to also perfectly fit Noble Verse 7:40 in the Noble Quran where Allah Almighty Promised that He will eventually open the Gates of Heaven to all disbelievers and empty Hell. Please visit: Hell will eventually be empty according to Islam.
Christians often believe that GOD Almighty does not change His views or Mind. But that is not true in both the Bible and the Noble Quran. Allah Almighty did create mankind with the ability of making choices and independent decisions. The choices of mankind sometimes determine the position of GOD Almighty toward certain situations or group of people. Allah Almighty said:
"None of Our revelations do We abrogate or cause to be forgotten, but We substitute something better or similar: Knowest thou not that God Hath power over all things? (The Noble Quran, 2:106)"
When Jesus peace be upon him cried out to GOD Almighty to save him from the cross, according to Islam and Hebrews 5:7, GOD Almighty did listen to Jesus and saved him from the crucifixtion.
In Isaiah 53, all it says is that he will get pierced which again it never mentioned the cross nor did it ever mention any sort of resurrection, not just in this chapter, but also throughout the Old Testament. If this servant is indeed Jesus peace be upon him, then him being pierced and never dying seems to perfectly support the Islamic teaching about Prophet Jesus peace be upon him NEVER died on the cross for anyone's sins.
Also notice that Isaiah 53:11 clearly states that "he will see the light". What is that light? Could it be the light of Heaven? Probably be raised to Heaven? Christians do believe that Jesus peace be upon him was indeed raised to Heaven, and so do Muslims too. However, we see no mention throughout the ENTIRE Old Testament including obviously Isaiah 53 any mention of resurrection, nor any mention for resurrection on the 3rd day or any day. So does this mean that the servant will get pierced (by being put on the cross perhaps) and then get raised without dying?
Let us look at the following Noble Verse from the Noble Quran (The Muslims Holy Scripture): "That they rejected Faith; That they uttered against Mary A grave false charge; That they said (in boast): 'We killed Christ Jesus The son of Mary, The Messenger of Allah.' But they killed him not, Nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not. Nay, Allah raised him up Unto Himself; and Allah Is Exalted in Power, Wise. And there is none of the people of the book (Jews and Christians) But must believe in him (Jesus) Before his death; And on the Day of Judgment He (Jesus) will be a witness Against them. (The Noble Quran, 4:156-159)"
Now compare the Noble Verses to Isaiah 52:13 "...he will be raised and lifted up....". Notice that Isaiah 52:13 did not say "....he will be RESURRECTED and lifted up...." Not even once, did the Old Testament predict for the foretold Servant (Jesus) to be raised to GOD Almighty after death. There absolutely no mention of any sort of resurrection in the Bible's Old Testament what so ever.
Also, "...he will be raised and lifted up...." seems to suggest that Jesus will be picked up right from the cross, or saved right from the cross by Allah Almighty. "raised and lifted" seems to suggest that Jesus will not die, nor get crucified, but rather be raised and lifted by GOD Almighty to Heavens.
It just seems odd to see both words "raised" and "lifted", and not just one of them, in Isaiah 52:13, and yet think that they agree with the fabricated crucifixion story about Jesus in the NT.
Why did GOD Almighty choose to say "raised" and "lifted" in Isaiah 52:13?
The very next verse also refutes the current New Testament:
It appears that Isaiah 52:14 "Just as there were many who were appalled at him - his appearance was so disfigured beyond that of any man and his form marred beyond human likeness-" further proves Islam's claims about Jesus peace be upon him never got crucified on the cross, because if Jesus was so badly disfigured beyond any human imagination, then this means his physical appearance (face and body) afterwards might have been very confusing to the people. In other words, people might not be able to recognize him, HENCE, THIS MIGHT CAUSE FOR ANOTHER PERSON TO HAVE BEEN PUT ON THE CROSS INSTEAD OF HIM (JESUS).
According to what we have in the New Testament, Jesus was never "disfigured.....beyond human likeness"! Jesus in the New Testament of today was NEVER DISFIGURED!
And certainly, the crucifixion does not cause for the person, NOR DID IT CAUSE FOR JESUS IN THE NEW TESTAMENT, to be disfigured beyond any human recognition!
According to Islam, Jesus peace be upon him might have been put on the cross and might have got "pierced", but he never died. According to Islam, he was raised to Allah Almighty and saved from death. We Muslims believe that Prophet Jesus peace be upon him will come back again to earth and fight the army of Satan and defeat it, and then the Judgment Day will come. According to Islam, every person (including Jesus) must taste death (The Noble Quran, 44:56).
Which ever possibility is correct, whether it was another person got crucified, or Jesus himself was put on the cross and never got crucified, the claim of Islam is still supported by the Bible in either case as we clearly saw above in both Isaiah 52:13 and 52:14.
Please visit the article Did Jesus get crucified according to Islam?
Was Jesus crucified on a tree (according to Peter), cross (according to others), or never got crucified (according to Islam)?
None of Jesus' disciples witnessed the crucifixion. They "all fled" and "deserted" Jesus. This further confirms Islam's claims.
The point is that Chapter Isaiah 53 agrees a lot more with Islam's claims than with the current Christianity's claims, and it is confirmed in Isaiah 52:13.
There are several other Noble Verses in the Noble Quran that talk about Jesus such as the following:
"So peace is upon me [Jesus] the day I was born, the day that I die, and the day that I shall be raised up to life. (The Noble Quran, 19:33)"
To see detailed explanation of this Noble Verse and about Jesus peace be upon him in Islam, please visit the following links:
Does the Noble Quran in Verse 19:33 confirm Jesus' crucifixion?
Ask me any question section. See responses to many questions about Jesus in Islam.
4- Conclusion:
The Bible is in clear contradiction between Hebrews 5:7-8 and other places where it says that Jesus died on the cross for people's sins. Both Hebrews 5:7-8 and the Noble Quran agree that Jesus never got crucified.
I pray to Allah Almighty that this article will shed some light upon the reader and clearly prove to him/her that Islam is the True Way to GOD Almighty, and it is indeed a True Divine Religion from GOD Almighty. Ameen.
urlPosts: 2728 | From: جمهورية مصر العربية | Registered: Sep 2006
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In this passage from Hebrews, we are told that Jesus is our great high priest. what is actually the role of the high priest? Chapter 5 verse 1 says that ‘Every high priest is selected from among men and is appointed to represent them in matters related to God, to offer gifts and sacrifices for sins’. In Leviticus, we read of the various types of gifts and sacrifices that could be offered by the people through the priests. Sometimes the sacrifice was an animal which was killed and at other times it was offerings of crops or flour. For example, whenever someone committed an unintentional sin, they had to offer a sin or a guilt offering, sacrificed by the priest. Also, there was the annual Day of Atonement, on which the high priest would offer sacrifices for the forgiveness of the entire nation. So the high priest offers gifts and sacrifices for sins, but the role is actually broader than that. The high priest is our representative before God – he helps us in our relationship with God. His role is not one where the high priest is too busy looking at God to help us, but his role is get alongside us, and help us relate to God ourselves.
For a high priest to be able to represent us before God, he must have been selected from among us. If he was not chosen from among us, then he is not really a true representative. For example, New Zealand has ambassadors in most countries in the world to liase with their governments, and represent the New Zealand government in those countries. Now if our ambassadors were not New Zealanders themselves, then are they really true representatives of New Zealand? Not really. In a similar way, a high priest representing us before God must have been selected from among us. He must be one of us or he is not a true representative. In verse 1 again: ‘Every high priest is selected from among men and is appointed to represent them in matters related to God’. Since Jesus was himself born a human, he has been selected from among us, and so he can represent us before God.
Now clearly if the high priest does not have a relationship with God themselves, it is very difficult for them to help us get closer to God. If they themselves are not worthy to enter God’s presence, how can they help us enter his presence. This problem was recognised in the Old Testament as well. On the Day of Atonement that I mentioned before, the high priest actually had to offer sacrifices for his own sins before he could offer sacrifices for the sins of the people. He had to restore his relationship with God before he could help the people with their relationship. But Jesus lived a sinless life. He never did anything that was wrong. He was perfect. So he was worthy to enter the presence of God by his own merits. He did not have to offer a sacrifice for himself. He did not need to restore his relationship with God prior to helping us. He has a perfect relationship with God, and so can help us into a relationship with God ourselves.
So Jesus has been selected from among us. He has a perfect relationship with God in his own right, and so is perfectly qualified to be our high priest.
If we now read verse 2: ‘He is able to deal gently with those who are ignorant and are going astray, since he himself is subject to weakness’. Even if our high priest is selected from among us, if he cannot relate to, or understand our temptations and our weaknesses, how can he be an effective representative for us before God? How can he help us in our relationship with God? It is reasonably easy to see how a human high priest could relate to our difficulties, because they are subject to the same weaknesses and temptations themselves. For example, Aaron, the first high priest appointed by God, could relate to the Israelites in their sin, because he also sinned. In Exodus after God had taken the Israelites out of Egypt, Moses went up Mt Sinai to receive the 10 commandments from God, and while this was taking place, Aaron was busy building an idol for the people to worship. He clearly was not perfect, and so he could understand why the Israelites sinned.
Jesus, however, was perfect. He lived a perfect, sinless life, and so how can he understand our temptations and our weaknesses? Well, Jesus was subject to temptation:
Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert, where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry. The devil said to him, "If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread." Jesus answered, "It is written: `Man does not live on bread alone.'" The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world. And he said to him, "I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to. So if you worship me, it will all be yours." Jesus answered, "It is written: `Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.'" The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down from here. For it is written: "`He will command his angels concerning you to guard you carefully; they will lift you up in their hands, so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'" Jesus answered, "It says: `Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'" When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time. (Luke 4:1-13)
It is important to note that a temptation is not really temptation if we don’t want to do the thing. For example, I am not really tempted to steal even if the opportunity presents itself, but if I am in bad trouble I do sometimes feel tempted to lie my way out of it. But in this case Jesus was tempted, and this was not the only instance of him being tempted that we are told of. On the night before he died, he was in the garden of Gethsemane praying, and he did not want to die. It would have been very attractive to find a way out to avoid the horrible torture and death he knew was coming. Back in Hebrews 5 verse 7 it says ‘During the days of Jesus’ life on earth, he offered up prayers and petitions with loud cries and tears to the one who could save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverent submission.’ Luke 22:44 says: ‘And being in aguish, he prayed more earnestly, and his sweat was like drops of blood falling to the ground’. Jesus was in anguish. His mission here on earth was not a simple walk in the park. He became fully human, and so was susceptible to our temptations and weaknesses even though he never gave into temptation and sinned.
So Jesus could relate to our temptations and our weaknesses, but it goes even further than that. In Hebrews 4:15 it says: ‘For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathise with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are – yet was without sin’. Jesus is able to sympathise with our weaknesses because he himself has been tempted, and is without sin. Even though he is without sin, this does not negate his ability to relate to sinners. The ability to relate to sinners is not based on the experience of the sin itself, but on the experience of knowing what it is like to be attracted to sin. And Jesus was tempted more than any one of us. It says that Jesus was tempted in every way, just as we are, but when we sin, we have given in to temptation, and so have not experienced the temptation at its most intense moment. As we are tempted, the attractiveness of the wrong thing or the level of temptation increases and keeps increasing until we either give in, or totally reject it. If we give in, then we are giving up before the temptation reaches its peak intensity. So we do not experience temptation to its fullest extent. Only he that is without sin, experiences the fullness of temptation. Only Jesus can fully understand the intensity of temptation. Jesus was tempted to avoid carrying our sin. He knows better than any one of us how difficult it is to withstand it, and so not only can he relate to us in our temptations, but he knows them even better than we do.
Our high priest is not only fully qualified in his own right to stand before God, but he fully understands us, and so can help us move closer to God.
So, what does that mean for us today? What are the implications of the high priesthood of Christ to our lives?
Let’s read Hebrews 4 verse 14: ‘Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has gone through the heavens, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess’. Jesus has been so highly exalted – God always hears him when he intercedes for us, which he is always doing. Our high priest, is able to understand where we come from, and yet his position in heaven is that of authority. He has both the desire to help us, and the authority to do so. This is a great encouragement for us when we are in difficult circumstances – we can know that Jesus is interceding for us. One small example of this in my life was a couple of years ago when work wasn’t going as well as it could have been. I was working as a computer network support contractor at the time, and I was on one of my first contracts and I made a few mistakes which managed to bring down the entire network at a school. It wasn’t entirely my fault, but I still should have been more careful in what I was doing. This was a cause of a great deal of anxiety. I was really worried about what was going to happen: how fast could the problem be fixed, and could I even fix it myself. It was causing me a great deal of stress. But in my anxiety Jesus was able to help me turn to him. It was really comforting to know that Jesus was interceding for me in my problems. My high priest was alongside me, helping me turn to God for help. When it comes down to it, it was really a small matter in an eternal perspective, but Jesus cared for me in that situation, and was able to help me in my anxiety. He helped me calm down, and once I calmed down I was able to think clearly again and sort out a way to fix the situation. They even employed me again the next time they needed computer support.
Nor has this happened to me only once. It is part of how I relate to God. As many of you know I finish my course at the end of this semester, and I sometimes feel a bit anxious about what my future holds. I am not sure what God has in store for me at the end of this year. And I need to know at some point in the near future, but he has not told me yet. But I know that as in the situation at work that I mentioned before, I have a high priest who is able to help me with this, and guide me through it. Although Jesus may not have been through this situation in particular, I know that he experienced anxiety when he was in the garden of Gethsemane the night before he died. I know he understands how I feel, and I can trust him to bring about the best results.
An implication of Jesus understanding our temptations is that he understands why we sin. This does not make it okay to sin, but we can know that he is pleading our case for us, and he is pleading it because he understands. If we can think of an analogy with a guy named Bob, who is in rather desperate circumstances. He is really poor, has no job and no food. So he has to resort to stealing to get some food to eat. Eventually Bob gets caught stealing, and is charged with burglary. Now, if Bob applies for legal aid, because of course he can’t afford a lawyer himself, and is assigned a lawyer who is rich, and who can always get whatever he wanted, then the lawyer would probably not understand where Bob was coming from and why he committed the burglary. Having never been in the situation himself, he wouldn’t realise what Bob was going through and feeling at the time, and just how desperate Bob was. And so, he could defend Bob, but if Bob had a lawyer who had been in similar situations himself things would be quite different. If his lawyer had been poor himself, and in desperate conditions himself, he would understand Bob. He would see Bob as a person, and the defence he could offer would be much more effective. This analogy isn’t perfect, but Jesus has been in similar circumstances to us. He has been tempted, just as we are, and so really understands where we are coming from. He can see things from our perspective.
Finally, verse 16: ‘Let us then approach the throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need’. We can confidently approach God because of Jesus our high priest. We do not need to approach God in fear or apprehension, but in confidence as Jesus has earned the way for us. Because he has experienced human temptation, he is able to sympathise with us and is motivated to help us when we are tempted. Jesus wants to help us in our trials – all we have to do is ask.
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Don't buy it Undercover. It is just another contest where the outcome is already made. Just silly. Consider Christians telling Muslims what The Prophet means to them. Silly.
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Hebrews 5:7-8 confirm Islam's claim about Jesus never got crucified and contradicts the Bible! According to the documentary film, "Banned from the Bible", which I watched on the History Channel, some of Saint Peter's apocalypse were banned from the current Bible, and these Epistles contain what Islam claims - that Jesus didn't get crucified on the cross and it only appeared that he was. This banned part also says that Jesus was standing next to the cross laughing. These are the parts of the Bible that only few people in the world know about.
According to the documentary film, the apocalypse was very popular among Christians during the 2nd century. They believed "it was spiritually inspired" by GOD Almighty to Saint Peter. They actually had doubts about "John's apocalypse", which is known today as "the Book of Revelation". Interestingly also, this apocalypse says that after GOD Almighty fills both Heaven and Hell with inhabitants from Mankind, and the people of Hell get tortured for a long period of time, the People of Heaven will ask and Pray to GOD Almighty to Forgive the people of Hell. GOD Almighty will then eventually listen to their Prayers, and will order the "Gates and the Steel Bars of Hell" to be opened and allow the people of Hell to enter Heaven for Good. This apocalypse of Peter seems to also perfectly fit Noble Verse 7:40 in the Noble Quran where Allah Almighty Promised that He will eventually open the Gates of Heaven to all disbelievers and empty Hell.Posts: 2728 | From: جمهورية مصر العربية | Registered: Sep 2006
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you gotta come better than this. Every single argument you have come up with in the past few months have been very weak. However, thinking about your argument about 'suicide bombings' in the Old Testament certainly made me laugh out loud....lol.
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quote:Originally posted by Batman, non-stop, righteous machine: Hebrews 5:7-8 confirm Islam's claim about Jesus never got crucified and contradicts the Bible! According to the documentary film, "Banned from the Bible", which I watched on the History Channel, some of Saint Peter's apocalypse were banned from the current Bible, and these Epistles contain what Islam claims - that Jesus didn't get crucified on the cross and it only appeared that he was. This banned part also says that Jesus was standing next to the cross laughing. These are the parts of the Bible that only few people in the world know about.
According to the documentary film, the apocalypse was very popular among Christians during the 2nd century. They believed "it was spiritually inspired" by GOD Almighty to Saint Peter. They actually had doubts about "John's apocalypse", which is known today as "the Book of Revelation". Interestingly also, this apocalypse says that after GOD Almighty fills both Heaven and Hell with inhabitants from Mankind, and the people of Hell get tortured for a long period of time, the People of Heaven will ask and Pray to GOD Almighty to Forgive the people of Hell. GOD Almighty will then eventually listen to their Prayers, and will order the "Gates and the Steel Bars of Hell" to be opened and allow the people of Hell to enter Heaven for Good. This apocalypse of Peter seems to also perfectly fit Noble Verse 7:40 in the Noble Quran where Allah Almighty Promised that He will eventually open the Gates of Heaven to all disbelievers and empty Hell.
And THE FOLLOWING Hebrews 6:1,6 says Jesus crucified
1 Wherefore leaving the doctrine of the first principles of Christ, let us press on unto perfection; not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 2 of the teaching of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 3 And this will we do, if God permit. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 4 For as touching those who were once enlightened and tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Spirit, -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 5 and tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the age to come, -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 6 and then fell away, it is impossible to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh(second time), and put him to an open shame.
quote:Originally posted by Batman, non-stop, righteous machine: According to Islam, Jesus peace be upon him might have been put on the cross and might have got "pierced", but he never died. According to Islam, he was raised to Allah Almighty and saved from death. We Muslims believe that Prophet Jesus peace be upon him will come back again to earth and fight the army of Satan and defeat it, and then the Judgment Day will come. According to Islam, every person (including Jesus) must taste death (The Noble Quran, 44:56).
That they said (in boast), “We killed Christ Jesus The son of Mary, The Messenger of Allah”—But they killed him not, Nor crucified him, But so it was made To appear to them, And those who differ Therein are full of doubts, With no (certain) knowledge, But only conjecture to follow, For of a surety They killed him not—Nay, Allah raised him up Unto Himself; and Allah Is Exalted in Power, Wise.[14]
I think the Islamic view is extremely problematic.From the verse above we understand that people believed that Jesus was killed.
Why would God want people to believe that Jesus was dead when he really wasn’t? Muslims can’t argue that God did it to protect Jesus from the Jews or Romans, since God was taking Jesus away safely anyway. So, why would God want to give Jesus’ enemies the satisfaction of seeing Jesus killed? Why not raise Jesus up without deceiving everyone about it? There seems to be no reason at all for God to deceive these people, especially since such a deception would soon lead to the formation of Christianity.
Even non-Christian historians are convinced that Jesus’ death is one of history’s best-established facts. Where did historians get this idea? They got it from God, who tricked so many people into believing in Jesus’ death that we now have tons of historical evidence for this event. Since there are roughly two billion Christians on earth at the present moment, it seems that Jesus and God are responsible for starting the only religion in the world that overshadows Islam. It does not make sense.
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''According to Islam, Jesus peace be upon him might have been put on the cross and might have got "pierced", but he never died.''
Pierced as in a 'nose ring', ya Batman? Maybe a belly button?
''According to Islam'', isn't an argument, as far as Loveforever/Undercover/Whomever is concerned as she/they are christians. Christians believe Christ died on the cross.
Keep banging your head against the wall, Batman or learn to accept the differences of others. Or do you want to be exactly like Undercover/Loveforever?
Posts: 2953 | From: Slightly south of Azkaban. | Registered: Aug 2006
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posted
"Keep banging your head against the wall, Batman or learn to accept the differences of others. Or do you want to be exactly like Undercover/Loveforever?"
Keep the deragatory comments to yourself SYWS. I respect and accept the differences of others, and I am sure Batman respects them too. At least Batman has refrained from hurling insults at me. You haven't. This shows that Batman accepts and respects the differences of others more than you do. Me and Batman can agree to disagree without resorting to insults, can you do the same? No you are calling people morons and idiots if they don't agree with your point of view.
Really we can do without your patronizing attitude.
Posts: 3188 | Registered: Feb 2007
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Christians are warned not to do this in Matthew 7:6 "7:6. Give not that which is holy to dogs; neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest perhaps they trample them under their feet, and turning upon you, they tear you."
Posts: 1419 | From: Amsterdam, Netherlands | Registered: Aug 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Undercover: "Keep banging your head against the wall, Batman or learn to accept the differences of others. Or do you want to be exactly like Undercover/Loveforever?"
Keep the deragatory comments to yourself SYWS. I respect and accept the differences of others, and I am sure Batman respects them too. At least Batman has refrained from hurling insults at me. You haven't. This shows that Batman accepts and respects the differences of others more than you do. Me and Batman can agree to disagree without resorting to insults, can you do the same? No you are calling people morons and idiots if they don't agree with your point of view.
Really we can do without your patronizing attitude.
I didn't call you a moron or an idiot, did I? I just find it hard to differentiate between you and Loveforever now.
Posts: 2953 | From: Slightly south of Azkaban. | Registered: Aug 2006
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