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sudaniya wrote: ------------------------------------ You should then have the sense to acknowledge that the ancient Egyptians are linguistically and cultually akin to Northern Sudanese and horn Africans. ------------------------------------
The Ancient Egyptians were the result of the ancient saharan complex of "north" Africa (Mali, Mauritania, Algeria, Tunisia, Niger, Libya, Chad, Sudan, Egypt). The horn of Africa was not a player in what the Ancient Egyptians did (maybe with the exception of outside of commercial trading, which would include other areas of Africa and the world beside the "horn" of Africa).
Posts: 3085 | Registered: Jan 2008
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Djehuti, Lefkowitz has since modified her position, you need to keep up with more recent data. You can peddle this black african thing all you wish, go for it. The fact is that black africa has been the arm pit of world civilizations since the beginning. They depend on global welfare to survive today and cannot compete with Euro Americans and Asians. You can put lip stick on a pig but it is still a pig. If we are looking at facts that is a fact.
Posts: 2069 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2008
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Freehand aka "Jeeves" you keep trying to prove to all the guest at the forum gathering that you are intelligent. But all you're doing is simply emphasizing to everyone why you are the forum's butler.
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Freehand wrote: --------------------------------- ^the Kemetians proclaimed to have come from Punt, a region probably located in Eritrea and Northern Ethiopia. ---------------------------------
Probably doesn't cut it. Because no one knows where punt is, they like your butler ass can only guess.
Now unless you have any real proof to counteract that Ancient Egypt arose from the Saharan complex of "north" Africa (Mali, Mauritania, Algeria, Tunisia, Niger, Libya, Chad, Sudan, Egypt), you should stick to serving everyone appetizers.
Posts: 3085 | Registered: Jan 2008
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"The Aithiopians [Northern Sudanese] say that the Egyptians are settlers from among themselves and that Osiris was the leader of the settlement. The customs of the Egyptians, they say, are for the most part Aithiopian, the settlers having preserved their old traditions. For to consider the kings gods, to pay great attention to funeral rites, and many other things, are Aithiopian practices, and also the style of their statues and the form of their writing are Aithiopian. Also the way the priestly colleges are organized is said to be the same in both nations. For all who have to do with the cult of the gods, they maintain, are [ritually] pure: the priests are shaved in the same way, they have the same robes and the type of scepter shaped like a plough, which also the kings have, who use tall pointed felt hats ending in a knob, with the snakes that they call the asp (aspis) coiled round them."
-Diodorus-
The crown of Upper Egypt originated in Qustal, Northern Sudan.
Linguistically, the ancients are related to the Beja, again in North-east Sudan.
The view of a Jewish women on Nile Valley civilization, should be regarded as of NO consequence, considering that the evidence of an indigenous Egypt akin to Taseti [ northern Sudan] is overwhelming.
Posts: 1568 | From: Pluto | Registered: Sep 2008
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Actually, a couple of finds say that the Punt location has been confirmed.
Posts: 5555 | From: Tha 5th Dimension. | Registered: Apr 2006
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quote:Originally posted by TheAmericanPatriot: Actually sunaniya, It is the other way around. Nubians borrowed from Egypt.
Actually, they borrowed from each other.. The Egyptians derive from populations however, that scholars may mistakingly call "Nubian" in the first place so all of that is redundant.
Posts: 4021 | From: Bay Area, CA | Registered: Mar 2007
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quote:Originally posted by TheAmericanPatriot: [QB] Egyptians are north Afican caucasians.
What a depressed American. Stop making sh1t up you racially obsessed redneck. Making up fake azz racial categories like "African Caucasian" (oxymoron) only makes you look delusional and about as crazy as batshit. Lefkowitz even knows you're a fraud..
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I can always expect a reply from the computer lab of the mental retardation center. Grow up Dumbjata and read an actual book or two.
Posts: 2069 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2008
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^^Yea, one referred to me by a whitehistory.com browsing ""African Caucasian""??? LMAO!! I'll pass and stick to REAL books. Like that of the variety cited here..
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Those guys are not bright but they are smarter than someone who thinks black Africa extends north of the desert. You simply lack the historical foundation to be able to make sense of what you read. I cannot help you if you refuse to listen.
Posts: 2069 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2008
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quote:Originally posted by TheAmericanPatriot: [QB] Those guys are not bright
And YOU cite them, so why should I pay any attention to anything you write after this?? You are of the same mold. LMAO @ "African Caucasians".. Your entire history comes from that crackpot website and others like it. You are a fraud. Go to the links I've posted or stfu. Peace.
Posts: 4021 | From: Bay Area, CA | Registered: Mar 2007
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again, at some point you have to develop a foundation. That is hat the Book Alerts are about.
Posts: 2069 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2008
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I don't know why some in here are giving TAP such a hard time over his "north African Caucasians" as he is merely echoing Sforza who is highly respect by some on ES!
As for Lefkowitz, she will disregard the more embarrassing aspects of Eurocentrism where AE are "invaders from the north" but she obviously agrees with TAP in terms of dividing up Africans into "black Africans" and "others" and seeing the former as not extending "north of the desert."
Posts: 4165 | From: jamaica | Registered: May 2008
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quote:Originally posted by TheAmericanPatriot: Djehuti, Lefkowitz has since modified her position, you need to keep up with more recent data. You can peddle this black african thing all you wish, go for it. The fact is that black africa has been the arm pit of world civilizations since the beginning. They depend on global welfare to survive today and cannot compete with Euro Americans and Asians. You can put lip stick on a pig but it is still a pig. If we are looking at facts that is a fact.
LOL Lefkowitz modified her position only after she was attacked by her 'Classicist' colleagues and NOT experts in Egyptology. And even her 'modified' opinions fly directly in the face of all historical and bio-anthropological evidence that she originally cited the first time! Africa has been the birthplace of civilizations since ancient times. Egypt was just one of many examples of it's native ingenuity, yet as usual you in the most absolute absurdity denies that fact. Just as you deny that the only reason why Africa is in the position that it is today is because European colonists have totally destroyed its infrastructure!!
quote: Actually sunaniya, It is the other way around. Nubians borrowed from Egypt.
Yes, during the New Kingdom and afterwards but that still does not change the fact that Nubians independently developed their own civilization since predynastic times and that Egyptians own civilized roots come from Nubia as well! But obviously all the past discussions on 'Nubia' in this forum have gone over your head along with all the info on the Egyptians African identity.
quote: Egyptians are north Afican caucasians. Nubian population in upper egypt was around 5%.
Strange how the Egyptians are "caucasians" while their Nubian neighbors to the immediate south are not, even though they are equally North African. Tell me professor. Exactly what makes the Egyptians "caucasian" but not the Nubians. This is like saying the Greeks were south European 'negroes' (which is proposed by some in this forum) but their Macedonian neighbors only a few miles north are not.
Tell us Pat, how all these ancient Egyptians above are "caucasian" and "not black"??
By the way, the Nubian population in southern Egypt has to be alot greater than 5% considering that northern Nubia was located in what is today southern Egypt! Also, those pictures of black people Sudaniya showed were NOT Nubians but ethnic non-Arab rural (true) Egyptians!
quote:As for influence usually the dominant neighbor will have the most cultural impact.
True. But you are obviously unaware that Egypt has not always been the dominant one in the Nile Valley, and there were times when her Nubian sister was more dominant. Also, even mainstream Egyptologists would be lying if they were to deny Nubian influence on Egyptian culture since early times.
quote: Those guys are not bright but they are smarter than someone who thinks black Africa extends north of the desert. You simply lack the historical foundation to be able to make sense of what you read. I cannot help you if you refuse to listen.
And since when is 'black Africa' or rather black peoples were ever restricted to south of the desert only?!! Do you realize that 'Nubia' which is directly south of Egypt is still in North Africa not south of the desert??!
Do you not know blacks are indigenous to ALL of Africa, the same way whites are indigenous to all of Europe?? Did you know that the Sahara did not always exist and that during Epipaleolithic times North Africa was green and fertile?? Do you know that even after North Africa dried out and became desert that indigenous (black) populations still survive either in oases or living as nomads??! Seriously, professor you are the last person to be criticizing others about "sense" historical, common, or otherwise!
quote: again, at some point you have to develop a foundation. That is what the Book Alerts are about.
LOL The intelligent posters of this forum have long built up a foundation based on FACTS and simple reality, one so great we could write an encylopedia with what we have yet all you is spout white supremacist lies and make ludicrous modern political excuses.
Posts: 26502 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by TheAmericanPatriot: Djehuti, Lefkowitz has since modified her position, you need to keep up with more recent data. You can peddle this black african thing all you wish, go for it. The fact is that black africa has been the arm pit of world civilizations since the beginning. They depend on global welfare to survive today and cannot compete with Euro Americans and Asians. You can put lip stick on a pig but it is still a pig. If we are looking at facts that is a fact.
Is TheAmericanPatriot the same poster as Horemheb?
This guy has been spouting his Eurocentric nonsense for years. You have to be mentally ill to sit on this forum losing the same debate over and over man. It's pathetic.
The racist, Eurocentric model of African history has been debunked. Lefkowitz is not and never has been an authority on this subject so there is no point in making a book alert for her.
It's time for you cut out this Blacks are inferior rhetoric and accept the fact that Ancient Egypt was a Black African civilization or find something else to do because you've lost your debates.
Posts: 647 | From: Atlanta | Registered: Jan 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Morpheus: Is TheAmericanPatriot the same poster as Horemheb?
LMAO And you just figured this out??
quote:This guy has been spouting his Eurocentric nonsense for years. You have to be mentally ill to sit on this forum losing the same debate over and over man. It's pathetic.
Well I've always said racism is like a mental disorder...
quote:The racist, Eurocentric model of African history has been debunked. Lefkowitz is not and never has been an authority on this subject so there is no point in making a book alert for her.
Of course, but you are well aware that all the professor knows is the Eurocentric model-- it is his whole state of mind and life. And he will continue to live in his delusional fantasy world but for how long?
quote:It's time for you cut out this Blacks are inferior rhetoric and accept the fact that Ancient Egypt was a Black African civilization or find something else to do because you've lost your debates.
Of course he knows deep down that he never even had a point in any of his so-called 'debates' let alone won any! He will instead dismiss us all as "radicalist left-wing loons" and continue to spout his nonsense no matter how many studies and papers we present from mainstream academians and scientists that debunk his claims.
Posts: 26502 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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I've been away from the boards for some time so I thought TAP was a new poster but when he started repeating those familiar phrases, "Lefkowitz modified her position" etc. etc. plus you calling him Professor it gave him away.
I seem to recall Horemheb rambling about IQ differences some time ago. That's what this is really all about for him. He is a racist, in the "race-realist" mold of claiming that certain groups are intellectually inferior and believes this is a scientific fact. So Ancient Egypt being a Black African civilization is problematic for him. It's a threat to his ideology.
I suspect that he has OCD and really can't overcome the urge to keep "debating" the same points over and over.
What's sad is that after all this time he hasn't come up with any new arguments.
Posts: 647 | From: Atlanta | Registered: Jan 2009
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Personally, I like to have fun with the guy by pointing out his irrationality and illogical 'reasoning'. I really think the guy is in some way coming to grips with reality and coping with his twisted world view. By the way, who are you again? Are you Serpent-Wisdom??
Posts: 26502 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Horemheb did email me some time ago saying that he had reconsidered some of his positions and seemed to take Salassin's position that the Ancient Egyptians were not 'purely' Black.
But if he has regressed to citing Whitehistory.com and saying that Africans cannot compete with Europeans and Asians then there is no hope for him.
Posts: 647 | From: Atlanta | Registered: Jan 2009
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quote: Of course he knows deep down that he never even had a point in any of his so-called 'debates' let alone won any! He will instead dismiss us all as "radicalist left-wing loons" and continue to spout his nonsense no matter how many studies and papers we present from mainstream academians and scientists that debunk his claims.
TAP can NOT counterract the overwhelming evidence of linguistics, anthropology, eye witnesses accounts, and a plehora of new evidence, supporting an indigenous Egypt akin to Northern Sudan.
There is'nt, and Never was, any evidence lendig credence to a "caucasian" ancient Egypt.
Djehuti, Lefkowitz has since modified her position, you need to keep up with more recent data. You can peddle this black african thing all you wish, go for it. The fact is that black africa has been the arm pit of world civilizations since the beginning. They depend on global welfare to survive today and cannot compete with Euro Americans and Asians. You can put lip stick on a pig but it is still a pig. If we are looking at facts that is a fact.
LOL Lefkowitz modified her position only after she was attacked by her 'Classicist' colleagues and NOT experts in Egyptology. And even her 'modified' opinions fly directly in the face of all historical and bio-anthropological evidence that she originally cited the first time! Africa has been the birthplace of civilizations since ancient times. Egypt was just one of many examples of it's native ingenuity, yet as usual you in the most absolute absurdity denies that fact.
I think some give Lefkowitz, who attained "internet" exposure merely as a whino [@ mainly *faceless* or *dead* "Afrocentrists"], unnecessary attention. She is irrelevant in the scheme of fact dissemination. It is comical to even entertain the pretense [as displayed by TAP for instance] that one needs to seek her approval for *anything*, let alone facts.
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quote: Actually sunaniya, It is the other way around. Nubians borrowed from Egypt.
Yes, during the New Kingdom and afterwards but that still does not change the fact that Nubians independently developed their own civilization since predynastic times and that Egyptians own civilized roots come from Nubia as well! But obviously all the past discussions on 'Nubia' in this forum have gone over your head along with all the info on the Egyptians African identity.
Once one speaks of "Nubians" as one's opponent just did, one had already lost the argument even before one proceeded further. In this instance for example, it's been tacitly accepted that "Nubian" is mutually exclusive with "Egyptian". But those of us who have been here long enough, already know the deal or ought to know it by now. Just an observation.
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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