posted
In their desperation to amass as much people as possible under the label "Black," so as to bolster their racial number, Black people erroneously call all people of color, "Black."
HEROIC RESISTANCE: THE BLACK PRESENCE IN AUSTRALIA
By RUNOKO RASHIDI
Australia is officially the world's smallest continent. Unofficially it is one of the most racist nations on earth. Australia was settled at least 100,000 years ago by Black people usually referred to as Australian Aborigines. Physically, the Aborigines are distinguished by straight to wavy hair textures and dark to near black complexions. In January 1788, when Britain began using Australia as a prison colony, an estimated 300,000 Black people were spread across the continent in about 600 small-scale communities.
The dumping of British convicts into Australia proved catastrophic for the Blacks. The Blacks were butchered and murdered like animals. They were the victims of deliberate poisonings and systematic slaughters, decimated by tuberculosis and syphilis, and swept away by infectious epidemics. With their community structures and moral fibers shredded, the Blacks, by the 1930s, had been reduced to a pathetic remnant of about 30,000 people and perhaps twice that number of mixed descent. Until the 1960s, the Blacks were not officially considered human beings.
When the continent was invaded by Europeans in the nineteenth century, the White historians who wrote about Australia invariably included a section on the Blacks, and acknowledged that, as the original inhabitants of the continent, the Blacks had had an historical role. After 1850, however, few writers referred to the Blacks at all, and they were identified as a "dying race." In 1859, Charles Darwin's book, The Origin of Species, popularized the notion of biological (and therefore social) evolution. Scholars began to discuss civilization as a unilinear process with White people at the top and Black people at the bottom.
It should be noted, that it was during this time that British and Australian scientists ran one of the biggest grave-robbing networks ever organized. Studies by an White Australian scholar researching at Oxford University indicate that the graves of between 5,000 and 10,000 Black people were desecrated, their bodies dismembered or parts stolen to support a "scientific" trade. Even worse, it appears that many Black people were systematically stalked, hunted down and murdered to obtain their body parts as "specimens for science." The Whites involved in this ghoulish traffic apparently had little shame, and some of the documents refer to traffic in Black men's penises.
PART 2
By 1950, general histories of the continent by White Australians almost never referenced the Aborigines at all. During this period, the Blacks, whether part or full-blood, were excluded from all major White Australian institutions, including schools, hospitals and labor unions. They could not vote. Their movements were restricted. They were outcastes in White Australia.
Today, the Blacks of Australia are terribly oppressed, and remain in a desperate struggle for survival. Recent demographic surveys, for example, show that the Black infant mortality rate is the highest in Australia. Blacks have the shoddiest housing and the poorest schools. Their life expectancy is twenty years less than Whites. Their unemployment rate is six times higher than the national average. Blacks did not obtain the right to vote in federal elections until 1961. They did not gain the legal right to consume alcoholic beverages until 1964. They were not officially counted as Australian citizens until after a constitutional amendment in 1967.
Their resistance continues, however. In January 1972, an Australian Black Panther Party was formed in Brisbane, Australia. On July 16, 1990, an Aboriginal Provisional Government was launched.
THE UNRELENTING STRUGGLE OF INDIGENOUS AUSTRALIANS
by GRACELYN SMALLWOOD*
Thank you, Brothers and Sisters. I'd like to thank The World Uranium Hearing for giving me the privilege of being able to present today. I have ten minutes to give you 200 years of colonization of Indigenous Australia. So, I commence by giving a quote from an Aboriginal woman in my country, Jackie Huggins:
"Aboriginal Australians have lived in Australia over 40,000 years. It has been a long argued view of European anthropologists and prehistorians that modern humanity migrated South to Australia. This fails to explain, however, why older forms of modern human beings have not been found outside the continent. The legends and religious beliefs of modern Aboriginal Australia have no stories of migration. There is no evidence of migration memories anywhere in our country. This is a religious position taken by Aboriginal Australians, and science has failed to refute it."
Before 1788, Aboriginal Australians enjoyed a nomadic lifestyle where men, women and children lived in harmony with each other and the environment. Mother Earth was regarded as sacred which everyone respected and did not exploit. The healthy lifestyle changed dramatically when the invaders arrived from England headed by Captain Cook. The land was claimed by them through a law that still exists today called "terra nullius", meaning "no man's land". The British government wanted to establish the penal colony because of the overcrowding in their own country. It was estimated that about one million Australian Aborigines inhabited the country with 500 different tribes in 1788. Today, in 1992, 200 years later, there are 300,000 left. Many were killed with guns, poisoned water holes and food, and many died from diseases introduced by the invaders. A document from the late 1700's states: "Some convicts were allowed to have the weekends free from the confines of their masters' properties on the condition that they brought back with them aboriginal scalps. These scalps were, in fact, pairs of ears."
The remainder of the Aborigines were placed on reserves and missions where white management had total control over their Aboriginal lifestyle. The hunted and gathered foods were replaced with high carbohydrate rations. Language and ceremonies were forbidden, as it was seen as paganistic to the invaders' superior, Christian values. The colonists brought with them their social order and notion of property, their birth rights and Christianity. With their invisible luggage they brought their racial prejudice. Aboriginal men were drastically losing their role in society by being used to slave labour. The women were used as domestics and sexual partners for the white invaders. Raping and killings continued as a sport. And I quote: "One gorges at the Sunday afternoon manhunts of sexual mutilation, of burying live Aboriginal babies up to their necks in sand and kicking their heads off after tying with a rape the severed neck of the husband around the raped spouse."
Half cast children were being born and many were sent away to welfare homes or to other reserves far away and many did not return home. The most systemic destruction occurred in 1909 when about 5,300 Aboriginal children were sent to Cootamundra Girls Training School and Kinchelle Boys Home in Kempsey, New South Wales, where they were given training as domestics and farm hands. There was an estimation that one in every six Aboriginal children were taken away from their families in that century, compared to the figure of one white out of 300 to the white community.
In the 1800's, scientists around the world -- in particular Britain and Germany -- encouraged the killing of Aboriginals for scientific research. Money was actually paid for skeletons. Thousands of graves were robbed, the British and Australian scientists ran one of the biggest graverobbing networks. Studies by an academic researcher in Oxford indicated that the graves of between 5,000 and 10,000 Aboriginals were desecrated, their bodies dismembered to support science. Recently discovered documents in Brisbane confirm that Aboriginals were killed for displays in museums. Presently, Dr. Robin Cox, head of the archeological branch of the Natural History Museum in London, has requested on television that more Aboriginal bodies be sent to his museum. Aboriginal Australians have called for his dismissal.
Legislation came in three stages for Aboriginals who were regarded not even as human beings. First, there was a series of official inquiries from 1845 to 1861 to investigate conflicts between settlers and Aboriginals. Out of this came the conclusion that it was best for both black and white, that Aboriginal people be separated from Europeans and live on small reserves, where it was assumed that they would eventually die out. The second stage was a protection act that all Aboriginal people would be under the control of the government rather than the settlers. Often, in isolated areas the person in charge was usually the local policeman. The third stage was in the late 19th century, an enactment of specific discriminative legislation. Between 1901 and 1911 all the states, including the Northern Territory with the exception of Tasmania, passed acts providing for Aboriginal welfare. This legislation was summed up by a researcher as "a system that confines the native within a legal system that has more in common with the born idiot than any other class of British subjects".
Queensland, where I was born, has many Aboriginal reserves. One which is called Palm Island is notoriously known for brutal treatment of Aboriginal people. Punishment for minor offences was shaving childrens' heads bald and making them parade in front of the community. And then the children were locked up in dormitories. The childrens' hair was their pride.
My father, a member of the Birrigubba tribe, was taken away as a child and raised on Palm Island. My grandfather was one of six brave men from Palm Island who went on a hunger-strike in 1957 for better conditions for Aboriginal people. All six men were taken in chains, with their families separated from each other and relocated to other reserves. In the 1950's and 60's, the British government tested nuclear bombs at Maralinga, Monte Bello Island and Emu Field. The fallout extended over a wide area including Queensland. At that time my father was working on the railroad in central Queensland, where there is now a high rate of leukemia in children.
In 1967, a referendum was held where 90 percent of white Australians voted that Aborigines become citizens in their own land. However, Queensland was the only state not to abolish all laws discriminating against Aboriginals. Many of the South African apartheid laws were actually modelled on the Queensland Aborigines Act.
In 1971, an Aborigine artist, Harold Thomas, designed the Aboriginal flag in the colours red, black and yellow. Black for the people, the red for the earth and the yellow for the sun, the giver of life. In the early 1970's, the Aboriginal bureaucracy was structured under the federal Labor government. Money was allocated for housing, health, schooling and various projects. This was a form of compensation to try to overcome the poverty among Aborigines. Most of the funding went to white public servants in the administration, and little reached the grassroot-levels. Many of the white public servants became experts in being Aboriginal. At this time the Girynga people of the Northern Territory were given some landrights. Since then there has been much legislation and government inquiries into landrights and heritage acts. Most Aboriginal people still have not had success in land claims. Multinational mining companies are stifling many claims. Uranium and other minerals were found where Aboriginal communities were mostly located.
In the late 1960's, I learned about the dangers of uranium mining in Mary Kathleen, a desert town in Queensland, from my father. He was the only source of information my family had. We had no access to newspapers, radio or television. He was very involved with the trades and labor movement while working with the railways. There was much opposition by railway unions against the transport and export of Mary Kathleen uranium, and in 1977, the Australian Council of Trade Unions called for a ban on the export of uranium. And like 1976, my father became aware of the secret rail shipment of uranium from Mary Kathleen on the Mount Isa railroad. Uranium demonstrators delayed the shipment for some time and publicity resulted on the dangers of uranium mining. In 1980, there was a theft of two tons of yellow cake from Mary Kathleen. It was transported out of the mine in six drums and later found in Sydney almost 5,000 kilometers away.
In the mid-1980's, my father died of stomach cancer, although he lived a very healthy lifestyle. As a midwife for the past 20 years, working in the area of public health nationally and internationally, I have witnessed an increase in sterility, cancers, miscarriages, deformities and other problems. It appears to be a general problem globally. The present situation of Aboriginal Australia is alarming. Many remote communities lack clean running water, adequate housing and proper sanitation. We represent one percent of the national population but we count for up to 70 percent of prison inmates. Infant mortality is three times higher than in the general population, and the life expectancy is 20 to 25 years less.
The unemployment rate is three to five times greater than the general population. We still have diseases like leprosy and tracoma that some Third World countries have eradicated. Alcoholism is on epidemic levels which causes family breakdowns and the loss of their cultural identity. To further this insulting situation towards Aboriginal society, we now have a black and a white bureaucracy.
The federal government gave the power to Aboriginal people to elect representatives, to advise the government on Aboriginal affairs. This advisory body called ATSIC, the Aboriginal and Torres Straight Islanders Commission, is continuing to disempower Aboriginal people as far too much money is spent in the administrative arm and very little reaches the grassroots-level.
An Indian Elder said in Canada three weeks ago, and I quote: "We must educate the indigenous people as well as the white people about the dangers of the ugly nuclear industry. Some are beginning to give the O.K. to mine on Aboriginal land in order to deal with the poverty. They must be told to leave uranium in the ground." End of quote. Michael Mansell, an Australian Aboriginal activist, summed up the prospects of Aboriginal people in my country when he stated: "The most crucial prerequisite to empowering Aboriginal people is their desire and capacity to put an end to their disadvantaged situation and take control of their own lives. There is no other way." The World Uranium Hearing will hopefully unite us all to achieve this and to take back our messages to our leaders and our people to leave uranium in the ground. And in closing, not is all doom and gloom. I encourage my indigenous sisters and brothers globally to continue our struggle. We have survived and we will survive, as we were all B.C. -- before Cook, Columbus and Christ.
-------------------- "TRUTH IS LIKE LIGHTNING WITH ITS ERRAND DONE BEFORE YOU HEAR THE THUNDER" - Gerald Massey "TRUTH IS FINAL" -Mumia Abu-Jamal Posts: 3446 | From: U.S. by way of JA by way of Africa | Registered: Jan 2010
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BLACK WAR THE DESTRUCTION OF THE TASMANIAN ABORIGINES
By RUNOKO RASHIDI
DEDICATED TO DR. GRACELYN SMALLWOOD
To many, the mention of Tasmania evokes humorous recollections of the Tasmanian devil--the voracious marsupial popularized in American cartoons. Tasmania is an island slightly larger in size than West Virginia, and is located two-hundred miles off Australia's southeast coast. The aboriginal inhabitants of the island were Black people who probably went there by crossing an ancient land bridge that connected Tasmania to the continent of Australia.
The Black aborigines of Tasmania were marked by tightly curled hair with skin complexions ranging from black to reddish-brown. They were relatively short in stature with little body fat. They were the indigenous people of Tasmania and their arrival there began at least 35,000 years ago. With the passage of time, the gradual rising of the sea level submerged the Australian-Tasmanian land bridge and the Black aborigines of Tasmania experienced more than 10,000 years of solitude and physical isolation from the rest of the world--the longest period of isolation in human history.
It is our great misfortune that the Black people of Tasmania bequeathed no written histories. We do not know that they called themselves or what they named their land. All we really have are minute fragments, bits of evidence, and the records and documents of Europeans who began coming to the island in 1642.
THE BLACK FAMILY IN TASMANIA
The Tasmanian aborigines were hunter-gatherers with an exceptionally basic technology. The Tasmanians made only a few types of simple stone and wooden tools. They lacked agriculture, livestock, pottery, and bows and arrows.
The Black family in Tasmania was a highly organized one--its form and substance directed by custom. A man joined with a woman in marriage and formed a social partnership with her. It would appear that such marriages were usually designed by the parents--but this is something about which very little is actually known. The married couple seems to have remained together throughout the course of their lives, and only in rare cases did a man have more than one wife at the same time. Their children were not only well cared for, but were treated with great affection. Elders were cared for by the the family, and children were kept at the breast for longer than is usual in child care among Europeans.
THE BEGINNING OF THE END OF THE BLACKS
The isolation of Tasmania's Black aborigines ended in 1642 with the arrival and intrusion of the first Europeans. Abel Jansen Tasman, the Dutch navigator after whom the island is named, anchored off the Tasmanian coast in early December, 1642. Tasman named the island Van Diemen's land, after Anthony Van Diemen--the governor-general of the Dutch East India Company. The island continued to be called Van Diemen's Land until 1855.
On March 5, 1772, a French expedition led by Nicholas Marion du Fresne landed on the island. Within a few hours his sailors had shot several Aborigines. On January 28, 1777, the British landed on the island. Following coastal New South Wales in Australia, Tasmania was established as a British convict settlement in 1803. These convicts had been harshly traumatized and were exceptionally brutal. In addition to soldiers, administrators, and missionaries, eventually more than 65,000 men and women convicts were settled in Tasmania. A glaringly inefficient penal system allowed such convicts to escape into the Tasmanian hinterland where they exercised the full measure of their blood-lust and brutality upon the island's Black occupants. According to social historian Clive Turnbull, the activities of these criminals would soon include the "shooting, bashing out brains, burning alive, and slaughter of Aborigines for dogs' meat."
PART 2
TASMANIAN DEVILS IN HUMAN FORM
As early as 1804 the British began to slaughter, kidnap and enslave the Black people of Tasmania. The colonial government itself was not even inclined to consider the aboriginal Tasmanians as full human beings, and scholars began to discuss civilization as a unilinear process with White people at the top and Black people at the bottom. To the Europeans of Tasmania the Blacks were an entity fit only to be exploited in the most sadistic of manners--a sadism that staggers the imagination and violates all human morality. As UCLA professor, Jared Diamond, recorded:
"Tactics for hunting down Tasmanians included riding out on horseback to shoot them, setting out steel traps to catch them, and putting out poison flour where they might find and eat it. Sheperds cut off the penis and testicles of aboriginal men, to watch the men run a few yards before dying. At a hill christened Mount Victory, settlers slaughtered 30 Tasmanians and threw their bodies over a cliff. One party of police killed 70 Tasmanians and dashed out the children's brains."
Such vile and animalistic behavior on the part of the White settlers of Tasmania was the rule rather than the exception. In spite of their wanton cruelty, however, punishment in Tasmania was exceedingly rare for the Whites, although occasionally Whites were sentenced for crimes against Blacks. For example, there is an account of a man who was flogged for exhibiting the ears and other body parts of a Black boy that he had mutilated alive. We hear of another European punished for cutting off the little finger of an Aborigine and using it as a tobacco stopper. Twenty-five lashes were stipulated for Europeans convicted of tying aboriginal "Tasmanian women to logs and burning them with firebrands, or forcing a woman to wear the head of her freshly murdered husband on a string around her neck."
Not a single European, however, was ever punished for the murder of Tasmanian Aborigines. Europeans thought nothing of tying Black men to trees and using them for target practice. Black women were kidnapped, chained and exploited as sexual slaves. White convicts regularly hunted Black people for sport, casually shooting, spearing or clubbing the men to death, torturing and raping the women, and roasting Black infants alive. As historian, James Morris, graphically noted:
"We hear of children kidnapped as pets or servants, of a woman chained up like an animal in a sheperd's hut, of men castrated to keep them off their own women. In one foray seventy aborigines were killed, the men shot, the women and children dragged from crevices in the rocks to have their brains dashed out. A man called Carrotts, desiring a native woman, decapitated her husband, hung his head around her neck and drove her home to his shack."
PART 3
THE BLACK WAR
"The Black War of Van Diemen's Land" was the name of the official campaign of terror directed against the Black people of Tasmania. Between 1803 and 1830 the Black aborigines of Tasmania were reduced from an estimated five-thousand people to less than seventy-five. An article published December 1, 1826 in the Tasmanian Colonial Times declared that:
"We make no pompous display of Philanthropy. The Government must remove the natives--if not, they will be hunted down like wild beasts and destroyed!"
With the declaration of martial law in November 1828, Whites were authorized to kill Blacks on sight. Although the Blacks offered a heroic resistance, the wooden clubs and sharpened sticks of the Aborigines were no match against the firepower, ruthlessness, and savagery exercised by the Europeans against them. In time, a bounty was declared on Blacks, and "Black catching," as it was called, soon became a big business; five pounds for each adult Aborigine, two pounds for each child. After considering proposals to capture them for sale as slaves, poison or trap them, or hunt them with dogs, the government settled on continued bounties and the use of mounted police.
After the Black War, for political expediency, the status of the Blacks, who were no longer regarded as a physical threat, was reduced to that of a nuisance and a bother, and with loud and pious exclamations that it was for the benefit of the Blacks themselves, the remainder of the Aborigines were rounded up and placed in concentration camps.
In 1830 George Augustus Robinson, a Christian missionary, was hired to round up the remaining Tasmanian Blacks and take them to Flinders Island, thirty miles away. Many of Robinson's captives died along the way. By 1843 only fifty survived. Jared Diamond recorded that:
"On Flinders Island Robinson was determined to civilize and Christianize the survivors. His settlement--at a windy site with little fresh water--was run like a jail. Children were separated from parents to facilitate the work of civilizing them. The regimental daily schedule included Bible reading, hymn singing, and inspection of beds and dishes for cleanness and neatness. However, the jail diet caused malnutrition, which combined with illness to make the natives die. Few infants survived more than a few weeks. The government reduced expenditures in the hope that the native would die out. By 1869 only Truganini, one other woman, and one man remained alive."
PART 4
THE LAST TASMANIANS
With the steady decrease in the number of Aborigines, White people began to take a bizarre interest in the Blacks, whom Whites believed "to be a missing link between humans and apes." In 1859 Charles Darwin's book, On the Origin of Species, popularized the fantasy of biological (and therefore social) evolution, with Whites at the top of the evolutionary scale and Blacks at the bottom. The Aborigines were portrayed as a group of people "doomed to die out according to a natural law, like the dodo, and the dinosaur." This is during the same period in the United States that it was legally advocated that a Black man had no rights that a White man was bound to respect.
William Lanney, facetiously known as King Billy, was the last full-blood male Tasmanian. He was born in 1835 and grew up on Flinders Island. At the age of thirteen Lanney was removed with the remnant of his people to a concentration camp called Oyster Cove. Ultimately he became a sailor and some years he went whaling. As the last male Tasmanian, Lanney was regarded as a human relic. In January 1860 he was introduced to Prince Albert. He returned ill from a whaling voyage in February 1868, and on March 2, 1868 he died in his room at the Dog and Partridge public-house in Hobart, Tasmania.
Lanney, the subject of ridicule in life, became, in death, a desirable object. Even while he lay in the Colonial Hospital at least two persons determined to have his bones. They claimed to act in the interest of the Royal Society of Tasmania. On March 6, 1868, the day of the funeral, fifty or sixty residents interested in Lanney gathered at the hospital. Rumors were circulating that the body had been mutilated and, to satisfy the mourners, the coffin was opened. When those who wished to do so had seen the body, the coffin was closed and sealed. Meanwhile it was reported that, on the preceding night, a surgeon had entered the dead-house where Lanney lay, skinned the head, and removed the skull. Reportedly, the head of a patient who had died in the hospital on the same day was similarly skinned, and the skull was placed inside Lanney's scalp and the skin drawn over it. Members of the Royal Society were "greatly annoyed" at being thus forestalled and, as body-snatching was expected, it was decided that nothing should be left worth taking and Lanney's hands and feet were cut off. In keeping with the tradition no one was punished. William Lanney, the last Black man in Tasmania, was gone.
QUEEN TRUGANINI: THE LAST TASMANIAN
"Not, perhaps, before, has a race of men been utterly destroyed within seventy-five years. This is the story of a race which was so destroyed, that of the aborigines of Tasmania--destroyed not only by a different manner of life but by the ill-will of the usurpers of the race's land.... With no defences but cunning and the most primitive weapons, the natives were no match for the sophisticated individualists of knife and gun. By 1876 the last of them was dead. So perished a whole people." --Clive Turnbull
On May 7, 1876, Truganini, the last full-blood Black person in Tasmania, died at seventy-three years of age. Her mother had been stabbed to death by a European. Her sister was kidnapped by Europeans. Her intended husband was drowned by two Europeans in her presence, while his murderers raped her.
It might be accurately said that Truganini's numerous personal sufferings typify the tragedy of the Black people of Tasmania as a whole. She was the very last. "Don't let them cut me up," she begged the doctor as she lay dying. After her burial, Truganini's body was exhumed, and her skeleton, strung upon wires and placed upright in a box, became for many years the most popular exhibit in the Tasmanian Museum and remained on display until 1947. Finally, in 1976--the centenary years of Truganini's death--despite the museum's objections, her skeleton was cremated and her ashes scattered at sea.
CONCLUSION
The tragedy of the Black aborigines of Tasmania, however painful its recounting may be, is a story that must be told. What lessons do we learn from the destruction of the Tasmanians? Truganini's life and death, although extreme, effectively chronicle the association not only between White people and Black people in Tasmania, but, to a significant degree, around the world. Between 1803 and 1876 the Black aborigines of Tasmania were completely destroyed. During this period the Black people of Tasmania were debased, degraded and eventually exterminated. Indeed, given the long and well-documented history of carnage, cruelty, savagery, and the monstrous pain, suffering, and inhumanity Europeans have inflicted upon Black people in general, and the Black people of Tasmania in particular, one could argue that they themselves, the White settlers of Tasmania, far more than the ravenous beast portrayed in American cartoons, have been the real Tasmanian devil.
POSTSCRIPT
INDIGENOUS TASMANIANS TODAY: SURVIVORS OF THE HOLOCAUST
The above article was written around 1997 and was a part of an ongoing series of articles designed to draw attention to the past and present, the history and the current status, of Black people around the world. In that sense I believe that it is basically a very good article. It should be pointed out though that it was written before my first trip to Australia. More and more, over the the course of time, I have come to find that travel is a wonderful educational experience indeed, and that during the process you often come across information not commonly found in books.
In November 1998 I was invited to speak at the World's Indigenous Peoples Conference in Toowomba, Queensland, Australia. During my Australian sojourn, in addition to the Conference, I was able to travel to several regions and three states. For the first time I interacted with large numbers of Indigenous Australians. The Conference itself was magnificent; a real triumph and one of the great experiences of my life. Even before the Conference convened, however, I was shocked to meet for the initial time a Black man from Tasmania! He was professor Errol West of the University of Southern Queensland. Prof. West (a noted scholar and an excellent poet) and I quckly developed a close bond and soon became good friends. We talked and socialized together a great deal and it became readily apparent that only the full-blood Blacks had perished in the holocaust, and that there were Black people living in Tasmania today. Obviously, this was in stark contrast to all of the major writings on the subject. Prof. West also gave me a very different and contrasting view of Truganini.
My trip to Australia gave me a great deal to think about and a lot to reassess. Eighteen months later I returned to Australia and saw even more of this fascinating country, and I have since learned a great deal more about the history and current conditions of the original people. And the education hasn't stopped. Several months ago I received a series of emails from a Tasmanian sister who expressed tremendous gratitude for the article and encouraged and assured me that the Blacks of Tasmania "are alive and still fighting for our rights and the recognition that we deserve as Indigenous peoples." In 2002 I plan to travel to Tasmania itself. And the education continues.
Also see: HISTORY NOTES: THE UNRELENTING STRUGGLE OF INDIGENOUS AUSTRALIANS and: REFERENCE NOTES: THE DESTRUCTION OF THE ABORIGINAL TASMANIANS - A BIBLIOGRAPHY and: REFERENCE NOTES: THE BLACK PRESENCE IN AUSTRALIA: A SELECTED BIBLIOGRAPHY and: LECTURE NOTES: HEROIC RESISTANCE - THE BLACK PRESENCE IN AUSTRALIA and: REFERENCE NOTES: MORE BOOKS ON ABORIGINAL AUSTRALIA and RACE RELATIONS IN AUSTRALIA, SOURCES PERTAINING TO
Black War: The Extermination of the Tasmanian Aborigines. Clive Turnbull. Cheshire: Lansdowne, 1965.
Race Relations in Colonial Queensland: A History of Exclusion, Exploitation and Extermination. Raymond Evans, Kay Saunders & Kathryn Cronin. St. Lucia: University of Queensland Press, 1988.
Black and White Australians: An Inter-Racial History 1788-1975. Margaret Ann Franklin. South Yarra: Heinemann, 1976.
What Did Happen to the Aborigines of Victoria, Volume 1: The Kurnai of Gippsland. Phillip Pepper and Tess De Araugo. South Yarra: Hyland House, 1985.
Blood on the Wattle: Massacres and Maltreatment of Aboriginal Australians Since 1788. Bruce Elder. Sydney: New Holland, 1998.
Because A White Man'll Never Do It. Kevin Gilbert. Sydney: Angus & Robertson, 1994.
Aborigines in White Australia: A Documentary History of the Attitudes Affecting Official Policy and the Australian Aborigine 1697-1973. Sharman Stone, editor. South Yarra: Heinemann Educational Books, 1974.
Australian Aborigines: The Common Struggle for Humanity. A. Barrie Pittock. Copenhagen: IWGIA, 1979.
Koori: A Will to Win: The Heroic Resistance, Survival and Triumph of Black Australia. London: Angus & Robertson, 1985.
The Global African Community: The African Presence in Asia, Australia and the South Pacific. Runoko Rashidi. Washington, D.C.: Institute of Independent Education, 1994.
Broome, Richard. Aboriginal Australians: Black Responses to White Domination. Sydney: George Allen & Unwin, 1982.
Davis, Jack, Stephen Muecke, Mudrooroo Narogin, and Adam Shoemaker, eds. Paperbark: A Collection of Black Australian Writings. Note by Oodgeroo Noonucal. St. Lucia: University of Queensland Press, 1990.
Elder, Bruce. Blood on the Wattle: Massacres and Maltreatment of Australian Aborigines Since 1788. French Forest: Child, 1988.
Evans, Raymond, Kay Saunders, and Kathryn Cronin. Race Relations in Colonial Queensland: A History of Exclusion, Exploitation and Extermination. St. Lucia: University of Queensland Press, 1988.
Gilbert, Keven. Because a White Man'll Never Do It. Foreword by Mudrooroo. Sydney: Angus & Robertson, 1994.
Miller, James. Koori: A Will to Win. The Heroic Resistance, Survival and Triumph of Black Australia. London: Angus & Robertson, 1985.
Monaghan, David. "Angel of Black Death: The Body-Snatchers." The Bulletin, 12 Nov 1991: 30-38.
Morgan, Sally. My Place: An Aborigine's Stubborn Quest for Her Truth, Heritage, and Origins. New York: Henry Holt, 1988.
Mullard, Chris. Aborigines in Australia Today. Phillip, ACT: National Aboriginal Forum, 1974.
Pepper, Phillip, and Tess De Araugo. What Did Happen to the Aborigines of Victoria. Vol. 1, The Kurnai of Gippsland. Foreword by Stewart Murray. Melbourne: Hyland House, 1985.
Rashidi, Runoko. The Global African Community: The African Presence in Asia, Australia and the South Pacific. Washington, D.C.: Institute for Independent Education, 1994.
Rosser, Bill. Dreamtime Nightmares: Biographies of Aborigines Under the Queensland Aborigine Act. Canberra: Australian Institute of Aboriginal Studies, 1985.
Stevens, Frank S., ed. Racism: The Australian Experience. A Study of Race Prejudice in Australia, 3 Vols. New York: Taplinger, 1972.
Stone, Sharman N., ed. Aborigines in While Australia: A Documentary History of the Attitudes Affecting Official Policy and the Australian Aborigine, 1697-1973. Melbourne: Heinemann Educational Australia, 1974.
Sykes, Roberta B. Black Majority: An Analysis of 21 Years of Black Australian Citizens. Hawthorn: Hudson, 1989.
Victims or Victors? The Story of the Victorian Aborigines Advancement League. South Yarra: Hyland House, 1985.
York, Barry, and Fergus Robinson. Black Resistance: An Introduction to the History of the Aborigines' Struggle Against British Colonialism. Camberwell: Widecope, 1977.
htp
Posts: 3446 | From: U.S. by way of JA by way of Africa | Registered: Jan 2010
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On 19 November 1998 I boarded a Qantas airlines flight from Los Angeles to Sydney, Australia. It was to be my first trip to Australia and the flight lasted fourteen hours. Thirty minutes after going through customs in Sydney I boarded a connecting flight to Darwin, Northern Territory in Australia's `top end.'
My interest in the Black people of Australia (known generally as "Aborigines") began as a young college student in the early 1970s when I chanced to read an article in the Los Angeles Times about the brutal treatment meted out to Australia's aboriginal people by the English convicts, administrators, soldiers and missionaries who landed in Sydney's Botany Bay beginning in January 1788. The article told of scores of Black people tossed to their deaths from high cliffs, and rewards being offered for the scalps of Black men, women and children. All of this and more I was later to confirm for myself. During the nineteenth century, for example, it was not uncommon for Whites to shoot Black people for use as dog food. Indeed, during certain periods of marshal law it was not a crime to murder a Black man. Sometimes an entire family of Black people would be rounded up by Whites. In front of his family the Black man would be handcuffed and then castrated. His head would then be cut off and strung around the widow's neck who would then be brutally gang-raped. Following this the children would be buried in the earth up to their heads. White men would then, with the mother of the children forced to watch, kick and club their heads off. Black people were given blankets infected with small pox virus. Their waterholes were poisoned. They were infected, women and children, with venereal diseases. It was only in 1967 that Aboriginal people in Australia were considered human. Today, the Black people of Australia constitute 1.6% of the total population but Black men make up 70% of the prison population. Black women make up 50% of the total prison population. The life expectancy for a Black man in Australia is forty-five years. The infant mortality rate is among the highest in the world.
PART 2
THE STOLEN GENERATIONS
On Saturday afternoon, November 21 1998 I landed in Darwin at the far top end of Australia's Northern Territory. Darwin, named after Charles Darwin and with a tropical climate, is a city of 70,000 people about 25% of which are Black. Darwin was to be the initial leg of my Australian travel adventure and it was here that I met Aboriginal people in Australia for the first time. The first Black people I saw were sitting in several groups on the floor of the airport's lower level. They were very dark with straight to wavy black hair and paid me not the slightest attention. I was later told that I shouldn't take their seeming indifference personally; that it was "a cultural thing."
I was met at the airport by two Black women whose job was "to take care of all of my needs." These sisters were Ms. Jacqui Katona and Ms. Christine Christophoson--two hard core activists who more or less introduced me to Black Australia. They checked me into a local hotel, fed me and introduced me to their families. After a relatively uneventful night in Darwin on Sunday morning Christine drove me to Jabiru in Kakadu National Park. Kakadu is on Aboriginal land and it was here that I learned that Aboriginal people regard themselves as "the custodians of the land." Kakadu is magnificent country and quite rightly regarded by many Australians as a national treasure. It was also in Jabiru where I became acquainted for the first time with the "Stolen Generations."
The "Stolen Generations" refers to those Black people who were abducted by White Christian missionaries beginning about 1905. By 1911 virtually all Australian states had legislated for the removal of Aboriginal children from their families. Tasmania was the exception, denying it actually had an indigenous population. An estimated 40,000 Aboriginal children, particularly the lighter-skinned children, were removed from their families this century. Under this legislation government officials acting under the authority of the Chief Protector or the relevant Welfare Board had absolute power over Aboriginal children and could simply order the removal of an Aboriginal child from their family without having to prove to a court that the child was neglected. In many cases this legislation permitted the removal of Aboriginal children on the grounds of race alone. The children were taken from their families and brought up largely as slaves in White foster homes and on Christian missions. The dominant ethos was that there was nothing of value in Aboriginal culture--all the value lay in European culture. Once removed the children were forbidden any contact with their families. Removed children were not allowed to know anything about their origins or their Aboriginal heritage. Any violation of this rule was met with severe floggings. Black children were told that their families had died or had abandoned them. Their names were changed. They were forbidden to speak their indigenous languages. They were forced to wear European clothes and adopt European diets. They were actually forced to wear dog tags for purposes of identification and were daily humiliated. Black families lived in constant fear for the children who might be taken away--and constant grief for those already gone.
There is not a single Black family in Australia that has not been affected by the Stolen Generations. In Kakadu I actually met many of the victims of this cruel government policy and heard their stories first hand. Unfortunately this extremely cruel process continues even now.
PART 3
ALICE SPRINGS
At noon on 24 November 1998 I left Darwin and flew to Alice Springs--a relatively small city in the very center of Australia. This part of Australia is sometimes called "the red center" and I must say that the soil itself has a dull orange-reddish hue with sparse vegetation and strange rock formations.
In Alice Springs I was met by representatives of the Central Land Council. They were extremely polite but seemed a little uncertain as to how to act towards me. Very few of the Aboriginal people of Australia that I met on the trip had had much experience with Black folk from America and they knew almost nothing of me personally. They only knew that "an African professor from the United States was coming to Australia and wanted to visit them." The "African professor" will be eternally grateful to them for I must say that it seems that every brother and sister that I met in Australia looked after me, and once they knew something about me became very anxious to talk with me. With two sisters I toured the city of Alice Springs; visiting every institution and facility directly affiliated with or run by Blackfellas.
Perhaps the highlight of my visit to Alice Springs was a tour of a women's Center. The center was for Aboriginal women, many of whom had been the victims of domestic abuse. Domestic abuse is a major problem in Aboriginal communities in Australia and much of it stems from massive alcohol and drug abuse. Such is the degree of despair and hopelessness among them that many Aboriginal people seemed determined to drink and drug themselves into a state of complete of oblivion. In the women's center I was introduced to many sisters, including two women of about fifty, although they looked much older. Life had not been very kind to them. Through a translator I asked them many questions. Questions like where they were born, their life stories, their goals, etc. At first they patiently answered my questions, but all at once they began to ask me all the questions! Basically they wanted to know who I was, what I was, what I wanted and why! It soon became extremely obvious to me that these sisters, who probably spoke for most of the Black people in Australia, knew almost nothing of their brethren in America. So I told them our story. I talked to them at length of mighty African empires and how we came to America. I talked to them of our enslavement and the door of no return. I told them how our families were separated and how our names were changed and how we were forbidden to speak our own languages. These sisters became more and more agitated and told me that they had never heard anything of what I was telling them. It was a very emotional experience. I told them of our struggle for justice and some of our great leaders. I then told the sisters in some detail about lynchings in America and they started to become visibly disturbed. It was at that time that one of them stopped my narrative and questioned me in a sad and plaintive way. She asked, "do you want us to help you?" It was my turn to wipe away the tears.
PART 4
ULURU NATIONAL PARK
Of all the international trips that I've taken, my visit to Australia during November and December 1998 is very hard to top. It was a unique experience. Indeed, there were times on the trip that I momentarily thought that I was in another world. Rather than the primitive people that the Blackfellas are often portrayed to be, they turned out to be for me the most complex and spiritually profound brothers and sisters that I've ever encountered or read about. Truly, Australia was both a delightful and vividly insightful experience. I felt continually that the ancestors were with me--guiding and protecting me, keeping me safe and strong. I prayed regularly and passionately and had few worries along the way.
On 26 November I flew from Alice Springs to Uluru. White folks commonly call Uluru "Ayers Rock." Uluru was one of the places on the trip that was not on my original itinerary but, certainly, I had hoped to travel there from the very beginning and I was prepared for it. Uluru is 273 miles from Alice Springs and I was the last person to board the plane. Naturally, I was the only Black man on the flight. That was the norm for the trip.
After a very short Qantas flight I departed the plane with the hope that someone would be at the airport to meet me. After about an hour sister Joann Wilmot, accompanied by a another lady, swooped me up. It didn't take me long to realize that the brothers and sisters in Australia, apparently like brothers and sisters everywhere, had their own sense of time!
Because I had no idea as to where I would be lodging Joann, who was a kind of Aboriginal director for Uluru and the designated person to escort me around, invited me, if I had no problem with the idea, "to stay with a Blackfella." It sounded good to me. Once again, I was in the company of two Black women. And because I'm a brother who happens to adore African females I was quite content and felt in good company.
Aboriginal people attach great spiritual significance to Uluru. It is one of the world's largest monoliths and rises more than 1,100 feet from the flatness of the surrounding plain. More impressive than its size, though, is its color--a brown to bright glowing red that changes throughout the day. About forty miles from Uluru lies another fascinating rock formation--Kata Tjuta. Indeed, some view Kata Tjuta as even more spectacular than Uluru. Uluru, however, as it was my understanding, is viewed by at least by many Aboriginal people, as the "navel of the world" and the center of creation. Although many visitors climb on top of Uluru I was forbidden to even touch it! With Ms. Wilmot I drove around Uluru and heard "dreamtime stories" of the beginning of the world.
Within a couple hundred yards of Uluru lies an Aboriginal community forbidden to non-Aboriginal people. Signs warning trespassers to stay out were liberally posted. Well, I didn't see myself as a tourist, and quite naturally, it was the place where I most wanted to go, and sister Joann was only too happy to take me there. Indeed, she was the person in charge and was gently deferred to within the community.
Although I ached to be with my brothers and sisters I had found in Kakadu National Park that an Aboriginal community, for me, wasn't always the most pleasant place to be. Squalor, disease and poverty were the rule. I have to say that Black children running around dirty and naked with mucous running down their faces is not a endearing sight but it is reality.
After touring the community Joann invited me to dinner. She asked me if I had any preferences and because I felt lucky to even be there naturally I said, "well sister, anything that you cook will be just fine for me." And then she told me that we'd have kangaroo tail and a whole host of second thoughts ran through my mind! She was determined to treat me to a real delicacy and all the polite excuses from me about her not going to any trouble were fruitless. As a result three large kangaroo tales (which she called "whippers") were purchased from the company store. She even shut down her office a little early--just for me! She then picked up her "skin mother" and granddaughter. We were going to have a feast.
To cook the kangaroo tails she accumulated quite a bit of dry wood and started a fire. As the fire began to blaze the whippers were tossed on top. They were purchased frozen and the fire would warm them up and burn the hair off. Suddenly I was not hungry, but, again, my protests that I didn't want to be the source of so much fuss got me nowhere. After about fifteen minutes on the fire the whippers were taken off the fire and the hair scrapped off with a knife. Where the fire had been a hole was dug, the whippers placed in the hole, the burning wood put on top of the hole and an hour later dinner was ready.
Uluru National Park is wonderful place and the Blackfellas were extremely friendly to me. In July 2000 I plan to take a group of brothers and sisters there to see Uluru and Kata Tjuta and the Aboriginal community. And while I will remain forever grateful to sister Joann Wilmot for her hospitality, the next time the dinner menu will be decidedly different.
POSTSCRIPT
THE BLACKFELLAS DOWN UNDER
The above article was written in December 1998. I had just returned to the United States from Australia and I was still very much floating on something of a cloud. Australia was such a phenomenal experience for me that I was determined to put at least some aspects of the trip down on the record for posterity. As it turned out I only told a part of the story. There was just so much, for varying reasons, that I left out. I wrote four sections covering about two thirds of the trip and then ran completely out of steam.
Since my return from Australia in 1998 I have journeyed to an additional two-dozen countries and in July 2000 returned to Australia in our ongoing global search for African people and African connections. From this experience, I am happy to say, has come a great deal of personal growth and development. And so now, in July 2001, as I prepare for my next big trip and with an extra bit of time on my hands it seems like a golden opportunity to engage in some additional reflection about my Australian adventure, supplement some of this current travel narrative, and add a more fitting conclusion to one of my favorite travel notes.
Besides my life long interest in the Black people of Australia, the major reason for my 1998 travel there was to attend the Second World Indigenous Pathways Conference. This was a historic event sponsored by the Kumbari/Ngurpai Lag Higher Education Center at the University of Southern Queensland, Toowoomba, Australia, and was held from November 28 to December 4, 1998. My participation in the Conference came after having met Dr. Gracelyn Smallwood. Sister Gracelyn, from Queensland, Australia, is a wonderful woman, a good friend, and perhaps the most dedicated and dynamic of all of the Indigenous Australians that I have met. To me, she is the absolute Queen of Australia and she was certainly the driving force behind the Conference.
The Second World Indigenous Pathways Conference was designed to present the opportunity for Indigenous and non-Indigenous people from around the world to engage in discourse about such issues as identity, culture, reconciliation, multiculturalism and social activism. The previous conference, in 1996 (to which I was also invited but could not attend because of a major scheduling conflict), drew together a cross-section of high profile participants from Australia's Indigenous peoples and oppressed groups from around the world.
The theme of the 1998 Conference was "Pathways: Journeys of Discovery within Diversity." The program was dedicated to identifying the topics: what it means to be Australian, civil rights and social activism in the struggle for a socially just society, Indigenous universities, ancient cultures, the identification of oppressed groups, reconciliation, youth perceptions of the struggle for justice, and wisdom and knowledge of the Elders. Rather than call for papers the Conference organizers decided to invite speakers to address the topics and follow the presentations with discussion panels. For reasons that I never did quite fully understand I was invited to speak on the U.S. civil rights movement. For me, however, it didn't really matter so much the topic that I was to speak on but that I was finally getting to go to Australia. That is what I was happy about. All I knew is that a wish of a lifetime was about to be fulfilled.
Well, suffice to say, I gave a very good speech. It was about forty minutes in length and, for once, I did not use any visual aids. As a matter of a fact, the majority of the speech only touched on civil rights in a peripheral manner. I began by talking about the origins of humanity (Black people), the spread of these early Black people around the world (including Australia), the rise of classical African civilizations, the coming of the white man, and the international subjugation and forced dispersal of Black people. Only then did I talk about the U.S. civil rights and Black power movements. I judged the audience and decided that this was what most needed to be heard. I was totally uncompromising, I was extremely well received, and I was most satisfied with my presentation. I believe that you would have been proud.
The Second Pathways Conference was definitely an international event. There were contingents from southern Sudan, Hawaii, New Zealand, Canada, Barbados, and four African-Americans, including myself and the great Dr. Tony Martin from Wellesley College, Massachusetts. One sister came from Drexel University, while another came from Harvard. There was a also a high-powered delegation from South Africa, including Rev. Makhenkesi Stofile (Premier of Eastern Cape Province) and the two youngest sons (Samora and Hlumelo) of Steven Biko. They were all interesting and engaging and a great pleasure to be around. Most interesting, though, were the Blackfellas themselves. I was particularly impressed with brother Murandoo Yanner (a dedicated young activist from northern Queensland), Charles Perkins (a pioneer Black Australian civil rights activist and now an Ancestor), Gary Foley (a Koori activist in Victoria), Errol West (a Black Tasmanian and a noted poet), and, of course, Dr. Smallwood herself. The most poignant part of the Conference were the stories of actual survivors of the Stolen Generations, white supremacy and police brutality. Accounts of Black deaths in police custody in many parts of Australia aroused great anger and fierce indignation. On the other hand, there was hardly a dry eye in the auditorium when the life stories of Stolen Generations survivors were recited and relayed. These were heart-rending narratives of children being torn from Aboriginal parents and never united again. Their stories haunt me still. The Conference, altogether, was an experience never to be forgotten.
Following the Second World Indigenous Pathways Conference I left Queensland and journeyed south to New South Wales to the cities of Sydney and Canberra. The Sydney visit was highlighted by multiple visits to Redfern--the downtrodden but heroic Black community sometimes called the "Harlem of Australia." In Canberra I visited the Aboriginal Embassy and paid more respect to the traditional owners of the land. In both cases I was guided and accompanied by another impressive sister--Isabel Coe. Sister Isabel (like Dr. Smallwood and several of the women that I met in Australia) is a wonderful and dedicated Aboriginal activist. Being in the presence of these sisters was a great honor and I shall never forget their warmth, dedication, commitment and hospitality.
I left Australia with the distinct impression that the Blackfellas were a very special people, a highly spiritual people and real survivors of the storm. In spite of all the setbacks that they have suffered at the hands of Europeans they refuse to accept the concept of final defeat. They believe that they have been fighting an unrelenting war of survival for more than two centuries against the white invaders of the land down under. I will never forget a conversation I had towards the end of my trip with several sisters and brothers in Redfern. I was a real curiosity and a bona fide celebrity during my visit, and was treated with great respect and courtesy. I asked them what they knew of Black folk outside of Australia. They told me that most of their knowledge of African-Americans was derived via the television. They said that they saw us on TV or from afar but most of them had never had the opportunity to actually interact with one close up and intimate. We all learned a lot from the interaction and enjoyed the opportunity. At one point I halted the conversation and told them that I did not believe that Africans in America had been captured and enslaved and taken away from home for no reason. I told them that I believe that we have a special mission and purpose. I then paused and looked around the room and asked them collectively "do you believe that you a have a mission and destiny in life" "Yes," they told me, "to have one last dust up with the white man to get our land back." I couldn't help but let go a broad smile of great satisfaction. These, indeed, were truly my sisters and brothers.
hmmm....if this Original Australian is not a Black Person...then...I wonder....if this gentleman was living back in Jim Crow Amerikkka...would he be required to sit at the back of the bus, or allowed to sit where he pleases...from which water fountain would he have been required to drink from, I wonder, "white" or "colored"....
matter of fact, 40 years ago, would he even have been considered a HUEman being by 'White' Australians......
I'm just wondering.....
htp
Posts: 3446 | From: U.S. by way of JA by way of Africa | Registered: Jan 2010
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posted
^Typical Negro still living in American slavery era, applying pseudo science; one drop rule, full features exclusive to Negroes, etc... Just a typical Negro, still living in slavery social era. Get w/the times buddy. Update your science, sir.
Posts: 2025 | Registered: Dec 2009
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^^Why do you think Oceanic populations resemble Africans in the first place? Is it a coincidence or is this because they came from Africa, and continued to reside in tropical environments like those found in Africa where they originally came from?
Why do you think Oceanic populations have been shown out of all non Africans to resemble early anatomical modern humans from Africa, Eurasia etc... 25kya and beyond?
Do Australian aborigines carry genetic lineages that are associated with OOA, which in turn descends from African L3 and CT?
quote:^Do tell us the genetic marker these Aboriginals share w/the Negro.
You mean indigenous Africans and not "Negro" how about you update your pseudoscience, you clown.
Now, let's clear this up. All Australian lineages are confirmed to fall within the mitochondrial founder branches M and N and the Y chromosomal founders C and F, which are associated with the exodus of modern humans from Africa 60–80,000 years ago. Australian aborigines carry Mtdna hg's M and N which both derive from African L3. All non African mtdna haplogroups found outside of Africa derive from these two haps M and N which as noted derive from African L3. Oceanic's Y chromosomes are as noted C and F whose ancestor is CF in turn whose ancestor is CT marked by the M-168 mutation, which all haplogroups except for A and B, carry.
Cavalli-Sforza: Genes, Culture, and Human Evolution. Pg 187.
quote: ..."In other words, all non-Africans carry M168. Of course, Africans carrying the M168 mutation today are the descendants of the African subpopulation from which the migrants originated.... Thus, the Australian/Eurasian Adam (the ancestor of all non-Africans) was an East African Man."
Point is, Australians are representative of one of the oldest populations outside of Africa, and where did they first come from to begin with again? Yup Africa. How do we know? Through genetic markers that these Oceanic carry shows they are directly descended from African haps, and through cranio-facial and skeletal remains which match with the African record of anatomically modern humans going back 10's of thousands of years.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
^Aboriginals are NOT Africans, clown. And of course you know this, which explains why you danced around the issue.
Posts: 2025 | Registered: Dec 2009
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Taken from another thread dealing with the same thing...
quote: of course note that Europeans especially Greeks (and other southwestern Europeans have plenty of recent (from Neolithic onwards) African admixture, yet these individuals (Greeks) consider themselves to be "white" pure European Mediterraneans!
Funny how Euronuts don't want to deal with these facts but yet are quick to point to East Africans and say they are mixed.
Address the fact that Europeans are closest genetically to Africans whereas original OOA populations descendants I.e, Oceanians appear furthest away genetically from Africa, if Oceanians and Europeans are part of the same non-African OOA population structure, then Europeans should be as distant genetically from Africans, as Oceanians are. If this is not due to post OOA Neolithic migrations into Europe from Africa, then what is it?
Take note of my clarification to poster Osirion on European populations clustering closer to Africans genetically than Oceanic's..
quote: Originally posted by MindoverMatter718: quote:
quote: Originally posted by osirion: Picture spamming is meaningless. Where is the genetic evidence? I don't see any reports supporting a connection with African haplogroups!
The Andaman Islanders also look like us Black Africans but they don't have any of our yChromosome or mtDNA. On the other hand, Greeks, who only look like some of us, do have a downstream version of a very prevalent sub-Saharan African marker. So I hope you guys aren't try to connect phenotype with relatedness.
Where is the genetic evidence supporting a connection between Africans (Nubians or any other Saharan Africans)?
Allow me to clear this European clustering closer to Africans than Oceanic's thing up.
Oceanics cluster genetically with mainland Asia since Oceanic's carry ancestral genes which became Asian after migrating OOA (out of Africa).
Oceanic's then cluster with Africans phenotypically because Africa is the homeland of anatomically modern humans and hence certain Africans are ancestral to Oceanic's, Asians, and Europeans alike!
Oceanic's cluster phenotypically with Africans because after migrating out of Africa along the coast of south Asia, they (Oceanic's) continued to reside in a tropical environment and maintained said tropical features as noted resembling the earliest modern humans 60kya from Africa.
Early Asians, Europeans etc...all resembled Africans as do Oceanic's today, there would not have been much of a difference in the tropical phenotype amongst early humans who left Africa (as noted amongst Oceanic's) if they (early humans) didn't move north, in all actuality if Europeans hadn't received post OOA African genetic admixture then Europeans, like other Asians and Oceanic's, would be further away genetically.
The only reason Europeans cluster closer to Africans than Oceanic's or other Asians is because Europeans received this post OOA African admixture.
This is yet another reason the categorization of "races" according to phenotype is imbeclic, it's also like saying the kids are giving the parents their genetic and cranio-facial variation.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: ^Aboriginals are NOT Africans, clown. And of course you know this, which explains why you danced around the issue.
Uhh never said they were Africans. Of course they're not Africans anymore since they lived outside of Africa for 10's of thousands of years, but the reason they look the way they do is because they come from Africa, and continued to reside in an environment similar to Africa which is the point, and their Mtdna and Y chromosomal lineages are directly descended from African CT and L3. As noted, these Oceanic populations are shown out of all non Africans to resemble closest to early anatomically modern humans who were from where? Yup AFRICA!! Learn this.
You need to stop squirming like you always do, and instead address the following head on...
quote:Originally posted by MindoverMatter718: ^^Why do you think Oceanic populations resemble Africans in the first place? Is it a coincidence or is this because they came from Africa, and continued to reside in tropical environments like those found in Africa where they originally came from?
Why do you think Oceanic populations have been shown out of all non Africans to resemble early anatomical modern humans from Africa, Eurasia etc... 25kya and beyond?
Do Australian aborigines carry genetic lineages that are associated with OOA, which in turn descends from African L3 and CT?
quote:^Do tell us the genetic marker these Aboriginals share w/the Negro.
You mean indigenous Africans and not "Negro" how about you update your pseudoscience, you clown.
Now, let's clear this up. All Australian lineages are confirmed to fall within the mitochondrial founder branches M and N and the Y chromosomal founders C and F, which are associated with the exodus of modern humans from Africa 60–80,000 years ago. Australian aborigines carry Mtdna hg's M and N which both derive from African L3. All non African mtdna haplogroups found outside of Africa derive from these two haps M and N which as noted derive from African L3. Oceanic's Y chromosomes are as noted C and F whose ancestor is CF in turn whose ancestor is CT marked by the M-168 mutation, which all haplogroups except for A and B, carry.
Cavalli-Sforza: Genes, Culture, and Human Evolution. Pg 187.
quote: ..."In other words, all non-Africans carry M168. Of course, Africans carrying the M168 mutation today are the descendants of the African subpopulation from which the migrants originated.... Thus, the Australian/Eurasian Adam (the ancestor of all non-Africans) was an East African Man."
Point is, Australians are representative of one of the oldest populations outside of Africa, and where did they first come from to begin with again? Yup Africa. How do we know? Through genetic markers that these Oceanic carry shows they are directly descended from African haps, and through cranio-facial and skeletal remains which match with the African record of anatomically modern humans going back 10's of thousands of years.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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Your problem is that all you do is post with a pre-conceived attitude towards what you believe from others who actually have hate for Africans. You fail to do your own research hence always fall flat on your face when the threads you open up are challenged. Just another one of those circumstances right here in this thread.
P.s. I just love when Euronuts say Australian aborigines adapted their features because they moved into the tropics, all the while forgetting that they were coming from the tropics of Africa to begin with and that Australian aboriginals exhibit cranio-facial features that are associated with early anatomically modern humans from Africa 30, 40, 50kya and beyond. Despite the fact that Oceanics carry direct derived genetic lineages from African L3 and CT yet still deny the apparent connection. Its hilarious the lengths these idiots will go to disconnect everything from Africa despite all the evidence to the contrary of their beliefs. Can you say deluded with a deep-rooted hate for Africans?
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
This is what I'm saying, not claiming, as its been confirmed by numerous anthropological studies. Which is that all early anatomically modern humans resembled modern tropical peoples such as Africans and Oceanic populations.
Early Europeans still resembled modern tropical peoples -> some resemble modern Australian and Africans, more than modern Europeans-- [C. Stringer, R. McKie 1996]
Only difference is these earlier humans were more robust and archaic in a few features such as their eyebrow ridges and postcranial features.
Anthropologist Chris Stringer notes the following to be a good representative reconstruction of the early modern human known as Herto...google Herto and see how old it is.
Watch this video with Chris Stringer and listen closely, you might learn something...
posted
^Nigga, you is smoking some good shyt! No scientist can give you a definitive depiction of the earliest anatomical human. When the pre humans shed their fur, their skin was white. It of course had to adapt to the environment. How many years between the shedding of the fur and becoming a noticably anatomical human, sir? And how many years before the white skin adapted and became dark? And when did the ancestors of the Aboriginals leave the African continent and arrive in Australia?
Entertain me now.
-------------------- Will destroy all Black Lies Posts: 2025 | Registered: Dec 2009
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LOL, this GIGANTIC must be David Duke's court JESTER. The boy doesn't have an original thought in his entire empty skull, is as dumb as a brick, and reminds me of a cross between Phillis Diller and Mr. Bean. The boy is as dumb as Lioness and makes even the KKK look like a gang of rocket scientists. Why do you cats even bother responding to his brain dead posts?
Posts: 2403 | Registered: Feb 2010
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^Yall niggas kill me w/this thought process that because humans arose OOA it must mean the earliest humans looked like the Negro. Yall simply amazing.
Posts: 2025 | Registered: Dec 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: ^Nigga, you is smoking some good shyt! No scientist can give you a definitive depiction of the earliest anatomical human.
Watch the video link I gave you dunce, Chris Stringer notes the reconstruction to be a pretty good representative of what Herto would've looked like the basic shape of the face.
quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: When the pre humans shed their fur, their skin was white.
Actually, this is just an assumption since other primates have light pinkish skin under their fur, which doesnt matter because...
By 1.2 million years ago, all people having descendants today had exactly the receptor protein of today's Africans; their skin was dark (Black), and the intense sun *killed off the progeny with any lighter(whiter) skin* that resulted from mutational variation in the receptor protein- - (Rogers 2004:107).
quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: It of course had to adapt to the environment.
Of course which means if they were pinkish under their fur they wouldve adapted darker skin
quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: How many years between the shedding of the fur and becoming a noticably anatomical human, sir?
Well ma'am our ancestors lost their fur around 1.2 million years ago with dark skin evolving pari passu, and the first noticeably anatomically modern human shows up in the fossil record 200kya, you do the math.
quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: And how many years before the white skin adapted and became dark?
Dark skin evolved pari passu with the loss of body hair and was the original state for the genus Homo. Melanin pigmentation is adaptive and has been maintained by natural selection.--Nina Jablonski
quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: And when did the ancestors of the Aboriginals leave the African continent and arrive in Australia?
Around 60-80kya according to the genetic and fossil record.
quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: Entertain me now.
You're the entertainment, you give others a chance to laugh at your stupidity and learn from it, if not for yourself.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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^You wont get any paleontologist to butress your position, buddy. Nevertheless, you are entertaining. Only an idiot would claim that proto-humans looked Negro.
-------------------- Will destroy all Black Lies Posts: 2025 | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
^^Sorry dunce, that is a word you use, not me, "Negro" in bio-anthropological science is outdated. Funny, you tell others to become more up to date with their science yet you still go around using outdated racial concepts. Poor fool, reduced to one liners with worthless ad hominem insults as usual, showing your frustration. Lol.
P.s. As always mentioned time and again, your whole argument rests relying on outdated 19th century racial categories that bio-anthropology has moved well beyond. If you'd step into the new day and age, you'd realize what an ass you've made of yourself over the last year or so.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
^I prefer to use "Negro" mr. Clown, because it is EXTREMELY specific. It cannot be used by the loons the way "Black" is used to claim any non-white.
Posts: 2025 | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
You prefer to use "Negro" because without it you wouldn't know what else to say. You don't know how to debate with up to date sources, your simpleminded ass can not grasp the fact that these racial categories that you fling around (which you can not even define) are completely flawed and outdated. lol.
quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: It cannot be used by the loons the way "Black" is used to claim any non-white.
You're kind of slow huh? If we were to go by this, then Oceanic's who you're arguing aren't related to "black Africans" whom you consider "Negro" would be "Negro", many N. east Asians would be considered "Negro", even many Europeans etc...
Ok, if you have no counters to what I posted since my arrival in this thread, and instead you're going to continue to throw ad hominems and use outdated concepts, I'll leave it alone. As it has already been shown when you're challenged you become reduced to simple one liner ad hominems.
You're dismissed!! Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
^No, mr Clown. The term is still in use (Forensic anthropology) and, to re-iterate, I prefer it because, frankly, I like to corner Afrocentric arses.
Class is no longer in session. YOU ARE DISMISSED.
Posts: 2025 | Registered: Dec 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Gigantic: ^No, mr Clown. The term is still in use (Forensic anthropology) and, to re-iterate, I prefer it because, frankly, I like to corner Afrocentric arses.
Lol, you're always the one who ends up looking like a fool, bio-anthropology does not use these terms which are totally flawed and misleading, nobody here is discussing forensic anthropology. We already debated this before and you disappeared out of the thread. LOL
From Encyclopedia of the Archaeology of Ancient Egypt;
quote:Two opposing theories for the origin of Dynastic Egyptians dominated scholarly debate over the last century: whether the ancient Egyptians were black Africans (historically referred to as Negroid) originating biologically and culturally in Saharo-Tropical Africa, or whether they originated as a Dynastic Race in the Mediterranean or western Asian regions (people historically categorized as White, or Caucasoid). Contemporary physical anthropologists recognize, however that race is not a useful biological concept when applied to humans. Although many people believe they can distinguish "races" on the basis of skin color, more of the variation in human genetic makeup can be attributed to differences between these so-called races than between them. Furthermore, the observable and unobservable (to the eye) physical variation is so great and complex that there are no criteria that can satisfactorily segregate all individuals into one race or another..[...]Unlike the classic typological approach, which interprets variation in physical form as resulting only from admixture of races, contemporary approaches to understanding variation takes into account genetic and physiological adaptations to local and regional environmental factors, such as the intensity of ultraviolet radiation, ambient temperature and humidity. Conceptually, biological affinity express a continuum of relationship that reflects genetic mixing (gene flow) from different local and regional areas in antiquity in addition to evolutionary factors, such as natural selection and genetic drift..[....]There is now a sufficient body of evidence from modern studies of skeletal remains to indicate that the ancient Egyptians, especially southern Egyptians, exhibited physical characteristics that are within the range of variation for ancient and modern indigenous peoples of the Sahara and tropical Africa. In general, the inhabitants of Upper Egypt and Nubia had the greatest biological affinity to people of the Sahara and more southerly areas..[...] Any interpretation of the biological affinities of the ancient Egyptians must be placed in the context of hypothesis informed by the archaeological, linguistic, geographic or other data. In this context the physical anthropological evidence indicates that the early Nile Valley populations can be identified as part of an African lineage, but exhibiting local variation. This variation represents the short and long term effects of evolutionary forces, such as gene flow, genetic drift, and natural selection influenced by culture and geography
Read the above, and then gracefully bow it in defeat...yet again. LOL
Repeat this to yourself over and over till you get it right...
"Contemporary physical anthropologists recognize, however that race is not a useful biological concept when applied to humans."Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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Similarly, forensic anthropologists draw on highly heritable morphological features of human remains e.g. cranial measurements to aid in the identification of the body, including in terms of race. In a recent article anthropologist Norman Sauer asked, if races don't exist, why are forensic anthropologists so good at identifying them? Sauer observed that the use of 19th century racial categories is widespread among forensic anthropologists:
In many cases there is little doubt that an individual belonged to the Negro, Caucasian, or Mongoloid racial stock.
Thus the forensic anthropologist uses the term race in the very broad sense to differentiate what are commonly known as white, black and yellow racial stocks.
In estimating race forensically, we prefer to determine if the skeleton is Negroid, or Non-Negroid. If findings favor Non-Negroid, then further study is necessary to rule out Mongoloid.
According to Sauer, The assessment of these categories is based upon copious amounts of research on the relationship between biological characteristics of the living and their skeletons. Nevertheless, he says he agrees with other anthropologists that race is not a valid biological taxonomic category, and that races are socially constructed. He argued there is nevertheless a strong relationship between the phenotypic features forensic anthropologists base their identifications on, and popular racial categories. Thus, he argued, forensic anthropologists apply a racial label to human remains because their analysis of physical morphology enables them to predict that when the person was alive, a particular racial label would have been applied to them. __________________
I had this debate before and no doubt won. There are two schools of thought in anthropology, those who adhere to the racial taxonomy and those who, for obvious socio-political reasons, reject it. Nonetheless, the term is still in USE and STILL VALID.
posted
It won't work because there are different racial stocks on the African continent. As an example, the people of north Africa are disimilar to those found in central Africa. There needs to be a distinction made between these groups. Unlike China or Japan, Africa is not homogenous.
quote:Originally posted by the lioness: just replace the word"negro" with "African"
quote:Originally posted by the lioness: just replace the word"negro" with "African"
Nope, if all you're doing is replacing one word for the other while having the same meaning, it's still incorrect. As "Negro" implies a certain cranio-facial phenotypical characteristic that many indigenous Africans do not fit.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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quote:Originally posted by the lioness: just replace the word"negro" with "African"
Nope, if all you're doing is replacing one word for the other while having the same meaning, it's still incorrect. As "Negro" implies a certain cranio-facial phenotypical characteristic that many indigenous Africans do not fit.
is an indigenous African limited to a certain boundary limit of skin lightness?
Posts: 42930 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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posted
You are wasting your time w/these clowns. They have to avoid using terms that can denote the different variations on the continent. As longs as multiple terms exist to denote Africa's people, they no longer have their veiled "Black" racial hold on all Africa.
quote:Originally posted by the lioness: s an indigenous African limited to a certain boundary limit of skin lightness?
quote:Originally posted by Confirming Truth: They have to avoid using terms that can denote the different variations on the continent.
Another outdated fool. There are variations amongst the African continent, differing climates, environments etc... lead to this, but there are also populations like coastal north Africans who have received non African gene flow. Is this part of the variation that you thought was indigenous?
As explained to "the lioness" elsewhere, wherein she ran away...
quote:Originally posted by MindoverMatter718: ^^That has already been explained to you countless times, you have to be one of the most incompetent posters on this board, and now again for the millionth and one time it's because genetically these populations in coastal north Africa show this non African admixture, not only noted uni-parentally, but also given the fact.....
The frequency of the SLC24A5 111*A allele outside of Europe is largely accounted for by high frequencies in geographically proximate populations in northern Africa , the Middle East, and Pakistan (ranging from 62% to 100%).--Norton, Kittles et. al
Do you think this is incorrect? If so, why? Elaborate.
quote:The Complex and Diversified Mitochondrial Gene Pool of Berber Populations
C. Coudray1 , A. Olivieri2, A. Achilli2,3, M. Pala2, M. Melhaoui4, M. Cherkaoui5, F. El-Chennawi6, M. Kossmann7, A. Torroni2 and J. M. Dugoujon1
Summary
The mitochondrial DNA variation of 295 Berber-speakers from Morocco (Asni, Bouhria and Figuig) and the Egyptian oasis of Siwa was evaluated by sequencing a portion of the control region (including HVS-I and part of HVS-II) and surveying haplogroup-specific coding region markers. Our findings show that the Berber mitochondrial pool is characterized by an overall high frequency of Western Eurasian haplogroups, a somehow lower frequency of sub-Saharan L lineages, and a significant (but differential) presence of North African haplogroups U6 and M1, thus occupying an intermediate position between European and sub-Saharan populations in PCA analysis. A clear and significant genetic differentiation between the Berbers from Maghreb and Egyptian Berbers was also observed. The first are related to European populations as shown by haplogroup H1 and V frequencies, whereas the latter share more affinities with East African and Nile Valley populations as indicated by the high frequency of M1 and the presence of L0a1, L3i, L4*, and L4b2 lineages. Moreover, haplogroup U6 was not observed in Siwa. We conclude that the origins and maternal diversity of Berber populations are old and complex, and these communities bear genetic characteristics resulting from various events of gene flow with surrounding and migrating populations.
This is why I told you, if ancient Egyptians were an admixed population like you believe, as we know coastal north Africans are, we would see it in their limb proportions.
But instead what do we note from their limb proportions? Be honest here.
We note that the ancient Egyptians were a tropically adapted people, not intermediate, and their brachial and crural indices show that the distal segments of each limb are longer relative to the proximal segments than in many “African” populations(data from Aiello and Dean, 1990).
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
When it comes to African civilizations and foreign gene flow, YES, Negro. At the end of the day, what is most important is history, not the primitive era.
quote:Originally posted by MindoverMatter718: Another outdated fool. There are variations amongst the African continent, differing climates, environments etc... lead to this, but there are also populations like coastal north Africans who have received non African gene flow. Is this part of the variation that you thought was indigenous?
quote:Originally posted by Confirming Truth: When it comes to African civilizations and foreign gene flow, YES, Negro. At the end of the day, what is most important is history, not the primitive era.
What the hell does what you rambled above about foreign gene flow to start African civilizations have to do with you proving your statement of;
They have to avoid using terms that can denote the different variations on the continent.--confirming truth
Which was in response to "the lion" about me using indigenous African denoted by genetics?
You fool, lets get that evidence for these different names of variations on the African continent, will you? Of course I expect your sources to be up to date.
Anyway, as I've said, another outdated fool, your "gene flow" for African civilizations went out the window with the "Dynastic Race Theory" a long time ago.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
I was responding to your statement: "but there are also populations like coastal north Africans who have received non African gene flow. Is this part of the variation that you thought was indigenous?"
Do you follow?
quote:Originally posted by MindoverMatter718: What the hell does what you rambled above about foreign gene flow to start African civilizations have to do with you proving your statement of;
They have to avoid using terms that can denote the different variations on the continent.--confirming truth
quote:Originally posted by Confirming Truth: I was responding to your statement: "but there are also populations like coastal north Africans who have received non African gene flow. Is this part of the variation that you thought was indigenous?"
Do you follow?
Oh of course, but I didn't think you were that stupid to imply that foreign gene flow was somehow indigenous. Lol
How does this from you
When it comes to African civilizations and foreign gene flow, YES, Negro.--confirmed dunce
Make sense as an answer to this from me..
but there are also populations like coastal north Africans who have received non African gene flow. Is this part of the variation that you thought was indigenous?
Basically what I asked you was if you thought the populations showing non African gene flow were part of the indigenous African variation, you answer with a YES...
When it comes to African civilizations and foreign gene flow, YES, Negro.-confirmed dunce
What an nitwit you are, Lol.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
^No clown. The point was to show you that, when it comes to history and ancient civilization, indigenous does not necessarily play a major role. Case in point, Egypt.
Posts: 1340 | Registered: Apr 2010
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posted
^^Nice try, I'll let you squirm out of your dunce corner for now.
So exactly where is your evidence that indigenous Africans didn't play a major role in ancient Egypt? I'll wait.
In the meantime, you can read the following for clarification on what the evidence from skeletal remains, archaeological cultural etc.. tells us about the A.E.'S...
Encyclopedia of the Archaeology of Ancient Egypt;
quote:Two opposing theories for the origin of Dynastic Egyptians dominated scholarly debate over the last century: whether the ancient Egyptians were black Africans (historically referred to as Negroid) originating biologically and culturally in ****Saharo-Tropical Africa****, or whether they originated as a Dynastic Race in the Mediterranean or western Asian regions (people historically categorized as White, or Caucasoid). Contemporary physical anthropologists recognize, however that race is not a useful biological concept when applied to humans. Although many people believe they can distinguish "races" on the basis of skin color, more of the variation in human genetic makeup can be attributed to differences between these so-called races than between them. Furthermore, the observable and unobservable (to the eye) physical variation is so great and complex that there are no criteria that can satisfactorily segregate all individuals into one race or another..[...]Unlike the classic typological approach, which interprets variation in physical form as resulting only from admixture of races, contemporary approaches to understanding variation takes into account genetic and physiological adaptations to local and regional environmental factors, such as the intensity of ultraviolet radiation, ambient temperature and humidity. Conceptually, biological affinity express a continuum of relationship that reflects genetic mixing (gene flow) from different local and regional areas in antiquity in addition to evolutionary factors, such as natural selection and genetic drift..[....] There is now a sufficient body of evidence from modern studies of skeletal remains to indicate that the ancient Egyptians, especially southern Egyptians, exhibited physical characteristics that are within the range of variation for ancient and modern indigenous peoples of the ***Sahara and tropical Africa.*** In general, the inhabitants of Upper Egypt and Nubia had the greatest biological affinity to people of the Sahara and more southerly areas..[...] Any interpretation of the biological affinities of the ancient Egyptians must be placed in the context of hypothesis informed by the archaeological, linguistic, geographic or other data. In this context the physical anthropological evidence indicates that the early Nile Valley populations can be identified as part of an African lineage, but exhibiting local variation. This variation represents the short and long term effects of evolutionary forces, such as gene flow, genetic drift, and natural selection influenced by culture and geography
^^Sorry kid, no evidence for that other opposing theory of a Dynastic Race in the Mediterranean or western Asian regions (people historically categorized as White, or Caucasoid). Instead all evidence as noted above points to an origin in Saharo Tropical Africa...
"whether the ancient Egyptians were black Africans (historically referred to as Negroid) originating biologically and culturally in ****Saharo-Tropical Africa****"
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
^Maybe I should use the word "Aboriginal" A population may not be aboriginal but indigenous. I will have to look that up and perhaps tweak my missive.
Posts: 1340 | Registered: Apr 2010
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posted
Nigga, I done went through this nonsense about ancient Egypt being Black and locally developed by indigenous blacks. Too much scholarship to prove otherwise. I am not going to rehash those arguments. You can consult the archive, LOSER.
quote:Originally posted by MindoverMatter718: Nice try, I'll let you squirm out of your dunce corner for now.
So exactly where is your evidence that indigenous Africans didn't play a major role in ancient Egypt? I'll wait.
In the meantime, you can read the following for clarification on what the evidence from skeletal remains, culture etc.. tells us about the A.E.'S...
posted
Ok, I've had enough of intellectually whooping this jackass under two of his monikers today, come back maybe tomorrow for more whoopin' everyone...
quote:Originally posted by confirmed dunce: duhhhhhh
.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
Only in your wet dreams where you jizz all over yourself can you ever put an intellectual whooping on me. Now go clean your soiled hands, perv.
quote:Originally posted by MindoverMatter718: Ok, I've had enough of intellectually whooping your jackass under two of your monikers today come back maybe tomorrow for more whoopin'...
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duhhhhhh
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