Students Protest in London..
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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The corrupt English Government is planning on tripling Tuition to 14000 pounds for people trying to better themselves.
The system is so corrupt that it's trying to screw over the Youth that will be the future of England.
Something needs to be done about the negative things that the government does. The mass(People) must rally together to protect their rights, if not, then the government will take away more of our rights and claim it's "Better" this way.
Peace
Posts: 9651 | From: Reace and Love City. | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
well, the medicine is hard. the liberal Nanny state has failed. The UK and others are trying to survive. California and New York will be close behind. We will either stop spending on these wild programs, of all kinds, right and left, or we will drop standard of living. There is no free lunch.
my dad got an engineering degree and worked two jobs to get it. We are going to have to return to toughness as a virtue. There is no free lunch. The crazy fed is blowing more worthless money into an already crippled economy....god help us all.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
Soo what are you gonna do? you still in collage right?..I think Americans take it for granted that it has to be this way and so accept anything thrown at them,while the sixties generation wasn't mine the current generation needs to revisit their activism and passion.
Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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posted
Hammer my dad got an engineering degree and worked two jobs to get it. We are going to have to return to toughness as a virtue. There is no free lunch. The crazy fed is blowing more worthless money into an already crippled economy....god help us all.
I bet your dad had the GI bill or something like it..and what do you mean Nanny state people pay into a system to get to collage..so it was never free,just like health care,social security etc,,It's people's money that goes into all that.
Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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posted
No Brada, the fog has lifted. All this stuff is falling apart and we still have people lost in dream land. Sooner or later the government runs out of spending other peoples money. Almost half of all americans pay no taxes at all to support any of the things you mentioned. My school is in terrible economic shape as are most of the rest.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
Hammer, Clearly, you don't have your dad's brains. Intelligent thinking will tell you that taxes are paid for almost every market transaction. There are sales taxes on almost every item and most business transactions--buying a house, a vehicle, etc.
The truth is that the costs for education are very negligible all over Europe--including Europe's most economically dynamic societies. Germany, Sweden, Finland, Norway, Holland all come to mind.
The point is that the silly Tory party in Britain--all silly, cultural descendants of effete feudal types who still are outrageously idle(the Queen and all her besotted offspring and entourage)as they indulge in polo and silly all-year-round-parties--is stupidly trying to ape their Anglo-Saxon cousins across the Atlantic. If you send the Queen out to pasture and chop off her free-meals budget education could be funded as before--next to nothing in fee payments.
And Hammer, don't forget that the big corporations hardly pay taxes. They hire their retainer lawyers to do the job. Remember what Warren Buffet said: he pays less taxes proportionally than his secretary.So get your head out of the ground Hammer and learn to think clearly and sensibly.
Posts: 5492 | Registered: Nov 2004
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posted
lamin, there is no money. Let me repeat THERE IS NO MONEY. National and other government institutions are going broke. Yes there are taxes but you cannot continue to spend more than you take in at these levels and survive.
You people on the left think this is all funny money. That we can just spend and send and spend and make money out of thin air.
Lamin, In the United states the upper classes are the ONLY people paying taxes. the lower 47% pay none, nada zero.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
If you fill out a yearly IRS tax return form and deductions are taken from your paycheck, you are paying taxes. If you aren't paying your share of taxes [which applies to *all* workers] and the IRS is not after you, then you must have somehow escaped their radar.
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
Where are your objective sources for this figure. Do they include working folks? Do these workers have social security numbers? If yes, that this so-called [and yet to be substantiated] "47%" are working folks, and that they have social security numbers, then tell me how this considerable number of folks have gotten away with not paying taxes, and retribution from the IRS.
-------------------- The Complete Picture of the Past tells Us what Not to Repeat Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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"The point is that the silly Tory party in Britain--all silly, cultural descendants of effete feudal types who still are outrageously idle(the Queen and all her besotted offspring and entourage)as they indulge in polo and silly all-year-round-parties--is stupidly trying to ape their Anglo-Saxon cousins across the Atlantic. "
obama is related to david cameron and both are related to the queen, its these bluebloods that are destroying the world.
more riots to come
Posts: 142 | From: england sw | Registered: Aug 2010
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posted
bluebloods? again viola...there is no money
research the topic explorer 47 % do not pay. In fact Explorer if you do not work, file a tax form you get a check even though you obviously paid no taxes. There are many sites on the net where you can find these figures.
The fact is ...we are broke. In 2011 the big issue is going to be that California is going bankrupt. They are going to ask the Federal governemt to bail them out and the republican House is going to turn them down.
These kids can riot all they want, there is no money.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
That is how you learn Exlorer, do the research yourself. On the other had if you even bother to watch American news you know full well the wealthy here pay the vast majority of the taxes.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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In fact Explorer if you do not work, file a tax form you get a check even though you obviously paid no taxes.
This is not a fact, it's bs.
You don't get a free check from the government, and by that, I'm hoping you mean some kind of unemployment benefit. The government doesn't hand out "free" money, without getting full documentation on work history, social security number, residence status, and obviously the reason you should be permitted to get this check. Where are you getting your info from; it certainly isn't from this planet.
PS: Your claim is even absurd for the unknowing [who is mentally alert] at face value, because how do you file a tax return form in the first place, if you aren't paying taxes?
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
The IRS has a form that is filed by those who do not pay taxes, they get a check in return. Republicans have trid to get rid of it for years. You need to read this stuff before you start yelling and screaming.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
You haven't documented your spurious "47 %" lower class non-taxpayers figure. You speak of government accepting tax return forms that does not involve tax paying, and instead that government says, oh well, here is a free check. Obviously you must be clueless about what this form is, because you call it a tax form...when it doesn't involve any tax payment.
-------------------- The Complete Picture of the Past tells Us what Not to Repeat Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
Income Group ---- Tax Share Top 1 percent ---- 33.7 percent Top 5 percent ---- 53.8 percent Top 10 percent ---- 65.7 percent Top 25 percent ---- 83.9 percent Top 50 percent ---- 96.5 percent These are from a Canadian article, the numbers come from the US Government. I have a son and a daughter that support Obama and they only paid in Social security last year. They like many Americans paid no income tax, although they think they do. The bush tax cut made the rich pay a larger share of the total even though the rate was reduced. Because their income rose. Lower 50% pays 3.5%. People don't want to get confused with the facts after their mind is made up. The tax burden was misrepresented by Kerry. It wasn't true when he said it and it's not true when Obama says it. Notice how Obama won't give a straight answer about the taxes of the rich now. They will put their money where he can't touch it and the stock market and job creation will get worse then ever. The rich do pay taxes and if you were rich you would know it.
posted
Apparently not, judging from your posts. How the heck will the IRS send one free money in return as a "tax return", when the person they are supposed to be sending it to doesn't pay any taxes? Isn't it the IRS' business to catch people who don't pay their share of taxes, and yet, here you are telling me, that they essentially reward people for not paying taxes. Come on, don't tell me that is not an attempt at comedy on your part.
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
In other words Explorer the top 50% pay 96% of the taxes in America. The lower classes have not paid taxes here in years but they keep wanting more and more and more. The fact is the well is now dry.
These numbers are correct.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
That piece from some forum is not substitute for the source you were pressed to produce. On every paycheck, if you have ever worked in your life, you are informed of both federal and state tax withheld. Therefore, people who can read, know that they are paying their share. It is not just social security. Now of course, last year, certain folks got credit back from the government, because of the economy, wherein mostly the lower wage folks got bigger returns. STILL, they had to have already paid taxes! You had better do the research you advice others to do, and from reliable sources, instead of hearsay stories from forums.
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
The chart on that post was accurate. Yes the money was deducted but when they filed they got the money back thus paid NO taxes. The fact is the upper half of the population pays almost all of the taxes.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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Data on Share of Federal Income Taxes Paid by Top 1%, Top 5%... by Gerald Prante
Per the release of income tax data by AGI percentile yesterday by the IRS, the Tax Foundation has updated its popular "Summary of Federal Individual Income Taxes" page. The data recently released is for tax year 2005 (same as calendar year).
The report highlights the fact that both the tax share and AGI share of the top 1 percent reached all-time highs in 2005. In 2005, the top 1 percent of tax returns earned 21.2 percent of adjusted gross income and paid 39.4 percent of the nation's federal individual income taxes. This indicates that the federal individual income tax is highly progressive as under a purely proportional system, the two shares would be identical.
Furthermore, in 2005, the top 1 percent of tax returns paid nearly the same amount in federal individual income taxes as the bottom 95 percent of tax returns, a group which was responsible for 40.4 percent of the federal individual income taxes paid.
(Note: This data does not include the refundable portions of the child tax credit or the Earned Income Tax Credit, which if included, would make the share of taxes paid by the top 1 percent even greater as those items would significantly lower the tax bill of the bottom income groups.)
ShareThis
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
I don't know the veracity of the chart, but I do know based on proportionality, the burden on taxes have largely been on the middle class and wage workers, as opposed to the top 1 percent. What I want authenticated though, is the one you don't seem to have authentication for: Your so-called "47 %" lower class non-taxpayers.
Furthermore, in ordinary circumstances, one only gets money back that they OVER paid in taxes. The tax credit went to all works below a designated income level. This is not free money as you imagine, and taxes had to have been paid for eligibility! This is the anti-thesis of your claim about people getting free check in return for paying no taxes.
-------------------- The Complete Picture of the Past tells Us what Not to Repeat Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
I just gave you those figures, you will find them everywhere. The upper 50% pay 96% of the taxes. You can fight me on this Explorer but you are going to lose. This information is everywhere. It is myth that the working class has most of the tax burden. I have got an 8 olclok class and have to go but if you look you will find more of this data.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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The upper 50% pay 96% of the taxes. You can fight me on this Explorer but you are going to lose.
That would be a neat trick, unless you have the requested authentication [re: "47 %" non-taxpayers]...which going on several replies now, has not been produced.
PS: In order to have any slight chance of winning, you should at least acquaint yourself with basic knowledge, like for example, knowing that the IRS does NOT hand out free checks as "tax returns" for non-taxpayers.
You should acquaint yourself with common sense that the government, even in the case of "entitlements", will only hand stuff out once certain criteria have been met, which generally includes work history, residence status, income status, etc. Guess what, if you have worked, but find yourself unemployed down the road, you were a tax payer!
Your claim about winning is like saying that you cannot do basic subtraction or addition, and yet you think you'll win someone who is well past calculus or higher. Absurd.
quote: It is myth that the working class has most of the tax burden.
Even the last piece you cited discredits you. It essentially admits that the remainder of the population, which is really a code word for layers of middle class and wage workers, bear the brunt of taxes than the top 1 [and 5] percent. Better re-examine your own citation.
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: Soo what are you gonna do? you still in collage right?..I think Americans take it for granted that it has to be this way and so accept anything thrown at them,while the sixties generation wasn't mine the current generation needs to revisit their activism and passion.
The difference is that the Generation of the 60's was more intuned to social problems from a young age, our generation did not grow up with social concerns stressed. American Youth are complacent, our concern is to find a Job, make money etc. The Wars are looked at as something the Adults to be concerned with, spending etc.
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Hammer: In the United states the upper classes are the ONLY people paying taxes. the lower 47% pay none, nada zero.
"Hammer" your premise is bogus because people of all classes pay sales taxes and other levies. Your claim above is complete BS..
Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Hammer: In the United states the upper classes are the ONLY people paying taxes. the lower 47% pay none, nada zero.
"Hammer" your premise is bogus because people of all classes pay sales taxes and other levies. Your claim above is complete BS..
Exactly, Hammer is an Apologist for the Banks and CEO's.
The Burden of Taxes falls on the Middle Class and not the Rich.
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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The people as a whole are becoming lazy with all the electronic gadgets that are out and quick fame things like videotaping yourself on youtube, twitter etc. The passion to defend your rights seems to have been toned down by the elites. They have made people think they have really no reasons to defend themselves. Thats why people are more concerned with there Facebook profiles etc. It is what is called "Dumbing Down". People have quick fixes so now when the governemnt screws them over, they have less reasons to fight back. Sad really that we see people in the 60's protest every step of the way, and this generation just takes it without putting up a fight.
All we can hope is that there is some Brave people who realize they are beeing taken as fools and stands up to the foolishness of the crooked governments.
Peace
Posts: 9651 | From: Reace and Love City. | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
Jari, Nobody is taking up for big business or ceo's. The fact is the upper half of our population pay almost all of the income taxes....period. That has been the case in America for quite some time. If the post above is not enough the infor is readily avilable to anyone who wants to look. It will take about five minutes to find it.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
Lumping the top 1 or 5 percent wealthiest folks with middle class and wage worker layers is absurd, because as noted multiple times now, the latter bear most of the burden of tax collection, from a proportionality standpoint. The top 1 or 5 percent simply enjoy the fruits of this burden, as corporations sought to lower costs by bringing wages down.
This top wealthiest essentially circumvent paying taxes on the most important sources of their wealth in the form of tax elimination on corporate dividends, interest, capital gains, savings/investment accounts, tax-free saving tools like 401(k) accounts and Individual Retirement accounts [or even more generous tax-relief safety nets -- aka Lifetime savings, Retirement Savings and Employer Retirement Savings accounts], inheritance tax-relief, relief of restriction limits on corporate management pension plan contributions and so forth.
With their income, the top wealthiest folks are able to take advantage of these tax-deferred/tax-free savings accounts with virtually no trouble, but wage workers living from paycheck to paycheck struggle in making contributions necessary to take advantage of said tax eliminations...
"One third of all Americans have no assets available for investment, and another fifth have only negligible assets. The United States household savings rate lags far behind other industrial nations, constraining national economic growth and keeping many Americans from entering the economic mainstream by buying a house, obtaining an adequate education, or starting a business." - US Treasury
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
Explorer, You are jumping all over the road. i know that this seriously interferes with your view that the evil white rich guy is sucking off the poor but you are just flat out incorrect. The money PAID in income taxes 'to the federal government' is COLLECTED from the upper half of the population....period.
The stuff you posted above has nothing to do with what we are talking about.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
The detailed source of your fictitious "47% lower class non-taxpayers" remains ever so elusive, and you haven't been successful with your propaganda of lumping the top 1 or 5% wealthiest with the real folks of burden, i.e. the middle class and wage workers, in covering up this myth (47% non-taxpayer lower class) with your fantasy unison group of "upper half". Even business corporate media pundits are willing to make the distinction between these layers, which should be a good indicator of how far out there you are. You were counting on an unalert audience who was not familiar with paying taxes. This was a miscalculation, as there was an alert audience which would eventually expose your ignorance of the tax system...e.g. like saying the IRS hands out checks as "tax returns" to "non-taxpayers".
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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The stuff you posted above has nothing to do with what we are talking about.
This statement further underscores your lack of education on the tax system.
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
You know explarer there are some posters here who are very bright even if sometimes a bit off on their facts. You on the other hand are a bone head. The subject was what portion of the fesderal income tax was PAID by the upper half of the population, not how many deductions they had. The best thing you could do is drop this argument as you continue to make a fool of yourself.
-------------------- The tree of liberty is watered by the blood of tyrants. Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
And where does that leave you? A total shithead. You don't even have enough brain cells to burn so as to remember the subject. It has to do with you imaginary "47 non-taxpaying lower class". To justify this, you introduced another imaginary stuff: "Upper half".
Ps: Let me dumb the earlier post down for you even further, but borrow a brain cell or two first, before you attempt to read -- as a warning:
Lumping the top 1 or 5 percent wealthiest folks with middle class and wage worker layers is absurd, because as noted multiple times now, the latter bear most of the burden of tax collection, from a proportionality standpoint. The top 1 or 5 percent simply enjoy the fruits of this burden, as corporations sought to lower costs by bringing wages down.
This top wealthiest essentially circumvent paying taxes on the most important sources of their wealth in the form of tax elimination on corporate dividends, interest, capital gains, savings/investment accounts, tax-free saving tools like 401(k) accounts and Individual Retirement accounts [or even more generous tax-relief safety nets -- aka Lifetime savings, Retirement Savings and Employer Retirement Savings accounts], inheritance tax-relief, relief of restriction limits on corporate management pension plan contributions and so forth.
With their income, the top wealthiest folks are able to take advantage of these tax-deferred/tax-free savings accounts with virtually no trouble, but wage workers living from paycheck to paycheck struggle in making contributions necessary to take advantage of said tax eliminations...
"One third of all Americans have no assets available for investment, and another fifth have only negligible assets. The United States household savings rate lags far behind other industrial nations, constraining national economic growth and keeping many Americans from entering the economic mainstream by buying a house, obtaining an adequate education, or starting a business." - US Treasury
^To put into simpler terms: The bulk of income of the top wealthiest individuals is rendered tax-free, or at worst -- pleasantly tax-reduced, through the designated investment and savings accounts. This leaves the rest, who could little afford to fulfill the basic requirements of using these tax-deferring safety nets, to claim mostly income that is subject to taxes. This is where the basic concept of proportionality kicks in, i.e. income power correlation with tax-associated deductions. You bet, this matter is more than relevant to what has been raised under this topic, by none other than hammer himself.
-------------------- The Complete Picture of the Past tells Us what Not to Repeat Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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In fact ... if you do not work, file a tax form you get a check even though you obviously paid no taxes.
The IRS has a form that is filed by those who do not pay taxes, they get a check in return. Republicans have trid to get rid of it for years...
It is run through the IRS system and the check is sent as a "tax return."
This sort of thing can only be uttered by someone who is less intellectually stimulating than a door knob. Simple translation for you, hammer: You are even dumber than a door knob.
Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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posted
A few words of interest, with regards to Bush tax plan:
In the face of burgeoning budget deficits, the president has proposed new tax cuts that would cost the Treasury nearly $1.5 trillion over 10 years, on top of the $1.35 trillion tax cut passed in 2001. The tax cuts' potential impact on government enterprises has caught many supporters and detractors by surprise.
If enacted, they would end for the vast majority of Americans the taxation of inheritances and eliminate taxes on interest, capital gains and dividends. Those are tax changes Ronald Reagan could only dream of. - Weisman, Washington Post.
Weisman's estimates of the cost may have even been underestimated, while Albert B. Crenshaw, of the same news organization, figures...
“we could end up with a Leona Helmsley tax code— one in which only the little people pay taxes.”
-------------------- The Complete Picture of the Past tells Us what Not to Repeat Posts: 7516 | From: Somewhere on Earth | Registered: Jan 2008
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