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The Roman historian Cornelius Tacitus (56-118 A.D.) made some interesting comments about the Hebrews in his history. In particular, he asserts that the Hebrews in Egypt were Lepers - Manetho also mentions Lepers in his account.
Tacitus wrote quote: Most writers, however, agree in stating that once a disease, which horribly disfigured the body, broke out over Egypt; that king Bocchoris, seeking a remedy, consulted the oracle of Hammon, and was bidden to cleanse his realm, and to convey into some foreign land this race detested by the gods. The people, who had been collected after diligent search, finding themselves left in a desert, sat for the most part in a stupor of grief, till one of the exiles, Moyses by name, warned them not to look for any relief from God or man, forsaken as they were of both, but to trust to themselves, taking for their heaven-sent leader that man who should first help them to be quit of their present misery. They agreed, and in utter ignorance began to advance at random. Nothing, however, distressed them so much as the scarcity of water, and they had sunk ready to perish in all directions over the plain, when a herd of wild asses was seen to retire from their pasture to a rock shaded by trees. Moyses followed them, and, guided by the appearance of a grassy spot, discovered an abundant spring of water. This furnished relief. After a continuous journey for six days, on the seventh they possessed themselves of a country, from which they expelled the inhabitants, and in which they founded a city and a temple.
Here we are quoting Josephus Flavius from his book, Against Apion, where he is quoting passages concerning the Hyksos from Manetho's Aegyptiaca. (This takes place after the first Hyksos expulsion.
"Those sent to work in the quarries lived miserably for a long while, and the king was asked to set apart the city Avaris, which the Hyksos had left, for their habitation and protection; and he granted them their wish.
But when these men had entered it, and found it suitable for a revolt, they chose a ruler from among the priests of Heliopolis, whose name was Osarsiph (Moses). They swore an oath that they would obey him in all things. The first laws he gave them were that they should not worship the Egyptian gods, nor should they abstain from any of the sacred animals that the Egyptians held in the highest esteem, but could kill them, and that they should not ally themselves to any but those that were of their conspiracy.
After making such laws as these, and others contrary to Egyptian customs, he ordered that the many hands at their service to be employed in building walls around the city and prepare for a war with king Ahmose. He colluded with the other priests, and those that were polluted as well, (apparently many of the quarry workers were Lepers), and sent ambassadors to those Hyksos expelled by Kamose to Jerusalem, informing them of his own affairs, and of the state of those others that had been treated so shamefully, and desired that they would come united to his assistance in this war against Egypt.
He also promised their return to their ancient city and land of Avaris, and plentiful support for their people; that he would protect them and fight for them if need be, and that the land would easily be subdued. The Hyksos were delighted with his message, and assembled two hundred thousand men. Shortly they arrived at Avaris.
CONCERNING THE HEBREW PROHIBITION OF EATING PORK.
Tacitus wrote quote: They abstain from swine's flesh, in consideration of what they suffered when they were infected by the leprosy to which this animal is liable. By their frequent fasts they still bear witness to the long hunger of former days, and the Jewish bread, made without leaven, is retained as a memorial of their hurried seizure of corn.
Deuteronomy 14 (King James Version)
Deuteronomy 14
1Ye are the children of the LORD your God: ye shall not cut yourselves, nor make any baldness between your eyes for the dead.
2For thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God, and the LORD hath chosen thee to be a peculiar people unto himself, above all the nations that are upon the earth.
3Thou shalt not eat any abominable thing.
4These are the beasts which ye shall eat: the ox, the sheep, and the goat,
5The hart, and the roebuck, and the fallow deer, and the wild goat, and the pygarg, and the wild ox, and the chamois.
6And every beast that parteth the hoof, and cleaveth the cleft into two claws, and cheweth the cud among the beasts, that ye shall eat.
7Nevertheless these ye shall not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the cloven hoof; as the camel, and the hare, and the coney: for they chew the cud, but divide not the hoof; therefore they are unclean unto you.
8And the swine, because it divideth the hoof, yet cheweth not the cud, it is unclean unto you: ye shall not eat of their flesh, nor touch their dead carcase.
9These ye shall eat of all that are in the waters: all that have fins and scales shall ye eat:
10And whatsoever hath not fins and scales ye may not eat; it is unclean unto you.
11Of all clean birds ye shall eat.
12But these are they of which ye shall not eat: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
13And the glede, and the kite, and the vulture after his kind,
14And every raven after his kind,
15And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
16The little owl, and the great owl, and the swan,
17And the pelican, and the gier eagle, and the cormorant,
18And the stork, and the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.
19And every creeping thing that flieth is unclean unto you: they shall not be eaten.
20But of all clean fowls ye may eat.
21Ye shall not eat of anything that dieth of itself: thou shalt give it unto the stranger that is in thy gates, that he may eat it; or thou mayest sell it unto an alien: for thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in his mother's milk.
Tacitus wrote quote: The Jewish religion is tasteless and mean. (The above is kinda mean).
22Thou shalt truly tithe all the increase of thy seed, that the field bringeth forth year by year.
23And thou shalt eat before the LORD thy God, in the place which he shall choose to place his name there, the tithe of thy corn, of thy wine, and of thine oil, and the firstlings of thy herds and of thy flocks; that thou mayest learn to fear the LORD thy God always.
24And if the way be too long for thee, so that thou art not able to carry it; or if the place be too far from thee, which the LORD thy God shall choose to set his name there, when the LORD thy God hath blessed thee:
25Then shalt thou turn it into money, and bind up the money in thine hand, and shalt go unto the place which the LORD thy God shall choose:
26And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth: and thou shalt eat there before the LORD thy God, and thou shalt rejoice, thou, and thine household.
BUT THE BIBLE DOESN'T SAY "WHY" PORK IS UNCLEAN... ONLY THIS:
Mark 5 (King James Version)
Mark 5
1And they came over unto the other side of the sea, into the country of the Gadarenes.
2And when he was come out of the ship, immediately there met him out of the tombs a man with an unclean spirit,
3Who had his dwelling among the tombs; and no man could bind him, no, not with chains:
4Because that he had been often bound with fetters and chains, and the chains had been plucked asunder by him, and the fetters broken in pieces: neither could any man tame him.
5And always, night and day, he was in the mountains, and in the tombs, crying, and cutting himself with stones.
6But when he saw Jesus afar off, he ran and worshipped him,
7And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not.
8For he said unto him, Come out of the man, thou unclean spirit.
9And he asked him, What is thy name? And he answered, saying, My name is Legion: for we are many.
10And he besought him much that he would not send them away out of the country.
11Now there was there nigh unto the mountains a great herd of swine feeding.
12And all the devils besought him, saying, Send us into the swine, that we may enter into them.
13And forthwith Jesus gave them leave. And the unclean spirits went out, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the sea, (they were about two thousand;) and were choked in the sea.
14And they that fed the swine fled, and told it in the city, and in the country. And they went out to see what it was that was done.
15And they come to Jesus, and see him that was possessed with the devil, and had the legion, sitting, and clothed, and in his right mind: and they were afraid.
16And they that saw it told them how it befell to him that was possessed with the devil, and also concerning the swine.
17And they began to pray him to depart out of their coasts.
18And when he was come into the ship, he that had been possessed with the devil prayed him that he might be with him.
19Howbeit Jesus suffered him not, but saith unto him, Go home to thy friends, and tell them how great things the Lord hath done for thee, and hath had compassion on thee.
20And he departed, and began to publish in Decapolis how great things Jesus had done for him: and all men did marvel.
Energy, if you can straighten all of this out, I would appreciate it.
For those who may not know:
When Constantine became the sole Roman Emperor in 324, Christianity became the religion of the Roman empire.
The Khazars were an ancient Turkic people from Asia. In the 8th Century, the Khazars (White Jews) converted to the Hebrew religion and made Judaism the State religion.Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
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The Romans were decadent imperialists who treated people brutally and enslaved them.
The Jewish and Arab prohibitions on pork had to do with the fact that the pig is not acclimated to arid climates or herd well for nomads. They dehydrate easily and waste water in these climates. They can be maintained but are a very inefficient animal to breed in arid semi-desert climates. On the other hand in places like the Amazon jungle they love breeding pigs. They are more suited to that climate just as it would be not worthwhile to try to bring camels into the jungle. Trichinosis is secondary but helps persuade people not to breed pigs in the arid climate. This is solved by thorough cooking. In America pigs are now kept in conditions where Trichinosis is so rare there are only under 20 cases report a year for the whole country.
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posted
^^^pigs are not indigenous or well suited to those areas, they are forest/jungle animals and can't be herded for the nomadic lifestyle.
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Archeological evidence suggests that pigs were domesticated from wild boar as early as 13,000–12,700 BC in the Near East in the Tigris Basin (Iraq) being managed in the wild in a way similar to the way they are managed by some modern New Guineans. Remains of pigs have been dated to earlier than 11,400 BC in Cyprus that must have been introduced from the mainland which suggests domestication in the adjacent mainland by then. There was also a separate domestication in China.
DNA evidence from sub-fossil remains of teeth and jawbones of Neolithic pigs in Europe shows that the first domestic pigs there had been brought from the Near East.Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
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LOL.. Lioness my dunce, that was actually funny.. lol I mean your vanishing trick! Posts: 7419 | From: North America | Registered: Mar 2009
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You know, I was thinking about this passage in the Christian Bible:
Deuteronomy 14 (King James Version)
21- Ye shall not eat of anything that dieth of itself: thou shalt give it unto the stranger that is in thy gates, that he may eat it; or thou mayest sell it unto an alien: for thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God.
And I'm thinking, well why is it bad to eat an animal that has dropped dead of it's own accord.
And I found, quote: "Any animal that dies of natural causes has most likely suffered death by having it's organs and muscle tissue fill with toxic chemicals byproducts of improper working organs, production of Bacteria or viruses. In some cases the animals body has literal died in it's own cells waste products."
So lets see what's going on here:
Deuteronomy is from the Hebrew Bible, so god is telling Hebrews to sell bad meat to Christians and Islamists.
But The King James Version is a Christian Bible, so god is telling Christians to sell bad meat to Hebrews and Islamists.
My guess is that the Islamic Bible is also telling Islamists to sell bad meat to Christians and Jews.
You know what?
I think I will try to find an Atheist Butcher!Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
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The priests shall not eat of any thing that is dead of itself, or torn, whether it be fowl or beast.
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The Islamic Bulletin
Dietary Laws The Prohibition of Eating What is Dead and its Wisdom
The first thing mentioned in the verses concerning prohibited foods is the flesh of "dead animals," that is, the beast or fowl which dies of natural causes, without being slaughtered or hunted by men. There are obvious reasons for this prohibition:
a) Eating the flesh of a dead animal is repugnant to civilized taste and is considered by thinking people in all societies to be contrary to human dignity. We also observe that all people possessing a divinely revealed scripture have prohibited it and that they do not eat the flesh of an animal unless it is slaughtered. However, the methods of slaughter may vary.
b) In whatever he does, the Muslim acts with a set purpose and intention; he does not use a thing nor reap its benefit without directing his intention,aim, and effort toward it. The significance of slaughtering, which is to take the life of the animal in order to use it as food, is to remove the slaughtered animal from the category of "dead animals." Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'ala does not desire that man should eat of what he did not intend or think of eating, as is the case with the dead animal; conversely, slaughtering an animal or hunting it as game both require an intention followed by effort and subsequent action.
c) If the animal died a natural death, it is quite likely that it died of some acute or chronic disease, through eating a poisonous plant, or other similar causes; hence eating its flesh would probably be harmful. The same is that case when the cause of death is old age or starvation.
d) By prohibiting the flesh of a dead animal to human beings, Allah in His Mercy provides source of food to animals and birds, who, in the words of the Qur'an, constitute an ummah (nation) like themselves. The truth of this is demonstrated by the fact that carcasses of animals lying out in the open are devoured by birds and animals.
e) This prohibition encourages the owner to guard it from disease and malnutrition lest it die and be wasted. Accordingly, in the case of disease, he will be quick to seek a cure for it or will hasten to slaughter the animal.
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What is happening here is the ancient people would not waste the meat of a bred animal that died of natural causes. They would eat it. You would have to eat it quickly, not waiting for decay to set in. This is not like walking into a forest and seeing a dead animal and using it for meat where you can't tell exactly how long it's been there. Meat from old animals is considered tough and inferior-but not something to be thrown away and wasted. With the religions, they try to introduce a higher standard of eating for the followers and make up dietary laws. This is also a discipline to follow.
It's not necessarily hey let's sneak this bad meat to the other bastards. I was in a hindu guru's restaurant last night. The had these large crepe thingys with fillings s called dosas. Some were vegetarian others chicken. I doubt the followers of the guru eat the chicken ones yet they serve them at the restaurant.
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posted
...and why would God make something no one likes, including himself...then pit others against each other for eating the bad product?
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quote:Originally posted by Grumman: ...and why would God make something no one likes, including himself...then pit others against each other for eating the bad product?
because God didn't say that people are pretending he did
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posted
One thing about Lioness, in her mind, she is an expert on everything. Now if only she could come to terms with the race issues. Lioness, exactly what is your situation?
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Although they would never admit to it, the peoples of these very hot countries were forbidden pork because it's the first meat to go bad in the heat. The same goes for mixing dairy products with other foodstuffs; if the dairy product has gone off with the heat it would also contaminate the other food.
It's not because you can catch swine flu from eating a bacon sandwich, which is what most of my Muslim friends think!
Posts: 430 | From: luxor | Registered: Apr 2008
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It seems apparent that in ancient times, religious dogma, acted as departments of health, in establishing good safety guidelines. And encouraged adherence on penalty of sin.
But alas, public gratitude for good works, turns to power over the public. And the Priesthood, just like the royalty, cannot resist the temptations of power.
Now today, not only the potentate tells you who you must kill, but the Priesthood too.
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posted
Back to Tacitus, his comments about Christ are also curious. Here it must be acknowledged that the victor gets to tell the story, and Christianity became the victor when Constantine made it the Roman religion. (Constantine himself, being no pillar of virtue).
Tacitus: Annals Book 15
43. Of Rome meanwhile, so much as was left unoccupied by his mansion, was not built up, as it had been after its burning by the Gauls, without any regularity or in any fashion, but with rows of streets according to measurement, with broad thoroughfares, with a restriction on the height of houses, with open spaces, and the further addition of colonnades, as a protection to the frontage of the blocks of tenements. These colonnades Nero promised to erect at his own expense, and to hand over the open spaces, when cleared of the debris, to the ground landlords. He also offered rewards proportioned to each person's position and property, and prescribed a period within which they were to obtain them on the completion of so many houses or blocks of building. He fixed on the marshes of Ostia for the reception of the rubbish, and arranged that the ships which had brought up corn by the Tiber, should sail down the river with cargoes of this rubbish. The buildings themselves, to a certain height, were to be solidly constructed, without wooden beams, of stone from Gabii or Alba, that material being impervious to fire. And to provide that the water which individual license had illegally appropriated, might flow in greater abundance in several places for the public use, officers were appointed, and everyone was to have in the open court the means of stopping a fire. Every building, too, was to be enclosed by its own proper wall, not by one common to others. These changes which were liked for their utility, also added beauty to the new city. Some, however, thought that its old arrangement had been more conducive to health, inasmuch as the narrow streets with the elevation of the roofs were not equally penetrated by the sun's heat, while now the open space, unsheltered by any shade, was scorched by a fiercer glow.
44. Such indeed were the precautions of human wisdom. The next thing was to seek means of propitiating the gods, and recourse was had to the Sibylline books, by the direction of which prayers were offered to Vulcanus, Ceres, and Proserpina. Juno, too, was entreated by the matrons, first, in the Capitol, then on the nearest part of the coast, whence water was procured to sprinkle the fane and image of the goddess. And there were sacred banquets and nightly vigils celebrated by married women. But all human efforts, all the lavish gifts of the emperor, and the propitiations of the gods, did not banish the sinister belief that the conflagration was the result of an order.
Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular.
Accordingly, an arrest was first made of all who pleaded guilty; then, upon their information, an immense multitude was convicted, not so much of the crime of firing the city, as of hatred against mankind. Mockery of every sort was added to their deaths. Covered with the skins of beasts, they were torn by dogs and perished, or were nailed to crosses, or were doomed to the flames and burnt, to serve as a nightly illumination, when daylight had expired. Nero offered his gardens for the spectacle, and was exhibiting a show in the circus, while he mingled with the people in the dress of a charioteer or stood aloft on a car. Hence, even for criminals who deserved extreme and exemplary punishment, there arose a feeling of compassion; for it was not, as it seemed, for the public good, but to glut one man's cruelty, that they were being destroyed.
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