posted
I was looking up Pacific Afrocoids when I stumbled across this youtube video of a purported S.Chinese/Papua New Guinean relationship. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n208L0Tvg-k Though I specifically remember a paper in which Clyde identifies Papuans as one of the Chinese Africoids my own knowledge of genetics is so scant it prevents me from any certainty,so all the REAL RESEARCHERS,mike111,clyde,iron and Marc what say ye??
Posts: 433 | From: nairobi | Registered: Oct 2011
| IP: Logged |
posted
In the Chinese literature the Blacks were called li-min, Kunlung, Ch'iang (Qiang), Yi and Yueh. The Yueh lived in North China. They were Kushites who first lived in Elam and migrated into China after 2500 BC. The Yi lived in South China. These people may have been the ancestors of some of the Melanesian people.
The founders of the Xia Dynasty and the Shang Dynasties were blacks. These blacks were called Yueh and Qiang. The modern Chinese are descendants of the Zhou. The second Shang Dynasty ( situated at Anyang) was founded by the Yin. As a result this dynasty is called Shang-Yin. The Yin or Oceanic Mongoloid type is associated with the Austronesian speakers ( Kwang-chih Chang, "Prehistoric and early historic culture horizons and traditions in South China", Current Anthropology, 5 (1964) pp.359-375 :375). The Austronesian or Oceanic Mongoloid type were called Yin, Feng, Yen, Zhiu Yi and Lun Yi. .
-------------------- C. A. Winters Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
There are craniometric difference between Australoids /Australians, Mongoloids and Melanoids; craniometric differences that indicate two migrations of the Black Variety into the Pacific. Tsuenehiko Hanihare discussed the phenotypic variations between these populations(1).
Tsuenehiko classified these people into three major populations Southeast Asian Mongoloids (Polynesians), the Australians or Austroloid type and the Nicobar and Andaman (Melanoid) samples which he found lie between the predominately Southeast Asian and Australoid/Australian type (1).
The Australian aborigines and Melanesians show cranonical variates and represent two distinct Black populations(2). The Australoids or Australians live mainly in Australia and the highland regions of Oceania.
The Melanoid people on the otherhand live in the coastal regions of Near Oceania and Fiji. D.J de Laubenfels discussed the variety of Blacks found in Asia. Laubenfiels explained that Negroids/Melanoids such as the Tasmanians are characterized by wooly black hair and sparse body hair (2).
Australoids or Australians on the otherhand have curly, wavy or straight hair and abundant body hair. Other differences between these Black populations include Negroid / Melanoid brows being vertical and without eyebrow ridges, whereas Australoid brows are sloping and with prominent ridges (2).
This led M. Pietrusewky to recognize two separate colonizations of the Pacific by morphologically distinct populations one Polynesian and the other Melanesian (3). Pietrusewky’s research indicates a clear separation between the Australian-Melanesian crania and the Polynesian crania (3). The findings indicate an origin for the Polynesians in Southeast Asia (3-5), and an early Australo-Melanesian presence in East Asia as will be discussed later.
Laubenfels argues that the Australians are remnants of the original African migration to the region 60kya (2). This view is supported by David Bulbeck who found that the Australian craniometrics are different from the Mongoloid (Polynesian), and Melanoid crania metrics (4). This research indicates that whereas Australian aborigine crania agree with the archaic population of Asia and first group of Africans to exit Africa, they fail to correspond to the Sahulland crania which are distinctly of Southwest Pacific or Melanoid affinity (2,4).
This suggests that by the rise of Sahulland 12kya there were two distinct Black populations in Asia one Austroloid and the other Melanoid (4).
By the Neolithic the Melanoids or Papuans are associated with millet cultivation at Yangshao and Lougshan according to Pietrusewky’s work (5). Tsang argues that the probable homeland of the Austronesian speakers was the Pearl River delta, here the Melanoid people cultivated millet (6). Sagart believes that there is a Proto-Sino-Tibetan-Austronesian family of languages based on the millet culture the Melanoids introduced to China (7).
Due to the expansion of the Mongoloid population after the fall of the Anyang Shang Dynasty , Melanoids began to settle the Pacific Islands and spread the Lapita culture (8). This is supported by Lapita skeletal remains that lack the characteristic 9b.p. deletion of the Polynesians, but show Melanesian similarities (9-11).
In summary, Melanesian Lapita skeletal remains indicate a Melanoid migration from East Asia to the Pacific (10-11). The crania dating to the first out of Africa exit which has Australian characteristic (2); the appearance of Melanoid people in Sahulland 12000 years ago (4); and the subsequent migration to the Pacific of Melanoids carrying the Lapita culture support two migrations of the Black Variety into the Pacific. Migrations that explain the genetic difference between Polynesians , Near Oceania coastal inhabitants, and the Highlanders in Oceania (9-10) .
Reference:
1. Tsunehiko Hanihare, Interpretation of craniofacial variations and diversification of East and Southeast Asia. In Bioarchaeology of Southeast Asia. (Eds.) Marc Oxenhan and Nancy Tayles (pp.91-111). Cambridge, 2005. 2. D.J. Laubenfels, Australoids, Negroids and Negroes: A suggested explanation for their distinct distributions. Annals Association of Am. Geographers, 58(1), 1968: 42-50. 3. Michael Pietrusewky, A multivariate craniometric study of the prehistoric and modern inhabitants of Southeast Asia, East Asia and surrounding regions:A human kaleidoscope. Cambridge Studies in Biological and Evolutionary Anthropology, No. 43, 2006: 59-90. 4. David Bulbeck, Australian Aboriginal craniometrics as construed through FORDISC, 2005. Retrieved: 4/2/2008: http://arts.anu.edu.au/bullda/oz_craniometrics.html 5. M. Pietrusewsky, The Physical anthropology of the Pacific, East Asia: A multivariate craniometric analysis. . In L. Sagart, R. Blench, A. Sanchez-Mazos (Eds), The peopling of East Asia Putting together Archaeology,Linguistics and Genetics (pp.201-229). RutledgeCurzon, 2005. 6. Tsang Cheng-Hwa, Recent discoveries at Tapenkeng culture sites in Taiwan;Implications for the problem of Austronesian origins. In The peopling of East Asia Putting together Archaeology, Linguistics and Genetics ,(Eds) L. Sagart, R. Blench, A. Sanchez-Mazos (pp.63-74). RutledgeCurzon, 2005. 7. L. Sagart, Sino-Tibetan-Austronesian an Updated and improved argument. In L. Sagart, R. Blench, A. Sanchez-Mazos (Eds), The peopling of East Asia Putting together Archaeology, Linguistics and Genetics (pp.161-176). RutledgeCurzon, 2005. 8. C. Winters, Dravidian settlements in ancient Polynesia, India Past and Present, 3 no2 (1986): pp.225-241. 9. E. Hagelberg & J.B. Clegg, Genetic polymorphisms in prehistoric Pacific Islanders determined by analysis of ancient bone DNA. Biological Science, 252 no.1334 (1993) : pp.163-170. 10. M. Pietrusewsky, A study of skeletal and dental remains from Watom Isalnd and comparisons with other Lapita people. Rec. Aust Mus. 41 (1989): pp.235-292. 11. M. Pietrusewky, A Lapita-associated skeleton from Natunuku Fiji, Rec. Aust. Mus., 41 (1989): pp.297-325.
-------------------- C. A. Winters Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
Blacks have been in East Eurasia long before the Tang Dynasty.
Melanesians came into the Pacific in three waves. The first group arrived 12kya. A second group associated with African Mound/Megalithic Culture expanded from East Africa into east Eurasia and Oceania. The third group was composed of Proto-Melanesians being driven out of East Asia as the hua/Han took over the mainland.
Negroid skeletons dating to the early periods of Southern Chinese history have been found in Shangdong, Jiantung, Sichuan, Yunnan, Pearl River delta and Jiangxi especially at the initial sites of Chingliengang (Ch'ing-lien-kang) and Mazhiabang (Ma chia-pang) phases ( see: K.C. Chang, The archaeology of ancient China, (Yale University Press:New Haven,1977) p.76) . The Chingliengang culture is often referred to as the Ta-wen-k'ou (Dawenkou) culture of North China. The presence of Negroid skeletal remains at Dawenkou sites make it clear that Negroes were still in the North in addition to South China. The Dawenkou culture predates the Lung-shan culture which is associated with the Xia civilization.
These blacks were the dominant group in South China. Kwang-chih Chang, writing in the 4th edition of Archaeology of ancient China (1986) wrote that:" by the beginning of the Recent (Holocene) period the population in North China and that in the southwest and in Indochina had become sufficiently differentiated to be designated as Mongoloid and OCEANIC NEGROID races respectively…."(p.64). By the Upper Pleistocene the Negroid type was typified by the Liu-chiang skulls from Yunnan (Chang, 1986, p.69).
In Southeast Asia and southern China, ancient skeletal remains represented the earliest inhabitants as identical to the Oceanic type ( Kwang-chih Chang, The archareology of ancient China, (New Haven,1977) p.42; G.H.R. von Koenigswald, A giant fossil hominoid from the pleistocene of Southern China, Anthropology Pap. Am Museum of Natural History, no.43, 1952, pp.301-309). Although Negritos were also established in north and southern China by the beginning of the Recent (Holocene) period the populations in North China and that in southern China and IndoChina had become sufficiently differentiated to be designated as Mongoloid and Negroid-Oceanic respectively, both having evolved out of a common Upper Plestocene substratum as represented by the Tzu-yang and Liu-Chiang skulls. In Southern China the most well known early cultures were the Ta-p'enK'eng culture of the southeastern coast, cultures dating to the 5th millenium. The Ta-p'en-K'eng sites have a chracteristic cord-marked pottery dating to before theird millennium. A radio-carbon date is available for this culture of 4450-4350 BC. The color of the pottery ranges from buff to dark brown, the principal shapes of the vessels are large globular jars and bowls. The people of this culture also made many stone sinkers and dugout canoes.There is believed to have been an early horticultural revolution in the tropical regions of southeast Asia, with the domestication of several cultigens. As in Africa this culture was Aqualithic with most of the people living on mounds and pilled houses. These horticulturalist ate aqualtic animals such as fish and shellfish, and grew root crops such as yam and taro .The Ta-p'en-K'eng site has provided much insight into their agricultural origins as indicated by the great variety of cord marks on the pottery demonstrates. The habi tat of the ancient people who made this ware at Ta-p'en-K' eng, was widespread in IndoChina and even in southern China and Japan.
The Hoabinhian culture of Vietnam and that of Ta-p' en-K'eng, were characterized by cord-marked pottery which is identical in both places , and it is possible that the Yang -shao site at Huang Ho basin in North China may have also been founded by blacks in southern China who probably been the cultivation of rice . In the southeast southerners began at Hupeh and Kuangsi the cultivation of means of artificial irrigation and by terracing of the mountain slopes. These same Austronesians were already using bronze before the Chinese. The women's standing was high, she participated in the worship which consisted of a mountain and snake cults. There is evidence from the physical anthropologist that skeletons from Shantung and Kiangsu show resemblances to the Negroid type of southern Chinese rather than Mongoloid, especially at the intial Ch'ing-lien -Kang and Ma chia-pang phases. As a resultt of this evidence it seems that agriculture was widely practiced in Southeast Asia and China long before the full impact of farming was felt in the North among the Chinese.
Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
The archeological evidence discussed above make it clear the ancestors of the Melanesians and Polynesians lived in East Asia.
The late appearance of Melanoid people from East Asia on the shore areas of Oceania would explain the differences between the genetic make up of Melanesians living in the highlands and Melanesians living along the shore [1-2].
The skeletal evidence from East Asia [3-7,12] suggests that the TMRCAs of the Polynesians and some of the coastal Melanesians may be mainland East Asia, not Taiwan. The ancestral population for the shoreline Melanesians was probably forced from East Asia by Proto-Polynesians as they were pushed into Southeast Asia by the Han or contemporary Chinese. This would explain the genetic diversity existing among shoreline Melanesians, in comparison to the genetic homogeneity among isolated inland Melanesians, like the Highland New Guineans who probably have an Australian origin.
There were two Shang Dynasties, one Melanoid (Qiang-Shang) and the other Proto-Polynesian (Yin-Shang). The first Shang Dynasty was founded by Proto-Melanesians or Melanoids belonging to the Yueh tribe called Qiang [7]. The Qiang lived in Qiangfeng, a country to the west of Yin-Shang, Shensi and Yunnan [7-11,13].
The archaeological evidence also indicates that the Polynesians probably originated in East Asia [4,6-7,12-13]. Consequently, the Polynesian migration probably began in East Asia, not Southeast Asia. Taiwan genetically probably belongs to the early Polynesians who settled Taiwan before they expanded into outer Oceania.
Given the archaeological record of intimate contact between Proto-Polynesians and Proto-Melanoids, neither a “slow boat” or “express train” explains the genetic relationship between the Melanesian and Polynesian populations. This record makes it clear that these populations lived in intimate contact for thousands of years and during this extended period of interactions both groups probably exchanged genes.
The presence of Melanesians formerly in East Eurasian explains the genetic relationship between Melanesians and Chinese.
References
1. Manfred Kayser, Oscar Lao, Kathrin Saar, Silke Brauer, Xingyu Wang, Peter Nürnberg, Ronald J. Trent, Mark Stoneking Genome-wide Analysis Indicates More Asian than Melanesian Ancestry of Polynesians. The American Journal of Human Genetics - 10 January 2008, 82 (1); pp. 194-198. 2. J. S. Fredlaender, F.R. Friedlaender, J.A. Hodgson, M. Stoltz, G. Koki, G. Horvat,S. Zhadanov, T. G. Schurr and D.A. Merriwether, Melanesian mtDNA complexity, PLoS ONE, 2(2) 2007: e248. 3 F. Weidenreich F., Bull. Nat. Hist. Soc. Peiping 13, (1938-40): p. 163. 4. Kwang-chih Chang, Archaeology of ancient China (Yale University Press, 1986) p. 64. 5. G. H. R. von Koenigswald, A giant fossil hominoid from the pleistocene of Southern China, Anthropology Pap. Am Museum of Natural History, no.43, 1952, pp. 301-309). 6. K. C. Chang, The archaeology of ancient China, (Yale University Press: New Haven, 1977): p. 76 7. Winters, Clyde Ahmad, “The Far Eastern Origin of the Tamils”, Journal of Tamil Studies, no27 (June 1985), pp. 65-92. 8. K. C. Chang, Shang Civilization, (Yale University Press: New Haven, 1980) pp. 227-230. 9. C. A. Winters, The Dravido-Harappa Colonization of Central Asia, Central Asiatic Journal, (1990) 34 (1-2), pp. 120-144. 10. Y. Kan, The Bronze culture of western Yunnan, Bull. Of the Ancient Orient Museum (Tokyo), 7 (1985), pp. 47-91. 11. S. S. Ling, A study of the Raft, Outrigger, Double, and Deck canoes of ancient China, the Pacific, and the Indian Ocean. The Institute of Ethnology Academic Sinica. Nankang, Taipei Taiwan, 1970. 12. Kwang-chih Chang, “Prehistoric and early historic culture horizons and traditions in South China”, Current Anthropology, 5 (1964): pp. 359-375: 375). 13. Winters, Clyde Ahmad, “Dravidian Settlements in ancient Polynesia”, India Past and Present 3, no2 (1986): pp. 225-241.
-------------------- C. A. Winters Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
You are ridiculous, Clyde. Here is a first hand account of Negro slaves offered as tribute during the Tang dynasty in China -
Ref.,
Edward H. Schafer (1963). The golden peaches of Samarkand: a study of Tang exotics. University of California Press. p. 46-47
Posts: 1340 | Registered: Apr 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
The culture hero Huang Di is a direct link of Africa. His name was pronounced in old Chinese Yuhai Huandi or Hu Nak Kunte. He was supposed to have arrived in China from the west in 2282 B.C., and settled along the banks of the Loh river in Shanxi. This transliteration of Huandgi, to Hu Nak Kunte is interesting because Kunte is a common clan name among the Manding speakers.
The Africans or blacks that founded civilization in China were often called li min 'black people; or "black headed people" by the Zhou dynasts. This term has affinity to the Sumero-Akkadian term sag- gig-ga "black headed people". These li min are associated with the Chinese cultural hero Yao.
In the Annals of the Bamboo Books, we learn that Yao devised a calendar to help regulate agrarian work through proper use of ritual and music and created a rudimentary government. The Annals of the Bamboo Books, makes it clear that Yao "he united and harmonized the myriad states [of his dominion], and the [li min] black people were reformed by his cordial agreement".
We also read that Shun, the successor of Yao, distinguished by his reputation as an obedient devoted son, noted to : "Ki [that] the Black headed are suffering the distress of hunger".
To help relieve the people Shun gave his throne over to Yu, the founder of the Shang Dynasty. Yu, in the Annals of the Bamboo Books, is reported to have noted that "...when a sovereign gives response to the people, he is kind, and the Black people cherish him in their heart".
posted
Seriously, Clyde, there is something dementing with your mind! Black does not always mean "Negro" in Chinese literature!!! Indian slaves were described black too! Geez! already!
quote:Originally posted by Confirming Truth: Seriously, Clyde, there is something dementing with your mind! Black does not always mean "Negro" in Chinese literature!!! Indian slaves were described black too! Geez! already!
LOL. You wish the obly Africans in China had been slaves but this is untrue. Check out this video which discusses the Chinese term li min
posted
Thanks,clyde! So then we can assume the info in the video is correct. Btw,can you direct me to a reliable tutorial on basic genetics? I need to know the basics of haplogroups,alleles and mtdna analysis etc etc and how they are used.
Posts: 433 | From: nairobi | Registered: Oct 2011
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by kikuyu22: Thanks,clyde! So then we can assume the info in the video is correct. Btw,can you direct me to a reliable tutorial on basic genetics? I need to know the basics of haplogroups,alleles and mtdna analysis etc etc and how they are used.
posted
Facial reconstruction of the Shang, Xia and cultures and civilization during 5000BC were 100% Mongoloid people. Please do not listen to the lies of these Afro-centrists who steals history, their only evidence is manipulating and misinterpreting genetic and historical evidences to their advantages.
" A careful study of the bones of 400 individuals removed from more than 300 graves indicates that the Jiahu ethnic group may be identified with the North Asian Mongolian group, and also with the Xiawanggang and Miaodigou groups in Henan Province and the Dawenkou, Yedian and Xixiahou groups that were later found in Shandong Province. The range of male heights was from 170 to 180 cm. In the late Palaeolithic Zhoukoudian Cave, `unspecialized' Mongoloids were described6. By the Yangshao period (3000 BC± 5000 BC)7, the skull measurements are `physically Chinese' and `modern'6. The physical similarity of the Jiahu people to the later Dawenkou (2600 BC±4300 BC) indicates that the Dawenkou might have descended from the Jiahu, following a slow migration along the middle and lower reaches of the Huai river and the Hanshui valley. "
Racial & Cultural continuity, from Yangshao to the Shang.
" Racially the Shang were Mongoloids, like the preceding Yangshao and Longshan cultures. The Shang bones are indistinguishable from the Longshan. The Shang were not invaders from the Middle East. In addition to racial similarities, the Shang also shared cultural similarities with the Yangshao and Longshan cultures. "
PLEASE don't listen Clyde Winters nonsense on Polynesians in Pacific today are descendants of Xia and Shang, there's no genetic or skeletal evidence to prove it.
Recent genetic has proven that the The Polynesian mtDNA marker B4a1a1 has existed in the Bismarck Archipelago 6000 years ago during the time when there was an very few people, and way before the Taiwanese aborigines (ancient ones, not like modern ones) have even migrated to Pacific and intermixed.
You are the dealing with the kind of people who could even claim that God was black man, if he had little dark skin or little curly hair. Afro-censtrists have been ridiculously claiming every civilization in the world. They keep taking advantages of the way sculptures were built and anything that has dark skin, wide nose, curly hair for their own history manipulation, when these traits are not stricly to negroid. But at the same time the would claim that Dravidian or Tamils as black, despite the fact they are straight haired, hairy bodied, facial haired, long nose-bridged people, they would claim them as black. They even claimed Mediterranean people like spanish, italians have darker skinned due to mixing with black. Despite the fact that Australian aborigines have different skull and genetics to African, afro-centrist would still claim them as their own. Despite the fact that Australoid are an much older race and the most genetically distanced to african negroid they would STILL would still claim them as one of their own, because afro-censtrists want's to claim ancient homosapiens as the same race as african black. And if they ever founded one australoid skeleton from 2000 years ago, they would make wild claims that he was an emperor with all sorts of fantasy they can come up with. Creating evidence through MANIPULATION, and taking ADVANTAGE of every little things is, and piece them bit by bit, to the point they can come up with there own theory.
Posts: 76 | From: London | Registered: Jun 2012
| IP: Logged |
posted
I was looking up Pacific Afrocoids when I stumbled across this youtube video of a purported S.Chinese/Papua New Guinean relationship. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n208L0Tvg-k
---------------------------------
LOL That's just an stupid video uploaded by an korean because of an Chinese who claimed that haplogroup O2b and common Korean marker is of Southeast Asian orgin. Haplogroup K exist everywhere in the world, in Europe, Middle East, it has nothing to do with Papuan, it just means unclassified marker. Korean centrists are also an bunch of wacked in the head people.
Posts: 76 | From: London | Registered: Jun 2012
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Confirming Truth: Seriously, Clyde, there is something dementing with your mind! Black does not always mean "Negro" in Chinese literature!!! Indian slaves were described black too! Geez! already!
Just because they were in India doesn't mean they weren't affiliated with black AFricans or were so-called Melanesians. it would not be surprising if these slaves were not the Kunlung or Kunlun/Kwanlun or Kolonitae of early Chinese literature. These were likely the woolly-haired native "Negroid"-looking populations of India and IndoNesia.
The name Kwanlun is also associated with a sacred mountain.
These could also be the blacks of China that Jahiz and Arabic texts talked about.
BTW - Not all blacks in China were "Melanesian" some were of Dravidian stock which were most likely related to the same small gracile "Negroid" groups that occupied Arabia, Iran and Africa at one time.
One thing is certain the fact that the musical instruments or xylophones among some black or dark-skinned tribes of Indo-China were tuned to the same tones as those of Guinea in Africa (as mentioned by John Jackson) means there were likely Negroid or African-affiliated peoples inhabiting the South Seas and southern China in relatively recent times (within the last several thousand years).
Kunlun there are many statuettes of the Kunlun slaves in China also asociated with things like magic and music - as usual
In other words we don't know whether the "Kurung" were early African/Dravidian or whether they were Melanesian (Austric or Papuan) natives who had arrived much earlier.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by SingaporeanROCKS: Facial reconstruction of the Shang, Xia and cultures and civilization during 5000BC were 100% Mongoloid people. Please do not listen to the lies of these Afro-centrists who steals history, their only evidence is manipulating and misinterpreting genetic and historical evidences to their advantages.
" A careful study of the bones of 400 individuals removed from more than 300 graves indicates that the Jiahu ethnic group may be identified with the North Asian Mongolian group, and also with the Xiawanggang and Miaodigou groups in Henan Province and the Dawenkou, Yedian and Xixiahou groups that were later found in Shandong Province. The range of male heights was from 170 to 180 cm. In the late Palaeolithic Zhoukoudian Cave, `unspecialized' Mongoloids were described6. By the Yangshao period (3000 BC± 5000 BC)7, the skull measurements are `physically Chinese' and `modern'6. The physical similarity of the Jiahu people to the later Dawenkou (2600 BC±4300 BC) indicates that the Dawenkou might have descended from the Jiahu, following a slow migration along the middle and lower reaches of the Huai river and the Hanshui valley. "
Racial & Cultural continuity, from Yangshao to the Shang.
" Racially the Shang were Mongoloids, like the preceding Yangshao and Longshan cultures. The Shang bones are indistinguishable from the Longshan. The Shang were not invaders from the Middle East. In addition to racial similarities, the Shang also shared cultural similarities with the Yangshao and Longshan cultures. "
PLEASE don't listen Clyde Winters nonsense on Polynesians in Pacific today are descendants of Xia and Shang, there's no genetic or skeletal evidence to prove it.
Recent genetic has proven that the The Polynesian mtDNA marker B4a1a1 has existed in the Bismarck Archipelago 6000 years ago during the time when there was an very few people, and way before the Taiwanese aborigines (ancient ones, not like modern ones) have even migrated to Pacific and intermixed.
You are the dealing with the kind of people who could even claim that God was black man, if he had little dark skin or little curly hair. Afro-censtrists have been ridiculously claiming every civilization in the world. They keep taking advantages of the way sculptures were built and anything that has dark skin, wide nose, curly hair for their own history manipulation, when these traits are not stricly to negroid. But at the same time the would claim that Dravidian or Tamils as black, despite the fact they are straight haired, hairy bodied, facial haired, long nose-bridged people, they would claim them as black. They even claimed Mediterranean people like spanish, italians have darker skinned due to mixing with black. Despite the fact that Australian aborigines have different skull and genetics to African, afro-centrist would still claim them as their own. Despite the fact that Australoid are an much older race and the most genetically distanced to african negroid they would STILL would still claim them as one of their own, because afro-censtrists want's to claim ancient homosapiens as the same race as african black. And if they ever founded one australoid skeleton from 2000 years ago, they would make wild claims that he was an emperor with all sorts of fantasy they can come up with. Creating evidence through MANIPULATION, and taking ADVANTAGE of every little things is, and piece them bit by bit, to the point they can come up with there own theory.
Jiahu culture is related to the Dawenkou. Dawenkou was a Negro culture--not mongoloid.
Negroid skeletons dating to the early periods of Southern Chinese history have been found in Shangdong, Jiantung, Sichuan, Yunnan, Pearl River delta and Jiangxi especially at the initial sites of Chingliengang (Ch'ing-lien-kang) and Mazhiabang (Ma chia-pang) phases ( see: K.C. Chang, The archaeology of ancient China, (Yale University Press:New Haven,1977) p.76) . The Chingliengang culture is often referred to as the Ta-wen-k'ou (Dawenkou) culture of North China.
The presence of Negroid skeletal remains at Dawenkou sites, as noted by Dr. Chang, make it clear that Negroes were still in the North in addition to South China. The Dawenkou culture predates the Lung-shan culture which is associated with the Xia civilization.
Chinese nationalist are attempting to re-write Chinese history so they can steal the negro rise of civilization in China.
posted
xylophones originated in Southeast Asia among the Austronesian speaking people and later came to Africa in 500 BC not the negrito or Africans.
" According to Nettl, however, it originated in southeast Asia and came to Africa c. 500 AD when a group of Malayo-Polynesian speaking peoples migrated to Africa. One piece of evidence for this is the similarity between East African xylophone orchestras and Javanese and Balinese gamelan orchestras. "
Nettl, Bruno, Music in Primitive Culture, Harvard University Press, Cambridge, Massachusetts, 1969, SBN 674-59000-7, pp.18-19, 100. Quoted at; https://theoryofmusic.wordpress.com/page/176/
Kunlun was also an term used to refer to Malaysians and other dark skinned Mongoloid people like filipino, Malaysians, Taiwan aborigines in the past. For example the term would apply to these Taiwan aborigines kids.
It's also interesting to say this, I've read from an Taiwanese site written in Chinese saying that according to their anthropology studies of ancient Austronesian or Taiwanese aborigine such as the amis tribe for example were dark brown skinned. Those amis or Taiwanese aborigine with dark skinned tribe it's what they original amis used to looked like 3000 years ago and that Filipino look is actually closer to what Austronesians used to look compared with modern Taiwanese aborigines. He claimed that the lighter skinned amis today have morphological recently or due to some recent admixture with Chinese
This is what ancient Taiwanese aborigines/amis looked like before.
ONE MORE THING, I understand why people would consider Negrito Africans but I really don't get the part why some people would think Dravidians are Black when they look nothing alike( aside from their skin), there even more genetically distant to African than Europeans are. Their nose, eyes, hair, beards is nothing like the traits of African.
Posts: 76 | From: London | Registered: Jun 2012
| IP: Logged |
quote:Jiahu culture is related to the Dawenkou. Dawenkou was a Negro culture--not mongoloid.
Negroid skeletons dating to the early periods of Southern Chinese history have been found in Shangdong, Jiantung, Sichuan, Yunnan, Pearl River delta and Jiangxi especially at the initial sites of Chingliengang (Ch'ing-lien-kang) and Mazhiabang (Ma chia-pang) phases ( see: K.C. Chang, The archaeology of ancient China, (Yale University Press:New Haven,1977) p.76) . The Chingliengang culture is often referred to as the Ta-wen-k'ou (Dawenkou) culture of North China.
The presence of Negroid skeletal remains at Dawenkou sites, as noted by Dr. Chang, make it clear that Negroes were still in the North in addition to South China. The Dawenkou culture predates the Lung-shan culture which is associated with the Xia civilization.
Chinese nationalist are attempting to re-write Chinese history so they can steal the negro rise of civilization in China.
That is NONSENSE. Dr Chang has never mentioned the presence of any Negro skeleton, you obviously got your source from an written Afro-centrist books that twisted and manipulated it's meaning. I've read what Dr Chang said in Chinese, he didn't mentioned no negro skeleton but rather those skeletons had straight hair and were more similar to the polynesian-mongoloid type like this. Also I've not read any Chinese historin who associated Xia civilization with Dawenkou culture, NONE. This BS book was clearly written by an Afro-centrist.
According to the change he claimed they were of mongoloid-polynesian looking type. He also claimed that the very old type of Southeast Asian Mongoloid look like Dawenkou.
In other words they would have looked like this rather than negrito.
Posts: 76 | From: London | Registered: Jun 2012
| IP: Logged |
posted
(Btw, sorry for my English I know I still need to learn and practice more )
Xia Civilization had nothing to do with Dawenkou, nobody knows what culture there connected so the fact that somebody is claiming it's related with Dawenkou shows this guy is making B.S that something neither Chinese or European archaeologists have suggested.
Most Chinese archaeologists[2] identify the Erlitou culture as the site of the Xia Dynasty, while most Western archaeologists remain unconvinced of the connection between the Erlitou culture and the Xia Dynasty since there are no extant written records linking Erlitou with the official history. IN OTHER WORD, nobody knows but is is for sure that people who inhabited in the Xia Civilization were all mongoloids and like modern Chinese.
Posts: 76 | From: London | Registered: Jun 2012
| IP: Logged |
posted
ONE MORE THING, Jiahu were always an north Asian mongoloid like North Chinese but old Dawenkou culture had an old mongoloid look like taiwan aborigines or like an Polynesian mongoloid look, but later Dawenkou culture would later become physically indistinguishable to Jiahu
舞阳贾湖: Volume 2 河南省文物考古硏究所 - 1999 - 1041 pages
" Through the study of the more than 300 burials and 400 human skeletal specimens, we understand that the Jiahu people belonged to the North Asian type Mongoloid. "
Posts: 76 | From: London | Registered: Jun 2012
| IP: Logged |
posted
Here's what an Jiahu looked like from 7000 BC an straight hair mongoloid with facial characteristics of northern mongolian group like northern Chinese and Tibetan. DO NOT GET ANY WRONG IDEAS about the brown shades or yellow shades, Chinese anthropologist have not been to able determined whether he was light skinned or lighter brown, but racially he looked just like what the neolithic Chinese have looked like.
Here's what an women from Dawenkou looked like from 5000 BC. Anthropologist determined she was an straight haired mongoloid women but has characteristics that are more similar to the old Taiwan aborigines, polynesians, Native Americans(Ameridians). Again no info on her skin color.
Posts: 76 | From: London | Registered: Jun 2012
| IP: Logged |
posted
The appearance of an 5000 BC Dawenkou culture women shows that their Mongoloid morphology is similer to old Taiwan aborigine, Polynesians, Native american Ameridians looked, thousand year later they would looked exactly like East Asian mongoloid Jiahu.
Posts: 76 | From: London | Registered: Jun 2012
| IP: Logged |
quote:Drinking, singing and dancing are expected to take place deep in the mountains of Miaoli and Hsinchu when the "Ritual of the Little Black People" (矮靈祭) is performed by the Saisiyat tribe once again this weekend.
For the past 100 years or so, the Saisiyat tribe (賽夏族) has performed the songs and rites of the festival to bring good harvests, ward off bad luck and keep alive the spirit of a race of people who are said to have preceded all others in Taiwan.
In fact, the short, black men the festival celebrates are one of the most ancient types of modern humans on this planet and their kin still survive in Asia today. They are said to be diminutive Africoids and are variously called Pygmies, Negritos and Aeta. They are found in the Philippines, northern Malaysia, Thailand, Sumatra in Indonesia and other places.
Chinese historians called them "black dwarfs" in the Three Kingdoms period (AD 220 to AD 280) and they were still to be found in China during the Qing dynasty (1644 to 1911). In Taiwan they were called the "Little Black People" and, apart from being diminutive, they were also said to be broad-nosed and dark-skinned with curly hair.
posted
^SingaporeanROCKS knows all of that. Facts and truth have no meaning for this brain defective Albino. He just wants to troll, it's best to ignore him, and the other ignorant losers like him.
Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
"The Former Tang History describes the homeland of the kunlun people: "The people living to the south of Linyi [present-day Vietnam] have curly hair and black bodies and are commonly called kunlun.,, The description of the country of Zhenla ~ HI (present-day Cambodia) also includes information on the kunlun: ~'The country of Zhenla is northwest of Linyi. It was originally a dependent of Funan. It is of the kunlun type..." J. Wilensky, "The Magical Kunlun and 'Devil Slaves,''' Sino-Platonic Papers, 122 (July, 2002) page 6
"One lengthy tale set in the early eighth century describes the amusements of the scholar Tao Xian and the amazing feats of his kunlun slave Mo He" p. 12 (J. Wilensky)
Early depiction of two Kunlun, Kwanlun or "Kurung" slaves. Kunlun was the early name for the Qumr or Khmer of the region of Cambodia, Thailand, Burma and Funan ("Nokor Phnam" or Vietnam) whom Muslim writers (Persians and other Arabized people) designated as "Zangi". "Qumr comes out as Kunlun in Chinese texts and is related to the name Kunlun cengqi..."
Invariably these Kunlun "IndoChinese" are described as short black-skinned with very curly hair magical, metallurgical and navigational powers.
Their sea goddess Mao Shan is related to the word "Machin" or "Masin" used by Arabs while Sin is the name for Java according to Yaqut. Java/Singapore/Indonesia/Malaysia was also the land of "Kunlun" in the time of the Tang dynasty.
Jahiz and several Midieval Arab writers designate their lands as "Sin" and "Masin" and refer to these folk as among "the Sudani".
“Ma’bar is the last part of India then comes the country of Sin the first part of which is Java reached by a difficult and fatal sea.” Yaqut al Rumi 12th century Byzantine Arab.
These names are often wrongly thought to be a reference to the modern China and the Chinese who are of course not black.
Buddha from the Mon-Khmer/Qumr or "Kunlun" culture
The black kingdoms of the Qumr/Kunlun were later especially after the 11th century settled by other ethnic groups like the Thai coming down from the north.
"Ibn Sa'id, writing about 1250, tells us that some of the Khmer (Qumr) expelled by the Chinese eventually reached Madagascar."
“Among the Sūdān are the Zanj, the Ḥabasha, the Fazzān, Barbar, the Qibṭ, the Nūba, Zaghāwa, Marw, the Sind, the Hind, the Qumār, the Dabīla, the Ṣīn and Māṣīn” Al-Jāḥiz, Rasā’il al-Jāḥiz, ‘Abd al-Salām Muḥammad Hārūn ed., 4 vols., (Cairo: Maktabat al-Khānjī, 1964), 1: 216.
These Khmers or Qumr were also the original "Nagas".
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
The "Old Tang history" was written in 945 A.D. and the "New Tang history" finished before 1060.
"The Former Tang History describes the homeland of the kunlun people: "The people living to the south of Linyi [present-day Vietnam] have curly hair and black bodies and are commonly called kunlun.,, The description of the country of Zhenla ~ HI (present-day Cambodia) also includes information on the kunlun: ~ 'The country of Zhenla is northwest of Linyi. It was originally a dependent of Funan. It is of the kunlun type..." J. Wilensky, "The Magical Kunlun and 'Devil Slaves,''' Sino-Platonic Papers, 122 (July, 2002) page 6.
"Besides the Zanj of Africa. Masudi wrote of another Zanj Empire in Asia centered in Indochina and spreading into Malaysia and Indonesia. 'India is a vast country,' said Masudi, 'having many seas and mountains, and borders upon the empire of ez-Zanij, which is the kingdom of the Maharaj, the king of the ilslands, whose dominions form the frontier between India and China, and are considered as part of India.' He referred to the 'splendor and high civilization' of these Asiatic Zanj and stated that 'the Maharaj is lord of the sixth sea and king of the islands from which drugs and spices are exported and that the population and the number of the troops of his kingdom cannot be counted ...(Meadows of Gold and Mines of Gems...Acording to Masudi , the people of this island empire were black." John Jackson p. 279 Man God and Civilization 1972.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
The Samre Pear/Por of Cambodia (negritos) are also called Proto-Malays. Their ancestors may have been the first people to domesticate the dog at PhuQuoc island. They also may have invented bronze, perhaps accidentally, as there is a river not far west in Thailand with natural deposits of copper on 1 side and tin on the other side near ancient ceramic craft sites.
The island of Basilan between Mindanao and Borneo is rich in magnetic iron. I think magnetic compasses were first used by Negrito & Yakkan people there and brought to China, along with proto-gunpowder from volcanic sulfur & guano/nitrite Borneo caves and the Borneo blowpipe and fire piston/pistol (cf ancient airbrushed hand prints in Sulawesi cave).
A southern island of Japan is claimed (not verified) to have 150cm pygmy skeletons, and 2 pygmy fossils have been found along the Narmada River Central India near the Bimbetke caves (which have painted walls).
Note: Kunlun mountains are adjacent to the Tarim basin of Takla Makan desert, Turkestan, China. The Malay word for mountain is gunung, this may be why Kunlun was applied to Austronesian volcanic isles. The Bajau/Sinama of the Sulu Sea refer to their ancestors as ebu, this is also what the pygmies of Flores refer to their ancestors, it is related to ibu(mother) abu/abba(father).
Per Dana: "Invariably these Kunlun "IndoChinese" are described as short black-skinned with very curly hair magical, metallurgical and navigational powers.
Their sea goddess Mao Shan is related to the word "Machin" or "Masin" used by Arabs while Sin is the name for Java according to Yaqut. Java/Singapore/Indonesia/Malaysia was also the land of "Kunlun" in the time of the Tang dynasty.
Jahiz and several Midieval Arab writers designate their lands as "Sin" and "Masin" and refer to these folk as among "the Sudani". "
Posts: 2021 | From: Miami | Registered: Aug 2014
| IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic