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Clarence Walker encourages black Americans to discard Afrocentrism July, 2001 Elisabeth Sherwin -- gizmo@ dcn.davis.ca.us Enterprise staff writer --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
UC Davis History Professor Clarence E. Walker doesn't have any plans to visit Cal State Long Beach or Temple University in Philadelphia soon.
That's where two of the most vocal proponents of Afrocentrism (Ron Karenga and Molefi Asante, respectively) teach.
Walker doesn't think he'd get an especially warm reception on either campus because his most recent book, "We Can't Go Home Again: An Argument About Afrocentrism" (Oxford University Press, 2001), is devoted to knocking their theories about a black African cradle of civilization out of the ring.
According to Walker's book, Afrocentrism encourages black Americans to discard their recent history, with its inescapable white presence, and to embrace an empowering vision of their African (specifically Egyptian) ancestors as the source of Western civilization, a dubious claim to distant glory that fails to come to grips with complex modern problems.
Walker describes Afrocentrism as a form of totalitarian groupthink, devoid of historical accuracy.
"Afrocentrism is a mythology that is racist, reactionary, and essentially therapeutic," writes Walker. "It suggests that nothing important has happened in black history since the time of the pharaohs and thus trivializes the history of black Americans. Afrocentrism places an emphasis on Egypt that is, to put it bluntly, absurd.
"I've always been interested in critical history," said Walker in an interview at his on-campus office. He is finding his views at odds with those who don't want anything critical said about blacks.
Walker has been an American history professor at Davis for 16 years. He grew up in an integrated neighborhood in West Berkeley and graduated from Berkeley High School. He earned his Ph.D. from Cal in 1976.
He is especially interested in the history of race and racial ideas and will be teaching a class this winter on the novel as social history. He is impatient with people who don't think critically, and he doesn't care if those people are black or white.
"There is no evidence that the ancient Egyptians were black as we understand that term today," he said.
"Afrocentrism essentializes history, caricatures Africa and holds out the past to be recaptured," he said. "It's not smart and it's not practical."
However, over the past 10 years it has achieved some academic currency, which upsets Walker.
"Black people are not the same today as they were in the past," he says. "We are of African descent, but we are not African."
He says Afrocentrism caricatures Africa by suggesting that that vast continent has one uniform culture.
"And glorifying history doesn't give us a great purchase on the contemporary world," he said. "In the post-industrial American society, no one should worry about whether Cleopatra was black or white," he added.
Walker said his parents came from southern Texas. He was born in Houston in 1941. His family then moved to California. He has never been to Africa and he has no desire to go there.
"The argument about origins misses the point," he said. "It's not your origins that are important but what you do with them. You have to take responsibility."
He understands that the Afrocentrist movement is designed in part to give blacks self-esteem and a sense of community. Walker shrugs this off, too. "Fairy tales aren't going to get it." "In terms of the education of black children, it hasn't done much," he said. "It may have given some kids a false sense of pride and that's not terribly useful."
Instead of promoting the mythology of Afrocentrism, Walker would like to see colleges and universities hire professors of African history who know what they're talking about.
At UCD, he'd like to see a professor of West African history who could teach classes on pre-colonial Africa and the slave trade.
"Students would learn that blacks in the United States didn't come out of a void; that there were complex societies in West Africa," he said.
"History is controversial," said Walker. "But how you read the past has all sorts of implications for the present." Walker suggests that there were many cradles of civilization including Egypt, the Nile Valley and China.
"I'm an old-fashioned intellectual critic," said Walker. "I don't like a lot of work being done in the field. No history should be presented as an exercise in celebration.
"What black people really need is a usable present, not a usable past," he added.
Walker said the publication of his book raised some eyebrows in black circles.
But he has not head from Molefi Asante.
"There's nothing to talk about with them," he said. "Just because you want to believe the world was created by black people doesn't make it so."
Posts: 430 | From: Tahrir | Registered: Dec 2011
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Black American history: 1450-Present; 19th Century social and political history of the United States. History of Sexuality, Film and Popular Culture.
Leonard Jeffries Jr. (born 1937) is an American professor of black studies at the City College of New York, part of the City University of New York. He achieved national prominence in the early 1990s for his controversial statements about Jews and other white people. In a 1991 speech he claimed that Jews financed the slave trade, used the movie industry to hurt black people, and that whites are "ice people" while Africans are "sun people".
Leonard Jeffries on the left.
They are both Black professors, one is an intellectually arrested Negro - and looks it. The other is an intelligent Black Man.
Your purpose in quoting the buffoon is obvious, the question is, how many did you catch with it.Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
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quote:He understands that the Afrocentrist movement is designed in part to give blacks self-esteem and a sense of community.
Spot on.
It's basically an escape to the reality that blacks never built an ancient civilization.
Posts: 2408 | From: My mother's basement | Registered: Dec 2010
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claus3600 - Get used to this problem. Professor Walker no-doubt made those comments with the most sincere belief in their truthfulness, and best intentions toward the betterment of Blacks.
The problem is that he is a Negro (a reminder: that means - "You dumb fuching Nigger"). Because of their absolute control over media and academia, the Albinos can, and do, hoist these chosen Negroes upon us.
They are not chosen for their brilliance, quite the contrary, they are chosen for the malleability of their low function minds. The Albinos teach them whatever they want to feature to Blacks, and these Negroes dutifully teach it to us.
Nowhere in the process do we get to vet them, or in any way, control them. Our only weapon is ridicule, and we should not hesitate to use it. When one of these Negroes raises his head and says something stupid, jump on him, tell him what a Negro he is. Perhaps then, the next time, he will try to think a little deeper.
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quote: Egypt Rome Indus Valley Sumeria Babylon Greece
Egypt? No. Rome? Not pure, too much Afro Asiatic ancestry and same for Greece. Indus Valley? Someone throw this guy a world map. Pakistanis and Indians are white now? Please provide the Haplogroups and related evidence for that one. Same with Sumeria and Babylon.
Posts: 2508 | From: . | Registered: Nov 2011
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quote: Egypt Rome Indus Valley Sumeria Babylon Greece
Egypt? No. Rome? Not pure, too much Afro Asiatic ancestry and same for Greece. Indus Valley? Someone throw this guy a world map. Pakistanis and Indians are white now? Please provide the Haplogroups and related evidence for that one. Same with Sumeria and Babylon.
Afro-Asiatic is a language group which originated with Caucasoids, most scholars place its homeland in the Levant. It was later taken to Africa. Negroid language in contrast is Niger-Congo. So more fail on your behalf again.
Many Indians are heavily Caucasoid admixed, you only have to look at bollywood -
Posts: 2408 | From: My mother's basement | Registered: Dec 2010
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Clarence Walker again? Yawn. This is warmed over pablum already dealt with 2 or more years ago on ES. It is the same stale bullshiit then, as it is now. Walker's tome is stale "Black Athena" stuff from the mid 1990s mostly. The field has already moved on. In his book he presents very little discussion of the evidence on the table re the African genesis of Ancient Egypt. Even Mary LEfkowitz back in the early/mid 1990s conceded that the core Egyptian population came from the tropical south, and were not alleged "Caucasoid invaders" from the north. Walker barely manages a few footnotes to Lefkowitz on the data, and he shies away from even minimal discussion of the substantial archaeological, anthropological, skeletal, metric and DNA data available to him in 2001. Below are credible mainstream Egyptologists, AND Mary Lefkowitz who acknowledge the debt of Egypt to African peoples. All of these are sources were available to Walker before he wrote his book.
Walker's analysis is amazingly shallow. He discusses Yurco and his disavowal of race in Ancient Egypt, but then swiftly glides to a roundup of negative Egyptian statements on Nubians, neglecting to show that Yurco ALSO said that the people ethnically the closest to the Egyptians were the Nubians, and that indeed, there were several Pharaohs of Nubian descent, including some of the 12th Dynasty, one of the most famous Dynasties in Egyptian history- and well before the 25th Dynasty. And the Egyptians also made numerous negative statements about "white" Middle Easterners, but these, curiously, do not find their way in a "racial roundup" of negativity in Walker's writing. Now why is that?
ANd it is unclear how analyses of cranial or skeletal data putting Egypt in its African context is "racist, reactionary of therepeutic." Walker's tome is a polemic- devoid of data, lacking even the insight and balance of Lefkowitz, and often a self-parody of its proclaimed purpose. Few Black Americans in the heat of the "Black Athena" era for example, took seriously the notion that Ancient Egypt is responsible for ALL Western Civilization. Even Asante never made that claim. What they were interested in is the suppressed information as to the strands of INFLUENCE of Egypt in Western Civ. And far form "group think"- they want rather an open dialog, a balanced conversation where black history is not distorted and denied by racists.
And there is and was no dire cloud of doom sweeping thru the schools as "Afrocentrism" reputedly "took over" curricula. Nonsense. In fact, aside from a few well publicized cases, such as certain dubious aspects of the "Portland Baseline Essays"- circa the late 1980s and early 1990s in a few school districts, so-called "Afrocentrism" has been a trivial force in the education of black youth in public schools. In fact the "back to basics" push, and the testing and accountability focus under Reagan, Bush I and Bush II allowed little room for alleged "swamping of schools" with waves of reputed "Afrocentric thought."
Walker's critique has some weight as regards EXTREME, so-called "Afrocentrists" - the fanciful "kente cloth" shouters you hear on the street-corners during Black History Month saying extreme things, or SOME extreme academics, or miscellaneous cranks and curmudgeons. But this occurs in EVERY population. It is nothing "black" at all. In any event, hard data, both BEFORE Walker and after Walker renders talk about "therapy" completely irrelevant. Most thoughtful students of African bio-history are not interested in "therapy." They want the facts, and a balanced, non-racist presentation of the data at hand.
To his credit, Walker does acknowledge that many early black writers faced a massive, almost totalitarian system of racism and racist scholarship, from elementary schools to colleges and private institutes. They had to defend their people polemically, from this racist onslaught, and did so, lacking access to up to date sources and research. SOme mistakes in interpretation and data were inevitable, Even the great John Hope Franklin back in the day was barred from some segregated research libraries, unable to examine critical sources. Those he found, too often, presented an unrelenting picture of distortion and racism. Walker does get this part right somewhat.
Conservative mainstream Oxford Encyclopedia of Ancient Egypt shows ancient Egypt derived from an African cultural sub-stratum. This data was readily available to walker, if he had troubled to look, and are not "Afrocentric" imaginings, but data by conservative white scholars.
quote:
"The evidence also points to linkages to other northeast African peoples, not coincidentally approximating the modern range of languages closely related to Egyptian in the Afro-Asiatic group (formerly called Hamito-Semetic). These linguistic similarities place ancient Egyptian in a close relationship with languages spoken today as far west as Chad, and as far south as Somalia. Archaeological evidence also strongly supports an African origin. A widespread northeastern African cultural assemblage, including distinctive multiple barbed harpoons and pottery decorated with dotted wavy line patterns, appears during the early Neolithic (also known as the Aqualithic, a reference to the mild climate of the Sahara at this time). Saharan and Sudanese rock art from this time resembles early Egyptian iconography. Strong connections between Nubian (Sudanese) and Egyptian material culture continue in later Neolithic Badarian culture of Upper Egypt. Similarities include black-topped wares, vessels with characteristic ripple-burnished surfaces, a special tulip-shaped vessel with incised and white-filled decoration, palettes, and harpoons...
Other ancient Egyptian practices show strong similarities to modern African cultures including divine kingship, the use of headrests, body art, circumcision, and male coming-of-age rituals, all suggesting an African substratum or foundation for Egyptian civilization (rather than diffusion from sub-Saharan Africa, as claimed by some Afrocentric scholars.)"
Source: Donald Redford (2001) The Oxford encyclopedia of ancient Egypt, Volume 3. Oxford University Press. p. 28
[Quote by another conservative mainstream scholar: - African American analysis of Kmt is based on hard data. Alleged "feelings" or "self-esteem" is irrelevant.]
"There is now a sufficient body of evidence from modern studies of skeletal remains to indicate that the ancient Egyptians, especially southern Egyptians, exhibited physical characteristics that are within the range of variation for ancient and modern indigenous peoples of the Sahara and tropical Africa.." (Nancy C. Lovell, " Egyptians, physical anthropology of," in Encyclopedia of the Archaeology of Ancient Egypt, ed. Kathryn A. Bard and Steven Blake Shubert, ( London and New York: Routledge, 1999) pp 328-332)
ANd from Lefkowtiz, Lovell, and Yurco:
Lefkowitz & Lovell
Yurco
RECAP FROM EARLIER THREAD
“African Americans" are not obsessively tracing their history back to Egypt as alleged by assorted blowhards and pundits. They don't need to any such tracing, nor do they need "permission" from self-styled Arab nativists, alleged "Egyptian" natives/nativists, or white people to study and comment on Egypt.
Informed African-Americans do not conceive of Egypt as being created out of thin air. Nor do they rely on the truism that "Egypt is in Africa." They begin at at the Saharan zone- once a lush greenbelt covering over one-third of Africa, and which provided the main source for the peopling of the Nile Valley, and laid the foundation, and was the genesis of the Nile Valley Civilization, as well as being a key part of the great West African polities and cultures.
Said informed African Americans don't begin any exploration of African civilizations with Egypt. They start with AFRICA ITSELF, from which the genesis, the foundational elements sprung, that provided the basis or substratum for that civilization. The Sahara is one such central foundational element. It is in that broad Saharan zone for example that the ancients created their huge megaliths of stone, and designed calendars and other astonomical alignments. It is from that broad zone that the cattle cults of NE Africa developed- cults that were to figure so prominently in Egyptian religion. It is from the African genesis that other concepts such as divine kingship, and the art iconography of Egypt developed. It is from the Saharan zone (which extends well into the Sudan) that patterns of technology in pottery, toolmaking, mummification, and numerous other influences emerged that were to distinguish ancient Egypt. And as said earlier, the Sahara, is also a key player in the development of West African civilizations as well- Timbuctu, Mali, Songhai, etc..
ANy "inspiration" taken by African-American begins with a foundation based on the ground, in Africa. African-Americans thus don't need anyone to tell them how they "should" think about Egypt, the Nile Valley, the Sahara or any other part of Africa, nor do they need "clearance" or "approval" from would be, reputed or alleged "concerned Egyptians" or presumptuous white lecturers to place any culture or civilization on the African continent, in its scientifically documented African context.
..................................................... A detailed picture of tropical diversity ...
Posts: 5906 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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Walker is wrong on every count. The major Afrocentric researchers did not use old sources If you compare the citations in these books to date they were originally published you would find they were contemporary.
You can trick the novices into believing the people of the River Valley civilizations were European--but this is because they have failed to study J.A. Rogers, DuBois and Diop.
I have taught research for years. I have taught my students that a good hypothesis is self-generating.
The Afrocentric study of ancient history (ASAH) is based on four hypotheses confirmed by 200 years of research.
The paradigms for ASAH predicted four hypotheses that were unknown at the time the "Ancient Model" of history was developed, to guide the development of scientific knowledge for the africalogical study of early history. These propositions based on the "Ancient Model" are:
(1) If Blacks founded civilization in Asia and Africa , they may have influenced civilization in the Americas.
(2) If Blacks founded civilization in West Asia, Africa and Europe, archaeological data will support their earlier presence in these regions of the world.
(3) If Blacks founded the first civilizations, they also invented writing and other elements of social and scientific technology.
(4) If Blacks founded civilization they probably founded civilization throughout Asia and Europe.
Given the two empirical paradigms and four predicted hypothesse related to the "Ancient Model", africalogical ancient history research increase the precision of the application of afrocentric research methods and scope of research in this area .
These hypotheses make Afrocentric researchers falsificationists. The falsificationists seeks to confirm or disconfirm the four ASAH hypotheses.
Euronuts always claim that Afrocentrism lacks a scientific base but they never provide counter evidence falsifying the four ASAH.
.
-------------------- C. A. Winters Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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Coconut african-americans like Walker, Fake Asian and European writers like Oshun will never define OUR history.
Knowledge is cumulative. In other words we build new knowledge on the research of the giants in our field. From your lack of knowledge about DuBois' it is clear you have no recognition of the fact that what you guys are writing about has already been discussed formerly, and your job should be confirming or disconfirming what these giants wrote.
I teach educational philosophy on occasion. In this class I just don't talk about contemporary educators I also talk about the Greek philosophers.
Charlie I have posted the following previously. I hope you will read it this time and begin to recognize that what Mike, Marc and I write about is part of a 200 year tradition of Afro-American scholarship. Learn to respect your own scholars. Don't let white supremacy continue to blind you to the truths of history.
Afrocentrism, is a mature social science that was founded by Afro-Americans almost 200 years ago.
These men and women provided scholarship based on contemporary archaeological and historical research the African/Black origination of civilization throughout the world. These Afro-American scholars, mostly trained at Harvard University (one of the few Universities that admitted Blacks in the 19th Century) provide the scientific basis the global role played by African people in civilizing the world.
Afrocentrism and the africalogical study of ancient Black civilizations was began by Afro-Americans.
Edward Blyden
The foundation of any mature science is its articulation in an authoritive text (Kuhn, 1996, 136). The africalogical textbooks published by Hopkins (1905), Perry (1893) and Williams (1883) provided the vocabulary themes for further afrocentric social science research.
The pedagogy for ancient africalogical research was well established by the end of the 19th century by African American researchers well versed in the classical languages and knowledge of Greek and Latin. Cornish and Russwurm (1827) in the Freedom Journal, were the first African Americans to discuss and explain the "Ancient Model" of history.
These afrocentric social scientists used the classics to prove that the Blacks founded civilization in Egypt, Ethiopia, Babylon and Ninevah. Cornish and Russwurm (1827) made it clear that archaeological research supported the classical, or "Ancient Model" of history.
Edward Blyden (1869) also used classical sources to discuss the ancient history of African people. In his work he not only discussed the evidence for Blacks in West Asia and Egypt, he also discussed the role of Blacks in ancient America (Blyden, 1869, 78).
By 1883, africalogical researchers began to publish book on African American history. G.W. Williams (1883) wrote the first textbook on African American history. In the History of the Negro Race in America, Dr. Williams provided the schema for all future africalogical history text.
Dr. Williams (1883) confirmed the classical traditions for Blacks founding civilization in both Africa (Egypt, Ethiopia) and West Asia. In addition, to confirming the "Ancient Model" of history, Dr. Williams (1883) also mentioned the presence of Blacks in Indo-China and the Malay Peninsula. Dr. Williams was trained at Howard.
A decade later R.L. Perry (1893) also presented evidence to confirm the classical traditions of Blacks founding Egypt, Greece and the Mesopotamian civilization. He also provided empirical evidence for the role of Blacks in Phoenicia, thus increasing the scope of the ASAH paradigms.
Pauline E. Hopkins (1905) added further articulation of the ASAH paradigms of the application of these paradigms in understanding the role of Blacks in West Asia and Africa. Hopkins (1905) provided further confirmation of the role of Blacks in Southeast Asia, and expanded the scope of africalogical research to China (1905).
This review of the 19th century africalogical social scientific research indicate confirmation of the "Ancient Model" for the early history of Blacks. We also see a movement away from self-published africalogical research, and publication of research, and the publication of research articles on afrocentric themes, to the publication of textbooks.
It was in these books that the paradigms associated with the "Ancient Model" and ASAH were confirmed, and given reliability by empirical research. It was these texts which provided the pedagogic vehicles for the perpetuation of the africalogical normal social science.
The afrocentric textbooks of Hopkins (1905), Perry (1893) and Williams (1883) proved the reliability and validity of the ASAH paradigms. The discussion in these text of contemporary scientific research findings proving the existence of ancient civilizations in Egypt, Nubia-Sudan (Kush), Mesopotamia, Palestine and North Africa lent congruency to the classical literature which pointed to the existence of these civilizations and these African origins ( i.e., the children of Ham= Khem =Kush?).
The authors of the africalogical textbooks reported the latest archaeological and anthropological findings. The archaeological findings reported in these textbooks added precision to their analysis of the classical and Old Testament literature. This along with the discovery of artifacts on the ancient sites depicting Black\African people proved that the classical and Old Testament literature, as opposed to the "Aryan Model", objectively identified the Black\African role in ancient history. And finally, these textbooks confirmed that any examination of references in the classical literature to Blacks in Egypt, Kush, Mesopotamia and Greece\Crete exhibited constancy to the evidence recovered from archaeological excavations in the Middle East and the Aegean. They in turn disconfirmed the "Aryan Model", which proved to be a falsification of the authentic history of Blacks in early times.
The creation of africalogical textbooks provided us with a number of facts revealing the nature of the afrocentric ancient history paradigms. They include a discussion of:
1) the artifacts depicting Blacks found at ancient sites
recovered through archaeological excavation;
2) the confirmation of the validity of the classical and Old
Testament references to Blacks as founders of civilization in Africa and Asia;
3) the presence of isolated pockets of Blacks existing outside Africa; and
4) that the contemporary Arab people in modern Egypt are not the descendants of the ancient Egyptians.
The early africalogical textbooks also outlined the africalogical themes research should endeavor to study. A result, of the data collected by the africalogical ancient history research pioneers led to the development of three facts by the end of the 19th century, which needed to be solved by the afrocentric paradigms: (1) What is the exact relationship of ancient Egypt, to Blacks in other parts of Africa;
(2) How and when did Blacks settle America, Asia and Europe;
(3) What are the contributions of the Blacks to the rise, and cultural expression ancient Black\African civilizations;
(4) Did Africans settle parts of America in ancient times.
As you can see the structure of Afrocentrism were made long before Boas and the beginning of the 20th Century.In fact , I would not be surprised if Boas learned what he talked about from the early Afrocentric researchers discussed in this post.
As you can see Afro-Americans have be writing about the Global history of ancient Black civilizations for almost 200 years. It was Afro-Americans who first mentioned the African civilizations of West Africa and the Black roots of Egypt. These Afro-Americans made Africa a historical part of the world.
Afro-American scholars not only highlighted African history they also discussed the African/Black civilizations developed by African people outside Africa over a hundred years before Bernal and Boas.
Your history of what you call "negrocentric" or Black Studies is all wrong. It was DuBois who founded Black/Negro Studies, especially Afro-American studies given his work on the slave trade and sociological and historical studies of Afro-Americans. He mentions in the World and Africa about the Jews and other Europeans who were attempting to take over the field. Hansberry There is no one who can deny the fact that Leo Hansberry founded African studies in the U.S., not the Jews.Hansberry was a professor at Howard University.
Moreover, Bernal did not initiate any second wave of "negro/Blackcentric" study for ancient Egyptian civilization. Credit for this social science push is none other than Chiek Diop, who makes it clear that he was influenced by DuBois.
DuBois
These scholars recognized that the people of ancient Greece, Southeast Asia and Indo-China were African people. When giants in study of Afrocentrism discussed Blacks in Asia they were talking about people of African descent. So when you claim that these civilizations should be outside the study area of Afrocentric scholars you don't know what you're talking about.
These researchers used anthropological, archaeological historical and linguistic evidence to support their conclusions. It is only natural that these well founded hypotheses developed by these scholars can be supported by population genetics.
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in the Western Hemisphere,Negro History Bulletin, 38 (7), 452-456.
Williams, G.W. (1869). History of the Negro Race in America. New York: G.P. Putnam.
Wimby, D. (1980). The Greco-Roman Tradition concerning Ethiopia and Egypt, black books bulletin, 7(1), 14-19, 25.
Winters, C.A. (1977). The influence of the Mande scripts on ancient American writing systems", Bulletin l'de IFAN, T39, serie B, no. 2 (1977), pp.941-967.
Winters, C.A. (1979). Manding Scripts in the New World", Journal of African Civilizations, l(1), 80-97.
Winters,C.A. (December 1981/ January 1982). Mexico's Black Heritage. The Black Collegian, 76-84.
Winters, C.A. (1983a). "The Ancient Manding Script". In Blacks
in Science:Ancient and Modern. (ed.) by Ivan van Sertima, (New Brunswick: Transaction Books) pp.208-215.
__________. (1983b). "Les Fondateurs de la Grece venaient d'Afrique en passant par la Crete". Afrique Histoire (Dakar), no.8:13-18.
_________. (1983c) "Famous Black Greeks Important in the development of Greek Culture". Return to the Source,2(1):8.
________.(1983d). "Blacks in Ancient China, Part 1, The Founders
of Xia and Shang", Journal of Black Studies 1 (2), 8-13.
________. (1984a). "Blacks in Europe before the Europeans".
Return to the Source, 3(1):26-33.
Winters, C.A. (1984b). Blacks in Ancient America, Colorlines, 3(2), 27-28.
Winters, C.A. (1984c). Africans found first American Civilization , African Monitor, l , pp.16-18.
_________.(1985a). "The Indus Valley Writing and related
Scripts of the 3rd Millennium BC". India Past and
Present, 2(1):13-19.
__________. (1985b). "The Proto-Culture of the Dravidians,
Manding and Sumerians". Tamil Civilization,3(1):1-9.
__________. (1985c). "The Far Eastern Origin of the Tamils",
Journal of Tamil Studies , no.27, pp.65-92.
__________.(1986). The Migration Routes of the Proto-Mande.
The Mankind Quarterly,27 (1), 77-96.
_________.(1986b). Dravidian Settlements in Ancient Polynesia.
India Past and Present, 3 (2), 225-241.
__________. (1988). "Common African and Dravidian Place Name
Elements". South Asian Anthropologist, 9(1):33-36.
__________. (1989a). "Tamil, Sumerian, Manding and the Genetic
Model". International Journal of Dravidian Linguistics,18(1):98-127.
__________. (1989b). "Review of Dr. Asko Parpola's 'The Coming of the Aryans'",International Journal of Dravidian Linguistics, 18(2):98-127.
__________. (1990). "The Dravido-Harappan Colonization of Central Asia". Central Asiatic Journal, 34(1/2):120-144.
___________. (1991). "The Proto-Sahara". The Dravidian Encyclopaedia, (Trivandrum: International School of Dravidian Linguistics) pp.553-556. Volume l.
----------.(1994). Afrocentrism: A valid frame of reference, Journal of Black Studies, 25 (2), 170-190.
_________.(1994b). The Dravidian and African laguages, International Journal of Dravidian Linguistics, 23 (1), 34-52.
________.2007. Afrocentrism Myth or Science.www.lulu.com Here
Woodson, C.G. & Wesley, C.H. (1972). The Negro in Our History. Washington, D.C. Associated Publisher.
Get up off your knees and learn from the Afro-American scholars who began the study of Blacks in ancient history.
In conclusion, Afrocentrism is a mature social science. A social science firmly rooted in the scholarship of Afro-American researchers lasting almost 200 years. Researchers like Marc Washington, Mike and I are continuing a tradition of scholarship began 20 decades ago. All we are doing is confirming research by DuBois and others, that has not been disconfirmed over the past 200 years.
Aluta continua.....The struggle continues.....
-------------------- C. A. Winters Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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^I wonder if anyone has noticed that when a claim like "Egyptians were White" is made: all discussion on more important new subjects are abandoned, so as to defend Black Egypt.
Why if I was a suspicious person, I would think that the Albinos were playing us. We can't very well move forward, if all it takes is a bogus claim, to get us to abandon new thoughts and new discussions.
Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
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Negroids in ancient times were confined to sub-sahara africa, until they were taken captive as slaves and taken to Egypt, and eventually Europe.
Posts: 2408 | From: My mother's basement | Registered: Dec 2010
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As you can see the Negroid is only indigenous to Sub-Sahara africa. Caucasoids are native to Europe, Middle-East, a segment of India and other large segments of Eurasia.
Posts: 2408 | From: My mother's basement | Registered: Dec 2010
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quote:Get up off your knees and learn from the Afro-American scholars who began the study of Blacks in ancient history.
And yet Dubois, your hero, was heavily white admixed with Dutch and English ancestry.
Blacks couldn't even start their own afrocentric scholarship (as bogus as it is). lol.
African-Americans are mutts -
The percentage of White European ancestry in African Americans has been given as 25 to 28% (Putnam, 1961, p. 92), among other figures; a 1998 study of genetic markers of 1022 self-identified African Americans from nine big cities showed they were 16.4% European, or about 5/6 African and 1/6 European. (Parra, 1998; also, Rosenberg, 2002). (Shriver, 2003) found that African Americans have 75% - 90% African ancestry, 25% - 10% White European.
Zaharan, Oshun, Mike111 and clyde are all in fact partially white. Its why african-americans are least sympathetic to white nationalists who want to preserve the white race, as they are mixed-breeds or mutts.
Posts: 2408 | From: My mother's basement | Registered: Dec 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Confirming Truth: He is right and I admire the way he qualified it. Very well crafted language. The man knows what he is talking about.
quote:Originally posted by claus3600: "There is no evidence that the ancient Egyptians were black as we understand that term today," he said.
For that comment alone, Clarence Walker can be disregarded.
quote:Originally posted by cassiterides: Who is indigenous to where?
As you can see the Negroid is only indigenous to Sub-Sahara africa. Caucasoids are native to Europe, Middle-East, a segment of India and other large segments of Eurasia.
quote:Wells says. "Race, in terms of deep-seated biological differences, doesn't exist scientifically. We are 99.9 per cent identical roughly, at the genetic level. That's actually a remarkably low level of genetic diversity compared to other species of large primates. It represents a population bottleneck event some 70,000 years ago when the population dropped down to as few as 2,000 people. We came back from that, and our genome reflects that."
quote:Originally posted by cassiterides: Who is indigenous to where?
As you can see the Negroid is only indigenous to Sub-Sahara africa. Caucasoids are native to Europe, Middle-East, a segment of India and other large segments of Eurasia.
You are a liar. whites were not native to Europe. Black celts
The Europeans make it clear that the early Welsh were Black Celts. They were a small black race that came to Britain from Iberia. They were forced off the mainland by whites.
T.R. (1890). The Gael at Bala. Bye-Gones, 26 Feb, pp.320-321.http://books.google.com/books?id=ht4GAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA321&dq=black+celts&hl=en&ei=rVRwTNa2MISjnQeIlNTbBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=8&ved=0CFAQ6AEwBw#v=onepage&q= black%20celts&f=false
Dr. Masson reported on the Highlanders of Canada. He said they were of the descendants Black Celts. Dr, Masson made it clear these Highlanders spoke Caelic and had African faces.
William Chamers , in Information for the people, said the Celts were descendants of Blacks who mixed with invading white tribes.Chambers said these Celts were Northern Ethiopians.http://books.google.com/books?id=L10MAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA4&dq=black+celts&hl=en&ei=gVdwTMHhN8qmnQe5zLHmBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=7&ved=0CEoQ6AEwBjgK#v=onepage&q= black%20celts&f=false
quote:Get up off your knees and learn from the Afro-American scholars who began the study of Blacks in ancient history.
And yet Dubois, your hero, was heavily white admixed with Dutch and English ancestry.
Blacks couldn't even start their own afrocentric scholarship (as bogus as it is). lol.
African-Americans are mutts -
The percentage of White European ancestry in African Americans has been given as 25 to 28% (Putnam, 1961, p. 92), among other figures; a 1998 study of genetic markers of 1022 self-identified African Americans from nine big cities showed they were 16.4% European, or about 5/6 African and 1/6 European. (Parra, 1998; also, Rosenberg, 2002). (Shriver, 2003) found that African Americans have 75% - 90% African ancestry, 25% - 10% White European.
Zaharan, Oshun, Mike111 and clyde are all in fact partially white. Its why african-americans are least sympathetic to white nationalists who want to preserve the white race, as they are mixed-breeds or mutts.
LOL. You're a joke. We are members of the original man: the BLACK MAN.
This makes every white mixed, since you came from us. This is why there are so many whites who belong to haplogroups E and R.
Like naughty children, they are always nervously looking over their shoulders because they know what they are spinning is bogus, outside the "amen corner" of "the white faithful". But they are not causing us any additional work. The facts and figures are easily at hand. And they are only making more opportunities for the info to be reinforced, which in turn is picked up by new visitors and on the web in general. A shrewd racist would do everything possible to prevent continued reinforcement of those facts, but these guys are clueless.
-------------------- Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began.. Posts: 5906 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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^ The Black Celts are Caucasoid, of the Mediterranoid (Ibero-Insular) division.
IBERO-INSULAR. Deniker's name for the short-statured, relatively small Mediterranean sub-race, also known as Mediterranean Proper or Gracile Mediterranean.
''This Neolithic race has consequently been nicknamed " Iberians," and it is now common to speak of the " Iberian " ancestry of the people of Britain, recognizing the racial characteristics of " Iberians " in the" small swarthy Welshman," - Encyclopædia Britannica, vol. 14, 1910
''It is the practice to speak of the dark-complexioned people of France, Great Britain and Ireland as " black Celts," - Encyclopædia Britannica, Vol. 5, 1926
''These short dark Iberian tribes (and the Basques also if they were a different race) were thrust back westward, and conquered and enslaved by slowly advancing waves of a taller and fairer Aryan-speaking people'' - Outline of History, H. G. Wells, 1919, p. 83
Gracile/Iberian Mediterranoid racial type -
Chiara Gensini
Negroids in contrast look like this -
You aren't Iberians you retards... the Iberian racial type is Caucasoid. Compare the above two photos.
Posts: 2408 | From: My mother's basement | Registered: Dec 2010
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quote:Get up off your knees and learn from the Afro-American scholars who began the study of Blacks in ancient history.
And yet Dubois, your hero, was heavily white admixed with Dutch and English ancestry.
Blacks couldn't even start their own afrocentric scholarship (as bogus as it is). lol.
African-Americans are mutts -
The percentage of White European ancestry in African Americans has been given as 25 to 28% (Putnam, 1961, p. 92), among other figures; a 1998 study of genetic markers of 1022 self-identified African Americans from nine big cities showed they were 16.4% European, or about 5/6 African and 1/6 European. (Parra, 1998; also, Rosenberg, 2002). (Shriver, 2003) found that African Americans have 75% - 90% African ancestry, 25% - 10% White European.
Zaharan, Oshun, Mike111 and clyde are all in fact partially white. Its why african-americans are least sympathetic to white nationalists who want to preserve the white race, as they are mixed-breeds or mutts.
Cry me a river,
quote:
Dr. Rick A Kittles
The graph also depicts another variable, one that is of interest to the historian—endogamous group membership or ethnic self-identity. Each dot in the chart is encoded to show whether the person sampled claimed to be a member of the U.S. White endogamous group (diamond shape, 187 individuals) or of the U.S. Black endogamous group (open circle, 232 individuals). (The x-shaped plots represent a population of British West Indian ethnicity living in London.12) The graph refers to these three groups as European American, African American, and African Caribbean, respectively, and the text explains that this trait was self-assessed and independent of actual genetics.
With this added information, three aspects of the scatter diagram suddenly jump out at you. First, there is significant overlap between White and Black Americans regarding Afro-European genetic admixture. Some so-called “Black” Americans have less DNA admixture of African ancestral origin than do some so-called “White” Americans. Second, the admixture range of Black Americans spans the entire chart. While most of the subjects who self-identify as Black (marked as circles) have strong African admixture (are found towards the right), some have little or no African admixture (are found at the left edge). Finally, although the range of genetic admixture in those who self-identify as “White” is narrower than the admixture range of Blacks, it is still significant. Many so-called “White” Americans have as much as 20 percent or more of African genetic admixture.
The next graph, “Afro-European Genetic Admixture as a Function of Ethnicity” below, was taken from a different study. It also matches ancestral continent-of-origin genetic admixture for several hundred individuals with their ethnic self-identity or endogamous group membership.
Dr. Shriver
Genetic Admixture is not the Same as Appearance
About one-third of White Americans are of between two and twenty percent recent African genetic admixture, as measured by the ancestry-informative markers in their DNA.19 This comes to about 74 million Americans. And yet, day-to-day experience teaches that virtually all White Americans look, well, White. Some may look more Mediterranean and others may look more Nordic, but very few White Americans have a distinctively African appearance. How can one reconcile DNA measurements with common experience?An anecdote may help illustrate the problem. Look again at the chart of Skin Tone as Function of Afro-European Admixture. Consider one of the graph’s outlier points—a “European American” individual plotted as having 11 percent20 African genetic admixture. Dr. Shriver, the project team leader, became curious about this individual for two reasons. First, the person’s African genetic admixture was unusually high for someone who self-identified as a member of the U.S. White endogamous group. Second, the sample had been taken from State College, Pennsylvania, the site of Dr. Shriver’s own campus.21 According to Dr. Shriver:
I had the result for two or three years before I even looked up the ID number of the person whom we tested. I looked at who it was and it was me! I checked myself and the rest of my relatives and tracked it through my family. I never considered that there were any African people in my family. There’s no real variation in my family. The admixture must have been pretty far back. It just so happens that we can detect it with the markers we have. My mom especially stood out as being surprised, maybe because I told her it was coming through her father. She still doesn’t believe it about her family! The part of Pennsylvania where my mother’s father came from is where the Underground Railroad ended. There are several towns right here in Southern Pennsylvania where there are very light-skinned African-American communities that are the remnants of the Underground Railroad.22Posts: 22244 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by cassiterides: Afro-Asiatic is a language group which originated with Caucasoids, most scholars place its homeland in the Levant. It was later taken to Africa. Negroid language in contrast is Niger-Congo. So more fail on your behalf again.
[/qb]
lol hilarious,
You are one incredible goddamn dumb hog, you belong in a nut house!
quote:Viktor Černý1 et al.
Migration of Chadic speaking pastoralists within Africa based on population structure of Chad Basin and phylogeography of mitochondrial L3f haplogroup
We use high-resolution genetic data to investigate the genetic and linguistic support for hypotheses concerning the population history in the Chad Basin.
The mitochondrial L3f3 haplogroup is found almost exclusively in Chadic speaking populations and its TMRCA corresponds well with archaeological and linguistic dates of the proposed migration of Chadic speaking pastoralists from East or North East Africa to the Chad Basin.
Haplogroup L3f is defined by the coding variants
3396-4218-15514-15944del and the control region motif 16209–16519 with a TMRCA of 57,100 ± 9,400 YBP. This haplogroup diversifies into sub-haplogroups L3f1, L3f2 and L3f3. The most geographically widespread sub-haplogroup is L3f1, which is distributed across the African continent [3] and also Arabia [32,33] and has a TMRCA of 48,600 ± 11,500 YBP.
..."The youngest clade, L3f1b2, seems to be more frequent in the Middle East. L3f1a seems to be older (37,700 ± 10,000 YBP) than its sister sub-haplogroup L3f1b and is also less diversified. A few samples from Chad belong to these sub-haplogroups: two to L3f1a and one to L3f1b3."
"We then estimated pairwise FST genetic distances between populations (Additional file 4) and displayed these on a MDS plot (Figure 3). Interesting results are immediately evident – while Chadic populations form a relatively homogeneous group, the Cushitic populations split into two completely different clusters. The first group is composed of Horn of African populations, such as Ethiopian and Somali Cushitic populations, which are close to neighbouring Ethiopian Semitic speaking groups and relatively close also to Chadic people from the Chad Basin. The second Cushitic group is composed by more southern groups from Tanzania, i.e. Burunge and Iraqw, who occupy outlier positions even within the Afro-Asiatic MDS plot. In the MDS plot, geography is more strongly associated with genetic distance than is linguistic affiliation.
Overall, we observe that Chadic speaking populations are intermixed with other populations from Chad Basin, including Niger-Congo, Semitic, and Berber speaking people. In this context, it seems that the linguistic categories play a secondary role in structuring the genetic diversity." [/QB]
Lancaster's article:
"As shall be shown, there are obvious reasons for considering whether Y Haplogroup E-M35 male lineages may have been present amongst peoples who spread the earliest Afroasiatic languages as well as the earliest technologies associated with farming and pastoralism in the Middle East, Africa and Europe."
"Ehret et al.(2004) in a short letter to , perhaps represents the first published remark associating E-M35 with the of Afroasiatic languages and Neolithic technologies, a subject this article intends to address in more detail."
"Importantly, we also wish to try to go beyond asserting that E-M35 and Afroasiatic have similar modern regional distributions. Therefore, this article shall also examine what is known of the larger phylogenetic (family tree) structure within which E-M35 is only one branching, as we must if we are to consider carefully how much genetics can add to debates in linguistics and archaeology."
"There are several relatively uncontroversial proposals concerning the ancient movements of Afroasiatic languages, each of which we can immediately compare to Haplogroup E-M35 and its sub-clades in population genetics:
Both E-M35 male lineages on the one hand, and Afroasiatic languages on the other, are seen by specialists in the two respective fields as having moved pre-historically within what Cruciani et al. (2007) refer to as a “bi-directional corridor” along the Nile and/or the western coast of the Red Sea, from the Sinai and Mediterranean, to the Horn of Africa."
"With this in mind, it is proposed that we may at least assume a strong likelihood that E-M35 male lineages were involved in at least many of the migrations and cultural transmissions which caused the present and historical distributions of the Afroasiatic languages."
Afroasiatic languages are a group of related languages spoken by various communities from a large area in West African centered around Lake Chad (Chadic), all the way across North Africa (Berber) into Egypt (Egyptian), Ethiopia, and Somalia, and down the Great Rift Valley to the foot of Mt. Kilimanjaro (Cushitic / Omotic). Crossing over into Western Asia (Semitic), they are also spoken in the Middle East through Palestine and Syria, down around the Arabian Peninsula into Yemen and Oman, and up into Iraq. This huge area encompasses and enormous variety of people who have shared over many thousands of years a common linguistic bond, the nature of which can be discovered only by careful investigation and comparison of the respective languages.Posts: 22244 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Get up off your knees and learn from the Afro-American scholars who began the study of Blacks in ancient history.
And yet Dubois, your hero, was heavily white admixed with Dutch and English ancestry.
Blacks couldn't even start their own afrocentric scholarship (as bogus as it is). lol.
African-Americans are mutts -
The percentage of White European ancestry in African Americans has been given as 25 to 28% (Putnam, 1961, p. 92), among other figures; a 1998 study of genetic markers of 1022 self-identified African Americans from nine big cities showed they were 16.4% European, or about 5/6 African and 1/6 European. (Parra, 1998; also, Rosenberg, 2002). (Shriver, 2003) found that African Americans have 75% - 90% African ancestry, 25% - 10% White European.
Zaharan, Oshun, Mike111 and clyde are all in fact partially white. Its why african-americans are least sympathetic to white nationalists who want to preserve the white race, as they are mixed-breeds or mutts.
I was going to skip this one since i tend too ignore most of your post,and after this more so.
I will say this and leave or just ignore anything else you say in here.
Those fig. you keep bragging about is averages,not everybody.
Recent studies by the way says about 60% of African Americans have european admixture,maybe less.
The average admixture for those THAT have european admixture is about 10% to 13%. IT's minor.
Another point all blacks IN AMERICA, recent ones from over seas and ones that been in america for A while are called African americans too in census.
The overall point is African Americans are black.You make that point everyday.
You racist want it both ways,any african american with european admixture that may want to claim europe or egypt too, you say no, they are black and west african.
So what's the point of always bringing up any type of european admixture in some african americans?
Does that help you put food on your table? do sleep well at night thinking this black or that black is 50% or 5 % european?
To a sick freak like you in your heart admixture no matter how small or how large or no admixture does not really matter,because all you see is a black person if they have admixture or not.
Another point,worldwide most whites have admixture with other groups while most blacks and asian do not.
To a certain point it should not matter since whites will still look white and black and asian are not bragging all the time that most whites have black or asian admixture.
Most folks are busy in real life to care.
It's racist white nerds and self hating folks that love pointing out non-sense all time.
Get a life and stop obsessing over ancient egypt
AFRICAN AMERICANS can't claim europe,no more then europeans like yourself that may or may not have african admixture could claim egypt.
Another point and this may be getting into mike's and Mr.winter's area.
AFRICANS/BLACKS have more rights to europe then europeans have to africa.
In fact europeans have no right to africa and no rights to egypt,i could care less how long greeks and romans and white arabs been there,but africans have some right to europe since they were the first on earth and some were first ones living there.
You could keep europe by the way,nobody else wants anymore.
Posts: 2688 | Registered: Jul 2004
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—PN2 clade (E3) bearers in the vicinity of the Sudanese-Central African Republic -Ugandan-Kenyan region give rise to E3a ~ between 21 and 18 ky ago [pending additional or new info]; E3b-M35* would have likely arose relatively earlier than E3a*[as evidenced by its near absence in some the populations that carry this], sometime prior to the Ogolian and the LGM period. At this time, it was likely the M78 derivative that came about ~ between 19 and 15 ky ago. It was also likely during this period, that some E3b-M35 variants spilled over to the "southwest Asia", which would be identified as E-M34. The E-M78* likely arose somewhere in the bidirectional-migration route between Northeast and sub-Saharan East Africa; this location was likely in the region straddling upper Egypt and Sudan of the eastern Sahara, amongst earlier E-M35 migrants from sub-Saharan East Africa. These M78 bearers were increasingly pressured to move further south due to progressive aridity, possibly as far as Uganda-Kenya and/or Tanzanian general region.
quote:Originally posted by cassiterides: Afro-Asiatic is a language group which originated with Caucasoids, most scholars place its homeland in the Levant. It was later taken to Africa. Negroid language in contrast is Niger-Congo. So more fail on your behalf again.
loooooool
quote:Viktor Černý1 et al.
Migration of Chadic speaking pastoralists within Africa based on population structure of Chad Basin and phylogeography of mitochondrial L3f haplogroup
We use high-resolution genetic data to investigate the genetic and linguistic support for hypotheses concerning the population history in the Chad Basin.
The mitochondrial L3f3 haplogroup is found almost exclusively in Chadic speaking populations and its TMRCA corresponds well with archaeological and linguistic dates of the proposed migration of Chadic speaking pastoralists from East or North East Africa to the Chad Basin.
Haplogroup L3f is defined by the coding variants
3396-4218-15514-15944del and the control region motif 16209–16519 with a TMRCA of 57,100 ± 9,400 YBP. This haplogroup diversifies into sub-haplogroups L3f1, L3f2 and L3f3. The most geographically widespread sub-haplogroup is L3f1, which is distributed across the African continent [3] and also Arabia [32,33] and has a TMRCA of 48,600 ± 11,500 YBP.
..."The youngest clade, L3f1b2, seems to be more frequent in the Middle East. L3f1a seems to be older (37,700 ± 10,000 YBP) than its sister sub-haplogroup L3f1b and is also less diversified. A few samples from Chad belong to these sub-haplogroups: two to L3f1a and one to L3f1b3."
"We then estimated pairwise FST genetic distances between populations (Additional file 4) and displayed these on a MDS plot (Figure 3). Interesting results are immediately evident – while Chadic populations form a relatively homogeneous group, the Cushitic populations split into two completely different clusters. The first group is composed of Horn of African populations, such as Ethiopian and Somali Cushitic populations, which are close to neighbouring Ethiopian Semitic speaking groups and relatively close also to Chadic people from the Chad Basin. The second Cushitic group is composed by more southern groups from Tanzania, i.e. Burunge and Iraqw, who occupy outlier positions even within the Afro-Asiatic MDS plot. In the MDS plot, geography is more strongly associated with genetic distance than is linguistic affiliation.
Overall, we observe that Chadic speaking populations are intermixed with other populations from Chad Basin, including Niger-Congo, Semitic, and Berber speaking people. In this context, it seems that the linguistic categories play a secondary role in structuring the genetic diversity."
Afroasiatic languages are a group of related languages spoken by various communities from a large area in West African centered around Lake Chad (Chadic), all the way across North Africa (Berber) into Egypt (Egyptian), Ethiopia, and Somalia, and down the Great Rift Valley to the foot of Mt. Kilimanjaro (Cushitic / Omotic). Crossing over into Western Asia (Semitic), they are also spoken in the Middle East through Palestine and Syria, down around the Arabian Peninsula into Yemen and Oman, and up into Iraq. This huge area encompasses and enormous variety of people who have shared over many thousands of years a common linguistic bond, the nature of which can be discovered only by careful investigation and comparison of the respective languages.Posts: 22244 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by cassiterides: ^ The Black Celts are Caucasoid, of the Mediterranoid (Ibero-Insular) division.
IBERO-INSULAR. Deniker's name for the short-statured, relatively small Mediterranean sub-race, also known as Mediterranean Proper or Gracile Mediterranean.
''This Neolithic race has consequently been nicknamed " Iberians," and it is now common to speak of the " Iberian " ancestry of the people of Britain, recognizing the racial characteristics of " Iberians " in the" small swarthy Welshman," - Encyclopædia Britannica, vol. 14, 1910
''It is the practice to speak of the dark-complexioned people of France, Great Britain and Ireland as " black Celts," - Encyclopædia Britannica, Vol. 5, 1926
''These short dark Iberian tribes (and the Basques also if they were a different race) were thrust back westward, and conquered and enslaved by slowly advancing waves of a taller and fairer Aryan-speaking people'' - Outline of History, H. G. Wells, 1919, p. 83
Gracile/Iberian Mediterranoid racial type -
Chiara Gensini
Negroids in contrast look like this -
You aren't Iberians you retards... the Iberian racial type is Caucasoid. Compare the above two photos.
Chambers wrote:
“Ephorus ,too (405B.C.)seems to have had a great impression of the power of the Ethiopians, since he names in the east, the Indians—in the south the Ethiopians—in the west, the Celts—in the north, the Scythians, as the most mighty and numrous people of the known earth. Already in Strabo’s time, however, their ancient power had gone for an indefinite period, and the Negro states found themselves, after Meroe had ceased to be a religious capital …”
quote: Egypt Rome Indus Valley Sumeria Babylon Greece
Egypt? No. Rome? Not pure, too much Afro Asiatic ancestry and same for Greece. Indus Valley? Someone throw this guy a world map. Pakistanis and Indians are white now? Please provide the Haplogroups and related evidence for that one. Same with Sumeria and Babylon.
Afro-Asiatic is a language group which originated with Caucasoids, most scholars place its homeland in the Levant. It was later taken to Africa. Negroid language in contrast is Niger-Congo. So more fail on your behalf again.
Many Indians are heavily Caucasoid admixed, you only have to look at bollywood -
North Indians have little to do with Afroasiatics. you only have to look at Bollywood for what - skin lightner ads?
Yes it may have begun with Natufians or Ubaid people. But, wherever it originated geographically it was with people who are and have always been black i.e. African with African systems of thought and culture. That of course rules out modern peoples of the Levant and their relatives in Europe or North Africa.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
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quote:Originally posted by cassiterides: ^ The Black Celts are Caucasoid, of the Mediterranoid (Ibero-Insular) division.
IBERO-INSULAR. Deniker's name for the short-statured, relatively small Mediterranean sub-race, also known as Mediterranean Proper or Gracile Mediterranean.
''This Neolithic race has consequently been nicknamed " Iberians," and it is now common to speak of the " Iberian " ancestry of the people of Britain, recognizing the racial characteristics of " Iberians " in the" small swarthy Welshman," - Encyclopædia Britannica, vol. 14, 1910
''It is the practice to speak of the dark-complexioned people of France, Great Britain and Ireland as " black Celts," - Encyclopædia Britannica, Vol. 5, 1926
''These short dark Iberian tribes (and the Basques also if they were a different race) were thrust back westward, and conquered and enslaved by slowly advancing waves of a taller and fairer Aryan-speaking people'' - Outline of History, H. G. Wells, 1919, p. 83
Gracile/Iberian Mediterranoid racial type -
Chiara Gensini
Negroids in contrast look like this -
You aren't Iberians you retards... the Iberian racial type is Caucasoid. Compare the above two photos.
The gracile Mediterranean race of early anthropologists had nothing to do with you, or other Eurasiatics. They are a dolichocephalic race of tropical appearance most likely ancestral to people like the Badarians or Haratin.
In the Neolithic they occupied and represented the Capsian, Chamblandes, Linear Band Ceramik culture , Iberia Muge and Malta, and were the purveyors of the painted pottery of the Anatolian cultures and Central Asia (as at Anau) spread into China , the Levant the Sahara along with other black groups and a minority of your Eurasian ancestors in some places.
That is why Coon wrote of them as possessing a typically Negroid facial aspect. Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
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Ironic you say this since you wave around pictures of Katrina victims as examples of "true Negroes" (and posted pics Clyde as well), but then call them Eurafricans, a sub division of Caucasoid.
quote:Zaharan, Oshun, Mike111 and clyde are all in fact partially white. Its why african-americans are least sympathetic to white nationalists who want to preserve the white race, as they are mixed-breeds or mutts.
You seem to have a lot of pride in the concept of inbreeding. The only examples of white achievement you have cited are people of mixed origins. You slug in the face your own arguments of white nationalism and concepts of "purity" in the process.
quote:
Afro-Asiatic is a language group which originated with Caucasoids, most scholars place its homeland in the Levant.
More irrelevant nonsense. I'm saying that biologically they are partially African and Asian which is why I said AfroAsiatic. I'm not talking about the language group or it's origins, simply their genealogical makeup.
quote:Coconut african-americans like Walker, Fake Asian and European writers like Oshun will never define OUR history.
Me a...European writer? No. Just no.
Posts: 2508 | From: . | Registered: Nov 2011
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posted
continue to argue the same thing with the albino? Waste of time this albino is a thief history. I do not care about the eurocentrics we will discuss new things! Let's move on
We already know that blacks have created great civilizations and whites are barbarians of central asia now want learn new things
Posts: 2922 | From: World Empire of the Black People | Registered: Jul 2011
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quote: Egypt Rome Indus Valley Sumeria Babylon Greece
Egypt? No. Rome? Not pure, too much Afro Asiatic ancestry and same for Greece. Indus Valley? Someone throw this guy a world map. Pakistanis and Indians are white now? Please provide the Haplogroups and related evidence for that one. Same with Sumeria and Babylon.
Afro-Asiatic is a language group which originated with Caucasoids, most scholars place its homeland in the Levant. It was later taken to Africa. Negroid language in contrast is Niger-Congo. So more fail on your behalf again.
Many Indians are heavily Caucasoid admixed, you only have to look at bollywood -
North Indians have little to do with Afroasiatics. you only have to look at Bollywood for what - skin lightner ads?
Yes it may have begun with Natufians or Ubaid people. But, wherever it originated geographically it was with people who are and have always been black i.e. African with African systems of thought and culture. That of course rules out modern peoples of the Levant and their relatives in Europe or North Africa.
In fact when some linguistics appose the Northeast African root for Afrasian. And rather the Levant, they actually refer to the Natufians. So in both cases we still deal with black i.e. African with African systems of thought and culture. However, in recent years the pinpoint of the root has shown to be at Lake Nuba.
I don't have to explain to you that only recent people from the North started to inhabit the Levantine.
Posts: 22244 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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posted
^Having said my piece, I was quite content to ignore this thread, even to the point of ignoring this quote from zarahan:
Walker's analysis is amazingly shallow. He discusses Yurco and his disavowal of race in Ancient Egypt, but then swiftly glides to a roundup of negative Egyptian statements on Nubians, neglecting to show that Yurco ALSO said that the people ethnically the closest to the Egyptians were the Nubians, and that indeed, there were several Pharaohs of Nubian descent, including some of the 12th Dynasty, one of the most famous Dynasties in Egyptian history- and well before the 25th Dynasty. And the Egyptians also made numerous negative statements about "white" Middle Easterners, but these, curiously, do not find their way in a "racial roundup" of negativity in Walker's writing. Now why is that?
Naturally the ancient Egyptians made no such comments about "white" Middle Easterners, because at that time, there were no "white" Middle Easterners.
But with Troll Patrol's correct but cryptic comment, "only recent people from the North started to inhabit the Levantine." It's clear that for everyone to understand what's being discussed, someone needs to present a chronology of middle eastern people, as the current people are quite different from the original inhabitants.
Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
Until I see Walker specific refute claims by so called "Afrocentrists" I will ignore threads like these.
Posts: 2598 | From: Vicksburg | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:The gracile Mediterranean race of early anthropologists had nothing to do with you, or other Eurasiatics.
Troll retard.
Gracile Meds are Caucasoid, as are their modern descendants. Go to the Iberian peninsula and you will still see the gracile med or ibero-insular type. There is nothing negro about these peoples, they are WHITE.
Posts: 2408 | From: My mother's basement | Registered: Dec 2010
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posted
Naturally the ancient Egyptians made no such comments about "white" Middle Easterners, because at that time, there were no "white" Middle Easterners.
They were not a huge or significant factor until much later in Egyptian Civ- Hyskos or Arabs for example. Nor did the Egyptians make commentary about "negroes", misleading translations of their documentation to the contrary. Unfortunately some Europeans insist on attempting to spin a "Racial" conflict angle into relationships between the two peoples, yet conveniently, and hypocritically, duck building up the same "Racial" angle as regards alleged "Caucasoid" Middle Easterners? Its sheer hypocrisy. The fact is that the Nubians are the closest people ethnically to the ancient Egyptians, as shown by repeated scientific studies.
ANd the double-standard of the EUropean/Eurocentric hypocrites is exposed when the tables are turned, and their own "racial conflict" spin is applied to "Middle Easterners." Even, steven.
The pharaohs that forbid the movement of certain Nubian tribes into Egypt were themselves of negroid origin according to conservative mainstream Egyptologist Frank Yurco..
Quote:
"the XIIth Dynasty (1991-1786 B.C.E.) originated from the Aswan region. As expected, strong Nubian features and dark coloring are seen in their sculpture and relief work. This dynasty ranks as among the greatest, whose fame far outlived its actual tenure on the throne. Especially interesting, it was a member of this dynasty- that decreed that no Nehsy (riverine Nubian of the principality of Kush), except such as came for trade or diplomatic reasons, should pass by the Egyptian fortress at the southern end of the Second Nile Cataract. Why would this royal family of Nubian ancestry ban other Nubians from coming into Egyptian territory? Because the Egyptian rulers of Nubian ancestry had become Egyptians culturally; as pharaohs, they exhibited typical Egyptian attitudes and adopted typical Egyptian policies."
- (F. J. Yurco, 'Were the ancient Egyptians black or white?', Biblical Archaeology Review (Vol 15, no. 5, 1989)
Applying a consistent 'race' model that interprets war between Egyptians and Nubians as 'racial' the Egyptians also pursued 'racial' wars against whites from the Middle East.
[IMG]http://digital.library.upenn.edu/wo men/edwards/pharaohs/207.gif[/IMG] RAMESES II. SLAYING THE "whites" BEFORE RA, THE TUTELARY DEITY OF THE GREAT TEMPLE OF ABÛ-SIMBEL..
THE DISCOURSE OF AMEN-RA, LORD OF THRONES agaimst "whites".
Thou hast struck off the heads of the Asiatics, and their children cannot escape from thee. Every land illuminated by thy diadem is encircled by thy might; and in all the zone of the heavens there is not a rebel to rise up against thee. The enemy bring in their tribute on their backs, prostrating themselves before thee, their limbs trembling and their hearts burned up within them."
Campaign against "white" Mittani in parts of Lebanon:
"He is a king valiant ... Naharin which its lord had deserted out of fear ... I hacked up its towns and villages and I set fire to them ... I carried off their inhabitants ... also their herds of cattle ... I felled all their plantations and their fruit trees ...I had many vessels ... built on the mountains of God's Land in the neighborhood of the Lady of Byblos ... then on that mountain of Naharin, my Majesty erected my stela, carved out of the mountain on the western side of the Euphrates.."
Conquest against and tribute from "white" Palestine:
"Tribute of the princes of Retenu, who came to do obeisance ... to the souls of his majesty... Now every harbor at which his majesty arrived was supplied with loaves and with assorted loaves, with oil, incense, wine, f[ruit] ---- abundant were they beyond everything ...
Tribute from 'white' Lebanon:
The chieftains, lord of Lebanon, construct the royal ships in order that people may sail south in them to bring all the marvels of the "Garden" to the palace. LPH. ... The chieftains of Retjenu (Retenu) who drag the flagpoles by means of oxen to the shore, it is they who come with their dues to the place where his majesty is, to the Residence in ...... bearing all the fine products brought as marvels of the south and being taxed for tribute annually as (with) all bondsmen of his Majesty."
Operations against more 'white' 'Troglodytes':
"Then my Majesty made them take their oaths of allegiance as follows: never again shall we do anything evil against Menkheperre (another name for Thutmose III), may he live forever ... Then my Majesty had them set free on the road to their cities*). They went off on donkeys for I had seized their chariotry. I captured their inhabitants for Egypt and their property likewise." [W. Helck transl. by B. Cummings (1982), `Urkunden der 18. Dynastie', `Egyptian Historical Records of the Later 18th Dynasty']
"His majesty proceeded northward, to overthrow the Asiatics (Mntyw-Stt). His majesty arrived at a district, Sekmem (Skmm) was its name. His majesty led the good way in proceeding to the palace of `Life, Prosperity, and Health (L.P.H.,' when Sekmen had fallen, together with Retenu (Rtnw) the wretched, while I was acting as rearguard." [Breasted, `Records', Vol. I, Sec. 680] Time of Seti the Great - Presentation of Syrian Prisoners and Precious Vessels to Amon
"Smiting the Troglodytes, beating down the Asiatics (Mn·t·yw), making his boundary as far as the `Horns of the Earth', as far as the marshes of Naharin (N-h-r-n)." [Ibid., Vol. III, Sec. 118;]
"Slaying of the Asiatic Troglodytes (Ynw-Mn·t·yw [Menate, Manasseh]), all inaccessible countries, all lands, the Fenkhu of the marshes of Asia, the Great Bend of the sea (w'd-wr)."
Booty seized from "white" Caananites:
".... 340 living prisoners; 83 hands; 2,401 mares; 191 foals; 6 stallions; ... young ...; a chariot, wrought with gold, (its) pole of gold, belonging to the chief of `M-k-ty' (as the land around Jerusalem was called); .... 892 chariots of his wretched army; total, 924 (chariots); a beautiful suit of bronze armor, belonging to the chief of Jerusalem; .... 200 suits of armor, belonging to his wretched army; 502 bows; 7 poles of (mry) wood, wrought with silver, belonging to the tent of that foe. Behold, the army of his majesty took ...., 297 ...., 1,929 large cattle, 2,000 small cattle, 20500 white small cattle." [JBRE, `Records', Vol. II, Sec. 435; See also the following sections.]
Tribute from "white" Assur/Assyria "The tribute of the chief of Assur (Ys-sw-r): genuine lapis lazuli, a large block, making 20 deben, 9 kidet; genuine lapis lazuli, 2 blocks; total, 3; and pieces, [making] 30 deben; total, 50 deben and 9 kidet; fine lapis lazuli from Babylon (Bb-r); vessels of Assur of hrrt- stone in colors, ---- very many." "Tribute of the chief of Assur: horses ---. A ---- of skin of the M-h-w as the [protection] of a chariot, of the finest of --- wood; 190(+x) wagons --- --- wood, nhb wood, 343 pieces, carob wood, 50 pieces; nby and k'nk wood, 206 pieces; olive oil, ------.." [BREASTED, Vol. II, Sec. 446, 449]
"Whites" put to slave labor in Egypt.
from Project Guttenberg full text of: A HISTORY OF EGYPT FROM THE EARLIEST TIMES TO THE PERSIAN CONQUEST BY JAMES HENRY BREASTED, II, 760-1, 773. 2 II, 761.
Inscription "the Asiatics of all countries came with bowed head, doing obeisance to the fame of his majesty."
book text:
"Thutmose's war-galleys moored in the harbour of the town; but at this time not merely the iceaUh of Asia was unloaded from the ships; the Asiatics themselves, bound one to another in long lines, were led down the gang planks to begin a life of slave- labour for the Pharaoh (Fig. 119). They wore long matted beards, an abomination to the Egyptians ; their hair hung in heavy black masses upon their shoulders, and they were clad in gaily coloured woolen stuffs, such as the Egyptian, spotless in his white linen robe, would never put on his body.
Their arms were pinioned behind them at the elbows or crossed over their heads and lashed together ; or, again, their hands were thrust through odd pointed ovals of wood, which served as hand-cuffs. The women carried their children slung in a fold of the mantle over their shoulders. With their strange speech and uncouth postures the poor wretches were the subject of jibe and merriment on the part of the multitude ; while the artists of the time could never forbear caricaturing them. Many of them found their way into the houses of the Pharaoh's favourites, and his generals were liberally rewarded with gifts of such slaves; but the larger number were immediately employed on the temple estates, the Pharaoh's domains, or in the construction of his great monuments and buildings."
Ancient Egyptians warn against cowardly, treacherous "whites" comparing them to destructive thieves and reptiles.
"The Instruction for King, Merikare takes a similar tone for peoples in the north (Lichtheim 1973: 10404):
Lo the miserable Asiatic (white), He is wretched because of the place he's in: Short of water, bare of wood, Its paths are many and painful because of mountains. He does not dwell in one place, Food propels his legs, He fights since the time of Horus.. He does not announce the day of combat, Like a thief who darts about a group.."
"Asiatics (whites) are both cowardly and pitiful, leading a marginal existence, constantly fighting but with nothing ever settled. They are also sly and ultimately treacherous, attacking without warning. This passage characterizes Asiatics as both primitive and threatening.. In this case, the passage reflects Egypt's combination of colonial domination and outright military conflict.."
Merikare goes on (Lichtheim 1976: 103-104)
"The Asiatic [white] is a crocodile on its shore It snatches from a lonely road, It cannot seize a populous town."
Along the same lines, the Prophecy of Neferti (c. 1950 BC) portrays Asiatic immigrants as a flock of rapacious birds descending on Egypt, taking advantage of civil wars of the First Intermediate Period (c. 2150 - 2050 BC) to infiltrate parts of the rich Egyptian delta (Lichtheim 1973: 141):
A strange bird will breed in the delta marsh, having made its nest besides the people.. All happiness is vanished, The land is bowed down in distress, Owing to those feeders, Asiatics [whites] who roam the land..
From: --Stuart Tyson Smith. (2003) Wretched Kush: ethnic identities and boundaries in Egypt's Nubian empire. Routledge, pp. 28-31 =========================
Posts: 5906 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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posted
Am J Phys Anthropol. 1996 Mar;99(3):413-28.
Cranial variation in the Iberian Peninsula and the Balearic Islands: inferences about the history of the population.
Fox et. al
A multivariate analysis of four prehistoric and nine historic populations from the Iberian Peninsula and Balearic Islands with large sample sizes (n > 30 individuals for the neurocranium and n > 15 for the facial skeleton) is presented, considering 874 male and 557 female skulls and using 20 craniometric measurements. Cluster analyses have been undertaken using the squared Euclidean distance as a measure of proximity and the average linkage between groups (UPGMA), and neighbor-joining algorithms as a branching method, and a bootstrap analysis was used to assess the robustness of the clustering topology. The study was complemented with a principal coordinate analysis and with the application of the Mantel test to measure the degree of correspondence between the information furnished by the female and the male samples. The analyses show that the main source of morphometric variability in the Iberian Peninsula is the Basque population. The second source of variation is provided by two populations (Muslims and Jews), different from the rest from an archaeological and cultural point of view, and can probably be attributed to influences from sub-Saharan Africa. The massive deportations of the Jews in 1492 and of the Moors between the 15th and 17th centuries may have erased this source of variability from the present population of the Iberian Peninsula. The remaining studied populations, including samples from Castile, Cantabria, Andalusia, Catalonia and Balearic Islands, are grouped together, showing a notable morphological homogeneity, despite their temporal and geographic heterogeneity. These results are in general agreement with those obtained in synthetic maps, by analyzing multiple genetic markers. In such studies, the Basque population is described as the main source of genetic variability, not only in the Iberian Peninsula, but also in Western Europe.
Posts: 22244 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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posted
Polimorfismos de DNA mitocondrial en poblaciones antiguas de la cuenca mediterránea.
Fernández Domínguez, E. et al.
(2005)
The presence of almost 50% of sub-Saharan lineages L1b, L2 and L3 in Abauntz Chalcolithic deposits and Tres Montes, in Navarre, suggests the existence of an important gene flow from Africa to this geographic region.
The low frequency of these lineages in the current Spanish population indicates that it has gene produced a replacement from the Chalcolithic period.
The entry of African lineages could occur during the Paleolithic, during the Neolithic period, or during both periods.
The phylogenetically related sequences present in the Chalcolithic deposit Iberian Peninsula and Neolithic and Chalcolithic samples of the Middle East points to Neolithic as most likely time of entry into the peninsula of these lineages.
Description: SUMMARY OF DOCTORAL THESIS The origins of European populations have been addressed from different disciplines, highlighting the contribution of population genetics studies. Shuffle two moments in prehistory in which it has been possible to model the gene pool of populations in Europe: the spread of Neolithic and Palaeolithic period expansions. The ability to recover from bygone population genetics provides a unique opportunity to test the assumptions made in situ from other disciplines. We studied 197 samples from 115 dental and bone individuals 17 archaeological sites Sumerian Neolithic and Middle East, when Meroitic Nubia and Paleolithic era, post-Neolithic and Neolithic of the Iberian Peninsula. We obtained complete sequences of mitochondrial DNA of 244 bp of 35 different individuals, were compared with sequences from the same region of present individuals from 38 populations in Europe, Africa and Middle East. In phylogenetic reconstructions based on Reynolds distance groups of ancient samples are grouped together, separated from the rest of current populations. However, phylogenetic reconstructions made from the haplotypes of ancient and modern samples denote that although the majority of ancient mitochondrial variants are not present in current populations sampled, may relate more or less closely with them. The composition of haplotypes and haplogroups of ancient samples from the Near East and the Iberian Peninsula differs markedly from that found in the current populations of these geographical regions. In the ancient Middle East show highlights in particular the absence of mitochondrial haplogroup J, U3, W and X, associated with the Neolithic expansion into Europe. This may be due either to the sample obtained is not old chronologically or geographically-representative populations of the Middle East that spread during the Neolithic well that these variants were not introduced in Europe during the Neolithic. In the ancient sample of the Iberian Peninsula highlights the presence of 50% of sub-Saharan lines. These lines may have been introduced during the Solutrean, the Mesolithic or Neolithic. This work also delved into various technical aspects of obtaining authentic ancient DNA and the influence of several variables in the preservation of genetic material. ABSTRACT The origins of the European Populations Studied extensively from Have Been Different disciplines. It is Thought That ancient demic expansions, like occurred After the Late Those Glacial Maximum or DURING the Middle East from neolithic diffussion to Europe. The Possibility to recover DNA from past Populations offers an unique Opportunity to test in situ These hypothesis. 197 It Were Analyzed teeth and bones from 115 individuos Archaeological Sites and 17 Different from Middle East and the Iberian Peninsula. It WAS possible to recover mitochondrial DNA sequences 244pb-35 from Different Individuals. They Were 38 Compared to sequences from European, African and Middle Eastern Populations present-day. Phylogenetic Reconstructions from Reynolds genetic distance Showed That ancient samples clustered together, extant from Clearly Separated Populations. Howeve, based phylogenetic Reconstructions on ancient and modern mitochondrial haplotypes Showed That ancient haplotypes are related to extant ones. Haplotype frequencies and haplogroup in samples from the ancient Middle East and the Iberian Peninsula are Different from Those Clearly present in the Same Geographical Nowadays regions. Haplogroups related to J neolithic expansion to Europe, U3, W and X-are absent in ancient middle eastern sample. There are two possible Explanations to this fact. First, It Could Be That the ancient samples possible Analyzed wont be representative of the Middle Eastern Populations That expanded the neolithic. Second, It Could Be That Those haplogroups Also possible wont Have Been made to them in Europe associated with expansions to neolithic demic. At This work It Were Also Examined technical Several Aspects related to the obtention of genuine ancient DNA and the Influence of Different variables in DNA preservation.
Posts: 22244 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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quote:Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova: Mike111: "Naturally the ancient Egyptians made no such comments about "white" Middle Easterners, because at that time, there were no "white" Middle Easterners."
zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova: "They were not a huge or significant factor until much later in Egyptian Civ- Hyskos or Arabs for example. Nor did the Egyptians make commentary about "negroes", misleading translations of their documentation to the contrary. Unfortunately some Europeans insist on attempting to spin a "Racial" conflict angle into relationships between the two peoples, yet conveniently, and hypocritically, duck building up the same "Racial" angle as regards alleged "Caucasoid" Middle Easterners? Its sheer hypocrisy. The fact is that the Nubians are the closest people ethnically to the ancient Egyptians, as shown by repeated scientific studies.
ANd the double-standard of the EUropean/Eurocentric hypocrites is exposed when the tables are turned, and their own "racial conflict" spin is applied to "Middle Easterners." Even, steven.
The pharaohs that forbid the movement of certain Nubian tribes into Egypt were themselves of negroid origin according to conservative mainstream Egyptologist Frank Yurco..
Quote:
"the XIIth Dynasty (1991-1786 B.C.E.) originated from the Aswan region. As expected, strong Nubian features and dark coloring are seen in their sculpture and relief work. This dynasty ranks as among the greatest, whose fame far outlived its actual tenure on the throne. Especially interesting, it was a member of this dynasty- that decreed that no Nehsy (riverine Nubian of the principality of Kush), except such as came for trade or diplomatic reasons, should pass by the Egyptian fortress at the southern end of the Second Nile Cataract. Why would this royal family of Nubian ancestry ban other Nubians from coming into Egyptian territory? Because the Egyptian rulers of Nubian ancestry had become Egyptians culturally; as pharaohs, they exhibited typical Egyptian attitudes and adopted typical Egyptian policies."
- (F. J. Yurco, 'Were the ancient Egyptians black or white?', Biblical Archaeology Review (Vol 15, no. 5, 1989)
Applying a consistent 'race' model that interprets war between Egyptians and Nubians as 'racial' the Egyptians also pursued 'racial' wars against whites from the Middle East.
THE DISCOURSE OF AMEN-RA, LORD OF THRONES agaimst "whites".
Campaign against "white" Mittani in parts of Lebanon:
Conquest against and tribute from "white" Palestine:
Tribute from 'white' Lebanon:
Operations against more 'white' 'Troglodytes':
Booty seized from "white" Caananites:
Tribute from "white" Assur/Assyria
"Whites" put to slave labor in Egypt.
Ancient Egyptians warn against cowardly, treacherous "whites" comparing them to destructive thieves and reptiles.
"The Instruction for King, Merikare takes a similar tone for peoples in the north (Lichtheim 1973: 10404):
Lo the miserable Asiatic (white), He is wretched because of the place he's in:
"Asiatics (whites) are both cowardly and pitiful, leading a marginal existence, constantly fighting but with nothing ever settled. They are also sly and ultimately treacherous, attacking without warning. This passage characterizes Asiatics as both primitive and threatening.. In this case, the passage reflects Egypt's combination of colonial domination and outright military conflict.."
Merikare goes on (Lichtheim 1976: 103-104)
"The Asiatic [white] is a crocodile on its shore It snatches from a lonely road, It cannot seize a populous town."
From: --Stuart Tyson Smith. (2003) Wretched Kush: ethnic identities and boundaries in Egypt's Nubian empire. Routledge, pp. 28-31
zarahan - Either you are extremely ignorant of the subject matter, OR you are an Albino Mole trying to sneak-in some bullsh1t Albino history. When I said: "at that time, there were no "white" Middle Easterners." I meant NONE - ZERO! Where did this nonsense of White Canaanites, Syrians, Anatolians come from? Certainly NOT from actual history or artifact. The only source that I know of is the fantasy's of Albinos. So where did you get it? Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
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Well then, at least apologize. Moleing is extremely unbecoming, fit only for people like Lioness and Jari.
Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
Originally posted by Troll Patrol: Am J Phys Anthropol. 1996 Mar;99(3):413-28.
Cranial variation in the Iberian Peninsula and the Balearic Islands: inferences about the history of the population.
Fox et. al
A multivariate analysis of four prehistoric and nine historic populations from the Iberian Peninsula and Balearic Islands with large sample sizes (n > 30 individuals for the neurocranium and n > 15 for the facial skeleton) is presented, considering 874 male and 557 female skulls and using 20 craniometric measurements. Cluster analyses have been undertaken using the squared Euclidean distance as a measure of proximity and the average linkage between groups (UPGMA), and neighbor-joining algorithms as a branching method, and a bootstrap analysis was used to assess the robustness of the clustering topology. The study was complemented with a principal coordinate analysis and with the application of the Mantel test to measure the degree of correspondence between the information furnished by the female and the male samples. The analyses show that the main source of morphometric variability in the Iberian Peninsula is the Basque population. The second source of variation is provided by two populations (Muslims and Jews), different from the rest from an archaeological and cultural point of view, and can probably be attributed to influences from sub-Saharan Africa. The massive deportations of the Jews in 1492 and of the Moors between the 15th and 17th centuries may have erased this source of variability from the present population of the Iberian Peninsula. The remaining studied populations, including samples from Castile, Cantabria, Andalusia, Catalonia and Balearic Islands, are grouped together, showing a notable morphological homogeneity, despite their temporal and geographic heterogeneity. These results are in general agreement with those obtained in synthetic maps, by analyzing multiple genetic markers. In such studies, the Basque population is described as the main source of genetic variability, not only in the Iberian Peninsula, but also in Western Europe.
^^Excellent references Patrol. Keep them coming. What other data do you have on Mediterranean zone routes from Africa into ancient Europe? What routes do some posit? Would Iberia be the primary point of entry on these routes? Were there sea links say in the Paleolithic? Neolithic?
-------------------- Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began.. Posts: 5906 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008
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