...
EgyptSearch Forums Post New Topic  Post A Reply
my profile | directory login | register | search | faq | forum home

  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» EgyptSearch Forums » Deshret » Black women have gotten ridiculous with this hair discussion.

 - UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!    
Author Topic: Black women have gotten ridiculous with this hair discussion.
Real tawk
Banned
Member # 20324

Rate Member
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Real tawk     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Black women hair problem has now gone national lmao! What problem plagues the Black community in America? Well, Black women have just informed America that a main social problem in the Black community is.... get this.... hair RFLOL!!!! Such a destroyed people, could you believe that?

Gabby Douglas is really the catalyst to this. Perhaps Chris Rock can revisit the hair issue and do a sequel documentary to "Good Hair."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/08/gabby-douglas-hair-debate_n_1756835.html

Posts: 507 | Registered: May 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
zarahan aka Enrique Cardova
Member
Member # 15718

Icon 1 posted      Profile for zarahan aka Enrique Cardova     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
 -


Ancient Egyptian hair

Across the web assorted "biodiversity" proponents, wage a
'racial war' using hair studies of ancient Egyptians to prove a
"Caucasian Egypt". But in fact the hair of Africans is highly
variable, debunking their simplistic claims.


The hair of Africans is highly variable, ranging from tight curls
of South African Bantu, to the loose curls and straight hair of
peoples of East and NE Africa, all indigenously evolved over
millennia as part of Africa’s high genetic diversity. This
diversity undermines and ultimately dismisses simplistic
"racial" claims based on hair.


Inconsistencies of the skewed "true negro" model and
definitions of African hair



Dubious assertions, double standards and outmoded racial
hair claims:

Czech anthropologist Strouhal's 1971 study touched on hair,
and advanced the most extreme racial definitions, claiming
Nubians to be white Europids overrun by later waves of
Negroes, and that few Negroes appeared in Egypt until the New
Kingdom. Indeed, Strouhal went so far as to argue that
'Negroes' failed to survive long in Egypt, because they were
ill-adapted to its arid climate! Tell that to the Saharans,
Sudanese and Nubians! Such dubious claims have been
thoroughly debunked by modern scholarship, however they
continue in various guises by those who attempt to use "hair" to
assign race 'percents' and categories to the ancients. Attempts to
define racial categories based on the ancient hair rely heavily
on extreme definitions, with "Negroids" typically being defined
as narrowly as possible. Everything not meeting the extreme
"type" is then classified as something else, such as "Caucasian".

Kieta (1990, Studies of Crania from Northern Africa) notes that
while many scholars in the field have used an extreme "true
negro" definition for African peoples, few have attempted to
apply the same model in reverse and define a "true white."
Such racial double standards are typical of much scholarship on
the ancient Nile Valley peoples. A consistent approach for
example would define the straight hair in Strouhal's hair sample
as an exclusive Caucasian marker (10 out of 49 or
approximately 20%) and make the rest (wavy and curled)
hybrid or negro, at >80%. Assorted writers who support the
Aryan race percent model however, are careful to avoid such
consistency and typically only run the comparison one way.

QUOTE:
"Strouhal (1971) microscopically examined some hair which
had been preserved on a Badarian skull. The analysis was
interpreted as suggesting a stereotypical tropical
African-European hybrid (mulatto). However this hair is
grossly no different from that of Fulani, some Kanuri, or
Somali and does not require a gene flow explanation any more
than curly hair in Greece necessarily does. Extremely "wooly"
hair is not the only kind native to tropical Africa.."
(S. O. Y.
Keita. (1993). "Studies and Comments on Ancient Egyptian
Biological Relationships," History in Africa 20 (1993) 129-54)



Disturbing attempts to use hair to prove race theories:

Fletcher (2002) in Egyptian Hair and Wigs, gives an example
of what she calls "disturbing attempts to use hair to prove
assumptions of race and gender"
involving 1800s European
researcher F. Petrie, who sometimes sought to use excavation
reports to prove his theories of Aegean settlers flowing into
Egypt. Such disturbing attempts continue today in the use of
hair for race category or percentage claims involving the
ancient peoples, such as the "racial" analysis seen on several
Internet blogs and websites, some thinly disguised fronts for
neo-nazi groups or sympathizers.


Hair studies touted by "heriditarian" race proponents
actually applied a stereotyped "true negro" model and used
late period samples of Egypt, after the coming of Greeks,
Hyskos, etc as "representative" excluding the previous 2500
years of ancient civilization.
A study of the hair of Egyptian
mummies by Czech anthropologists Titlbachova and Titllbach
(1977) (reported in Strouhal 1977) using only late period
samples found a wide range of hair in mummies. Of the 14
samples, only 4 were from the south of Egypt, and none of the
14 samples were earlier than the 18th Dynasty. Essentially the
previous 2,000 years + of Egyptain civilization and peopling
are not represented. Only the narrowest definition is used to
identify 'true negro' types'. All other intermediate types were
deemed 'non-negroid.' If a similar procedure is used in reverse
and designates only straight hair as a marker of a European,
then only 4 out of 14 or 29% of the samples can be deemed
"Caucasoid." Below is a breakdown of the Czech data:

Sample# 5- 18th-21st dynasties- Deir el medina- curly
Sample# 8- 21st-25th dynasties- hair looks straight
Sample# 11- Late to Greek Period- hair partly wavy
Sample# 18- Late period Egypt- hair fine diameter
Sample# 19- Greek period- wavy hair
Sample# 29- 18-21st Dynasties- Deir El Medina- hair shape
unascertainable - south
Sample# 31- 18-21st dynasties- Deir El Median- wavy to curly
- south
Sample# 33- 21st-25th dynasties- appears straight
Sample# 34- 21st-25th dynasties- shape difficult to determine
Sample# 35- 21st-25th dynasties- wavy shape
Sample# 40- 21-25th Dynasties- hair curly,
Sample# 44- 21-25th Dynasties- appears straight
Sample# 45- 21-25th Dynasties- appears wavy
Sample# 46- Kharga Oasis- 4th-5th centuries AD


Using modern technology, the same Aryan Race models are
undercut with the data actually showing that Egyptians group
closer to Africans than vaunted white Nordics.



------------ "Nordic hair measurements"

Neo-Nazis and sympathizers tout the work of German researcher
Pruner-Bey in the 1800s (yes they actually go back this far),
which derived racial indexes of hair including Negroes, Egyptians and Germans.
Germanic hair is closer to that of the Egyptians they assert. But
is it as they claim?

(Data of Bruner-Bey 1864- 'On human hair as a race character')
- Negroid index: 57.40
- Egyptian index: 69.94
- White Germans: 66.33
Neo-Nazi conclusion: White German Nordics are 'closer'
to Egyptians

Modern data using electron microscopes- Conti-Fuhrman &
Massa (1972). Massa and Masali (1980)

Compare to Pruner Bey's 1864 data:
- Negroid index: 57.40
- Egyptian index: 60.02 (modern electron microscope data)

White Germans: 66.33
___________________________________________________
___________________________
Conclusion using modern microscope data: Negroes much
‘closer’ to Egyptians than Nordics

___________________________________________________
__________________________________________________


Using hair for race identification as older research does can be
shaky, but even when used, it undercuts ‘Aryan” clams as
shown above.


Fletcher 2002 decries “"disturbing attempts to use hair to prove
assumptions of race and gender..”
Other credible scientists note:

"The reader must assume, as apparently do the authors, that
the "coarseness" or "fineness" of hair can readily distinguish
races and that hair is dichotomized into these categories.
Problematically, however, virtually all who have studied hair
morphology in relation to race since the 1920’s to the present
have rejected such a characterization .. Hausman, as early as
1925, stated that it is "not possible to identify individuals from
samples of their hair, basing identification upon histological
similarities in the structure of scales and medullas, since these
may differ in hairs from the same head or in different parts of
the same hair". Rook (1975) pointed out nearly 50 years later
out that "Negroid and Caucasoid hair" are "chemically
indistinguishable".

--Tom Mieczkowsk, T. (2000). The Further Mismeasure: The
Curious Use of Racial Categorizations in the Interpretation of
Hair Analyses. Intl J Drug Testing 2000;vol 2


Environmental factors can influence hair color, and the
Egyptians routinely placed hair from different sources in
mummy wrappings, making claims of "Nordic-haired" or
"white" Egyptians dubious.


Mummification practices and dyeing of hair. Hair
studies of mummies note that color is often influenced by
environmental factors at burial sites. Brothwell and Spearman
(1963) point out that reddish-brown ancient color hair is
usually the result of partial oxidation of the melanin pigment.
Other causes of hair color "blonding" involve bleaching, caused
by the alkaline in the mummification process. Color also varies
due to the Egyptian practice of dyeing hair with henna. Other
samples show individuals lightening the hair using vegetable
colorants. Thus variations in hair color among mummies do not
necessarily suggest the presence of blond or red-haired
Europeans or Near Easterners flitting about Egypt before being
mummified, but the influence of environmental factors.

Egyptian practice of putting locks of hair in mummy
wrappings.
Racial analysis is also made problematic by the
Egyptian practice of burying hair, in many "votive or funerary
deposits buried separately from the body, a practice found from
Predynastic to Roman times despite its frequent omission from
excavation reports." (Fletcher 2002) In examining hair samples
Fletcher (2004) notes that care is needed to determine what is
natural scalp hair, versus hair from a wig, versus hair
extensions to natural locks. Tracking the exact source of hair is
also critical since the Egyptians were known to have placed
locks of hair from different sources among mummy wrappings.
(The Search for Nefertiti, By Joann Fletcher, HarperCollins,
2004, p. 93-94, 96)


Egyptians shaved much of their natural hair off and used
wigs extensively as covering, obtaining much of the hair for
wigs through trade.
Discoveries" of "Aryan" or 'Nordic"
hair are thus hardly 'proof' of incoming Caucasoids, but may
be simply hair purchased from some source and made into a
wig. This is much less dramatic than the exciting picture of
inflowing 'Aryan' hordes.


The ancient Egyptians shaved off much of their own natural
hair as a matter of personal hygiene and custom, and wore wigs
in public. According to the Encyclopedia of body
adornment

(Margo DeMello, 2007, Greenwood Publishing Group, p.
101), "Boys and girls until puberty wore their hair shaved
except for a side locl left on the side of their head. Many
adults- both men and women- also shaved their hair as a way of
coping with heat and lice. However, adults did not go about
bald, and instead wore wigs in public and in private.. Wigs
were initially worn by the elites, but later worn by women of all
classes.."


The widespread use of wigs in ancient Egypt thus complicates
and contradicts attempts at 'racial' analysis. Fletcher (2002)
shows that many Egyptian wigs have been found with what is
defined as straighter 'cynotrichous' hair. This however is hardly
a marker of massive European or Near Eastern presence or
admixture. Fletcher notes that the Egyptians often eschewed
their own personal hair, shaving carefully and using wigs
widely. The hair for these wigs was often obtained through
trade. Indeed -quote - "hair itself being a valuable commodity ranked
alongside gold and incense in account lists from the town of
Kahun."



Egyptian trading links with other regions is well known, and a
commodity like straighter 'cynotrichous' hair could have been
easily obtained via the Sahara, Levant, the Maghreb,
Mediterranean contacts, or even the hair of Asiatic war captives
or casualties from Egypt's numerous conflicts. There is little
need to postulate mass influxes of European admixtures or
populations to account for hair types in wigs. The limb
proportion studies of the ancient Egyptians showing them to be
much more related to tropical types than to Europids, is further
demonstration of the fallacy of using hair as 'proof' of a 'Aryan'
or predominantly European admixed Egypt.



Nubian wigs and wigs in Egypt


Such exchanges or use of hair appear elsewhere in the Nile
valley. Tomb finds show Nubians themselves wearing wigs of
straight hair. But one Nubian from the Royal valley, of the 12th
century, named Maherpra, was found to be wearing a wig
himself, made up of tightly curled 'negroid' hair, on top of his
natural covering (Fletcher 2002). The so-called "Nubian wig"
also appears in Egyptian art relief's depicting daily life, a
stylistic arrangement thought to imitate those found in southern
Egypt or Nubia. Such wigs appear to have been popular with
both Egyptians and Nubians. Fletcher 2004 notes that the
famous queen Nefertiti made frequent use of the Nubian wig:
"Nefertiti and her daughter seem to have set a trend for wearing
the Nubian wig.. a coiffure first worn by Nubian mercenaries
and clearly associated with the military." A detail of a wall
scene in Theban tomb TT.55 shows the queen wearing the
Nubian wig.
Infantrymen from the Nubia. Note both bow and battle-axe
carried into combat.


Hair studies of Nubians show built-in African genetic
variability


Hair studies of Nubians have also been undertaken. One study
at Semna, in Nubia (Daniel Hrdy 1978- Analysis of Hair
Samples of Mummies from Semna South, American Journal of
Physical Anthropology, (1978) 49: 277-262), found curling
patterns intermediate between Northwest European and African
samples. The X-group, especially males, showed more African
elements than the Meroitic in the curling variables. Crimping
and curvature data patterned in a northwest Europe direction.
These data plots however do not necessarily indicate race
admixture or percentages, or the presence of European migrants
or colonists (see Keita 2005 below), but rather a data pattern of
variation in how hair curls, and native African diversity which
cases substantial overlap with non-African groups. This is a
routine occurrence within human groups.

Africa has the highest phenotypic variation, just as it has
the highest geentic variation- accommodating a wide range of
features for its peoples without the need for any "race mix:
Relethford (2001) shows that ".. methods for estimating
regional diversity show sub-Saharan Africa to have the highest
levels of phenotypic variation, consistent with many genetic
studies." (
Relethford, John "Global Analysis of Regional
Differences in Craniometric Diversity and Population
Substructure". Human Biology - Volume 73, Number 5,
October 2001, pp. 629-636) Hanihara 2003 notes that
[significant] "..intraregional diversity are present in Subsaharan
Africans.." While ancient Egypt had gene flow in various eras,
hair variations easily fall under this pattern of built-in,
indigenous diversity, as well as the above noted cultural
practice of using wigs with hair from different places obtained
through trade.

Among Europeans for example, some people have curlier hair
and some have straighter hair than others. Various peoples of
East and West Africa also have narrow noses, which are
different from other peoples elsewhere in Africa, nevertheless
they still remain Africans. DNA studies also note greater
variation within selected populations that without. Since Africa
has the highest genetic diversity in the world, such routine
variation in characteristics such as hair need not indicate any
racial percentage or admixture, but simply part of the built-in
genetic diversity of the ancient peoples on the continent.
Indeed, the Semna study author notes that blondism, especially
in young children, is common in many dark-haired populations
(e.g., Australian, Melanesian), and is still found in some
Nubian villages. As regards hair color variation, reddish type
hair is associated with the presence of pheomelanin, which can
also be found in persons with dark brown or even black hair as
well. See "Rameses" below. Albinism is another source of red
hair.


Dubious attempts at 'racial analysis' using Nubian hair and
crania.
Assorted supporters of the stereotypical Aryan 'race'
model attempt to use hair to argue for a predominantly 'white'
Nubia. But as noted above, such attempts are dubious given
built-in African genetic diversity. Often 'racial' hair claims
attempt to link on with cranial studies purporting to match
ancient Nubians with Swedes, Frenchmen, etc. But such claims
are also dubious. In a detailed analysis of the Fordisc computer
program used to put forward such claims, Williams,
Armelagos, et al. (2005) found that the program created
ludicrous "matches" between the ancient Nubian crania and
peoples from Hungary, Japan, Easter Island and a host of others
in far-flung regions! Their conclusion was that the diversity of
human populations in the databank explained such wide
ranging matches. Such objective mainstream analyses debunk
obsolete and improbable claims of 'racial' migrations of alleged
Frenchman, Hungarians, or other whites into ancient Nubia, or
equally improbable racial 'percentages' supposedly quantifying
such claims. (Frank l'engle Williams, Robert L. Belcher, and
George J . Armelagos, "Forensic Misclassification of Ancient
Nubian Crania: Implications for Assumptions about Human
Variation," Current Anthropology, volume 46 (2005), pages
340-346)

Alleged massive influx of Europeans and Middle Easterners
to give the ancient peoples hair variation did not happen.

Such variation was already in place as part of Africa' built in
genetic and phenotypic diversity.
As regards diameter, the average diameter of the Semna sample
was close to both the Northwest European and East African
samples. This again suggests a range of built-in African
indigenous variability, and calls into questions various
migration theories to the Nile Valley. One study for example
(Keita 2005) tested the model of C. Loring Brace (1993) as to
the notion of incoming European migrants replacing
indigenous peoples of the Nile Valley. Brace's work had also
suggested a relationship between northwest Europeans such as
Scandanavians and African peoples of the Horn. Data analysis
failed to support this model, instead clustering samples much
closer to African series than to Europeans. Keita concluded that
similarities between African data in his survey (skulls, etc) and
non-Africans was not due to gene flow, but a subset of built-in
African variability.

Ancient Egyptians cluster much closer to other Egyptians and
Nubians. A later study by Brace, (Brace 2005- The
questionable contribution..) groups ancient Egyptian
populations like the Naqada closer to Nubians and Somalis
than European, Mediterranean or Middle Eastern populations,
and places various Nubians samples closer to Tanzanian,
Dahomeian, and Congoid data points than to Europeans and
Middle easterners. The limb proportion studies of Zakrzewski
(2003) (Zakrzewski, S.R. (2003). "Variation in ancient
Egyptian stature and body proportions". American Journal of
Physical Anthropology 121 (3): 219-229.) showing the tropical
body plan of the ancient Egyptians also undercuts theories of
inflowing European or near Eastern colonists, or the 'native
Europid' model of Strouhal (1971).


The yellowish-red-hair of Rameses: proof of a Nordic
Egypt?


Red hair itself is within the range of African diversity or that of
dark-skinned peoples. Native black Australoids for example
routinely produce blonde hair:

Detailed microscopic analysis during the 1980s (Balout 1985)
identified some of the hair of Egyptian Pharoah Rameses II as
being a yellowish-red. Such a finding should not be surprising
given the wide range of physical variability in Africa, the most
genetically diverse region on earth, out of which flowed other
population groups. Indeed, blondism and various other hair
shades are not unknown in East Africa or Nubia, particularly in
children, nor are such hair color variants uncommon in
dark-haired or dark skinned populations like the Australians.
(Hrdy 1978) Given the range of genetic variability in Africa, a
red-haired Rameses is hardly unusual. Rameses' reign, in the
19th Dynasty, came over 1,500 years after the Egyptian state
had been established, and after the Hyskos interlude. Such
latecomers to Egypt, like the Hyskos, Assyrians, Greeks,
Romans, Arabs etc would add their own genetic strands to the
nation’s mix. Whatever the blend of genes that occurred with
Rameses, his hair offers little supposed "proof" of a "white" or
"Nordic" Egypt. If anything, X-rays of the royal mummies from
earlier Dynasties by mainstream scientists show that the
Egyptians pharaohs and other royals had varied 'Negroid'
leanings. See X-Rays of the Royal mummies here, or here.

Pheomelanin and Rameses- Dark haired populations routinely
produce light hair. Pheomelanin is found in light and
dark-haired populations:
The finding of Rameses “red” hair
also deserves further scrutiny. The analysis found evidence of
dyeing to make the hair yellowish-red, but some elements were
untouched by the dye. These elements of yellowish-red hair in
Balout’s study, were established on the basis of the presence of
pheomelanin, a red-brown polymeric pigment in the skin and
hair of humans. However, pheomelanin can also be found in
persons with dark brown or even black hair as well, which
gives it a reddish hue. Most natural melanins contain sulfur,
which is typically associated with pheomelanin. In scientific
tests of melanin, black hair contained as much as 5% sulfur,
3% lower than the 8.8% found in Irish red hair, but exceeding
the 2.3% found in Scandinavian blond hair. (Jolles, et al. 1996)
Thus the yellowish-red hair discovered on Rameses is well
within the range of human variation for dark haired people,
whatever the exact gene combination that led to the condition.

Rameses hair was not a typical European red, but
yellowish-red, within African variation. It was also not ultra
straight, further undermining claims of "Nordic" influence
.
Somalians and Ethiopians are SUB-SAHARANS and they
routinely produce straight-haired people without the need for
any "race mix" to explain why. The analysis on Rameses also
did not show classic "European" red hair but hair of a light red
to yellowish tinge. Black haired or dark-skinned populations
are quite capable of producing such yellowish-red color
variants on their own, as can be seen in today's east and
northeast Africa (see child's photo above). Nor is such color
variation unusual to Africa. Native dark-skinned populations in
Australia, routinely produce people with blond or reddish hair.
As noted above, ultra diverse Africa is the original source of
such variation.

The analysis also found the hair to be cymotrich or wavy, again
a characteristic quite within the range of overall African or Nile
valley physical and genetic diversity. A "pure" Nordic type of
straight hair was thus not established for Rameses. Hence the
notion of white Europeans or red-headed Caucasoids from
other areas flowing into ancient Egypt to add hair variation,
particularly the early centuries of the dynastic state is unlikely.
Such flows may have occurred most heavily in the Greek and
Roman era but say nothing about the thousands of years
preceding. The presence of pheomelanin conditions or other
genetic combinations also explains how the different hair used
in Egyptian wigs could vary in color, aside from environmental
oxidation, bleaching and dyeing.

Red hair is rare worldwide, and history shows little evidence
of Northern Europeans or "Nordics" sweeping into Egypt to
give the natives a bit of hair coloring or variation.

Most red hair is found in northern and western Europe,
especially in the British Isles, and even then it appears in minor
frequencies in Europe- some 4% of the population. It is
unlikely such populations had any major contact or influence in
the ancient Nile Valley. As noted above, red hair is
comparatively rare in the world’s populations and pheomelanin
conditions are found in dark-haired populations, and thus is
well within the range of variation from the Sahara, East Africa
and the Nile valley. “White Aryan” theories of Egypt are seen
in the works of HFK Gunther (1927), Archibald Sayce (1925)
and Raymond Dart (1939), and still find traction on a number
of 'Aryan', neo-nazi and "race" websites and blogs which
purport to show a "white Nordic Egypt" using Rameses' "red"
hair as an example. Today's scientific research however, has
debunked these dubious views, showing that red hair, while not
common world wide, is a well known variant within human
populations, even those with dark hair.

Straight or curly hair is also routine among sub-Saharans like
Somalians, who are firmly part of the East African populations.
As regards Somalians for example, Somali DNA
overwhelmingly links much more heavily with other Africans
including Kenyans & Ethiopians (85%), than with Europeans &
Middle Easterners. (15%) On Y-chromosome markers (E3b1),
Somalis (77%) and other African populations dwarf small
European (5.1%) or Middle Eastern (6.3%) frequencies. “The
data suggest that the male Somali population is a branch of the
East African population..” (Sanchez et al., High frequencies of
Y chromosome lineages.. in Somali males (2005)


 -

As one mainstream researcher notes about the dubious value
of "racial" hair analysis:


"The reader must assume, as apparently do the authors, that
the "coarseness" or "fineness" of hair can readily distinguish
races and that hair is dichotomized into these categories.
Problematically, however, virtually all who have studied hair
morphology in relation to race since the 1920’s to the present
have rejected such a characterization .. Hausman, as early as
1925, stated that it is "not possible to identify individuals from
samples of their hair, basing identification upon histological
similarities in the structure of scales and medullas, since these
may differ in hairs from the same head or in different parts of
the same hair". Rook (1975) pointed out nearly 50 years later
out that "Negroid and Caucasoid hair" are "chemically
indistinguishable".

--Tom Mieczkowsk, T. (2000). The Further Mismeasure: The
Curious Use of Racial Categorizations in the Interpretation of
Hair Analyses. Intl J Drug Testing 2000;vol 2


In numerous studies of mummies, alleged "red" hair turns
out to be affected by aging, chemical oxidation, dyeing and
other processes having nothing to do with red-headed visitors,
migrants, slaves or invaders. Red hair is rare worldwide,
occurring mostly in Northern EUrope and even then, only
within less that 9% of northern populations


"The current colour of the hair is brown with reddish
highlights, a common observation on many mummies, and
probably originated through post-mortem alteration
(Aufderheide, 2003; Wilson et al., 2001). Sun-exposure,
bacterial reaction, and embalming methods are some of the
factors that may affect the original hair colour. As a result, hair
that was originally black or brown exhibits reddish, orange or
even blond colour due to post mortem alterations. All human
hair, however, does not turn red over archaeological
time-scales (Wilson, 2001). Based on the histological analysis
of the unstained hair samples, the limited fungal influence, and
the macroscopic view, it can be assumed that the original hair
colour was brown. Similar cases of hair preservation have been
reported in studies of both mummified and non-mummified
human remains (Aufderheide, 2003; Brothwell and Dobney,
1986; Lubec et al., 1987; White, 1993; Wilson et al., 2002,
2007b)."


--C. Papageorgopoulou et al. 2008. Indications of embalming
in Roman Greece by physical, chemical and histological
analysis. Journal of Archaeological Science

--------------------
Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began..

Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Real tawk
Banned
Member # 20324

Rate Member
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Real tawk     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
^spambot fool
Posts: 507 | Registered: May 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
zarahan aka Enrique Cardova
Member
Member # 15718

Icon 1 posted      Profile for zarahan aka Enrique Cardova     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
 -

On the web, extensive neo-Nazi spam and Wikipedia “stealth” inserts
claim that Cro-Magnons are pure “Caucasian” ancestors of today’s
Europeans. Hard data however debunks this on 6 counts, and shows a
diverse Cro-Magnon population.



1-- Detailed modern cranial studies show Cro-magnon crania clustering
AWAY from today’s Europeans.
Brace 2005 testedthe “Cro-magnid”
claim and found it “folklore.” QUOTE: "When canonical variates are
plotted, neither sample ties in with Cro-Magnon as was once suggested. ..
If this analysis shows nothing else, it demonstrates that the oft-repeated
European feeling that the Cro-Magnons are “us” (46) is more a product of
anthropological folklore than the result of the metric data available from
the skeletal remains..."
--CL. Brace 2005. The Questionable contribution of the Neolithic to
European craniofacial form



2–Africans possessing the highest phenotypical diversity on earth,
producing variants covering most features. Several Cro-Magnon
specimens are described as ‘negroid.’
QUOTE:

“Both methods for estimating regional diversity show sub-Saharan
Africato have the highest levels of phenotypic variation consistent with
many genetic studies.“
[-- Relethford, John "Global Analysis of Regional Differences in
Craniometric Diversity .” Hum Bio v73, n5, -629-636])

---------------------- Three scholars (Arthur Keith, M Boule and HV
Valloid found ‘negroid’Cro-Magnon features:
QUOTE: "The ancient
Grimaldi woman and boy are of the mixed or negroid type."
--(Arthur Keith. Ancient Types of Man. p. 60)


3- Several Upper Paleolithic European specimens show high cural
indices in limb proportions- more akin to dark-skinned tropical Africans
than today’s Europeans, who show lower cural indices.
QUOTE:
"As with all the other limb/trunk indices, the recent Europeans evince
lower indices, reflective of shorter tibiae, and the recent sub-Saharan
Africans have higher indices, reflective of their long tibiae... The Dolno
Vestonice and Pavlov humans.. have body proportions similar to those of
other Gravettian specimens. Specifically, they are characterized by high
bracial and cural indices, indicative of distal limb segment elongation.."
--Trinkaus and Svoboda. 2005. Early Modern Human Evolution in Central
Europe]


– AND--

-Body proportions of early European H. sapiens fossils suggest a tropical
adaptation and support an African origin (Holliday & Trinkaus, 1991;
Ruff, 1994; Pearson, 1997, 2000; Holliday, 1997, 1998, 2000).”
-–McBrearty and Brooks 2000. The Revolution that Wasn’t. Jrn Hu Evo
39, 453-563



4-- Traits like narrow noses occur naturally in African
environments:

".. low mean nasal indices (high, narrow noses) tend to [also] be found in
arid regions, such as the desert areas of east Africa.. -- Mays. S. (2010).
The Archaeology of Human Bones. Pg 100-101


5-- Several Upper Paleolithic European types- Predmost (Czech),
Combo Capelle (France) Grimaldi (Italy) and Teviec (France) show a
variant of “African” affinities like prognathism. Some scholars hold this to
be an ‘Eastern Cro-Magnon’ variant:
QUOTE:

------ "others like Predomost and to a lesser degree Grimaldi and Teviec,
are more prognathic like Skhul 5."
--Marta Mirazón Lahr. 2005. The Evolution of Modern Human Diversity:
A Study of Cranial Variation

and

---------- ".. on whose basis, many specialists define the eastern
Cro-Magnon variant in the Upper Paleolithic population of western
Europe."
--S. De Laet (1994). History of Humanity, UNESCO


6– DNA provides clear evidence of tropical African types migrating to
Paleolithic era Europe, contradicting claims of “Caucasoid” evolution in
situ. Tropical limb evidence confirms DNA. The African tropical types
may have interbred with local Neanderthals, but in any event would have
adapted to the colder conditions of Europe over time.
QUOTE:

"Early modern Europeans reflect both their predominant African early
modern human ancestry and a substantial degree of admixture between
those early modern humans and the indigenous Neandertals. Given the
tens of millennia since then and the limitations inherent in ancient DNA,
this process is largely invisible in the molecular record. It is readily
apparent in the paleontological record.“
--E. Trinkhaus (2004) European early modern humans and the fate of the
Neandertals. PNAS 2007 vol. 104 no. 18 7367-7372

and

"The so-called Old Man [Cro-Magnon 1] became the original model for
what was once termed the Cro-Magnon or Upper Paleolithic "race" of
Europe.. there's no such valid biological category, and Cro-Magnon 1 is
not typical of Upper Paleolithic western Europeans- and not even all that
similar to the other two make skulls found at the site. Most of the genetic
evidence, as well as the newest fossil evidence from Africa argue against
continuous local evolution producing modern groups directly from any
Eurasian pre-modern population.. there's no longer much debate that a
large genetic contribution from migrating early modern Africans infuenced
other groups throughout the Old World.“
--B. Lewis et al. 2008. Understanding Humans: Introduction to Physical
Anthropology and Archaeology. p 297
------------------------------------

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/romania/5273654/Scientists-reveal-face-of-the-first-European.html

 -

Scientists reveal face of the first European
The face of the first European has been recreated from bone fragments by scientists.

By Urmee Khan, Digital and Media Correspondent

8:22PM BST 04 May 2009

The head was rebuilt in clay based on an incomplete skull and jawbone discovered in a cave in the south west of the Carpathian Mountains in Romania by potholers.
The first modern European Forensic artist Richard Neave reconstructed the face based on skull fragments from 35000 years ago.

Using radiocarbon analysis scientists say the man or woman, it is still not possible to determine the sex, lived between 34,000 and 36,000 years ago.

Europe was then occupied by both Neanderthal man, who had been in the region for thousands of years, and anatomically-modern humans – Homo sapiens.

Modern humans first arrived in Europe from Africa.

...
---------------------

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/5299351/African-tribe-populated-rest-of-the-world.html
African tribe populated rest of the world
The entire human race outside Africa owes its existence to the survival of a single tribe of around 200 people who crossed the Red Sea 70,000 years ago, scientists have discovered.

By Richard Gray, Science Correspondent

9:00PM BST 09 May 2009


Research by geneticists and archaeologists has allowed them to trace the origins of modern homo sapiens back to a single group of people who managed to cross from the Horn of Africa and into Arabia. From there they went on to colonise the rest of the world.

Genetic analysis of modern day human populations in Europe, Asia, Australia, North America and South America have revealed that they are all descended from these common ancestors.

It is thought that changes in the climate between 90,000 and 70,000 years ago caused sea levels to drop dramatically and allowed the crossing of the Red Sea to take place.

The findings are to be revealed in a new BBC Two documentary series, The Incredible Human Journey, that traces the prehistoric origins of the human species.

Dr Peter Forster, a senior lecturer in archaeogenetics at Anglia Ruskin University in Cambridge who carried out some of the genetic work, said: "The founder populations cannot have been very big. We are talking about just a few hundred individuals."
Homo sapiens, known casually as "modern humans", are thought to have first evolved around 195,000 years ago in east Africa – the earliest remains from that time were uncovered near the Omo River in Ethiopia.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 -

Parents of "Eurasian Adam" and "Eurasian Eve" came from
Africa modern DNA analysis shows


"The vast majority, perhaps all, men with European and Asian genetic
backgrounds can trace their Y-chromosome lineage back to a particular
male (named M168, after the marker that defines these chromosomes). M168
thus can be considered the Eurasian Adam. Although the Y-chromosome Adam
and mitrochondrial Eve did not meet, it is quite possible that the Eurasian "Adam"
M168 could have met his equivalent, the Eurasian Eve (known as L3). The
estimates of their dates overlap (around five thousand years ago) and they both
probably lived in northeast Africa. Africa? Yes, Africa. Although nearly all Eurasian
mtDNA and Y chromosomes currently existing can be traced back to L3 and M168
respectively, M168 and L3 also had African descendants."

---Norman Johnson (2007) Darwinian Detectives: Revealing the Natural History of
Genes and Genomes. p. 100. [Norman A. Johnson, an evolutionary geneticist,
is the author of numerous research publications, mainly in the genetics and evolution
of reproductive isolation between nascent species. Johnson has taught at the University
of Chicago, University of Texas at Arlington, and the University of Massachusetts].

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


 -

Advanced cognitive, technological and behavioral patterns derive from
Africa. Dubbed the "Human Revolution" by some researchers, they lead up to the
expansion of humans from Africa to other parts of the world, circa 60-40kya. Other
scholars argue for a more gradual continuum of advances deeply rooted in
Africa that spread worldwide. In either scenario, whether relatively rapid advance
or gradual accumulation, the cognitive, technological and behavioral advances
took place within Africa.


QUOTE:
"Recent research has provided increasing support for the origins of anatomically
and genetically "modern" human populations in Africa between 150,000 and 200,000
years ago, followed by a major dispersal of these populations to both Asia and Europe
sometime after ca. 65,000 before present (B.P.). However, the central question of why it
took these populations {approx}100,000 years to disperse from Africa to other regions of
the world has never been clearly resolved. It is suggested here that the answer may lie
partly in the results of recent DNA studies of present-day African populations, combined
with a spate of new archaeological discoveries in Africa. Studies of both the mitochondrial
DNA (mtDNA) mismatch patterns in modern African populations and related mtDNA
lineage-analysis patterns point to a major demographic expansion centered broadly within
the time range from 80,000 to 60,000 B.P., probably deriving from a small geographical
region of Africa.

Recent archaeological discoveries in southern and eastern Africa suggest that, at approximately
the same time, there was a major increase in the complexity of the technological, economic, social,
and cognitive behavior of certain African groups,
which could have led to a major demographic
expansion of these groups in competition with other, adjacent groups. It is suggested that this
complex of behavioral changes (possibly triggered by the rapid environmental changes around
the transition from oxygen isotope stage 5 to stage 4) could have led not only to the expansion of
the L2 and L3 mitochondrial lineages over the whole of Africa but also to the ensuing dispersal of
these modern populations over most regions of Asia, Australasia, and Europe, and their replacement
(with or without interbreeding) of the preceding "archaic" populations in these regions."

---Mellars, Paul (2006) Why did modern human populations disperse from Africa ca. 60,000 years ago?
A new model. PNAS, 2006, 103(25), pp. 9381-9386

 -


Advanced cognitive, artistic and behavioral patterns and technology like more refined tools
are found in Africa long before similar patterns arose in Europe. The migration of tropical
African types to Europe in the Cro-Magnon era brought these cognitive, cultural and behavioral
advances to Neanderthal Europe.


"A more gradual "revolution" position is now held [by Paul Mellars].. a period of
accelerated change in Africa between about 60,000 and 80,000 years ago, as shown
by the following developments recorded in South African cave sites: new and better-
techniques for producing long thin flakes of stone blades; specialized tools called end
scrapers and burins, which were probably used for working skins and bones, the
[production of tiny stone segments that must have mounted on handles of wood or
bone to make composite tools, complexly shaped stone tools such as 'leaf points',
relatively complex bone tools; marine shells perforated to make necklaces or bracelets,
red ochre (natural iron oxide) engraved with geometric designs suggesting early artwork,;
greater permanence and differentiated occupation areas in caves; new subsistence practices
such as the exploitation of marine fish as well as shellfish; and perhaps intentional burning
of undergrowth to encourage the growth of underground plant resources such as tubers.
Mellars suggests that a neurological switch to modernity in the brain alongside rapid
Climatic fluctuations, could have been the driving forces behind this period of heightened
cultural innovations.."

"The most impressive site for early evidence of symbolism however, is Blombos Cave in South
Africa, with a record stretching well beyond 70,000 years ago.. The stone tools in these levels
include Still Bay points, beautifully shaped thin lanceolate spear points, flaked on both sides.
They also show the earliest application of a refined stone tool-making technique known as
pressure flaking, some 55,000 years before its best-known manifestation in the Soultrean
industry of EUrope. Slabs of red ochre were excavated from various levels, including the
deepest ones, with wavy, fan or mesh-shaped patterns carefully engraved on them..
Hundreds [beads made from seashells] have now been excavated from Blombos,
and most show signs of piercing, with many holes also displaying signs of wear.. The
shells have a natural shiny luster, but the color seems to have been modified by rubbing
with hematite in some cases and by heating to darken the shells in other cases, so they
may have been strung in different-colored patterns.. "

--Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only human on earth 150-155


 -

Some archaeologists criticize notions of a "human revolution" suddenly
occurring after humans exited Africa for Asia and Europe. Instead they
argue, the supposed "revolutionary" changes in cognition, symbol
manipulation, advanced technology, trade etc were ALREADY occurring
WITHIN Africa, long before any migration out. There is no need for a
'eureka moment' of 'progress' upon leaving Africa. 'Progress' was already
well underway and long in place within Africa, without the need for
'eureka' moments.
QUOTE:

"This is because by focusing on changes that occurred at the Middle
Paleolithic/Upper Paleolithic or Middle Stone Age/Later Stone Age
transitions (in Europe and Africa, respectively), there is a failure to
appreciate the depth and breadth of the African Middle Stone Age record
that preceded the time of the supposed revolution by at least 100,000
years. In their view, [McBrearty and Brooks 2000] 'modern' features such
as advanced technologies, increased geographic range, specialized hunting,
fishing and shell-fishing, long distance trade, and the symbolic use of
pigments had already developed in a broad range of Middle Stone Age
industries right across Africa, between 100,000 and 250,000 years ago.
This suggested to them that an early assembly of the package of modern
human behaviors occurred in Africa, followed by much later export to the
rest of the world. Thus the origin of our species, both behaviorally and
morphologically, was linked to early developments in Middle Stone Age
technology, and not to changes that occurred much later.. 'this quest for
this 'eureka moment' reveals a great deal about the needs, desired and
aspirations of archaeologists, but obscures rather than illuminates events in
the past.."

--Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only
human on earth 128-29

--------------------
Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began..

Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Thule
Member
Member # 18853

Rate Member
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Thule     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
^ poor troll.

Cro-Magnons were Caucasoid.

quote:
To examine this idea further, we use the eight Upper Paleolithic crania available from the test series of Howells (1995), all of which are complete. Our analysis of these eight, based on 55 measurements, is presented in Table 1. Using raw measurements, 6 of 8 express an affinity to Norse, and with the shape variables of Darroch and Mosimann (1985), 5 of 8 express a similarity to Norse. Using shape variables reduces the Mahalanobis distance, substantially in some cases. Typicality probabilities, particularly for the shape variables, show the crania to be fairly typical of recent populations. The results presented in Table 1 are consistent with the idea that Upper Paleolithic crania are, for the most part, larger and more generalized versions of recent Europeans. Howells (1995) reached a similar conclusion with respect to European Mesolithic crania
Jantz and Owsley (2003)
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajpa.10188/abstract
American Journal of Physical Anthropology
Volume 121, Issue 2, pages 185–188.

Cro-Magnons cluster in multivariate cranial analysis with Nordics. " of 8 express an affinity to Norse, and with the shape variables of Darroch and Mosimann (1985), 5 of 8 express a similarity to Norse."

Read it and weep.

Posts: 1575 | From: - | Registered: May 2011  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Ish Geber
Member
Member # 18264

Member Rated:
4
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Ish Geber     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by zarahan- aka Enrique Cardova:
 -

On the web, extensive neo-Nazi spam and Wikipedia “stealth” inserts
claim that Cro-Magnons are pure “Caucasian” ancestors of today’s
Europeans. Hard data however debunks this on 6 counts, and shows a
diverse Cro-Magnon population.



1-- Detailed modern cranial studies show Cro-magnon crania clustering
AWAY from today’s Europeans.
Brace 2005 testedthe “Cro-magnid”
claim and found it “folklore.” QUOTE: "When canonical variates are
plotted, neither sample ties in with Cro-Magnon as was once suggested. ..
If this analysis shows nothing else, it demonstrates that the oft-repeated
European feeling that the Cro-Magnons are “us” (46) is more a product of
anthropological folklore than the result of the metric data available from
the skeletal remains..."
--CL. Brace 2005. The Questionable contribution of the Neolithic to
European craniofacial form



2–Africans possessing the highest phenotypical diversity on earth,
producing variants covering most features. Several Cro-Magnon
specimens are described as ‘negroid.’
QUOTE:

“Both methods for estimating regional diversity show sub-Saharan
Africato have the highest levels of phenotypic variation consistent with
many genetic studies.“
[-- Relethford, John "Global Analysis of Regional Differences in
Craniometric Diversity .” Hum Bio v73, n5, -629-636])

---------------------- Three scholars (Arthur Keith, M Boule and HV
Valloid found ‘negroid’Cro-Magnon features:
QUOTE: "The ancient
Grimaldi woman and boy are of the mixed or negroid type."
--(Arthur Keith. Ancient Types of Man. p. 60)


3- Several Upper Paleolithic European specimens show high cural
indices in limb proportions- more akin to dark-skinned tropical Africans
than today’s Europeans, who show lower cural indices.
QUOTE:
"As with all the other limb/trunk indices, the recent Europeans evince
lower indices, reflective of shorter tibiae, and the recent sub-Saharan
Africans have higher indices, reflective of their long tibiae... The Dolno
Vestonice and Pavlov humans.. have body proportions similar to those of
other Gravettian specimens. Specifically, they are characterized by high
bracial and cural indices, indicative of distal limb segment elongation.."
--Trinkaus and Svoboda. 2005. Early Modern Human Evolution in Central
Europe]


– AND--

-Body proportions of early European H. sapiens fossils suggest a tropical
adaptation and support an African origin (Holliday & Trinkaus, 1991;
Ruff, 1994; Pearson, 1997, 2000; Holliday, 1997, 1998, 2000).”
-–McBrearty and Brooks 2000. The Revolution that Wasn’t. Jrn Hu Evo
39, 453-563



4-- Traits like narrow noses occur naturally in African
environments:

".. low mean nasal indices (high, narrow noses) tend to [also] be found in
arid regions, such as the desert areas of east Africa.. -- Mays. S. (2010).
The Archaeology of Human Bones. Pg 100-101


5-- Several Upper Paleolithic European types- Predmost (Czech),
Combo Capelle (France) Grimaldi (Italy) and Teviec (France) show a
variant of “African” affinities like prognathism. Some scholars hold this to
be an ‘Eastern Cro-Magnon’ variant:
QUOTE:

------ "others like Predomost and to a lesser degree Grimaldi and Teviec,
are more prognathic like Skhul 5."
--Marta Mirazón Lahr. 2005. The Evolution of Modern Human Diversity:
A Study of Cranial Variation

and

---------- ".. on whose basis, many specialists define the eastern
Cro-Magnon variant in the Upper Paleolithic population of western
Europe."
--S. De Laet (1994). History of Humanity, UNESCO


6– DNA provides clear evidence of tropical African types migrating to
Paleolithic era Europe, contradicting claims of “Caucasoid” evolution in
situ. Tropical limb evidence confirms DNA. The African tropical types
may have interbred with local Neanderthals, but in any event would have
adapted to the colder conditions of Europe over time.
QUOTE:

"Early modern Europeans reflect both their predominant African early
modern human ancestry and a substantial degree of admixture between
those early modern humans and the indigenous Neandertals. Given the
tens of millennia since then and the limitations inherent in ancient DNA,
this process is largely invisible in the molecular record. It is readily
apparent in the paleontological record.“
--E. Trinkhaus (2004) European early modern humans and the fate of the
Neandertals. PNAS 2007 vol. 104 no. 18 7367-7372

and

"The so-called Old Man [Cro-Magnon 1] became the original model for
what was once termed the Cro-Magnon or Upper Paleolithic "race" of
Europe.. there's no such valid biological category, and Cro-Magnon 1 is
not typical of Upper Paleolithic western Europeans- and not even all that
similar to the other two make skulls found at the site. Most of the genetic
evidence, as well as the newest fossil evidence from Africa argue against
continuous local evolution producing modern groups directly from any
Eurasian pre-modern population.. there's no longer much debate that a
large genetic contribution from migrating early modern Africans infuenced
other groups throughout the Old World.“
--B. Lewis et al. 2008. Understanding Humans: Introduction to Physical
Anthropology and Archaeology. p 297
------------------------------------

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/romania/5273654/Scientists-reveal-face-of-the-first-European.html

 -

Scientists reveal face of the first European
The face of the first European has been recreated from bone fragments by scientists.

By Urmee Khan, Digital and Media Correspondent

8:22PM BST 04 May 2009

The head was rebuilt in clay based on an incomplete skull and jawbone discovered in a cave in the south west of the Carpathian Mountains in Romania by potholers.
The first modern European Forensic artist Richard Neave reconstructed the face based on skull fragments from 35000 years ago.

Using radiocarbon analysis scientists say the man or woman, it is still not possible to determine the sex, lived between 34,000 and 36,000 years ago.

Europe was then occupied by both Neanderthal man, who had been in the region for thousands of years, and anatomically-modern humans – Homo sapiens.

Modern humans first arrived in Europe from Africa.

...
---------------------

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/5299351/African-tribe-populated-rest-of-the-world.html
African tribe populated rest of the world
The entire human race outside Africa owes its existence to the survival of a single tribe of around 200 people who crossed the Red Sea 70,000 years ago, scientists have discovered.

By Richard Gray, Science Correspondent

9:00PM BST 09 May 2009


Research by geneticists and archaeologists has allowed them to trace the origins of modern homo sapiens back to a single group of people who managed to cross from the Horn of Africa and into Arabia. From there they went on to colonise the rest of the world.

Genetic analysis of modern day human populations in Europe, Asia, Australia, North America and South America have revealed that they are all descended from these common ancestors.

It is thought that changes in the climate between 90,000 and 70,000 years ago caused sea levels to drop dramatically and allowed the crossing of the Red Sea to take place.

The findings are to be revealed in a new BBC Two documentary series, The Incredible Human Journey, that traces the prehistoric origins of the human species.

Dr Peter Forster, a senior lecturer in archaeogenetics at Anglia Ruskin University in Cambridge who carried out some of the genetic work, said: "The founder populations cannot have been very big. We are talking about just a few hundred individuals."
Homo sapiens, known casually as "modern humans", are thought to have first evolved around 195,000 years ago in east Africa – the earliest remains from that time were uncovered near the Omo River in Ethiopia.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 -

Parents of "Eurasian Adam" and "Eurasian Eve" came from
Africa modern DNA analysis shows


"The vast majority, perhaps all, men with European and Asian genetic
backgrounds can trace their Y-chromosome lineage back to a particular
male (named M168, after the marker that defines these chromosomes). M168
thus can be considered the Eurasian Adam. Although the Y-chromosome Adam
and mitrochondrial Eve did not meet, it is quite possible that the Eurasian "Adam"
M168 could have met his equivalent, the Eurasian Eve (known as L3). The
estimates of their dates overlap (around five thousand years ago) and they both
probably lived in northeast Africa. Africa? Yes, Africa. Although nearly all Eurasian
mtDNA and Y chromosomes currently existing can be traced back to L3 and M168
respectively, M168 and L3 also had African descendants."

---Norman Johnson (2007) Darwinian Detectives: Revealing the Natural History of
Genes and Genomes. p. 100. [Norman A. Johnson, an evolutionary geneticist,
is the author of numerous research publications, mainly in the genetics and evolution
of reproductive isolation between nascent species. Johnson has taught at the University
of Chicago, University of Texas at Arlington, and the University of Massachusetts].

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


 -

Advanced cognitive, technological and behavioral patterns derive from
Africa. Dubbed the "Human Revolution" by some researchers, they lead up to the
expansion of humans from Africa to other parts of the world, circa 60-40kya. Other
scholars argue for a more gradual continuum of advances deeply rooted in
Africa that spread worldwide. In either scenario, whether relatively rapid advance
or gradual accumulation, the cognitive, technological and behavioral advances
took place within Africa.


QUOTE:
"Recent research has provided increasing support for the origins of anatomically
and genetically "modern" human populations in Africa between 150,000 and 200,000
years ago, followed by a major dispersal of these populations to both Asia and Europe
sometime after ca. 65,000 before present (B.P.). However, the central question of why it
took these populations {approx}100,000 years to disperse from Africa to other regions of
the world has never been clearly resolved. It is suggested here that the answer may lie
partly in the results of recent DNA studies of present-day African populations, combined
with a spate of new archaeological discoveries in Africa. Studies of both the mitochondrial
DNA (mtDNA) mismatch patterns in modern African populations and related mtDNA
lineage-analysis patterns point to a major demographic expansion centered broadly within
the time range from 80,000 to 60,000 B.P., probably deriving from a small geographical
region of Africa.

Recent archaeological discoveries in southern and eastern Africa suggest that, at approximately
the same time, there was a major increase in the complexity of the technological, economic, social,
and cognitive behavior of certain African groups,
which could have led to a major demographic
expansion of these groups in competition with other, adjacent groups. It is suggested that this
complex of behavioral changes (possibly triggered by the rapid environmental changes around
the transition from oxygen isotope stage 5 to stage 4) could have led not only to the expansion of
the L2 and L3 mitochondrial lineages over the whole of Africa but also to the ensuing dispersal of
these modern populations over most regions of Asia, Australasia, and Europe, and their replacement
(with or without interbreeding) of the preceding "archaic" populations in these regions."

---Mellars, Paul (2006) Why did modern human populations disperse from Africa ca. 60,000 years ago?
A new model. PNAS, 2006, 103(25), pp. 9381-9386

 -


Advanced cognitive, artistic and behavioral patterns and technology like more refined tools
are found in Africa long before similar patterns arose in Europe. The migration of tropical
African types to Europe in the Cro-Magnon era brought these cognitive, cultural and behavioral
advances to Neanderthal Europe.


"A more gradual "revolution" position is now held [by Paul Mellars].. a period of
accelerated change in Africa between about 60,000 and 80,000 years ago, as shown
by the following developments recorded in South African cave sites: new and better-
techniques for producing long thin flakes of stone blades; specialized tools called end
scrapers and burins, which were probably used for working skins and bones, the
[production of tiny stone segments that must have mounted on handles of wood or
bone to make composite tools, complexly shaped stone tools such as 'leaf points',
relatively complex bone tools; marine shells perforated to make necklaces or bracelets,
red ochre (natural iron oxide) engraved with geometric designs suggesting early artwork,;
greater permanence and differentiated occupation areas in caves; new subsistence practices
such as the exploitation of marine fish as well as shellfish; and perhaps intentional burning
of undergrowth to encourage the growth of underground plant resources such as tubers.
Mellars suggests that a neurological switch to modernity in the brain alongside rapid
Climatic fluctuations, could have been the driving forces behind this period of heightened
cultural innovations.."

"The most impressive site for early evidence of symbolism however, is Blombos Cave in South
Africa, with a record stretching well beyond 70,000 years ago.. The stone tools in these levels
include Still Bay points, beautifully shaped thin lanceolate spear points, flaked on both sides.
They also show the earliest application of a refined stone tool-making technique known as
pressure flaking, some 55,000 years before its best-known manifestation in the Soultrean
industry of EUrope. Slabs of red ochre were excavated from various levels, including the
deepest ones, with wavy, fan or mesh-shaped patterns carefully engraved on them..
Hundreds [beads made from seashells] have now been excavated from Blombos,
and most show signs of piercing, with many holes also displaying signs of wear.. The
shells have a natural shiny luster, but the color seems to have been modified by rubbing
with hematite in some cases and by heating to darken the shells in other cases, so they
may have been strung in different-colored patterns.. "

--Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only human on earth 150-155


 -

Some archaeologists criticize notions of a "human revolution" suddenly
occurring after humans exited Africa for Asia and Europe. Instead they
argue, the supposed "revolutionary" changes in cognition, symbol
manipulation, advanced technology, trade etc were ALREADY occurring
WITHIN Africa, long before any migration out. There is no need for a
'eureka moment' of 'progress' upon leaving Africa. 'Progress' was already
well underway and long in place within Africa, without the need for
'eureka' moments.
QUOTE:

"This is because by focusing on changes that occurred at the Middle
Paleolithic/Upper Paleolithic or Middle Stone Age/Later Stone Age
transitions (in Europe and Africa, respectively), there is a failure to
appreciate the depth and breadth of the African Middle Stone Age record
that preceded the time of the supposed revolution by at least 100,000
years. In their view, [McBrearty and Brooks 2000] 'modern' features such
as advanced technologies, increased geographic range, specialized hunting,
fishing and shell-fishing, long distance trade, and the symbolic use of
pigments had already developed in a broad range of Middle Stone Age
industries right across Africa, between 100,000 and 250,000 years ago.
This suggested to them that an early assembly of the package of modern
human behaviors occurred in Africa, followed by much later export to the
rest of the world. Thus the origin of our species, both behaviorally and
morphologically, was linked to early developments in Middle Stone Age
technology, and not to changes that occurred much later.. 'this quest for
this 'eureka moment' reveals a great deal about the needs, desired and
aspirations of archaeologists, but obscures rather than illuminates events in
the past.."

--Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only
human on earth 128-29

bumb
Posts: 22234 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
zarahan aka Enrique Cardova
Member
Member # 15718

Icon 1 posted      Profile for zarahan aka Enrique Cardova     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Anglo_Pyramidologist:


Cro-Magnons were Caucasoid.

quote:
To examine this idea further, we use the eight Upper Paleolithic crania available from the test series of Howells (1995), all of which are complete. Our analysis of these eight, based on 55 measurements, is presented in Table 1. Using raw measurements, 6 of 8 express an affinity to Norse, and with the shape variables of Darroch and Mosimann (1985), 5 of 8 express a similarity to Norse. Using shape variables reduces the Mahalanobis distance, substantially in some cases. Typicality probabilities, particularly for the shape variables, show the crania to be fairly typical of recent populations. The results presented in Table 1 are consistent with the idea that Upper Paleolithic crania are, for the most part, larger and more generalized versions of recent Europeans. Howells (1995) reached a similar conclusion with respect to European Mesolithic crania
Jantz and Owsley (2003)
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/ajpa.10188/abstract
American Journal of Physical Anthropology
Volume 121, Issue 2, pages 185–188.

Cro-Magnons cluster in multivariate cranial analysis with Nordics. " of 8 express an affinity to Norse, and with the shape variables of Darroch and Mosimann (1985), 5 of 8 express a similarity to Norse."

Read it and weep.

 -
^^Dodgy "generalized" features

Hold on ace. You better break out your handkerchiefs.
Note how Jantz and Ousley hedge:
"Upper Paleolithic crania are, for the most part,
larger and more generalized versions.."


WHat they do is define away African affinities as
"generalized features",
so that they can then
"cluster" them with today's Europeans. Its a game
that is exposed by (a) the clear Africoid affinities seen in
Predmost, Grimaldi, Teviec and Combo Capelle, and others,
(b) the tropical limb proportions and dark skin
spoken of by numerous scholars as quoted above
and (c) the fact that African crania have the most
diversity in the world. By defining away that diversity
as "generalized features" they attempt to hide th
clear affinities of Cro-Magnon with Africoids.

But they fail and are contradicted by numerous other scholars
Indeed the "generalized morphology" of people in
Europe at that time included tropical adaptations,
dark skin and other Africoid features, consistent with a tropical
African
origin. But these curiously get airbrushed away with the
all to convenient "generalized" model.

Even your boy Dienkes is hedging on Cro-Magnons
Here is what your boy Dinkenes says in a letter to C. Loring BRace
whose metric analysis dismisses your Cro-Magnon claim as "folklore.:"

"But, in Table 4, Cro-Magnon I shows mixed affiliations between Modern
Europe and Late Prehistoric Eurasia. The inability to fall completely
in either Modern Europe or LP Eurasia is not surprising, since Modern
Europe and Late Prehistoric Eurasia are extremely close to each other
(Table 3). So, the data in Table 4 seem to suggest that Cro-Magnon I
did in fact resemble modern Europeans and Late Prehistoric Eurasians.
"
--DInekes to Brace.

Dienekes gives the game away with his shaky wording. He says the
Cro-Magnon shows "mixed affiliations" "between" Modern Europe and
QUOTE- "LATE PREHISTORIC EURASIA." Dienkes forgets to mention
that "Late PRehistoric Eurasians" resembled tropical Africans, who
have the most diverse crania in the world, and in fact in BRace's 2005
study, the "Late Prehistoric Eurasia" clusters closer to Northeast
Africans before they even begin to approach modern Europeans. In fact
Dienkes does not at all say Cro-Magnons cluster with TOday's
EUropeans. he says they are "between." SO even your boy Dienkes is
hedging, on your "Cro-Magnons are us" fantasy.

In short, Jantz and Ouseley use a double standard. They disguise Africoid
affiliations by defining them away as "generalized features" - but in keeping
with the typical double standard, they do not do the reverse for so-called
"European" features. They run the "generalized" meme one-way.

WHen it comes to Africoid features they are airbrushed away as
"generalized." But when "European" features are in question, they don't
call those "generalized" at all- in fact they rush to link them with the
Cro-Magnons. We know the game.

 -
WHatever clusters with Late Pre-historic Eurasians,
said "Eurasians" in turn cluster first with tropical Africans


Africa has the most diversity in crania in the world. It has almost any skull
variation on earth. This diversity DECREASES the farther one goes from Africa.
As one of the world's foremost palentologists Chris Stringer notes:


"Africa today has the greatest internal genetic variation of any inhabited
continent and its skull shapes show the highest variation. This is usually
attributed to its greater size, larger ancient populations and deepest
timelines for humanity."

----Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only
human on earth p260

You lose again.

Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Firewall
Member
Member # 20331

Member Rated:
5
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Firewall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Dubious assertions, double standards and outmoded racial
hair claims:
Czech anthropologist Strouhal's 1971 study touched on hair,
and advanced the most extreme racial definitions, claiming
Nubians to be white Europids overrun by later waves of
Negroes, and that few Negroes appeared in Egypt until the New
Kingdom. Indeed, Strouhal went so far as to argue that
'Negroes' failed to survive long in Egypt, because they were
ill-adapted to its arid climate! Tell that to the Saharans,
Sudanese and Nubians! Such dubious claims have been
thoroughly debunked by modern scholarship, however they
continue in various guises by those who attempt to use "hair" to
assign race 'percents' and categories to the ancients. Attempts to
define racial categories based on the ancient hair rely heavily
on extreme definitions, with "Negroids" typically being defined
as narrowly as possible. Everything not meeting the extreme
"type" is then classified as something else, such as "Caucasian".


Kieta (1990, Studies of Crania from Northern Africa) notes that
while many scholars in the field have used an extreme "true
negro" definition for African peoples, few have attempted to
apply the same model in reverse and define a "true white."
Such racial double standards are typical of much scholarship on
the ancient Nile Valley peoples. A consistent approach for
example would define the straight hair in Strouhal's hair sample
as an exclusive Caucasian marker (10 out of 49 or
approximately 20%) and make the rest (wavy and curled)
hybrid or negro, at >80%. Assorted writers who support the
Aryan race percent model however, are careful to avoid such
consistency and typically only run the comparison one way.


QUOTE:
"Strouhal (1971) microscopically examined some hair which
had been preserved on a Badarian skull. The analysis was
interpreted as suggesting a stereotypical tropical
African-European hybrid (mulatto). However this hair is
grossly no different from that of Fulani, some Kanuri, or
Somali and does not require a gene flow explanation any more
than curly hair in Greece necessarily does. Extremely "wooly"
hair is not the only kind native to tropical Africa.." (S. O. Y.
Keita. (1993). "Studies and Comments on Ancient Egyptian
Biological Relationships," History in Africa 20 (1993) 129-54)


Hair studies of Nubians show built-in African genetic variability

Hair studies of Nubians have also been undertaken. One study at Semna, in Nubia (Daniel Hrdy 1978- Analysis of Hair Samples of Mummies from Semna South, American Journal of Physical Anthropology, (1978) 49: 277-262), found curling patterns intermediate between Northwest European and African samples. The X-group, especially males, showed more African elements than the Meroitic in the curling variables. Crimping and curvature data patterned in a northwest Europe direction. These data plots however do not necessarily indicate race admixture or percentages, or the presence of European migrants or colonists (see Keita 2005 below), but rather a data pattern of variation in how hair curls, and native African diversity which cases substantial overlap with non-African groups. This is a routine occurrence within human groups.


and


The average diameter of the semna sample was to both the N.W. european and east african samples,which are of medium thickness.
Of the variables that best distinguish european and african samples was closer to the european on average curvature,crimp,and ratio length.

Although there is not a consistent statistically significant difference between the x-group and meroitic samples,it is interesting that the x-group
sample,especially the males,had higher curling variables.although larger sample sizes are needed for statistically significant results,the results here are consistent with the evidence summarized by strouhal(' 77) for skeletal material,which shows x-group very similar to meroitic.


Africa has the highest phenotypic variation, just as it has the highest geentic variation- accommodating a wide range of features for its peoples without the need for any "race mix: Relethford (2001) shows that ".. methods for estimating regional diversity show sub-Saharan Africa to have the highest levels of phenotypic variation, consistent with many genetic studies." (Relethford, John "Global Analysis of Regional Differences in Craniometric Diversity and Population Substructure". Human Biology - Volume 73, Number 5, October 2001, pp. 629-636) Hanihara 2003 notes that [significant] "..intraregional diversity are present in Subsaharan Africans.." While ancient Egypt had gene flow in various eras, hair variations easily fall under this pattern of built-in, indigenous diversity, as well as the above noted cultural practice of using wigs with hair from different places obtained through trade.


Among Europeans for example, some people have curlier hair and some have straighter hair than others. Various peoples of East and West Africa also have narrow noses, which are different from other peoples elsewhere in Africa, nevertheless they still remain Africans. DNA studies also note greater variation within selected populations that without. Since Africa has the highest genetic diversity in the world, such routine variation in characteristics such as hair need not indicate any racial percentage or admixture, but simply part of the built-in genetic diversity of the ancient peoples on the continent. Indeed, the Semna study author notes that blondism, especially in young children, is common in many dark-haired populations (e.g., Australian, Melanesian), and is still found in some Nubian villages. As regards hair color variation, reddish type hair is associated with the presence of pheomelanin, which can also be found in persons with dark brown or even black hair as well. See "Rameses" below. Albinism is another source of red hair.


Dubious attempts at 'racial analysis' using Nubian hair and crania. Assorted supporters of the stereotypical Aryan 'race' model attempt to use hair to argue for a predominantly 'white' Nubia. But as noted above, such attempts are dubious given built-in African genetic diversity. Often 'racial' hair claims attempt to link on with cranial studies purporting to match ancient Nubians with Swedes, Frenchmen, etc. But such claims are also dubious. In a detailed analysis of the Fordisc computer program used to put forward such claims, Williams, Armelagos, et al. (2005) found that the program created ludicrous "matches" between the ancient Nubian crania and peoples from Hungary, Japan, Easter Island and a host of others in far-flung regions! Their conclusion was that the diversity of human populations in the databank explained such wide ranging matches. Such objective mainstream analyses debunk obsolete and improbable claims of 'racial' migrations of alleged Frenchman, Hungarians, or other whites into ancient Nubia, or equally improbable racial 'percentages' supposedly quantifying such claims. (Frank l'engle Williams, Robert L. Belcher, and George J . Armelagos, "Forensic Misclassification of Ancient Nubian Crania: Implications for Assumptions about Human Variation," Current Anthropology, volume 46 (2005), pages 340-346)


Alleged massive influx of Europeans and Middle Easterners to give the ancient peoples hair variation did not happen. Such variation was already in place as part of Africa' built in genetic and phenotypic diversity.


As regards diameter, the average diameter of the Semna sample was close to both the Northwest European and East African samples. This again suggests a range of built-in African indigenous variability, and calls into questions various migration theories to the Nile Valley. One study for example (Keita 2005) tested the model of C. Loring Brace (1993) as to the notion of incoming European migrants replacing indigenous peoples of the Nile Valley. Brace's work had also suggested a relationship between northwest Europeans such as Scandanavians and African peoples of the Horn. Data analysis failed to support this model, instead clustering samples much closer to African series than to Europeans. Keita concluded that similarities between African data in his survey (skulls, etc) and non-Africans was not due to gene flow, but a subset of built-in African variability.

Ancient Egyptians cluster much closer to other Egyptians and Nubians. A later study by Brace, (Brace 2005- The questionable contribution..) groups ancient Egyptian populations like the Naqada closer to Nubians and Somalis than European, Mediterranean or Middle Eastern populations, and places various Nubians samples closer to Tanzanian, Dahomeian, and Congoid data points than to Europeans and Middle easterners. The limb proportion studies of Zakrzewski (2003) (Zakrzewski, S.R. (2003). "Variation in ancient Egyptian stature and body proportions". American Journal of Physical Anthropology 121 (3): 219-229.) showing the tropical body plan of the ancient Egyptians also undercuts theories of inflowing European or near Eastern colonists, or the 'native Europid' model of Strouhal (1971).


The yellowish-red-hair of Rameses: proof of a Nordic Egypt?

Red hair itself is within the range of African diversity or that of dark-skinned peoples. Native black Australoids for example routinely produce blonde hair:

Detailed microscopic analysis during the 1980s (Balout 1985) identified some of the hair of Egyptian Pharoah Rameses II as being a yellowish-red. Such a finding should not be surprising given the wide range of physical variability in Africa, the most genetically diverse region on earth, out of which flowed other population groups. Indeed, blondism and various other hair shades are not unknown in East Africa or Nubia, particularly in children, nor are such hair color variants uncommon in dark-haired or dark skinned populations like the Australians. (Hrdy 1978) Given the range of genetic variability in Africa, a red-haired Rameses is hardly unusual. Rameses' reign, in the 19th Dynasty, came over 1,500 years after the Egyptian state had been established, and after the Hyskos interlude. Such latecomers to Egypt, like the Hyskos, Assyrians, Greeks, Romans, Arabs etc would add their own genetic strands to the nation’s mix. Whatever the blend of genes that occurred with Rameses, his hair offers little supposed "proof" of a "white" or "Nordic" Egypt. If anything, X-rays of the royal mummies from earlier Dynasties by mainstream scientists show that the Egyptians pharaohs and other royals had varied 'Negroid' leanings. See X-Rays of the Royal mummies here, or here.


Pheomelanin and Rameses- found in light and dark-haired populations: The finding of Rameses “red” hair also deserves further scrutiny. The analysis found evidence of dyeing to make the hair yellowish-red, but some elements were untouched by the dye. These elements of yellowish-red hair in Balout’s study, were established on the basis of the presence of pheomelanin, a red-brown polymeric pigment in the skin and hair of humans. However, pheomelanin can also be found in persons with dark brown or even black hair as well, which gives it a reddish hue. Most natural melanins contain sulfur, which is typically associated with pheomelanin. In scientific tests of melanin, black hair contained as much as 5% sulfur, 3% lower than the 8.8% found in Irish red hair, but exceeding the 2.3% found in Scandinavian blond hair. (Jolles, et al. 1996) Thus the yellowish-red hair discovered on Rameses is well within the range of human variation for dark haired people, whatever the exact gene combination that led to the condition.

Rameses hair was not a typical European red, but yellowish-red, within African variation. It was also not ultra straight, further undermining claims of "Nordic" influence. Somalians and Ethiopians are SUB-SAHARANS and they routinely produce straight-haired people without the need for any "race mix" to explain why. The analysis on Rameses also did not show classic "European" red hair but hair of a light red to yellowish tinge. Black haired or dark-skinned populations are quite capable of producing such yellowish-red color variants on their own, as can be seen in today's east and northeast Africa (see child's photo above). Nor is such color variation unusual to Africa. Native dark-skinned populations in Australia, routinely produce people with blond or reddish hair. As noted above, ultra diverse Africa is the original source of such variation.


The analysis also found the hair to be cymotrich or wavy, again a characteristic quite within the range of overall African or Nile valley physical and genetic diversity. A "pure" Nordic type of straight hair was thus not established for Rameses. Hence the notion of white Europeans or red-headed Caucasoids from other areas flowing into ancient Egypt to add hair variation, particularly the early centuries of the dynastic state is unlikely. Such flows may have occurred most heavily in the Greek and Roman era but say nothing about the thousands of years preceding. The presence of pheomelanin conditions or other genetic combinations also explains how the different hair used in Egyptian wigs could vary in color, aside from environmental oxidation, bleaching and dyeing.


Red hair is rare worldwide, and history shows little evidence of Northern Europeans or "Nordics" sweeping into Egypt to give the natives a bit of hair coloring or variation.
Most red hair is found in northern and western Europe, especially in the British Isles, and even then it appears in minor frequencies in Europe- some 4% of the population. It is unlikely such populations had any major contact or influence in the ancient Nile Valley. As noted above, red hair is comparatively rare in the world’s populations and pheomelanin conditions are found in dark-haired populations, and thus is well within the range of variation from the Sahara, East Africa and the Nile valley. “White Aryan” theories of Egypt are seen in the works of HFK Gunther (1927), Archibald Sayce (1925) and Raymond Dart (1939), and still find traction on a number of 'Aryan', neo-nazi and "race" websites and blogs which purport to show a "white Nordic Egypt" using Rameses' "red" hair as an example. Today's scientific research however, has debunked these dubious views, showing that red hair, while not common world wide, is a well known variant within human populations, even those with dark hair.


Straight or curly hair is also routine among sub-Saharans like Somalians, who are firmly part of the East African populations. As regards Somalians for example, Somali DNA overwhelmingly links much more heavily with other Africans including Kenyans & Ethiopians (85%), than with Europeans & Middle Easterners. (15%) On Y-chromosome markers (E3b1), Somalis (77%) and other African populations dwarf small European (5.1%) or Middle Eastern (6.3%) frequencies. “The data suggest that the male Somali population is a branch of the East African population..” (Sanchez et al., High frequencies of Y chromosome lineages.. in Somali males (2005)

Posts: 2560 | From: Somewhere | Registered: May 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
TruthAndRights
Member
Member # 17346

Rate Member
Icon 14 posted      Profile for TruthAndRights     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
 -

'WHEN SHE RETURNS FROM LONDON TO VISIT HER HOMETOWN (VIRGINIA BEACH, VA), SHE'LL SEE A HUGE MURAL OF HERSELF. SO FITTING...'

[Roll Eyes] Those who want to continue focusing on her hair/the idiotic comments re; her hair by idiots, please go kick rocks and chuck off a cliff, please and thanks....oh, and do let us know when there is a well-deserved huge mural painted of you in your hometown in your honor ok....

Posts: 3446 | From: U.S. by way of JA by way of Africa | Registered: Jan 2010  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Thule
Member
Member # 18853

Rate Member
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Thule     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
Red hair itself is within the range of African diversity or that of dark-skinned peoples. Native black Australoids for example routinely produce blonde hair:
How the heck are Australian aborigines "Africans"? What will be next? Are Eskimos Africans? lol.
Posts: 1575 | From: - | Registered: May 2011  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Thule
Member
Member # 18853

Rate Member
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Thule     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote:
WHat they do is define away African affinities as
"generalized features", so that they can then
"cluster" them with today's Europeans. Its a game
that is exposed by (a) the clear Africoid affinities seen in
Predmost, Grimaldi, Teviec and Combo Capelle, and others,
(b) the tropical limb proportions and dark skin
spoken of by numerous scholars as quoted above
and (c) the fact that African crania have the most
diversity in the world. By defining away that diversity
as "generalized features" they attempt to hide th
clear affinities of Cro-Magnon with Africoids.

The Grimaldi as Negroid has been debunked.

See my short essay here:

quote:
Afrocentrics like to claim Grimaldi Man was Negroid, and regularly quote-mine Arthur Keith. What they never though point out is that Keith retracted his claim in 1911 that the Grimaldi can be identified as Negroid after actually analysing the crania:

"The bridge of the nose is not flat as in negroes, but rather prominent as in Europeans" (Keith, 1911)

The nasal bridge and infraglabellar region in Negroids is flat and broad. Yet despite having a prominent nasal bridge, the Grimaldi are platyrrhine with a nasal depression. Australoids are the only subspecies to posess this variation of a narrow nasal bridge, depression with a platyrrhine nose shape (Gates, 1960; Hanihara, 2000). The Grimaldi were most likely Australoid (Smith, 1927; Abbie, 1951).

If you take a look at: Hanihara, T., Frontal and facial flatness of major human populations, Am J Phys Anthropol, 111, 105 (2000) - you will see Negroids are POLAR OPPOSITE to Australoids in their nasal depression and bridge appearance.
Posts: 1575 | From: - | Registered: May 2011  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
zarahan aka Enrique Cardova
Member
Member # 15718

Icon 1 posted      Profile for zarahan aka Enrique Cardova     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
 -

On the web, extensive neo-Nazi spam and Wikipedia “stealth” inserts
claim that Cro-Magnons are pure “Caucasian” ancestors of today’s
Europeans. Hard data however debunks this on 6 counts, and shows a
diverse Cro-Magnon population.



1-- Detailed modern cranial studies show Cro-magnon crania clustering
AWAY from today’s Europeans.
Brace 2005 testedthe “Cro-magnid”
claim and found it “folklore.” QUOTE: "When canonical variates are
plotted, neither sample ties in with Cro-Magnon as was once suggested. ..
If this analysis shows nothing else, it demonstrates that the oft-repeated
European feeling that the Cro-Magnons are “us” (46) is more a product of
anthropological folklore than the result of the metric data available from
the skeletal remains..."
--CL. Brace 2005. The Questionable contribution of the Neolithic to
European craniofacial form



2–Africans possessing the highest phenotypical diversity on earth,
producing variants covering most features. Several Cro-Magnon
specimens are described as ‘negroid.’
QUOTE:

“Both methods for estimating regional diversity show sub-Saharan
Africato have the highest levels of phenotypic variation consistent with
many genetic studies.“
[-- Relethford, John "Global Analysis of Regional Differences in
Craniometric Diversity .” Hum Bio v73, n5, -629-636])

---------------------- Three scholars (Arthur Keith, M Boule and HV
Valloid found ‘negroid’Cro-Magnon features:
QUOTE: "The ancient
Grimaldi woman and boy are of the mixed or negroid type."
--(Arthur Keith. Ancient Types of Man. p. 60)


3- Several Upper Paleolithic European specimens show high cural
indices in limb proportions- more akin to dark-skinned tropical Africans
than today’s Europeans, who show lower cural indices.
QUOTE:
"As with all the other limb/trunk indices, the recent Europeans evince
lower indices, reflective of shorter tibiae, and the recent sub-Saharan
Africans have higher indices, reflective of their long tibiae... The Dolno
Vestonice and Pavlov humans.. have body proportions similar to those of
other Gravettian specimens. Specifically, they are characterized by high
bracial and cural indices, indicative of distal limb segment elongation.."
--Trinkaus and Svoboda. 2005. Early Modern Human Evolution in Central
Europe]


– AND--

-Body proportions of early European H. sapiens fossils suggest a tropical
adaptation and support an African origin (Holliday & Trinkaus, 1991;
Ruff, 1994; Pearson, 1997, 2000; Holliday, 1997, 1998, 2000).”
-–McBrearty and Brooks 2000. The Revolution that Wasn’t. Jrn Hu Evo
39, 453-563

AND --

Upper Paleolithic Europeans resembled modern Africans -2003 data

"Upper Palaeolithic humans not only were taller and had more robust bones
in comparison with the Linear Band Pottery Culture Neolithic people; they also
had longer limbs, a shorter trunk and, similar to modern African people, very long
forearms and crural segments.

---Michael Hermanussen (2003) Stature of early Europeans. HORMONES 2003, 2(3):175-178
-----------------


4-- Traits like narrow noses occur naturally in African
environments:

".. low mean nasal indices (high, narrow noses) tend to [also] be found in
arid regions, such as the desert areas of east Africa.. -- Mays. S. (2010).
The Archaeology of Human Bones. Pg 100-101


5-- Several Upper Paleolithic European types- Predmost (Czech),
Combo Capelle (France) Grimaldi (Italy) and Teviec (France) show a
variant of “African” affinities like prognathism. Some scholars hold this to
be an ‘Eastern Cro-Magnon’ variant:
QUOTE:

------ "others like Predomost and to a lesser degree Grimaldi and Teviec,
are more prognathic like Skhul 5."
--Marta Mirazón Lahr. 2005. The Evolution of Modern Human Diversity:
A Study of Cranial Variation

and

---------- ".. on whose basis, many specialists define the eastern
Cro-Magnon variant in the Upper Paleolithic population of western
Europe."
--S. De Laet (1994). History of Humanity, UNESCO


6– DNA provides clear evidence of tropical African types migrating to
Paleolithic era Europe, contradicting claims of “Caucasoid” evolution in
situ. Tropical limb evidence confirms DNA. The African tropical types
may have interbred with local Neanderthals, but in any event would have
adapted to the colder conditions of Europe over time.
QUOTE:

"Early modern Europeans reflect both their predominant African early
modern human ancestry and a substantial degree of admixture between
those early modern humans and the indigenous Neandertals. Given the
tens of millennia since then and the limitations inherent in ancient DNA,
this process is largely invisible in the molecular record. It is readily
apparent in the paleontological record.“
--E. Trinkhaus (2004) European early modern humans and the fate of the
Neandertals. PNAS 2007 vol. 104 no. 18 7367-7372

and

"The so-called Old Man [Cro-Magnon 1] became the original model for
what was once termed the Cro-Magnon or Upper Paleolithic "race" of
Europe.. there's no such valid biological category, and Cro-Magnon 1 is
not typical of Upper Paleolithic western Europeans- and not even all that
similar to the other two make skulls found at the site. Most of the genetic
evidence, as well as the newest fossil evidence from Africa argue against
continuous local evolution producing modern groups directly from any
Eurasian pre-modern population.. there's no longer much debate that a
large genetic contribution from migrating early modern Africans infuenced
other groups throughout the Old World.“
--B. Lewis et al. 2008. Understanding Humans: Introduction to Physical
Anthropology and Archaeology. p 297
------------------------------------

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/romania/5273654/Scientists-reveal-face-of-the-first-European.html

 -

Scientists reveal face of the first European
The face of the first European has been recreated from bone fragments by scientists.

By Urmee Khan, Digital and Media Correspondent

8:22PM BST 04 May 2009

The head was rebuilt in clay based on an incomplete skull and jawbone discovered in a cave in the south west of the Carpathian Mountains in Romania by potholers.
The first modern European Forensic artist Richard Neave reconstructed the face based on skull fragments from 35000 years ago.

Using radiocarbon analysis scientists say the man or woman, it is still not possible to determine the sex, lived between 34,000 and 36,000 years ago.

Europe was then occupied by both Neanderthal man, who had been in the region for thousands of years, and anatomically-modern humans – Homo sapiens.

Modern humans first arrived in Europe from Africa.

...
---------------------

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/5299351/African-tribe-populated-rest-of-the-world.html
African tribe populated rest of the world
The entire human race outside Africa owes its existence to the survival of a single tribe of around 200 people who crossed the Red Sea 70,000 years ago, scientists have discovered.

By Richard Gray, Science Correspondent

9:00PM BST 09 May 2009


Research by geneticists and archaeologists has allowed them to trace the origins of modern homo sapiens back to a single group of people who managed to cross from the Horn of Africa and into Arabia. From there they went on to colonise the rest of the world.

Genetic analysis of modern day human populations in Europe, Asia, Australia, North America and South America have revealed that they are all descended from these common ancestors.

It is thought that changes in the climate between 90,000 and 70,000 years ago caused sea levels to drop dramatically and allowed the crossing of the Red Sea to take place.

The findings are to be revealed in a new BBC Two documentary series, The Incredible Human Journey, that traces the prehistoric origins of the human species.

Dr Peter Forster, a senior lecturer in archaeogenetics at Anglia Ruskin University in Cambridge who carried out some of the genetic work, said: "The founder populations cannot have been very big. We are talking about just a few hundred individuals."
Homo sapiens, known casually as "modern humans", are thought to have first evolved around 195,000 years ago in east Africa – the earliest remains from that time were uncovered near the Omo River in Ethiopia.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 -

Parents of "Eurasian Adam" and "Eurasian Eve" came from
Africa modern DNA analysis shows


"The vast majority, perhaps all, men with European and Asian genetic
backgrounds can trace their Y-chromosome lineage back to a particular
male (named M168, after the marker that defines these chromosomes). M168
thus can be considered the Eurasian Adam. Although the Y-chromosome Adam
and mitrochondrial Eve did not meet, it is quite possible that the Eurasian "Adam"
M168 could have met his equivalent, the Eurasian Eve (known as L3). The
estimates of their dates overlap (around five thousand years ago) and they both
probably lived in northeast Africa. Africa? Yes, Africa. Although nearly all Eurasian
mtDNA and Y chromosomes currently existing can be traced back to L3 and M168
respectively, M168 and L3 also had African descendants."

---Norman Johnson (2007) Darwinian Detectives: Revealing the Natural History of
Genes and Genomes. p. 100. [Norman A. Johnson, an evolutionary geneticist,
is the author of numerous research publications, mainly in the genetics and evolution
of reproductive isolation between nascent species. Johnson has taught at the University
of Chicago, University of Texas at Arlington, and the University of Massachusetts].

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


 -

Advanced cognitive, technological and behavioral patterns derive from
Africa. Dubbed the "Human Revolution" by some researchers, they lead up to the
expansion of humans from Africa to other parts of the world, circa 60-40kya. Other
scholars argue for a more gradual continuum of advances deeply rooted in
Africa that spread worldwide. In either scenario, whether relatively rapid advance
or gradual accumulation, the cognitive, technological and behavioral advances
took place within Africa.


QUOTE:
"Recent research has provided increasing support for the origins of anatomically
and genetically "modern" human populations in Africa between 150,000 and 200,000
years ago, followed by a major dispersal of these populations to both Asia and Europe
sometime after ca. 65,000 before present (B.P.). However, the central question of why it
took these populations {approx}100,000 years to disperse from Africa to other regions of
the world has never been clearly resolved. It is suggested here that the answer may lie
partly in the results of recent DNA studies of present-day African populations, combined
with a spate of new archaeological discoveries in Africa. Studies of both the mitochondrial
DNA (mtDNA) mismatch patterns in modern African populations and related mtDNA
lineage-analysis patterns point to a major demographic expansion centered broadly within
the time range from 80,000 to 60,000 B.P., probably deriving from a small geographical
region of Africa.

Recent archaeological discoveries in southern and eastern Africa suggest that, at approximately
the same time, there was a major increase in the complexity of the technological, economic, social,
and cognitive behavior of certain African groups,
which could have led to a major demographic
expansion of these groups in competition with other, adjacent groups. It is suggested that this
complex of behavioral changes (possibly triggered by the rapid environmental changes around
the transition from oxygen isotope stage 5 to stage 4) could have led not only to the expansion of
the L2 and L3 mitochondrial lineages over the whole of Africa but also to the ensuing dispersal of
these modern populations over most regions of Asia, Australasia, and Europe, and their replacement
(with or without interbreeding) of the preceding "archaic" populations in these regions."

---Mellars, Paul (2006) Why did modern human populations disperse from Africa ca. 60,000 years ago?
A new model. PNAS, 2006, 103(25), pp. 9381-9386

 -


Advanced cognitive, artistic and behavioral patterns and technology like more refined tools
are found in Africa long before similar patterns arose in Europe. The migration of tropical
African types to Europe in the Cro-Magnon era brought these cognitive, cultural and behavioral
advances to Neanderthal Europe.


"A more gradual "revolution" position is now held [by Paul Mellars].. a period of
accelerated change in Africa between about 60,000 and 80,000 years ago, as shown
by the following developments recorded in South African cave sites: new and better-
techniques for producing long thin flakes of stone blades; specialized tools called end
scrapers and burins, which were probably used for working skins and bones, the
[production of tiny stone segments that must have mounted on handles of wood or
bone to make composite tools, complexly shaped stone tools such as 'leaf points',
relatively complex bone tools; marine shells perforated to make necklaces or bracelets,
red ochre (natural iron oxide) engraved with geometric designs suggesting early artwork,;
greater permanence and differentiated occupation areas in caves; new subsistence practices
such as the exploitation of marine fish as well as shellfish; and perhaps intentional burning
of undergrowth to encourage the growth of underground plant resources such as tubers.
Mellars suggests that a neurological switch to modernity in the brain alongside rapid
Climatic fluctuations, could have been the driving forces behind this period of heightened
cultural innovations.."

"The most impressive site for early evidence of symbolism however, is Blombos Cave in South
Africa, with a record stretching well beyond 70,000 years ago.. The stone tools in these levels
include Still Bay points, beautifully shaped thin lanceolate spear points, flaked on both sides.
They also show the earliest application of a refined stone tool-making technique known as
pressure flaking, some 55,000 years before its best-known manifestation in the Soultrean
industry of EUrope. Slabs of red ochre were excavated from various levels, including the
deepest ones, with wavy, fan or mesh-shaped patterns carefully engraved on them..
Hundreds [beads made from seashells] have now been excavated from Blombos,
and most show signs of piercing, with many holes also displaying signs of wear.. The
shells have a natural shiny luster, but the color seems to have been modified by rubbing
with hematite in some cases and by heating to darken the shells in other cases, so they
may have been strung in different-colored patterns.. "

--Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only human on earth 150-155


 -

Some archaeologists criticize notions of a "human revolution" suddenly
occurring after humans exited Africa for Asia and Europe. Instead they
argue, the supposed "revolutionary" changes in cognition, symbol
manipulation, advanced technology, trade etc were ALREADY occurring
WITHIN Africa, long before any migration out. There is no need for a
'eureka moment' of 'progress' upon leaving Africa. 'Progress' was already
well underway and long in place within Africa, without the need for
'eureka' moments.
QUOTE:

"This is because by focusing on changes that occurred at the Middle
Paleolithic/Upper Paleolithic or Middle Stone Age/Later Stone Age
transitions (in Europe and Africa, respectively), there is a failure to
appreciate the depth and breadth of the African Middle Stone Age record
that preceded the time of the supposed revolution by at least 100,000
years. In their view, [McBrearty and Brooks 2000] 'modern' features such
as advanced technologies, increased geographic range, specialized hunting,
fishing and shell-fishing, long distance trade, and the symbolic use of
pigments had already developed in a broad range of Middle Stone Age
industries right across Africa, between 100,000 and 250,000 years ago.
This suggested to them that an early assembly of the package of modern
human behaviors occurred in Africa, followed by much later export to the
rest of the world. Thus the origin of our species, both behaviorally and
morphologically, was linked to early developments in Middle Stone Age
technology, and not to changes that occurred much later.. 'this quest for
this 'eureka moment' reveals a great deal about the needs, desired and
aspirations of archaeologists, but obscures rather than illuminates events in
the past.."

--Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only
human on earth 128-29

---------------------------------------------------------

blombos ochre processing tech
 -


The bogus "generalized Caucasoids" model. This involves defining
away Africoid affinities or features as "generalized" but at the
same time ot treating "European" features the same way. The double
standard only runs one way- if a feature has African affinities-
airbrush it away as "generalized" but otherwise call it "Caucasoid"
or equivalent. This double-standard howevert is contradicted by Africa's
diversity, and clear tropical body/limb proportion affinities of its migrating
peoples


For example, Jantz and Ousley 2003 assert that:
"Upper Paleolithic crania are, for the most part, larger
and more generalized versions of recent Europeans."
(AJPA 121(2))

But their wording gives the game away. They achieve a "match" with
"recent Europeans" because features deemed to have African affinities
are defined away as "generalized." The African irritant thus eliminated,
they can then go on to cluster all else with Europe. Two central
points undermine this method:

-----------CRANIA
Africa has the most diversity in crania in the world. It has almost any skull
variation on earth. This diversity DECREASES the farther one goes from Africa.
As one of the world's foremost palentologists Chris Stringer notes:


[i]"Africa today has the greatest internal genetic variation of any inhabited
continent and its skull shapes show the highest variation. This is usually
attributed to its greater size, larger ancient populations and deepest
timelines for humanity."

----Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only
human on earth p260

-----------TROPICAL LIMB/BODY ADAPTATIONS
"Erik Trinkhaus noted that the Cro-Magnons who livd in much the same
environments as Neanderthals were more like recent African populations in
body shape than Neanderthals. And the same thing now seems to apply to the
earliest modern skeleton we have from the north of Ice Age China."
----Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only
human on earth p105

Qafzeh/Skhul remains cluster more with tropical Africans and show
similarities to Cro-Magnons. They are not identical, nor are they direct
parents, but they show certain affinities- Cro-Magnons themselves also showing tropical affinities.


i]"The Qafzeh/Skhul sample is fundamentally modern,
and in fact very similar to Cro-Magons.."

--Geoffrey A. Clark, Catherine M. Willermet. 1997.
Conceptual Issues in Modern Human Origins Research. p111

"Results indicate that the Qafzeh-Skhul hominids
have African-like, or tropically adapted,
proportions, while those from Amud, Kebara,
Tabun, and Shanidar (Iraq) have more
European-like, or cold-adapted, proportions. This
suggests that there were in fact two distinct
Western Asian populations and that the
Qafzeh-Skhul hominids were likely African in
origin - a result consistent with the
"Replacement" model of modern human origins.

.. Thus, the discovery of tropically adapted
hominids in the region would therefore
likely indicate population dispersal from
the TROPICS, and the most logical
geographic source for such an influx is
Africa. In this regard, Trinkaus (1981,
1984, 1995) and Ruff (1994) have
argued that the high brachial and crural
indices, narrow biiliac breadths, and
small relative femoral head sizes of the
Qafzeh-Skhul hominids suggest an
influx of African genes associated with
the emergence of modern humans in the
region."

---Trenton Holliday (2000) Evolution at the
Crossroads: Modern Human Emergence in Western
Asia. American Anthropologist. New Series,
Vol. 102, No. 1, 54-68

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

In summary, Cro-Magnons were tropically adapted migrants to
Europe that resembled tropical Africans. They were never IDENTICAL
to tropical Africans for they adapted over time to colder European
environments. However several specimens still show evidence of
African links. Africa in addition has the highest phenotypic diversity
in the world. For example, skull shapes on African fossils for example
are the most diverse. They cover most known variants in skull shape
on earth- thru the ages. Everything else is a more limited subset of this diversity.

Its worth repeating:

"Africa today has the greatest internal genetic variation of any inhabited
continent and its skull shapes show the highest variation. This is usually
attributed to its greater size, larger ancient populations and deepest
timelines for humanity."

----Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only
human on earth p260

When in comes to Cro-Magnons's Eurocentric writers
play a hypocritical double game, defining away African features as
"generalized" but not doing the same when it comes to their favorite
"European" fossils. Thus a dark-skinned, broad nosed, prognathous
fossil with tropical limb proportions becomes "generalized[/img] features"
but a narrow nose (common in Africa by the way) conveniently becomes
"European". Can we all say hypocrisy?


Blombos- Africa: oldest pigment production operation on earth. Advanced
cognitive, behavioral, technological and social features were already
in place and ongoing before any migration out of Africa.


 -

Assorted Multi-regionalists like Michael Wolpoff deny such diversity, but that
denial is hollow in the face of substantial evidence of the Out OF Africa model.
Four prominent multi-regionalists along with Wolpoff claimed in 1994 for example- QUOTE:

"The evolutionary patterns of three different
regions show that the earliest "modern" humans
are not Africans and do not have the complex of
features that characterize the Africans of that
time or any other... There is no evidence of
specific admixture with Africans at any time, let
alone replacement by them.. "

END WOLPOFF et all quote.

But, Wolpoff et al are comprehensively refuted by fossil
and DNA evidence of the Out OF Africa model:
Respected paleontologist Chris Stringer notes: (continued)


"This model gave Africa no special place in our
evolution and claimed specific connections in
individual features between Homo erectus fossils
more than a million years old in each region and
humans in the same regions today.. these particular
views have been pretty comprehensively shown to be false."

----Chris Stringer (2012) Lone Survivors: How we came to be the only
human on earth p267human on earth p267

Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Firewall
Member
Member # 20331

Member Rated:
5
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Firewall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
quote-
Hair studies of Nubians have also been undertaken. One study at Semna, in Nubia (Daniel Hrdy 1978- Analysis of Hair Samples of Mummies from Semna South, American Journal of Physical Anthropology, (1978) 49: 277-262), found curling patterns intermediate between Northwest European and African samples. The X-group, especially males, showed more African elements than the Meroitic in the curling variables. Crimping and curvature data patterned in a northwest Europe direction. These data plots however do not necessarily indicate race admixture or percentages, or the presence of European migrants or colonists (see Keita 2005 below), but rather a data pattern of variation in how hair curls, and native African diversity which cases substantial overlap with non-African groups. This is a routine occurrence within human groups.

___________________________
Keep in mind even when i posted the quote above,this is a study taken from semna in lower nubia,and we all know that lower nubia had varied hair types,but the racist want to make the study represent most of nubia,and its clear that it does not.

It's kinda like when certain samples are taken for ancient egypt,where were they taken and from what population etc..

It clear that the study show african diversity for lower nubia,meaning varied hair types were found in lower nubia,from tightly coiled to wavy.

Even in most of lower nubia tighly coiled hair was common.
I know the nubians from other parts of nubia had tightly coiled hair or kinky.

Some of it due to native african diversity meaning climate etc...,others is due to admixture.

It clear that some lower nubans later had some admixture,the question is was it most of them by the end of the meroe period or not.

There were some outsiders that came to live and some mixed with some of locals in lower nubia,but the question is how widespread it was,and when these migrants like the romans ,greeks and some others came they were still the minor group living in lower nubia.

I know it's not popular here to say that there was no admixture in lower nubia period at all in later ancient times or white migrants never came into lower nubia,but from what i have read so far this seems to be the case.

I know there are many folks who still have a problem with Keita saying that white native berbers are native to africa.

So i know there are some that disagree with keita on certain things,but the berber issue is another topic.

It clear by the early christain period,most lower nubians did not have admixture,because of the some upper nubians came in to lower nubia region and the unmixed black nubians in lower nubia outgrew those that had admixture.

Anyway the lower nubia question is still not has clear yet,and more samples need to be taken because they are still small and more needs to be done.

Posts: 2560 | From: Somewhere | Registered: May 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Firewall
Member
Member # 20331

Member Rated:
5
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Firewall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Edited-
I meant to say for one of my comments before that wavy hair or loose curled hair in lower nubia could be due to outside admixture or it could be native without admixture.

The rest of nubia did not have admixture and kinky or coiled hair was the only hair type.

I will change some of my wording around from the last reply below.


__________________


Hair studies of Nubians have also been undertaken. One study at Semna, in Nubia (Daniel Hrdy 1978- Analysis of Hair Samples of Mummies from Semna South, American Journal of Physical Anthropology, (1978) 49: 277-262), found curling patterns intermediate between Northwest European and African samples. The X-group, especially males, showed more African elements than the Meroitic in the curling variables. Crimping and curvature data patterned in a northwest Europe direction. These data plots however do not necessarily indicate race admixture or percentages, or the presence of European migrants or colonists (see Keita 2005 below), but rather a data pattern of variation in how hair curls, and native African diversity which cases substantial overlap with non-African groups. This is a routine occurrence within human groups.

___________________________
Keep in mind even when i posted the quote above,this is a study taken from semna in lower nubia,and we all know that lower nubia had varied hair types,but the racist want to make the study represent most of nubia,and its clear that it does not.

It's kinda like when certain samples are taken for ancient egypt,where were they taken and from what population etc..

It clear that the study show african diversity for lower nubia,meaning varied hair types were found in lower nubia,from tightly coiled to wavy.

________________________
edited-
Even in most of lower nubia tightly coiled hair was the most common.

Has for wavy hair to loosely curled hair in lower nubia, some of it due to native african diversity meaning climate etc...,others is due to admixture.

I know the nubians from other parts of nubia had tightly coiled hair or kinky hair.
_________________________________________


It clear that some lower nubans later had some admixture,the question is was it most of them by the end of the meroe period or not.

There were some outsiders that came to live and some mixed with some of locals in lower nubia,but the question is how widespread it was,and when these migrants like the romans ,greeks and some others came they were still the minor group living in lower nubia.

I know it's not popular here to say that there was no admixture in lower nubia period at all in later ancient times or white migrants never came into lower nubia,but from what i have read so far this seems to be the case.

I know there are many folks who still have a problem with Keita saying that white native berbers are native to africa.

So i know there are some that disagree with keita on certain things,but the berber issue is another topic.

It clear by the early christain period,most lower nubians did not have admixture,because of the some upper nubians came in to lower nubia region and the unmixed black nubians in lower nubia outgrew those that had admixture.

Anyway the lower nubia question is still not has clear yet,and more samples need to be taken because they are still small and more needs to be done. Posts: 56 | Registered: May 2012 | IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
.

Posts: 2560 | From: Somewhere | Registered: May 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
zarahan aka Enrique Cardova
Member
Member # 15718

Icon 1 posted      Profile for zarahan aka Enrique Cardova     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
I know it's not popular here to say that there was no admixture in lower nubia period at all in later ancient times or white migrants never came into lower nubia,but from what i have read so far this seems to be the case.

^Sounds like you are creating bogus strawmen. Can
you point to any thread where credible posters claim
that lower Nubia had all this admixture? Hence it would
be "unpopular" to say the opposite? Who are these
mysterious denizens that have made "mixed lower nubians"
allegedly "popular?"


I know there are many folks who still have a problem with Keita saying that white native berbers are native to africa.

WHere has Keita ever called Berbers "white" and
said they were "white natives" of Africa? Can you
quote any of his writings to this effect?

--------------------
Note: I am not an "Egyptologist" as claimed by some still bitter, defeated, trolls creating fake profiles and posts elsewhere. Hapless losers, you still fail. My output of hard data debunking racist nonsense has actually INCREASED since you began..

Posts: 5905 | From: The Hammer | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Firewall
Member
Member # 20331

Member Rated:
5
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Firewall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
It was awhile ago.
One person mention that there were no admixture in lower nubia in late ancient times.


I will not bring up names since i can't find that reply,i am just going on memory from a few years ago.


I Would say some late ancient lower nubians had admixture,some did not,but one person i remember again said there none,but that was while ago and i can't find the reply.

The talk was not in any recent thread,and it was awhile ago since i seen it in any thread.

So please ignore that comment i said about i know it's not unpopular.

It was few years back since i seen it,but i can't remember the thread.


The berber comment i got that from a website,i seen a few years ago,it could been have statement mention in the website that keita did not really say or believe in.

Some websites do put in things that the scholar never mention or really believe in or misunderstood what that scholar was trying to say.


I have not gone to any other website that may have repeat that,and i think one of the websites was wikipeda about moors,maybe berbers but that was years ago,but since then it's been removed.

Again that could have been something kieta does not believe in either,just somebody may have misunderstood him and put that comment in the websites i have mention.

So ignore that one too.
Thanks.

Posts: 2560 | From: Somewhere | Registered: May 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Firewall
Member
Member # 20331

Member Rated:
5
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Firewall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Oh i found something close to what was said a few years ago on the websites i have mention,this is wikipeda,but since then the lasts comments have been added.So i do not think kieta believe that fair skin blonds are native to africa but wiki for example did not make it clear a few ago,so i just have be careful next time.

Note-
A white looking baby could come from two black people,and it's known that the northern part of northwest africa has a ice age along time ago,so it's possible that white looking types could be native to northern africa,but i am not clear about that yet.
If anyone is let me know.

quote-
Shomarka Keita, a biological anthropologist from Howard University, has claimed that populations in Carthage circa 200 BC and northern Algeria 1500 BC were very diverse. As a group, they plotted closest to the populations of Northern Egypt and intermediate to Northern Europeans and tropical Africans. Keita claimed that "the data supported the comments from ancient authors observed by classicists: everything from fair-skinned blonds to peoples who were dark-skinned 'Ethiopian' or part Ethiopian in appearance." Modern evidence showed a similar diversity among present North Africans. Moreover, this "diversity" of phenotypes and peoples was probably due to in situ differentiation, not foreign influxes.
Of course foreign influxes certainly had an impact but they did not replace the indigenous Berber population.

___________________________________________


The last statement was added recently or was not there i don't think a few years.


quote-
Of course foreign influxes certainly had an impact but they did not replace the indigenous Berber population.


____________________
So since i was going by wikipedia for some of my info i should have been more careful,so once again ignore my comments about the berbers.

Thanks.

Posts: 2560 | From: Somewhere | Registered: May 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Firewall
Member
Member # 20331

Member Rated:
5
Icon 1 posted      Profile for Firewall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Edited-
That should been please ignore the comment i said about i know it's not popular.

Posts: 2560 | From: Somewhere | Registered: May 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
LocDiva
Member
Member # 13393

Rate Member
Icon 1 posted      Profile for LocDiva   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
Your obsssiveness reveals your true inner desires. Asspee, Cracker Bat Lice, you long to tangle your hands in our hair

--------------------
Give God The Credit

Posts: 71 | From: Cleve OH | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
LocDiva
Member
Member # 13393

Rate Member
Icon 1 posted      Profile for LocDiva   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post   Reply With Quote 
But you c't touch this if you paid us [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Big Grin]

--------------------
Give God The Credit

Posts: 71 | From: Cleve OH | Registered: Apr 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

Quick Reply
Message:

HTML is not enabled.
UBB Code™ is enabled.

Instant Graemlins
   


Post New Topic  Post A Reply Close Topic   Feature Topic   Move Topic   Delete Topic next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:


Contact Us | EgyptSearch!

(c) 2015 EgyptSearch.com

Powered by UBB.classic™ 6.7.3