quote:Originally posted by MK the Most Interlectual:
Didn't God say in the Quran: "Arabs are the worst infidels and hypocrites"?
Can you refer to the verse? Thanks in advance.
The Arabs are the worst in disbelief and hypocrisy, and the most likely to ignore the laws that God has revealed to His messenger. God is Omniscient, Most Wise. [9:97]
Posts: 3587 | Registered: Mar 2006
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Look like the thread went to nowhere ..... as usual.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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Why should we need a government that is based on any one particular religion, especially when the citizens are of at least a few different systems of faith?
Our government should represent us all, and protect us all, and make laws based on what is in all of our basic interests. LAW should not be based upon complex interpretations of vague statements from 1500 year old books.
The complexity of the Qur'an and Hadith requires *personal* study. The details are settled by how the individuals decide to live their lives. One man understands the Qur'an differently than his father, or wife. We should not be forced by men with guns, fighter jets, and other weapons of war to act as so-called Muslims (especially their idea of Islam, where we kill people for deciding to be at peace with others as we saw with Sadat) rather we should only be made to act in the basic ways that make society vibrant. The rest of the day to day details should be up to the individual.
We must be given and guaranteed a right to freedom of speech. As well as the freedom of press so we are free to learn about anything we wish to learn about! This includes praise, questioning, and criticism of any and all religions. The muslim brotherhood doesn't wish to offer this to us, as we don't even get it now under our more secular government.
In the Egypt of my parents' youth religion was something between a person, family, and god. Why should it be anything more than that? Why compulsory? Why enforced? Why dictated by men with guns?
Posts: 345 | Registered: Aug 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Graf_Genn: Why should we need a government that is based on any one particular religion, especially when the citizens are of at least a few different systems of faith?
Our government should represent us all, and protect us all, and make laws based on what is in all of our basic interests. LAW should not be based upon complex interpretations of vague statements from 1500 year old books.
The complexity of the Qur'an and Hadith requires *personal* study. The details are settled by how the individuals decide to live their lives. One man understands the Qur'an differently than his father, or wife. We should not be forced by men with guns, fighter jets, and other weapons of war to act as so-called Muslims (especially their idea of Islam, where we kill people for deciding to be at peace with others as we saw with Sadat) rather we should only be made to act in the basic ways that make society vibrant. The rest of the day to day details should be up to the individual.
We must be given and guaranteed a right to freedom of speech. As well as the freedom of press so we are free to learn about anything we wish to learn about! This includes praise, questioning, and criticism of any and all religions. The muslim brotherhood doesn't wish to offer this to us, as we don't even get it now under our more secular government.
In the Egypt of my parents' youth religion was something between a person, family, and god. Why should it be anything more than that? Why compulsory? Why enforced? Why dictated by men with guns?
First, Thank you for a Normal response that actually has to do with the topic.
I have no idea why people here are happy with the idea of the Muslim brotherhood. They don't believe in Equality between muslims and non muslims, and they support terrorist groups like Hamas and Hizbolla (which happens to be the main problem for lebanon now, remember not everyone who stands up to israel should be your hero automatically)
Posts: 511 | From: Alexandria, Egypt | Registered: Jun 2005
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quote:Originally posted by MK the Most Interlectual:
Didn't God say in the Quran: "Arabs are the worst infidels and hypocrites"?
Can you refer to the verse? Thanks in advance.
The Arabs are the worst in disbelief and hypocrisy, and the most likely to ignore the laws that God has revealed to His messenger. God is Omniscient, Most Wise. [9:97]
quote:Originally posted by MK the Most Interlectual:
Didn't God say in the Quran: "Arabs are the worst infidels and hypocrites"?
Can you refer to the verse? Thanks in advance.
The Arabs are the worst in disbelief and hypocrisy, and the most likely to ignore the laws that God has revealed to His messenger. God is Omniscient, Most Wise. [9:97]
Please pay attention when posting translations to the Quran. It's not Arabs, it's A3raabs, meaning Bedouins, nomads, uncivilized Arabs not all Arabs.
Posts: 743 | Registered: Oct 2006
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You people have to realize that life is about perception. There is no such thing as a complete perception for human experience is limited by one's genes not to mention exposure to various elements of life. And of course there is the physical limitations of the human senses and mind processing power.
My point is, apart from instincts, basic instincts that all races and backgrounds share, perceptions of life are different. Thus different races deal with challenges of survival in different ways.
Now what matters when speaking in terms of competing cultures is the ability of one culture to obliterate the other or at least subdue it.
The strength of Islam in the early days, is the concept of JIHAD. The fact that early Muslims loved death more than they loved life.
The concept of JIHAD is unique to Islam. JIHAD is one of the corner stones of Islam. The prophet makes it clear that "People who give up on JIHAD will live in humiliation". Christianity and Judaism don't support the same notion, even if they were violent at times. Judaism is mainly concerned with enforcing the rules of the faith within the faithful only. Judaism doesn't encourage conversion because of the false belief in purity of blood. Christianity on the other hand has been marked with passivity from the beginning even if there was a time when holy wars were waged in the name of Christianity, the christian as a warrior has always been an alien concept.
Today many condemn the U.S for waging wars. What many don't realize is that war maintains the dynamism of the society - as long as you can win it and control its outcomes.
In short, If you wanna go Islam, you have to take the whole package in order to reap the real benefits. You can't go half way. The prophet lead raged-clothed people to fight the Romans at the end of his life. The message was clear. This is the path. If you want to identify yourself as a Muslim, you have to keep fighting. You have to dedicate your life to the fight within yourself with your inner demons. You also have to be on the lookout and on the offensive against other cultures. You have to be fair with them, but yes, as a Muslim, you do look down on other faiths. You have to believe that Muslims are supreme to others. It's part of the Islamic belief.
Again, any other argument is an attempt to please others. Or a misunderstanding of Islam.
The MB have been walking a fine line for a long time. They could never make a full commitment to the cause as they often aimed to please. Hence they never gained enough support to make it to the top. They just didn't seem serious enough to go all the way.
Now back to perceptions. A boy/girl born in a Muslim society, raised according to the way of life described above, will be pretty hard if impossible to defeat in any arena.
It's almost impossible for most of us to accept a notion of a true Islamic society where many of the so-called privileges of freedom are taken away. However again, if you were raised this way from the get go, you wouldn't miss a thing. Not a single thing. Actually most of what you have around today are just distractions that eat away your time and energy.
I believe there is nothing wrong with an Islamic society that could be even Wahabi. Actually I believe that the Wahabi concept - not current practice- is the closest to the spirit of Islam.
At the end I don't think we should worry about the MBs getting to power in Egypt. They're just not men enough. Never been men enough for the part.
Posts: 743 | Registered: Oct 2006
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Judaism and Christianity initiate you into the faith by taking a ritual bath.
Islam initiates you by a declaration. A commitment. A "Shahadah". A declaration that there is no God but Allah. One God, one way. And that his prophet is Muhammad. One last prophet and a commitment to follow HIS way of life. Not Michael Jackson's way. Not Martha Stewart way. Not Plato's nor Russel. Not Calvin Klein ... etc.
Once you become Muslim, you're considered "Shaheed".
Shaheed = Martyr
If you can't be that, don't bother. It's just the way it's.
-------------------- MK is the hottest of all Posts: 743 | Registered: Oct 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Katanga we bass: Please pay attention when posting translations to the Quran. It's not Arabs, it's A3raabs, meaning Bedouins, nomads, uncivilized Arabs not all Arabs.
Never knew that A3raabs were Rednecks. A3raabs are Arabs. Period.
Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:Originally posted by MK the Most Interlectual:
quote:Originally posted by Katanga we bass: Please pay attention when posting translations to the Quran. It's not Arabs, it's A3raabs, meaning Bedouins, nomads, uncivilized Arabs not all Arabs.
Never knew that A3raabs were Rednecks. A3raabs are Arabs. Period.
A3raabs are different from Arabs. They were considered inferior to Quraish and other settled merchant tribes. A3raabs were savages in many ways.
And there is no point of arguing here. If God wanted to name all Arabs he would have said Arabs not A3raabs. There is a big difference.
Here is the verse in Arabic: "Al A3raab Ashaddoh Kofran Wa Nifaqan ... ". See, Al A3raab. Not Al 3arab.
Even today, if you go to Saudi Arabia, you will see that being called A3raabi is a bad baaaaaad thing.
Posts: 743 | Registered: Oct 2006
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Yusuf Ali 97 The Arabs of the desert are the worst in Unbelief and hypocrisy, and most fitted to be in ignorance of the command which Allah hath sent down to His Messenger. But Allah is All-knowing, All-Wise.
M.pickthal 97 The dwellers of the desert are very hard in unbelief and hypocrisy, and more disposed not to know the limits of what Allah has revealed to His Messenger; and Allah is Knowing, Wise. Mohsin Khan 97 The bedouins are the worst in disbelief and hypocrisy, and more likely to be in ignorance of the limits (Allahs Commandments and His Legal Laws, etc.) which Allah has revealed to His Messenger. And Allah is All-Knower, All-WisePosts: 2728 | From: جمهورية مصر العربية | Registered: Sep 2006
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"الأعراب" أهل البدو "أشد كفرا ونفاقا" من أهل المدن لجفائهم وغلظ طباعهم وبعدهم عن سماع القرآن "وأجدر" أولى "أن" أي بأن "لا يعلموا حدود ما أنزل الله على رسوله" من الأحكام والشرائع "والله عليم" بخلقه "حكيم" في صنعه بهم
تفسير الجلالين
Posts: 2728 | From: جمهورية مصر العربية | Registered: Sep 2006
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quote:Originally posted by MK the Most Interlectual:
Didn't God say in the Quran: "Arabs are the worst infidels and hypocrites"?
Can you refer to the verse? Thanks in advance.
The Arabs are the worst in disbelief and hypocrisy, and the most likely to ignore the laws that God has revealed to His messenger. God is Omniscient, Most Wise. [9:97]
i wonder where u get this translation without "Arab of the desert" Posts: 2728 | From: جمهورية مصر العربية | Registered: Sep 2006
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Question: Didn't all Arabs come from the desert? Some settled down in cities and some stayed in the desert. Ask Micky's hosbond about them!
One thing to add here though; true Egyptians were never desert wanderers. Except those of course who didn't listen to Moses and left their GPS back home for 40 years.
Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote: The prophet himself came from The desert Ya Mk can we say this verse is about the prophet?
The prophet came from one of the best families in Quraysh, but Quraysh traced its roots back to the desert too.
And yes, the prophet's part of his family that didn't embrace Islam was one of his worst enemies ya Batty.
Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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modern (not bedouin) arabs have a difficult time associating themselves with bedouin, I've noticed, but truth is truth and the EXACT translation is:
9:97 The arabs of the desert are the worst in unbelief and hypocrisy, and most fitted to be in ignorance of the command which allah hath sent down to his messenger but allah is all-knowing, all-wise.
it doesn't specify that the quran meant all arabs out of all people, but might have been referring to the desert arabs as opposed to the city arabs at that time, who did not live in the desert (per se). otherwise why specifically say desert arabs if all were from the desert. anyway, not that it really matters, Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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I think everybody has the right to say whatever he thinks about the subject , and that has nothing to do with his personal life? why u guys mixed it up ? y u posted Tarek photos ? it' only the lord that will ask us for what we had done in our lives ? everybody know the right and wrong ? we make our choices ...... why we don't accept the other point of view , i'm diffenernt than you , becoz i had diffenet family , edu, house, experinces, etc so i don't have to agree with ur thoghts all the time . and i think that's what democracy is, having diferent point of view doesn't mean that i'm wrong or you are wrong ? it's a mater of how i see things with my own eyes not yours ,,,,,,,
Posts: 47 | From: tour guide | Registered: Dec 2001
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quote:Originally posted by zeina20: I think everybody has the right to say whatever he thinks about the subject , and that has nothing to do with his personal life? why u guys mixed it up ? y u posted Tarek photos ? it' only the lord that will ask us for what we had done in our lives ? everybody know the right and wrong ? we make our choices ...... why we don't accept the other point of view , i'm diffenernt than you , becoz i had diffenet family , edu, house, experinces, etc so i don't have to agree with ur thoghts all the time . and i think that's what democracy is, having diferent point of view doesn't mean that i'm wrong or you are wrong ? it's a mater of how i see things with my own eyes not yours ,,,,,,,
Zeina, habibty, they don't have a concept of what your trying to say! Pretty much you must be A MUSLIM, YOU MUST BE A MUSLIM WHO HATES ALL OTHER RELIGIONS AND KEEPS HIS WOMAN MONAKABA, AND GROWS A BEARD, YOU MUST HATE ISRAEL, YOU MUST LOVE PALESTINIAN SUICIDE DIRTY TERRORISTS. Oh and you must not have any pictures with the other gender or talk to them! and wait, you must also agree with them on everything! Then they will like you!
Posts: 511 | From: Alexandria, Egypt | Registered: Jun 2005
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quote:Originally posted by TAREK307: Zeina, habibty, they don't have a concept of what your trying to say! Pretty much you must be A MUSLIM, YOU MUST BE A MUSLIM WHO HATES ALL OTHER RELIGIONS AND KEEPS HIS WOMAN MONAKABA, AND GROWS A BEARD, YOU MUST HATE ISRAEL, YOU MUST LOVE PALESTINIAN SUICIDE DIRTY TERRORISTS. Oh and you must not have any pictures with the other gender or talk to them! and wait, you must also agree with them on everything! Then they will like you!
Grow up and sober up. What is this PMSy hysteria of yours?
If you're (not "your", wakhed balak enta?) planning to move to live in Egypt with this aggressive attitude, then expect nothing but even more aggression. And a softy like you has NOT seen aggression yet when it comes to the Egyptian type of aggression.
So far I have not seen one post of yours that doesn't contain foul language. Now that you have called everyone in here animals; animals do better than you! You could never win a debate. And guess what, thanks to you, I am now more positive about the MB!
Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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here here ,court in recess ,back at 11am for the verdict who ever think hes guilty put your caps on if not forever hold your BRAIN Posts: 4597 | Registered: Jun 2006
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by With a name like Smuckers:
9:97 The arabs of the desert are the worst in unbelief and hypocrisy, and most fitted to be in ignorance of the command which allah hath sent down to his messenger but allah is all-knowing, all-wise. QUOTE]
I'm astounded...clear as crystal and yet no one gets it. I need to look only at Saudi Arabia and know what Arabs Allah was referring to.
Posts: 407 | From: USA | Registered: Jan 2007
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quote:Originally posted by MK the Most Interlectual:
quote:Originally posted by TAREK307: Zeina, habibty, they don't have a concept of what your trying to say! Pretty much you must be A MUSLIM, YOU MUST BE A MUSLIM WHO HATES ALL OTHER RELIGIONS AND KEEPS HIS WOMAN MONAKABA, AND GROWS A BEARD, YOU MUST HATE ISRAEL, YOU MUST LOVE PALESTINIAN SUICIDE DIRTY TERRORISTS. Oh and you must not have any pictures with the other gender or talk to them! and wait, you must also agree with them on everything! Then they will like you!
Grow up and sober up. What is this PMSy hysteria of yours?
LOL MK again with my daily dose of laughter thanks again Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Batman, non-stop, righteous machine:
quote:Originally posted by Dalia*:
quote:Originally posted by sultan.org(In Makka ):
quote:Originally posted by MK the Most Interlectual:
Didn't God say in the Quran: "Arabs are the worst infidels and hypocrites"?
Can you refer to the verse? Thanks in advance.
The Arabs are the worst in disbelief and hypocrisy, and the most likely to ignore the laws that God has revealed to His messenger. God is Omniscient, Most Wise. [9:97]
i wonder where u get this translation without "Arab of the desert"
ya dahlia u see this? Posts: 2728 | From: جمهورية مصر العربية | Registered: Sep 2006
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It's almost impossible for most of us to accept a notion of a true Islamic society where many of the so-called privileges of freedom are taken away. However again, if you were raised this way from the get go, you wouldn't miss a thing
Freedom means responsibility and that is why most men shun it.
George Bernard Shaw
Posts: 3587 | Registered: Mar 2006
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^^ Umm Batty, maybe Dalia is not replying because she's off the computer?!
Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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I HAVE ABOUT 20 TRANSLATION OF QURAN AND I DONT SEE THIS KIND OF TRANSLATION I ASKED FOR HER SOURCE AND SHE IGNORED ME NOW THIS GIVE ME HIGH SUSPICION
Posts: 2728 | From: جمهورية مصر العربية | Registered: Sep 2006
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- Shortly after their good start, Abdel-Rahman El-Sannady took them to the tunnel of assassinators, murdering Nokrashy Pacha. The prim minister by that time. - In 1954 tried to assassinate Gamal Abdel-Nasser, it is not faked story as they say, it is true and documented - Sayed Qotb, one of the MB leaders but the bible of violence and terrorism in his book "Ma3alim 3ala El-Tareek" or "Landmarks on the Road" - Partnered with Sadat in 1971 through a deal between Sadat and Omar Telmesany to counteract the Nasserist and leftist stream in the Egyptians universities. In re-turn, Sadat shall free their prisoners. They traded Egypt freedom for their freedom. - In 1980s they partnered with a leftist party "El-Amal" to pass national assembly elections.. in 70s they were against leftists… in 80s..they changed. Simply because they adopt a pragmatic philosophy to reach power. - In 90s they had extensive communications with USA seeking support !! - Finally they have a terribly bad intentions toward Coptic Egyptians who are our partners in this land. Their thoughts qualifies for an internal war in Egypt. This was obvious in their "Guidance office" declarations
-------------------- Last Knight Posts: 139 | From: Cairo | Registered: Dec 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Last Knight: I will tell you what is wrong with MB
- Shortly after their good start, Abdel-Rahman El-Sannady took them to the tunnel of assassinators, murdering Nokrashy Pacha. The prim minister by that time. - In 1954 tried to assassinate Gamal Abdel-Nasser, it is not faked story as they say, it is true and documented - Sayed Qotb, one of the MB leaders but the bible of violence and terrorism in his book "Ma3alim 3ala El-Tareek" or "Landmarks on the Road" - Partnered with Sadat in 1971 through a deal between Sadat and Omar Telmesany to counteract the Nasserist and leftist stream in the Egyptians universities. In re-turn, Sadat shall free their prisoners. They traded Egypt freedom for their freedom. - In 1980s they partnered with a leftist party "El-Amal" to pass national assembly elections.. in 70s they were against leftists… in 80s..they changed. Simply because they adopt a pragmatic philosophy to reach power. - In 90s they had extensive communications with USA seeking support !! - Finally they have a terribly bad intentions toward Coptic Egyptians who are our partners in this land. Their thoughts qualifies for an internal war in Egypt. This was obvious in their "Guidance office" declarations
Finally a knowledgeable contribution. Thank you, Last Knight.
Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Batman, non-stop, righteous machine: OK WAITING
I'M ALL WAITING FOR HER SOURCE
I HAVE ABOUT 20 TRANSLATION OF QURAN AND I DONT SEE THIS KIND OF TRANSLATION I ASKED FOR HER SOURCE AND SHE IGNORED ME NOW THIS GIVE ME HIGH SUSPICION
FFS batman get over it, how many times has Dalia asked you a question to wait days even months for you to try to answer it, or NOT answer it as is more you. She doesnt sit here waiting and stamping her feet like you are, she has a life outside ES, get one for yourself. The one that adds and takes away from translations is you 99% of the time.
Posts: 15090 | From: http://www.egyptalk.com/forum/ | Registered: Jul 2004
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Sure man, just hope u r not living on the other side of the city, I live in Nasr City. I usually go to a nice cafe names "Cala Cala" closed to Sarag Mall. What about you?
-------------------- Last Knight Posts: 139 | From: Cairo | Registered: Dec 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Last Knight: Sure man, just hope u r not living on the other side of the city, I live in Nasr City. I usually go to a nice cafe names "Cala Cala" closed to Sarag Mall. What about you?
Would like to join you man, but the Mrs. won't let me go out that much. Too jealous and crap.
Women are such a pain, man.
Give me a kiss ya CAT.
Posts: 8756 | From: Tax-Free Zone | Registered: Jul 2005
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[/qb][/QUOTE]Walahey you guys maganeen! Just because someone doesn't agree with you , you say he's either Kafir or Israeli...MAGANEEEEN.
I wish the days of king farouk would come back when idiots like you couldn't say a word! and egypt was a cosmopolitan place where the Arts and literature and peacful Islam was abundent. Now we have radicals like you guys! All you think is KILL KILL KILL [/QB][/QUOTE]
ROFL , I don't warry either egypt is a kingdom or republic or radical , I agree With any government who can put egypt in the front of progressive countries ,civilized ,and strong country . I don't hate you , only your stupide ideas I don't agree with , you think all of us are blinds , and radicals coz we don't agreed with your ideas about our affairs not yours ,I cann't consider you as egyptian , may be your ideas are good one , but certainly not in egypt , may be in your home ( I MEAN USA ) May be you don’t know enough information about egypt , or you have a confusion , or YOUR BRAIN WASHED ( DO you use RABSOO) Posts: 367 | From: cairo , egypt | Registered: Aug 2001
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Walahey you guys maganeen! Just because someone doesn't agree with you , you say he's either Kafir or Israeli...MAGANEEEEN.
I wish the days of king farouk would come back when idiots like you couldn't say a word! and egypt was a cosmopolitan place where the Arts and literature and peacful Islam was abundent. Now we have radicals like you guys! All you think is KILL KILL KILL [/QB][/QUOTE]
ROFL , I don't warry either egypt is a kingdom or republic or radical , I agree With any government who can put egypt in the front of progressive countries ,civilized ,and strong country . I don't hate you , only your stupide ideas I don't agree with , you think all of us are blinds , and radicals coz we don't agreed with your ideas about our affairs not yours ,I cann't consider you as egyptian , may be your ideas are good one , but certainly not in egypt , may be in your home ( I MEAN USA ) May be you don’t know enough information about egypt , or you have a confusion , or YOUR BRAIN WASHED ( DO you use RABSOO) [/QB][/QUOTE] =================================================
lool ... helwa rabsoo dy Posts: 137 | From: uk | Registered: Feb 2007
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