posted
Is that so? A bawab and a housecleaner are making more!
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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posted
Police officers 400-500 pound a month too. They should cut the police force down to the half and give them a good education and a much better salery. Then they would probaly also start to work for their money...
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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TL .. 300 is teh basic Salary , they get something called hawafez and attending exams ..etc they end with much more than 700-800 pounds a month ,, now 80% if not more of the teacher give private classes,, and the average gets 3000-4000 per month in Cairo.. some teachers .. ( it is big number by the way ) they make average of 25000-3000 per month ,, my nephew in first yar in Secondary school gets some private classes,, pays 30-50 pounds per our , the teacher gives the classes in a group of 5-7 and he gives average of 4-5 gropus a day .. so if say 40 piunds average and 5 students and 5 groups 40*5*5= 1000 per day .. other teachers , teh famous ones charge at least 100 pounds per hour ,, bare in mind you hav eto book with the teachers at least , 2-3 month in advance,, I know many teachers who perefr to work at schools as part time only as they need more time for the private classess,, and they use the scool only as a point to get students and market them selves.. Waiters get 300 pounds and they get tips as well.. which can make the gross income much more,, Bawab( door man ) gets 200-300 per month ,, as basic salry ,, but he is given free accoomodation ( room ) and he does not have to pay any bills.. also he gest tips.. from al the people lives there for each service he does as shooping or washing the cars ,, I am aware ( unless this have changed ) that the only people who do not get salary at all are those who work in the gas/petrol station.. and they work for the tips only ,, I know it is strange system ,, but that what it used to be ,, but do not feel sorry forthem as they always ended with good money at the end of the day .. so the summary that the real/actual salaries is much much more than baisc ones or what the people mention
Posts: 1373 | From: London | Registered: Mar 2004
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quote:Originally posted by south_london_male: TL .. 300 is teh basic Salary , they get something called hawafez and attending exams ..etc they end with much more than 700-800 pounds a month ,, now 80% if not more of the teacher give private classes,, and the average gets 3000-4000 per month in Cairo.. some teachers .. ( it is big number by the way ) they make average of 25000-3000 per month ,, my nephew in first yar in Secondary school gets some private classes,, pays 30-50 pounds per our , the teacher gives the classes in a group of 5-7 and he gives average of 4-5 gropus a day .. so if say 40 piunds average and 5 students and 5 groups 40*5*5= 1000 per day .. other teachers , teh famous ones charge at least 100 pounds per hour ,, bare in mind you hav eto book with the teachers at least , 2-3 month in advance,, I know many teachers who perefr to work at schools as part time only as they need more time for the private classess,, and they use the scool only as a point to get students and market them selves.. Waiters get 300 pounds and they get tips as well.. which can make the gross income much more,,
IT'S AGAINST LAW IN EGYPT that teachers offer private lessons outside class hours although many have to do it to bring food on the table for their own families. Don't you think these teachers would not like to go home after a hectic day in school, enjoy the evening and have a fresh start the next day??
Tell me to become a teacher in Egypt you have to study for at least three or four years in a university, right? And all this for meager 400 LE??
I stayed in a 4* all-inclusive hotel in Hurghada and my husband and I actually never saw people tipping waiters in the restaurant. We tipped our two waiters each time very well - nevertheless one of them gets married next week.
We also tipped each of the gardeners upon departure, these are the people who never have any contact with hotel guests (so they are not able to make some extra tips) but these are the ones who did such an amazing job in looking after the flowers and plants at the hotel complex and this from the early morning hours on.
quote:Originally posted by south_london_male: I know it is strange system ,, but that what it used to be ,, but do not feel sorry forthem as they always ended with good money at the end of the day
I do feel very sorry for them. I saw honest, hard-working Egyptian men who get basically nothing, their work is not appreciated enough.
I am coming to Egypt now for 15 years and salaries seem not to have been improved which is a shame. My ex back in the mid 90's made 600 LE a month in a car factory - and I am afraid to think he wouldn't make much more now either.
posted
some hotels, such as the 5 star Movenpick in El Gouna, distribute the surcharge tax between all the employees every month - so that seems like a fairer system
Posts: 712 | Registered: Apr 2008
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quote:Originally posted by south_london_male: TL .. 300 is teh basic Salary , they get something called hawafez and attending exams ..etc they end with much more than 700-800 pounds a month ,, now 80% if not more of the teacher give private classes,, and the average gets 3000-4000 per month in Cairo.. some teachers .. ( it is big number by the way ) they make average of 25000-3000 per month ,, my nephew in first yar in Secondary school gets some private classes,, pays 30-50 pounds per our , the teacher gives the classes in a group of 5-7 and he gives average of 4-5 gropus a day .. so if say 40 piunds average and 5 students and 5 groups 40*5*5= 1000 per day .. other teachers , teh famous ones charge at least 100 pounds per hour ,, bare in mind you hav eto book with the teachers at least , 2-3 month in advance,, I know many teachers who perefr to work at schools as part time only as they need more time for the private classess,, and they use the scool only as a point to get students and market them selves.. Waiters get 300 pounds and they get tips as well.. which can make the gross income much more,, Bawab( door man ) gets 200-300 per month ,, as basic salry ,, but he is given free accoomodation ( room ) and he does not have to pay any bills.. also he gest tips.. from al the people lives there for each service he does as shooping or washing the cars ,, I am aware ( unless this have changed ) that the only people who do not get salary at all are those who work in the gas/petrol station.. and they work for the tips only ,, I know it is strange system ,, but that what it used to be ,, but do not feel sorry forthem as they always ended with good money at the end of the day .. so the summary that the real/actual salaries is much much more than baisc ones or what the people mention
But it really sucks that they have to put in all those extra hours with private lessons in order to make a liveable wage. And then they risk losing their jobs if the school finds out.
I had parents of my studends asking for private lessons left and right. Because they were used to getting them from teachers. But I always had to say no it is against school policy.
1,000 LE for a teacher with a Master's degree is absurd. Even more so are the salaries of the assistant teachers which average around 500 LE.
Posts: 1626 | From: whatever, wherever | Registered: Jul 2008
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posted
It is against our sense of justice, that a man has to work more as we do during a normal working-week and still doesn't earn enough to provide a family. Nevertheless any relativize is needed. What is a basic level for us, isn't a basic level in Egypt.
The bawab-salaries cannot be 200-300 a month anymore, because the cleaning-lady earns twice as much right now. Two years ago the bawab earned 600, now it's more, because of the salaries of the other staff, as cleaners/maids. A engineer who just finished education earned 1200 two years ago, on a temporary contract, and each year he earns more.
Teachers indeed make a good salary out of private lessons, I don't remember exactly how high, but I guess it was something like 100 or 150 for two hours. That's 2000 extra a month, if they do that daily. I think the big problem that it is all 'black money'. They don't pay taxes about their extra income.
The gouvernment is kind of encouraging that, because the people need that extra income. And of course, they just want to lead a life on higher standards, just like anybody else will do.
It's a vicious circle, and it's running everywhere. The whole world is living like this. In western societies it are also the cleaners, the gardener, the home-painter, the plummer etc. who are working like this. All working people who want to raise their level a bit.
You can't say they need that extra income to stay alive, they just want more as their salary gives them. 1000 EP for a master is absurd in your eyes ( tbh I dont think its 1000 right now) but it is 3½ times as much as a basic salary.
Take a basic salary in your own country, and take the salary of somebody who just finished university. I think it even won't be 3½ times as much...
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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posted
There are such subjects like Music,Sport,Art,Agriculture,History...etc Which its teachers dont have the option of giving private lessons,,Even lots of other teachers who teach basic or important subjects such as Arabic,Math,Physics dont have that option as it appear to be in the media..So at last you will find at the end of day loads of teachers are working in absolutely different careers beside their original career.
The horrible problem in egypt that education is not for education its for the certificate which be given at last,,Load of parents would do anything to get it because its socially needed,,Its not about wanting their children to get educated,,So you will find people who talk about the important subjects which they concentrate on it financially to win the certificates and the unimportant subjects which they totally ignore so at the end you will find this horrible problem such as the Doctor who might forget towls in patients stomachs and The teacher who might know nothing about his own subject etc...
The education system in Egypt is such a nightmare which is a saaaad fact.
As for salaries being horrible I believe its something mutual between government and people as well,, Government share is because in almost 60 years after 23th july revolution we just had no any visible progress in anything while there are other nations who were in worser sitiuation than us became in shorter time so much better than us....,,They spend money stupidly on things such as the heads of local councils for example like paving some street with millions of pounds and after couple of weeks you will find them destroying what is paved because they renewing the electricity pipes or the waterways which mean more millions wasted,,Add to it spending millions on some governmental buildings or offices without really services with good efficiency which this building would offer to people,,And if you asked some governmental official "hey!!!! what the problem??!!!" they will draw so innocent impressions on their faces with saying we just did our duties as it should be,,there are no mistakes..we did that and that and that,,And at the end He would give you some statics which you will never going to understand anything from it about their achievments in their jobs.
People share is because we applying the policy of the herd on almost everything,,For example if people in some area found someone opened a shop for mobile business and he is making good profit from it then you will find almost ALLLLLLL the shop owners in this area giving up their original activites for opening mobile shop business then at the end of month you would find the whole neighborhood is full of mobile shops,Playstation centers,,Netcafes,,Coffeeshops,,Flafel resturants..Etc...There is almost NO production in anything,,Farmers giving up their farms to go to the city,,We almost have no industry in anything because we just keep importing every thing,,Even khan al khalili handcraft makers almost up to extinct if they didnt extincted already because the egyptian stuff now instead of being handmade as in past its being imported by TONS from China,,We even import rubbers and clothspins from there!!!!!!!
Also from the herd policy you would find loads of people would give up where they live and being raised up originally and start heading from all Egypt to stay in cities because they feel its better so they will end up fighting each others for living elements,,Jobs,,Residency,,Food,,Transports,,Education..And at last you will find for instance a city which could hardly handle 8 million human beings ends with more than 20 millions living in it!!!
Money being spend stupidly,,No education,,No production,,No industry,,Government and people keep blaming each other and every side seeing no mistakes on their behalf,,From where the salaries gonna be rasied then?!!!!!!!!
Posts: 712 | Registered: Sep 2006
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Oh my god, I can't believe that I am letting myself get involved in this again I did write something about wages and salaries 2 years ago and it caused a lot of tension and debate back then, I am sure it will still do the same now. Ok, I will not talk about teachers, I will not talk about doctors (like myself) I will not talk about Engineers, I will talk generally about University graduates who work for the government; and please don't say "they should work for the private sector" coz then who would work in the government if everyone only worked for the private sector, and would the private sector absorb all the people in need for work? A fresh University graduate is hired on the 3rd degree in the government, no matter what college or speciality. 3rd degree gets a full salary of around 220-300LE depending on his post and place of work, (thats the full salary), his basic salary is around the 80-100LE. He gets a 10% raise every year calculated from his basic salary and added to his basic salary. so the second year his basic salary would get 88-110LE. this means that all the percentage bonuses and adds rise also, but a lot if the bonuses are fixed figures that don't change: Like for example bankers or tellers at the train station, people who handle money notes, the get compensation for exposure to infection transmission 2LE/month, doctors get that also around 5LE/month or so, it is a fixed number that doesn't rise with the yearly 10%. There are many bonuses that are like this, bottom line is the total salary doesn't necessarily rise 10%. Not everyone can moon light or get an extra job; teachers can, doctors can, although they both shouldn't, but they can; but what can a normal employee do, the one that serves you when you go to a government facility to do something. the one that works in a museum, or in a library, or in a train station. A first degree employee with 30 years of experience and a year or two to retire my get a full salary that is way less than 1000LE. A doctor on the 2nd degree (not a 2nd degree doctor plz) graduating in 1995 for example, would get a total salary of 380-420LE depending on what governorate is he serving at (please don't argue with that). The wages were raised 30% last year, the prices were raised to match them by at least 40% for everything. The government is making promises of policy and salary changes that are no fulfilled. It is a pitty to see people living like this, and it is amazing how people survive. Some workers (like cleaning workers) in our hospital are temporary contract employed, they get a total salary of 80LE/month. along with obligatory shifts with 1-2LE/shift! Nurses get peanuts, accountants, and other non-medical staff also get salaries below what anyone can imagine. My point is, we shouldn't assume that everyone can make some extra money, some people can't and have no means for it, and they are the majority. PS, due to previous experience from a similar post last time, I would like to tell everyone, I have money, I drive a fancy car, I live a good life and I even have an apartment that I put out for rent on this site. (thats how I came across this post in the first place). Cheers for everyone and have a good day.
Posts: 134 | From: Maadi, Cairo, Egypt | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
Forgot to add that the value of the egyptian pound keep getting decreased by almost 30% every year if I remember correctly,,So what you can buy by seven pounds this year for example you would need ten pounds next year to buy it.
So salaries might appear getting up every year but in return the goods you can get through this salaries are still limited and not so much different before it were raised up so you still need to work more and more and moooooooore to compensate the decreasing in the value of the pound.
Posts: 712 | Registered: Sep 2006
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quote:Originally posted by dwgendy: and it is amazing how people survive.
Yeah,,Once I read before a sentence for writer saying that the Egyptian citizen is bearing in silence a circumstances which if someone else has been under the same circumstances would go ALL crazy
Some would think of the concept that we just love to victimizing ourselves and portray us as heros,,No of course I dont mean that,,But what I mean its amazing for a bit how many between all of that still holding their morals and still are capable of live,,Smile,,laugh and enjoy life,,Playing,,Going to resorts,,Cinemas...etc..
Posts: 712 | Registered: Sep 2006
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posted
Yeah, and people from Sudan escape to Egypt because Egypt is better as Sudan. You all must not forget that this are issue's related to the status of Egypt as what it is right now: a second world developing country. The sad thing is that it hasn't always been this way, once Egypt was on a much higher level as most of the other Middle-Eastern and African countries. So, the Egyptian gouvernments didn't do well... Maybe it should be usefull to find the reason why. Why didn't they do well? Why did they take wrong decisions? Why did they allow people to rule the country who weren't qualified enough? Did they actually have a vote in that? Egypt is a quasy democratic nation. People can vote, but not everyone is free to be a candidate. Knowledge has left the country long ago, chased off by new belligerent rulers. All those (lost) wars have brought the country to a bankrupt, and the ones in charge took all what there was, included the systems.
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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I'm about 90% certain that I will NEVER move to Egypt and it's got nothing to do with not liking the place, it's the fact that the salaries are so ridiculously low. My husband is a civil engineer and when he left Egypt in 2004 he was making around 2500 LE a month, which he says was an Okay salary. At that time he still lived with his parents so didn't have to pay rent and all the other expenses of running a household.
Since he left Cairo he bought an apartment but only after spending a few years working in the desert in places like Saudi Arabia and Algeria and saving every penny he earned, enough to put a big downpayment on the apartment and pay off a big chunk of the mortgage. He wouldnt have had a hope in hell of buying somewhere otherwise. Even now the mortgage on this apartment is 3000 LE a month and its got nothing done to it. I only saw it once and it's nice enough from outside as its a new development in a place called Golf City in New Cairo but inside is something else as it has no floors, electrics, plumbing nothing. It will take us forever to be able to make it liveable and with the cost of livng being high where we live I can't see it happening anytime soon.
Also my mother and father in law both worked for the government all their lives and their salaries were so low. my FIL is 64 he has a Ph.D and he still works part time at the local university because if he retires now he will have to live on his Egyptian pension which is so meagre its a joke
I feel fortunate that I have the option to go back to England cos i know not everyone has the choice and if for some reason my husband couldnt come then I would rather stay here in the UAE forever than have to live on Egyptian Wages Posts: 500 | From: United Arab Emirates | Registered: Jul 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Dubai Girl: I'm about 90% certain that I will NEVER move to Egypt and it's got nothing to do with not liking the place, it's the fact that the salaries are so ridiculously low. My husband is a civil engineer and when he left Egypt in 2004 he was making around 2500 LE a month, which he says was an Okay salary. At that time he still lived with his parents so didn't have to pay rent and all the other expenses of running a household.
Since he left Cairo he bought an apartment but only after spending a few years working in the desert in places like Saudi Arabia and Algeria and saving every penny he earned, enough to put a big downpayment on the apartment and pay off a big chunk of the mortgage. He wouldnt have had a hope in hell of buying somewhere otherwise. Even now the mortgage on this apartment is 3000 LE a month and its got nothing done to it. I only saw it once and it's nice enough from outside as its a new development in a place called Golf City in New Cairo but inside is something else as it has no floors, electrics, plumbing nothing. It will take us forever to be able to make it liveable and with the cost of livng being high where we live I can't see it happening anytime soon.
Also my mother and father in law both worked for the government all their lives and their salaries were so low. my FIL is 64 he has a Ph.D and he still works part time at the local university because if he retires now he will have to live on his Egyptian pension which is so meagre its a joke
I feel fortunate that I have the option to go back to England cos i know not everyone has the choice and if for some reason my husband couldnt come then I would rather stay here in the UAE forever than have to live on Egyptian Wages
That area's with new to build appartments and houses, and indeed the financial issue's from the people, made the gouvernment cautius. Beacuse others, who can afford it, won't buy a place to live in an area that is filled with half finished buildngs. So, in the new area's there is a time limit. When people buy land, they have to build and finish that building within that time limit. When they don't make it on time, in first instance they have to pay a fine, and when they still are not able to finish it, the gouvernment confiscates it. That last part - the gouvernment takes it away- I don't know for sure. It has been told to me, but it is hard to imagine to me, that a gouvernment could take land and half finished building without a compensation. Anyway, it's to prevent desolate landscapes because of opportunism. There still are enough people who have the money to buy land, start building, while they don't have enough money to catually finish it. The building materials are much cheaper now, so the money has to be invested in where it's meant for, and not to become rich later. The prices of housing increased a lot during the last years- as everywhere else on this world- and actually they are not based on real value anymore. The people with money were able to invest in land, with the purpose to sell it for a multiplied amount later. At the same time - of course- there are not enough houses, that's why they became that expensive. In fact it's the same as project-developers are doing on large scale. The only difference is, that this project-developers need to have enough money to finish it, and don't use it as a long term investment.
Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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posted
I was amazed to see so many new developments being built outside of Cairo (big billboard advertisings all along the ring road), we went to the 6 of October City area and also on the way to Ain Sukhna many projects have been started yet it seems it takes years to finish them up. We never saw any construction workers on any of the premises.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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It looks very appealing,but i wonder about the prices of such,specially for Egyptians. How many of them could afford that? Posts: 3833 | From: here,there,everywhere | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
The whole campaign is geared at the so called A-class, and they are the ones who can afford it.
Posts: 2803 | Registered: Feb 2007
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