posted
I need advice on the culture and character of egyptian men.
Most importantly the following:
How difficult is it for Egyptians to leave their country and travel to america...what are requirements in getting US visa...what would prevent him from getting the visa? I do not understand why it is SO difficult to come to US!
The story goes...
We met online and I have read similar postings for women in my position. I know that many people believe that egyptian men are liars and all of that but I do trust in human decency. People of bad character are found everywhere.
I want to believe that he is honest in all that he says. My own instinct says that he IS the kindest man I have ever known, and we discuss matters in great detail. I appreciate his views and opinions and think that they are much like my own. I feel like I have finally found someone who loves me 100% for who I am despite my faults. I am not ugly and I am not fat. He did not woo me because I have a pathetic self-image. I am not really wealthy (but by his standards I'm sure that I would be) however, I think that his family is. He is a doctor. Seems to be very smart and have all good intentions at heart. My mother says that if I marry him and have children I will never be able to have a decent nights rest not knowing if he will take them from me back to Egypt one day. My family keeps telling me that I am not thinking this through. I have tried to do research on my own and have found soo many articles, but for every bad there is a good.
He has never asked me for money and does not like the fact that I spend money on him even to call him on occasion. Whenever we speak of my visit he is willing to help me pay for the expense. When I ask him how do I know that he is not just searching for a green card his response is:
Do you think it will be easy to leave my friends, my family, my work, and everything considered for uncertain happiness in USA. He still thinks that it will be somewhat dangerous to live here and that people may target him with hate crimes. So I don't necessarily think that he was searching for a woman to "trick" into love.
Also I am curious about what he may expect in my role as a wife. I am not muslim but he says that me being christian would be OK.
I just want to know some information about similar stories that may relate to my situation.
I also want to know how safe it is for an American female traveling into Egypt. Thanks for any help that you can provide.
Best wishes
Posts: 8 | From: Colorado, USA | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
Egypt is a veeeeery safe country. No problem about all. And there are lots of foreigners and also Americans living here. It is a very internatinoal country, lets say. Concerning your e-boyfriend, I would say, be careful. Lets assume that he is not interested in going to the US. But I said be careful not only because of his willing to be with you, but because his environment. Try to know and read more about Egypt and Islam (f he is Muslim of course and he is practising the religion). Second, I said just be careful coz he may be a wonderful person or not...this happens in every country with e-relationships. I do not know if you read my thread before, about EMOTIONAL INTELLIGENCE, in LIVING IN EGYPT. To be honest I think that culture, tradition and religion is not a big deal for Westerners, but you have to analyse also the character of Egyptians. For example, the way they are dealing with people is very different from the way you can be used to. For me, this is the real difference. With the rest, you can deal easily if you are open minded.
Posts: 108 | From: London | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
it will be very hard, if not impossible for him to get a fiance/immigrant visa to the states.
if he had a tourist visa to europe/usa in the past, it will be easier, but still not easy.
the US embassy does not look favorably on relationships forged in cyberspace and for a long time, they even had a paragraph about online relationships/marriage applications on their cairo web site.
it's hard because for a tourist visa, he has to prove he's not going there to emigrate and he will return to egypt.
for fiance visa, obviously he's going there to emigrate.
there's many people married who have known each other for years and live in egypt as a married couple who apply for the egyptian husband's US visa, so in this respect, yours - a romance online - will get the most speculation and probably fall down on the list of who gets one.
also, public schools in egypt are cheap, doctors don't always make a decent salary and every egyptian family has at least one doctor. his profession does not AT ALL mean he's financially secure. it just means he had to learn english for his degree
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
Hi concerned i am in case like you.. mm i am an Egyptian guy from Cairo and my girl friend is Russian and i may marry her but not this days.. ok you have to know that Egypt consider from the most safe countries and you can walk alone at street at anytime ..in the 24 hours in day..and specially Cairo ..and it even called "the city which don't sleep" and many Americans,russian,italian,and from other countries live here..so it is international Country.. and i can tell you that i have 2 friends from USA ..and about if he is Muslim ..no no don't worry about that many Muslims marry not Muslims girls specially if they are christian.. but i can tell you something ..that may be he want you to be just a help for him to travelling to USA coz here many guys want to travel there for work.. and it is hard to have it is visa ..coz after 11 Sep events it become too hard to get it ..and my brother was there.... he stayed much time to get it is visa..but may be he really love you ...i just tell u .. and if u need any help about anything just ask .. bye Posts: 4 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
Check out the website of the US Embassy in Cairo for further information on visa application: http://egypt.usembassy.gov/consular.htm#nvs It's damn hard for Egyptians to get a visa to the US or Europe these days & embassies tend to be very suspicious about internet relationships. I think it would be better if you go & meet him in Egypt. It's a safe country & I am sure he will take good care of you. Being a doctor in Egypt doesn't mean that he is financially secure, you'd be shocked to hear how little money some of them are making. Don't rush into anything, insist that you meet him on his own turf and take things very slowly. Good luck to you. Cheers Ann
Posts: 316 | From: Cairo, Egypt | Registered: Jan 2001
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quote:Originally posted by concerned: I need advice on the culture and character of egyptian men.
Most importantly the following:
How difficult is it for Egyptians to leave their country and travel to america...what are requirements in getting US visa...what would prevent him from getting the visa? I do not understand why it is SO difficult to come to US!
The story goes...
We met online and I have read similar postings for women in my position. I know that many people believe that egyptian men are liars and all of that but I do trust in human decency. People of bad character are found everywhere.
I want to believe that he is honest in all that he says. My own instinct says that he IS the kindest man I have ever known, and we discuss matters in great detail. I appreciate his views and opinions and think that they are much like my own. I feel like I have finally found someone who loves me 100% for who I am despite my faults. I am not ugly and I am not fat. He did not woo me because I have a pathetic self-image. I am not really wealthy (but by his standards I'm sure that I would be) however, I think that his family is. He is a doctor. Seems to be very smart and have all good intentions at heart. My mother says that if I marry him and have children I will never be able to have a decent nights rest not knowing if he will take them from me back to Egypt one day. My family keeps telling me that I am not thinking this through. I have tried to do research on my own and have found soo many articles, but for every bad there is a good.
He has never asked me for money and does not like the fact that I spend money on him even to call him on occasion. Whenever we speak of my visit he is willing to help me pay for the expense. When I ask him how do I know that he is not just searching for a green card his response is:
Do you think it will be easy to leave my friends, my family, my work, and everything considered for uncertain happiness in USA. He still thinks that it will be somewhat dangerous to live here and that people may target him with hate crimes. So I don't necessarily think that he was searching for a woman to "trick" into love.
Also I am curious about what he may expect in my role as a wife. I am not muslim but he says that me being christian would be OK.
I just want to know some information about similar stories that may relate to my situation.
I also want to know how safe it is for an American female traveling into Egypt. Thanks for any help that you can provide.
Best wishes
Please go and meet him in Egypt first before you do any´thing. I could never trust anyone just knowing him online. Hope he is not the same doctor who wanted to marry aussifem. Be careful , get to know him in person take care. BTW Egypt is a safe place so no worries in that matter
Posts: 523 | From: Finland | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Wanted to ask another question for anyone who may know.
If a man is denied a visa is it simply a denial or do they return information you stating DENIED on the basis OF..........???
Posts: 8 | From: Colorado, USA | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
mm i didn't understand your question good ..but i think i got what u mean.. ok about denied visa ..i think it is DENIED on the basis OF many things ..like why u travel? "the reason of traveling" and another things like that
Posts: 4 | Registered: Oct 2005
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posted
no embassy tells you why it's denied. they just say you did not satisfy the criteria, which is determined by the consular who reviews your application and/or interviews you.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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posted
hey, i think it is easy to discover if he is really in love you and does not will for a green card. Simply, say honey, i would like to be always be happy and be beside your family and friend and never leave your work, then tell him you will love to live in Egypt with you.
you really have to live with him in Egypt for at least one year, and never tell him that inside you. you will move again to usa.
-------------------- River Of Love Posts: 696 | From: egypt | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
Concerned, the info is on the web site of the embassy.
Not to jump to any conclusions, as you may just be getting info for your own curiousity, but isn't HE doing any of this research HIMSELF?
I mean, if you wanted to visit Egypt, would you ask him to call the Egyptian Embassy in Washington DC from Egypt to ask them what you as a US citizen need to do to get a visa to Egypt?
Sorry to sound harsh, but it's a trend on this forum that the foreign women are always doing the info seeking for the men - including things like how does my egyptian boyfriend get an egyptian passport.... and I always wonder, who the hell are these man-boys who can't even get their own passports?!
(Ok rant over)
Simply, let him take care of this. If he asks his circle of friends, eventually he'll find someone who has gone through the experience first hand and will share the process he went through with him.
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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Thanks for your post. It actually made me smile. The reason I ask here is not to try to help him but more to compare what he has told me with an insiders point of view. I am just trying to be really cautious and cover all my bases. The thing is, he has applied and been denied and he really has no answer to give me as to why that was so. So to do a little investigative work I decided to ask here to make sure the stories match up. I know I know...people will say I wouldn't be doing this if I trusted him. Truth is after reading all the stuff you can find here at ES do you blame me. It is merely a fact that I am trying to build trust is all. What better way than the help from people who may know best. Thank you all and I welcome any and all comments. BEST WISHES
Posts: 8 | From: Colorado, USA | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
hi concerned we seem to be sharing the same story i myself am from the u.s now temp staying in egypt with my husband who i met online ...you dont need to be worried about travling to egypt it is safe just a little outdated unless like others mentioned you stay in cario ..its kinda noisy and there are ALOT of people in the streets at all times of the day and night the only problem i seem to have here is you cant go anywhere with out 50 peoples eyes following you ...talk about being self concious ....and when ever you date any foreign man you get the ole he wants you for the visa ,welll maybe sometimes thats true but what if its not you ready to give up on what might be the real thing for what other people say ...beleive me i heard it all ...and it is true egyption men have very smoothe tounges so romantic so its easy to get cought up ...but when you really think about it was your life this happy before you knew him and would it be this happy without him? and if he did just want the visa wouldnt those 3 years of that good feeling be worth it ,just another point you know the average divorce rate in the u.s i think is about 3 years so what do you have to lose ... but i will warn you the visa is hard you will do several interveiws just to prove your realtion ship is real then he will need a med check police record fingerprinting c i a report among several more pain in the ,,,, things youll have to do but most importantly is you need to have paid taxes for the last 3 years and make enough money according to there chart to sponcer him hope this helps a little feel free to email me if you need to get more in depth
Posts: 16 | From: egypt | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
You know everyone says how the men there are smooth talkers. ((and boy is it true)) So I said to him what's the deal with that? I mean do they sit the boys down in school and teach them how to talk to women??? :-D He just laughed at me. He does seem to always have the right words to say.
I am really finding a lot of the info i have found here to be useful! We have been talking less in general conversation and more in the things that may matter most and it really feels great. Some things we do not see eye to eye on but they are all issues that can be resolved.
He does wish that i would be there tomorrow...but as far as marriage goes...whether we will marry on my first visit or not has yet to be determined. In his words this is a decision for me to make based on my time there and if it feels right. There is not a lot of pressure.
I know that when i am having a bad day, talking to him is what lifts me back up again!!!
Posts: 8 | From: Colorado, USA | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
just keep in mind being a doctor in egypt is not as difficult as being one in america. they dont make much money, unless there practice deal with mostly expats. most doctors here work for the govt in clinics and make very little money. for example nurses here make about $50 a month, drs make maybe 100-200 from the govt? a dr once made a house call and charged less than 15$, he was here for 2 hours. just to give you an idea. and do you know about the other differences in egypt like the social standing? here there is a strong class division, no real middle class, either poor or rich.
Posts: 71 | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
He does wish that i would be there tomorrow...but as far as marriage goes...whether we will marry on my first visit or not has yet to be determined. In his words this is a decision for me to make based on my time there and if it feels right. There is not a lot of pressure.
Getting married on your first visit with this man & you say there isn't a lot of pressure?! Would you marry an American man at home upon having him met once?
By your admission he already applied for a US visa & got denied. Doesn't that tell you enough about this motivations? Be careful. Play smart & tell him that you wish to live with him in Egypt permanently, see how he reacts.
Posts: 316 | From: Cairo, Egypt | Registered: Jan 2001
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quote: By your admission he already applied for a US visa & got denied. Doesn't that tell you enough about this motivations? Be careful. Play smart & tell him that you wish to live with him in Egypt permanently, see how he reacts. [/QB]
Con, visa denial tells you nothing about his motives, a lot of God fearing and innocent people are denided this unquestionable priviledge to enter the paradise. One of them was my stepmom a few years back (in her fifties now), a gal with the true traveller's spirit 'snooping' everywhere in the world. She was so hurt by it (and jerks acting as omnipotent consuls) it broke my heart. She got the visa at second try (next calendar year from the first one) when i got my then husband to write her a letter of personal recommendation (he works for the government). It all sucks. Write me an email, I will try to answer your questions despite getting nauseated when thinking about the visa nightmare yet AGAIN... (karah_mia @ Y)
Posts: 2238 | From: Mother Earth | Registered: Jun 2004
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quote: By your admission he already applied for a US visa & got denied. Doesn't that tell you enough about this motivations? Be careful. Play smart & tell him that you wish to live with him in Egypt permanently, see how he reacts.
Con, visa denial tells you nothing about his motives, a lot of God fearing and innocent people are denided this unquestionable priviledge to enter the paradise. One of them was my stepmom a few years back (in her fifties now), a gal with the true traveller's spirit 'snooping' everywhere in the world. She was so hurt by it (and jerks acting as omnipotent consuls) it broke my heart. She got the visa at second try (next calendar year from the first one) when i got my then husband to write her a letter of personal recommendation (he works for the government). It all sucks. Write me an email, I will try to answer your questions despite getting nauseated when thinking about the visa nightmare yet AGAIN... (karah_mia @ Y) [/QB]
What i meant to say is that he already applied for a visa so he is clearly after a visa.
Posts: 316 | From: Cairo, Egypt | Registered: Jan 2001
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posted
I don't think that's true. I know a lot of people who got turned down for visas to europe and they just wanted to go on a vacation. Anyway, a lot of people who are after the good life prefer the woman come to egypt and bring her money. It goes further in egypt and the guy has a chance to control the woman (if she allows it.)
Posts: 2182 | Registered: Oct 2002
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First of all, I am in the same situation 'concerned' except for the fact that I already went to egypt, met the love of my life, and married him within 3 weeks.
It tore my heart out to leave him behind when coming home. So I would suggest that as soon as you get married, if that's the plan, you register your marriage at the embassy as it is more easily validated by the immigration department here in USA. At the same time, ask for how to start the process of immigration from the embassy. I don't know how it varies, but they told us that we could have done it at the same time we registered our marriage. But this was a day before I was to come back home and the process required a couple of days. The guy at the embassy told us he could have come home with me that same time. I wish I had known... I would have brought him home with me.
Anyway, I got back from Egypt and filed his petition. Immigration was very quick at responding to us. About 4 weeks after I filed the petition he was approved and then the next step was to file the affidavit of support and pay the 380.00 fee. After that, sending payment for the application for the permanent visa which was I think 180.00. From there, they send you the actual application and you submit it with all necessary documentation in originals and with certified translations. He can do this there and send it to you or you can do it here. The translations here, at least in california, are very very expensive. My advice when you are there get 3 copies of your marriage certificate with translations. Here translations will cost about 180.00 per certificate copy whereas there you will pay about 150.00 for three.
The National Visa Center will require you to send the DS230 Part I and II which needs to be in original and singed by him. NO copies will be taken. So you have to get it, fill it out, scan it and email it to him or fax it. He signs it and sends it back via mail (fedex if possible) and then you send it back with:
1 -- Original Marriage Certificate with translation 2 -- Original Birth Certificate for him with translation 3 -- Police certificate with fingerprints with translation 4 -- Copies of his passport
and I think that's it. When you do the affidavit of support before this process you will be asked to provide the last 3 years of your filed income taxes to verify that you do actually work.
For most countries they don't ask for this documentation until the day of the interview, but for EGYPT specifically they ask for all of this before they even consider you for the appointment.
Our lawyer, which you don't need one, made the mistake of telling us that we needed to only submit the Part I of the DS230 application for permanent visa. They returned it to us and asked for everything again. That delayed us 2 months, so don't make this mistake.
If you do things on time... that is return paperwork as soon as you get their request, and i suggest overnight mail, your husband should be here in as early as 4-5 months. That is what was supposed to happen for us, but unfortunately with the mistake made by our lawyer and my husband having a student passport which restrict his traveling during nov. 1 to jan. 15 so he can't come home Insha'Allah until Jan. 17 after the Day of Arafat festivals.
I hope this helps. It is not at all hard to get into the US I have learned. I have a few friends with husbands here already from many arab countries. I have a friend who got married a month before me and petitioned his wife 2 weeks before me and she arrived here in 7 - 8 months just in time to deliver their brand new baby boy!!
It's hard not to wonder if it's a game they are at. I didn't have this thought about my husband though, but I did have friends who were in that situation. I trust my husband Alhamdulellah and I know that he will be good to me. If not, he has Allah to answer to. Not me.
For me, I'm happier than I could have ever imagined in a million dreams. The full circle will come when he arrives here, Insha'Allah.
BTW - I was born and raised in California of Mexican descent. I converted to Islam upon returning from Egypt, by my own complete and free will. I have pretty much done a 360 with my life. Changing it from liberated California style to the more modest yet focused and complete way of Islam... I still have my sense of humor and enjoy life more than ever, Alhamdulellah!
I hope all this info helps! I wish you the best Insha'Allah!
Zenah
P.S. Be prepared to spend about 1,800.00 on this process. ; ) Good luck!
Posts: 7 | From: California | Registered: Nov 2005
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welcome to ES. Have you *met* Paint Me AS I Am, yet? She is latina, living in California, and a revert as well. I wonder if you live close to her? She's in the Monterey area...
Perhaps you have somethings in common.
Susan
quote:Originally posted by zenah: Hi, it's my first time posting here.
First of all, I am in the same situation 'concerned' except for the fact that I already went to egypt, met the love of my life, and married him within 3 weeks.
It tore my heart out to leave him behind when coming home. So I would suggest that as soon as you get married, if that's the plan, you register your marriage at the embassy as it is more easily validated by the immigration department here in USA. At the same time, ask for how to start the process of immigration from the embassy. I don't know how it varies, but they told us that we could have done it at the same time we registered our marriage. But this was a day before I was to come back home and the process required a couple of days. The guy at the embassy told us he could have come home with me that same time. I wish I had known... I would have brought him home with me.
Anyway, I got back from Egypt and filed his petition. Immigration was very quick at responding to us. About 4 weeks after I filed the petition he was approved and then the next step was to file the affidavit of support and pay the 380.00 fee. After that, sending payment for the application for the permanent visa which was I think 180.00. From there, they send you the actual application and you submit it with all necessary documentation in originals and with certified translations. He can do this there and send it to you or you can do it here. The translations here, at least in california, are very very expensive. My advice when you are there get 3 copies of your marriage certificate with translations. Here translations will cost about 180.00 per certificate copy whereas there you will pay about 150.00 for three.
The National Visa Center will require you to send the DS230 Part I and II which needs to be in original and singed by him. NO copies will be taken. So you have to get it, fill it out, scan it and email it to him or fax it. He signs it and sends it back via mail (fedex if possible) and then you send it back with:
1 -- Original Marriage Certificate with translation 2 -- Original Birth Certificate for him with translation 3 -- Police certificate with fingerprints with translation 4 -- Copies of his passport
and I think that's it. When you do the affidavit of support before this process you will be asked to provide the last 3 years of your filed income taxes to verify that you do actually work.
For most countries they don't ask for this documentation until the day of the interview, but for EGYPT specifically they ask for all of this before they even consider you for the appointment.
Our lawyer, which you don't need one, made the mistake of telling us that we needed to only submit the Part I of the DS230 application for permanent visa. They returned it to us and asked for everything again. That delayed us 2 months, so don't make this mistake.
If you do things on time... that is return paperwork as soon as you get their request, and i suggest overnight mail, your husband should be here in as early as 4-5 months. That is what was supposed to happen for us, but unfortunately with the mistake made by our lawyer and my husband having a student passport which restrict his traveling during nov. 1 to jan. 15 so he can't come home Insha'Allah until Jan. 17 after the Day of Arafat festivals.
I hope this helps. It is not at all hard to get into the US I have learned. I have a few friends with husbands here already from many arab countries. I have a friend who got married a month before me and petitioned his wife 2 weeks before me and she arrived here in 7 - 8 months just in time to deliver their brand new baby boy!!
It's hard not to wonder if it's a game they are at. I didn't have this thought about my husband though, but I did have friends who were in that situation. I trust my husband Alhamdulellah and I know that he will be good to me. If not, he has Allah to answer to. Not me.
For me, I'm happier than I could have ever imagined in a million dreams. The full circle will come when he arrives here, Insha'Allah.
BTW - I was born and raised in California of Mexican descent. I converted to Islam upon returning from Egypt, by my own complete and free will. I have pretty much done a 360 with my life. Changing it from liberated California style to the more modest yet focused and complete way of Islam... I still have my sense of humor and enjoy life more than ever, Alhamdulellah!
I hope all this info helps! I wish you the best Insha'Allah!
Zenah
P.S. Be prepared to spend about 1,800.00 on this process. ; ) Good luck!
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