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Originally posted by supercar:
The entire Egyptian civilization was marvelous, but there were ups and downs, like in any other civilization. I think we all know enough about Ancient Egyptian dynasties, or at least to a certain degree, to be able to “personally” pick a dynastic period which is considered the most innovative and productive. If you feel that there are several most productive dynasties, that is fine, but then pick one that you think tops them all. It would be interesting to mention why the one selected to be the “best of all”, is better than other personally picked most innovative dynasties. In the same token, it would be interesting to mention which dynasty or dynastic period, is personally considered the least productive and why, in comparison to other dynasties. Hopefully , this will be fun!

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Originally posted by kenndo:
THE FOURTH,THRIRD,18TH,11TH AND 25TH DYNASTY WERE ON or about the SAME LEVEL TO ME.I would have to explain why later.

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That's really specific, in terms of choices.

Looking forward to your explanation of why those dynasties.

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Originally posted by ausar:
12th dyansty because of the various engineering works by Amenemhet III and others. During this time we get more productive literature that inform us more about the lives of the commoners throughout Egypt.

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Fair enough! Then is there any dynasty you consider "least" productive?

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Originally posted by rasol:
That's really specific, in terms of choices.

Looking forward to your explanation of why those dynasties.

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I can't help but notice your interest in Kenndo's choices. How about you rasol, do you have any dynasty(s) in mind, that you would like to express your opinion on, that is, both the most productive and least productive?

[list]

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Originally posted by supercar:
The Hyksos saw a relative period of dark ages, while the Persions brief rule fared no better than the Hyksos.

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The opposite is true. One of the reasons the Egyptians allowed the Hyksos to rule is because they were near anarchy and needed a stable government. The Hyksos broght relative stability to most of lower Egypt while upper Egypt underwent a period of self-rule. The Hyksos brought with them new technologies like the composite bow and the chariot. The move to drive the Hyksos out appears to have been rooted in a conflict between a ruiling family from Thebes and a ruiling family in the Delta.

From tour Egypt:

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Until the Hyksos invasion, the history of Egypt and Asia were mostly isolated, while afterwards, they would be permanently entwined. The Hyksos brought more than weapons to Egypt. It was due to the Hyksos that the hump backed Zebu cattle made their appearance in Egypt. Also, we find new vegetable and fruit crops that were cultivated, along with improvements in pottery and linen arising from the introduction of improved potter's wheels and the vertical loom.

Perhaps one of the greatest contribution of the Hyksos was the preservation of famous Egyptian documents, both literary and scientific. During the reign of Apophis, the fifth king of the “Great Hyksos,” scribes were commissioned to recopy Egyptian texts so they would not be lost. One such text was the Edwin Smith Surgical Papyrus. This unique text, dating from about 3000 BC, gives a clear perspective of the human body as studied by the Egyptians, with details of specific clinical cases, examinations, and prognosis. The Westcar Papyrus preserved the only known version of an ancient Egyptian story that may have otherwise been lost. Other restored documents include the Rhind Mathematical Papyrus, the most important mathematical exposition ever found in Egypt.

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The opposite is true. One of the reasons the Egyptians allowed the Hyksos to rule is because they were near anarchy and needed a stable government.

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The Hyksos brought with them new technologies like the composite bow and the chariot.

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It is said that the reason this period is poorly documented and mysterious is that the Kemetians were horrified by Hyksos rule, and either did not record the events or even destroyed records of their reign, much as the Romans did during the reign of the insane Caligula.

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Originally posted by rasol:

[QUOTE]The Hyksos brought with them new technologies like the composite bow and the chariot.

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Here's what Manetho had so say about them:
"unexpectedly from the regions of the East, invaders of obscure race marched in confidence of victory against our land. By main force they easily seized it without striking a blow; and having overpowered the rulers of the land they then burned our cities ruthlessly, razed to the ground the temples of the gods, and treated all the natives with a cruel hostility, massacring some and leading into slavery the wives and children of others... Finally, they appointed as king one of their number whose name was Salitis"
He is the one who is said to have given them the name Hyksos.[/QUOTE]

You have to keep in mind that the 18th dynasty hated the Hyksos so some of the bad stuff written about them is propaganda. The Hyksos didn't go much futher than the Delta even though they claimed to rule both upper and lower Egypt. Part of the reason that they seized the Delta so easily might be because Asiatic immigrants had already established communities there:

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It appears that the Hyksos left much of Egypt alone. It is clear that Avaris (Tell el-Dab'a) was occupied by a people who exhibited specifically non-Egyptian cultural traits. We find this in the layout of the town itself, the houses, and particularly the burials, which were intermixed with the living community, unlike those of the Egyptians. While we know that the Hyksos established centers, as their influenced gradually moved towards Memphis along the eastern edge of the Delta, at Farasha, Tell el-Sahaba, Bubastis, Inshas and Tell el-Yahudiyas, very little of this particular culture has been found at other Egyptian sites.

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The Hyksos had their own belief systems but they adopted some Egyptian Gods and respected the beliefs of the Egyptian people. I'm not saying that Hyksos rule over Egypt was not violent or widely accepted, I'm just pointing out that they were somewhat productive and beneficial to Egypt's overall history. It can be argued that tehy helped jumpstart the renaissance in Egypt's 18th dynasty...

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Originally posted by rasol:
You have to keep in mind that the 18th dynasty hated the Hyksos so some of the bad stuff written about them is propaganda.

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The Hyksos were foreign invaders of Kemet, expelled by Kemetian citizens. They do not need PROPAGANDA to justify their rule in their own country. Just the opposite is true (to repeat your phrase). You are the one who is promoting revisionist history via Hyksos propaganda.

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Part of the reason that they seized the Delta so easily might be because Asiatic immigrants had already established communities there

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It appears that the Hyksos left much of Egypt alone.

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While we know that the Hyksos established centers, as their influenced gradually moved towards Memphis along the eastern edge of the Delta, at Farasha, Tell el-Sahaba, Bubastis, Inshas and Tell el-Yahudiyas, very little of this particular culture has been found at other Egyptian sites.

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I'm not saying that Hyksos rule over Egypt was not violent or widely accepted, I'm just pointing out that they were somewhat productive and beneficial to Egypt's overall history.

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Originally posted by rasol:

I think the most important effect of Hyksos rule is that by subjecting Kemet to foreign domination and brutality, it set the stage for for re-uniting Kemet and for the birth of renewed alliances between Kemet and Cush...The Hyksos were the "darkness" before the dawn of Kemet's golden age.

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Did the Thebean royal family reunite Egypt? Yes. On your second point you forget that the Nubians/Cushites were allied with the Hyksos and Egypt invaded Nubia while simultaneously driving the Hyksos out.

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Did the Thebean royal family reunite Egypt? Yes. On your second point you forget that the Nubians/Cushites were allied with the Hyksos

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In hindsight, the Hyksos invasion of the Delta was beneficial. Bringing new technology and culture from Asia, the Hyksos helped ignite the resurgence of Egypt's power in the 18th dynasty.

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Whatever your opinion of the Hyksos, the period they ruled was not a dark age.

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Originally posted by supercar:
I can't help but notice your interest in Kenndo's choices. How about you rasol, do you have any dynasty(s) in mind, that you would like to express your opinion on, that is, both the most productive and least productive?

I would have to definitely pick the 1st dynasty, 3rd, 4th, 12th, 18th, and 25th dynasties, because these were not only the periods that saw much creative expression in art, engineering, and recontruction, but also were ruled by indigenous Africans, who were mostly Black folks.The main reason the 1st dynasty is included in my list of productive dynasties, is because of the innovative steps taken to create a nation in the first place. The 3rd, but especially fourth dynasty, saw many new monuments and more sophisticated pyramids being built. The 18th dynasty saw experimentation and practice of monotheism, and new expression in arts. The 25th dynasty saw reunification of the Egyptian nation, and some resurgence in creative art and reconstruction, as well as rule by native African rulers. If I had to pick my personal best, it would have to be the 4th dynasty with their sophisticated engineering accomplishments, particularly the Giza monuments which were upgraded, along with new constructions. The least productive dynasties would be 8, 9, 10, 15th, 27th,and 31th dynasties. The Hyksos saw a relative period of dark ages, while the Persions brief rule fared no better than the Hyksos. Other dynasties not listed in the most productive or least productive, have been less innovative and progressive in varying ways compared to the most productive dynasties, but comparatively better than the least productive groups.

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I SAID i had to explain later,but supercar you hit the nail largely on the the head.ONE thing,is that the 25th dynasty was a golden age for egypt and had more of a benefit did we realize,than what was said on this topic,but it was to really benefit,nubia and the 25th is not egyptian,but they did bring more of a renaissance to egypt that was on the level of the greatest egyptian dynasty.you had demotic,building,trade,some changes in army tactics,greater wealth, written works,great art, costume or clothing fashions and some other things, and that is clear,but after that period,it was a deline for the africans,in egypt,but there were brief times of conquest and ,by africans in egypt,and nubia and many raids from later nubia as well,but i have to say the 25th is my personal favorite,because of the clear all nubian element, after the 25th,the other known african dynasties of egypt are next on my list.Is there a bias on my part?yes,i admit it,but i am giving personal views on this and the facts,and the invaders of egypt,really started it's african deline IN THE END SO FAR,and if it was not for the outsiders,egypt would still be largely african today like the sudan.

[This message has been edited by kenndo (edited 26 July 2004).]

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Originally posted by rasol:
[QUOTE]
Did the Thebean royal family reunite Egypt? Yes. On your second point you forget that the Nubians/Cushites were allied with the Hyksos

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Oversimplification? Saying that the Hyksos united Egypt and Cush is a distortion of the facts. Saying that the 18th dynasty was Nubian in orgin is also a distortion of the facts. The 18th dynasty was rooted in a ruiling family from Thebes. These people were culturally and politically 100% Egyptian.

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"Apepi I (Auserre, c.1600 to 1560) tried unsuccessfully to counter the threat posed by Tao II (Sekenenre) and Kamose (Wadjkheperre) by entering into an alliance with the Kushites who had conquered Nubia. He killed Tao II in battle (though some think that Tao was assassinated), but had to retreat northward before Kamose to the vicinity of Avaris in the delta."

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"Ahmose continued Kamose's expansion into Nubia as far as Buhen (near the second cataract) in an attempt to prevent a recurrence of the incursions of the Kushites, which Upper Egypt had suffered from during the 17th Dynasty. The overseer over these conquered lands became one of the most important people in Egypt and was given the title of "Son of the King"."

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Originally posted by rasol:

[QUOTE]In hindsight, the Hyksos invasion of the Delta was beneficial. Bringing new technology and culture from Asia, the Hyksos helped ignite the resurgence of Egypt's power in the 18th dynasty.

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Oversimplification? Saying that the Hyksos united Egypt and Cush is a distortion of the facts.

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Saying that the 18th dynasty was Nubian in orgin is also a distortion of the facts. The 18th dynasty was rooted in a ruiling family from Thebes. These people were culturally and politically 100% Egyptian.

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Apples and oranges. Not to mention the fact that the Hyksos rule lasted about 150 years.

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about which you've been able to tell us what we already know, namely that they introduced Kemet to the compound bow and chariot (the hard way), and little else.

oh, they either brought law and order to the country, or...depending on what self contradictory argument you need to make....they didn't go much futher than the Delta even though they claimed to rule both upper and lower Egypt.

You can't even find coherent rhetoric by which to defend the Hyksos!

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Originally posted by rasol:

[QUOTE] Saying that the 18th dynasty was Nubian in orgin is also a distortion of the facts. The 18th dynasty was rooted in a ruiling family from Thebes. These people were culturally and politically 100% Egyptian.

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How does that counter what I said? It's common knowledge that ethnically, the 18th dynasty was of mixed Egyptian/Nubian ancestry. Still, culturally they were Egyptian, and politically they were definately Egyptian.

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SAID ONE thing,is that the 25th dynasty was a golden age for egypt and had more of a benefit did we realize,than what was said on this topic,but it was to really benefit,nubia and the 25th is not

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The family of the 18th Dynasty, with a great deal of Nubian and Egyptian anscestry, organized an armed rebellion with the help of the Nubian army to chase the Hyksos out of Egypt. The Egyptian population also rebelled against Hyksos domination. When this occurred, the monarchs of the 18th dynasty were firmly back in power. As a result, they transferred the capital of Egypt from Memphis to Luxor, or from lower Egypt to upper Egypt. Most Egyptologists now believe that the 18th dynasty was a black one. Tyre, the queen mother of the 18th dynasty was of distinct Nubian ancestry. - Gregory M. Gordon, Professor/History Grayslake College, Illinois

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Yes, most of the mummies when X-rayed by Kent R. Weeks and Edward Harris did show affinities with Nubians. The dyansty came from southern Upper Egypt where the population today is still very African in apperance. Some have also suggested it might have had a partial Beja origin from the Beja names writen in the tombs. We also know that various people called Nehsi[Nubian] fought alongside Ahmoses in his liberation against the Hykos. Not all Nubians were incopperation of the Hykos,and some did actually help the Wasetan[Theban] royal family. However,the mother of the 18th dyansty was not Tiye but Ahmes-Nefertari. She was most likley of Nubian origin,and early Egyptologist like Petrie called her such.

It's a fine line between Nubian/Egyptian culture which share some common feature but often contrasting differences. Some Egyptologist personally believe that Amun might actually be a Nubia deity alongside with other deities such as Ma'ahmes which was venterated in the Delta city nome of Leontoplis.

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Originally posted by neo*geo:
How does that counter what I said? It's common knowledge that ethnically, the 18th dynasty was of mixed Egyptian/Nubian ancestry. Still, culturally they were Egyptian, and politically they were definately Egyptian.

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uh, sorry, but you were responding to....

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the 18th dynasty was Kemetic/Cushitic in origin.

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trying to clearly separate Egypt from Nubia culturally is.....well...it just leads me back to the question of whether this is even a constructive, accurate division when discussing nile valley civilizations.

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Originally posted by rasol:
about which you've been able to tell us what we already know, namely that they introduced Kemet to the compound bow and chariot (the hard way), and little else.

oh, they either brought law and order to the country, or...depending on what self contradictory argument you need to make....they didn't go much futher than the Delta even though they claimed to rule both upper and lower Egypt.

You can't even find coherent rhetoric by which to defend the Hyksos!

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Unlike you, I'm not distorting the facts. Was the Hyksos invasion violent? In some places yes, in others no. Not all Egyptians stood up to the Hyksos and some welcomed the relative stability they brought to Egypt. From the time of the invasion until the the murder of Seqenere Tao there was little to no resistance against the Hyksos.

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Originally posted by rasol:

But you assure as that we can ignore the views of 18th Dynasty Kemet because they are probably propaganda. lol So, we should trust your views instead. Right, let me move on to other posters in this thread....

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Do remember that I emphasized the word "some" in referring to Egyptian propaganda. Every nation did it. Ancient Egypt was no exception. But as a historian, I seek to be objective and unbiased to I take into account not only what the Egyptians said.

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Originally posted by rasol:
"It's a fine line between Nubian/Egyptian culture which share some common feature but often contrasting differences. Some Egyptologist personally believe that Amun might actually be a Nubia deity alongside with other deities such as Ma'ahmes which was venterated in the Delta city nome of Leontoplis."

trying to clearly separate Egypt from Nubia culturally is.....well...it just leads me back to the question of whether this is even a constructive, accurate division when discussing nile valley civilizations.

as we have just seen re: 18th dynasty...half the time this division just seems to cover up the reality of how completely intertwined Kemet with it's "mother nations" to the South.

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I understand your point but no matter how similar Egyptians and Nubians were culturally and ethnically, they were different enough for them to be two seperate nations during various periods. I think the closest modern comparison to Egypt and Nubia is England and Scotland. However, Nubians and Egyptians spoke different languages.

The problem with saying Nubia and Egypt were united is the fact that Nubia was not united at the time of the 18th dynasty. Nubia was loosely populated and there were several distinct tribes of people who made up the population. They were never a country with a unified ethnicity or defined borders until the late period of dynastic Egypt. Some tribes like the Beja and the Yamites were friendly to Egyptians, others like the Kushites opposed the Egyptians(although they later assimilated and went on to rule Egypt in the 25th dynasty).

This is why it's a distortion to say that Nubia and Egypt were united as early as the 18th dynasty. The land of Nubia itself took quite some time before it actually united...

[This message has been edited by neo*geo (edited 26 July 2004).]

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Was the Hyksos invasion violent? In some places yes, in others no.

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I'm not distorting the facts.

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Do remember that I emphasized the word "some" in referring to Egyptian propaganda. Every nation did it. Ancient Egypt was no exception.

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Originally posted by rasol:
[QUOTE]Do remember that I emphasized the word "some" in referring to Egyptian propaganda. Every nation did it. Ancient Egypt was no exception.

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Would you care to counter my point that all nations engage in propaganda?

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understand your point but no matter how similar Egyptians and Nubians were culturally and ethnically, they were different enough for them to be two seperate nations during various periods

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Originally posted by neo*geo:
[B] Would you care to counter my point that all nations engage in propaganda?

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Originally posted by rasol:
[b]that does not cover up the fact that you denied that the 18th dynasty was of mixed Egyptian/Nubian origins.
So either admit your error, or defend it to the death, but don't think you can run away...your semantics are way too weak for that kind of evasive manouvering.[/B]

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I disagree with the word "origins." And I see that you left out my use of the words "culturally" and "politically." I obviously left open the likelihood that the 18th dynasty was of mixed ancestry.

Just because George Bush's family is ethnically of British origin doesn't mean George Bush isn't 100% American. Yes Thebes is close to Nubia and yes, it was difficult to say where Egyptians ended and Nubians began because physically they held affinities with each other. But knowing how Egyptians felt politically about the Nubians at the time, they might be offended to hear someone say their ruiling family was of Nubian origin. So without taking into account ethnic affinities we can positively say that the 18th dynasty was 100% Egyptian culturally and politically.

If I were to say a dynasty was of Nubian origin I would say the 25th since the kings did come from Napata and returned there when the dynasty ended...

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Originally posted by rasol:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by neo*geo:
[B] Would you care to counter my point that all nations engage in propaganda?

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Would you care to counter my point that you are engaging in propaganda now, and you are laughably bad at it? No? didn't think so.

You make me laugh. It's obvious you can't hold your own in a debate on history. So either make a decent rebuttal or quit wasting space on this thread...

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Unlike you, I'm not distorting the facts. Was the Hyksos invasion violent? In some places yes, in others no. Not all Egyptians stood up to the Hyksos and some welcomed the relative stability they brought to Egypt. From the time of the invasion until the the murder of Seqenere Tao there was little to no resistance against the Hyksos.

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The Wasetan[Theban] family to the south called the northern Hykos rulers ilgeitmate rulers. You can read from the literature from this period that not all of the confrontations in Egypt was a peaceful one. The fact that the Delta region cooperated with the Hykos only shows that around the First Intermediate Period lots of Asiatic people were moving into the Delta. I have explain this many times on the forum that something like the Tales of Sinuhe illustrates that both the Delta and Upper Egypt were distinct as they are today in Egypt. Probabaly in ethnicity as well as language,for it was often very hard for a Delta man to talk to a man from Upper Egypt. The Delta Egyptians around this time might have had more loyalthy towards the Hykos than to the Upper Egyptians.

The patron deity of the Hykos that alinged with their own deity was Set. The patron animal of Set was sometimes a hippo that the southernly Wasetan[Theban] family would often spear. The spearing of the Hippo had some religious significance that started hostility between the Hykos and Wasetan Egyptians. This action to the Hykos consistuted a battle,for which Sequenen Re Tao decided to attack,and later his desendants drove the Hykos out of Egypt. You see the speaing of the Hippo was in defiance of the rulership of the Hykos.

Have you read Manetho,neo*geo? My sugestion to you is read some of what Manetho has to say about the Hykos,but take his words with some salt,for Manetho in the past has been found to be wrong.

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Originally posted by neo*geo:
I disagree with the word "origins."

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Originally posted by rasol:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by neo*geo:
[b] I disagree with the word "origins."

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nonetheless, do continue.....[/B][/QUOTE]

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It's obvious you can't hold your own in a debate on history. So..

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Originally posted by ausar:
You can read from the literature from this period that not all of the confrontations in Egypt was a peaceful one. The fact that the Delta region cooperated with the Hykos only shows that around the First Intermediate Period lots of Asiatic people were moving into the Delta.

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Originally posted by Osiris II:
People!!!! Please!!!!
The topic under discussion is your favorite and least favorite dynasty--not the genetic make-up of any particular dynasty, or to advance your own personal thoughts on racism.
Back to the subject!!!

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Originally posted by ausar:

Have you read Manetho,neo*geo? My sugestion to you is read some of what Manetho has to say about the Hykos,but take his words with some salt,for Manetho in the past has been found to be wrong.

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I've read Mantheo and I have heard that his accounts are not the most accurate. I know I'm getting redundant but here are the positive things the Hyksos did:

- Egyptian religion was respected; Egyptian was the language of government; and many Egyptians served in the administration

- They maintained tribute or trade relations with the Minoans and Babylonians

- They assimilated to Egyptian culture. Egyptian artifacts bearing the name Khyan have been found in Babylon, and Knossos.

- Egyptians acquired new military techniques, such as the use of the horse-drawn chariot and the composite bow. They also began using a new rectangular fortress similar to fortresse found in Jericho.

The most productive King from the Hyksos period was Khyan...

[This message has been edited by neo*geo (edited 26 July 2004).]

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Originally posted by rasol:

For that I would need a debating partner.
You are merely a punching bag, and dunk tank clown rolled into one.
splash(!) down he goes, again. lol.

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You're good with the one liners but obviously bad with reading comprehension. Maybe you should take your historical views on Comic View. I've gotten plenty of laughs out of them here today...

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- Egyptian religion was respected; Egyptian was the language of government; and many Egyptians served in the administration

- They maintained tribute or trade relations with the Minoans and Babylonians

- They assimilated to Egyptian culture. Egyptian artifacts bearing the name Khyan have been found in Babylon, and Knossos.

- Egyptians acquired new military techniques, such as the use of the horse-drawn chariot and the composite bow. They also began using a new rectangular fortress similar to fortresse found in Jericho.

The most productive King from the Hyksos period was Khyan...

[This message has been edited by neo*geo (edited 26 July 2004).]

[This message has been edited by neo*geo (edited 26 July 2004).]

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Neo: when you cut and paste without attribution you are guilty of plagiarism.

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You're good with the one liners

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Originally posted by rasol:
[QUOTE]
- Egyptian religion was respected; Egyptian was the language of government; and many Egyptians served in the administration

- They maintained tribute or trade relations with the Minoans and Babylonians

- They assimilated to Egyptian culture. Egyptian artifacts bearing the name Khyan have been found in Babylon, and Knossos.

- Egyptians acquired new military techniques, such as the use of the horse-drawn chariot and the composite bow. They also began using a new rectangular fortress similar to fortresse found in Jericho.

The most productive King from the Hyksos period was Khyan...

[This message has been edited by neo*geo (edited 26 July 2004).]

[This message has been edited by neo*geo (edited 26 July 2004).]

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* and you've edited it twice with no attribution, so please do not lie about it.
we are not stupid, neo. [/QUOTE]

Good job. I see you're a selective reader. Still waiting for you to defend your assertion that the 18th dynasty was of Nubian origin...

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Originally posted by rasol:
[QUOTE]You're good with the one liners

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And at identifying plagiarism as well, which means you're in a world of hurt.

Why would I be hurt? This is an open forum and people can cut and paste from wherever they choose unless you feel they're making a statement that challenges common knowledge. In that case it's fair to ask for sources. Which no one did. But for you from now on I'll post a link to whatever resources I take from the net...

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This is an open forum and people can cut and paste from wherever they choose

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I understand your point but no matter how similar Egyptians and Nubians were culturally and ethnically, they were different enough for them to be two seperate nations during various periods. I think the closest modern comparison to Egypt and Nubia is England and Scotland. However, Nubians and Egyptians spoke different languages.

The problem with saying Nubia and Egypt were united is the fact that Nubia was not united at the time of the 18th dynasty. Nubia was loosely populated and there were several distinct tribes of people who made up the population. They were never a country with a unified ethnicity or defined borders until the late period of dynastic Egypt. Some tribes like the Beja and the Yamites were friendly to Egyptians, others like the Kushites opposed the Egyptians(although they later assimilated and went on to rule Egypt in the 25th dynasty).

This is why it's a distortion to say that Nubia and Egypt were united as early as the 18th dynasty. The land of Nubia itself took quite some time before it actually united...

[This message has been edited by neo*geo (edited 26 July 2004).]

I disagree.If you get the book,ancient nubia:egypt rival in africa and some others you would see that nubia during the late kerma period was for the most part united and stronger than upper egypt for awhile before the new kingdom in egypt.nubian scholars have admit as well than the nubians of the 25th dynasty, did not assimilated all the way.They kept a great deal of kushite culture,in fact they still remain kushite in culture during the 25th dynasty.as for the greatest dynasty in ancient egypt,for me it is the 18th and 25th,BUT the 25th was nubian AND NOT egyptian so in one sense the 18th should be compared really to other periods of egyptian rule in egypt.The 25th really was for nubian progress in nubia,THAT IS WHY the early rulers of that dynasty stayed in nubia and were buried THERE and the others, were in the end buried in nubia as well,but i narrowed it down it terms of what dynasty of egypt was the greatest anyway.

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disagree.If you get the book,ancient nubia:egypt rival in africa and some others you would see that nubia during the late kerma period was for the most part united and stronger than upper egypt for awhile before the new kingdom in egypt.

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That is the truth.

Just a little support for your point:

"1730 BC, "Hittites"* invaded Egypt. So, many Egyptians emigrated to Nubia.
Nubia had stability and peace while Egypt was under Hittites colonialism.

Ahmos I married the Nubian king's daughter** and he helped Ahmos to expel the invaders. Ahmos, one of Thebes princes, after he had expelled Hittites, became king of Egypt and founded the 18th dynasty. Thus, Thebes became Egypt's capital and Amon Raa' was Egypt's god." http://www.sis.gov.eg/public/magazine/iss007e/html/art08txt.htm

* for Hittite read Hyksos.

** Kemet like Nubia(Cush) was a matriarchy.