Some doctrines of racial supremacy as classically taught in Euro/American institutions, textbooks and media:
PHYSICAL CALIBRATION DOCTRINE: In which white anthropologists treat people as racial specimens, measuring "cephalic indices" and attempting to prove superiority of the "white" brain. Ugly racist terminology: "prognathism," "platyrhiny," "steatopygous," "sub-Egyptian." Mug-shot lineups of "the Veddan female," "Arapaho male, "Negroid type," "Mongoloid specimen" chacterize this approach. Out of favor in the mid-20th-century, it has enjoyed a revisionist comeback with sociobiology and works claiming racial differentials in intelligence, such as "The Bell Curve."
TECHOLOGICAL CALIBRATION DOCTRINE: Insists on forcing archaeological finds as well as living cultures into a grid of "development" based on the use of certain tools, materials and techniques valued by "Western" scholars. Example: "They were a stone age civilization who never discovered the wheel!" Forces cultures into a progressional paradigm: Old and New Stone Ages, Bronze Age, Iron Age, Industrial Revolution, Space Age. This classification ignores the complexity of culture, and the fact that metallurgic technology and military might are not the ultimate measure of advanced culture.
STAGES OF DEVELOPMENT DOCTRINE: The assumption that "primitive" cultures represent lower "stages" in historical evolution, and have yet to attain advanced forms of culture. One English scholar referred to "the child-races of Africa." Usually, social hierarchy, militarization and industrialization are taken as measures of "advanced" civilizations. In the 19th century, scholars openly used the terms "savage," "barbarian," "civilized." Though these offensive words have (mostly) been dropped, the underlying assumptions are still quite influential.
SPREAD OF CIVILIZATION DOCTRINE: Credits all achievements to conquering empires, assuming their superiority in science, technology, and government. Adherents are usually incapable of perceiving advanced earth-friendly systems of land management, agronomy, medicine, collective social welfare networks, healing, astronomical knowledge, or profound philosophical traditions of peoples considered "primitive" by dominant "Western" standards.
PASSING OF THE TORCH DOCTRINE: Claims a chain of cultural transmission from Mesopotamia and Egypt to Greece to Rome to western Europe to the USA, leaving vast gaps where the history of the rest of the world should be. (The discussion never returns to Egypt or Iraq to consider what happened there after the fall of their ancient empires.) Most of the planet's cultures are discussed only in relation to the European conquest, if mentioned at all. As a result, few people have any idea of the history of Sumatra, Honduras, Niger, Ecuador, Mozambique, Ohio, Hokkaido, Samoa, or even European countries such as Lithuania or Bosnia.
IF IT WAS GREAT, IT MUST HAVE BEEN WHITE: If advanced science, art, or architecture is found in Africa or South America, then Phoenecians, Greeks, Celts, Vikings (or, in the extreme case, space aliens) must be invoked to explain their presence. (Here, whiteness often functions as a relative concept, as "lighter than.") This bias gives rise to a pronounced tendency to date American or African cultures later than warranted, and as a result dating is constantly having to be revised further back into the past as evidence of greater antiquity piles up.
Corollary: IF IT WAS WHITE, IT MUST HAVE BEEN GREAT. Thus, the conqueror Charlemagne was a great man, in spite of his genocidal campaign against the Saxons, but the Asian conquerors Attila the Hun and Genghis Khan were simply evil. Stereotypes of head-hunters picture Africans (in the absence of any evidence for the practice) but never Celtic head-hunters in France and Britain -- much less Lord Kitchener making off with the Mahdi's skull in Sudan, or U.S. settlers taking scalps and body parts of Indian people. This doctrine also underlies the common assumption that European conquest must have improved life for subject peoples.
A 19th century French engraving idealizes the conquest of Algeria as a showering of the benefits of superior civilization on abject, genuflecting North Africans.
IF IT WAS NOT WHITE, AND ITS GREATNESS IS UNDENIABLE, THEN IT MUST BE DEPRECATED IN SOME WAY: Example:The Epic of Man, published in the '60s by Time/Life Books, says of the advanced civilization of ancient Pakistan: "It is known that a static and sterile quality pervaded Indus society." It used to be the academic fashion to call ancient Egypt a "moribund" civilization which "stifled creativity." Similar writings dismissed the "Incas" (Quechua) as "totalitarian," or the Chinese as "isolated" and "resistant to change."
The AFRICAN GAP DOCTRINE: After examining the first humans hundreds of thousands of years ago, this historical approach completely skips over most of the African archaeological record. It discusses ancient Egypt but ascribes its civilization to "the Middle East," denying its African identity and archaeological connections with Saharan and southern Nilotic civilizations. Saharan civilization, Ile-Ife or Mwanamutapa are not discussed at all. Africa is simply dropped from historical consideration until the era of European slaving and colonization.
The BERING STRAIT DOCTRINE insists that all indigenous American peoples came across a land bridge between Siberia and Alaska, filtering down through Central America into South America. Problem: numerous archaeological sites in the Americas predate any possible Bering Strait migration by many thousands of years. Access from Alaska to the rest of North America was blocked for millennia by two great ice sheets that covered Canada. An narrow opening that might have allowed passage appeared much too late (about 13,500 years ago) to explain the growing evidence that people were living in both North and South America much earlier than these "first" migrations.
By 1997-98, the tide of opinion began to turn: several scientific conclaves declared that a majority of attending scholars rejected the Bering Strait theory as a full explanation of how the Americas were peopled.The long-doctrinal hypothesis of Clovis hunters as the first immigrants is crumbling before the new dating, as hundreds of pre-Clovis sites pile up: Cactus Hill, Virginia (13,500 BP); Meadowcroft Rock Shelter in Pennsylvania (14,000 - 17,000 Before Present); Monte Verde (12,500 BP); Pedra-Furada, Brazil (15,000 BP, and possibly as old as 32,000 BP).
Bering Strait diehards discount the oral histories of indigenous Americans, such as Hopi accounts of migrations across "stepping-stones" in the Pacific. In spite of the huge diversity among the American peoples and differences between most Americans and east Asians, all are declared to be of "Mongoloid racial origin." After the initial press stampede declaring "Kennewick Man" to be "white," study of the genetic evidence shows something entirely different. Instead, it appears that there have been several waves of migration: from central China, from the ancient Jomon culture of Japan, from south Asia or the Pacific islands. And "Luzia," an 11,500-year-old female skeleton in Brazil "appeared to be more Negroid in its cranial features than Mongoloid," in the stodgy anthropological terminology of the New York Times (Nov 9, 1999). But there is also a uniquely North American X-haploid group of mitochondrial DNA, which could uphold American Indian traditions of origins in North America.
THE POWER OF NAMING
STEREOTYPING entire peoples as mad, uncontrollable threats: "Wild Indians," "Yellow Hordes" or "the Yellow Peril." As inferior nonhumans: "primitives," "savages," "gooks," "niggers" -- this last term used not only against African-Americans, but also by English colonizers of Egypt and India. Even the word "natives," which originally meant simply the people born in a country and by extension the aboriginal inhabitants, took on heavy racist coloration as an inferior Other.
POLARIZATION: "Scientific thought" vs. "primitive belief"; "undeveloped" vs "civilized"; or "the world's great religions" vs. "tribal superstitions," "cults," "idolatry" or "devil-worship." Depending on where it was created, a sculpture could either be a "masterpiece of religious art" or an "idol," "fetish," or "devil." Few people realize that "Western" scientists did not match the accuracy of ancient Maya calculations of the length of the solar year until the mid-20th century.
Indians who resist colonization and land theft are commonly portrayed as evil in popular media, which applies negative labels such as "Renegades."
RENAMING: Dutch colonists called the Khoi-khoi people "Hottentots" (stutterers). Russians called the northwest Siberian Nentsy "Samoyed" (cannibals). These are blatant examples, but many nationalities are still called by unflattering names given by their enemies: "Sioux" (Lakota); "Miao" (Hmong); "Lapps" (Saami); "Basques" (Euskadi); "Eskimos" (Inuit). European names have replaced the originals in many places: Nigeria, Australia, New Caledonia, New Britain, etc. (But "Rhodesia" bit the dust.)
DEGRADATION OF MEANINGS: "Mumbo jumbo" has become a cliché signifying meaningless superstitions, but it comes from a Mandinke word -- mama dyambo -- for a ritual staff bearing the image of a female ancestor. (Look it up in any good dictionary.) "Fetish" now connotes an obsessive sexual fixation, but originated as a Portuguese interpretation of sacred West African images as "sorcery" (feitição). The holy city of Islam is often appropriated in phrases like "a Mecca for shoppers."
DOUBLE-THINK: Conquest becomes "unification," "pacification,""opening up," and conquered regions are dubbed "protectorates." The convention is to use Europe as the standard, writing texts from the viewpoint of the conquerors / colonizers. Thus, a Rajasthani rebellion against English rule was termed the "Indian Mutiny." A peculiarity of this thinking is the tendency to refer to times of bloody invasions and enslavement with respectful affection, as in "The Golden Age of Greece" and "The Glory That Was Rome," or "How the West Was Won." British subjugation of southern Nigeria is recast as The Pacification of the Primitive Tribes of the Lower Niger.
A contributor to Men Become Civilized, edited by Trevor Cairns explains it all to children:
"When the king of one city conquered others, he would have to make sure that all the people in all the cities knew what to do. He would have to see that they all had rules to follow, so that they would live peacefully together."
Double-think finds ways to recast genocide as regrettable but necessary, due to failings of the people being killed, who are somehow unable to "adapt." Distancing the agent is key here, obscuring the violence with the idea that some kind of natural process is at work: "vanishing races," "by that time the Indians had disappeared."
THE POWER OF IMAGES
Hollywood tomtoms beat as fake Indians jump up and down, uttering brainless cries and grunts. There's the "squaw" complex in literature and cinema, the faithful Indian sidekick, and Robinson Crusoe's "Man Friday." John Wayne as the Western movie hero, saying: "There's humans and then there's Comanches." Or in real life, justifying settler theft of Indian countries: "There were great numbers of people who needed new land, and the Indians were selfishly trying to keep it for themselves."
This picture appeared in an ad for insurance. Advertising is an important transmitter of historical misrepresentation. It draws on colonial mythologies such as the notion that the Dutch "bought" Manhattan for the equivalent of $24 in trade goods --in spite of the fact that the Indians did not think of land as something that could be sold. The role of violence (including massacres after which Staten Island settlers played football with Wappinger heads) is obliterated.
Tarzan goes up against witch doctors and eye-rolling African chiefs. The Caribbean shown as full of fearful, superstitious natives and zombies, Arabs who have nothing to do all day but loll around in harems, or cheat the white hero. Seductive Suzie Wongs, thieving Mexicans, and shiftless and sexually insatiable African-Americans. Movies depicting the Chinese as obsequious and deceitful, Arabs as treacherous, Africans as ignorant and barbaric.
COUNTERPOINT
The Mande were farming millet and other crops in West Africa in 6500-5000 BCE.
Temples in Peru and India are much older than the Parthenon.
People in Mississippi, Illinois and Mexico traded with each other and exchanged ideas and symbols, as the the sea-faring Ecuadorians did with Costa Rica and western Mexico.
A small-statured Black people built the oldest civilization in southeast Asia, leaving megalithic temples and statuary in south India, Cambodia, Sumatra and other Indonesian islands.
Archaeology shows that the formative influences on ancient Egypt came from Sudan and the Sahara, not the "Middle East."
The oldest megalithic calendar in the world has recently been discovered in the Egyptian Sahara, dating back to 7000 years ago. European megaliths (which spread from the south) may have an African origin.
Polynesian mariners had begun navigating by the stars and settling the vast ocean expanses of the Pacific islands before the time of Moses.
WHAT IS DEFINED AS HISTORY?
In the last half century the boundaries of "acceptable" history have been expanded by a multidisciplinary approach, including sources previously dismissed: orature (oral tradition), linguistics, anthropology, social history, art, music and other cultural sources. More recently, the social locations of historians have come under consideration as a factor shaping their perspectives, along with a sense that there is no absolutely "objective" view of history. Past claims of objectivity have biases clearly visible today, notably in siding with European settlers and slavers against non-christian cultures, and the almost total eclipse of female acts and experience from historical accounts.
A reader who might react negatively to a blatant expression of racism often misses perceiving one cloaked in scholarly language, in assumptions, judgements and misinformation most people have not been educated to catch. It does not occur to many people to question a pronounced overemphasis on Europe, the smallest continent (actually, a subcontinent of Asia.) If a chapter or two on African and Asian history is inserted in a textbook, publishers go ahead and call it a world history. Typically, media depictions of history have not caught up with information now available in specialized academic sources, and continue to present the old stereotypes and distortions as fact.
BARBARIANS AT THE GATES
In the early '90s a hue and cry was raised in the national media against "multiculturalism." It threatened the very foundations of Western Civilization, explained an outpouring of magazine articles and newspaper columns which shed much heat but little light. A Newsweek cover blared: "THOUGHT POLICE: There's a 'Politically Correct' Way to Talk About Race, Sex and Ideas. Is This the New Enlightenment -- Or the New McCarthyism?" As if this wasn't heavy-handed enough, it adds a warning, "Watch What You Say." (December 24, 1990)
"In U.S. classrooms, battles are flaring over values that are almost a reverse image of the American mainstream. As a result, a new intolerance is on the rise." William A. Henry III, "Upside Down in the Groves of Academe", Time Magazine, April 1, 1991
"'It used to be thought that ideas transcend race, gender and class, that there are such things as truth, reason, morality and artistic excellence, which can be understood and aspired to by everyone, of whatever race, gender or class.' Now we have democracy in the syllabus, affirmative action in the classroom. 'No one believes in greatness.' Bate says mournfully. 'That's gone.'" Op-Ed, New York Times Magazine, by Gertrude Himmelfarb, June 5, 1991
"If there is insufficient authentic African culture to meet the demands of self-esteem, then culture must be borrowed from ancient Egypt. No black pharaohs? A few must be invented. Not enough first-rate women poets? Let second-raters be taught instead." James Kilpatrick, "Poisoning the Groves of Academe," San Francisco Chronicle, April 15, 1991
The assumption that were are no great women poets, no black pharaohs, no other greatness than the usual diet of "Western Civilization" is so ingrained that it is regarded as incontrovertible. Protesting the monochrome, all-male landscape of classic pedagogy becomes "intolerance." But what then are we to call the refusal to open up media and educational horizons to the full spectrum of human achievement?
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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By the way, this has a lot to do with ancient Egypt, as for how that civilization as well as others throughout the world have been taught by the West!
[This message has been edited by Djehuti (edited 10 March 2005).]
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Every ounce of modern civilization now in third world nations was brought there by the British Empire of american corporations. Thats not racism it is simply a fact. When the global frontier opened around 1500 Europe began to spread modernism around the globe. It is a process that is reaching maturity today and is accepted as gospel by historians everywhere.
Posts: 5822 | From: USA | Registered: Jan 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Horemheb: Every ounce of modern civilization now in third world nations was brought there by the British Empire of american corporations. Thats not racism it is simply a fact. When the global frontier opened around 1500 Europe began to spread modernism around the globe. It is a process that is reaching maturity today and is accepted as gospel by historians everywhere.
I never said it wasn't a fact! The British Empire was just that, an empire. They colonized countries around the world. Yes, in the end they may have helped these nations by introducing more advanced technology, but do you really think that was their purpose was to help the natives?
No, their purpose was to help themselves! What you don't understand is that many of the native economies of these colonized countries suffered because of the colonization, and the only way the natives could succeed was by depending on their colonizers.
But this is not the purpose of this thread. The sole purpose of this thread is to educate peoples, especially whites like yourself, about the major biases of so-called Western History. This topic goes out especially to you "Horemheb," since you yourself seem to be caught up in all the nonsense that this article exposes.
You actually claimed that there was no such thing as Eurocentrism and that it was made up by "black radicals," when the facts are that almost all groups of people are ethnocentric regardless of race or creed. Many peoples have seen themselves as the center of the world, but Europeans of all people are guilty of this, since recently in history they gained world power and pre-eminence. "Black-radicals" of the 20th century U.S. weren't the first ones to realize this. Black peoples everywhere in the Americas and in Africa, aboriginal Australians and it's not just black people but peoples in the Middle-East, Central Asia, South Asia especially India, China, basically all people of color!! And that's a lot of people. Even white Westerners have recently become aware of their racial and cultural bias.
In actuality it's really silly to deny Eurocentrism yet acknowledge the existence of racism! That's because racism and white supremacy is a direct product of Eurocentrism. To deny Eurocentrism but acknowledge racism, is like denying that a child has ever had parents.
The main thing is that what you apparently don't understand is this is not an "attack" on the West or some "bashing" on the West as you and others like you are fond presuming. This is more like an attack on the past and continuing mistakes of racial and cultural bias, both in history as well as in social practices! I do not "hate" the West or Westerner, because I myself live in West as a Westerner. I live in the greatest nation in the world, the good old US of A and am proud of it!! I acknowledge that the "West" was founded by white Europeans and, in fact, I am also grateful for all the achievements and positive things those Europeans have done! The U.S. has gives me freedom that many countries in the world do not allow. It was white men who came up with these ideals that have been made a reality for many (but with harder work for some.) What I denounce are the negative and overall wrong impacts the West has had and am hoping we, as Westerners can improve them!
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Djehuti, Some very good writing, I must say. I think you are a very idealistic man, and that is not all bad. I'm leaving for the weekend and I want to continue this discussion on Monday. Let me leave you with this thought: *** when in the history of the human race has the stronger power, anywher on the globe, not tried to dominate the weaker? the left in the west has a major philosophical flaw and it goes to the heart of your concerns.....can man be perfected from an ethical standpoint. History tells us that it cannot. I suggest reading 'The Prince' by Machavelli ... that is the way humanity has always worked and always will. Its not pretty but its true. Posts: 5822 | From: USA | Registered: Jan 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Horemheb: Djehuti, Some very good writing, I must say. I think you are a very idealistic man, and that is not all bad. I'm leaving for the weekend and I want to continue this discussion on Monday. Let me leave you with this thought: *** when in the history of the human race has the stronger power, anywher on the globe, not tried to dominate the weaker? the left in the west has a major philosophical flaw and it goes to the heart of your concerns.....can man be perfected from an ethical standpoint. History tells us that it cannot. I suggest reading 'The Prince' by Machavelli ... that is the way humanity has always worked and always will. Its not pretty but its true.
What you say is true!
Throughout human history, people regardless of race have sought power and domination, and unfortunately this was attained by subjegation and oppression other peoples. The problem is that some Afrocentrics who claim that such attitudes are solely those of Europeans, when in fact, many peoples throughout the world are guilty of it even some Africans!
[This message has been edited by Djehuti (edited 11 March 2005).]
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Interesting observations but do you think history should have a moral dimension. If not, then do you make a distinction between killing a human being and killing a mosquito? Or do you think that seizing a piece of land to plant crops that is already used by birds and wild goats is no different than doing the same to humans?
If you think that history has a moral dimension then how would you have liked to have been one of the millions slaughtered and captured by the West to make North America, South America, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Kenya, Algeria, etc. to make those lands habitable for "free Westerners"--now awake after a thousand years of slavery?
Finally, if you think history shouldn't have a moral dimension then do you believe that the mistake Germany made during WWII was just to have lost the war? If Germany had won WWII then everything would have been just fine for the Germans and the Holocaust would have only been a minor feature of the war--agree? So do you think that the Holocaust was "just history in motion"? Or Leopold of Belgium's slaughter of 10 million Congolese as "those people were just standing in the way of progress. The Western world just had to have as much rubber as possible for the sake of capitalism and Western econmic growth"?
So do you see any difference between a Germany victorious after WWII and the West(America, Canada, Australia, UK, France, Europe in general...)victorious after its slaughters, enslavements, mineral, resources, and land thefts since 1492? If not, then how do you really feel to be a "man of the West" now?
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Why are some of u so unwilling to separate the "White West" from the behaviour of other groups
.....they have attacked other groups physically and psychologically mercilessly for hundreds of years....call it what it is.
While most sit numb and dumb to what the West does to the world enviroment and non-white people, others act.....like the Chinese for example, because they know full well what the West are about. To combat the west u need to know they are the enemy and will respect nothing but power
If u don't Name and Shame the west for what it is u will be doomed to never break those chains of mental slavery they shackle non-whites with to replace the physical domination they had in the past.
I know what the West means to people that are Non-White......ask a Native American or do they suffer from poor perception of self and widespread alcoholism as a product of their own culture.....ask some other indigenous peoples what the West did to their culture........and still does on a psychological level.......or do u think all those black men in the USA are in Jail because of the genetics of blackness thats leads them to jail in far greater numbers than any other group?
quote:Originally posted by Obenga: Why are some of u so unwilling to separate the "White West" from the behaviour of other groups
.....they have attacked other groups physically and psychologically mercilessly for hundreds of years....call it what it is.
While most sit numb and dumb to what the West does to the world enviroment and non-white people, others act.....like the Chinese for example, because they know full well what the West are about. To combat the west u need to know they are the enemy and will respect nothing but power
If u don't Name and Shame the west for what it is u will be doomed to never break those chains of mental slavery they shackle non-whites with to replace the physical domination they had in the past.
I know what the West means to people that are Non-White......ask a Native American or do they suffer from poor perception of self and widespread alcoholism as a product of their own culture.....ask some other indigenous peoples what the West did to their culture........and still does on a psychological level.......or do u think all those black men in the USA are in Jail because of the genetics of blackness thats leads them to jail in far greater numbers than any other group?
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lamin, history not only does not have a moral dimension, it cannot have one. Read 'The Prince' and you will gain a more accurate understanding of the way the world works in all societies in all times.
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quote]lamin, history not only does not have a moral dimension, it cannot have one. [/quote]
Morality is a fundamental component of intelligence. Lacking morality one lacks intelligence. Actually explains quite a bit in your case, and giving you a copy of Machiavelli's the Prince - is like giving a firecracker to a retarded child.
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Intelligence is understanding the enviorment you live in and dealing with it. Obviously not much of that is going on here. This utopian crap you guys are latching will produce predictible results. get an education that results in a more REALISTIC of the world you live it. nobody cares that you are black and have issues with life.
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Horemheb, I am quite disturb by your way of thinking. I find it way too pessimistic! Although I agree with certain ideas found in The Prince. You must understand that it can be unhealthy to go by the Machiavellian philosophy and way of thinking alone! For millenia, human societies have lived by other means and methods that were not only democratic but also involved little strife.
Also this thread is not about the ways of power, but the fact that history has been misinterpreted time and again by the West due to biases.
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Here it is again for professor Hore and anyone else that missed it or have forgotten!...
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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How has history been misinterpreted? Look, Since 1500 Europeans have been the dominant cutural center in the world. They have literally created the modern world we live in today. You cannot spin it anyother way. We can spend hours talking about all the reasons why it happened the way it did but the fact is, it happened. This is not a racial matter, its a cultural matter. American Indians lost North America because in a clash between two cultures the stronger culture won....AS THEY ALWAYS DO. You have turned a historical fact into an obsession.
[This message has been edited by Horemheb (edited 28 September 2005).]
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WOW!! Interesting points. Everybody stated some fundamental truths, but concerning Europeans, I wonder if they believe that they will, in time reap what they have sown????????
I wonder if we will be a little more mercifull the next time around, when the rolls are turned.....
Posts: 303 | From: Inside my Mind | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Horemheb: How has history been misinterpreted? Look, Since 1500 Europeans have been the dominant cutural center in the world. They have literally created the modern world we live in today. You cannot spin it anyother way. We can spend hours talking about all the reasons why it happened the way it did but the fact is, it happened. This is not a racial matter, its a cultural matter. American Indians lost North America because in a clash between two cultures the stronger culture won....AS THEY ALWAYS DO. You have turned a historical fact into an obsession.
[This message has been edited by Horemheb (edited 28 September 2005).]
actually the american indian lost for the same reason Africans were enslaved......
GUN POWDER..........THE MUSKET.....and the mass production thereof.........
even then they were freed from their renewed state of catatonia by the moors (Afrasians) - twice enlightened......with their first universities and even running water....even windows at their homes were brought during the dark ages from afar...not to mention bathing.....(lol)
[This message has been edited by AFROCENTRIST32 (edited 28 September 2005).]
quote:Originally posted by AFROCENTRIST32: actually the american indian lost for the same reason Africans were enslaved......
GUN POWDER..........THE MUSKET.....and the mass production thereof.........
even then they were freed from their renewed state of catatonia by the moors (Afrasians) - twice enlightened......with their first universities and even running water....even windows at their homes were brought during the dark ages from afar...not to mention bathing.....(lol)
[This message has been edited by AFROCENTRIST32 (edited 28 September 2005).]
"history not only does not have a moral dimension"
For distortionists and eurocentrists......of course not
"Intelligence is understanding the enviorment you live in and dealing with it."
not intelligence is ones ability to think critically and rationally - something many of us don't seem to be able to do.
"Obviously not much of that is going on here. This utopian crap you guys are latching will produce predictible results."
assimilation and degradation of the other cultures of the world at the hand of Europeans is coming to an end - hence the awakening of so many africans to their true past.......
"get an education that results in a more REALISTIC of the world you live it. nobody cares that you are black and have issues with life."
great point..........I'll continue what should have been written next......
Certainly not those openly attack your culture; but more-so those who claim to have your best interests at heart. those who claim to be on your side.... (lol) The reality is that those of us who know are responsible to relay that information to our youth......even if they don't believe at first.....for it is imperative that we at the very least spark an interest in investigating some of the claims we make...............
quote:even then they were freed from their renewed state of catatonia by the moors (Afrasians) - twice enlightened......with their first universities and even running water....even windows at their homes were brought during the dark ages from afar...not to mention bathing.....(lol)
You can also look at as the demise of Africans and the beginning of the Trans-Atlantic slave trade. The Moors only preserved Greco-Roman classics and transported Asiatic technology[irrigation[from Persians],Arabic numerals[really from Hindus],lateen sails[was used in the east before the West].
I am willing to bet that without Moorish intervention that Europeans would have never developed the sea power or developed into the Age of Exploration. Sometimes bringing civlization to people is not always the best. The Moors should have stayed in their own countries and developed them.
Prince Henery the Navigator asked the Moors about where their gold came from,and he told them and showed them exactly where it came from.
Most people don't know that Moors[your heroes] were importing slaves from Timbuktu and other Saharan slave routes. Look up the Trans-Saharan slave route[it did not offically end untill 1950's in Libya]
However, what you are glossing over is the Byzantine Empire. Unlike the Northern-Western Europeans, the Byzantines still had thriving schools and recieved technology and ideas from the east.
Posts: 8675 | From: Tukuler al~Takruri as Ardo since OCT2014 | Registered: Feb 2003
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You can also look at as the demise of Africans and the beginning of the Trans-Atlantic slave trade. The Moors only preserved Greco-Roman classics and transported Asiatic technology[irrigation[from Persians],Arabic numerals[really from Hindus],lateen sails[was used in the east before the West].
I am willing to bet that without Moorish intervention that Europeans would have never developed the sea power or developed into the Age of Exploration. Sometimes bringing civlization to people is not always the best. The Moors should have stayed in their own countries and developed them.
Prince Henery the Navigator asked the Moors about where their gold came from,and he told them and showed them exactly where it came from.
Most people don't know that Moors[your heroes] were importing slaves from Timbuktu and other Saharan slave routes. Look up the Trans-Saharan slave route[it did not offically end untill 1950's in Libya]
However, what you are glossing over is the Byzantine Empire. Unlike the Northern-Western Europeans, the Byzantines still had thriving schools and recieved technology and ideas from the east.
actually (LOL), the moors are not my heroes for exactly the reasons you mentioned.....I spoke in another thread to the severity of pre-European Arab-chattel slavery to which most of the arabized African moors were subjected. their form of slavery was so severe that infact the africans almost ran into the arms of the europeans (figuratively)...
[This message has been edited by AFROCENTRIST32 (edited 28 September 2005).]
quote:Originally posted by AFROCENTRIST32: actually the american indian lost for the same reason Africans were enslaved......
GUN POWDER..........THE MUSKET.....and the mass production thereof.........
even then they were freed from their renewed state of catatonia by the moors (Afrasians) - twice enlightened......with their first universities and even running water....even windows at their homes were brought during the dark ages from afar...not to mention bathing.....(lol)
Gun powder and related technology-- guns, bombs, cannons, etc. were invented in East Asia, specifically by the Chinese!!
The Chinese had the technology but during the age of European conquest, unfortunately the Chinese goverment was going through a period of economic instability and they so they didn't have the army. Europeans soon stormed them using their own weapons!
[This message has been edited by Djehuti (edited 29 September 2005).]
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: Gun powder and related technology-- guns, bombs, cannons, etc. were invented in East Asia, specifically the Chinese!!
The Chinese had the technology but during the age of European conquest, unfortunately the Chinese goverment was going through a period of economic instability and they didn't so they didn't have the army. Europeans soon stormed them using their own weapons!
posted
Chinese Invention of Gun powder isn't as clear cut and absolute as some believe. I posted earlier:
Interesting roots of what became the tool of European imperialism...
Gunpowder:
The Chinese knew gunpowder in the 11th century, but didn’t know the right proportions of getting explosions and didn’t achieve the necessary purification of potassium nitrate. The first Chinese book, which details the explosives proportion, was in 1412 by Huo Lung Ching. [1]
Al-Rammah’s book is the first to explain the purification procedure for potassium nitrate and described many recipes for making gunpowder with the correct proportions to achieve explosion. This is necessary for the development of canons. Partington [ 3] says “the collection of recipes was probably taken from different sources at different times in the author’s family and taken down. Such recipes are described as tested.” Al-Razi, Al-Hamdany, and an Arabic-Syriaque manuscript of the 10th century describe potassium nitrate. Ibn Al-Bitar describes it in 1240. The Arab-Syriaque manuscript of the 10th century gives some recipes of gunpowder. It is assumed that these were added in the 13th century.
The Latin book “Liber Ignium” of Marcus Graecus is originally Arabic (translated in Spain) gives many recipes for making gunpowder the last four of which must have been added to the book in 1280 or 1300. “Did Roger Bacon derive his famous cryptic gunpowder in his Epistola of ca. 1260 from the crusader Peter of Maricourt, some other traveler or from a wide range of reading from Arabic and alchemical books”. References [1], [3], and Joseph Needham, doubt the correctness and effectiveness of the recipe of Bacon.
The German scientist Albert Magnus obtained his information from the “Liber Ignium” originally an Arabic book translated in Spain.
Evidence of the use of gunpowder during the crusades in Fustat, in Egypt, 1168 was found in the form of traces of potassium nitrate. Such traces were also found in 1218 during the siege of Dumyat and in the battle of Al-Mansoura in 1249.
Winter mentions, “the Chinese may have discovered saltpeter (gunpowder) or else that discovery may have been transmitted to them by the Muslims whom they had plenty of opportunities of meeting either at home or abroad. Sarton is referring to Arab-Muslim traders to China, as well as Arab inhabitants in China. As early as 880 an estimated 120,000 Muslims, Jews and Persians liven in Canton alone.”
Canons and Rockets:
There are four Arabic manuscripts (Almakhzoun manuscripts; one in Petersburg, two in Paris and one in Istanbul) in 1320 describing the first portable canon with suitable gunpowder. This description is principally the same as for modern guns. Such canons were used in the famous battle of Ain-Galout against the Mongols (1260).
The Mamlouks developed the canons further during the 14th century.
In Spain, Arabs used canons defending Seville (1248), in Granada 1319, in Baza or Albacete 1324, in Huescar and Martos 1325, in Alicante 1331 and in Algeziras 1342-1344. Partington says, “ the history of artillery in Spain is related to that of the Arabs”.
J.R. Partington mentions, “Arabic accounts suggest that the Arabs introduced firearms into Spain, from where they passed to Italy, from there to France, and finally Germany.”
“The Arabs, in any event, appear to have been the first to inherit (and possibly) originate the secret of the rocket, and it was through Arabic writings, rather than the Mongols -- that the Europeans came to know the rocket. The two notable examples of Arabic knowledge of the rocket are the so-called “self-moving and combusting egg” of the Syrian Al-Hassan Al-Rammah (d. 1294 - 1295), details of which may be found in Willey Ley’s popular “Rockets, Missiles, and Space Travel” and physician Yusuf ibn Ismail Al-Kutub’s description (1311) of the saltpeter (“they use it to make a fire which rises and moves, thus increasing it in lightness and inflammability”). - Frank H. Winter
quote:Gun powder and related technology-- guns, bombs, cannons, etc. were invented in East Asia, specifically the Chinese!!
The Chinese had the technology but during the age of European conquest, unfortunately the Chinese goverment was going through a period of economic instability and they didn't so they didn't have the army. Europeans soon stormed them using their own weapons!
That's not the only innovation that the Chinese introduced. Don't forget the first moveable type[found in Korea],paper currency,and deep oil drilling. Military innovartions like the striup came from either the nomadic Mongols or Chinese.
Windmills can either from ancient India or Persia[Moors brought this to Europe].
Posts: 8675 | From: Tukuler al~Takruri as Ardo since OCT2014 | Registered: Feb 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Horemheb: They have literally created the modern world we live in today. You cannot spin it anyother way.
Oh really? What about the significant African-Americans inventors such as Elijah McCoy, Lewis Howard Latimer, George Washington Carvar, and so forth. Add to that the large number of Asian or African inventors.
The first 'modern' European nations were in the Iberian peninsula; without Moorish, Arab, Indian, and Chinese knowledge, they would have gone nowehre. Besides civilization can't develop in a vacuum, the nations of the 1500 centuries were blessed by the civilization of the past. Many of these civilizations can be found in Africa.
1. The Western civlization is a very late group of civilization. Ancient Greece shouldn't even be included; they were heavily influenced by West Asia and Africa. Ancient Greece should be a part of the Eastern part of the world; just like Armenia. 2. Germanic peoples of Europe were originally considered barbarians. 3. Without the wheel, there would be no car at all.
West, nanely Germany, Great Britain, Western Europe and the US rose not only, because of the whites but also other races. Whether they were inventors, labourers, or slaves does not matter. Just take a closer look at the list of colour inventors, scholars, etc who have greatly contributed to the Western civilization.
quote:Originally posted by AFROCENTRIST32 actually the american indian lost for the same reason Africans were enslaved.
GUN POWDER..........THE MUSKET.....and the mass production thereof.........
What about smallpox?
Posts: 58 | From: Toronto | Registered: Sep 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Idiotic accusation
What exactly is the idiotic accusation about the 5 dollar pretentians?
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Indeed I know Native Americans mainly in USA, Mexico and Brazil, and I have for many years. Do you know any, have you ever participated in any action for Native rights? Are you member of any organisation for the support of Native Americans?
If I know any? Yep, I have been to the Amazon and more.... Now what?
The word is organization not organisation. Btw, I am here addressing injustices done by 5 dollar pretentians, while you are making exuces for these 5 dollar pretentians.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Seems you have even lower EQ. If we now shall discuss each others eventual EQ. You seem unable to understand how some Native Americans view cultural appropriation.
How is that possible when I am addressing "racial injustices", while you are making excuses? That was more illogical diarrhea babble you spewed there.
You seem not to understand that people who have been 5 dollar pretentians are the one who have cultural appropriated Native American culture and history.
You are literally arguing over people who either a) arguing over an hypothesis on social media, b) are mostly unknown individuals and even anonymous, c) do not hold any valid degrees on this matter, not have published any peer reviewed papers.
And yes I agree that it's BS, to take people serious, who are online (mostly anonymous) claiming weird things like we came out of the earth in America etc. Most of these individuals do not even follow any scientific methodology not believe in the consensus.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: You seem only interested in Black peoples perspective.
What is a Black peoples perspective? I have been calling out 5 dollar pretentians, is that a Black peoples perspective?
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: The rest of your post is mostly spam bringing up a lot of things irrelevant for the discussion. Seems you are just out to have a quarrel.
I am not surprised about your position calling it spam, considering it debunked he hell out of you left and right. A man stands on his square and admits defeat, which is the more likely think to do. This tells something about you. Bitchmade?
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Are you jealous that some Native Americans got a very small compensation for some of the land loss and suffering they had to endure? Jealousy is a bitch.
Why would I be jealous that some Native Americans got a very small compensation for some of the land loss and suffering they had to endure? I don't even live in the States, not am I a Black American. By that logic this made nonsense: (Jealousy is a bitch.).
That argument was funny as hell, made no sense but was insensitive at the same time.
quote:By law, Native American tribes, their members, their lands, and their profits are exempt from state taxation without express authorization from Congress.
The issues is that fraudulent 5 dollar pretantians steal these things from people who are actually Native American. For some odd reason you are unable to grasp this? But have the nerve to speak on E.Q.?
quote:The number of Indigenous people in the United States of America is estimated at between 2.5 and 6 million,1 of which around 20% live in American Indian areas or Alaska Native villages. Indigenous Peoples in the United States are more commonly referred to as Native groups. The state with the largest Native population is California; the place with the largest Native population is New York City.
quote:There is no official estimate of how many $5 Indians enrolled. The Dawes Rolls remain a murky and inaccurate snapshot of Native American citizenship. In the 2000 Census, the number of people claiming Cherokee ancestry was 3 times that of the official tribe enrollment.
Tell, why do you hate Black Americans as much as you do. What have Black Americans done to you?
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Well, I bring it up also with those Black people that uphold and promote outdated ideas about Black Olmecs or other Black/African peoples in precolumbian America. You will be hard pressed to find experts on precolumbian cultures promoting such ideas today. Ask an expert like Ann Cyphers if you do not believe me.
Are you saying these white scholars / professors primary scholarly work on cranial metrical data was false or true?
Is Ann Marie Cyphers her observation on the cranial metric in disagreement with the former white / European scholars? That's the quintessential question here. Others have addressed this same question, you seem to avoid for some reason.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: How many archaeologists, anthropologists, geneticists and others specializing in precolumbian Native American cultures do you know?
I am not this invested in this subject outside of this I am more focused on other things like Computer technology. But by your argument there seem to be a consensus on the precolumbian Native American cultures?
What I know pertains more to the topic we talk about here. Like genealogy. However, this is Egyptsearch, so we mostly talk about things that directly relate to African history.
quote:The Arawak community is celebrated on this date in 1500. They are a non-white community of indigenous peoples of South America and the Caribbean.
Specifically, the term "Arawak" has been applied at various times to the Lokono of South America and the Taíno, who historically lived in the Greater Antilles and the northern Lesser Antilles in the Caribbean. All these groups spoke related Arawakan languages. The term Arawak originally was applied by white Europeans specifically to the South American community who self-identified as Arawak, Arhuaco, or Lokono. Their Arawak language is the name of the overall Arawakan language family. Arawakan speakers in the Caribbean were also historically known as the Taíno, a term meaning “relative”.
[...]
The Arawakan languages may have emerged in the Orinoco River valley. They subsequently spread widely, becoming by far the most extensive language family in South America at the time of white-European contact, with speakers located in various areas along the Orinoco and Amazonian rivers and their tributaries. The group that self-identified as the Arawak, also known as the Lokono, settled the coastal areas of what is now Guyana, Suriname, Grenada, Jamaica, and parts of the islands of Trinidad and Tobago. The Spaniards who arrived in the Americas in 1492, and later in Puerto Rico, did not bring women on their first expeditions.
[...]
In the 21st century, these descendants, about 10,000 Lokono, live primarily in the coastal areas of Venezuela, Guyana, Suriname, and French Guiana, with additional Lokono living throughout the larger region. Unlike many indigenous groups in South America, the Lokono population is growing.
quote:“All Native American mtDNA can be traced back to five Haplogroups called A, B, C, D, and X. More specifically, Native American mtDNA belongs to sub-haplogroups that are unique to the Americas and not found in Asia or Europe: A2, B2, C1, D1, and X2a (with minor groups C4c, D2, D3, and D4h3)”
quote:Notwithstanding the general interest and the geopolitical importance of the island countries in the Greater Antilles, little is known about the specific ancestral Native American and African populations that settled them.
In an effort to alleviate this lacuna of information on the genetic constituents of the Greater Antilles, we comprehensively compared the mtDNA compositions of Cuba, Dominican Republic, Haiti, Jamaica and Puerto Rico.
To accomplish this, the mtDNA HVRI and HVRII regions, as well as coding diagnostic sites, were assessed in the Haitian general population and compared to data from reference populations.
The Taino maternal DNA is prominent in the ex-Spanish colonies (61.3%–22.0%) while it is basically non-existent in the ex-French and ex-English colonies of Haiti (0.0%) and Jamaica (0.5%), respectively. The most abundant Native American mtDNA haplogroups in the Greater Antilles are A2, B2 and C1. The African mtDNA component is almost fixed in Haiti (98.2%) and Jamaica (98.5%), and the frequencies of specific African haplogroups vary considerably among the five island nations.
The strong persistence of Taino mtDNA in the ex-Spanish colonies (and especially in Puerto Rico), and its absence in the French and English excolonies is likely the result of different social norms regarding mixed marriages with Taino women during the early years after the first contact with Europeans. In addition, this article reports on the results of an integrative approach based on mtDNA analysis and demographic data that tests the hypothesis of a southward shift in raiding zones along the African west coast during the period encompassing the Transatlantic Slave Trade.
quote:“Thirteen of the 18 haplogroups previously observed in African populations were observed in the African American populations: L1a, L1b, L1c, L2a, L2b, L2c, L3b, L3d, L3e1, L3e2, L3e3, L3e4, and L3f”
quote:“In this context, the Dominican Republic is in line with the observations from other Caribbean and non-Caribbean American regions. All the mtDNA African lineages account for 61% of the maternal haplogroups, with the most frequent mtDNA lineages being the sub-Saharan L1c, L2a, L3b, and L3d, all reaching frequencies higher than 10%.
Y Haplogroup Diversity of the Dominican Republic: Reconstructing the Effect of the European Colonization and the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trades”
posted
The idiotic accusation I talked about was your claim that I do not know any native Americans but only sit and make up stuff. You do not know which people I know, or anything about my personal experiences.
None of the articles you link to prove any African presence in precolumbian Americas (if it is what you wanted to say by posting them). They just show that people have mixed and interacted, and that Natives have been displaced, or diminished in numbers, in certain places.
DNA shows that Olmecs were Native Americans. Anne Cyphers actually states that there has not been any evidence of any African presence during Olmec times. If you would visit some conferences with people studying precolumbian cultures you would find that the majority will agree with her that there is so far no tangible evidence of an African presence. Post contact is another thing since people have mixed and interacted for about 500 years.
I do not hate Black people, I just have reacted on some Black individuals behavior, when they are trying to distort the history of Native peoples.
Do you hate Native Americans?
What is it really that bothers you about me addressing the issue of some Black people who distort Native American history? What is it to you? You said yourself that you are not even African American.
You seem to think it is rather unimportant. Then one can ask If the issue is not important how come that people spend time addressing it? Why do Native Americans and also some African Americans, Latinos and White people go through the trouble of writing books, articles, making videos and debating on social media if it is a question without importance?
Why did people react so strongly over an Olmec head in a mural on African American history? There was even a petition online to try to make the artists remove the Olmec head.
Why would some people protest against that New Mexico university arranged trips for students to Mexico, to try to find African influence among the Olmec heads? Why would anyone protest if they did not find it important?
Why would at least two academics with Native background write a letter to an academic journal asking them to retract an article who promoted the Black Olmec myth? Why would they care if they did not think it was an important question?
-------------------- Once an archaeologist, always an archaeologist Posts: 2683 | From: Sweden | Registered: Mar 2020
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: years.
I do not hate Black people,
Your string of melanophobic posting behavior prove otherwise and seems a typical parallel of the below Swedish MO. You've not said one positive thing about Blacks or blacks and chafe when confronted about it by attempting to excuse your anti-Black rants.
Swedish clothing giant Hennes and Mauritz (HM) said on Thursday it had [only] suspended a team at one of its subsidiaries for using a racist slur in an internal product name. Published: 7 August 2020 07:47 CEST
The product, a beanie hat, was being developed for the H&M-controlled “& Other Stories” fashion chain, which has 70 stores in Europe, the United States and Asia.
“We take the use of racially offensive language extremely seriously. While internal and external investigations are taking place, we have suspended the team and managers responsible for this area of the business,” H&M spokeswoman Ulrika Isaksson said in a statement to AFP.
The product team had used a racist slur in the name for the hat internally, and it had not gone on sale to the public, according to H&M.
Like other companies, the Swedish retail group has been emphasising its anti-racism credentials in response to Black Lives Matter protests, since the killing by police of unarmed black American George Floyd in May.
But it has been accused of racial insensitivity in the past.
[Only a]fter a backlash, H&M issued an apology and withdrew the hoodie from sale. Isaksson said the company was making a number of commitments to “improve the diversity of our teams”, and strengthening “internal controls” on images and texts.
* H&M removes ad over racism accusations
“We have already run training on conscious and unconscious bias for thousands of people across the company. As part of our global inclusion and diversity strategy, this will now become mandatory for everyone,” she said.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: The idiotic accusation I talked about was your claim that I do not know any native Americans but only sit and make up stuff. You do not know which people I know, or anything about my personal experiences.
You are confused over 5 dollar pretendians you know. Those aren't Indians, do you understand that?
quote: The Commission to the Five Civilized Tribes was appointed by President Grover Cleveland in 1893 to negotiate land with the Cherokee.
Will Rogers and his wife, 1935. Will's application to the Dawes Commission in 1900 was accepted, and he was enrolled as a member of the Cherokee Nation.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: None of the articles you link to prove any African presence in precolumbian Americas (if it is what you wanted to say by posting them). They just show that people have mixed and interacted, and that Natives have been displaced, or diminished in numbers, in certain places.
The point was that these are not indigenous to the Americas, but separate. Are trull this dumb, you don't understand this? Good lord, you are dumb as hell.
You are so blinded with your hate for Black Americans and Black people in general, you couldn't grap this.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: DNA shows that Olmecs were Native Americans. Anne Cyphers actually states that there has not been any evidence of any African presence during Olmec times. If you would visit some conferences with people studying precolumbian cultures you would find that the majority will agree with her that there is so far no tangible evidence of an African presence. Post contact is another thing since people have mixed and interacted for about 500 years.
The point of my post was to say that there's not genetic similarity. What part of this do you not understand? Has Black hatred you blinded so deep you count grasp this?
But can you explain if "Anne Cyphers" has ever discredited these white scholars from Europe, who did these discoveries based on primary work where they published their findings?
You seem not being able to answer this question.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Do you hate Native Americans?
This question comes from someone who defends 5 dollar Indians. That's comical.
You have gone from defending 5 dollar Indians, to asking me if I hate Native Americans in the Amazon. Although I have been defending actual Native Americans and separated the fake 5 dollar pretendians from them.
That argument is, that most of what you say made no sense.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: What is it really that bothers you about me addressing the issue of some Black people who distort Native American history? What is it to you? You said yourself that you are not even African American.
As I said before, these few "Black people" got this information from WHITE SCHOLARS.
If you are going to be upset with someone, it has to be WHITE SCHOLARS who have put out these sources and information.
Yes, I said that I and not an African Americans. Why is this so odd to you?
With that being said, why do you even talk about all this history that is not attached to you?
As I said, I have been to the Amazon region and actually met Native Americans. And I do know Black Americans, with whom I grew up as as well as having friends and family in the States.
You are arguing over some unknown and irrelevant people on the internet, social media, who make weird claims. And your argument is that this is more damaging that the billions of dollars 5 dollar Indians steal from actual Indians. Here is where we disagree. I don't take these type of Black people serious as I said, but you spin this lie and narrative as if I am supporting this.
Secondly is that some of these Black Americans have these Native Americans ancestry and have the right not claim it.
quote:
Navajo Radmilla Cody,
Cody is a traditional Navajo recording artist, Indie Award winner, Native American Award nominee, Miss Navajo Nation (1997)
It makes me wonder what all this is to you? lol smh
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: You seem to think it is rather unimportant. Then one can ask If the issue is not important how come that people spend time addressing it? Why do Native Americans and also some African Americans, Latinos and White people go through the trouble of writing books, articles, making videos and debating on social media if it is a question without importance?
Some individuals on social media making unsubstantiated claims, are indeed unimportant.
Why are you worried with some individuals on social media making unsubstantiated claims, but no with 5 dollar Indians? That's weird.
Not only are these 5 dollar Indians culture vultures, but they also steal billions up on billions.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Why did people react so strongly over an Olmec head in a mural on African American history? There was even a petition online to try to make the artists remove the Olmec head.
Because Black Americans history was mudded and confused by white scholars and the government. This was explained not just by me, but by others on here as well.
I did explain this a few times already and I posted actual information for you to see and read. Somehow you ignored this.
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Why would some people protest against that New Mexico university arranged trips for students to Mexico, to try to find African influence among the Olmec heads? Why would anyone protest if they did not find it important?
I have no idea what you are talking about. Perhaps you should ask New Mexico university this question?
quote:Originally posted by Archeopteryx: Why would at least two academics with Native background write a letter to an academic journal asking them to retract an article who promoted the Black Olmec myth? Why would they care if they did not think it was an important question?
Because it's a myth?
You act as if Black Americans started these claims and spread this information about cranial metrics and olmec heads.
You are not well in the head.
Posts: 22234 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
Your string of melanophobic posting behavior prove otherwise and seems a typical parallel of the below Swedish MO. You've not said one positive thing about Blacks or blacks and chafe when confronted about it by attempting to excuse your anti-Black rants.
Swedish clothing giant Hennes and Mauritz (HM) said on Thursday it had [only] suspended a team at one of its subsidiaries for using a racist slur in an internal product name. Published: 7 August 2020 07:47 CEST
The product, a beanie hat, was being developed for the H&M-controlled “& Other Stories” fashion chain, which has 70 stores in Europe, the United States and Asia.
“We take the use of racially offensive language extremely seriously. While internal and external investigations are taking place, we have suspended the team and managers responsible for this area of the business,” H&M spokeswoman Ulrika Isaksson said in a statement to AFP.
The product team had used a racist slur in the name for the hat internally, and it had not gone on sale to the public, according to H&M.
Like other companies, the Swedish retail group has been emphasising its anti-racism credentials in response to Black Lives Matter protests, since the killing by police of unarmed black American George Floyd in May.
But it has been accused of racial insensitivity in the past.
[Only a]fter a backlash, H&M issued an apology and withdrew the hoodie from sale. Isaksson said the company was making a number of commitments to “improve the diversity of our teams”, and strengthening “internal controls” on images and texts.
* H&M removes ad over racism accusations
“We have already run training on conscious and unconscious bias for thousands of people across the company. As part of our global inclusion and diversity strategy, this will now become mandatory for everyone,” she said.
It's obvious this person has issues with Black people, especially Black Americans and is trying to hide it by supposedly supporting Native Americans. However, when 5 dollar pretendians are being brought up, this individual is nowhere to do found.
When reparations for Black Americans is being brought up, that argument becomes: "but what about the Native Americans". Although Native Americans didn't built the USA as we know it. Others and I have explained and shown that Native Americans did receive reparations, although the problem is that 5 dollar pretendians get a large some of this money.
See how this individual has no smoke for the white scholars who have put out all this information and data about the Olmecs.
Posts: 22234 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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posted
This nice summary discussing the many Eurocentrisms of academia needs a good bump every once in a while. (Especially with the dumb provocation thread that just got created about light skin color reconstructed from Abusir genomes [which has already been posted before and which, even if true, is supposed to prove what, exactly?]).
As Martin Bernal pointed out, it can't be overstated the extent to which these 'scientific' institutions are betraying ancient proto-anthro texts and are hostile to Africans (and minorities in general), as Greek and biblical texts putting Egyptians with tropical populations, or the ancient global south, or whatever you want to call it, in terms of dark skin, have been part of the collective memory of white intellectual institutions since the Middle Ages.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
Seems like Djehuti already had a victim mentality back in 2005 ! It is amusing to witness his continuous efforts to depict the present Academic field as a racially exclusive club reminiscent of the early 20th century. However, this is merely a desperate and insincere endeavor to validate his afrocentrist perspectives, while simultaneously suggesting the existence of an obscure and covert academic elite conspiring to inferiorize Africans. Meanwhile the truth is that they either tend to remain neutral or are politically correct due to their white guilt.
Posts: 1779 | From: Somewhere In the Rif Mountains | Registered: Nov 2021
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quote:Originally posted by Swenet: This nice summary discussing the many Eurocentrisms of academia needs a good bump every once in a while. (Especially with the dumb provocation thread that just got created about light skin color reconstructed from Abusir genomes [which has already been posted before and which, even if true, is supposed to prove what, exactly?]).
As Martin Bernal pointed out, it can't be overstated the extent to which these 'scientific' institutions are betraying ancient proto-anthro texts and are hostile to Africans (and minorities in general), as Greek and biblical texts putting Egyptians with tropical populations, or the ancient global south, or whatever you want to call it, in terms of dark skin, have been part of the collective memory of white intellectual institutions since the Middle Ages.
People rage about Afrocentricism and for some good reasons. But Eurocentricism in Academia is more dangerous.
Posts: 1891 | From: NY | Registered: Sep 2014
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posted
^The thing with these scientific institutions is that the technological hegemony of western civilization and its concrete and tangible effects in people's lives (e.g. the potential to raise nations out of poverty, prolong lifespans, cure illnesses, bring social mobility, etc), is drowning out all the ongoing aggressions by these institutions. After all, if you're living in a western country, use western technology (smartphones, etc.), have made capitalism work for you, have invested in western education for more than a decade, what is all the above in the OP going to mean to you? It's going to feel like it's history/in the past.
Thankfully this clean image is now beginning to show cracks as people are becoming more aware of the massive looting of antiquities and other illegal and unethical activities by 'scientific' and educational institutions that are too flagrant, blatantly disrespectful and shocking to put aside as 'done history'.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
Much as I'd like to think academia has improved recently, many of the relevant fields are still dominated by affluent White dudes. Even African Studies, of all disciplines, has been disproportionately dominated by White scholars.
These fields could stand to undergo serious decolonization (e.g. diversification, or at least removing obstacles for minority individuals to become scholars) if we are to see substantial perspective shifts.
posted
Has anyone in this space ever wondered what would have been the case if any of the African samples with Northeast African or Egyptian related ancestry were sequenced and published before the Raqefet Natufian were?
Let me note with a degree of certainty that if:( the Pastoral Neolithic Samples, Taforalt, IAM or Oub02, Skhirat, The ancient Swahili, Kulubnarti and christian Nubian samples, or even Abusir el Meleq.) ..any of these samples were published before the Natufian, a lot would have been different in these spaces.
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That aside I don't think academia has been improved, and with that being said, I don't think the issue is the amount of "white dudes" in academia. For one there are many cultural representatives contributing to these publications. Also, it's inconceivable to me that so much people white or not will enter the field with such bad intentions. I believe its just cumulative bias built from anti-black and anti-African foundation. Part of what hold this "conscious bubble" together nowadays is the almost universal perception of black people as primitive. This is an idea that was bolstered by propaganda and scientific publication starting by at least late 19th century. It is a pervasive idea which is at the stem of even some of the most progressive personalities. And to be honest, the progressive types are the worst as their ideals are often not in a place to be challenged. These guys are like PETA, in the case which the "A" stands for African.
Aside from the bias, I personally believe there is some politics involved. Take it as an anecdote as I can't say anything about it now. But we've likely arrived past a tipping point in which it'd take decades to fix. The Cleopatra thing was pretty much the nail in the coffin as far as public perception goes. And there's a certain idea being pushed to where North West Africans and East Africans will become residual. Afrocentrism takes a lot of public heat but as far as influence goes it's merely a niche. I can't fully explain how the criticisms became more influential than the "movement" but that where we are.
Posts: 1781 | From: New York | Registered: Jul 2016
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posted
^Not sure what would happen in that scenario (too aware of what these people are capable of to be optimistic that it would make a difference), but I do note it's funny how all these factors are working against the transparent and open study of early Egyptian aDNA, with the Egyptian government already having admitted to obscurantist policies as far as closed door aDNA collection.
You'd think Semitic aDNA (early Mesopotamian, early Akkadian?) would be a nice alternative with the Egyptian government withholding test results, but it seems the same factors are at play in the Middle East where Bronze Age DNA has been piling up, but with Semite (ie Egyptian) aDNA somehow not being among the published results. Instead we're told by some, as in Egypt where Abusir genomes bearing foreign Y-DNA J are being passed off as Egyptian, that Y-DNA J bearing Bronze Age Levantines are biologically Semitic (Egyptian) .
The other alternative to early Egyptian aDNA, A-Group Nubians immediately south of the ancient Egyptian border, is currently within modern Egyptian borders, so that door is closed as well.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Swenet: ^The thing with these scientific institutions is that the technological hegemony of western civilization and its concrete and tangible effects in people's lives (e.g. the potential to raise nations out of poverty, prolong lifespans, cure illnesses, bring social mobility, etc), is drowning out all the ongoing aggressions by these institutions. After all, if you're living in a western country, use western technology (smartphones, etc.), have made capitalism work for you, have invested in western education for more than a decade, what is all the above in the OP going to mean to you? It's going to feel like it's history/in the past.
Thankfully this clean image is now beginning to show cracks as people are becoming more aware of the massive looting of antiquities and other illegal and unethical activities by 'scientific' and educational institutions that are too flagrant, blatantly disrespectful and shocking to put aside as 'done history'.
The cracks are definitely showing but is it enough?
Posts: 1891 | From: NY | Registered: Sep 2014
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posted
^The public thinks scientific and educational institutions can do no wrong (white is right, especially if it's wearing a white lab coat). I've already given up hope and have already moved on from academia, so when the scandals came to light recently (e.g. Douglas Latchford, etc), I thought it was positive, but I thought the same thing you're saying. It is what it is.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
I remember that, when I was majoring in Biological Anthropology at UCSD over ten years ago, I wanted to get into academia so I could challenge the Eurocentric narratives on ancient Egypt more effectively. Unfortunately, I couldn't get into grad school since I suck at math and therefore couldn't get past the math section on the GRE test. Though, even if I had, I don't know how much influence I would have had on the field anyway. I've never been a great debater anyway.
Aside from the bias, I personally believe there is some politics involved. Take it as an anecdote as I can't say anything about it now. But we've likely arrived past a tipping point in which it'd take decades to fix. The Cleopatra thing was pretty much the nail in the coffin as far as public perception goes. And there's a certain idea being pushed to where North West Africans and East Africans will become residual. Afrocentrism takes a lot of public heat but as far as influence goes it's merely a niche. I can't fully explain how the criticisms became more influential than the "movement" but that where we are.
If anything Afrocentricism(or hoteps) gets clowned/made of by other Black people in the Black community. Yet, non-Black Americans(mainly the non-Black ones) think its some huge force in the Black community.
Yea you'll have some Black Americans who will be like, "mAn... eGyPt iS iN aFrIkA! hOw cAnT tHe aNciEnTs bE bLaCk!?" but outside of that most keep it moving and don't even care about the deep stuff most Afrocentrics talk about.
Posts: 1891 | From: NY | Registered: Sep 2014
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A 19th century French engraving idealizes the conquest of Algeria as a showering of the benefits of superior civilization on abject, genuflecting North Africans.
Indians who resist colonization and land theft are commonly portrayed as evil in popular media, which applies negative labels such as "Renegades."
This picture appeared in an ad for insurance. Advertising is an important transmitter of historical misrepresentation. It draws on colonial mythologies such as the notion that the Dutch "bought" Manhattan for the equivalent of $24 in trade goods --in spite of the fact that the Indians did not think of land as something that could be sold. The role of violence (including massacres after which Staten Island settlers played football with Wappinger heads) is obliterated.
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