posted
By JUDY DEMPSEY Published: October 18, 2009
BERLIN — Culture lovers, visitors and the city authorities of Berlin were reveling in the reopening Friday of the Neues Museum in the heart of the German capital by Chancellor Angela Merkel, the culmination of decades of efforts to renovate a special site destroyed during World War II.
But the celebrations have been marred by a growing dispute between the German and Egyptian governments about the star of the show: the 3,300-year-old limestone and stucco bust of Queen Nefertiti, a wife of Pharaoh Akhenaten.
The Nefertiti sculpture has been in Germany since 1913. But it is only now that Egypt is demanding that this fragile and haunting object, perched alone in a domed room that overlooks the length of the museum, be returned.
The Egyptian antiquities chief, Zahi Hawass, told the German media over the past few days that Nefertiti belonged to his country.
In interviews with Kölner Stadt-Anzeiger and Spiegel Online, Mr. Hawass said that an official investigation had begun into how Nefertiti arrived in Germany. “If she left Egypt illegally, which I am convinced she did, then I will officially demand it back from Germany,” he said in both interviews.
It was the first time that Egypt had made an official request for the statue to be returned if it was found to have been illegally removed from Egypt.
The comments from Mr. Hawass came just weeks after the Culture Minister Faruq Hosni of Egypt complained bitterly about his failure to be elected as the new director general of Unesco, the United Nations culture agency based in Paris.
Once considered a front-runner for the post, Mr. Hosni stirred controversy because of remarks made in 2008, when he told the Egyptian Parliament that he would that he would personally burn any Israeli book found in an Egyptian library.
Even though he distanced himself from that remark during his effort to become the first Arab to run Unesco, the United States, France and Elie Wiesel, a prominent survivor of Auschwitz, said his appointment would bring shame to the global community.
A German Foreign Ministry official would not say how Germany had voted. “It is secret,” said the official, who asked not to be identified because of the sensitivity of the issue. She said that there was “no connection between the Egyptian request to have Nefertiti returned and the outcome of the Unesco vote.”
Days after the defeat of Mr. Hosni, Mr. Hawass accused France of stealing antiquities and insisted that they be returned. He referred to five painted wall fragments dating to the Pharoahs which ended up in Paris at the Louvre Museum in 2000 and 2003.
After Egypt threatened to suspend cooperation for exhibitions organized with the Louvre, as well as any work conducted by the Louvre on the Pharaonic necropolis of Saqqara, south of Cairo, the French culture minister, Frédéric Mitterrand, said that his country was ready to return the antiquities if they had been stolen.
German art experts deny that Nefertiti was taken out of Egypt illegally.
“The documentation exists. The arrangements were agreed. The process was legal,” said Monika Grütters, an art history professor, legislator and a leading cultural expert in Mrs. Merkel’s Christian Democratic Union party.
“There was a complete understanding about what would remain in Egypt and what would be taken to Germany,” Mrs. Grutters said by telephone. “Maybe there is a bit of jealousy on the part of Egypt over Nefertiti. In any event, I am not so sure Egypt has the best conditions for this statue,” she added. “And because it is so fragile, I am not sure the statue can even be flown. We have excellent conditions here in Germany.”
Mr. Hawass alleged that the Egyptian officials may have been misled about how Nefertiti had been taken to Germany in 1913. According to the German newsmagazine Der Spiegel, there exists a document written in 1924 explaining how the secretary of the German Oriental Company, which was involved in the region, gave an account of a meeting in 1913 between a senior Egyptian official and the German archaeologist Ludwig Borchardt. Mr. Borchardt had found the bust during a dig in 1912.
According to the document, the secretary was present at the meeting, which had been called to divide the spoils of a dig between Germany and Egypt. Mr. Borchardt, the witness noted, “wanted to save the bust for us.” Perhaps intentionally, the bust was not shown in the best light.
Hermann Parzinger, the head of the Prussian Cultural Heritage Foundation, which oversees Berlin’s museums, told journalists ahead of the opening of the galleries that he was confident that Nefertiti’s place in Germany was secure.
The Neues Museum was for years a derelict, bomb-scarred shell. Situated in the former East Germany, it was left in its war-torn state because of the lack of funds. Nefertiti and thousands of other items have now been returned to their former home for the first time. It was only after the reunification of Germany in 1990 that Berlin city authorities, with substantial support from the federal government, could embark on a huge renovation of cultural sites, which has drawn more tourists to the city.
The neoclassical architecture of the museum, which has been recognized as a Unesco world heritage site, has been given a modernist touch by the British architect David Chipperfield. In his €233-million, or $347 million, redesign, he left some of the historic decay untouched. The original columns still show fire damage.
posted
How do you know?? Have you inspected the the Nefertiti bust in person??
Please support your statement of being 'non-authentic'.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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Tigeress!!! Please keep up! He is refer to the recent news of it not being a "true" representation of the Queen. Although it may authentic AE art.. . . underneath.
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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Whatbox does not know Tiger. he is just putting out the same ignorant babble you hear from these other black Egypt morons.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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And so what? It's a simple claim that's all, there is no proof. People are making claims all day long - whether true or not.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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deleted - saw that WBox responded..
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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Exactly tiger. the bust is not considered a fake anywhere but here on Egyptsearch. These guys lock onto an article that fits their PRECONCIEVED position and from then on it is gospel. they photoshop pictures to make them look negroid and accuse everyone else in academia of dishonesty. The truth is, as I have said, they are in the computer lab of a mental institution. Just as nutty as a christmas cake. The Nefertiti bust will conti nue to be seen as one of the great Egyptian works of art.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Exactly tiger. the bust is not considered a fake anywhere but here on Egyptsearch.
You big dummy, the outer facade is a fake, the original inner face was discovered under the outer facade during a CT scan of the Berlin bust, sorry if that disappoints you but that's just what it is.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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Incorrect as usual. The bust is NOT considered to be incorrect. If you found an article saying the world was flat you might believe it. Again, we have a group of black kids here who run around looking for anything they can find to uphold an ALREADY ARRIVED AT POSITION. You morons were saying the bust was fake long before the article on the CT scans. The problem is, how do you educate a comeplete goofball? One article does not create an established position. How you guys dress yourself in the morning is beyond me. It takes multi studies and a generally accepted thesis to establish a position. You do not have either one in this case.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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It iss not about ideas Bogle, it is about understanding how to use information in a scholarly way. This is why nobody in academia takes you guys seriously.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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No, you're incorrect and dishonest as usual, since nobody said the bust was fake, so you're arguing against something that was never said here. What has been noted in this thread is that there is an inner face which was detected through a CT scan.
You say people have been saying the bust was a fake well before the CT scans revealed this, yes I know, and guess what? Now, they're actually proven to be correct, and this bothers you deeply, yes I know.
It doesn't take multiple studies to reveal what one did, showing the marked differences between the inner face (which would have been taken directly from the Queens face) and the outer facade. Lol.
quote:Using the latest computer tomography techniques developed for medicine, the researchers from Berlin's Imaging Science Institute took a series of scans of the bust and discovered that the sculpture was made up of a limestone core covered in layers of stucco of varying thickness. Advances in CT technology meant that they were able to probe deeper than a previous scan carried out in 1992. They found that the inner facial cast, which would have been taken directly from the queen's face, differed significantly from the outside of the bust. It had less prominent cheekbones; a slight bump on the ridge of the nose; marked wrinkles around the corner of the mouth and cheeks; and less depth at the corners of the eyelids.
^^Ignore the above if you want hammerhead, but you only show your ignorance by doing so....
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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This study does not prove anything. What does it take to make a dent in your bone head? One study does not establish anything....it is just that a study, one of hundreds dealing with the bust. Further there is no accepted scholarly view that this bust is a fake except in your peanut head.
You do not even understand the basic system that filters academic information and if you cannot do that you are lost, which is obvious. You give more fodder to those who say negroids have a lower collective IQ by showing that you cannot learn.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Hammer: This study does not prove anything.
Lol the study clearly reveals through CT scans that the inner face (which would have been taken directly from the Queens face) and the outer facade has marked differences.
It doesn't take a theory for CT scans to note this, what needs a theory would be why this is so, why does the inner face show marked differences compared to the outer facade?
The rest of your post is the same old bigoted ad hominem fallacies you're always reduced to when you know that you're wrong, which of course further elaborates and speaks to the ignorance on your part.
Posts: 6572 | From: N.Y.C....Capital of the World | Registered: Jun 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Hammer: This is why nobody in academia takes you guys seriously.
Oh really, then why do they waste time writing all those books, articles, journals etc attacking "Afrocentric" scholarship? Red neck you make no god dam sense as usual.
Posts: 4254 | From: dasein | Registered: Jun 2009
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Guys the question is who, when . . . and maybe why.
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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ROTFLOL @ the Texan trailer trash getting his ass beat again!
He claims the images above were "photoshopped" by 'Afrocentrics' when they were the exact images taken the CT scan at the Berlin Imaging Science Institute!! Unless he wants to argue that black Afrocentrics of Germany forged those pics. Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: Guys the question is who, when . . . and maybe why.
If you are asking about the Nefertiti bust being forged or rather covered up, then the when would be back in 1912 when the bust was first discovered, the who would probably be Ludwig Borchardt, the German Egyptologist who first 'discovered' it as even his peers suggested he did some of the painting himself, and the why?... Obviously to white-wash ancient Egypt, as there are dozens of incidences of artifacts being altered to look more 'white' or forged entirely. Remember, it was only recently that the statuette of 17th dynasty matriarch was deemed a fake even though its been in museums for decades!
But getting back to the topic of this thread, Egypt has demanded the return of the bust for like the past several years now. The question is when are they actually going to get it?
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Yeah! Yeah! But wasn't there a report that said the overlay was done during dynastic times which is something AE does. . . like renaming statues.
In other words. . .is it a fake when/if it was done during dynastics times.
Hence the question. . .who, when. . . .why? followed by. . .does it matter?
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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"Oh really, then why do they waste time writing all those books, articles, journals etc attacking "Afrocentric" scholarship? Red neck you make no god dam sense as usual."
There is no such thing as "afrocentric scholarship." They attack afrocentrism much as they would people who believe in a flat earth or UFO's.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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^ That makes no sense whatsoever since Asian is not a color like white or black, and Hebrews did originate in Asia as their writings and other historical documents claim.
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Hammered: There is no such thing as "afrocentric scholarship." They attack afrocentrism much as they would people who believe in a flat earth or UFO's.
Of course there is such thing as afrocentric scholarship the same way there is eurocentric scholarship. Though I don't see the illogic in being afrocentric about Egypt since Egypt is IN Africa. Or did you forget that geographic fact, 'professor'?
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: ^ That makes no sense whatsoever
Yeh, just shows how stupid you are Mary no wonder you flipped on your "Asian" Hebrews. Posts: 4254 | From: dasein | Registered: Jun 2009
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Djehuti, Your demented view of history makes another faulty assumption. What does being in africa have to do with the racial composition of Egypt? That is like saying that only sunflowers can grow in Mrs. Smith's garden. While Egypt is in Africa it is a near eastern nation as it always has been. Canada and Mexico are both in North America but hardly the same.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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Typical insular thinking!!!! about 200 yrs ago Canada, USA and Mexico was made of one group of people with different ethnicities.
Infact ALL of the Americas were made up of ONE group of people.
What . . .an entire continent(over 1 million sq miles????)of one group of people.
Sounds familiar. . . . . hint (Africa)
Modern Technology, extermination changed that!!!
Idiotic analogy!!!
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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^ Not only idiotic, but hypocritical as well. It's like asking what does being in Europe have to do with the racial composition of Greece?? Nobody denies that Classical Greeks were 'white', yet nobody also denies that being in Europe has everything to do with that also. Moreover, Greece while being in Europe is right next to the Near East and is proven to have cultural influence and roots in the Near East than does Egypt, yet why is Greece not considered a 'Near Eastern' nation??
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Bogled-butt: Yeh, just shows how stupid you are Mary no wonder you flipped on your "Asian" Hebrews.
Nope. It shows just how stupid YOU are since again, Asian is not a color. And all historical and every other info shows Hebrews were Levantine Asiatics. I don't know why you have such a problem with that, just like you do with the fact that you and your European people have African admixture. Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: Hebrews were Levantine Asiatics.
Asiatics? I thought you said "that the Arabian peninsula and Levant all the way of to the Zagros is geologically part of the African plate...I acknowledge that that Semitic language and culture is also African"
But I guess old habits die hard little Manila whore.
quote:Greece while being in Europe is right next to the Near East and is proven to have cultural influence and roots in the Near East
Again, nice try, but the cultural influences and roots of Greece are south in Africa.
Posts: 4254 | From: dasein | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: [qb] Asiatics? I thought you said "that the Arabian peninsula and Levant all the way of to the Zagros is geologically part of the African plate...I acknowledge that that Semitic language and culture is also African"
Yes, geologically it is. Those were originally Takruri's words by the way, which is true enough. Though generally speaking those areas are considered Southwest Asia now. Of course Semitic language and culture are African as that is where they originated but that doesn't change the fact that the 'Hebrew' ethny originated in the Levant.
So your semantics can't change that and won't save you.
quote:But I guess old habits die hard little Manila whore.
LMAO Indeed, your old habits of denial and ad-hominem name-calling due to intellectual frustration are hard to die.
quote:Again, nice try, but the cultural influences and roots of Greece are south in Africa.
Yes, some are. But others are largely West Asian. The point is it is still considered a European civilization.
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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LOL @ this clown talking about semantics when he admits geologically, culturally and lingustically they are African, yet he still insists on calling them "Asiatics".
The many faces of Mary:
"Hebrew culture is Asiatic in origin"
"Semitic [Hebrew] language and culture is... African"
Just like your "majority" of influences on Hebrew culture are from Mesopotamia and Levant at the same time! LOL
Posts: 4254 | From: dasein | Registered: Jun 2009
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He is a piece of work. Speaking from both sides of his mouth.
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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^ No, moron. Hebrew language and culture is Asiatic in origin, but it also Semitic and the ancestral Semitic language is ultimately African origin. As usual you just aren't intelligent enough to comprehend what is said, and your boyfriend bogled-butt has a penchant to distort and take out of context what others have said if he doesn't like it. Just like how he distorts Bowcock and Keita's findings that Europeans are African mixed.
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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There he goes again! So to make up for his about face after months of claiming an Asiatic origin for ancient Hebrews he has to now claim Hebrew culture as both Asiatic and African in origin! What a loser! LOL
quote:As usual you just aren't intelligent enough to comprehend what is said
posted
^ LOL Indeed. It is YOU who is the loser, as you are too stupid to even understand what I wrote!
Hebrew language and culture is Asian in that it developed in the Levant! Hebrew is a Semitic language, however the Semitic language group or rather it's ancestor as Afrasian originated in Africa! Sorry I don't know how else to explain it. Even a small child or perhaps even a retard could understand this. So I won't even bother to repeat myself.
By the way, the topic of this thread is about Egypt demanding the Nefertiti bust back. If you won't address the topic then leave. I know you can't help your compulsion of carrying baggage from other threads onto new ones, so I'll no longer appease it. Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Hey, retard, these are your words "the Arabian peninsula and Levant all the way of to the Zagros is geologically part of the African plate...I acknowledge that that Semitic language and culture is also African"
I don't need to tell you that you are on record for claiming both Asia and Africa as the origins of Hebrew language and culture.
quote:Sorry I don't know how else to explain it.
You're doing just fine Mary, providing us with yet more quotes as evidence of your utter stupidity!
Posts: 4254 | From: dasein | Registered: Jun 2009
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^ Yes geologically Levant and Arabia are African or rather were African as tectonic shifts are making it part of Asia now. By the way, it is Takruri who is emphatic about claiming those regions to still be African, not mine! The point is Levant and Arabia are generally considered part of Southwest Asia, and YOUR original point is still debunked as your claim that Hebrews orginated in Africa proper specifically in Egypt is of course WRONG.
Get over it and stop b*tching, Eva. This is my last reply since not only is this (your) issue off-topic, but there is nothing left to offer your mentally bankruptass. Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:tectonic shifts are making it part of Asia now.
Hebrew culture did not begin now.
quote:it is Takruri who is emphatic about claiming those regions to still be African, not mine!
You dumb Asian you agreed with him, hence your quote. Now you want to change your mind, again. Go figure.
quote:The point is Levant and Arabia are generally considered part of Southwest Asia
Not what you said, "the Arabian peninsula and Levant all the way of to the Zagros is geologically part of the African plate...I acknowledge that that Semitic language and culture is also African" LOL
Posts: 4254 | From: dasein | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Bogledass: Hebrew culture did not begin now.
Of course not, but those tectonic shifts took place millions of years before humanity even existed let alone 'Hebrew' dummy. LOL
quote:You dumb Asian you agreed with him, hence your quote. Now you want to change your mind, again. Go figure.
As usual, your ethnic ad-hominem name calling betrays your frustration. I never changed my mind, since I have always maintained the fact that Hebrews were a Levantine people. It is YOU who denies such an elementary historical fact.
quote:"the Arabian peninsula and Levant all the way of to the Zagros is geologically part of the African plate...I acknowledge that that Semitic language and culture is also African" LOL
Actually the quote originally belongs to Takruri not I. But I personally am speaking of the general geographic view that the Levant and Arabia are Southwest Asia. But even if you consider those regions African that still doesn't follow your view that Hebrews originated in Africa proper via Egypt! So rather it is YOU who tries to twist and squirm like the brainless worm that you are! Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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For all the intelligent posters, let's stay on topic...
quote:Originally posted by Tigerlily:
By JUDY DEMPSEY Published: October 18, 2009
BERLIN — Culture lovers, visitors and the city authorities of Berlin were reveling in the reopening Friday of the Neues Museum in the heart of the German capital by Chancellor Angela Merkel, the culmination of decades of efforts to renovate a special site destroyed during World War II.
But the celebrations have been marred by a growing dispute between the German and Egyptian governments about the star of the show: the 3,300-year-old limestone and stucco bust of Queen Nefertiti, a wife of Pharaoh Akhenaten.
The Nefertiti sculpture has been in Germany since 1913. But it is only now that Egypt is demanding that this fragile and haunting object, perched alone in a domed room that overlooks the length of the museum, be returned.
The Egyptian antiquities chief, Zahi Hawass, told the German media over the past few days that Nefertiti belonged to his country.
In interviews with Kölner Stadt-Anzeiger and Spiegel Online, Mr. Hawass said that an official investigation had begun into how Nefertiti arrived in Germany. “If she left Egypt illegally, which I am convinced she did, then I will officially demand it back from Germany,” he said in both interviews.
It was the first time that Egypt had made an official request for the statue to be returned if it was found to have been illegally removed from Egypt.
The comments from Mr. Hawass came just weeks after the Culture Minister Faruq Hosni of Egypt complained bitterly about his failure to be elected as the new director general of Unesco, the United Nations culture agency based in Paris.
Once considered a front-runner for the post, Mr. Hosni stirred controversy because of remarks made in 2008, when he told the Egyptian Parliament that he would that he would personally burn any Israeli book found in an Egyptian library.
Even though he distanced himself from that remark during his effort to become the first Arab to run Unesco, the United States, France and Elie Wiesel, a prominent survivor of Auschwitz, said his appointment would bring shame to the global community.
A German Foreign Ministry official would not say how Germany had voted. “It is secret,” said the official, who asked not to be identified because of the sensitivity of the issue. She said that there was “no connection between the Egyptian request to have Nefertiti returned and the outcome of the Unesco vote.”
Days after the defeat of Mr. Hosni, Mr. Hawass accused France of stealing antiquities and insisted that they be returned. He referred to five painted wall fragments dating to the Pharoahs which ended up in Paris at the Louvre Museum in 2000 and 2003.
After Egypt threatened to suspend cooperation for exhibitions organized with the Louvre, as well as any work conducted by the Louvre on the Pharaonic necropolis of Saqqara, south of Cairo, the French culture minister, Frédéric Mitterrand, said that his country was ready to return the antiquities if they had been stolen.
German art experts deny that Nefertiti was taken out of Egypt illegally.
“The documentation exists. The arrangements were agreed. The process was legal,” said Monika Grütters, an art history professor, legislator and a leading cultural expert in Mrs. Merkel’s Christian Democratic Union party.
“There was a complete understanding about what would remain in Egypt and what would be taken to Germany,” Mrs. Grutters said by telephone. “Maybe there is a bit of jealousy on the part of Egypt over Nefertiti. In any event, I am not so sure Egypt has the best conditions for this statue,” she added. “And because it is so fragile, I am not sure the statue can even be flown. We have excellent conditions here in Germany.”
Mr. Hawass alleged that the Egyptian officials may have been misled about how Nefertiti had been taken to Germany in 1913. According to the German newsmagazine Der Spiegel, there exists a document written in 1924 explaining how the secretary of the German Oriental Company, which was involved in the region, gave an account of a meeting in 1913 between a senior Egyptian official and the German archaeologist Ludwig Borchardt. Mr. Borchardt had found the bust during a dig in 1912.
According to the document, the secretary was present at the meeting, which had been called to divide the spoils of a dig between Germany and Egypt. Mr. Borchardt, the witness noted, “wanted to save the bust for us.” Perhaps intentionally, the bust was not shown in the best light.
Hermann Parzinger, the head of the Prussian Cultural Heritage Foundation, which oversees Berlin’s museums, told journalists ahead of the opening of the galleries that he was confident that Nefertiti’s place in Germany was secure.
The Neues Museum was for years a derelict, bomb-scarred shell. Situated in the former East Germany, it was left in its war-torn state because of the lack of funds. Nefertiti and thousands of other items have now been returned to their former home for the first time. It was only after the reunification of Germany in 1990 that Berlin city authorities, with substantial support from the federal government, could embark on a huge renovation of cultural sites, which has drawn more tourists to the city.
The neoclassical architecture of the museum, which has been recognized as a Unesco world heritage site, has been given a modernist touch by the British architect David Chipperfield. In his €233-million, or $347 million, redesign, he left some of the historic decay untouched. The original columns still show fire damage.
quote:Originally posted by Bogledass: You lying troll.
Nope. I believe I stated this was Takruri's argument that since these regions were geologically part of Africa then *all* these peoples should be Africans too and not just 'Hebrews' but Arabs, other Levantines, and even some Iranis.
Now, YOUR premise is that Hebrews culture and language originated in Egypt which is FALSE as it is Levantine.
So your silly argument is bankrupt. Address the actual topic of this thread or leave.
Posts: 26236 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
^ yeh cause showing your lying ways is quite embarassing:
Majority of outside influence on Hebrews came from Levant and Mesopotamia!
quote:"the majority of influence on Hebrew myths come from Mesopotamia"
"by and large Israelite religous beliefs and traditions are NOT Egyptian but Asiatic in origin--- largely Levantine but also some Mesopotamian influence"
Hebrew culture is both African and Asian in origin!
quote:"Hebrew culture is Asiatic in origin"
"Semitic [Hebrew] language and culture is... African"
Hebrew language and culture is African in origin but the "ethny" is Levant (Mary's "Asia")!
quote:"Of course Semitic language and culture are African as that is where they originatedbut that doesn't change the fact that the 'Hebrew' ethny originated in the Levant.
LOL
quote:Nope. I believe I stated this was Takruri's argument
And you agreed, your words - "I also know that the Arabian peninsula and Levant all the way of to the Zagros is geologically part of the African plate..."
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