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Originally posted by Monkey:

Can I pick your brains? I have laid my hands on a copy of Rosetta Stone Arabic. I got so far with Michele Thomas but he's getting on my wick. Anyway, I've been reading Rosetta Stone is what do you call it? Modern Arabic rather than Egyptian Arabic. Is it a waste of time? I quite like the way they teach it so if it's a no go it would be a shame. Plus Michele Thomas doesn't teach you written Arabic. But no point learning it if it's a no go. What do you think?

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I liked Michel Thomas Method for Arabic because I already knew just about everything that was covered, but it helped me put it all together as practical spoken sentences. I did find the woman very annoying though - her English accent (and she is British) was totally bizarre - she says tmahrow instead of tmorow (for tomorrow - attempting to be phonetic here!) and I'm really sure some of her Arabic pronunciation is off, though Mahmoud the Egyptian guy there all the time helps a lot. Having said that, one Egyptian guy friend of a friend listened to some of it and said she had a good accent! Most of the books she does are Standard Arabic though so maybe she had a good standard Arabic pronunciation rather than Egyptian?

I haven't personally looked at Rosetta stone but I have heard it's standard Arabic. Really, it depends what you are trying to achieve. If you want to read books and the newspaper, then fine. If you want to be understood talking to the non-English speaking Egyptians who tend to be makwas, shop workers, taxi drivers, bus drivers/money collectors and so on, then the Egyptian Arabic is better.

As to the writing, I am working through Akallimni Arabi with a friend, we are on book 3 of 5. It is Colloquial Egyptian NOT Standard and is written using Arabic script not dodgy transliterations.

Also quite often the dialogues mirror conversations you actually hear in real life (eg an argument between a passenger and a taxi driver in Masr Gdeeda!) so you can figure out the pronunciation. If you don't know the words and haven't heard them, the lack of short vowel characters in written Arabic makes it hard to know!

I'm making much better progress working with someone a little but not too much ahead of me than with an Arabic speaker. Because the Arabic speakers who offer to help often speak reasonable English, then as for the most part they are not experienced teachers and do not understand the need to allow the student time to put a sentence together, assume you don't know when you do - you are carefully in your head putting the right starts and ends on the verbs for example - and they butt in with it or correct you all the time. It's actually pretty intimidating and it's something we were taught on TEFL to be very careful about doing as it really inhibits students from trying things and thus their ability to communicate.

I much prefer trying my Arabic out on Egyptians who can't speak any English other than 'wilcom in Egypt' and 'wats yoor name'
The friend I am learning with doesn't speak great English either so we normally communicate in a hybrid of Arabic and English.
 

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Posted by Monkey (Member # 17287) on :
 
It's the guy who sounds half American half Yorkshire. He bugs me! And she definitely favours him over the girl student - poor girl can't do a thing right

But are nouns different or the whole stringing it together or a bit of both? I was thinking of doing the Rosetta thing because like I say, I like the look of it and the fact you get the written side in there. Then I was thinking of coming back to Michele thingy. I'm just kind of stuck with it because I've done "can I have" "I'm thirsty" "I'm tired" "I want I want I want" and it makes no sense to me because they haven't even taught me how to say hello yet! Rosetta does seem to start from the beginning. I think it would be interesting to see the difference too. And they have pictures! I'm a sucker for pictures
 

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Posted by Shanta Gdeeda (Member # 9889) on :
 
Well I guess that could be one of the reasons I like Michel Thomas.
I did 80 hours of evening classes in Colloquial Egyptian before I moved here spread over a couple of years.
When I got here, a few of us got together and did a 6 week course of about 20 hours altogether. I joined it mainly for the 'social' side and it drove me potso. Out of 6 weeks, we had 5 weeks of greetings in transliteration (designed for American vowels not British!) and narry an Arabic letter to be seen. By the end I was screaming inside - I got sick to the teeth of Sabah el khaer sabah el noor, ahlan wa sahlan etc etc.
To find a course that didn't say hello even ONCE was wonderful beyond all imagining for me.
That greetings and other basic stuff you should be able to pick up easily in short holiday makers course I think - though it probably won't be in written Arabic.
 

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Posted by Shanta Gdeeda (Member # 9889) on :
 
Do you live anywhere near a university that might offer Colloquial Egyptian evening classes?
 

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Posted by Monkey (Member # 17287) on :
 
Yes - Exeter Uni's not far off. They go into Middle Eastern studies there in a pretty big way so I'd be surprised if they didn't have something. Hmm. Sounds like a plan to me.

Thanks Shanta
 

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Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 
Monkey, http://www.arabacademy.com/ do courses online in all types of Arabic including Egyptian. It's paid for but extremely good! Does written also. I did a course a few years ago and I know it's improved since then and it was bloody fab then. Thats how I learnt the proper pronunciation of all the letters coz it shows you where in the mouth and throat to form the letter.

Really can't recommend it enough!

Edit, cannot find anywhere there they do Egyptian Arabic anymore
 

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Posted by Monkey (Member # 17287) on :
 
I got the dentists chair Aaaaagh thingy from the Michele Thomas woman but I completely get what Shanta's saying about her pronunciation. When you listen to her then Mahmoud - noticeable difference.

Thanks Ayisha - I'll have a look see
 

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Posted by Shanta Gdeeda (Member # 9889) on :
 
@Monkey - check out things like 'Continuing Education' or 'Languages' rather than degree courses.
 

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Posted by Shanta Gdeeda (Member # 9889) on :
 
Look what I found:

http://devon.floodlight.co.uk/devon/courses-classes-lessons/exeter,-university-of/best-language-courses/qualification/study/devon/16180339/220706/100/3740/domain.html
 

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Posted by Monkey (Member # 17287) on :
 
Oh yes - definitely. Degree courses... I don't think they take organ donation as payment... yet!
 

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Posted by Monkey (Member # 17287) on :
 
Ah cool - thanks
 

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Posted by Shanta Gdeeda (Member # 9889) on :
 
Mildly amusing story:

I often buy khudar moshakal (mixed veg) here in the shop. Sometimes they don't have any in and I say peas and carrots is ok then. Except for one thing... for about 2 years I have been saying 'gazma we basilla'. And never did they laugh.

Anyway, when I went to the horse and camel place in February, there was a huge sack of carrots meant for the animals and some kids kept coming and stealing the carrots. Then the whole sack vanished. I said to the vet "gazma fein?" and she started looking on the floor and saying "I don't know, what are they like?" Anyway, suffice to say I had been saying 'shoes' instead of 'carrots' gzra for the past 2 years in the shop

Nothing to the person who shall remain nameless who went in the shop where she lives asking for a kilo of zib - she remembered the word for olives began with a z.... but didn't remember the right one - the shopkeeper had a quiet word with her husband.
 

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Posted by Ayisha (Member # 4713) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Shanta Gdeeda:


Nothing to the person who shall remain nameless who went in the shop where she lives asking for a kilo of zib - she remembered the word for olives began with a z.... but didn't remember the right one - the shopkeeper had a quiet word with her husband.

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reminds me of when I first went to buy a zip, had no idea what the word was, but after trying to explain by showing my jeans zip to a horrified man and woman in the shop while saying 'zip' I learnt 'zoster' very quickly
 

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Posted by Dalia* (Member # 10593) on :
 

quote:

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Originally posted by Monkey:

But are nouns different or the whole stringing it together or a bit of both?

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