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The North-South relationship..Mahgreb and Sudan..
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by the lioness: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: ^^^^ Instead of Copy N pastine why not explain your beliefs/ideas so we can have an open and intellectual conversation.. [QUOTE]my remark was a generalized statement about what the Moors did to the Songhai[/QUOTE]Lioness, when you say "Moors did to Songhai" you support or uphold the idea that Moors=North Africans and Songhai=Sudanis or "Negros" correct?? Further were Moors at all vital to Songhai, Sudan etc and vice versa?? and If so would it not be devastating to these Moors as well if their Intellectual center was destroyed?? If not..explain?? [/QUOTE]you mixing up two things. There was a time when Mali and Songhai were various tribal people with indigenous culture religions. This is a lost unrecorded history. The Islamic conquest of NA itself. we have no cotemporary record of it. accounts come later. The first invasion of North Africa, ordered by the caliph, was launched in 647. Marching from Medina, Arabia, 20,000 Arabs were joined in Memphis, Egypt, by another 20,000 and led into the Byzantine Exarchate of Africa by Abdallah ibn al-Sa’ad. Tripolitania in what is modern Libya was taken.The Islamic conquest of North Africa of Umayyad is around 647. The motive was expansion of an empire and acquistion of resources, gold, salt, slaves and to a lesser extent convert people to their montheistic way of thinking. They sometimes let the people continue their "pagan" ways to an extent, as long as the Muslim leadership had estabished control of the region. In later Muslim conquest periods West Africa is conquered ________________________________________________________ [i]Mali was once part of three famed West African empires which controlled trans-Saharan trade in gold, salt, slaves, and other precious commodities.These Sahelian kingdoms had neither rigid geopolitical boundaries nor rigid ethnic identities.The earliest of these empires was the Ghana Empire, which was dominated by the Soninke, a Mande-speaking people. The nation expanded throughout West Africa from the 8th century until 1078, when it was conquered by the Almoravids. The Mali Empire later formed on the upper Niger River, and reached the height of power in the 14th century. Under the Mali Empire, the ancient cities of Djenné and Timbuktu were centers of both trade and Islamic learning.The empire later declined as a result of internal intrigue, ultimately being supplanted by the Songhai Empire. The Songhai people originated in current northwestern Nigeria. The Songhai had long been a major power in West Africa subject to the Mali Empire's rule. In the late 14th century, the Songhai gradually gained independence from the Mali Empire and expanded, ultimately subsuming the entire eastern portion of the Mali Empire. The Songhai Empire's eventual collapse was largely the result of a Moroccan invasion in 1591, under the command of Judar Pasha. The fall of the Songhai Empire marked the end of the region's role as a trading crossroads. Following the establishment of sea routes by the European powers, the trans-Saharan trade routes lost significance. One of the worst famines in the region's recorded history occurred in the 18th century. According to John Iliffe, "The worst crises were in the 1680s, when famine extended from the Senegambian coast to the Upper Nile and 'many sold themselves for slaves, only to get a sustenance', and especially in 1738–56, when West Africa's greatest recorded subsistence crisis, due to drought and locusts, reportedly killed half the population of Timbuktu."[/i] _________________________________________________________ "Moors" are not a distinct or self-defined people. Medieval and early modern Europeans applied the name primarily to Berbers, but also at various times to Arabs and Muslim Iberians. Mainstream scholars observed in 1911 that "The term 'Moors' has no real ethnological value. In 711 CE, the now Islamic Moors conquered Visigothic Christian Hispania. This is the beginning of al-Andalus, the power center in Spain. Later Islamic pentration into West Africa are in this context. [i]Starting out as a seasonal settlement, Timbuktu became a permanent settlement early in the 12th century. After a shift in trading routes, Timbuktu flourished from the trade in salt, gold, ivory and slaves and became part of the Mali Empire early in the 13th century. In the first half of the 15th century the Tuareg tribes took control of the city for a short period until the expanding Songhay Empire absorbed the city in 1468. A Moroccan army defeated the Songhay in 1591, and made Timbuktu, rather than Gao, their capital. The invaders established a new ruling class, the arma, who after 1612 became independent of Morocco. However, the golden age of the city was over and it entered a long period of decline. In its Golden Age, the town's numerous Islamic scholars and extensive trading network made possible an important book trade: together with the campuses of the Sankore madrassah, an Islamic university, this established Timbuktu as a scholarly centre in Africa. [/i] [QUOTE]Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: Why were the Scholars of Timbuctu exiled In your opinion?? [/QUOTE]Because of our Moorish friends: [i]Following the Battle of Tondibi, the city was captured on 30 May 1591 by an expedition of mercenaries and slaves, dubbed the Arma. They were sent by the Saadi ruler of Morocco, Ahmad I al-Mansur, and were led by Judar Pasha in search of gold mines. The Arme brought the end of an era of relative autonomy. The following period brought economic and intellectual decline. In 1593, Ahmad I al-Mansur cited 'disloyalty' as the reason for arresting, and subsequently killing or exiling, many of Timbuktu's scholars, including Ahmad Baba.] Perhaps the city's greatest scholar, he was forced to move to Marrakesh because of his intellectual opposition to the Pasha, where he continued to attract the attention of the scholarly world. Ahmad Baba later returned to Timbuktu, where he died in 1608. The city's decline continued, with the increasing trans-atlantic trade routes – transporting African slaves, including leaders and scholars of Timbuktu – marginalising Timbuktu's role as a trade and scholarly center[/i] [/QB][/QUOTE]
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