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Genomic Ancestry of North Africans Supports Back-to-Africa Migrations Brenna M. Henn
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by The Explorer: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by the lioness,: No, the harem role of the women, sex slaves, is entirely different from the role of men. The men probably weren't capable of freeing the women who were situated inside the Pasha's or sultan's residence under guard and army. The men were expendable and would be used for more temporal projects[/QUOTE]It strikes me as odd that of all the historic events of slavery, wherein [b]both[/b] men and female slaves were brought in substantial numbers, as opposed to one gender favored over the other, that the males are sent back, leaving behind only a record of female slaves. Can you give me a single documented incidence of this? And let's not forget that proof you never presented, of European male slaves being sent back, leaving the females behind. [QUOTE]you are putting "had it worse" as a quote but it's not a quote.[/QUOTE]Yeah, it's called emphasizing a general idea that some group or another holds. I don't have to use quotes only when I'm actually quoting a specific person. Sometimes I get the impression that you just crawled out from under a rock. Besides, it IS implied in the your citation, that the European captives had it harder than than "blacks in the Americas". [QUOTE]They said the attrition rate was estimated at 20%. The exact reasons are not indicated.[/QUOTE]If you read further down, the citation offers a reason for the attrition. Neither the estimation or the reasons offered are "exact". [QUOTE]That mortality rate should be considered in context of the mortality rate of all slaves of the Arab/Ottomans, including black African Zanj who were said to die in high numbers in the harsh salt mines of Iraq as well as very high mortality rates when slaves were being transported over land in long distances across Africa, along various trade routes, Ethiopians and various Africans enslaved by Muslim empires.[/QUOTE]Well, newsflash: Your citation only compares European slaves in the Maghreb with the American slaves. [QUOTE]They also castrated certain slaves and simply killed large numbers of slaves at times.[/QUOTE]I've talked about possible castration of male slaves in my notes on slavery in the Maghreb myself. That doesn't justify a lack of record left by male slaves of the size being insinuated in your citation. [QUOTE]Europeans in theory could seek reparations from Morocco and Algeria as well as black Africans. Reparations in America is hardly talked about in America currently and few blacks are pushing hard for it or even raising the issue. There are a tiny few but hardly any. This is a fact. It was probably more discussed in the 1990s[/QUOTE]Politics around "white guilt" and "reparations" for slavery in the Americas, particularly North America, is an issue that has re-surfaced on occasion when the topic presents itself. This is not something that a specific date or time can be applied to as a cap. The idea of reparations have often taken the form of figurative speak, since it is not something that most observers actually see happening. "Morocco and Algeria, and black Africans" can in theory seek reparations that probably outweighs your theory of European reparation pursuits, given the carnage Europeans have caused to these territories and said peoples in their "carving up" Africa to the present neo-colonial destructive forces that they have put in place with the help of institutions like the IMF, World Bank and the UN. [QUOTE] The topic of European slaves of Muslim empires was covered in several books including Christian Slaves, Muslim Masters 2004 by Robert C, Davis. The book ranks #173,655 on Amazon. I'm sure the mainstream of whites in America and Europe would rather not talk about this humiliating topic at all as opposed to a few obscure white supremacists who might like to use it in a "we had it worse than you" argument.[/QUOTE]Of course, most of the time whites in said places would perhaps "rather not talk about this humiliating topic", because said whites do not honestly think they are actual victims of such proportion. Perhaps this plays a part when "slavery" is taken off the table as a likely contributor to supposed "European" component in the Maghreb maternal gene pool. On occasion however, when confronted with "white guilt" talk about European carnage of other people, it becomes enticing to capitalize on such "humiliating topic", and this is not necessarily relegated to a few white supremacist zealots. [QUOTE]No it means "most" [/QUOTE]Really? You know this because you sampled "most" Maghrebi folks? I haven't come across any sample that has achieved that. [QUOTE]That varies but in this case let's say 25% and up [/QUOTE]Give me the numbers, and the specific markers that would render say, 25% European ancestry, in "most" Maghrebi folks. [QUOTE]A population would be more mixed if frequencies for haplogoups associated with Eurasia are higher in Maghrebians than frequencies of haplogoups associated with Eurasia in other Africans Don't worry so much [/QUOTE]Funny talk aside, if anyone needs to worry, you couldn't be a better candidate: So, firstly, only when there is supposed "Eurasian" elements in a gene pool, it is rendered "mixed"? Your double standard belies rational thinking: Any combination of distinct monophyletic units in a gene pool technically constitutes a "mixture" of ancestries. "Eurasian" monophyletic units do not hold any supernatural superiority over any other monophyletic unit. You are in the 21st century with a 19th century mind, since the ideas you hold had even been outmoded by the time the 20th century itself ended. Your mind is still locked into perceiving a concept that was put into place in the 19th century Europe, i.e. human racialism and racial hierarchy, as a scientific reality. [/QB][/QUOTE]
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