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Ancient Egyptian DNA from 1300BC to 426 AD
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Cass/: [QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by sudaniya: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Cass/: [qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by sudaniya: I'm trying to understand why the European mind has this disturbing, almost maniacal need to insert himself into ancient African history using "Eurasian" as a Trojan horse.[/QUOTE]And yet you're trying to insert Sub-Saharan Africans into Egypt. So its OK with connecting Egyptians to peoples thousands of miles south of the Sahara, but not south Levant peoples a lot geographically closer? lol. This is just pan-African politics again. The way you politicalize "Eurasians" vs. "Africans" isn't normal. [/qb][/QUOTE]You need psychological help, my friend. Ancient Egyptians were part of the Afrasian group of Northeast Africans, and the last time I checked a map, the source of Egyptian civilization (Upper Egypt) was clearly closer to North Sudan than it is to the Levant. You can pretend that Afrasians in Upper Egypt and North Sudan have absolutely no links to Afrasians in the Horn to your heart's content, but it won't change the simple fact that the ancient Egyptians were not "Eurasians" in any way... your facile protestations notwithstanding. Nothing has been "politicized"; facts were simply stated. Facts matter. Here are the facts: The ancient Egyptians were not "Eurasians" ; they were indigenous Northeast Africans and were indistinguishable from "Nubians" in Upper Egypt and North Sudan in the predynastic period. This cannot be said of the Levant. [/qb][/QUOTE]I don't need ancient Egyptians to be "Eurasian", since I've criticized this since 2013 [an essay I then wrote was on their Saharan origin]. What I'm simply pointing out is the Hamitic model-pushes back the settlement/migration of "Caucasoids" into North Africa 20,000 years ago (e.g. Coon, 1962), so its not actually fatal to an autochthonous (native Saharan) model because of the time depth; Hamiticists argue for long-term continuity in Egypt from the Epipaleolithic to modern times. Coon for example, discussed the strong biological continuity from ancient to modern peasantry in Egypt: "One may expect to find a racial continuity between the landed peasants of ancient Egypt and the modern Fellahin. This continuity should be, and is, as great as that between ancient Mesopotamia and modern Iraq." Therefore if ancient DNA of Egyptians does show strong Levant affinity, I would just (re)adopt Hamiticism as I argued pre-2013. But it is not a Hamitic or "Eurocentrist" position to argue for biological discontinuity between early Dynastic and late Dynastic Egyptians as Afrocentrists argue. The reason Afrocentrists argue modern Lower/Middle (northern) Egyptians are substantial recently "Eurasian" admixed through population replacement or large-scale gene flow by Ptolemaic Greeks, Romans or Arabs etc. - is because living northern Egyptians are unambiguously not "black" in pigmentation (but light brown) so they don't easily fit Afrocentrist's "Black Egypt" fantasy, so they *have* to be foreigners. However, northern Egyptians today are barely different in pigmentation to their ancient Egyptian ancestors: "I have encountered arguments that the ancient Egyptians were much 'blacker' than their modern counterparts, owing to the influx of Arabs at the time of the conquest, Caucasian slaves under the Mamlukes, or Turks and French soldiers during the Ottoman period. However, given the size of the Egyptian population against these comparatively minor waves of northern immigrants, as well as the fact that there was continuous immigration and occasional forced deportation of both northern and southern populations into Egypt throughout the pharaonic period, [b]I doubt that the modern population is significantly darker or lighter, or more or less 'African' than their ancient counterparts[/b]." - Ann Macy Roth) BUILDING BRIDGES TO AFROCENTRISM: A LETTER TO MY EGYPTOLOGICAL COLLEAGUES http://www.africa.upenn.edu/Articles_Gen/afrocent_roth.html [/QB][/QUOTE]
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