quote:More than two decades after researchers discovered the 3,800-year-old remains of "Jomon woman" in Hokkaido, Japan, they've finally deciphered her genetic secrets.
And it turns out, from that perspective, she looks very different from modern-day inhabitants of Japan. The woman, who was elderly when she died, had a high tolerance for alcohol, unlike some modern Japanese people, a genetic analysis revealed. She also had moderately dark skin and eyes and an elevated chance of developing freckles.
Surprisingly, the ancient woman shared a gene variant with people who live in the Arctic, one that helps people digest high-fat foods. This variant is found in more than 70% of the Arctic population, but it's absent elsewhere, said study first author Hideaki Kanzawa, a curator of anthropology at the National Museum of Nature and Science in Tokyo. [Photos of Samurai: The Last Century of Japanese Warriors]
This variant provides further evidence that the Jomon people fished and hunted fatty sea and land animals, Kanzawa said.
"Hokkaido Jomon people engaged in [not only] hunting of ... land animals, such as deer and boar, but also marine fishing and hunting of fur seal, Steller's sea lions, sea lions, dolphins, salmon and trout," Kanzawa told Live Science. "In particular, many relics related to hunting of ocean animals have been excavated from the Funadomari site," where the Jomon woman was found.
Who is Jomon woman? Jomon woman lived during the Joman period, also known as Japan's Neolithic period, which lasted from about 10,500 B.C. to 300 B.C. Though she died more than three millennia ago — between 3,550 and 3,960 years ago, according to recent radiocarbon dating — researchers found her remains only in 1998, at the Funadomari shell mound on Rebun Island, off the northern coast of Hokkaido.
But Jomon woman's genetics have remained a mystery all these years, prompting researchers to study her DNA, which they extracted from one of her molars. Last year, the researchers released their preliminary results, which helped a forensic artist create a facial reconstruction of the woman, showing that she had dark, frizzy hair; brown eyes; and a smattering of freckles.
Her genes also showed that she was at high risk of developing solar lentigo, or darkened patches of skin if she spent too much time in the sun, so the artist included several dark spots on her face.
"These findings provided insights into the history and reconstructions of the ancient human-population structures in east Eurasia," said Kanzawa, who was part of a larger team that included Naruya Saitou, a professor of population genetics at the National Institute of Genetics in Japan.
Now, with their study slated to be published in the next few weeks in The Anthropological Society of Nippon's English-language journal, Kanzawa and his colleagues are sharing more of their results. Jomon woman's DNA shows, for example, that the Jomon people split with Asian populations that lived on the Asian mainland between 38,000 and 18,000 years ago, he said.
It's likely that the Jomon people lived in small hunter-gatherer groups, likely for about 50,000 years, Kanzawa noted. Moreover, Jomon woman had wet earwax. That's an interesting fact because the gene variant for dry earwax originated in northeastern Asia and today up to 95% of East Asians have dry earwax. (People with the dry earwax variant also lack a chemical that produces smelly armpits.)
Despite her differences from the modern Japanese population, Jomon woman is actually more closely related to today's Japanese, Ulchi (the indigenous culture of eastern Russian), Korean, aboriginal Taiwanese and Philippine people than these populations are to the Han Chinese, Kanzawa said.
This would be their model reconstruction of her. I have to wonder about the article's description of her as "moderately dark-skinned" since the reconstruction's complexion doesn't look too out of place among modern Japanese (even if she came from a different population altogether). Maybe the paper will clarify when it gets published.
Askia_The_Great Member # 22000
posted
I mean its not shocking that she is completely different from the modern population. Modern Japanese people are actually recent migrants to the island from continental East Asia.
the questioner Member # 22195
posted
editor Laura Geggel
the questioner Member # 22195
posted
editor Laura Geggel
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
quote:Originally posted by Tyrannohotep:
More than two decades after researchers discovered the 3,800-year-old remains of "Jomon woman" in Hokkaido, Japan, they've finally deciphered her genetic secrets.
And it turns out, from that perspective, she looks very different from modern-day inhabitants of Japan. The woman, who was elderly when she died, had a high tolerance for alcohol, unlike some modern Japanese people, a genetic analysis revealed. She also had moderately dark skin and eyes and an elevated chance of developing freckles.
I have to wonder about the article's description of her as "moderately dark-skinned" since the reconstruction's complexion doesn't look too out of place among modern Japanese (even if she came from a different population altogether). Maybe the paper will clarify when it gets published.
quote:Originally posted by Askia_The_Great: I mean its not shocking that she is completely different from the modern population. Modern Japanese people are actually recent migrants to the island from continental East Asia.
Tyrannohotep's point is that she does not look completely different.
I agree. She looks like a typical Japanese woman without the primping. Some of them are light skinned others slightly brown ("moderately dark" relative to many modern Western Europeans) and in some cases with patchy brown age spots like this in the elderly. The only thing that looks atypical to me is the pinkish flush coming through the brown tones. Not sure about the hair, looks either not as straight as most Japanese or it could just be in an unkempt condition. Her whole facial structure looks very Japanese to me (although he nose is not as flat as some). But of course some of these phenotypical details are conjecture of the reconstruction artists (and geneticists)
This Ainu man looks in between Japanese and European to me but is unlikely to have had European admixture.
wiki:
quote: Recent research suggests that Ainu culture originated from a merger of the Jomon, Okhotsk and Satsumon cultures.[6]
[6]Sato, Takehiro; et al. (2007). "Origins and genetic features of the Okhotsk people, revealed by ancient mitochondrial DNA analysis". Journal of Human Genetics. 52 (7): 618–627. doi:10.1007/s10038-007-0164-z. PMID 17568987.
" A genetic analysis in 2016 showed that although the Ainu have some genetic relations to the Japanese people and Eastern Siberians "
Thereal Member # 22452
posted
Clearly you used a image that shows a hella mixed ainu to where he looks white passing. The reconstruction looks close to these folks, though some are obviously admixed.
quote:Originally posted by Thereal: Clearly you used a imagined that shows a hella mixed ainu to where he looks white mixed. The reconstruction looks close to these folks, though some are obviously admixed.
a proper comparison would be another man with no facial hair and not elderly.
The Ainu don't all look one way. Some look Asian but they have a lot more body hair than Japanese. Some resemble an Asian European mix but are not actually European at all. It is unlikely that man is mixed with a European 5,000 miles away. Some Central Asians resemble Europeans or Ainus but people with similar phenotypic traits may be not really be related and that can be revealed in the DNA
Thereal Member # 22452
posted
I never stated dude was European mixed only his look is akin to one also the ladies in the picture closely resemble the reconstruction.
Djehuti Member # 6698
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Looks like someone in this forum doesn't know how to read, but oh well.
quote:Originally posted by Tyrannohotep: I have to wonder about the article's description of her as "moderately dark-skinned" since the reconstruction's complexion doesn't look too out of place among modern Japanese (even if she came from a different population altogether). Maybe the paper will clarify when it gets published.
Yeah. Though I have to point out some Japanese today can get quite deep tans especially in the south. And the Ainu though described as 'fair-skinned' can also tan pretty well.
Tyrannohotep Member # 3735
posted
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: Looks like someone in this forum doesn't know how to read, but oh well.
quote:Originally posted by Tyrannohotep: I have to wonder about the article's description of her as "moderately dark-skinned" since the reconstruction's complexion doesn't look too out of place among modern Japanese (even if she came from a different population altogether). Maybe the paper will clarify when it gets published.
Yeah. Though I have to point out some Japanese today can get quite deep tans especially in the south. And the Ainu though described as 'fair-skinned' can also tan pretty well.
Thinking back to the description of this Jomon woman as having "frizzy" hair and wet earwax in addition to "moderately" dark skin...maybe these traits would represent an intermediate or "transitional" phenotype between the modern East Asian look and that of so-called "Negrito" people? I presume, of course, that the latter would represent the ancestral phenotype for East Asians until a subset of them moved north into Beringia and evolved lighter skin and all those EDAR-linked traits (the ancestral Sinodonts probably to a greater extent than the Sundadonts). Jomon woman might represent a population that was more cold-adapted than Negritos but less so than modern Sinodonts or Sundadonts.
Tyrannohotep Member # 3735
posted
Anyway, it seems that the paper has already been published. Click the red button to the right and you can download the .pdf for free.
Nothing in the paper on her hair's "frizziness" here, only that the shafts would have been thinner (in general, her EDAR traits have subdued expression). They do mention her having "moderately dark skin", but nothing more specific than that (so are we talking the full spectrum of human skin color, or only relative to modern East Asians)?
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
quote:Originally posted by Tyrannohotep: Thinking back to the description of this Jomon woman as having "frizzy" hair and wet earwax in addition to "moderately" dark skin...maybe these traits would represent an intermediate or "transitional" phenotype between the modern East Asian look and that of so-called "Negrito" people? I presume, of course, that the latter would represent the ancestral phenotype for East Asians until a subset of them moved north into Beringia and evolved lighter skin and all those EDAR-linked traits (the ancestral Sinodonts probably to a greater extent than the Sundadonts). Jomon woman might represent a population that was more cold-adapted than Negritos but less so than modern Sinodonts or Sundadonts.
I doubt that the Jomon features are themselves intermediary between tropical indigenes like 'Negrito' types and today's Asians. For the reason I will state in a moment.
But first, these findings and the description of features actually remind me of the Cheddar Man debacle. Albeit Cheddar Man dates back to an earlier period in the mesolithic giving a difference of about 5,000 years, I find it odd that his his likely complexion was described in the range of "dark to black" while this Jomon woman is simply "moderately dark", and then her reconstruction does not show any dark complexion at all! LOL
But getting back to my first point, a lot has been made of tying the Jomon with the Andamanese due to shared paternal clade haplogroup D as well as other possible genetic elements. In regards to hg D, people forget that it is also found among Tibetans.
Also let's not forget the 2015 study from David Reich et. al that shows genomic traces of ghost population ancestral to some Indigenous Americans including some Inuit.
What's interesting is that this population did NOT descend from Andamanese or other "Negrito" or Australasian aborigines but instead are partially ancestral to these groups as well!
Differences in the shared DNA suggest this ancestry did not come directly from these populations, the team concluded, but through a now extinct population they call “Population Y” that may have lived somewhere in East Asia and contributed genes to both very early Paleoamericans and to Australo-Melanesians. Because the Amazonian groups are only distantly related to Population Y, the team concludes that this represents an ancient rather than recent genetic contribution that arrived in an early “pulse of migration” to the Americas.
So going by Reich et. al findings, what we have here is an ancestral ghost population which I like to call 'Basal East Asian' since this group seems to predate the ancestors of today's East Asians.
By the way, isn't this the third ghost population Reich discovered? He found 'Basal Eurasian' and 'Ancestral North Eurasian' and now 'Population Y' or Basal East Asian.
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: Albeit Cheddar Man dates back to an earlier period in the mesolithic giving a difference of about 5,000 years, I find it odd that his his likely complexion was described in the range of "dark to black" while this Jomon woman is simply "moderately dark", and then her reconstruction does not show any dark complexion at all! LOL
Interesting turn of events. Seems some of the folks involved in the reconstruction are doubting if it is possible to determine skin color from ancient DNA. Obviously this has implications across the board when trying to understand when and how major phenotype changes, such as skin color took place.
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
^ That still pertains to my point about the conclusions about the Joan woman's complexion as well, even though her reconstruction does not show it.
Tyrannohotep Member # 3735
posted
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti:
quote:Originally posted by Tyrannohotep: Thinking back to the description of this Jomon woman as having "frizzy" hair and wet earwax in addition to "moderately" dark skin...maybe these traits would represent an intermediate or "transitional" phenotype between the modern East Asian look and that of so-called "Negrito" people? I presume, of course, that the latter would represent the ancestral phenotype for East Asians until a subset of them moved north into Beringia and evolved lighter skin and all those EDAR-linked traits (the ancestral Sinodonts probably to a greater extent than the Sundadonts). Jomon woman might represent a population that was more cold-adapted than Negritos but less so than modern Sinodonts or Sundadonts.
I doubt that the Jomon features are themselves intermediary between tropical indigenes like 'Negrito' types and today's Asians. For the reason I will state in a moment.
But first, these findings and the description of features actually remind me of the Cheddar Man debacle. Albeit Cheddar Man dates back to an earlier period in the mesolithic giving a difference of about 5,000 years, I find it odd that his his likely complexion was described in the range of "dark to black" while this Jomon woman is simply "moderately dark", and then her reconstruction does not show any dark complexion at all! LOL
But getting back to my first point, a lot has been made of tying the Jomon with the Andamanese due to shared paternal clade haplogroup D as well as other possible genetic elements. In regards to hg D, people forget that it is also found among Tibetans.
Also let's not forget the 2015 study from David Reich et. al that shows genomic traces of ghost population ancestral to some Indigenous Americans including some Inuit.
What's interesting is that this population did NOT descend from Andamanese or other "Negrito" or Australasian aborigines but instead are partially ancestral to these groups as well!
Differences in the shared DNA suggest this ancestry did not come directly from these populations, the team concluded, but through a now extinct population they call “Population Y” that may have lived somewhere in East Asia and contributed genes to both very early Paleoamericans and to Australo-Melanesians. Because the Amazonian groups are only distantly related to Population Y, the team concludes that this represents an ancient rather than recent genetic contribution that arrived in an early “pulse of migration” to the Americas.
So going by Reich et. al findings, what we have here is an ancestral ghost population which I like to call 'Basal East Asian' since this group seems to predate the ancestors of today's East Asians.
By the way, isn't this the third ghost population Reich discovered? He found 'Basal Eurasian' and 'Ancestral North Eurasian' and now 'Population Y' or Basal East Asian.
When I invoked an "Negrito" appearance for ancestral East Asians, I didn't mean to suggest that the latter were all descended from current Negrito ethnic groups like the Andamanese. Rather, I meant what you would call a "black" phenotype, like that all human beings would have possessed in the beginning. You have to admit that, at one point in time, the progenitors of all East Eurasian populations (this Population Y included) would have been black before some of them migrated further north and evolved lighter skin and all those EDAR-related traits.
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
^ Yeah, this likely explains why some Indigenous Americans have complexions like below:
Funny how, in some documentary re-enactments of the first modern human migrants into the they use East Asian actors, but this is as much inaccurate as using modern Europeans to portray the first modern humans to enter Europe.
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
^^ That is a indigenous Mexican, Rarámuri or Tarahumara
Ish Gebor Member # 18264
posted
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: This Ainu man looks in between Japanese and European to me but is unlikely to have had European admixture.
wiki:
quote: Recent research suggests that Ainu culture originated from a merger of the Jomon, Okhotsk and Satsumon cultures.[6]
[6]Sato, Takehiro; et al. (2007). "Origins and genetic features of the Okhotsk people, revealed by ancient mitochondrial DNA analysis". Journal of Human Genetics. 52 (7): 618–627. doi:10.1007/s10038-007-0164-z. PMID 17568987.
" A genetic analysis in 2016 showed that although the Ainu have some genetic relations to the Japanese people and Eastern Siberians "
That's ironic, because we have discussed this topic on the Ainu people. And I remember the racist troll claimed that in classics literature the Ainu was described as "quasi-caucasian".
The images you used is from Wikipedia. And they call him "full-blooded". Now he can be full-blooded while having admixture is a bit confusing in my opinion.
Full-blooded Ainu, compared to people of Yamato descent, often have lighter skin and more body hair.[46] Many early investigators proposed a Caucasian ancestry.[47] Luigi Luca Cavalli-Sforza places the Ainu in his "Northeast and East Asian" genetic cluster.[48]
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
^ The "caucasian ancestry" claim of the Ainu has been debunked for years now. The Ainu are truly northeast Asian people albeit an outlier. This is why anthropological studies on outlier populations is important because it eradicates these age old racial notions.
North Africans such as the Egyptians (and Nubians) possess features typically associated with caucasians such as long narrow faces and narrow noses and this gives Eurocentrics an excuse to classify them as such. But then we have Paleo-indian remains like Luzia and Naia who possess "negroid" features. This throws a wrench in the whole racial paradigm.
DD'eDeN Member # 21966
posted
I won't be commenting here. Anyone interested in Ainu (Hokkaido, Amur) & Aynu (Tarim Basin), PM me.
DD'eDeN Member # 21966
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the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
^ this is a 1920s photo that had been hand colored to make into a postcard.
anthropologists have been noting the relatively light appearance of the Ainu since first studying the Ainu describing them as light skinned but slightly darker than the average Japanese. There are many old photos of them and the often look relatively light skinned, with some exceptions
It is hard to tell what is going on with the men's faces with all the beards
Thereal Member # 22452
posted
Stop lying.From March to September the uv index of Hokkaido is no lower than 5 and peaks at 8,if what You're saying is true than why is japan one of the top 50 countries with high melanoma rates?
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
Could write in proper sentences and thought through explanation please? I don't know what the hell you're saying.
Start with quoting a particular thing I said you claim is a lie. Then proceed to a clear explanation of your theory and why what I said is a lie.
I can't respond to gobbledygook.
Thereal Member # 22452
posted anthropologists have been noting the relatively light appearance of the Ainu since first studying the Ainu describing them as slightly lighter than the average Japanese.
By the time Europeans made a official documentation of other people they were already mixed with Yayoi so why select the lights most ambiguous look Japanese you can find when they varied? also the ainu consumed Salomon which is a good source for vitamin D so what would cause them to depigment if their diet was sufficient to reduce the effects of vitamin D deficiency?
I Don't know how to post pic but I show you the time to burn scale and Hokkaido yearly UV index.
"Anthropologists have been noting the relatively light appearance of the Ainu since first studying the Ainu describing them as light skinned but slightly darker than the average Japanese."
I meant to say this before but it is not that different from what I said before. I meant slightly darker
_________________________
This is the situation. We have Japanese people. Many but not all are light skinned. In Northern Japan are indigenous people called the Ainu. They are typically hairier than the other Japanese and their features are somewhat East Asian but they can also diverge from that. Many also have somewhat light skin.
So the first thing we need to look at is how things look on the ground. How do the people look? And then you go back as far as you can looking for the earliest descriptions.
That is what we are working with, how the people look. The theories come after that not before.
AINU WOMAN
real expert Member # 22352
posted
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: ^ Yeah, this likely explains why some Indigenous Americans have complexions like below:
Funny how, in some documentary re-enactments of the first modern human migrants into the they use East Asian actors, but this is as much inaccurate as using modern Europeans to portray the first modern humans to enter Europe.
Dude have you ever heard the term TANNING? Take this guy out the constant sun exposure and from the mountains and he will be some shades lighter.
Sun exposure on the mountains is much more intense than on the beach.
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
^ Yes, tanning occurs among darker hued people of color even black peoples.
Even if the man above is tanned, that means his original shade really wasn't that light to begin with. Or does this fact bother you?
Tukuler Member # 19944
posted
Guess that guy's lips caught a super-tan too!
Reminds of the 'Tuareg are pink-skinned up under those sheets' shis ytes used to promote not so long ago.
What r ppl of that type mentality so afraid of? Such an inferiority complex they must have, smh.
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
^ Yeah it reminds me how many years ago I was lurking in one of the anthro-bio forums and someone posted pictures of modern day non-Arab (black) Egyptians and one Euronut claimed they all were "sun-tanned", even though they had chocolate dark complexions! LOL
I guess you have entire populations who like this tan addicted white woman below:
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
Considering that mtDNA hg D1 is found among Jomon people as it is among Amerindians including Naia, this map may show a probable migration route from Japan to the Americas south of Beringia.
Ish Gebor Member # 18264
posted
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: Could write in proper sentences and thought through explanation please? I don't know what the hell you're saying.
Start with quoting a particular thing I said you claim is a lie. Then proceed to a clear explanation of your theory and why what I said is a lie.
I can't respond to gobbledygook.
If I remember it correctly the Papua and Japanese have some genetic relation. We have discussed this about 8 years ago.
If correct Hg D was the relation.
the lioness, Member # 17353
posted
"I remember" is not good enough
Ish Gebor Member # 18264
posted
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: "I remember" is not good enough
You are not in the position to judge anyone. You gather judgment on biases. lol
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted Artifacts in Idaho may be earliest evidence of humans in America: Scientists say they’ve found artifacts in Idaho that indicate people were living there around 16,000 years ago, providing new evidence that the first Americans entered their new home by following the Pacific coast.
The discovery also points to Japan as a possible origin or influence for the migration, said study leader Loren Davis of Oregon State University...
The site is between 15,280 and 16,560 years old, for an approximate age of 16,000 years, analysis indicated. It was occupied repeatedly over time, researchers said.
What does it all mean? For one thing, the researchers said, the calculated age argues for one side of a debate about just how the first Americans arrived.
The traditional narrative is that the peopling of the Americas began after a migration crossed a now-submerged land bridge called Beringia that used to extend from Siberia to Alaska. The migration’s progress south from there was blocked for a while by massive ice sheets in Canada, but eventually a gap in the ice opened and people moved through this so-called “ice-free corridor.”
*But in recent years, as scientists have found earlier and earlier signs of humans living in the Americas, some have argued that people had shown up before that corridor appeared. So maybe they traveled the Pacific instead, either on foot or by boat, or both.*
Davis said his paper indicates people were living in Idaho long before the corridor opened, citing others’ research that says it was open by about 14,800 years ago. The best explanation, he said, is that “they came down the coast and took a left-hand turn south of the ice, and went up the Columbia River Basin.”
The site also revealed a style of stone projectile point that resembles artifacts of similar age on the Japanese island of Hokkaido. So that supports the idea that the migration that led to the first Americans may have begun in that area, when Hokkaido was part of a larger land mass, Davis said. Or it could have started somewhere else in northeast Asia, but still reflect a cultural contribution of the Hokkaido area, he said.
A migration from the Hokkaido area could have skirted the southern coast of Beringea before heading south along the Pacific, he said...
Dennis Jenkins, senior research archaeologist at the University of Oregon’s Museum of Natural and Cultural History, said the Idaho site appears to go back 16,000 years. He also said the paper provides “a major advance” by linking early Americans to Japan more firmly than before...
posted
The Ainu descend from early arrivals in northeastern Eurasia. They were therefore still similar to the people in central Siberia and the steppes, some of whom contributed to European ancestry. This would explain their appearance which some have called "Caucasian"-like.
If they seem to resemble Native Americans, that also would be due to common ancestry, not a migration from Japan to America.
Thereal Member # 22452
posted
Naw!.thin facial features have been part of humanity so the ainu phenotype can be explained away as adaptation to that particular environment or mixing with the yayoi.
Marija Member # 23167
posted
quote:Originally posted by Thereal: Naw!.thin facial features have been part of humanity so the ainu phenotype can be explained away as adaptation to that particular environment or mixing with the yayoi.
Many Ainu characteristics are those of the archaic Eurasians in the East. Several genetic lines mixed in Siberia, and their descendants include Native Americans and Europeans.
This explains also why remains such as that of the infamous "Luzia" in Brazil seem to resemble Australoid, though genome analysis of her people reveal no Australoid ancestry. Rather, it is that both early Native Americans and early Australoids and other eastern Eurasians as well descend from the same archaic peoples.
Djehuti Member # 6698
posted
^ Luzia's skull was totally fossilized so there was no DNA to extract from it. Instead, there was genome analysis done on DNA extracted from the skull of Naia a young pubescent girl found in Yucatan, Mexico dated 1-2 thousand years earlier than Luzia and it shows her genome to be ancestral to modern living Native Americans including mtDNA clade D2 that links her to Jomon people, yet Naia's skull displays features that are more "negroid" than "mongoloid" or Amerindian.
Interestingly, genome analysis of isolated tribes living today in the region that Luzia lived shows the presence of autosomal markers associated with Australian Aborigines and Andamanese. A recent study shows that Australians and Andamanese are not the source but rather recipients of these markers suggesting recent common inheritance or ancestry from another population.
posted 
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