posted
My husband and I are having a debate, can you help?
If a non-muslim man and woman are married and live in a Western country and the woman converts to Islam, does she HAVE TO divorce her non-muslim husband? Any links to the evidence of opinions to this question are greatly appreciated. Thanks.
Posts: 13440 | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
It's bizarre imo. But you read this often on Salafi sites. I find it strange that there are some sheikhs who always try to stress "the importance of the family", up to the point that they advise women who are suffering from domestic abuse to "be patient and stay with their husband for the sake of the family", or issue fatwas saying that women don't have the right to divorce. Yet, in the case of a woman converting they try to brainwash her into leaving her husband. Quite a double standard imo.
Marriage in Islam
Is the Qurānic prohibition of marriage to unbelievers applicable to all non-Muslims? More specifically are Muslim women only allowed to marry Muslim men? Perhaps not.
Firstly - the Qur'ān describes different types of people, there are for example:
Believers
Believers before the time of the Prophet Muhammad (saw): Surah al-I-Imran 3:52, 67
Muslims: Surah al-Hajj 22:78
Faithful People of the Book: Surah al-Ma'idah 5:6;?Surah al-Muddaththir 74:31
Those who believe in Allah (swt), the Last Day & do good deeds: Surah al-Baqarah 2:62; Surah al-Ma'idah 5:72;
Unbelievers
Unfaithful People of the Book: Surah al-Bayyinah 98:1, 6; Surah al-Hashr 59:2
Hypocrites (those who called themselves Muslims but secretly disbelieve): Surah al-Munafiqun 63:1; Surah al-Ahzab 33:1
If we understand Islam as more than one specific religious dispensation, instead the entire body of Allah's (swt) revelation to the cosmos, then we can say that there are those who are generically muslim who may not necessarily follow the specific sharī'ah as we know it from Prophet Muhammad (saw). The Qur'ān says that *any* (not just "Muslims") who believe in Allah (swt), believe in the concept of being held accountable for one's actions, and do good works "shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve" (Sūrah al-Baqarah 2:62; Sūrah al-Ma'idah 5:72).
The Qur'ān points to this idea of a 'meta-religion' in that it describes all of Allah's (swt) revelatory messages to humanity have been part of the one deen. Abraham (saw) was neither a "Jew" nor a "Christian" but one who submitted himself to Allah (swt).
In regard to marriage, the Qur'ān (Sūrah al-Baqarāh 2:221) says that Muslim men and women may not marry those of the second category - the unbelievers (al-mushrikaat & al-mushrikiin). However the Qur'an does say that chaste women from the People of the Book are lawful.
Now there is a general principle that unless something is specifically negatively qualified for women (or simply doesn't make sense), laws are understood to be applicable for women as well as for men mutatis mutandis. In this case there is no negative qualifier for Muslim women against marrying men from the People of the Book.
Put another way the Qur'an does not say that Muslim women may *not* marry men from the People of the Book. (The verse about not marrying unbelieving men does not apply because that verse applies specifically to the category of al-mushrikiin.) But even having said that, as long as person fits into the first broad category of 'believer' then he or she is halal for a Muslim or Muslimah. It is the unbelievers who are forbidden to both men and women.
So what is the definition of an "unbeliever"? The Qur'an paints a picture of a person in *active* rebellion against Allah (swt).
* They worship false gods: Surah al-Anbiyya 21:98
* Plot and plan against the Muslims: Surah al-Anfal 8:30
* Spend their wealth hindering people from the path of Allah (swt): Surah al-Anfal 8:36
* Protect one another against the Muslims: Surah al-Anfal 8:73
* Fight against the Muslims: Surah an-Nisa 4:101-2
* Dispute about the signs of Allah (swt): Surah al-Mu'min 40:4
* Detest the call of Allah (swt): Surah al-Mu'min 40:14
* Ridicule the Prophet (saw): Surah al-Anbiyya 21:36
* Regard the Qur'an as lies and sorcery: Surah al-Ahqaf 46:7; ?Surah Saba 34:43
* Scoff at the idea of the Hour: Surah Saba 34:3, 7;?Surah at-Taghabun 64:7
* Reject all of Allah's (swt) scripture: Surah Saba 34:31
* Dispute with vain arguments in order to weaken truth: Surah al-Kahf 18:56
* Revel in self-glory and separatism: Surah Suad 38:2
* Discount the divine nature of revelation: Surah al-An'am 6:25
* Persecute the Prophets (saw): Surah Ibrahim 14:13
* Persist in rejecting truth: Surah al-Buruj 85:19
* Deny spiritual existence - the Hereafter: Surah Qaf 50:2, 12;?Surah an-Naml 27:67
However even if a Muslim woman is married to a mushrik, then she is not required to divorce him as evidenced by the situation regarding the Prophet's (saw) daughter Zaynab who was married to an unbeliever who fought against the Muslims at the Battle of Badr. Whilst the Prophet (saw) asked that Zaynab return to Medina, the marriage was not dissolved and when the husband did finally accept Islam they resumed cohabitation.
The Qur'an narrates the principle that it is not fitting to be married to a person who is in active rebellion and hatred towards the Beloved Creator whether they are wife or husband, male or female is beside the point.
Secondly, the overarching principle of the Qur'an is the equality of women and men. Recognising however that in some cultures full equality is unachievable (as in 7th century Arabia) the Qur'an then provides a certain number of laws that provide a pattern in situations where women cannot achieve full equality (and thus are dependent on their husbands). This is similar to the concept that the spirit of the Qur'an preaches abolition of slavery but recognises and provides for those cultures which cannot achieve abolition straight away.
If a Muslim woman is in a situation where she can achieve equality then she can stipulate this in her marriage contract. As such she no longer is required to be dependent on her husband and can claim full equal rights. And Allah (swt) knows best.
posted
Firstly: A muslim woman who reverted for God's Sake and uttered the testimony of God( which includes the oneness of God) should invite her husband to Islam. If her husband accepted the message and uttered the testimony of God, he became a muslim whether he declared to people or not.
Secondly: If he disbleive, we need to know the reasons ; we have some probabilities. *He didn't understand about Islam . She should explain to him.
* He is afraid of some social problem, He can hide his reversion to people till he obtain the bravery.
* He is blind with no hope, in this case a muslim woman should seek a divorce. and when he sees , she can back to him.
IMHO , an Intelligent Loving husband who wants to keeping his muslim wife will submit to Allah instruction. You will say this is not a pure faith in the begining. this faith will turn into a pure faith after profoundly learning about Islam.
Posts: 1007 | From: http://www.sultan.org | Registered: Mar 2006
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quote:Originally posted by With a name like Smuckers: My husband and I are having a debate, can you help?
If a non-muslim man and woman are married and live in a Western country and the woman converts to Islam, does she HAVE TO divorce her non-muslim husband? Any links to the evidence of opinions to this question are greatly appreciated. Thanks.
According to whom that should be. Anyone can give you an answer followed by 'Allah knows best' to stress that it is 'the' answer.
Posts: 1419 | From: Amsterdam, Netherlands | Registered: Aug 2003
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posted
If she converted after they were already married, no she does NOT have to divorce him (it was a pretty big discussion a while back). I realize this is contrary to what many muslims may think (assumption on my part, so don't jump down my throat for this).
I will try to find the evidence for it, but there are even examples from hadiths of this woman who converted (I wish I could remember her name) eventhough her husband didn't, and she remained married to him. Then there was some kind of war and there was some kind of exchange where she was given the option of being released from obligation to remain married to the man (this was used as one of the references used by the islamic scholar to justify that divorce was not necessary).
-------------------- Disclaimer: My posts are not meant to personally offend anyone. If you find yourself reading my posts repeatedly, you are kindly asked to seek the help of a professional Posts: 483 | From: cairo | Registered: Mar 2006
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Muslim men may wed non-Muslim women whereas Muslim women are, in theory, not allowed to marry non-Muslim men. Now Abdullahi An-Naim has published a book that takes a close look at Muslims and inter-religious marriages. Yogi Sikand has read it
Muslim societies are commonly assumed to strictly abide by shariah-based rules in personal and family law matters, including issues related to marriage. The ulama of the different law schools have developed elaborate rules regarding marriage, including marriage between Muslims and people of other faiths.
Yet, as this book highlights, there is often a hiatus between theoretical prescriptions and actual practice in this regard. This book deals with the issue of inter-religious marriages involving Muslims, looking at how inter-religious couples negotiate their marriages that are often in violation of what are seen as shariah rules.
Men as guardians of women
As Abdullahi An-Naim points out in his introduction to this volume, the shariah allows for Muslim men to marry women belonging to communities traditionally considered to be "People of the Book" (ahl-e kitab), but it forbids them from marrying other women. Muslim women are, in theory, not allowed to marry non-Muslim men.
This reflects, An-Naim says, the underlying notion that Muslim men are guardians of women. It also reflects the belief that Muslims are superior to non-Muslims.
The very fact of marriages taking place against received rules of normative shariah suggests that Muslims who enter into such marriages have their own, alternate understandings of Islam, which need to be explored.
In an increasingly inter-connected world, such cross-community marriages are on the increase, and this calls for new, contextually relevant understandings of shariah on the subject to be developed that, contrary to traditional notions, are firmly rooted in gender equality and a more accommodative approach to people of other faiths.
The book is divided into three chapters, each of which looks at inter-religious marriages involving Muslims. In their chapter on India, Rohit Chopra and Jyoti Punwani examine over 50 such cases in Mumbai, India's most populous city with a fairly sizeable Muslim population.
The Muslims of Mumbai, they write, consist of a number of different sectarian, linguistic and caste communities. In a country where caste endogamy is the general rule, these various Muslim communities rarely marry among themselves, and marriages between Muslims and other communities are even rarer.
In the current political climate in India, where right-wing Hindu organizations are particularly strong and have been responsible, often with the collusion of agencies of the state, for organized massacres of Muslims, inter-community relations have come under increasing strain.
Mingling among the middle class and elites
Yet, despite this, marriages between Muslims and other communities, including Hindus, Parsis and Christians, do occur, particularly among the middle class and elites. In this regard, the authors discuss such issues as reasons for such marriages, the reaction of families to such marriages and the upbringing of children from such unions.
An interesting subject that the authors dwell on in detail is the mutual perceptions of the spouses of each other's religion and community. Often such marriages result in one partner converting to the religion of his or her spouse. In other cases there is no conversion at all, often in the case when neither of the partners practices religion.
In yet other cases, the partners follow their own religion while also developing an appreciation of each others' religion, participating in festivals of both religions and developing an inclusive understanding of religion that transcends narrowly inscribed communal boundaries.
Ethnicity stronger than religion in Senegal
The chapter on Senegal by Codou Bop examines cases of inter-religious marriages involving Muslims, both men and women, and non-Muslims, particularly Catholics. She notes that for many Senegalese, ethnicity, rather than religion, is a primary marker of identity and that Senegalese Muslims and Catholics share many customs and traditions, which makes inter-religious marriage a less problematic issue than it would otherwise be.
Yet, Christian and Islamic revivalist movements and tendencies have definitely impacted on Christian-Muslim relations in Senegal, making it more difficult for inter-religious couples to gain social acceptance, although such marriages are recognized as legal by the Senegalese state.
The concluding chapter, on inter-religious marriages in Istanbul, Turkey, by Somnur Vardar, looks at cases of marriage involving Sunni Muslims and Alevis, Christians and Jews.
Despite the fact that Turkey is a secular state, Vardar notes the difficulties involved in gaining social acceptance for such unions. As in the case of India and Senegal, such marriages often involve conversion of one partner to the faith of the other (often that of the husband).
In other cases, they lead to changing notions of religion and identity, often involving some sort of syncretism and borrowing from both traditions, or else to simple indifference to religion altogether.
Alternate notions of the religious "other"
Based as it is on in-depth ethnographic studies, this book would be found useful to readers interested in inter-community relations, for it portrays "ordinary" Muslims' perceptions of Islam that are not reflected in shariah-centred debates and that offer alternate and more accepting notions of the religious "other".
That said, one crucial point that is missing from the book is how the growing number of inter-religious marriages in countries dealt with here have been responded to by Islamic religious authorities and how they have, if at all, sought to revise traditional normative rules governing marriages between Muslims and others.
-------------------- Disclaimer: My posts are not meant to personally offend anyone. If you find yourself reading my posts repeatedly, you are kindly asked to seek the help of a professional Posts: 483 | From: cairo | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
I have talked to several muslims both men and women on this subject and they all agree that yes , there must be a divorce for the fact that children born to the marriage take the religion of the father. So there would be problems in her raising her children as muslims if the father doesnt agree and he is going to influence them in ways that are negative to their learning islam properly by not following islam. (I am running into that exact thing with my childrens father, I have converted of course and I am teaching my children of islam as they request, mainly my youngest child as she has a natural love for it already, but his influence is making it difficult for her to stick to the halal things as for food and things. He keeps telling her not to be ridiculous and just eat what he gives her ,, and as she is only 7 and half , she doesnt have much choice but to follow his orders.)
quote:Originally posted by mysticheart: I have talked to several muslims both men and women on this subject and they all agree that yes , there must be a divorce
So because several muslims you spoke to agree on this it's supposed to be a fact?!?
posted
Wow Dalia you responded three times in this thread it must really be important to you, are you Muslim?
Ok, thanks for everyone else who responded, my husband and I have done some further research into this subject...it's always nice to get the point of view from other Muslims and their intrepretations.
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posted
Yes, I think this subject is quite important. But I can open a new thread on it if my replies are bothering you. Posts: 3587 | Registered: Mar 2006
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quote:Originally posted by sultan.org(In Makka ): *He didn't understand about Islam . She should explain to him.
* He is afraid of some social problem, He can hide his reversion to people till he obtain the bravery.
* He is blind with no hope, in this case a muslim woman should seek a divorce. and when he sees , she can back to him.
Islam accept that Christianity and Juadism are heavenly releigions and it has been taught that at schools either,Now if Islam accepted the equality position of the other two relegions,it can't now accusing who belongs to other heavenly releigion as Kafir or Infidel which conflict with acceptance as revelation from God and also it will give the right for Christian Husband to teach Christianity to his wife same as she wants to do with him...what do you think.
Posts: 653 | From: Great Manchester | Registered: Apr 2007
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posted
Freshsoda, People whatever u label christian, jewish, muslims, who believe/testify That God is one and that Moses, Jesus, and Mohamed are the prophets of Allah. those people r muslims ( SUMBISSION TO GOD) .
Now, the belief of the christian today is very unclear to me, some believe in trinity {god is 3} and some doesnt believe in the prophet mohammed which was fortold in their bible. We can't say those are believer till they believe the right things in their bible. this is very clear that No verse in Bible stating trinity till now.
AFTER THE BELIEF, THE OTHER IMPORTANT PARTS OF RELIGION COMES WHICH IS THE OTHER BASICS OF WORSHIPS ( PRAYER, CHARITY.. etc)
Posts: 2728 | From: جمهورية مصر العربية | Registered: Sep 2006
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quote:Originally posted by mysticheart: but his influence is making it difficult for her to stick to the halal things as for food and things. He keeps telling her not to be ridiculous and just eat what he gives her ,, and as she is only 7 and half , she doesnt have much choice but to follow his orders.)
posted
Originally posted by Mr Amr El-Wahabbi: Freshsoda, People whatever u label christian, jewish, muslims, who believe/testify That God is one and that Moses, Jesus, and Mohamed are the prophets of Allah. those people r muslims ( SUMBISSION TO GOD)
Jews,Christians Testify that God is one so what! the only difference that Christians went deeply in the nature of God after teaching of Jesus,Muslims laying back and said God is one any more discussion is blasphemy,Jews thought Messiah will be a king and would rule their nation while Jesus told them save your treasure in heaven where cannot be destroyed by moths,so they rejected him as the Messiah and still waiting.
Now, the belief of the christian today is very unclear to me, some believe in trinity {god is 3} and some doesnt believe in the prophet mohammed which was fortold in their bible. which Bible you mean?!the current one you believe it was corrupted or another one not in our planet!!do you think Muhammed as an Arabic person didn't belong to any of Jew's tribes neither spoke Hebrew would have been foretold to Jews nation as the coming prophet after Moses or Jesus!! and how he could speak with them?? by signs or body langauge..come on man wake up from this miconception legacies and legends you inherited on Blind like other millions without logically discussion or analyzing and stop accusing God that he wasn't able to portect his words against corruption or altering,think again and be realistic.
Posts: 653 | From: Great Manchester | Registered: Apr 2007
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