posted
Is it possible that dark matter is a field that envelops ordinary matter. Consequently could dark matter be what our conscience self is made of?
Posts: 4028 | From: NW USA | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
AlTakruri I thought dark matter only exists in intergalactic outer space? So did I!!
Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
| IP: Logged |
posted
No Dark Matter is all around us and can move between regular matter unnoticed. It is theorized that it is the reason why we exist at all. We know there is a relationship between regular matter and dark matter. There is also significantly more dark matter than regular matter. The question is, can their be a type of life form or entity that can be made out of this substance that we cannot detect. Something that can detect us but we cannot detect it. Something that can influence us but not the other way around. Something aware in the mist of dark matter clouds.
-------------------- Across the sea of time, there can only be one of you. Make you the best one you can be. Posts: 4028 | From: NW USA | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
I would have to agree with al Takruri and Brada-Anansi.
Quantum Mechanics has opened up the ''supernatural'' book, according to what I've seen on the Science Channel. It would be interesting to see who does the metaphysical theorizing on ''dark matter all around us'' and how many quantum scientists agree with it.
Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
My comment seems to reflect that the two posters agree with my comment. My comment however is independent of their thinking that dark matter is galactic? in nature which is my understanding also. My comment should have been prefaced by ''Having said that, Quantum Mechanics has opened up...''Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
^ dark matter does open up metaphysical questions since it has no physical representation. It is the "paranormal" or "supernatural" of modern day science.
I think it is completely natural to ask a simple question: if there is something in the universe that cannot be seen, touched, etc, but is the nature by which we have formed into planets, start, galaxies, etc, then how is that different than what superstitious people believe?
-------------------- Across the sea of time, there can only be one of you. Make you the best one you can be. Posts: 4028 | From: NW USA | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by osirion: No Dark Matter is all around us and can move between regular matter unnoticed. It is theorized that it is the reason why we exist at all. We know there is a relationship between regular matter and dark matter. There is also significantly more dark matter than regular matter. The question is, can their be a type of life form or entity that can be made out of this substance that we cannot detect. Something that can detect us but we cannot detect it. Something that can influence us but not the other way around. Something aware in the mist of dark matter clouds.
Posts: 1819 | From: odesco baba | Registered: Feb 2005
| IP: Logged |
''The question is, can their be a type of life form or entity that can be made out of this substance that we cannot detect. Something that can detect us but we cannot detect it. Something that can influence us but not the other way around. Something aware in the mist of dark matter clouds.''
Whose question is it, yours or a physicist? Since the topic is weird enough in itself in terms of needing an explanation, and it has physicists scratching their collective heads, the issue is compounded by positing yet another unknown; an invisible entity; an entity that can interact on a material plane. I can't wrap my head around that one at all.
Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
I'm sure I saw a science show that was talking about black holes and it said there was one third dark matter...
Posts: 314 | From: australia | Registered: Jul 2010
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: Is dark matter being confused for anti-matter? Anti-matter is all around. Dark matter is light years away. No?
Dark matter is light years away?
Might want to think of it like a mist that you are encapsulated in that provides gravitons that other wise we would not have planets and stars in the first place. A particle with its own field that is able to pass through ordinary matter undetected. It is matter that is around ordinary matter.
posted
I you took away the rectangles the ordinary unschooled eye will see nothing. So a schooled-eye is only to those in that community who have to grapple with what they are seeing. Think about it. Take away the rectangles. What do you see, or think you see? This stuff is too complex to make sense of to the layman. That's why the Quantum Mechanic people stay up all night scratching their heads. But have no fear, a 31st and 41st century physics will explain everything.
Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
The nature of dark matter is unknown that's why it's called dark matter. Its existence is inferred but it has never been detected.
Posts: 1038 | From: Franklin Park, NJ | Registered: Aug 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Is dark matter being confused with dark energy, a theoretical energy thought to homogenously occupy space? One evidenced for by the accelerating (instead of decelerating) rate at which galaxies are spreading apart from eachother after the Big Bang theoretically happened.
Posts: 5555 | From: Tha 5th Dimension. | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
Consciousness is something that has no associated particle or material substratum that can be used to prove its existence. It is merely inferred by observation.
Is an egg conscious but yet it is made out of the same material we are made of. What makes us aware? At the end of the telephone line that is our central nervous system - what or who is listening? What we are aware of is matter that envelops our conscious self. You are aware of your buttocks pressing down, due to gravity, on the seat you are seating in. You feel the pressure from the electromagnetic interplay of atoms surrounding you. All of this fed through your central nervous system to what? What is on the other end?
-------------------- Across the sea of time, there can only be one of you. Make you the best one you can be. Posts: 4028 | From: NW USA | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
Can anyone verify from science sources if dark matter, as known to science, is what takes up the space between galaxies. If not, then what do scientists say about dark matter?
In the early 1990's, one thing was fairly certain about the expansion of the Universe. It might have enough energy density to stop its expansion and recollapse, it might have so little energy density that it would never stop expanding, but gravity was certain to slow the expansion as time went on. Granted, the slowing had not been observed, but, theoretically, the Universe had to slow. The Universe is full of matter and the attractive force of gravity pulls all matter together. Then came 1998 and the Hubble Space Telescope (HST) observations of very distant supernovae that showed that, a long time ago, the Universe was actually expanding more slowly than it is today. So the expansion of the Universe has not been slowing due to gravity, as everyone thought, it has been accelerating. No one expected this, no one knew how to explain it. But something was causing it.
Eventually theorists came up with three sorts of explanations. Maybe it was a result of a long-discarded version of Einstein's theory of gravity, one that contained what was called a "cosmological constant." Maybe there was some strange kind of energy-fluid that filled space. Maybe there is something wrong with Einstein's theory of gravity and a new theory could include some kind of field that creates this cosmic acceleration. Theorists still don't know what the correct explanation is, but they have given the solution a name. It is called dark energy.
WHAT IS DARK ENERGY
More is unknown than is known. We know how much dark energy there is because we know how it affects the Universe's expansion. Other than that, it is a complete mystery. But it is an important mystery. It turns out that roughly 70% of the Universe is dark energy. Dark matter makes up about 25%. The rest - everything on Earth, everything ever observed with all of our instruments, all normal matter - adds up to less than 5% of the Universe. Come to think of it, maybe it shouldn't be called "normal" matter at all, since it is such a small fraction of the Universe.
WHAT IS DARK MATTER
By fitting a theoretical model of the composition of the Universe to the combined set of cosmological observations, scientists have come up with the composition that we described above, ~70% dark energy, ~25% dark matter, ~5% normal matter. What is dark matter? We are much more certain what dark matter is not than we are what it is. First, it is dark, meaning that it is not in the form of stars and planets that we see. Observations show that there is far too little visible matter in the Universe to make up the 25% required by the observations. Second, it is not in the form of dark clouds of normal matter, matter made up of particles called baryons. We know this because we would be able to detect baryonic clouds by their absorption of radiation passing through them. Third, dark matter is not antimatter, because we do not see the unique gamma rays that are produced when antimatter annihilates with matter. Finally, we can rule out large galaxy-sized black holes on the basis of how many gravitational lenses we see. High concentrations of matter bend light passing near them from objects further away, but we do not see enough lensing events to suggest that such objects to make up the required 25% dark matter contribution. However, at this point, there are still a few dark matter possibilities that are viable. Baryonic matter could still make up the dark matter if it were all tied up in brown dwarfs or in small, dense chunks of heavy elements. These possibilities are known as massive compact halo objects, or "MACHOs". But the most common view is that dark matter is not baryonic at all, but that it is made up of other, more exotic particles like axions or WIMPS (Weakly Interacting Massive Particles). However, at this point, there are still a few dark matter possibilities that are viable. Baryonic matter could still make up the dark matter if it were all tied up in brown dwarfs or in small, dense chunks of heavy elements. These possibilities are known as massive compact halo objects, or "MACHOs". But the most common view is that dark matter is not baryonic at all, but that it is made up of other, more exotic particles like axions or WIMPS (Weakly Interacting Massive Particles).Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Maybe the reader can understand why there are science ''fiction''? writers; fiction in the sense that it may not be that, but we don't yet know how to unravel a physics that reaches far beyond our capacity to even comprehend. Maybe this stuff is several thousand years into the future.
Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
This dark energy is thought to homogenously fill space and not fill matter?
If so gravity can be thought of as matter pushing dark energy aside, or atleast occupying position dark energy wants to occupy -- and the result is like if you push or pull a spring out of its balanced "happy" state of rest: something's got to give. Say you have two mass objects in a fixed frame of referene -- get less space energy between them, get them close enough and the energy which pushes into the "matter" and away from itself creates a suction effect instead of affecting expansion. I guess one can think of this like charged particles in a see of "content" particles will hookup with eachother, like with single guys and gyals .
Posts: 5555 | From: Tha 5th Dimension. | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
I'm new to this forum and I say, you guys are a bunch of bright folks.
But I can never understand anything this Whatbox character is saying. If you don't mind me asking, do you go into a state of ecstatic trance before making your posts?
Posts: 89 | From: no blood-pressure | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
I grab ma bong. Sometimes i get distracted, skip and leave stuff out, half way edit to leave the message drastically altered or write stuff i don't intend.
btw the following,
get less space energy
could read
get less space (i.e. dark energy)
* was referring by space energy to dark energy, since its thought to homogenously fill space.
* "affecting expansion" was an excuse to use effect and affect, which are part of an annoying pointless rule of the English language, right next to eachother.
* If you didn't get the charged particles (particles with incomplete electron fields) and single people analogy, that has to do with your understandng of chemistry. No i didn't catch that i used see instead of sea and i could've sworn i ended the last sentance with 'surrounded by couples'.
Posts: 5555 | From: Tha 5th Dimension. | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by osirion: Consciousness is something that has no associated particle or material substratum that can be used to prove its existence. It is merely inferred by observation.
^ This i like.
Consciousness is awareness, sensitivity to something, a reaction things are connected by.
So from a non "organism" -centric point of view one could say reality in general is a universal consciousness or mind.
O.T. but yeah my basic idea was that the same force responsible for attraction of nearby objects is responsible for the repulsion of far off objects. Think about it: in general relativity "gravity" isn't thought of in terms of "virtual particles" but the bending of the curvature of spacetime, but general relativity isn't the whole story as it's incompatible wiith quantum mechanics. Think about it like an elastic styrofoam you force a spherical object into. The area right around the object will have pressure exerted upon it by the invasive object. Areas further away will be closer to their default density and eventually a point is reached where they push back.
Quantum mechanics is problematic for Relativity because it's closer to the root of gravitational force to begin with, which is the beginning of mass.
Think of other examples of duality based constructs and mechanisms now understood to be one or have the line between them blurred revealing a connection: energy & matter, space and time, particle and wave.
Posts: 5555 | From: Tha 5th Dimension. | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
So you do stay up at night trying to figure out this stuff. Do you think it will hold up another 10 years?
Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
dark matter supposedly is the invisible matter that holds everything in the universe together. it is very metaphysical concept, some scientist don't even think it exist
Posts: 89 | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Grumman: So you do stay up at night trying to figure out this stuff.
Actually i fell asleep, woke up and decided to re-explain myself. And the first time i read about dark energy which is styll a mystery and a hypothetical concept was right after reading of gravity being conceptualized of as the curvature of spacetime according to the Relativity school of thought. Basically i thought, what if gravity was a result of bending i.e. pressure in this hypothetical field of universally homogenous dark energy? And also, what if baryons are just a manipulated energy. Remember, atoms were once thought to be things one can't break down ... yet out of all those elements we get protons and neutrons, and of those we get positrons and neutrinos.
Anyway just refreshing my mind a little. This was an old idea that hadn't been in my consciousness for about a year or more until this thread reminded me of it, so i'm floating it out here instead of leaving it in ma head.
Not that difficult an idea, unless we were the ones doing the experiments. This is interesting enough to ask a scientist or Professor. But it's no philosophy ..
Posts: 5555 | From: Tha 5th Dimension. | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by osirion: Consciousness is something that has no associated particle or material substratum that can be used to prove its existence. It is merely inferred by observation.
^ This i like.
Consciousness is awareness, sensitivity to something, a reaction things are connected by.
So from a non "organism" -centric point of view one could say reality in general is a universal consciousness or mind.
O.T. but yeah my basic idea was that the same force responsible for attraction of nearby objects is responsible for the repulsion of far off objects. Think about it: in general relativity "gravity" isn't thought of in terms of "virtual particles" but the bending of the curvature of spacetime, but general relativity isn't the whole story as it's incompatible wiith quantum mechanics. Think about it like an elastic styrofoam you force a spherical object into. The area right around the object will have pressure exerted upon it by the invasive object. Areas further away will be closer to their default density and eventually a point is reached where they push back.
Quantum mechanics is problematic for Relativity because it's closer to the root of gravitational force to begin with, which is the beginning of mass.
Think of other examples of duality based constructs and mechanisms now understood to be one or have the line between them blurred revealing a connection: energy & matter, space and time, particle and wave.
Not sure how a warp in the space time continuim would result in pushing an object away unless there is a wave that ripples outward as a result of the bending. But then if we consider how mass came into being, we should expect shock waves to form. Small shock waves being sent out from each particle in existence.
Interesting point about duality that could indeed extend itself into discussions about consciousness. The point of this thread was to question the duality of matter and dark matter. If there is a relationship between regulat matter we can see and dark matter that we cannot, can there be consciousness in dark matter? Can a being made of dark matter be possible? Such a being would be aware of regular matter but not the other way around. Such a being could impact regular matter but only with a significant amount of dark matter energy. Dark matter would necessarily have dark energy. Dark energy permeates space/time.
Again - there could be dark matter beings. Based on the relationship dark matter has with regular matter, we ourselves could be a mixture of the seen and the unseen.
Posts: 4028 | From: NW USA | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged |
Again - there could be dark matter beings. Based on the relationship dark matter has with regular matter, we ourselves could be a mixture of the seen and the unseen.
indeed...
Posts: 89 | From: no blood-pressure | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
Maybe these scientists ought to get in the business of making viewing devices that will reveal this particular unseen.
Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Dark matter cannot be seen since it emits no radiation nor absorbs photons. Therefore dark matter is completely invisible to our perceptions.
Dark matter does have mass and using this characteristic assists scientists presently in measuring dark matter gravitational pull by observing it's lensing effects on a distant object.This exercise allows scientist to then calculate mass. Obviously these measurements have in their mids conclusively shows the universe is primarily comprised of dark matter
quote:Originally posted by Grumman: Maybe these scientists ought to get in the business of making viewing devices that will reveal this particular unseen.
Where to start?
Posts: 89 | From: no blood-pressure | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Grumman: Maybe these scientists ought to get in the business of making viewing devices that will reveal this particular unseen.
Not really,
We just only recently in the last century been able to document the existence of sub-atomic particles. We don't really know what the hell dark matter really is or dark energy is. People think that dark energy is causing the universe to expand. Some people think its effects are just an illusion!
When you start to really delve really deep down into the nature of matter, weird things happen like locality and linear time breaking down.
Posts: 89 | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
''That's why the Quantum Mechanic people stay up all night scratching their heads.''Posts: 2118 | From: midwest, USA | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Ceasar: When you start to really delve really deep down into the nature of matter, weird things happen like locality and linear time breaking down.
-> Uncertainty, right?
So somethin could just be phuckin with the light causing the universe to appear to be expanding at a faster rate?
It may not really have anything to do with science, but i'd rather believe that the world isn't a series of cyclic big bangs, i.e. going in circles like a loop in programming. Those can get boring. It don't have to be linear, it can have derivatives as well as integrals.
Then again, if the circle was different everytime that'd make it an expanding spiral or something.
Posts: 5555 | From: Tha 5th Dimension. | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Ceasar: When you start to really delve really deep down into the nature of matter, weird things happen like locality and linear time breaking down.
-> Uncertainty, right?
So somethin could just be phuckin with the light causing the universe to appear to be expanding at a faster rate?
It may not really have anything to do with science, but i'd rather believe that the world isn't a series of cyclic big bangs, i.e. going in circles like a loop in programming. Those can get boring. It don't have to be linear, it can have derivatives as well as integrals.
Then again, if the circle was different everytime that'd make it an expanding spiral or something.
yeh its Heisenberg uncertainty principle.
Its impossible to determine simultaneously both the position of a subatomic particle with any great degree of accuracy or certainty.
If you want to know why go do some research on the double slit experience or if you want to really stretch your brain go do some research on the the phenomena of Schrodinger cat
Posts: 89 | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
According to multiple universe theory and chaotic inflation theory endless amount of universes are being created by an endless amount of big bangs that make up the meta-verse. Each universe has its own set of laws that are different from this one. According to this theory anything that is possible will eventually happen or has already happened. The avatar, lord of the rings, star-wars storyline are all realities in other universes
The multi-verse theory is supported by quantum mechanics. I do believe in god but I also do believe that this universe isn't the only universe there is.
Posts: 89 | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
Lol I think when you start talking about multiple universes and things like that it makes earth and its history seem so small and insignificant
Posts: 89 | Registered: Nov 2010
| IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
.
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Do you think it will hold up another 10 years?
Printer-friendly view of this topic