posted
This was something that came to mind while preparing to color a recent Cleopatra drawing of mine. Now, while I know Cleopatra VII would have been Macedonian on her father's side, her mother's exact identity seems to be unknown and it seems her (half?) sister Arsinoe's skeletal remains had a mixture of African and European traits. Therefore, I'm quite partial to the idea that Cleopatra herself may have been biracial, as in an African/Macedonian mix.
If this was the case, how dark could she have gotten? Most biracial people I've seen seem to have Halle Berry's light yellow-brown color, but then most of them here in the US would be mixed with pale Northern Europeans. Would a biracial person be darker if the non-African side of their ancestry was olive-skinned Mediterranean rather than Nordic? In which case, could Cleo and Arsinoe have been a moderately brown color, like Gabrielle Union for example?
posted
I would apply Sienna,light yellow, and white colors, to Mixing a light brown color. If you want to enhance, just add a little bit dash of Cadmium Red.
-------------------- ---lnnnnn* Posts: 198 | From: USA | Registered: Aug 2014
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quote:Originally posted by Thereal: It depends as whites are near fixed albino group so it's rare for a union with them to produce someone very dark,that is some what true for Chinese type folks but they have a different version of albinism so dark Chinese type people are possible, Winslow m iwaki is blasian but doesn't look as mixed.
I'm pretty sure Mediterranean people, like the ancient Macedonians (presumably), wouldn't have been as pale as Northern Europeans (let alone people from any population who actually do have albinism). I understand they tend to have dark hair and eyes as well as olive/tan skin.
posted
The Mediterranean covers Asia, African and Europe it doesn't really have much meaning in terms of race because north Africans and modern mid easterners look the same, assuming they were always like that you have to explain the various black populations in those areas on top of that mid easterners and north Africans are consider a white related group so the race question is already confusing.
Posts: 1123 | From: New York | Registered: Feb 2016
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posted
Considering that Cleopatra was half Greek and she lived in a time after great Asiatic migration into Egypt, I doubt she'd be that dark to be perfectly honest. Although biracials can be very dark.
Posts: 2508 | From: . | Registered: Nov 2011
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quote:Originally posted by Lion: European traits? LOL
What are those? Barbarism? LOL!
-------------------- “Three things cannot be long hidden: the sun, the moon, and the truth.” Posts: 195 | From: Southern Africa(Azania) | Registered: Mar 2017
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posted
how dark and how white. Dark as the father white as the mother
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
Ha! Ha! Ha! You are a real clown. You know that....
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
I don't know where most of these silly conclusions are coming from, but the chances that Cleopatra was as light as Meghan Markle are really slim. And this is for the simple reason that many of the nations around the Mediterranean basin were not as white as we see them today.
In fact Meghan Markle is what would be considered white in those regions, and would still be today, given there are still a number of brown complexioned people in those areas today.
Let us consider the faulty reasoning here.
Assume for instance that the Ancient Egyptians emigrated form the Nile areas to the Mediterranean. What is the evidence that they would have stopped at the boundaries of the Mediterranean shores? They would have moved and settled further in Europe even if the boundaries of their empire was closer to Africa. We have to distinguish between areas where they had settlements and colonies, and the actual boundaries of their empire.
Commonsense indicated that they would have had settlements in Europe, and some of those settlers would have acquired positions of power within the communities they settled for formed alliances with, given that they had the resources and knowledge of the empire at their disposal.
Take Alexander the Great who was described as swarthy, or Arsinoe, a sister of Cleopatra who was believed to have "an African mother" from her skeletal remains. He is the "ruddy" complexioned guy on the horse.
This is how Indian artists portrayed him because they had no reason to believe he was white-skinned. Given that Alexander died in India, they probably have a better idea of how he looked like. We are looking at history from the skewed perspective of white West European scholars when the history of West Asians may be more accurate.
How often do we see portrayals of Byzantine era emperors as dark-skinned people for us to believe that even during that era, many of the nobles were white-skinned?
"Caucasoid" features do not imply white skin.
-------------------- The Habsburg Agenda - Defending Western Christian civilization Posts: 890 | From: London | Registered: Apr 2014
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Ruddy, doesn't mean brown, it is more red than brown.
@Lioness - Which part of the statement that the fact that Alexander died in India means they probably have a better idea of how he looked like.
The Indians got it right because many of their population look like that. White skinned Europeans refuse to acknowledge it because it means that Alexander did not look like them. They just don't want to accept that they are the A word.
If you want to see what "ruddy" means, Google "ruddy animals" and you won't see a single animal with the pink skin of contemporary whites. Of course if you search for humans you will be given pictures of white people with faces reddened to various degrees.
The red complexion in the Indian painting is probably closer to what he might have been. White-skinned Europeans still cannot come to grips that many medieval Europeans natives were what they call Black today, and that some still are.
Ruddy, doesn't mean brown, it is more red than brown.
@Lioness - Which part of the statement that the fact that Alexander died in India means they probably have a better idea of how he looked like.
The Indians got it right because many of their population look like that.
Iskandar (Alexander the Great) meeting the Brahmans. A miniature painting from an eighteenth century manuscript of the latter half of the epic poem of Shahnama. India, 1719. Shelfmark: Add.18804 Page Folio Number: f.117v
^ These are the Greek skin tones according to this 18th century Indian painting. Do you have a picture of a real person that matches closely to the top square, The Alexander skin tone?
Posts: 42940 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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posted
Sapna Parikh's skin tone at left compared to the skin tone of Alexander in the 18th century Indian painting Can you find a better real person match for the Alexander skin tone?
Posts: 42940 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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posted
Yeah,because of mixing.there several known version of albinism with several sub categories where the expression of albinism isn't as bad compared to oca1, here's a discription of oca3 in Africans and a Japanese person.
Visual anomalies, such as nystagmus, are frequently undetectable and patients usually present with one of two phenotypes: rufous OCA (ROCA), characterized by red-bronze skin color, blue or brown irises and ginger-red hair, or brown OCA (BOCA), characterized by light to brown hair and a light to brown or tan skin color. The clinical features of OCA3 have been considered as rather mild, and in the rare cases of non-African patients, reddish hair color has been reported. A Japanese girl was reported with having OCA3 who presented with blond hair and light skin (with a small Mongolian spot), was able to tan and was negative for nystagmus.
Posts: 1123 | From: New York | Registered: Feb 2016
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posted
Beyoku. You do know this is fake? This was discussed already
quote:Originally posted by sudaniya:
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,:
brown skin,
Alexander the Great, detail of Alexander Mosaic Date circa 100BC
Not even close to brown.
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
I know, I'm talking about gramps' long and hilarious track record of accusing ES members of being other ES members or other nationalities (e.g. "Hindoos"). Sometimes it's very obvious the people he mixes up are completely different people, but his mix ups are perfectly logical to him.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
Thanks but I do not see the albinism connection you make on that website. Is this a theory you created or it is established and wildly accepted in the field?
quote:Originally posted by Thereal: This isn't a technical site but important information is on the net also the mixed part is for the Americas.
Jacqueline - Motherland Journey Documentary (Jamaica's most beautiful white woman)
The woman is 72% Black, 28%, approx three-quarters black, one quarter white, a griffe, basically. You can see how dark she is. A "white" arab is not the same as a North European white male.
People like Colin Powell and Adam Clayton Powell would be "white" if they were Arabs.
So the idea that Kola is too dark to be the biracial daughter of white Arab is plain nonsensical. I know that because I am personally acquainted with people like that, such as the offspring of an African male with a Turkish woman.
Are General Sisi and Mohammed Morsi black Arabs or a white Arabs? Don't forget that in Africa and Arabia even people as dark as Kola Boof herself or even darker can be Arabs.
What is this attitude with some Egyptsearch moderators, and why should people who can get so personally involved in discussions be moderators in the first place?
I pointed out Kola Boof's background to explain why she takes the stance on colour and colourism in the way she does and a moderator feels he has to mock her. Why this attitude?
quote:Originally posted by Oshun:
-------------------- The Habsburg Agenda - Defending Western Christian civilization Posts: 890 | From: London | Registered: Apr 2014
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quote: So the idea that Kola is too dark to be the biracial daughter of white Arab is plain nonsensical. I know that because I am personally acquainted with people like that, such as the offspring of an African male with a Turkish woman.
You got what I was saying wrong. I was saying she is an example of how dark a child with parents of two different races can be.
...I'm not a mod either.
Posts: 2508 | From: . | Registered: Nov 2011
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