Originally posted by Yonis2:
Obama connecting to his Somalid roots.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
quote:What are you basing this date on?
Originally posted by MaximallyAbstract_Faith:
modern West Africans are mostly E3a because of events happening 30-10 kya including the Neolithic Sahara so basically yes.
quote:Well ofcourse, there are plenty of Somalid Bantus mainly in East africa in particular Kenya and Tanzania. But somalids are more represented among the Nilotes than the Bantu. Rendille, Massai, Iraqwa, Luo and Sambura are all somalid nilotics. Obama is a half Somalid nilotic.
Originally posted by azkanasi ju:
Are there also "Somalid" Bantus, since Somalians are everywhere?
quote:There needs to be a definition of exactly what 'Somalid' is..
Originally posted by azkanasi ju:
Are there also "Somalid" Bantus, since Somalians are everywhere?
quote:Somalid is a unique profile of blood, everyone who carries this blood is a "Somalid", E1b1b is the scientific name of this blood. They all come from a single Northeast-African root, some more bastardized than others. Southern Greeks/Albanians/Anatolians and coastal levantines are watered down Somalids, northern Egyptians are also relatively watered down Somalids compared to cenral and southern Egyptians, same with kabyle and Riffian Berbers. 500 years from now if my male descendants continue living in northern Europe, they will all be watered down Somalids, but will still retain their Somalid signiture.
Originally posted by carambolas:
quote:There needs to be a definition of exactly what 'Somalid' is..
Originally posted by azkanasi ju:
Are there also "Somalid" Bantus, since Somalians are everywhere?
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
quote:No, not that far, since many clades carried by most modern people didn't even exist during that time, 60k is way to far back.
MaximallyAbstract_Faith wrote:
If "Somalid" counts for East Africans as far back as 60kya then all humanity is "Somalid".
quote:Specifically; what events would these be?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:What are you basing this date on?
Originally posted by MaximallyAbstract_Faith:
modern West Africans are mostly E3a because of events happening 30-10 kya including the Neolithic Sahara so basically yes.
quote:Obamas' father was from Kenya; NOT Somalia.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Obama connecting to his Somalid roots.
quote:According to whom kid; you?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Somalid is a unique profile of blood, everyone who carries this blood is a "Somalid", E1b1b is the scientific name of this blood.
quote:Could this be why an individual might try to portray a Somali; when truly he is not?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Somalids are masters when it comes to disguise,
quote:What genetic evidence do you possess, that indicates the individuals posted in that (your) thread are second generation "Somalids" or even Somalis ?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Check out these second generation Somalids and how they quickly fit in where ever they explore even the far east.
http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=8;t=005034;p=1
quote:According to whom did E3a and E3b split 30kya; and, amongst what populations did these mutations occur and how did they look phenotypically?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No, not that far, since many clades carried by most modern people didn't even exist during that time, 60k is way to far back.
E3a and E3b splited some 30 thousand years ago.
E3b mutated (somewhere in NE Africa) into sub-clades during the last 5-10 thousand years, which is quite recent.
quote:LOl, i don't claim Obama, i just state the facts.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Obamas' father was from Kenya; NOT Somalia.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Obama connecting to his Somalid roots.
Why are you referencing Obama as getting in touch with his "Somalid" roots?
quote:Which facts would these be; and according to whom?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:LOl, i don't claim Obama, i just state the facts
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Obamas' father was from Kenya; NOT Somalia.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Obama connecting to his Somalid roots.
Why are you referencing Obama as getting in touch with his "Somalid" roots?
quote:So according to you; there is no such thing as a Kenyan, I.e, they are really Somalis(your imaginary Somalids)?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Kenya is a modern nation with hundred of ethnicieties, if you didn' know, the whole northern kenya belongs to Somali nomads, it's not a heterogenous nation like Sweden.
quote:According to Cruciani et. al (2004).
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:According to whom did E3a and E3b split 30kya; and, amongst what populations did these mutations occur and how did they look phenotypically?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No, not that far, since many clades carried by most modern people didn't even exist during that time, 60k is way to far back.
E3a and E3b splited some 30 thousand years ago.
E3b mutated (somewhere in NE Africa) into sub-clades during the last 5-10 thousand years, which is quite recent.
quote:Go fetch?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:According to Cruciani et. al (2004).
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:According to whom did E3a and E3b split 30kya; and, amongst what populations did these mutations occur and how did they look phenotypically?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No, not that far, since many clades carried by most modern people didn't even exist during that time, 60k is way to far back.
E3a and E3b splited some 30 thousand years ago.
E3b mutated (somewhere in NE Africa) into sub-clades during the last 5-10 thousand years, which is quite recent.
I'm not going to act as your librarian go fetch it yourself.
![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
quote:It's completely relevant, as you're the one stating E3b derived mutations after a split from E3a 30kya; hence the question of where did these mutations you describe arise, and amongst whom?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Also, no one knows how they looked phenotypically, it's really irrelevant since phenotype is is an adaptive trait, only Nazis care about phenotype (Be they "black" or "white".)
quote:No! That's an un-intelligent way of interpreting my post.
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
So according to you; there is no such thing as a Kenyan, I.e, they are really Somalis(your imaginary Somalids)?
quote:So Kenyans and Somalians do not know amongst themselves who is who? Somalians in Keyna regard themselves as Kenyan?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:No! That's an un-intelligent way of interpreting my post.
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
So according to you; there is no such thing as a Kenyan, I.e, they are really Somalis(your imaginary Somalids)?
I said modern Kenya has hundreds of ethnicities it's no like Sweden where the overwhelming majority of it's people share same recent origin. Kenya is a melting pot of many different ethnicities where the Somali ethnicity is one among hundreds of Kenyan ethnicities.
quote:What's unintelligent is you promoting derivatives of E3b, and a man from Kenya as "Somalid".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:No! That's an un-intelligent way of interpreting my post.
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
So according to you; there is no such thing as a Kenyan, I.e, they are really Somalis(your imaginary Somalids)?
quote:Then why the hell are you arguing?
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
According to published data Africans descendant of AB and E [40kya~] lineages with the PN2 clade denoting the common ancestor of all E3A and E3b Africans with E3b splitting about 25kya~.
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
) still doesn't change the facts that E3a splited from E3b atleast 15kya before E3b mutated into it's current sub-clades.
quote:Do elaborate with a genetic explanation.....
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Yonis2:
[qb] I bet if Obama got tested today he would belong to the E1b1b family, which automatically makes him a Somalid, simple as that
quote:What did this mutation involve? Did these genetic mutations have effect on phenotypic changes etc..?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Then why the hell are you arguing?
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
According to published data Africans descendant of AB and E [40kya~] lineages with the PN2 clade denoting the common ancestor of all E3A and E3b Africans with E3b splitting about 25kya~.
I said about 30kya (okay you say 25kya, whatever the difference
quote:Obama is most likely a Somalid since his father is Luo
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:So Kenyans and Somalians do not know amongst themselves who is who? Somalians in Keyna regard themselves as Kenyan?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:No! That's an un-intelligent way of interpreting my post.
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
So according to you; there is no such thing as a Kenyan, I.e, they are really Somalis(your imaginary Somalids)?
I said modern Kenya has hundreds of ethnicities it's no like Sweden where the overwhelming majority of it's people share same recent origin. Kenya is a melting pot of many different ethnicities where the Somali ethnicity is one among hundreds of Kenyan ethnicities.
e.g., Obama stating that he is the son of a black Kenyan man is really false because according to you; he is a "Somalid"?
quote:Phenotype is a function of environment, so wherever these sub-clades mutated they adapted to their in-situ environment.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:What did this mutation involve? Did these genetic mutations ave effect on phenotypic changes etc..?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Then why the hell are you arguing?
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
According to published data Africans descendant of AB and E [40kya~] lineages with the PN2 clade denoting the common ancestor of all E3A and E3b Africans with E3b splitting about 25kya~.
I said about 30kya (okay you say 25kya, whatever the difference
Btw, no one is arguing, I am simply checking your reference.
quote:I see where you base your assumption on why Obama might have a Somali ancestor.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Obama is most likely a Somalid since his father is Luo
[/QB]
quote:In essence you're saying E1b1b admixture anywhere found comes from Somali expansions?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Btw, Somalids doesn't equall modern somalis, although modern Somalis are Somalids.
quote:No, not from Somalis expansion but from the ancestors of Somalis, expansion.
MaximallyAbstract_Faith wrote:
In essence you're saying E1b1b admixture anywhere found comes from Somali expansions?
quote:So why are you calling one derivative "Somalid"?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Phenotype is a function of environment, so wherever these sub-clades mutated they adapted to their in-situ environment.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:What did this mutation involve? Did these genetic mutations have effect on phenotypic changes etc..?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Then why the hell are you arguing?
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
According to published data Africans descendant of AB and E [40kya~] lineages with the PN2 clade denoting the common ancestor of all E3A and E3b Africans with E3b splitting about 25kya~.
I said about 30kya (okay you say 25kya, whatever the difference
Btw, no one is arguing, I am simply checking your reference.
quote:Again, according to whom?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:No, not from Somalis expansion but from the ancestors of Somalis, expansion.
MaximallyAbstract_Faith wrote:
In essence you're saying E1b1b admixture anywhere found comes from Somali expansions?
quote:All Northeast africans have the same recent root, that's just the way it is.
Again, according to whom?
What is exactly your definition of a "Somalid"?
Btw, I am not "Alive-what box" , a.k.a "MaximallyAbstract_Faith".
quote:All modern humans have an East African origin, and that's just the way it is; so what's your point
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:All Northeast africans have the same recent root, that's just the way it is.
Again, according to whom?
What is exactly your definition of a "Somalid"?
Btw, I am not "Alive-what box" , a.k.a "MaximallyAbstract_Faith".
quote:Yes, they also populated the whole Africa(from 200kya), and the entire world(from around 60-80kya).
Originally posted by Yonis2:
And NE Africans have expanded historically into the levant coast and southeast Europe among many other places.
quote:Indeed, which is why OOA(Out of Africa) is confirmed, and it's proven that all non Africans descend from a subset of East Africans...
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The trademark of NE Africans is eternally printed in the blood of all places they settled untill this date, nothing me and you can change about it.
quote:You can call our ancestors X, Y or Z, all kind of terminologies can be applied to describe them.
MindoverMatter718 wrote:
What is exactly your definition of a "Somalid"?
quote:Translation; it's a made up term, coined by a non scholar, and hence not to be ever taken seriously.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The "Assyrian" character in SF chose to call them "Somalids" and i personally like this choice of name,
quote:Well scholars are also humans, most of what they coin is based on their ethnic biase, they are not divine as being above none-objectiveness. Why would a term coined by a scholar be more genuine than an informed layman?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Translation; it's a made up term, coined by a non scholar, and hence not to be ever taken seriously.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The "Assyrian" character in SF chose to call them "Somalids" and i personally like this choice of name,
I understand.
That puts an end to this erroneous thread.
quote:A scholar would back up what he proposes with significant evidence; so far you haven't.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Well scholars are also humans, most of what they coin is based on their ethnic biase, they are not divine as being above none-objectiveness. Why would a term coined by a scholar be more genuine than an informed layman?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Translation; it's a made up term, coined by a non scholar, and hence not to be ever taken seriously.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The "Assyrian" character in SF chose to call them "Somalids" and i personally like this choice of name,
I understand.
That puts an end to this erroneous thread.
quote:..more like anti-ignorance!
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I sense that you are an anti-somalid
quote:The Luo are close relatives of the shilluck in southern Sudan, in fact collectively they call themselves Luo. The Luo are in essence a Sudanese tribe.
But somalids are more represented among the Nilotes than the Bantu. Rendille, Massai, Iraqwa, Luo and Sambura are all somalid nilotics. Obama is a half Somalid nilotic.
Obama connecting to his Somalid roots.
quote:It doesn't matter what we call these ancien NE Africans, we could name them "Carambolas" if we like, it still doesn't change the fact that "carambolas" were and are a tangible group of people mainly based in NE Africa.
Originally posted by carambolas:
^ The DNA lineages as quite clearly mentioned above are indigenous tropical Africans. So far you have based your dubious theory on a guy from Stormfront, and have yet to produce a credible definition of 'Somalid."
quote:But if they erroneously referred to that same lineage as "Bantu" or "Bantid" Lol, I suspect you'd have issue with the term then, no?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The "Assyrian" character in SF chose to call them "Somalids" and i personally like this choice of name
quote:SO?
Originally posted by Carambolas:
Quote from yet another 'front' page:
Haplogroup E1b1 isnt ''Somalid'' or negroid like you want to think.Don't forget that E1b1 is also in Turkey at a big amount.Negroes were slaves,not conquerors.
quote:
Originally posted by Whitiepants:
What Assyriann is saying...is that where ever those Genes came from..(i don't care, sure as hell not a white people gene)
The E1b1b1a(M78)
30% OF GREEKS SHARE IT WITH A BUNCH OF PEOPLE FROM NORTH AFRICA ESP THOSE LIVING IN SOMALIA NOW..
It's so simple!..
I'm no Greek so i don't care that 30% of them share genes with African people.. The Point is that Pre Ancient Greeks where Somali lovers.. and that they will just underhandedly contaminate the white race even more!
Their phenotypes may seem homogeneous now... but they are all have that dark blood inside of them.. even in ancient times..
quote:Not really, as long as the term "bantu" or "bantid" was not occupied by another group.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:But if they erroneously referred to that same lineage as "Bantu" or "Bantid" Lol, I suspect you'd have issue with the term then, no?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The "Assyrian" character in SF chose to call them "Somalids" and i personally like this choice of name
quote:How would that be possible? Considering that the man is a Nilotic.
Obama is most likely a Somalid since his father is Luo
Btw, Somalids doesn't equall modern somalis, although modern Somalis are Somalids.
quote:Please elaborate on "bantu or "bantid" was not occupied by another group".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Not really, as long as the term "bantu" or "bantid" was not occupied by another group.
quote:Some Dinkas might be, Luos have lived in East africa longer than Bantus, many Kenyan nilotes have interacted with southern afrasians groups such as Boran and other Oromo for centuries, but Shiluk, Dinka and Anuak are deep inside southern Sudan, thus less likely they have been in contact with indigenous NE Africans, while Luo have been just next door.I sense Obama is a Somalid. East African nilo-saharans and afrasians have a long hiistory together compared to other groups.
Originally posted by sudaniya:
Yonis:
quote:How would that be possible? Considering that the man is a Nilotic.
Obama is most likely a Somalid since his father is Luo
Btw, Somalids doesn't equall modern somalis, although modern Somalis are Somalids.
The Luo/shilluck, Dinka and Nuer have NO close relations with 'Somalids', rather they are more closely related to each other.
The Anuak, Shilluck/Luo and many others are virtually the same people and congnated from Bahr el Ghazal, the Dinka heartland.
Yonis, are Dinkas 'Somalids'? Or is that label solely reserved for their cousins-the Luo?
quote:The term is occupied by a group who recently arrived to East Africa (less than 3kya) They are a different entity.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Please elaborate on "bantu or "bantid" was not occupied by another group".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Not really, as long as the term "bantu" or "bantid" was not occupied by another group.
quote:Should it matter, really? Since the term Somalia itself is a modern construct, not to mention that when E1b1b first emerged, it is highly likely that the Somali language did not exist, as the differentiated Afrisan sub-phylum that it is. Plus, if we are to take Cruciani et al. at their findings, then the home of E1b1b1a [the predominant Somali male marker] would have been in the region straddling Egypt and Sudan, as opposed to the African Horn.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The term is occupied by a group who recently arrived to East Africa (less than 3kya) They are a different entity.
quote:^There does exist the possibility that the Luo have had close genetic/cultural influences from the Somalis, but until genetic evidence can be carried out proving this assertion, then such a possibility must be looked at with justified incredulity.
Some Dinkas might be, Luos have lived in East africa longer than Bantus, many Kenyan nilotes have interacted with southern afrasians groups such as Boran and other Oromo for centuries, but Shiluk, Dinka and Anuak are deep inside southern Sudan, thus less likely they have been in contact with indigenous NE Africans, while Luo have been just next door.I sense Obama is a Somalid. East African nilo-saharans and afrasians have a long hiistory together compared to other groups.
quote:I don't find that strange. The *bulk* of Nilo-Saharan language diversity is found in the eastern Saharan region, namely in Upper Egypt and well into Sudan. There are some groups in Ethiopia as well. Yes, they are a few in western Africa as well.
Originally posted by sudaniya:
The strange thing about the Massai, Dinka and Nuer, is that they claim to of come from the North, sometimes eluding to Egypt.
quote:I wrote in one of my previous post that they most likely expanded from Ethiopia, North eastern Sudan or Southern Egypt. Most definetly not from Somalia. But it doesn't really matter that they didn't expand from somalia, people are not static. What matters is that somalis with the rest of indigenous NE Africans descend from them, so the term "Somalids" fits them well regardless where they expanded from.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Should it matter, really? Since the term Somalia itself is a modern construct, not to mention that when E1b1b first emerged, it is highly likely that the Somali language did not exist, as the differentiated Afrisan sub-phylum that it is. Plus, if we are to take Cruciani et al. at their findings, then the home of E1b1b1a [the predominant Somali male marker] would have been in the region straddling Egypt and Sudan, as opposed to the African Horn.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The term is occupied by a group who recently arrived to East Africa (less than 3kya) They are a different entity.
quote:LOL, everyone wants to be connected to The Oba.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Obama connecting to his Somalid roots.
![[Cool]](cool.gif)
quote:Well, mainly the African migrations described here leading up to the "Neolithic era" in what is now the Sahara.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Specifically; what events would these be?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:What are you basing this date on?
Originally posted by MaximallyAbstract_Faith:
modern West Africans are mostly E3a because of events happening 30-10 kya including the Neolithic Sahara so basically yes.
quote:Well yes, enphasis on the dichotomy between E3a and E3b in themselves is of limited use since really, at birth not only were their divergences from the P2 mutation (E1b1; "PN2") seperated by no more than a few thousand years, but by only a mutation (M2 for the former, M35/M215 for the latter).
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E3a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E3b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Or better yet, "Ethiopids"?
quote:
Originally posted by argyle104:
MaximallyAbstract_Faith aka Alive WhatBox aka Jeeves wrote:
---------------------------
---------------------------
Dude, why don't you just go back to lurking? Your sorry ass tries so hard to be intellectually relevant its sad to observe.
Folks, this boy reminds me of a butler at a party, serving all of the intellectual attendees horderves and perrier. At some point during the party, he decides he wants to be a bigwig too, so he starts talking in hopes of impressing them. Too dumb to realize that talking about McDonald's dollar menu ain't high intellect.
woooaaaahhooooooooooooohohohohohohohohohohohoho : ) :
quote:I suspected you were referencing Rosa et al.'s window of 30-20k years. That window itself is reasonable, but IMO, the 30k years upper end might be a tad too high, when compared with estimates for E-M215 or E-M35 [not its derivatives]. I reckon this, since in some of the populations where E*-M35 is relatively prevalent, E-M2 is relatively rare or occurs in fairly modest frequencies, suggesting that the former might be the older sibling. Semino et al.'s 21k years ago estimate for the same lineage fits into that window; though not as comprehensive as Arredi et al.'s, they [Semino et al.] had a relatively greater intra-E1b1a phylogenetic representation than Rosa et al.
Originally posted by MaximallyAbstract_Faith:
Well, mainly the African migrations described here leading up to the "Neolithic era" in what is now the Sahara.
quote:Using that rationale, then it shouldn't matter if it was named after even a group that arrived in the region 3ky ago, as you objected. If members of that group carry E1b1b1a, then he/she could use the same rationale as you did, but name it after his/her ethnic group. You may not agree with that, but his/her claim would be just as subjective as your's.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I wrote in one of my previous post that they most likely expanded from Ethiopia, North eastern Sudan or Southern Egypt. Most definetly not from Somalia. But it doesn't really matter that they didn't expand from somalia, people are not static. What matters is that somalis with the rest of indigenous NE Africans descend from them, so the term "Somalids" fits them well regardless where they expanded from.
quote:I think I prefer "Hornids"
Originally posted by MaximallyAbstract_Faith:
Since the thread subject is "Somalids", though, here are more streams of Borana people:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mytripsmypics/3081260081/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/world_discoverer/3031896835/
Why not call Somalids "Hornids"?
since that has been my experience with Somali chics, generally speaking, back in my playboy days.
quote:This doesn't make sense whatsoever, those who arrived to the region 3ky ago are different in many aspects, they speak completely different languages are genetically cut of for atleast 25kya, and are not descendent from the original NE Africans (wherever they were originally located, Ethiopia, Sudan or southern Egypt). So no, it can't be named after them. It's as redicoulas as naming other European people as slavs, who migrated recently to central and SE Europe.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Using that rationale, then it shouldn't matter if it was named after even a group that arrived in the region 3ky ago, as you objected. If members of that group carry E1b1b1a, then he/she could use the same rationale as you did, but name it after his/her ethnic group. You may not agree with that, but his/her claim would be just as subjective as your's.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I wrote in one of my previous post that they most likely expanded from Ethiopia, North eastern Sudan or Southern Egypt. Most definetly not from Somalia. But it doesn't really matter that they didn't expand from somalia, people are not static. What matters is that somalis with the rest of indigenous NE Africans descend from them, so the term "Somalids" fits them well regardless where they expanded from.
quote:Indeed. It makes just about as much sense as your "Somalid" moniker of E1b1ba marker.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
This doesn't make sense whatsoever,
quote:It doesn't matter; if the members of the group bear E1b1ba, and they speak the same language as a group that just arrived 3ky ago, they too can feel obliged to name it after their ethnic group; it won't make it any less ridiculous than your "Somalid" moniker.
those who arrived to the region 3ky ago are different in many aspects, they speak completely different languages are genetically cut of for atleast 25kya
quote:Why would anyone with E1b1ba not be descendant of "original NE"; even if they belong culturally and linguistically to a group that just arrived 3ky ago? Why can't say a Greek with E1b1ba not label the lineage "Greekid", after his own ethnicity?
, and are not descendent from the original NE Africans (wherever they were originally located, Ethiopia, Sudan or southern Egypt).
quote:So is your's!
So no, it can't be named after them. It's as redicoulas
quote:The difference here is that those who arrived 3kya and carry NE African lineage got it from admixture, it's not their core lineage, while for somalis it's their core lineage, almost all carry it, so you can't relate it that way, like naming the original carriers as "bantid". As for the Greeks they got it also from admixture, it doesn't belong to them, It belongs to Africa, (NE africa to be more specific) Therefore you can't call it "Greekid" either, there are also many more attributes attached to this lineage, like language, some cultural similarities and also features ((if we remove the watered down "somalids" from the equation)but features is secondary), therefore "Somalid" makes it a very suitable name. Ofcourse there are probably better alternatives, you could say, "Ethiopid", "Eritrid", "Egyptid", or even "Saharid", but "Greekid" or "bantid" are not the better choice, since none of these are originally NE Africans, whatever they have of it they attained it from admixture.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Indeed. It makes just about as much sense as your "Somalid" moniker of E1b1ba marker.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
This doesn't make sense whatsoever,
quote:It doesn't matter; if the members of the group bear E1b1ba, and they speak the same language as a group that just arrived 3ky ago, they too can feel obliged to name it after their ethnic group; it won't make it any less ridiculous than your "Somalid" moniker.
those who arrived to the region 3ky ago are different in many aspects, they speak completely different languages are genetically cut of for atleast 25kya
quote:Why would anyone with E1b1ba not be descendant of "original NE"; even if they belong culturally and linguistically to a group that just arrived 3ky ago? Why can't say a Greek with E1b1ba not label the lineage "Greekid", after his own ethnicity?
, and are not descendent from the original NE Africans (wherever they were originally located, Ethiopia, Sudan or southern Egypt).
quote:So is your's!
So no, it can't be named after them. It's as redicoulas
quote:And? You do know that Somali does not = a population with a single lineage, right?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Th difference here is that those who arrived 3kya and carry NE African lineage got it from admixture
quote:Tell me how an individual carrying E1b1ba, is not carrying his core lineage? LOL.
, it's not their core lineage
quote:The male lineage of somalis are one and the same, the 15% J lineage are not Indigenous to NE Africa, they came from West asia and the 5% E3a among somalis are not indigenous either they came with the bantu-somalis.
Explorer wrote:
And? You do know that Somali does not = a population with a single lineage, right?
quote:Of course they would have not spoken somali, duh.
You also know that the original E1b1ba carriers would not have spoken Somali, right?
quote:According to which geneticist, does Somalia comprise of a singular lineage. Name this person; he/she ought to be very nervous to have come to that wacky toon conclusion.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The male lineage of somalis are one and the same
quote:Exactly; which is why it is intellectually handicapped to name them after a language/nationality that didn't exist. But hey, in Yonis world anything goes, right? LOL.
quote:Of course they would have not spoken somali, duh.
You also know that the original E1b1ba carriers would not have spoken Somali, right?
quote:All NE Africans speak Afrasian languages, that is if you remove the recent arrivals of Nilo-saharans. culturally there ar more connection between Afrasians in Africa than to anyother group. Of course alot have diverged due to historical circumstances, mainly population expansion and incursion.
Explorer wrote:
^Add to this, the fact that NE does not = single language family, single lineage, or culture either.
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
All NE Africans speak Afrasian languages,
quote:I wasn't talking about an individual, but the group "Greekid" and "Bantid", it's not their core lineage
Explorer wrote:
Tell me how an individual carrying E1b1ba, is not carrying his core lineage? LOL.
quote:What evidence do you have that suggests Nilo-Saharan speaker are recent arrivals in NE Africa? This should prove interesting; maybe the stormfront quacks will supply you with the answer, right? LOL.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
that is if you remove the recent arrivals of Nilo-saharans.
quote:If your other comment was freaky, then this one should be awarded a double...
culturally there ar more connection between Afrasians in Africa than to anyother group. Of course alot have diverged due to historical circumstances, mainly population expansion and incursion.
quote:Lifting words from it's context will not do you any favour, infact it produces the opposite effect. I don't discuss for the sake of arguing you know.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
All NE Africans speak Afrasian languages,
quote:Hey genius, if it's not individuals in a population who carry these lineages, then who does?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I wasn't talking about an individual, but the group "Greekid" and "Bantid", it's not their core lineage
Explorer wrote:
Tell me how an individual carrying E1b1ba, is not carrying his core lineage? LOL.
quote:Sounds more like you've been brainwashed since you were "borned".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
We the Somalids can never be compared to any other people or group, our ancestors have laid seeds that flourished in three continents, Africa, Europe and Asia, we are a proud people, inprinted in our minds since we got borned , we inherently know that without us the human species would be nothing. And our ethnical base is NorthEast Africa.
All haters can go aside.
quote:LOL
Explorer wrote:
Is that why Ethiopians, Eritreans and Somalis are killing the living daylights out of one another as we speak?
quote:Not somalis, but "somalids", NE africans , somalis are nomads, nomads are normally useless in state building, their expertise is raiding and subjugating. But the sedentary "somalids" of NE africa have done a quite good job, don't you think?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Sounds more like you've been brainwashed since you were "borned".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
We the Somalids can never be compared to any other people or group, our ancestors have laid seeds that flourished in three continents, Africa, Europe and Asia, we are a proud people, inprinted in our minds since we got borned , we inherently know that without us the human species would be nothing. And our ethnical base is NorthEast Africa.
All haters can go aside.
What imprint have Somalis left on Africa, Europe and Asia; and how?
Also, do tell why humanity would be nothing without Somalians?
quote:You mean by not including the part where you mention "Nilo-Saharans" as "recent arrivals", essentially meaning "foreigners"? How does that change the context of your post, or help you for that matter?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Lifting words from it's context will not do you any favour, infact it produces the opposite effect. I don't discuss for the sake of arguing you know.
quote:It does change the context of the post, since minus nilo-saharans all NE Africans are afrasians. And no, kenya is not a NE African nation, although many of their population are NE Africans.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:You mean by not including the part where you mention "Nilo-Saharans" as "recent arrivals", essentially meaning "foreigners"? How does that change the context of your post, or help you for that matter?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Lifting words from it's context will not do you any favour, infact it produces the opposite effect. I don't discuss for the sake of arguing you know.
BTW, is Kenya in NE Africa?
quote:Exactly; not Somalis, hence not "Somalids".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Not somalis , i was talking about NE africans as a whole, [/QB]
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Sounds more like you've been brainwashed since you were "borned".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
We the Somalids can never be compared to any other people or group, our ancestors have laid seeds that flourished in three continents, Africa, Europe and Asia, we are a proud people, inprinted in our minds since we got borned , we inherently know that without us the human species would be nothing. And our ethnical base is NorthEast Africa.
All haters can go aside.
What imprint have Somalis left on Africa, Europe and Asia; and how?
Also, do tell why humanity would be nothing without Somalians? [/qb]
quote:Nope, since Somalid would be a reference to a Somalian; and Somalians were not the Egyptians "Nubians", Kushites, Meroites, Aksumites etc... were they?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
But the sedentary "somalids" of NE africa have done a quite good job, don't you think?
quote:Indeed; after all, this is your post:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
LOL
quote:But how does "minus" Nilo-Saharans change the context of your context-less post? Why "minus" them? How does it help you, the mere fact that you have to "minus" another group from the same region?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
It does change the context of the post, since minus nilo-saharans all NE Africans are afrasians.
quote:Why is that Kenya falls into the same latitude as Somalia, yet it is supposedly not a NE African nation, but Somalia supposedly is?
And no, kenya is not a NE African nation, although many of their population are NE Africans.
quote:They were all somalids, and somalis are related to all of them, (this topic is not about Ancient Somalid civilizations though) i don't know about the "Nubians" , but the rest are "Somalids"
Nope, since Somalid would be a reference to a Somalian; and Somalians were not the Egyptians "Nubians", Kushites, Meroites, Aksumites etc... were they?
quote:latitude of countries is irrelevant in this matter people are not static, half of somalia for instance was not inhabitated by somalis before the 16th century, but today they strech all the way untill northern kenya due to expansion. NE africans are made up of lineage not latitude.
Why is that Kenya falls into the same latitude as Somalia, yet it is supposedly not a NE African nation, but Somalia supposedly is?
quote:All E1b1b, where ever they are located or the different mutations they have taken, are still in core NE african, not South african, not Balkan, not Anatolian and Not levantine, they are the trademark of Somalids in NE africa..
Originally posted by The Explorer:
The paragroup E-M35* has been observed at high frequencies in both eastern (10.5%) and southern (15.2%) Africa - Cruciani et al.
Based on this, is it safe to say, as per your [Yonis'] rationale, that E-M35* is more the core lineage of Southern Africa than eastern Africa?
quote:But according to your "Yonis style" standard, E-M35* should be more southern African lineage to the "core" than NE Africa. BTW, which geneticist [not your stormfront teachers] are you relying on about E-M35* being a NE African marker?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
All E1b1b, where ever they are located or the different mutations they have taken, are still in core NE african, not South african, not Balkan, not Anatolian and Not levantine, they are the trademark of Somalids in NE africa..
quote:Is that why you named countries, vis-a-vis geographical coordinates?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
latitude of countries is irrelevant in this matter people are not static
quote:Exactly, which is why it is puzzling you are not naming territories with directional-geographical descriptives [geography] after latitudes [which is also geography] but after people, and inversely calling people [biological] after geographical coordinates [as though they were more static than said territories vis-a-vis latitudes] -- just twisted beyond comprehension. And even then, going by "Yonis style" standards
half of somalia for instance was not inhabitated by somalis before the 16th century, but today they strech all the way untill northern kenya due to expansion. NE africans are made up of lineage not latitude.
, this: quote:Again; none of them were "Somalid", since none were Somalis.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:They were all somalids,
Nope, since Somalid would be a reference to a Somalian; and Somalians were not the Egyptians "Nubians", Kushites, Meroites, Aksumites etc... were they?
quote:Aw man you gotta try one of dem 'Somalid'
Originally posted by MaximallyAbstract_Faith:
lol .. Ive never met any Horinds, but somethin about them does make it seem like they'd have freaky intentions deep down.
chics. That's premium ***** right there. quote:None had anything to do with somalis?
Of course feeling left out of NE African civilizations, would make any Somali jump at the chance to call all these other great civilizations as 'Somalids", meanwhile none had anything to do with Somalis.
quote:^ Listen to this happy Tom who lives to parrot the racialism of white scholars pointing fingers at the Somalid happy Tom. How entertaining!
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
But like a happy Tom you run along with it not even understanding (or perhaps you do).
.
quote:Go ahead; tell us what they had to do with "Somalis".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
None had anything to do with somalis?
quote:Not really; Somalians were not the Egyptians "Nubians", Kushites, Meroites, Aksumites etc... were they?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:None had anything to do with somalis?
Of course feeling left out of NE African civilizations, would make any Somali jump at the chance to call all these other great civilizations as 'Somalids", meanwhile none had anything to do with Somalis.
That's a very bold statement don't you think?
quote:Again, all NE Africans are not Somalians, hence not Somaild.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Anyway, We somalids don't need to claim NE African civilizations
quote:Indeed; and so, he likes to be referenced by SF posters as being different from other Africans, I.e, not a "Negroid".
Originally posted by The Explorer:
^I think being in stormfront has had more corroding effect on Yonis' mind; that's probably what it is.
You can't be on that site as regularly as he does, and not be maxed out with being wacked out: LOL!
quote:Indeed.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Well, what Yonis likes or dislikes will not prevent him from being straightened out here, when he comes with these fairytale "Somalids". LOL.
quote:What an inane question
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Go ahead; tell us what they had to do with "Somalis".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
None had anything to do with somalis?
quote:I never said they were somalis, you need to pay attention...i said they are all Somalids, this time notice the difference.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Not really; Somalians were not the Egyptians "Nubians", Kushites, Meroites, Aksumites etc... were they?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:None had anything to do with somalis?
Of course feeling left out of NE African civilizations, would make any Somali jump at the chance to call all these other great civilizations as 'Somalids", meanwhile none had anything to do with Somalis.
That's a very bold statement don't you think?
quote:Again, all NE Africans are not Somalians, hence not Somaild.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Anyway, We somalids don't need to claim NE African civilizations
quote:Modern Somalis are not the ancestors of other Somalids. They are simply an offshoot that remained less mixed, while the rest of the Somalids mixed.
Originally posted by argyle104:
What I find even more laughable than Somalis big teeth, is that he tries to imply that Somalis are responsible for the achievements
quote:Nice post!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Modern Somalis are not the ancestors of other Somalids. They are simply an offshoot that remained less mixed, while the rest of the Somalids mixed.
Originally posted by argyle104:
What I find even more laughable than Somalis big teeth, is that he tries to imply that Somalis are responsible for the achievements
mtDNA data on Berbers shows a very high % of European mtDNA, similar to South Balkans Somalids (diff subclades). The only mtDNA clade shared by all Somalids is M1 mtDNA at very low frequencies outside of Africa, because it mainly the males who migrated in Neolithic times.
In Egypt mtDNA is still closer to East Africa & M1 seems more like a native mtDNA stretching along the Red Sea & having a high frequency in Northern Somalia, Eastern Ethiopia, Eritrea, Coastal Sudan, Upper Egypt, Hejaz with a small frequency in Lebanon, Tunis, Yemen & minor frequency in the Med Coasts.
quote:No, Somalis are *NOT* responsible for the achievements of these nations above (btw Chad is not a Somalid nation neither is the majority of Niger and Sudan), however the people of some of the nations you mention above are derived from the same pool (some more mixed than others), the pool they are derived from is the Somalid pool
Herpes boy wrote:
What I find even more laughable than Somalis big teeth, is that he tries to imply that Somalis are responsible for the achievements of saharans/"north" Africans (ie. Morocco, Mauritania, Mali, Algeria, Tunisia, Niger, Libya, Egypt, Chad and Sudan).
, you get the difference, Herpes boy?
quote:I am not Yonis, I just found this forum on google
Originally posted by argyle104:
Somalid_V13 wrote:
quote:Herpes boy, why all the hate on Somalids? You should attack your real enemies in Europe, they are the ones who messed you up real good, what has Somalids ever done to you or your people? Of all these thousands of years that somalids knew about you, they let your people alone to live in peace. It's only when the arabs and europeans entered the scene that the tradegy came to occur. Do i sense stockholm syndrome from your part? Go and attack your real enemy!
Originally posted by argyle104:
You know what I find funny also is there was a thread on this forum about iq from the different regions of Africa. Somalia, Eritrea, and the other horn of African nations ranked the lowest on the entire continent. The only thing that brought up "east" Africa on par with the rest of Africa was that Uganda and Kenya's were high.
PS. This post is not to give credence to bogus measures of intelligence ie iq tests, but its purpose is to show the stupidity of trying to imply that Somalia and other horn of African nations are responsible for the achievements of the saharan/"north" African countries.
Africans from the horn with maybe, maybe the exception of Ethiopia are some of the dumbest people on the planet.
quote:The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I never said they were somalis, you need to pay attention...i said they are all Somalids, this time notice the difference.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Not really; Somalians were not the Egyptians "Nubians", Kushites, Meroites, Aksumites etc... were they?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:None had anything to do with somalis?
Of course feeling left out of NE African civilizations, would make any Somali jump at the chance to call all these other great civilizations as 'Somalids", meanwhile none had anything to do with Somalis.
That's a very bold statement don't you think?
quote:Again, all NE Africans are not Somalians, hence not Somaild.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Anyway, We somalids don't need to claim NE African civilizations
They couldn't have been Somalis since Somalis are a young group that didn't exist at that time, neither did the somali language, however Somalis are derived from the same pool as all the other NE Africans, you get the picture?
quote:Do us all a favor and keep that pseudo-nonsense of referencing Horn Africans as "Somalids", on another board where it actually belongs.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Also Somalid is a genetic term that should not be equated or confused with Somali nationality.
I am a Sicilian-American Somalid, but not a Somali
quote:Wrong!
The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
So by calling them Somalid, it's kind of like referencing towards a specific "race".
Only people who could, actually should be referenced as Somalid are actually Somalians, and no one else. Point blank.
quote:Somalid has nothing to do with anyone other than a Somalian.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Wrong!
The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
So by calling them Somalid, it's kind of like referencing towards a specific "race".
Only people who could, actually should be referenced as Somalid are actually Somalians, and no one else. Point blank.
Somalid has nothing to do with phenotype, it's much deeper than that, i's about Blood
quote:If you don't know what it is, how can you say they're not?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Btw, Somalis are not "caucasian", what ever that is.
quote:Somalid, Negrid, Europid, Arabid, Mongolid, Indid, Caucasid, Australid are genetic classifications
Somalid has nothing to do with anyone other than a Somalian. [/QB]
quote:More like pseudo genetic classifications.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Somalid, Negrid, Europid, Arabid, Mongolid, Indid, Caucasid, Australid are genetic classifications
Somalid has nothing to do with anyone other than a Somalian.
[/QB]
quote:
Y-chromosomal evidence of the cultural diffusion of agriculture in southeast Europe.
Battaglia et al.
Dipartimento di Genetica e Microbiologia, Università di Pavia, Pavia, Italy.
The debate concerning the mechanisms underlying the prehistoric spread of farming to Southeast Europe is framed around the opposing roles of population movement and cultural diffusion. To investigate the possible involvement of local people during the transition of agriculture in the Balkans, we analysed patterns of Y-chromosome diversity in 1206 subjects from 17 population samples, mainly from Southeast Europe. Evidence from three Y-chromosome lineages, I-M423, E-V13 and J-M241, make it possible to distinguish between Holocene Mesolithic forager and subsequent Neolithic range expansions from the eastern Sahara and the Near East, respectively. In particular, whereas the Balkan microsatellite variation associated to J-M241 correlates with the Neolithic period, those related to E-V13 and I-M423 Balkan Y chromosomes are consistent with a late Mesolithic time frame. In addition, the low frequency and variance associated to I-M423 and E-V13 in Anatolia and the Middle East, support an European Mesolithic origin of these two clades. Thus, these Balkan Mesolithic foragers with their own autochthonous genetic signatures, were destined to become the earliest to adopt farming, when it was subsequently introduced by a cadre of migrating farmers from the Near East. These initial local converted farmers became the principal agents spreading this economy using maritime leapfrog colonization strategies in the Adriatic and transmitting the Neolithic cultural package to other adjacent Mesolithic populations. The ensuing range expansions of E-V13 and I-M423 parallel in space and time the diffusion of Neolithic Impressed Ware, thereby supporting a case of cultural diffusion using genetic evidence. European Journal of Human Genetics advance online publication, 24 December 2008
quote:Note; the "Negroid" reference below...
“The presence of E-M78* Y chromosomes in the Balkans (two Albanians) , previously described virtually only in northeast Africa, upper Nile, gives rise to the question of what the original source of the E-M78 may have been. Correlations between human-occupation sites and radiocarbon-dated climatic fluctuations in the eastern Sahara and Nile Valley during the Holocene provide a framework for interpreting the main southeast European centric distribution of E-V13. A recent archaeological study reveals that during a desiccation period in North Africa, while the eastern Sahara was depopulated, a refugium existed on the border of present-day Sudan and Egypt, near Lake Nubia, until the onset of a humid phase around 8500 BC (radiocarbon-calibrated date). The rapid arrival of wet conditions during this Early Holocene period provided an impetus for population movement into habitat that was quickly settled afterwards. Hg E-M78* representatives, although rare overall, still occur in Egypt, which is a hub for the distribution of the various geographically localized M78-related sub-clades. The northward-moving rainfall belts during this period could have also spurred a rapid migration of Mesolithic foragers northwards in Africa, the Levant and ultimately onwards to Asia Minor and Europe, where they each eventually differentiated their regionally distinctive branches.”
quote:
"Against this background of disease, movement and pedomorphic reduction of body size one can identify Negroid traits of nose and prognathism appearing in Natufian latest hunters (McCown, 1939) and **in Anatolian** and Macedonian first farmers, probably from Nubia via the unknown predecesors of the Badarians and Tasians....". - J. L. Angel
quote:Mongoloid , Caucasoid, Negroid etc.. are pseudo racial classifications.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Example
When someone is genetically Mongolid or Phenotypically Mongoloid that doesn't mean he is from Mongolia (a nation of 2 Million!), yet the classification cover more than 1 Billion people
quote:More like genotype and phenotype African (specifically sub-Saharan), "Not Somalid".
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Another Example
Nationality: American
Heritage : Sicilian
Phenotype : East Med
Genotype : Somalid
quote:People will get more and more self-aware, mind washed NE Africans need to drop the arab imposed doctrine, wahabi, islamic-emperialism and what not, and go back to their Somalid heathen background.
Ghassan Mattar wrote:
Egypt is outside the Arabian plate, so it depends if the Angry Somalid majority in Egypt decides to expell or exterminate the Egyptian Arabid sizeable minority to revenge actions taken by Arabids against Somalids in the Arabian plate.
As of today 50% of Egypt is Somalid, They are backed with Somalid reinforcments in Maghreb reaching 80% amongst Berbers & strong Somalid reserves in the Horn of Africa reaching 90% in Somalia...
Those might pour in to help their Egyptian Somalid Brothers vs the invasive Arabids & other Aliens racial types living in Egypt.
![[Mad]](mad.gif)
quote:You mean he's trying ineffectively to make people think NE Africans are some sort of a separate "race" or entity in its own, and different from the rest of Africa, separate from those they deem "Negroes"
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I like the Assyrian character, he's making people more self-aware.
quote:Are you denying that indigenous NE Africans are extremely closely related, thousand times more related to each other than to anyother people, be they from West asia, Southern Europe or West, central and Southern Africa (that is except the Somalids spread in those regions)?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:You mean he's trying ineffectively to make people think NE Africans are some sort of a separate "race" or entity in its own, and different from the rest of Africa, separate from those they deem "Negroes"
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I like the Assyrian character, he's making people more self-aware.
This is pseudo scientific nonsensical drivel. No wonder you agree.
Talk about someone waking up; in fact that should be YOU, who needs to wake up.
![[Confused]](confused.gif)
quote:You are amazing!
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:You mean he's trying ineffectively to make people think NE Africans are some sort of a separate "race" or entity in its own, and different from the rest of Africa, separate from those they deem "Negroes"
Originally posted by Yonis2:
[qb] I like the Assyrian character, he's making people more self-aware.
quote:My Phenotype is East Med not Negroid
More like genotype and phenotype African (specifically sub-Saharan), "Not Somalid".
quote:Whatever you mean by "thousands of times more related" is irrelevant, since I'm not asking you anything about the relationship of NE Africans; what's being discussed here is your fabricated use of "Somalid" to classify all NE Africans.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Are you denying that indigenous NE Africans are extremely closely related, thousand times more related to each other than to anyother people, be they from West asia, Southern Europe or West, central and Southern Africa (that is except the Somalids spread in those regions)?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:You mean he's trying ineffectively to make people think NE Africans are some sort of a separate "race" or entity in its own, and different from the rest of Africa, separate from those they deem "Negroes"
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I like the Assyrian character, he's making people more self-aware.
This is pseudo scientific nonsensical drivel. No wonder you agree.
Talk about someone waking up; in fact that should be YOU, who needs to wake up.
quote:Your erroneous classification of NE Africans under the label of "Somalid".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
If not, then why are you arguing?
quote:Somalid is not a geographic classification!
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Your erroneous classification of NE Africans under the label of "Somalid".
quote:I've never heard of such a thing as a "Negrid" or "Somalid", gene. They're all African.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
The Sahara is an ocean of Sands that splits Africa
* Genetically: Negrids from Somalids.
quote:This again makes no sense and no anthropologist in their right mind promotes this, please give a credible reference otherwise....
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
* Phenotypically: Negroids from Aethopoids/Meds
quote:What language is African? lol.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
* Linguistically: African from Afroasiatic
quote:
Ancient Egyptian as an African Language , Egypt as an African Culture
Christopher Ehret
Professor of History, African Studies Chair
University of California at Los Angeles
Ancient Egyptian civilization was, in ways and to an extent usually not recognized, fundamentally African. The evidence of both language and culture reveals these African roots.
The origins of Egyptian ethnicity lay in the areas south of Egypt. The ancient Egyptian language belonged to the Afrasian family (also called Afroasiatic or, formerly, Hamito-Semitic). The speakers of the earliest Afrasian languages, according to recent studies, were a set of peoples whose lands between 15,000 and 13,000 B.C. stretched from Nubia in the west to far northern Somalia in the east. They supported themselves by gathering wild grains. The first elements of Egyptian culture were laid down two thousand years later, between 12,000 and 10,000 B.C., when some of these Afrasian communities expanded northward into Egypt, bringing with them a language directly ancestral to ancient Egyptian. They also introduced to Egypt the idea of using wild grains as food.
quote:You have heard of the Kiffians and Tenerians; right?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
* Geographically: Green Africa from the
Sahara!
quote:
August 15, 2008
In the Sahara, Stone Age Graves From Greener Days
By JOHN NOBLE WILFORD
When Paul C. Sereno went hunting dinosaur bones in the Sahara, his career took a sharp turn from paleontology to archaeology. The expedition found what has proved to be the largest known graveyard of Stone Age people who lived there when the desert was green.
The first traces of pottery, stone tools and human skeletons were discovered eight years ago at a site in the southern Sahara, in Niger. After preliminary research, Dr. Sereno, a University of Chicago scientist who had previously uncovered remains of the dinosaur Nigersaurus there, organized an international team of archaeologists to investigate what had been a lakeside hunting and fishing settlement for the better part of 5,000 years, originating some 10,000 years ago.
In its first comprehensive report, published Thursday, the team described finding some 200 graves belonging to two successive populations. Some burials were accompanied by pottery and ivory ornaments. A girl was buried wearing a bracelet carved from a hippo tusk. A man was interred seated on the carapace of a turtle.
quote:Yeh, we know gringo. We know.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Mongoloid (Bowcock's Bay Area Chinese as an archetype), Caucasoid (Bowcock's Yale residents as archetypes), Negroid (Bowcock's Forest Negros as African archetypes) etc.. are pseudo racial classifications I only adhere to when it suits me.
quote:Please provide credible reference to a scholar who promotes this nonsense of Somalid Arabid or Europid..?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
The majority of North Africans are Somalid with a moderate % Arabid & Europid
quote:
Moreover, a specific evolutionary model tested, i.e., that Europe is formed by contributions from Asia and Africa, fits the distance matrix perfectly (6). In this simplified model, the migrations postulated to have populated Europe are estimated to have occurred at an early date (30,000 years ago), but it is impossible to distinguish, on the basis of these data, this model from that of several migrations at different times. The overall contributions from Asia and Africa were estimated to be around two-thirds and one-third, respectively. Simulations have shown (7) that this hypothesis explains quite well the discrepancy between trees obtained by maximum likelihood and neighbor joining. --
Cavalli-Sforza L
quote:
The Levant versus the Horn of Africa: Evidence for Bidirectional Corridors of Human Migrations
A more recent dispersal out of Africa, represented by the E3b-M35 chromosomes, expanded northward during the Mesolithic (Underhill et al. 2001b). The East African origin of this lineage is supported by the much larger variance of the E3b-M35 males in Egypt versus Oman (0.5 versus 0.14; table 3). Consistent with the NRY data is the mtDNA expansion estimate of 10–20 ky ago for the East African M1 clade.
In contrast, the E3b*-M35 lineages appear to be confined almost exclusively to the sub-Saharan populations, except for a very low incidence in Egypt (2.7%) and a somewhat larger frequency in Ethiopia (7%, as reported by Underhill et al. [2000]). The highest levels of E3b*-M35 are in Tanzania (37.2%), Kenya (13.8%), and the Khoisans (11% in !Kung and 31% in Khwe).
Since the E3b*-M35 lineages appear to be confined mostly to the sub-Saharan populations, it is conceivable that the initial migrations toward North Africa from the south primarily involved derivative E3b-M35 lineages. These include E3b1-M78, a haplogroup especially common in Ethiopia (23%), and, perhaps, E3b2-M123 (2%), which is present as well (Underhill et al. 2000; Cruciani et al. 2002; Semino et al. 2002).
quote:This again makes no sense and no anthropologist in their right mind promotes this, please give a credible reference otherwise....[/QUOTE]
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:
Population genetic relationships between Mediterranean populations determined by HLA allele distribution and a historic perspective.
HLA genomics shows that: 1) Greeks share an important part of their genetic pool with sub-Saharan Africans (Ethiopians and west Africans) also supported by Chr 7 Markers. The gene flow from Black Africa to Greece may have occurred in Pharaonic times or when Saharan people emigrated after the present hyperarid conditions were established (5000 years B.C.).
quote:"Sometimes they [racial terms] are used in an unknowing fashion, while at other times names of continents are used, but the populations or physiognomies deemed representative, or the "true" originals, by various investigators, merely conform to Coon's (1962, 1965) or C. G. Seligman's (1930)ideas of original races." - Keita
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Correct me if I am wrong
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
This is your idea of a credible reference?
quote:Genetically; Sicilians carry lineages that originate in Africa, amongst black Africans.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
You need a reference stating that Sicilians are not Ni66ers
quote:
We obtained an estimate of 25.6 thousand years (ky) (95% CI 24.3-
27.4 ky) for the TMRCA of the 509 haplogroup E3b chromosomes, which
is close to the 30 ± 6 ky estimate for the age of the M35 mutation
reported by Bosch et al. (2001) using a different method. Several
observations point to eastern Africa as the homeland for haplogroup
E3b - that is, it had (1) the highest number of different E3b
clades..., (2) a high frequency of this haplogroup and a high
microsatellite diversity, and finally, (3) the exclusive presence of
the undifferentiated E3b* paragroup. [Cruciani et al., 2004, p.1015]
The paragroup E-M35* has been observed at high frequencies in both
eastern (10.5%) and southern (15.2% Africa, with rare occurrences in
northern Africa and Europe (0.4% and 0.5% respectively)...Also, the
extensive interpopulation E-35* microsatellite diversity...between
Ethiopians and Khoisan indicates that eastern Africans and Khoisan
have been separated for a considerable period of time, as has been
suggested elsewhere (Scozzari et al., 1999; Cruciani et al. 2002;
Semino et al. 2002). [Cruciani et al., 2004, p.1020]
The E-M35* lineage shows its highest frequency (19.2%) in the
Ethiopian Oromo...Indeed, it is also found at high frequency (16.7%)
in the Khoisan of South Africa (Underhill et al. 2000; Cruciani et
al. 2002) [Semino et al., 2004, p. 1025]
E3b "can be related to the spatial range of the Afroasiatic
linguistic phylum" [Keita, 2005, p. 562]
quote:
"a Mesolithic population carrying Group III lineages with M35/M215
mutation [E3b] expanded northwards from sub-Saharan to north Africa
and the Levant" (Underhill et al., 2001, p. 55; see also Bosch et
al., 2001; Bar-Yosef, 1987) [Keita, 2005, p. 562]
The M35/M215 sub-clade cluster of haplotypes fragments a lineage (Ht
4) described previously (Hammer et al. 1997). We suggest that a
population with this sub-clade of the African YAP/M145/M203/PN2
cluster expanded into the southern and eastern Mediterranean at the
end of the Pleistocene...These lineages would have been introduced
then from the Middle East into southern Europe (and to a lesser
extent northern India and Pakistan) by farmers during the Neolithic
expansion. [Underhill et al., 2001, p. 51]
The Pleistocene epoch on the geologic timescale is the period from
1.8 million to 11,550 years BP [BP = before present (i.e. 1950)]
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleistocene]
...the diffusion of Neolithic farmers from the Near East between
4,000 and 7,500 years ago (Semino et al. 2000)...Interestingly, M35+
chromosomes (E3b*; or their evolutionary precursors E* and E3*) were
previously hypothesized to have migrated to Europe with farmers in
the Neolithic (Hammer et al. 1997; Rosser et al. 2000; Semino et al.
2000). However, because M35* chromosomes are rare in Europe, we
instead hypothesize that the derived lineage, E-M78 (E3b1), is the
more likely haplogroup reflecting Neolithic demic diffusion. [Behar
et al., 2003, p. 362]
quote:All genes originated in Africa. We were also Primates before that! Whats your point
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QB] Genetically you carry lineages that originate in Africa amongst black Africans.
quote:Yes, but a group of East Africans migrated out of Africa over 60 thousand years ago to become non Africans, these once East African lineages, then became non African lineages, diverged, and now represent all non Africans.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:All genes originated in Africa.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Genetically you carry lineages that originate in Africa amongst black Africans.
quote:
Y-chromosomal evidence of the cultural diffusion of agriculture in southeast Europe.
“The presence of E-M78* Y chromosomes in the Balkans (two Albanians) , previously described virtually only in northeast Africa, upper Nile, gives rise to the question of what the original source of the E-M78 may have been. Correlations between human-occupation sites and radiocarbon-dated climatic fluctuations in the eastern Sahara and Nile Valley during the Holocene provide a framework for interpreting the main southeast European centric distribution of E-V13. A recent archaeological study reveals that during a desiccation period in North Africa, while the eastern Sahara was depopulated, a refugium existed on the border of present-day Sudan and Egypt, near Lake Nubia, until the onset of a humid phase around 8500 BC (radiocarbon-calibrated date). The rapid arrival of wet conditions during this Early Holocene period provided an impetus for population movement into habitat that was quickly settled afterwards. Hg E-M78* representatives, although rare overall, still occur in Egypt, which is a hub for the distribution of the various geographically localized M78-related sub-clades. The northward-moving rainfall belts during this period could have also spurred a rapid migration of Mesolithic foragers northwards in Africa, the Levant and ultimately onwards to Asia Minor and Europe, where they each eventually differentiated their regionally distinctive branches.”
quote:Wrong, you all carry a lineage which came about as admixture with Africans carrying lineages which originated in sub Saharan Africa.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
We evolved as Somalids I carry the same gene as fellow North African & Med Somalids. NOT SUBSHARAN E1b1a!
quote:This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I share a common origin with E1b1a Negrids, the same way I also share a common origin with the Gorilla, but that doesn't make me a Gorilla! It only makes a member of the Primates order
quote:
Originally posted by Charlie Bass:
Damn, look at all those areas where E3b appears in high frequencies in SSA, by Evil Euroturd's logic SSA should be overwhelmingly Levantine K-Zoid looking
According to this study, Datog, who are Nilotic speaking people have 43% E3b1-M293, but since E3b is Caucasoid, why don't they look like so-called "mulattoes" and instead look like this:
Almost forgot those darfur people too, damn another study said this about Darfur males:
"Haplogroup E-M78, however, is more widely distributed
and is thought to have an origin in eastern African.
More recently, this haplogroup has been carefully dissected
and was found to depict several well-established subclades with defined geographical clustering (Cruciani
et al., 2006, 2007). Although this haplogroup is common
to most Sudanese populations, it has exceptionally high
frequency among populations like those of western
Sudan (particularly Darfur) and the Beja in eastern
Sudan."
And those Masalit
"The Masalit possesses by far the highest frequency
of the E-M78 and of the E-V32 haplogroup, suggesting
either a recent bottleneck in the population or a
proximity to the origin of the haplogroup. Both E-V13,
which is believed to originate in western Asia with its
low frequency in North Africa, and E-V65 of North African
origin (Cruciani et al., 2007), were not found among
Sudanese."
quote:Sure enough; we can see how it earned that title -- that question had its way of having you demonstrate how to make an inane jackass out of yourself, just from your answer. It's truly educating to see that Southern Egypt is actually that backwater that we call "Somalia".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What an inane question
ok, let me educate you, M78/V12, the Somali marker arose in southern Egypt just some few thousand years ago.
quote:How kind of you; to be able to say things that you cannot back up; we are moved, LOL.
There are plenty of other connections, it's not my duty to line them up here
quote:True; this topic is solely about how unbelievably 'out-of-this-world' stupid you are; you've "educated" me on this matter quite a bit. Thumbs up, my Somalid friend.
since this topic is not about somalia or egypt
quote:These new breed "Somalid" creatures that just *interestingly* creep in this intellectually-barren topic, don't cease to crack me up. Why stop your "common origin" at an entirely discrete species like the Gorilla; why not go as far as the first bacteria-like organism, while you're at it. Unenlightened one, there's one thing you've overlooked in your "creative" analogy: E1b1a shares the very same *immediate* father as E1b1b; was this father a "Negrid" then, or did he just so happen to miraculously begot sons of two distinct "races"; the "negrid" here, and the "somalid" there, LOL?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I share a common origin with E1b1a Negrids, the same way I also share a common origin with the Gorilla, but that doesn't make me a Gorilla! It only makes a member of the Primates order
quote:How about naming it "Stupid", since "Somalid" ~ "Stupid".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Somalid is just a name, we could change the name but the core principal still remains the same.
quote:
Mindovermatters wrote:
look at all those areas where E3b appears in high frequencies in SSA
quote:Listen old man, if you can't manage to discuss without calling people names then i'll advise you to get out of this thread, no one here is in the mood with your childish rantings. Maybe you could go and join a boxing club or buy yourself a baseboll bat and use it on trees in the woods, just keep your rage private and out of public forums.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Sure enough; we can see how it earned that title -- that question had its way of having you demonstrate how to make an inane jackass out of yourself, just from your answer. It's truly educating to see that Southern Egypt is actually that backwater that we call "Somalia".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What an inane question
ok, let me educate you, M78/V12, the Somali marker arose in southern Egypt just some few thousand years ago.
quote:How kind of you; to be able to say things that you cannot back up; we are moved, LOL.
There are plenty of other connections, it's not my duty to line them up here
quote:True; this topic is solely about how unbelievably 'out-of-this-world' stupid you are; you've "educated" me on this matter quite a bit. Thumbs up, my Somalid friend.
since this topic is not about somalia or egypt
quote:Listen frail chimp, if you can't manage to think like a human being, you are advised to stay out of discussion forums.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Listen old man, if you can't manage to discuss without calling people names then i'll advise you to get out of this thread, no one here is in the mood with your childish rantings.
quote:You are entertaining; people correct your lack of intelligence, and you take that as being rage?
Maybe you could go and join a boxing club or buy yourself a baseboll bat and use it on trees in the woods, just keep your rage private and out of public forums.
Boy, that "Samolid" name fits you, or shall I say "Stupid".
quote:There is a def mutation & a clear geographic split in the distribution of the gene. There is no specific father for E1b1b! Maybe you think its an actual father
E1b1a shares the very same *immediate* father as E1b1b[/QB]
quote:Listen kid,
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
There is no specific father for E1b1b!
quote:According to one study, Datog, who are Nilotic speaking people have 43% E3b1-M293..
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1a is confined to the Subsaharan Africa
E1b1b is North African/Med
quote:
“The presence of E-M78* Y chromosomes in the Balkans (two Albanians) , previously described virtually only in northeast Africa, upper Nile, gives rise to the question of what the original source of the E-M78 may have been. Correlations between human-occupation sites and radiocarbon-dated climatic fluctuations in the eastern Sahara and Nile Valley during the Holocene provide a framework for interpreting the main southeast European centric distribution of E-V13. A recent archaeological study reveals that during a desiccation period in North Africa, while the eastern Sahara was depopulated, a refugium existed on the border of present-day Sudan and Egypt, near Lake Nubia, until the onset of a humid phase around 8500 BC (radiocarbon-calibrated date). The rapid arrival of wet conditions during this Early Holocene period provided an impetus for population movement into habitat that was quickly settled afterwards. Hg E-M78* representatives, although rare overall, still occur in Egypt, which is a hub for the distribution of the various geographically localized M78-related sub-clades. The northward-moving rainfall belts during this period could have also spurred a rapid migration of Mesolithic foragers northwards in Africa, the Levant and ultimately onwards to Asia Minor and Europe, where they each eventually differentiated their regionally distinctive branches.”
quote:Note,
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
There is a def mutation & a clear geographic split in the distribution of the gene.
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E1b1a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E1b1b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
All Africans sharing this common ancestor split about 25kya, which is way after the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa.
Whereas, the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa over 60-80 thousand years ago.
Therefore; all non Africans (Europeans near easterners etc..) are extremely far, genetically speaking, from both E1b1a and E1b1b carriers.
Africans carrying E1b1b and E1b1a, are genetically related to eachother, before any other haplogroup, especially a non African lineage.
Unless those said non Africans, carry one of these African lineages; E1b1b or E1b1a.
The only thing that unites any non African to these Africans is the fact that they are carrying an African lineage.
I challenge you to show me another lineage that is closer to this lineage, and diverged as recently from any of these lineages as E1b1a and E1b1b did?
quote:Indeed, normies like me don't have their beady eyes bugged out on the idea that an actual living and breathing father is necessary for Y DNA transmission. Silly us "normies".
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Maybe you think its an actual father
quote:What is a "Somalid".. Please define. I'm lost..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I wonder how many somalids ended up in the new world, surely some handful of somalids might have got caught in the net at the sahel, i bet Denzel Washington and P-Diddy are Somalids, but we'll have to check their blood to be certain
quote:Well duh, Datog are nilo-saharans and live in Tanzania, that's just next door to NE Africans domain, they live next door to the oromo influenced Iraqwa tribe of Tanzania.
Mindovermatters wrote:
According to one study, Datog, who are Nilotic speaking people have 43% E3b1-M293..
quote:Take note of the erroneous classification Yonis the Somali adheres to.... "Somalid" is supposedly in reference to all NE Africans...
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:What is a "Somalid".. Please define. I'm lost..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I wonder how many somalids ended up in the new world, surely some handful of somalids might have got caught in the net at the sahel, i bet Denzel Washington and P-Diddy are Somalids, but we'll have to check their blood to be certain
quote:
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Somalid, Negrid, Europid, Arabid, Mongolid, Indid, Caucasid, Australid are genetic classifications
Example
When someone is genetically Mongolid or Phenotypically Mongoloid that doesn't mean he is from Mongolia (a nation of 2 Million!), yet the classification cover more than 1 Billion people
Another Example
Nationality: American
Heritage : Sicilian
Phenotype : East Med
Genotype : Somalid
If you can't differentiate between those, you should not be in the debate seriously! [/QB]
quote:Somalid is genotype, mostly confined in NE Africa, associated with afrasian people of NE Africa and Maghreb (watered down somalids), but there are some proxy somalids scattered here and there, most notably the levant coast, Anatolia, Balkan and in lower frequency at SW europe. All these places are one way or the other affected by NE Africans.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:What is a "Somalid".. Please define. I'm lost..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I wonder how many somalids ended up in the new world, surely some handful of somalids might have got caught in the net at the sahel, i bet Denzel Washington and P-Diddy are Somalids, but we'll have to check their blood to be certain
quote:Indeed, perhaps Yonis can elaborate on this...
Originally posted by The Explorer:quote:Sure enough; we can see how it earned that title -- that question had its way of having you demonstrate how to make an inane jackass out of yourself, just from your answer. It's truly educating to see that Southern Egypt is actually that backwater that we call "Somalia".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What an inane question
ok, let me educate you, M78/V12, the Somali marker arose in southern Egypt just some few thousand years ago.
[/QB]
quote:These said places have been influenced by sub Saharan Africans, and none of them were from Somalia.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
there are some proxy somalids scattered here and there, most notably the levant coast, Anatolia, Balkan and in lower frequency at SW europe. All these places are one way or the other affected by NE Africans.
quote:Are you saying that Somalid is a "genotype" and not an ethnic descriptor (as you seem to use it in this context when referring to actual human populations)? Are you stating that there are Somalids spread from NE Africa all the way to SW Europe? What's a "proxy" Somalid? I only ask because your stormfront lingo is confusing Yonis. If you're referring to the marker in question, E1b1b, then why not refer to it by its technical name? What does this term "Somalid" have to do with anything and why is it so close to the word "Somali". Why is Somalia so central in this case?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Somalid is genotype, mostly confined in NE Africa, associated with afrasian people of NE Africa and Maghreb, but there are some proxy somalids scattered here and there, most notably the levant coast, Anatolia, Balkan and in lower frequency at SW europe. All these places are one way or the affected by NE Africans.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:What is a "Somalid".. Please define. I'm lost..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I wonder how many somalids ended up in the new world, surely some handful of somalids might have got caught in the net at the sahel, i bet Denzel Washington and P-Diddy are Somalids, but we'll have to check their blood to be certain
quote:Because to stormfront posters Somalis are not "Negroids" but rather are K-zoids.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
Why is Somalia so central in this case?
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
So by calling them Somalid, it's like referencing towards a specific "race" separate from all other Africans who they deem "Negroid".
Only people who could, actually should be referenced as Somalid are actually Somalians, and no one else. Point blank.
quote:I see... Seems like a desperate attempt to isolate himself with a group of people in hopes of forming a blockade between them and "Black/Negro/sub-Saharans"... It's a ruse easily exposed once you disassemble the logic. He's arguing a slippery slope since relatedness is ALWAYS relative and anyone can emphasis a petty separation of two sister lineages based on a couple of mutations. Such doesn't warrant any new taxonomic classification as much as the son of a parent doesn't, or the sister of a brother. Yonis is promoting quack science.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Take note of the erroneous classification Yonis the Somali adheres to.... "Somalid" is supposedly in reference to all NE Africans...
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:What is a "Somalid".. Please define. I'm lost..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
[qb] I wonder how many somalids ended up in the new world, surely some handful of somalids might have got caught in the net at the sahel, i bet Denzel Washington and P-Diddy are Somalids, but we'll have to check their blood to be certain
quote:No that's not it. Somalis are not caucasian
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Because to stormfront posters Somalis are not "Negroids" but rather are Caucasoids.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
Why is Somalia so central in this case?
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
So by calling them Somalid, it's like referencing towards a specific "race" separate from all other Africans who they deem "Negroid".
Only people who could, actually should be referenced as Somalid are actually Somalians, and no one else. Point blank.
quote:^^Precisely..
The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
So by calling them Somalid, it's like referencing towards a specific "race" separate from all other Africans who they deem "Negroid".
Only people who could, actually should be referenced as Somalid are actually Somalians, and no one else. Point blank.
quote:Highest frequency of what? ONE marker in one small part of the human genome?
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:No that's not it. Somalis are not caucasian
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Because to stormfront posters Somalis are not "Negroids" but rather are Caucasoids.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Sundjata:
[qb] Why is Somalia so central in this case?
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
So by calling them Somalid, it's like referencing towards a specific "race" separate from all other Africans who they deem "Negroid".
Only people who could, actually should be referenced as Somalid are actually Somalians, and no one else. Point blank.
It's rather because the Somali nation has the highest frequency in the world at this date. Had Angola had the highest frequency then then the term "Angolid" would also fit, but that's not the case.
quote:Look kid, you seem to be to be too slow to understand that "Somalid" is actually in reference to populations, that stormfront posters deem as "Caucasoid", hence E3b is North African "Caucasoid" ("Somalid") to them, and E3a is sub Saharan "Negroid".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No that's not it. Somalis are not caucasian
As said before somalid has nothing to do with phenotype.
quote:Highest frequency of E1b1b, and it's not just a small marker, this marker is spectacular, it has many stories to tell, if only they could speak and tell their journey since neolithic
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:^^Precisely..
The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
So by calling them Somalid, it's like referencing towards a specific "race" separate from all other Africans who they deem "Negroid".
Only people who could, actually should be referenced as Somalid are actually Somalians, and no one else. Point blank.
quote:Highest frequency of what? ONE marker in one small part of the human genome?
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:No that's not it. Somalis are not caucasian
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Because to stormfront posters Somalis are not "Negroids" but rather are Caucasoids.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Sundjata:
[qb] Why is Somalia so central in this case?
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
The thing is, Somalid is a made up term by retards who think Somalians are "Caucasian".
So by calling them Somalid, it's like referencing towards a specific "race" separate from all other Africans who they deem "Negroid".
Only people who could, actually should be referenced as Somalid are actually Somalians, and no one else. Point blank.
It's rather because the Somali nation has the highest frequency in the world at this date. Had Angola had the highest frequency then then the term "Angolid" would also fit, but that's not the case.
quote:^ he knows this dumby, he just substitutes Caucasoid with Somalid.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Look kid, you seem to be to be too slow to understand that "Somalid" is actually in reference to populations, that stormfront posters deem as "Caucasoid", hence E3b is North African "Caucasoid" ("Somalid") to them, and E3a is sub Saharan "Negroid".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No that's not it. Somalis are not caucasian
As said before somalid has nothing to do with phenotype.
quote:Using the word "stormfront" in all your posts won't discredit anything, besides if you go to stormfront and read the threads made by "assyrian" you'll notice that all the "white" racialist there hate the term "somalid" and fight it, just like you guys do.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
LOL @ Yonis turning into a typical stormfront hack.. He even uses their talking points..
quote:Poor kid didn't even understand what "Somalid" really does (separates) to Africans, or implied.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
LOL @ Yonis turning into a typical stormfront hack.. He even uses their talking points..
quote:Even that is just the stormfront-neophyite Somalid's wishful thinking:
Originally posted by Sundjata:
Highest frequency of what? ONE marker in one small part of the human genome?
quote:You make no sense.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
i bet Denzel Washington and P-Diddy are Somalids, but we'll have to check their blood to be certain
quote:You can add the following bunch to your "minus NE Africans" list:
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:But how does "minus" Nilo-Saharans change the context of your context-less post? Why "minus" them? How does it help you, the mere fact that you have to "minus" another group from the same region?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
It does change the context of the post, since minus nilo-saharans all NE Africans are afrasians.
quote:Maybe because they carry the oldest lineages, so like Bay Area Chinese as Asian archetypes, it doesn't matter what they look like right?...
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:You make no sense.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
i bet Denzel Washington and P-Diddy are Somalids, but we'll have to check their blood to be certain
If "Somalid" to you is not a phenotype; how then can you think Denzel and P-diddy are "Somalids"?
quote:Maybe it's the "bucktooth" thing now, not "genotype".
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
If "Somalid" to you is not a phenotype; how then can you think Denzel and P-diddy are "Somalids"?
quote:Hahahahaha!!!! Dude, YOU ARE pure comedy. Diddy may well be "Somalid"
Originally posted by Yonis2:
i bet Denzel Washington and P-Diddy are Somalids, but we'll have to check their blood to be certain
with his buckteeth, but Denzel is almost certainly 100% western African. He looks so much like my uncle I confuse the two. He also has that unmistakeable western (African, of course) swag. That's why the ladies love him so.
quote:Lol I immediately thought the same because the teeth
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Maybe it's the "bucktooth" thing now, not "genotype".
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
If "Somalid" to you is not a phenotype; how then can you think Denzel and P-diddy are "Somalids"?
quote:Dang! That "bucktooth" line was mine! You're reading my mind!!
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Maybe it's the "bucktooth" thing now, not "genotype".
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
If "Somalid" to you is not a phenotype; how then can you think Denzel and P-diddy are "Somalids"?
quote:Not really. I don't boast, I just tell it like it is.
Originally posted by akoben:
^ maybe certain west Africans have low self esteem, that's why they like to boast?
quote:Please do not direct or recommend individuals on this board to stromfront, that's just retarded.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
besides if you go to stormfront and read the threads made by "assyrian"
quote:We don't hate the term, nor are we fighting it; rather the term is unscientific and we're falsifying it...
Originally posted by Yonis2:
you'll notice that all the "white" racialist there hate the term "somalid" and fight it, just like you guys do.
quote:The Mystery of Yonis2 is that he sometimes displays flashes of intelligence.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Herpes boy, why all the hate on Somalids? You should attack your real enemies in Europe, they are the ones who messed you up real good, what has Somalids ever done to you or your people? Of all these thousands of years that somalids knew about you, they let your people alone to live in peace. It's only when the arabs and europeans entered the scene that the tradegy came to occur. Do i sense stockholm syndrome from your part? Go and attack your real enemy!
Originally posted by argyle104:
You know what I find funny also is there was a thread on this forum about iq from the different regions of Africa. Somalia, Eritrea, and the other horn of African nations ranked the lowest on the entire continent. The only thing that brought up "east" Africa on par with the rest of Africa was that Uganda and Kenya's were high.
PS. This post is not to give credence to bogus measures of intelligence ie iq tests, but its purpose is to show the stupidity of trying to imply that Somalia and other horn of African nations are responsible for the achievements of the saharan/"north" African countries.
Africans from the horn with maybe, maybe the exception of Ethiopia are some of the dumbest people on the planet.
It's very crucial that we all become self aware.
quote:Majority of southern somalis are somalilized oromo, they are slightly different from northern somalis even culturally, 400 years ago they didn't speak somali. The Ajuran who are a big clan only become Somali during the 18th century, so it's not a surprise that they and Boran(oromo) share identical sub-clades, since they are very recently derived from oromo (Boran) and assimilated into somali. In any case all are indigenous NE Africans
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Even that is just the stormfront-neophyite Somalid's wishful thinking:
Originally posted by Sundjata:
Highest frequency of what? ONE marker in one small part of the human genome?
The cluster E-M78γ was found in eastern Africa at an average frequency of 17.7%, with the highest frequencies in the three Cushitic-speaking groups: the Borana from Kenya (71.4%), the Oromo from Ethiopia (32.0%), and the Somali (52.2%). Outside of eastern Africa, it was found only in two subjects from Egypt (3.6%) and in one Arab from Morocco. - Cruciani et al.
And this is just a single cluster, in particular the one that is predominant in Somali M78 distribution.
quote:Why would they be fighting it, if those quacks came up with the quack term in the first place. It's not a matter of hating the term; rather the invocation of the term just underlies plain stupidity. To suggest that this quack slang is worthy of "falsification", is imo, giving it undue merit.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:We don't hate the term, nor are we fighting it; rather the term is unscientific and we're falsifying it...
Originally posted by Yonis2:
you'll notice that all the "white" racialist there hate the term "somalid" and fight it, just like you guys do.
quote:And why would stormfront be offensive to someone who sees the "Forest Negro" as an African archetype? LOL
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Please do not direct or recommend individuals on this board to stromfront.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
besides if you go to stormfront and read the threads made by "assyrian"
quote:Face it stormfront-neophyte somalid; that piece closes the curtain on your latest wishful thinking. You ought to now call it "Kenyanid", using your own quack standard, and say that you Somalis are " Kenyanized" Somalis.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Majority of southern somalis are somalilized oromo, they are slightly different from northern somalis even culturally, 400 years ago they didn't speak somali. The Ajuran who are a big clan only become Somali during the 18th century, so it's not a surprise that they and Boran(oromo) share identical sub-clades, since they are very recently derived from oromo (Boran) and assimilated into somali. In any case all are indigenous NE Africans
Even that is just the stormfront-neophyite Somalid's wishful thinking:
The cluster E-M78γ was found in eastern Africa at an average frequency of 17.7%, with the highest frequencies in the three Cushitic-speaking groups: the Borana from Kenya (71.4%), the Oromo from Ethiopia (32.0%), and the Somali (52.2%). Outside of eastern Africa, it was found only in two subjects from Egypt (3.6%) and in one Arab from Morocco. - Cruciani et al.
And this is just a single cluster, in particular the one that is predominant in Somali M78 distribution.
quote:somalilized oromo?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Majority of southern somalis are somalilized oromo,
quote:Indeed, by his illogical points, all NE Africans are actually "Kenyanids" and so are Europeans with this admixture, and so called near Easterners etc...
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Face it stormfront-neophyte somalid; that piece closes the curtain on your latest wishful thinking. You ought to now call it "Kenyanid", using your own quack standard, and say that you Somalis are " Kenyanized" Somalis.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Majority of southern somalis are somalilized oromo, they are slightly different from northern somalis even culturally, 400 years ago they didn't speak somali. The Ajuran who are a big clan only become Somali during the 18th century, so it's not a surprise that they and Boran(oromo) share identical sub-clades, since they are very recently derived from oromo (Boran) and assimilated into somali. In any case all are indigenous NE Africans
Even that is just the stormfront-neophyite Somalid's wishful thinking:
The cluster E-M78γ was found in eastern Africa at an average frequency of 17.7%, with the highest frequencies in the three Cushitic-speaking groups: the Borana from Kenya (71.4%), the Oromo from Ethiopia (32.0%), and the Somali (52.2%). Outside of eastern Africa, it was found only in two subjects from Egypt (3.6%) and in one Arab from Morocco. - Cruciani et al.
And this is just a single cluster, in particular the one that is predominant in Somali M78 distribution.
quote:By your logic it should be termed "Kenyanid"; no?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Listen guys, what exactly is it that you don't like? I said it before and i'll say it again the term "somalid" can be change,
quote:Noone argues against a relationship culturally etc.. between NE Africans, this is actually not what you promoted to be "Somalid" at first, which was actually by a single genetic marker; E1b1b.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
- NE Africans share same recent geographical origin compared to others.
-NE Africans share a lot of cultural characteristics compared to others
-NE Africans share similar languages compared to others.
-NE Africans share almost identical DNA compared to others.
quote:Now it's secondary? Before you said phenotype had nothing to do with it at all; right?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
-Ne africans share similar phenotype compared to others (although this is secondary when it comes to the term "somalid")
quote:...problem is, YOU nor NE Africans came up with the term.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
So why do you, as outsiders care if we name all indigenous NE Africans lineage after a group of NE africans?
quote:I said similar phenotype not "uniform".
Mindovermatter wrote:
Btw, do tell what uniform phenotype NE Africans share?
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I said similar phenotype not "uniform".
Mindovermatter wrote:
Btw, do tell what uniform phenotype NE Africans share?
Well, then what similar phenotype is this? quote:These are NE african features, what is it with you and your obsession with "caucasoid"?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I said similar phenotype not "uniform".
Mindovermatter wrote:
Btw, do tell what uniform phenotype NE Africans share?
Please elaborate with a clear descriptive definition of features, alongside the picture.
Btw, would these features happened to be once termed "Caucasoid"?
quote:Well isnt this a flip by you? All of a sudden, gringo, you have a problem with the racial schema and its claims of "uniform morphologies and geographical origin (i.e. classical "races" as commonly accepted)"?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Btw, do tell what uniform phenotype NE Africans share?
quote:I asked you to elaborate on what NE African features are; and didn't you say that phenotype had nothing to do with it?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:These are NE african features, what is it with you and your obsession with "caucasoid"?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I said similar phenotype not "uniform".
Mindovermatter wrote:
Btw, do tell what uniform phenotype NE Africans share?
Please elaborate with a clear descriptive definition of features, alongside the picture.
Btw, would these features happened to be once termed "Caucasoid"?
quote:I was talking about country not group/tribe, Einstein.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Even that is just the stormfront-neophyite Somalid's wishful thinking:
Originally posted by Sundjata:
Highest frequency of what? ONE marker in one small part of the human genome?
The cluster E-M78γ was found in eastern Africa at an average frequency of 17.7%, with the highest frequencies in the three Cushitic-speaking groups: the Borana from Kenya (71.4%), the Oromo from Ethiopia (32.0%), and the Somali (52.2%). Outside of eastern Africa, it was found only in two subjects from Egypt (3.6%) and in one Arab from Morocco. - Cruciani et al.
And this is just a single cluster, in particular the one that is predominant in Somali M78 distribution.
quote:You dumb troll, if you would've read the thread you would notice Yonis said Somalid had nothing to do with phenotype, then contradicts himself and says, Denzel and P-diddy can possibly be Somalids just by looking at them.
Originally posted by argyle104:
I'm not into these pseudoscientific racialistic names, but I will say that AAs have ancestry to so called "north", "southern", and "east" Africa. It seems to bother you immensely, as we can see in most of your posts.
quote:Summarily dismissed: it reads "Kenya". Ps -- With that reading capacity, just about anybody would be Einstein relative to you.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I was talking about country not group/tribe, Einstein.
As far as i know their is no country called "Boran", so the country somalia still shows the highest frequency.
quote:I'm not going to dance along your tune, if you can't yourself capture the NE features then that's your own problem, you are the one obsessed with phenotyp. somalid is first and foremost about genotype.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:I asked you to elaborate on what NE African features are; and didn't you say that phenotype had nothing to do with it?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:These are NE african features, what is it with you and your obsession with "caucasoid"?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I said similar phenotype not "uniform".
Mindovermatter wrote:
Btw, do tell what uniform phenotype NE Africans share?
Please elaborate with a clear descriptive definition of features, alongside the picture.
Btw, would these features happened to be once termed "Caucasoid"?
quote:The Boran are an insignificant small group in kenya, they probably don't even come up to 1% of kenya's total population the majority are Nilo-saharan and Niger-congo speakers, Boran are numerically insignificant, lol.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Summarily dismissed: it reads "Kenya". Ps -- With that reading capacity, just about anybody would be Einstein relative to you.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I was talking about country not group/tribe, Einstein.
As far as i know their is no country called "Boran", so the country somalia still shows the highest frequency.
quote:You're the one who said phenotype had nothing to do with it at first, then you switch and say it does, when I ask you to elaborate on this phenotype; you then accuse me of being obsessed with phenotype?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
you are the one obsessed with phenotyp. somalid is first and foremost about genotype.
quote:Kenyans showed up with greater frequencies. Deal with it stormfront neophyte.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The Boran are an insignificant small group in kenya, they probably don't even come up to 1% of kenya's total population the majority are Nilo-saharan and Niger-congo speakers, Boran are numerically insignificant, lol.
Your logic is incredible to say the least.
quote:^ lol
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:The Boran are an insignificant small group in kenya, they probably don't even come up to 1% of kenya's total population the majority are Nilo-saharan and Niger-congo speakers, Boran are numerically insignificant, lol.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Summarily dismissed: it reads "Kenya". Ps -- With that reading capacity, just about anybody would be Einstein relative to you.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I was talking about country not group/tribe, Einstein.
As far as i know their is no country called "Boran", so the country somalia still shows the highest frequency.
Your logic is incredible to say the least.
quote:You're slow kid.
Originally posted by argyle104:
I didn't say that "Somalids" was a phenotype.
quote:That you're a distraught stalking jackass for one.
Originally posted by akoben:
^ what the hell can you explain
quote:I "dot" even understand that article?
Originally posted by akoben:
you dot even understand that article too!
quote:"don't even understand that article too"?
Originally posted by akoben:
you dont even understand that article too!
quote:You mean like "every 100 Britain's directly descended from an African or Asian"?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:I "dot" even understand that article?
Originally posted by akoben:
you dot even understand that article too!
Coherence please.
quote:Well, it seems your fellow British pals weren't aware; they actually thought they were "completely British".
Originally posted by akoben:
one cannot be a "Britain"
quote:1 in every 100 "white" Britons is directly descended from an African or Asian.
Originally posted by akoben:
quote:^ at last! I see our English lessons are paying off you illiterate Spanish buffoon!
gringo's posts now reads: 100 "white" Britons
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718, Co-Signed by Lord Sauron:
quote:1 in every 100 "white" Britons is directly descended from an African or Asian.
Originally posted by akoben:
I know this burns your hurt kid.
quote:Kenyans are only 20% or less E1b1b, the majority of Kenyans are E1b1a. Borana are just one small tribe they are related to the HOA
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Kenyans showed up with greater frequencies.
quote:Since you say that Denzel Washington's look is so common in your country that you have an uncle that looks like him, can you direct us to images of these people? I ask because I have not seen these "west" Africans who look like him. Again can you show us some who do?
Hahahahaha!!!! Dude, YOU ARE pure comedy. Diddy may well be "Somalid" with his buckteeth, but Denzel is almost certainly 100% western African. He looks so much like my uncle I confuse the two. He also has that unmistakeable western (African, of course) swag. That's why the ladies love him so.
quote:So you're making these statements based on ad hoc fantasy that you pulled out of the sky. Which is implying that you were lying about Denzel looking like your uncle.
My generalised statement was based on the FACT that 97% of African Americans are western Africans (genetically)
quote:To the contrary, I don't see African Americans as slaves, therefore there is no connection between them being 97% western African (genetically) and west Africa being a "slave resource". Again, to the contrary, I don't see west Africa as a "slave resource" but rather as a magical place, the most beautiful and satisfying place to be and be-from on earth. And it's the people that make it so.
Originally posted by argyle104:
Anyone who designates as you do that his people were the world's slave resource definitely has mental issues.
quote:No, kenyans do not show the highest frequency, Boran in kenya show the highest frequency, they are a very small afrasian group in northern kenya,the boran are more represented in southern somalia (although they today speak Somali and have adopted and identify with the somali clan system) and also numerous in southern Ethiopia, than they are in Kenya.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Kenyans showed up with greater frequencies. Deal with it stormfront neophyte.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The Boran are an insignificant small group in kenya, they probably don't even come up to 1% of kenya's total population the majority are Nilo-saharan and Niger-congo speakers, Boran are numerically insignificant, lol.
Your logic is incredible to say the least.
quote:"Somalia" is an Italian invention, Yonis. It is no basis for any retarded sub-race classifications based on the presence (in any given frequency) of one marker.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:The Boran are an insignificant small group in kenya, they probably don't even come up to 1% of kenya's total population the majority are Nilo-saharan and Niger-congo speakers, Boran are numerically insignificant, lol.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Summarily dismissed: it reads "Kenya". Ps -- With that reading capacity, just about anybody would be Einstein relative to you.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I was talking about country not group/tribe, Einstein.
As far as i know their is no country called "Boran", so the country somalia still shows the highest frequency.
Your logic is incredible to say the least.
quote:Then they should be watered down and hence, share more E1b1a ancestry relative to E1b1b, but as we have been shown, they actually have the highest frequency of E1b1b. Such has to be devastating to your phenotypical hierarchy. Why you associate phenotype with lineage is beyond me anyways. What does genotype have to do with phenotype? Why is there a need to explain that Boran intermingle with other Africans? Your quackiness is extraordinary....
Boran are the most southern front of NE Africans, they intermarry alot with Nilo-saharans.
quote:Are you sure you're not Jeeves aka What-Box? This incoherent rambling sounds just like something he would write.
To the contrary, I don't see African Americans as slaves, therefore there is no connection between them being 97% western African (genetically) and west Africa being a "slave resource". Again, to the contrary, I don't see west Africa as a "slave resource" but rather as a magical place, the most beautiful and satisfying place to be and be-from on earth. And it's the people that make it so.
quote:Or do you not understand population genetics?
Originally posted by argyle104:
If AAs are "west" African, then they can't be mixed like everyone obsessively needs them to be.
So either you are wrong, or the "them AAs beeze mixed loons are wrong, or you're both wrong and AAs have ancestry from the rest of Africa.
quote:From what I've read, they are more frequent in Ethiopia than anywhere else, and then Kenya. The Borana are said to be migrant Oromos originally from Southern Ethiopia.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No, kenyans do not show the highest frequency, Boran in kenya show the highest frequency , they are a very small afrasian group in northern kenya,the boran are more represented in southern somalia (although they today speak Somali and have adopted and identify with the somali clan system) and also numerous in southern Ethiopia, than they are in Kenya.
quote:Good point. Also notable is the correlation between E1b1b carriers and Cushitic-speakers as again, the most numerically abundant speakers of the Cushitic language group are Oromos.
Nothing about Somalians, but Oromos in Somalia, Boranas don't come from Somalis, hence the highest frequency IS NOT IN SOMALIS
quote:You people that have been there sure make it seem like it in your descriptions.
Originally posted by Heru:
To the contrary, I don't see African Americans as slaves, therefore there is no connection between them being 97% western African (genetically) and west Africa being a "slave resource". Again, to the contrary, I don't see west Africa as a "slave resource" but rather as a magical place, the most beautiful and satisfying place to be and be-from on earth. And it's the people that make it so.
quote:How is it desperate? How is it pseudo-scientific? Imaginary?? Don't confuse me with you.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Good point. Also notable is the correlation between E1b1b carriers and Cushitic-speakers as again, the most numerically abundant speakers of the Cushitic language group are Oromos.
Nothing about Somalians, but Oromos in Somalia, Boranas don't come from Somalis, hence the highest frequency IS NOT IN SOMALIS
It's funny how Yonis' ethnocentric agenda can be tracked through precedent. He is simply recycling old concepts. Caucasoid>>Mediterranean>>Ethiopoid>>Cushitic [people]>>Somalid. Same relationship, different hierarchy. Now instead of Africans being Medit, non-Africans from the Mediterranean can be so labeled "Somalid".. Why can't we let these weakly and pseudo-scientifically defined terms die Yonis? This is obviously a way to somehow boost your own personal self-esteem while continuing your attempt to force some imaginary dichotomy between African people. It looks desperate.
quote:Like I told you before no one argues against a relationship culturally etc.. between NE Africans, this is actually not what you promoted to be "Somalid", which was actually by a single genetic marker; E1b1b.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
All NE Africans despite zero knowledge of anthropology or that they originally come from same root always relate to each other when overseas before connecting with other people, be they from other parts of Africa or the world.
quote:The country Somalia has the highest frequency, how is it false?
Mindovermatter wrote:
That you said had it's highest frequencies in Somalis, and hence should be called "Somalid".
This is False!
quote:So why didn't you notice this slight of hand with your illiterate Jewish friend who claimed that Kenyans showed up with greater frequencies?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Nothing about Somalians, but Oromos in Somalia
quote:Your logic is flawed since 1) Somalia is a European construct with arbitrarily defined borders and 2), those with the highest frequency do NOT reside or originate in modern Somalia... No one is arguing against any cultural similarity, only your bunk concepts. According to you and your argument, Kenyan Borana are more "Somalid" than are Somalis..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:The country Somalia has the highest frequency, how is it false?
Mindovermatter wrote:
That you said had it's highest frequencies in Somalis, and hence should be called "Somalid".
This is False!
Btw, borana are less in kenya than in somalia, the difference is that they speak somali and have dropped their background and completly assimilated, majority of south western somalis are former Borana in particular the sabs, so they are not known as Borana. We only have one language, but people drawn from many minority tribes who didn't speak somali before, almost all over the southern part.
quote:Exactly.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Your logic is flawed since 1) Somalia is a European construct with arbitrarily defined borders and 2), those with the highest frequency do NOT reside or originate in modern Somalia... No one is arguing against any cultural similarity, only your bunk concepts. According to you and your argument, Kenyan Borana are more "Somalid" than are Somalis..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:The country Somalia has the highest frequency, how is it false?
Mindovermatter wrote:
That you said had it's highest frequencies in Somalis, and hence should be called "Somalid".
This is False!
Btw, borana are less in kenya than in somalia, the difference is that they speak somali and have dropped their background and completly assimilated, majority of south western somalis are former Borana in particular the sabs, so they are not known as Borana. We only have one language, but people drawn from many minority tribes who didn't speak somali before, almost all over the southern part.
quote:Hey Yonis the stormfront neophyte, the cited piece makes a jackass out of you, since it clearly shows another non-Somali group with a higher proportion of the same marker that makes up the bulk of Somali E-M78. Thus, even by your own clown standards, your unintelligible nick of "somalid" comes to a naught.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Kenyans are only 20% or less E1b1b, the majority of Kenyans are E1b1a. Borana are just one small tribe they are related to the HOA
quote:Load of BS. Present one researcher who [is not your stormfront guardian] says Somalia is the ancestral home to E1b1ba or its father E1b1b, respectively.
Somalia & Moroc are the 2 nations with the highest E1b1b frequency
quote:Look at this foolish little stormfront somalid contradict himself. In breath denies that Kenyans, in this case the Borana, showed high frequencies, and in the next, he essentially admits that they are from Kenya.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No, kenyans do not show the highest frequency, Boran in kenya show the highest frequency
quote:If they didn't, the authors you cited wouldn't have made note of the fact that they are a Kenyan sample.
they do *NOT* represent kenya
quote:lol.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Look at this foolish little stormfront somalid contradict himself. In breath denies that Kenyans, in this case the Borana, showed high frequencies, and in the next, he essentially admits that they are from Kenya.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No, kenyans do not show the highest frequency, Boran in kenya show the highest frequency
quote:If they didn't, the authors you cited wouldn't have made note of the fact that they are a Kenyan sample.
they do *NOT* represent kenya
quote:Gofuckyourself, tell us why it is wrong to acknowledge Cruciani's Borana sample as Kenyans?
Originally posted by AssOpen:
So why didn't you notice this slight of hand with your illiterate Jewish friend who claimed that Kenyans showed up with greater frequencies?
quote:lol. again. just reading this thread and the systemtic destruction of Yonis/Somalid nonsense is quite hilarious.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Your logic is flawed since 1) Somalia is a European construct with arbitrarily defined borders and 2), those with the highest frequency do NOT reside or originate in modern Somalia... No one is arguing against any cultural similarity, only your bunk concepts. According to you and your argument, Kenyan Borana are more "Somalid" than are Somalis..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:The country Somalia has the highest frequency, how is it false?
Mindovermatter wrote:
That you said had it's highest frequencies in Somalis, and hence should be called "Somalid".
This is False!
Btw, borana are less in kenya than in somalia, the difference is that they speak somali and have dropped their background and completly assimilated, majority of south western somalis are former Borana in particular the sabs, so they are not known as Borana. We only have one language, but people drawn from many minority tribes who didn't speak somali before, almost all over the southern part.
at stormfront.
quote:i tried to save him from this humiliating fiasco, but he wouldn't listen.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
It would be funny, if stormfront's chewing away of whatever's left of the somalid's brain wasn't so tragic.
quote:Well said. Matter of fact, the somalid clown admits that there are "assimilated" Borana in Somali; no doubt that this "assimilated" originally non-Somali subset contributes to the E-M78 distribution there, which would otherwise be lower without it. It also comes back to my point about "acculturation".
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
From what I've read, they are more frequent in Ethiopia than anywhere else, and then Kenya. The Borana are said to be migrant Oromos originally from Southern Ethiopia.
The Borana are part of a very much larger group of about 4 to 5 million persons of whom over 100 thousand live in north central Kenya, with the balance in Ethiopia.
They are related to the Oromo in Somalia also.
Nothing about Somalians, but related Oromos in Somalia, Boranas don't come from Somalia, hence the highest frequency IS NOT IN SOMALIS
quote:Indeed. Not any less funny, is that the somalid clown seems to think there is nothing wrong about the notion of naming the father after his son, instead of the other way around.
Originally posted by rasol:
lol. again. just reading this thread and the systemtic destruction of Yonis/Somalid nonsense is quite hilarious.
this is what happens when you "lurk"
it does to your mind what lurking at whorehouses does to the phallus.
quote:Not that it wouldn't have been wrong as well, for him to call the distinctive cultures of non-Somalis "Somalid"; it wouldn't matter if there is a "relationship".
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Like I told you before no one argues against a relationship culturally etc.. between NE Africans, this is actually not what you promoted to be "Somalid", which was actually by a single genetic marker; E1b1b.
quote:Again, Einstein, Borans are more in Somalia and Ethiopia than in kenya, they are just caught up inside northern kenya due to colonial borders, they have absolutly nothing to do with kenyans such as kikuyu and other Niger-congo speakers. As i said before, they are the most southern front of NE Africans, although many have mixed with nilo-saharans such as sambura since the Borana males have as tradition to take sambura females. Kenya has 70 ethnicities and all are not related to each other, get it through your skull.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Look at this foolish little stormfront somalid contradict himself. In breath denies that Kenyans, in this case the Borana, showed high frequencies, and in the next, he essentially admits that they are from Kenya.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No, kenyans do not show the highest frequency, Boran in kenya show the highest frequency
quote:If they didn't, the authors you cited wouldn't have made note of the fact that they are a Kenyan sample.
they do *NOT* represent kenya
quote:1)The somali ethnicity is NOT a european construct, the somali borders however are a european construction same with all borders in Africa and Middle East.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Your logic is flawed since 1) Somalia is a European construct with arbitrarily defined borders and 2), those with the highest frequency do NOT reside or originate in modern Somalia... No one is arguing against any cultural similarity, only your bunk concepts. According to you and your argument, Kenyan Borana are more "Somalid" than are Somalis..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:The country Somalia has the highest frequency, how is it false?
Mindovermatter wrote:
That you said had it's highest frequencies in Somalis, and hence should be called "Somalid".
This is False!
Btw, borana are less in kenya than in somalia, the difference is that they speak somali and have dropped their background and completly assimilated, majority of south western somalis are former Borana in particular the sabs, so they are not known as Borana. We only have one language, but people drawn from many minority tribes who didn't speak somali before, almost all over the southern part.
quote:How would it be lower? We are speaking about frequency here not amount, with or without borana E1b1ba will still be the dominating haplogroup in Somalia, not much would have changed. E1b1a(E3a) however has nothing to do with somalia or rest of NE Africa, other than arrival of recent alien groups to NE Africa. Same with west asian markers.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Well said. Matter of fact, the somalid clown admits that there are "assimilated" Borana in Somali; no doubt that this "assimilated" originally non-Somali subset contributes to the E-M78 distribution there, which would otherwise be lower without it. It also comes back to my point about "acculturation".
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
From what I've read, they are more frequent in Ethiopia than anywhere else, and then Kenya. The Borana are said to be migrant Oromos originally from Southern Ethiopia.
The Borana are part of a very much larger group of about 4 to 5 million persons of whom over 100 thousand live in north central Kenya, with the balance in Ethiopia.
They are related to the Oromo in Somalia also.
Nothing about Somalians, but related Oromos in Somalia, Boranas don't come from Somalia, hence the highest frequency IS NOT IN SOMALIS
quote:He said "highest frequency" he didn't say "ancestral"...pay attention Einstein.
Explorer wrote:
quote:Load of BS. Present one researcher who [is not your stormfront guardian] says Somalia is the ancestral home to E1b1ba or its father E1b1b, respectively.
Somalia & Moroc are the 2 nations with the highest E1b1b frequency
quote:Just like Somalis are entrapped in colonial borders; your point?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Again, Einstein, Borans are more in Somalia and Ethiopia than in kenya, they are just caught up inside northern kenya due to colonial borders
quote:Of course they do, which is why they were identified as such, moron.
they have absolutly nothing to do with kenyans
quote:Who said otherwise; remember, you are that idiot who can't get it in that somalid block head, the simple fact that a non-Somali Kenyan group not only outdoes somalis when it comes to the very same marker that dominates somali E-M78 distribution, but also is the reason you have the numbers that you find a false sense of self-aggrandizement in.
Kenya has 70 ethnicities
quote:All somalis are NE Africans and somalids (except the somali-bantu)and speak same language, all Kenyans are *NOT*, that's the point.
Explorer wrote:
Just like Somalis are entrapped in colonial borders; your point?
quote:I told you before to stop lifting words out of their original context, i wrote "they have absolutly nothing to do with kenyans such as kikuyu and othe niger-congo speakers ", which they don't, other than sharing the country Kenya.
quote:Of course they do, which is why they were identified as such, moron.
they have absolutly nothing to do with kenyans
quote:Bonehead; if you take a subset of the population and subtract them out; do you still get the same overall size?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
How would it be lower?
quote:And I'm talking about the Borana contributing to that frequency.
We are speaking about frequency here not amount
quote:Perhaps. But without them Borana, perhaps it would be more apparent that you are little more than water-downed *derivatives* of the relatively more pristine groups, like the Borana.
, with or without borana E1b1ba will still be the dominating haplogroup in Somalia
quote:You lie.
E1b1a(E3a) however has nothing to do with somalia
quote:You lie again. This your best shot at making a fool out of yourself?
or rest of NE Africa,
quote:You mean "you said".
Originally posted by Yonis2:
He said
quote:I know what is said, moron, which is why I asked that question. If Somalia had the greatest frequency of E1b1b, then you'd have to implicate all the derivatives of E1b1b in that. Where's your evidence for this?
"highest frequency" he didn't say "ancestral"...pay attention Einstein.
quote:Denying it, won't help.
Btw i'm not "Somalid-V13".
quote:You're the "bonehead" who seems incapable to discuss without lifting sentences out of their context. That's very cheap, i bet you don't even see it as a dishonest way of engaging in a discourse, it's quite obvious that your whole presence at this forum is based on arguing not discussing, pffh
Explorer wrote:
Bonehead; if you take a subset of the population and subtract them out; do you still get the same overall size?
quote:In which case, they have absolutely nothing do with Somalis either...and which is why, this group being more pristine E-M78 carriers than Somalis seems to bother you; it cripples your moronic & fairytale "stormfrontisque racialist" hierarchy, forcing you to go into all sorts of rounds in rationalizing why they ought not be counted on their own "discrete" merit...from Somalis.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
"they have absolutly nothing to do with kenyans such as kikuyu and othe niger-congo speakers "
quote:Exactly. As modest as it may be, perhaps there is some hope for you after all.
other than sharing the country Kenya
quote:What, are you denying that E3a has nothing to do with NE Africa other than recent migration or slave trade?
quote:You lie.
E1b1a(E3a) however has nothing to do with somalia
quote:You lie again. This your best shot at making a fool out of yourself?
or rest of NE Africa
quote:Of course they have much to do with Somalis since Borana are Somalids.
Explorer wrote:
In which case, they have absolutely nothing do with Somalis either...
quote:Lol. The stormfront neophyte is now placing blame on me for having asked a dumb question.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
You're the "bonehead" who seems incapable to discuss without lifting sentences out of their context. That's very cheap, i bet you don't even see it as a dishonest way of engaging in a discourse, it's quite obvious that your whole presence at this forum is based on arguing not discussing, pffh
quote:Hate to break it to you stormfront neophyte; but yes, frequency has everything to do with "quantity". You'd know this if you were schooled in any degree in molecular genetics, if you weren't such a "perfect" stormfront neophyte.
Also, learn the difference between "frequency" and "quantity".
quote:Thanks for proving my point [above] stormfront neophyte, with this moronic example.
If we have five red apples and remove two red apples from these five, the frequency of red apples would still be 100%, got it Einstein?
quote:How did it prove your point? These type of substanceless lines does not give you any extra credibility you know.
Explorer wrote:
Thanks for proving my point [above] stormfront neophyte, with this moronic example.
quote:I'm *outing* your lie, when you say:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What, are you denying that E3a has nothing to do with NE Africa other than recent migration or slave trade?
quote:It's not a lie it's a *FACT*, E1b1a has nothing to do with NE Africa, what ever that exist of it came through recent admixture or migration from other parts of Africa.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:I'm *outing* your lie, when you say:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What, are you denying that E3a has nothing to do with NE Africa other than recent migration or slave trade?
E1b1a(E3a) however has nothing to do with somalia or rest of NE Africa, other than arrival of recent alien groups to NE Africa.
You can't deny a "lie", and a contradictory one at that.
quote:If I must "illustrate" it to a stormfront neophyte, than it shall be:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
How did it prove your point?
quote:Has it occurred to you that if you don't go making moronic claims in just about every post, that perhaps then, people won't have to call you out as it is.
Btw have you ever engaged in a thread longer than three pages with atleast 15 posts produced by you without calling people names?
quote:You mean like what you are doing above. So I throw it right back at you; do you have friends?
This type of behaviour is a strong sign of bad upbringing and also an abnormal and skewed personality. Do you have friends?
quote:It is as about as much fact as flying pigs; otherwise you wouldn't feel the need to contradict yourself when lying, again and again.
It's not a lie it's a *FACT*, E1b1a has nothing to do with NE Africa, what ever that exist of it came through recent admixture or migration from other parts of Africa.
quote:Well we don't know what the original somalids called themselves, therefore their is absolutly nothing wrong to name them after one of their descendants.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Indeed. Not any less funny, is that the somalid clown seems to think there is nothing wrong about the notion of naming the father after his son, instead of the other way around.
Originally posted by rasol:
lol. again. just reading this thread and the systemtic destruction of Yonis/Somalid nonsense is quite hilarious.
this is what happens when you "lurk"
it does to your mind what lurking at whorehouses does to the phallus.
quote:LOL, frequency and quantity are still *NOT* the same, regardless if frequency relies on quantity, stop saving face, these are two different measurement units.
Explorer wrote:
If I must "illustrate" it to a stormfront neophyte, than it shall be:
The frequency, moron, is how many times an element re-appears in a sample size. Hence, the frequency relies on the quantity of that element in that sample size. Is this finding any easier way into your somalid head now? I hope so.
quote:Let's make this simple for you, stormfront stooge: "Somalis", let alone "somalids", was a *non-existent* entity, when E-M78 emerged.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Well we don't know what the original somalids called themselves,
quote:If you weren't such a stormfront buffoon, you'd know that we do have populations that have E-M78*, the more ancestral E-M78 markers, and Somalia ain't one of them.
therefore their is absolutly nothing wrong to name them after one of their descendants.
quote:somalid bonehead, learn to read:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
LOL, frequency and quantity are still *NOT* the same, regardless if frequency relies on quantity, stop saving face, these are two different measurement units.
quote:I see you also suffer from reading comprehension problems, no wonder you have adopted the cheap habit of lifting sentences out of their context.
Explorer wrote:
If you weren't such a stormfront buffoon, you'd know that we do have populations that have E-M78*, the more ancestral E-M78 markers, and Somalia ain't one of them.
quote:And we see that you are a blind moron, because you:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I see
quote:For sure it doesn't take a rocket scientist, and with your logic you wouldn't even qualify to be the shoe shiner of a Rocket scientist assistant.
Explorer wrote:
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand the above, let alone be ignorant of the difference between what was said and what you just said. FYI: Frequency is a quantitative application; are you a high school drop out? If not, please do go back, and then come discuss basic math.
quote:And what exactly did this post of yours change?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:And we see that you are a blind moron, because you:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I see
suffer from reading comprehension problems....
Such that you don't understand this:
If you weren't such a stormfront buffoon, you'd know that we do have populations that have E-M78*, the more ancestral E-M78 markers, and Somalia ain't one of them.
And therefore repeating this jackass post:
"their is absolutly nothing wrong to name them after one (group) of their descendants " i never said the group or carriers of " the more ancestral E-M78 markers",....pay attention Einstein.
quote:What does this supposed to do for Somalis?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Again, Einstein, Borans are more in Somalia and Ethiopia than in kenya,
quote:With your appalling reading level [must be the "somalid" thing], and the fact you were ignorant of the relationship between frequency and quantity [until just now schooled on it] makes you only qualified to clean a shoe shiner's ass. You can't learn elementary math overnight by randomly googling, yonis; you need to go back to primary school, that's how it's done.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:For sure it doesn't take a rocket scientist, and with your logic you wouldn't even qualify to be the shoe shiner of a Rocket scientist assistant.
Explorer wrote:
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand the above, let alone be ignorant of the difference between what was said and what you just said. FYI: Frequency is a quantitative application; are you a high school drop out? If not, please do go back, and then come discuss basic math.
Let me break it down to you, quantity as in numbers of discontinued tangible things is the most basic method of measuring multitude.
As example; given a sample of 5 borana that are E1b1ba and given six somalis that are E1b1ba, are in total quantity=11 individuals of E1b1ba.
Now using the measurment unit of frequency, the above qiven quantity of E1b1ba would be=100% frequency of E1b1ba occuring in the sample, now if we remove the 5 borana from the equation, the frequency of E1b1ba occuring in the sample would still be = 100%, but the quantity would change from 11 to 6.
Quantity and frequency are two different measurment units. Do you need further examples or are you going to continue arguing for the sake of it, Einstein?
quote:Nothing; because it demonstrates this:
And what exactly did this post of yours change?
quote:Kid, we are trying to knock some sense into that stormfront-infested blockhead of your's. This is a serious condition you are in; it is not a tap dancing game.
so your point remains moot, stop wasting time and start writing something of value, i'm not in the mood of tap dancing with you.
quote:The only reason Greeks are close to these African populations is because they carry this African genetic marker, from these Africans.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
DNA evidence is clear Somalians are genetically closer to Southern Greeks than to the Bantu guys near by, just like Afghans are genetically closer to Poland more than Arabia.
quote:If you can't comprehend the above then you definitely have no business discussing anything else.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E1b1a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E1b1b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
All Africans sharing this common ancestor split about 25kya, which is way after the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa.
Wherein, the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa over 60-80 thousand years ago.
Therefore; all non Africans (Europeans near easterners etc..) are extremely far, genetically speaking, from both E1b1a and E1b1b carriers.
Africans carrying E1b1b and E1b1a, are genetically related to eachother, before any other haplogroup, especially a non African lineage.
Unless those said non Africans, carry one of these African lineages; E1b1b or E1b1a.
The only thing that unites any non African to these Africans is the fact that they are carrying an African lineage.
I challenge you to show me another lineage that is closer to this lineage, and diverged as recently from any of these lineages as E1b1a and E1b1b did?
quote:In turn, the whole European population is more closer genetically to Africans, than all non African populations.
Population genetic relationships between Mediterranean populations determined by HLA allele distribution and a historic perspective.
HLA genomics shows that: 1) Greeks share an important part of their genetic pool with sub-Saharan Africans (Ethiopians and west Africans) also supported by Chr 7 Markers. The gene flow from Black Africa to Greece may have occurred in Pharaonic times or when Saharan people emigrated after the present hyperarid conditions were established (5000 years B.C.).
quote:And alternatively, using that somalid's logic, one can say that Benin haplotype HbS ties Greeks more closely to Niger-Congo speaking and Egyptian populations who have this genetic trait, than it does to Somalis.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:The only reason Greeks are close to these African populations is because they carry this African genetic marker, from these Africans.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
DNA evidence is clear Somalians are genetically closer to Southern Greeks than to the Bantu guys near by, just like Afghans are genetically closer to Poland more than Arabia.
quote:You mean southern Greeks are closer to Somalids, rather than other Europens, right?
Mindovermatters wrote:
So it's actually the other way around, and Greeks are closer to Africans, rather than other Europeans.
quote:
HLA genomics shows that: 1) Greeks share an important part of their genetic pool with sub-Saharan Africans (Ethiopians and west Africans) also supported by Chr 7 Markers. The gene flow from Black Africa to Greece may have occurred in Pharaonic times or when Saharan people emigrated after the present hyperarid conditions were established (5000 years B.C.).
quote:Isn't that a sickness?
Explorer wrote:
Benin haplotype HbS ties Greeks more closely to Niger-Congo speaking and Egyptian populations who have this genetic trait
quote:It's a resistance to Malaria you imbecile.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Isn't that a sickness?
Explorer wrote:
Benin haplotype HbS ties Greeks more closely to Niger-Congo speaking and Egyptian populations who have this genetic trait
Thank God i don't have it.
quote:I don't care about Greeks as a whole, only Somalid Greeks.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^Let me know if you see any Somalian reference below; ok?
Population genetic relationships between Mediterranean populations determined by HLA allele distribution and a historic perspective.
quote:
HLA genomics shows that: 1) Greeks share an important part of their genetic pool with sub-Saharan Africans (Ethiopians and west Africans) also supported by Chr 7 Markers. The gene flow from Black Africa to Greece may have occurred in Pharaonic times or when Saharan people emigrated after the present hyperarid conditions were established (5000 years B.C.).
quote:No such thing. If anything by your logic there are Aethiopid and West Africanid Greeks though.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I don't care about Greeks as a whole, only Somalid Greeks.
quote:Wrong, that was another study which was axed for political reasons, this is a different study, same results.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Btw, wasn't that study discredited long time ago, since it was sponsered by an anti-hellenic institution in Macedonia?
quote:
Originally posted by Knowledgeiskey718:
Courtesy of Refuting "Racial Reality" re Greeks
http://www.onedroprule.org/about1335.html
Author
William
Moderator
There is a fraudulent claim, promulgated by Racial Reality and Dienekes Pontikos, that the Arnaiz-Villena study HLA genes in Macedonians and the sub-Saharan origin of the Greeks (abstract and link to full study below) has been retracted or scientifically refuted. Rest assured, the study is perfectly valid. It would be helpful here to discuss the study that was retracted, and the reason why. It is The origin of Palestinians and their genetic relatedness with other Mediterranean populations (which contained some cross-referenced Greek data in a neighbor-joining dendogram and a correspondence analysis), and it was retracted solely and strictly for political reasons, as this Observer article makes crystal clear:
(Keep in mind we are dealing with the study on the relatedness of Jews and Palestinians at the moment, which was retracted, and not the one on the Greek-sub-Saharan relatedness, which was not retracted. The two must not be confused.)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0,4273,4307083,00.html
Observer wrote:
Journal axes gene research on Jews and Palestinians
Robin McKie, science editor
Observer
Sunday November 25, 2001
A keynote research paper showing that Middle Eastern Jews and Palestinians are genetically almost identical has been pulled from a leading journal.
Academics who have already received copies of Human Immunology have been urged to rip out the offending pages and throw them away.
Such a drastic act of self-censorship is unprecedented in research publishing and has created widespread disquiet, generating fears that it may involve the suppression of scientific work that questions Biblical dogma.
'I have authored several hundred scientific papers, some for Nature and Science, and this has never happened to me before,' said the article's lead author, Spanish geneticist Professor Antonio Arnaiz-Villena, of Complutense University in Madrid. 'I am stunned.'
British geneticist Sir Walter Bodmer added: 'If the journal didn't like the paper, they shouldn't have published it in the first place. Why wait until it has appeared before acting like this?'
The journal's editor, Nicole Sucio-Foca, of Columbia University, New York, claims the article provoked such a welter of complaints over its extreme political writing that she was forced to repudiate it. The article has been removed from Human Immunology's website, while letters have been written to libraries and universities throughout the world asking them to ignore or 'preferably to physically remove the relevant pages'. Arnaiz-Villena has been sacked from the journal's editorial board.
Dolly Tyan, president of the American Society of Histocompatibility and Immunogenetics, which runs the journal, told subscribers that the society is 'offended and embarrassed'.
The paper, 'The Origin of Palestinians and their Genetic Relatedness with other Mediterranean Populations', involved studying genetic variations in immune system genes among people in the Middle East.
In common with earlier studies, the team found no data to support the idea that Jewish people were genetically distinct from other people in the region. In doing so, the team's research challenges claims that Jews are a special, chosen people and that Judaism can only be inherited.
Jews and Palestinians in the Middle East share a very similar gene pool and must be considered closely related and not genetically separate, the authors state. Rivalry between the two races is therefore based 'in cultural and religious, but not in genetic differences', they conclude.
But the journal, having accepted the paper earlier this year, now claims the article was politically biased and was written using 'inappropriate' remarks about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Its editor told the journal Nature last week that she was threatened by mass resignations from members if she did not retract the article.
Arnaiz-Villena says he has not seen a single one of the accusations made against him, despite being promised the opportunity to look at the letters sent to the journal.
He accepts he used terms in the article that laid him open to criticism. There is one reference to Jewish 'colonists' living in the Gaza strip, and another that refers to Palestinian people living in 'concentration' camps.
'Perhaps I should have used the words settlers instead of colonists, but really, what is the difference?' he said.
'And clearly, I should have said refugee, not concentration, camps, but given that I was referring to settlements outside of Israel - in Syria and Lebanon - that scarcely makes me anti-Jewish. References to the history of the region, the ones that are supposed to be politically offensive, were taken from the Encyclopaedia Britannica, and other text books.'
In the wake of the journal's actions, and claims of mass protests about the article, several scientists have now written to the society to support Arnaiz-Villena and to protest about their heavy-handedness.
One of them said: 'If Arnaiz-Villena had found evidence that Jewish people were genetically very special, instead of ordinary, you can be sure no one would have objected to the phrases he used in his article. This is a very sad business.'
It is worth exploring a few quotes from the above article, as they are very revealing:
Observer wrote:
Such a drastic act of self-censorship is unprecedented in research publishing and has created widespread disquiet, generating fears that it may involve the suppression of scientific work that questions Biblical dogma.
This shows the politics at work in certain circles of genetic research.
Sir Walter Bodmer wrote:
British geneticist Sir Walter Bodmer added: 'If the journal didn't like the paper, they shouldn't have published it in the first place. Why wait until it has appeared before acting like this?'
The fact that the journal initially published the paper shows the journal found nothing wrong with it scientifically. Indeed, all papers must pass peer review to be published. It also, apparently, saw nothing politically objectionable, until it received all those letters from people objecting to the supposedly politically incorrect wording.
Apparently, later on, in an attempt to discredit the study "scientifically," three scientists wrote in to Nature Magazine. Racial Reality and Pontikos claim it somehow "challenges" that the study was pulled for political reasons. This is utter nonsense, as the Observer article makes the political reasons for the withdrawal very plain. The three scientists are expressing their own opinions only, and their "lack of scientific merit" idea, which falls very weakly and definitely untrue, was not the reason for the retraction. This can be seen when viewing their own comment at the end of the article: "We believe that the paper should have been refused for publication on the simple grounds that it lacked scientific merit." In actuality, this "scientific refutation" is a thinly veiled and weak attempt, containing nonsensical and straw-man arguments, to discredit the study solely and strictly because of its politically controversial remarks.
Here is the article. Note that what Dienekes Pontikos quotes on his site is only a portion of the article, and this is done to make it seem, to the unsuspecting reader, as though it pertains to the Greek study, or to Arnaiz-Villena's methodology in general, which it most certainly does not; if the scientists truly had a problem with the Greek study, they would have written specifically about it, and if they truly had a problem with Arnaiz-Villena's methodology in all his studies, they would have written about that. They didn't, and to reiterate, their comments about the Palestinian/Jewish study are invalid, and this will be explained below. This deception is also found on Racial Reality's own site, and he has added it to Wikipedia's article on admixture in Europe, calling it the "Arnaiz-Villena Controversy." Note also that there is no controversy in the scientific community over the study on Greeks at all; such controversy exists only in the minds of the two aforementioned southern European White Nationalists. I have made requests to have the misinformation removed from Wiki, but it hasn't happened yet. Racial Reality dodges the bullet by rewording it slightly, while still saying essentially the same thing. So, I have given up. Dear Reader, please take what you find on Wiki with several grains of salt; it is notorious for falsification, and I frankly don't think this problem will ever be resolved:
http://www.nature.com/cgi-taf/DynaPage.taf?file=/nature/journal/v415/n6868/full/415115b_r.html
Quote:
Nature 415, 115 (10 January 2002); doi:10.1038/415115b
Dropped genetics paper lacked scientific merit
Sir – Even though the controversial withdrawal of a paper on the genetic relatedness of Palestinians and Jews by the journal Human Immunology (see Nature 414, 382; 2001) is a minor episode compared with the tragedies caused by ethnic/religious conflicts over past decades, the issues involved are worth revisiting.
The stated purpose of the paper by Antonio Arnaiz-Villena et al. was to "examine the genetic relationships between the Palestinians and their neighbours (particularly the Jews) in order to: (1) discover the Palestinian origins, and (2) explain the historic basis of the present ... conflict between Palestinians and other Muslim countries with Israelite Jews".
They conclude: "Jews and Palestinians share a very similar HLA genetic pool that supports a common ancient Canaanite origin. Therefore, the origin of the long-lasting Jewish–Palestinian hostility is the fight for land in ancient times."
It is difficult to believe that knowledge of genes may help to explain the present conflict. Although population genetics can address issues of relatedness of populations, mating patterns, migrations and so on, obviously it cannot provide evidence about reasons for conflicts between people.
Our primary concern, however, is that the authors might be perceived to have been discriminated against for political, as opposed to legitimate scientific, reasons.
Even a cursory look at the paper's diagrams and trees immediately indicates that the authors make some extraordinary claims. They used a single genetic marker, HLA DRB1, for their analysis to construct a genealogical tree and map of 28 populations from Europe, the Middle East, Africa and Japan. Using results from the analysis of a single marker, particularly one likely to have undergone selection, for the purpose of reconstructing genealogies is unreliable and unacceptable practice in population genetics.
The limitations are made evident by the authors' extraordinary observations that Greeks are very similar to Ethiopians and east Africans but very distant from other south Europeans; and that the Japanese are nearly identical to west and south Africans. It is surprising that the authors were not puzzled by these anomalous results, which contradict history, geography, anthropology and all prior population-genetic studies of these groups. Surely the ordinary process of refereeing would have saved the field from this dispute.
We believe that the paper should have been refused for publication on the simple grounds that it lacked scientific merit.
Neil Risch
Department of Genetics, Stanford University School of Medicine, Stanford, California 94305, USA
Alberto Piazza
Department of Genetics, Biology and Biochemistry, University of Torino, Via Santena 19, 10126 Torino, Italy
L. Luca Cavalli-Sforza
Department of Genetics, Stanford University School of Medicine, Stanford, California 94305, USA [/QB]
quote:Well, who cares if they had it, i'm just glad that i don't have that sickle cell stuff.
Mindovermatters wrote:
It's funny that you should say that you thank God you don't have it, since ancient Egyptians had it,
quote:
We conducted a molecular investigation of the presence of sicklemia in six predynastic Egyptian mummies (about 3200 BC) from the Anthropological and Ethnographic Museum of Turin. Previous studies of these remains showed the presence of severe anemia, while histological preparations of mummified tissues revealed hemolytic disorders. DNA was extracted from dental samples with a silica-gel method specific for ancient DNA. A modification of the polymerase chain reaction (PCR), called amplification refractory mutation system (ARMS) was then applied. ARMS is based on specific priming of the PCR and it permits diagnosis of single nucleotide mutations. In this method, amplification can occur only in the presence of the specific mutation being studied. The amplified DNA was analyzed by electrophoresis. In samples of three individuals, there was a band at the level of the HbS mutated fragment, indicating that they were affected by sicklemia. On the basis of our results, we discuss the possible uses of new molecular investigation systems in paleopathological diagnoses of genetic diseases and viral, bacterial and fungal infections.
quote:^
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:It's a resistance to Malaria you imbecile.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Isn't that a sickness?
Explorer wrote:
Benin haplotype HbS ties Greeks more closely to Niger-Congo speaking and Egyptian populations who have this genetic trait
Thank God i don't have it.
quote:BS. Demonstrate that Somalia has the most comprehensive E1b1b.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
The only reason it's called that is because the greatest E1b1b frequency is in Somalia
quote:What makes them any more "radically" different than two brothers by the same father. E1b1a and E1b1b are more than cousins; they are siblings!
E1b1b is genetically seperate from E1b1a, in the same way J (Arabids) and I (Nordids) Y-DNAs are now radically different, despite being genetic cousins.
quote:That phylogenetically and material-barren map [possibly done by some amateur, pending references] answers my question how? Is it possible that you even understand what I just asked you?
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
"BS. Demonstrate that Somalia has the most comprehensive E1b1b."
I gave a link the map specifically for this.
And all genetic studies point to this fact.
quote:You can guess all you like; one fact stands: E1b1a and E1b1b are phylogenetically sibling clades.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
Guess that makes Arabids and Nordids siblings...
quote:Wrong, the highest frequency appears in a non Somali population, hence your logic is already shot.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
Ok, just wanted to clarify something, because I feel people don't like the word 'Somalid", nothing wrong with it.
The only reason it's called that is because the greatest E1b1b frequency is in Somalia
quote:This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
E1b1b is genetically seperate from E1b1a, in the same way J (Arabids) and I (Nordids) Y-DNAs are now radically different, despite being genetic cousins.
quote:No further than two brothers being "separate" from a single father.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
^ I never denied the fact that E1b1b is closer to E1b1ba than any other haplogroup. But they are still far, in the same manner J Y-DNA and I Y-DNA are seperate after they split from IJ Y-DNA.
quote:That's what "we" are talking about as well.
We are talking about frequency. Percentages.
quote:Listen,
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
^ I never denied the fact that E1b1b is closer to E1b1ba than any other haplogroup. But they are still far, in the same manner J Y-DNA and I Y-DNA are seperate after they split from IJ Y-DNA.
quote:What is biblical about a father having two sons?
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
[QB] "No further than two brothers being "separate" from a single father. "
Don't try to be biblical about it.
quote:I take it by this, you are totally oblivious to the fact that a single line of paternal ancestry is what were talking about, with regards to E1b1a and E1b1b. E1b1a and E1b1b share the same "immediate" father phylogenetically; What does this mean to you?
You can't compare events and splits that are tens of millenias old, with father sons situations.
quote:I suppose you didn't read the thread before posting, and note...
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
"In Somalis, 14 Y chromosome haplogroups were identified including E3b1 (77.6%) and K2 (10.4%)."
That the hingest E1b1b (E3b1) frequency in any country. Taht's why they call it Somalid. But if the name bother you. Call it berberid. I personally do not careabout semantics.
quote:You're trying to say two E derivative brother haplotypes, are totally different, and threw in phenotype for a difference.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
@ Mindovermatter.
I honestly fail to see your point. what are you trying to say? Are you refuting the fact that Egypt is mostly Somalid or Berberid, or whatever you want to call it. E1b1b.
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
What can be so different when they derive from the same parental lineage, and split just recently; and how does one say "Somalids" are not "Negroid" but these so called "Somalids" supposedly migrated into the near East and Europe and these places mentioned showed clear sub Saharan affinities?
The near eastern Natufians showed clear sub Saran affinities, and so did the populations in areas from which these Natufians spread into Europe.
"Against this background of disease, movement and pedomorphic reduction of body size one can identify Negroid traits of nose and prognathism appearing in Natufian latest hunters (McCown, 1939) and **in Anatolian** and Macedonian first farmers, probably from Nubia via the unknown predecesors of the Badarians and Tasians....". - J. L. Angel [/QB]
quote:The part of it that you seem to think has a point to make or makes sense. It is no more significant than say, an older brother being "split" from his younger brother.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
What part of "They split tens of millenias ago" don't you understand?
quote:I don't know what "Arabids" and "Nordids" are, but I do know that you left the request I put to you about it unanswered. The question is: why?
Do you consider Arabids and Nordids to be genetically equivalent then?
quote:And what other cluster were you under the impression was the predominant E-M78 marker in Somalis?
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
"The cluster E-M78γ "
You are talking about a cluster. Not a haplogroup in its entirety.
quote:I thought I had told you to produce that already, in showing how E1b1b is phylogenetically most comprehensive in Somalis, which naturally would include all its clusters. Why do you repeat yourself with immaterial posts, while having no answers to questions?
E1b1b's highest frequency is in Somalia. There exists different clusters, but I am talking about the haplogroup in general.
quote:Haplogroup I is closely related to Haplogroup J, but J is not I and I is not J.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
"Do tell how I and J which are like cousins, can be in any comparison to two E haplotypes derivatives E1b1a and E1b1b who are brothers ?"
You ever heard of IJ Y-DNA that split 30 thousand years ago?
quote:You are genetically related to all Africans under the PN2 clade Y chromosome.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
If you are E1b1b, then you are genetically related to the Somalians. What's wrong with that?
quote:Actually the Natufians showed Archaic affinities, similar to Homo-erectus and Neandertal not sub-saharan affinities. To draw parallels between archaic homonids and modern "sub-saharans" is something i would expect to be written by a "white" racialist and not you Mindovermatters.
Mindovermatters wrote:
The near eastern Natufians showed clear sub Saran affinities, and so did the populations in areas from which these Natufians spread into Europe.
quote:according to whom; what source?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Actually the Natufians showed Archaic affinities, similar to Homo-erectus or Neandertal not sub-saharan affinities.
quote:What's bothering me is your lack of understanding
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
So it's the letter "E" that's bothering you?
It's not concret. It's a scientific marker. Created. Artificial. A name. To identify a haplogroup.
quote:Yes, but from a common ancestor E haplotype not an EB or EC or EA haplotype , like I and J derive from IJ.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
E1b1b and E1b1a split around the same time I and J split.
quote:The point is: You can't read. You are too far behind, for me to drag you just to keep up, man. What did my question just ask you. What word didn't you understand in it?
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
@ explorer. Please try to keep up. I said, E1b1b in its entirety has the highest frequency in Somalia. I was not talking about clusters. So what is your point?
quote:
Clusters are not genetic races, I hope you know that. They differ from region to region.
Hey man, you shouldn't be worried about me -- I'm the least you should be concerned about; let's hope you understand that. Take it easy boy; you have a lot to learn.quote:Is that why it is found in non-Somalis, and in some cases, greater frequencies [see: Borana for instance]?
E-M78γ is Somalian.
quote:That's just the problem here; there is disconnect in not only the level of knowledge you seem to have in genetics, which is obviously far behind, but also a clear language barrier problem here.
I fail to see your point.
quote:Darn it; and here I was, thinking that you had the guts to answer elementary genetic questions put to you. My bad for overestimating you.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
@ explorer. I am not going to even bother with you.
quote:Semantics?
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
You are arguing about semantics. I, J, E are all markers artificially created! It's not like Y-DNA has a letter E inscribed in it!
I Y-DNA can perfectly be called J1b1a and J be called J1b1b. It would still be accurate.
quote:Thanks for caring about the unimportant bit about your quack-slang terms, but it would be more appreciated if you dealt with the part [the important one] that you "forgot" to address:
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
"I don't know what "Arabids" and "Nordids" are"
Arabids: J Y-DNA. Nordids: I Y-DNA.
They had a smae ancestor IJ Y-DNA, that split 30 thousand years ago. In the same way E1b1b and E1b1a split.
quote:As in where? You are not referring to the questions you keep dodging, are you?
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
^ Then ask, instead of going around copy pasting
quote:I've been asking them, kid; the problem is, you've been dodgin' them, and then claim that they are saying nothing. If you don't understand words in the question, just tell me where, and I'll be glad to assist.
and saying nothing. What is your question?
quote:What if geneticists named E1b1b (Z) and E1b1a(P). Similar to the distinction of (I) and (J), i bet you would have seen things from a different light, eh? Since J and I split almost the same time as E1b1b and E1b1a. The difference are the same it's just the similar sounding scientific name of these two haplogroups that makes you think they are so close. But the fact is 25Kya is a long time.
Mindovermatters wrote:
Genetics is not semantics, and their defining lineages(A, E, B etc..) mutations, derivatives etc.. are not semantics either.
quote:Oh man, no it's not.
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
E1b1b and E1b1a had a same ancestor. They are genetically close to each other. But they are not equivalent. In the exact same way I and J are not equivalent, despite having the same ancestor.
quote:Yonis, I wish I could fix or obscure somebody's stupidity, like that displayed by yourself for instance, but it can't be done. When he/she displays it, that in itself ridicules him/her without assistance from others.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
For God sake Explorer can you ever, FOR ONCE, discuss with people without ridiculing them?
quote:And what are you, pretty, as in "somalid" pretty? LOL.
What you are doing is really pathetic,
quote:That can be arranged Yonis. Where do you want to meet for this confrontation? I must warn you though, a skinny somalid is no match for me.
you should thank god that you have internet or else someone would have slapped the living sh7t out of you, long time ago, with all that childish name calling.
quote:See; this is what I was talking about in my last post. You simply seem intellectually incapable of understanding the questions at hand, let alone deliver what's being expected of you. I didn't ask you to babble on with rehashing what you've been saying since your post "A". I'm asking you to demonstrate, phylogenetically, what's being asked above. What part of the question can't you just seem to grasp?
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
"Since you love drawing "parallels" with IJ, can you demonstrate how closely the relationship between I and J phylogenetically parallels a relationship *as close as* that which E1b1a and E1b1b have with one another."
Other than the fact they have the same ancestor, no they aren't that close. However, I and J YDNA are genetically closer to each other than to other Y-DNAs.
Exact same thing about E1b1b and E1b1a.
quote:Take a queue from MindoveMatter, as this below for example:
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:See; this is what I was talking about in my last post. You simply seem intellectually incapable of understanding the questions at hand, let alone deliver what's being expected of you. I didn't ask you to babble on with rehashing what you've been saying since your post "A". I'm asking you to demonstrate, phylogenetically, what's being asked above. What part of the question can't you just seem to grasp?
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
"Since you love drawing "parallels" with IJ, can you demonstrate how closely the relationship between I and J phylogenetically parallels a relationship *as close as* that which E1b1a and E1b1b have with one another."
Other than the fact they have the same ancestor, no they aren't that close. However, I and J YDNA are genetically closer to each other than to other Y-DNAs.
Exact same thing about E1b1b and E1b1a.
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E1b1a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E1b1b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
quote:A skinny somalid? heh, you don't know me. If you lived at the neck of my woods i would have met you and from that point you would have interacted with people like a chiwawa puppy. Your fundamental problem is that you haven't met people like me in real life yet, which is quite obvious by observing your disrespectful attitude and uncontained manners.
Explorer wrote.
That can be arranged Yonis. Where do you want to meet for this confrontation? I must warn you though, a skinny somalid is no match for me.
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:A skinny somalid? heh, you don't know me. If you lived at the neck of my woods i would have met you and from that point you would have interacted with people like a chiwawa puppy. Your fundamental problem is that you haven't met people like me in real life yet, which is quite obvious by observing your disrespectful attitude and uncontained manners.
Explorer wrote.
That can be arranged Yonis. Where do you want to meet for this confrontation? I must warn you though, a skinny somalid is no match for me.
hey, somalid kid, or shall I say "keyboard warrior" stormfront neophyte: talk is cheap...especially when you are doing it as a refugee in back in Sweden, AND behind a computer.
quote:Ex:
Originally posted by Massinissa511:
Ok. J Y-DNA is IJ 1 Y-DNA. And I is IJ 2 Y-DNA.Tell me, how is that inaccurate?
The father lineage is IJ. I and J have the same ancestor the exact same way E1b1b and E1b1a had. So what's the difference?
quote:
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E1b1a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E1b1b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
quote:Actually the poster that I was referencing this towards, was saying that these two sibling lineages, are the same as "I" and "J" being descended from IJ.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Mindovermatters i think it's quite clear that E1b1b and E1b1a are siblings, no one can argue against this current fact.
quote:It's a non-somali population but it's a Somalid population
Mindovermater wrote:
and as for as you're concerned, it's a non Somali population who carries E1b1b at the highest frequency.
So much for "Somalid".
quote:Makes no sense, you were basing this Somalid nonsense, on Somali population having the highest frequency. But it's not a Somali population, hence you're shot in the foot.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:It's non-somali population but it's a Somalid population
Mindovermater wrote:
and as for as you're concerned, it's a non Somali population who carries E1b1b at the highest frequency.
So much for "Somalid".
quote:So if i said "boranid" you would think it's better?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Makes no sense, you were basing this Somalid nonsense, on Somali population having the highest frequency. But it's not a Somali population, hence you're shot in the foot.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:It's non-somali population but it's a Somalid population
Mindovermater wrote:
and as for as you're concerned, it's a non Somali population who carries E1b1b at the highest frequency.
So much for "Somalid".
So much for "Somalid"
quote:Which seems to be your dilemma; as you can't segregate E1b1a lineage from that of E1b1b as much as you would have liked; it messes up your "somalid" racialist schema.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Mindovermatter i think it's quite clear that E1b1b and E1b1a are siblings, no one can argue against this current fact.
quote:First; what data are you basing this separation on?
However they are still distinct, ~30kya is a very long time of seperation, don't you agree?
quote:They have criss-crossed; it's your imagination that they haven't. Which geographic region on the continent, is say E1b1a, not found? However, it is true that they also have geographical structurings peculiar to the way each lineage subsequently expanded [and/or contracted in some cases], in multiple migration events. Again, this can be analogized in a sibling scenario, wherein each take their own livelihood paths in maturity, including possibly eventual "family-making" paths respective to each. This doesn't change the biological relationship between the two siblings.
They have been seperated for such a long time, that even today we have clear geographic boundary between these two haplogroups even though they both share the same unbroken landmass, increadible isn't it?
Naturally (since they are siblings) these haplogroups should have spread all over the continent, criss crossed each other all over Africa,
quote:Wasn't there a study in 2008 by Hisham Y. Hassan that found the Masalit of western Sudan were sampled to have the highest M78 V32 lineages?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:The country Somalia has the highest frequency, how is it false?
Mindovermatter wrote:
That you said had it's highest frequencies in Somalis, and hence should be called "Somalid".
This is False!
Btw, borana are less in kenya than in somalia, the difference is that they speak somali and have dropped their background and completly assimilated, majority of south western somalis are former Borana in particular the sabs, so they are not known as Borana. We only have one language, but people drawn from many minority tribes who didn't speak somali before, almost all over the southern part.
quote:They are not "somalids" are they? Or maybe Somalids are really "Masalids" They dont even speak Afro-Asiatic languages..........Oh yeah they look something like this:
E-V32 is the most frequent subclade among Sudanese. The Masalit possesses by far the highest frequency of the E-M78 and of the E-V32 haplogroup, suggesting either a recent bottleneck in the population or aproximity to the origin of the haplogroup
quote:Nope, we're just showing how your logic is illogical, and adherence to ignorance should be avoided.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:So if i said "boranid" you would think it's better?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Makes no sense, you were basing this Somalid nonsense, on Somali population having the highest frequency. But it's not a Somali population, hence you're shot in the foot.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:It's non-somali population but it's a Somalid population
Mindovermater wrote:
and as for as you're concerned, it's a non Somali population who carries E1b1b at the highest frequency.
So much for "Somalid".
So much for "Somalid"
quote:Of course they are Somalids, just watered down Somalids with seazible Nilo-saharan input, even in southern somalia there are many Somalids with some degree of Nilo-saharan input.
astenb wrote:
They are not "somalids" are they? Or maybe Somalids are really "Masalids" They dont even speak Afro-Asiatic languages..........Oh yeah they look something like this:
quote:If they are "watered down", then why do they have such a high frequency of E-M78?? If Somalis have less, doesn't the deductive logic indicate that Somalis are the watered down recipients of the said lineage? I thought E1b1b was the main criteria you use in identifying who and who is not "Somalid"..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Of coure they are s
astenb wrote:
They are not "somalids" are they? Or maybe Somalids are really "Masalids" They dont even speak Afro-Asiatic languages..........Oh yeah they look something like this:
Somalids, just watered down somalids with seazible nilo-saharan input, even in southern somalia there are many watered down somalids with some degree of nilo-saharan input.
The linguistic factor of the Masalit is secondary, likewise the Somalids in Balkan and Anatolia don't speak afrasian languages due to their Europen input.
quote:Most likely the males take Nilotic wives, just like the Borans of Kenya.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:If they are "watered down", then why do they have such a high frequency of E-M78?? If Somalis have less, doesn't the deductive logic indicate that Somalis are the watered down recipients of the said lineage?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Of coure they are s
astenb wrote:
They are not "somalids" are they? Or maybe Somalids are really "Masalids" They dont even speak Afro-Asiatic languages..........Oh yeah they look something like this:
Somalids, just watered down somalids with seazible nilo-saharan input, even in southern somalia there are many watered down somalids with some degree of nilo-saharan input.
The linguistic factor of the Masalit is secondary, likewise the Somalids in Balkan and Anatolia don't speak afrasian languages due to their Europen input.
quote:"Most likely"?? Where's your proof for such selective breeding habits? And what [according to you] is a "Nilotic"?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Most likely the males take Nilotic wives, just like the Borans of Kenya.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:If they are "watered down", then why do they have such a high frequency of E-M78?? If Somalis have less, doesn't the deductive logic indicate that Somalis are the watered down recipients of the said lineage?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Of coure they are s
astenb wrote:
They are not "somalids" are they? Or maybe Somalids are really "Masalids" They dont even speak Afro-Asiatic languages..........Oh yeah they look something like this:
Somalids, just watered down somalids with seazible nilo-saharan input, even in southern somalia there are many watered down somalids with some degree of nilo-saharan input.
The linguistic factor of the Masalit is secondary, likewise the Somalids in Balkan and Anatolia don't speak afrasian languages due to their Europen input.
quote:..here's the thing, they're NOT Somalis either.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Of course they are Somalids, just watered down Somalids with seazible Nilo-saharan input, even in southern somalia there are many Somalids with some degree of Nilo-saharan input.
quote:Actually, it's two different situations as Balkan and Anatolians received African lineages from migrants. The E1b1b carrying Africans weren't in Europe to receive European admixture, it was the other way around, so there was no need to speak Afro-Asiatic, and your example of why they don't is illogical.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The linguistic factor of the Masalit is secondary, likewise the Somalids in Balkan and Anatolia don't speak Afrasian languages due to their Europen input.
quote:Another hypothesis could be that the patriarchs of the Masalits (maybe a dussin or two) procreated with alot of Nilo-saharan females, and the male descandants later continued to breed with nilo-Saharan females but overall isolated their tribe from other Nilo-Saharan communities except when males were searching for additional wives, their traditional habit, customs, diety and rituals should be taken into acount.
Sundjata wrote:
"Most likely"?? Where's your proof for such selective breeding habits? And what [according to you] is a "Nilotic"?
quote:Nice imagination, but I believe that I asked you for proof [or any indication there of], not a circular argument.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Another hypothesis could be that the patriarchs of the Masalits (maybe a dussin or two)procreated with a lot of Nilo-saharan females, and the male descandants later continued to breed with nilo-Saharan females but overall isolted the tribe from other nilosharans communities except when males search for wives, theiir traditional habit, customs, diety and rituals should be taken into acount.
Sundjata wrote:
"Most likely"?? Where's your proof for such selective breeding habits? And what [according to you] is a "Nilotic"?
quote:There are over 250,000 of them..
Btw i would like to know how many Masalits exist, if they are less than 10k then their outlier effect is understandable.
Try again.. Yonis is taking quite a pounding; this is what this thread has essentially been reduced to... all for the sake of guarding his "somalid" racialist fantasies.
quote:Or it could simply be what the researcher potined to :
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Another hypothesis could be that the patriarchs of the Masalits (maybe a dussin or two) procreated with alot of Nilo-saharan females, and the male descandants later continued to breed with nilo-Saharan females but overall isolated their tribe from other Nilo-Saharan communities except when males were searching for additional wives, their traditional habit, customs, diety and rituals should be taken into acount.
Sundjata wrote:
"Most likely"?? Where's your proof for such selective breeding habits? And what [according to you] is a "Nilotic"?
Btw i would like to know how many Masalits exist, if they are less than 10k then their outlier effect is understandable.
quote:approximately how close is Somalia to Western Sudan? The Fur of Darfur were also found to harbor high Frequencies of V32.............Oh yeah, they look like this:
suggesting either a recent bottleneck in the population or aproximity to the origin of the haplogroup
quote:My theory of the Masalits isolating themselves from other Nilo-saharans was accurate
Originally posted by Sundjata:
^^Indeed.. I wouldn't be surprised if he waved the white flag soon. Someone should ask Yonis why the two populations discussed (Borana and Masalit) who have retained the highest traces of E-M78 don't fit the ideal phenotype that his racial schema so desperately depends on. I see no way out of this for him.
quote:http://www.sudan101.com/masalit.htm
The Masalit are a 250,000 strong non-Arab people group living in the most remote and unknown areas of the North African countries of Sudan and Chad. Approximately 140,000 of these live in Sudan, primarily in the west near the border with Chad. The Masalit developed a reputation for being fiercely independent—they had their own language and customs, produced everything they needed to survive and were capable of defending their own borders. In more recent years, however, political, economic and cultural processes have brought them into increasing contact with the outside world....In Masalit society, men often have two or more wives simultaneously. The groom must pay a bridewealth consisting of cows and goats and a variable amount of cash, and must live with his bride on her mother’s compound for at least the first year of marriage, working in his mother-in-law’s fields.
quote:Yonis, you did not claim that they isolated themselves from Nilo-Saharans, you said that they "most likely" took Nilo-Saharan/Nilotic wives. Where is this stated and how does this piece support you?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:My theory of the masalits isolating themselves from other Nilo-saharans was accurate
Originally posted by Sundjata:
^^Indeed.. I wouldn't be surprised if he waved the white flag soon. Someone should ask Yonis why the two populations discussed (Borana and Masalit) who have retained the highest traces of E-M78 don't fit the ideal phenotype that his racial schema so desperately depends on. I see no way out of this for him.
quote:http://www.sudan101.com/masalit.htm
The Masalit are a 250,000 strong non-Arab people group living in the most remote and unknown areas of the North African countries of Sudan and Chad. Approximately 140,000 of these live in Sudan, primarily in the west near the border with Chad. The Masalit developed a reputation for being fiercely independent—they had their own language and customs, produced everything they needed to survive and were capable of defending their own borders. In more recent years, however, political, economic and cultural processes have brought them into increasing contact with the outside world....In Masalit society, men often have two or more wives simultaneously. The groom must pay a bridewealth consisting of cows and goats and a variable amount of cash, and must live with his bride on her mother’s compound for at least the first year of marriage, working in his mother-in-law’s fields.
quote:The Masalit possesses by far the highest frequency of the E-M78 and of the E-V32 haplogroup, suggesting either a recent bottleneck in the population or aproximity to the origin of the haplogroup
Btw Masalits showing the highest frequency of E-V32, doesn't mean that they show the highest frequency of E1b1b haplogroup overall, this could be just some few percentage of their total Y-DNA sample.
quote:Using that logic, this could just as apply to Somalis. Who knows, a countrywide sampling of Somalia will show that you have much higher frequencies of E1b1a; the lineage you most fear
Originally posted by Yonis2:
In any case the Masalits don't show the highest frequency of E1b1b, the E-V32 could be just 5% 0r 10% of their overall Y-DNA despite it being the highest observed.
Someone could post the whole study to get a clear picture.
. Who knows, you might be a 'watered down' somalid yourself.
quote:For sure i'm not since both my parents come from Northeastern Somalia, and all somali-bantus and other watered down somalis are located in Southern somalia
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Using that logic, this could just as apply to Somalis. Who knows, a countrywide sampling of Somalia will show that you have much higher frequencies of E1b1a; the lineage you most fear
Originally posted by Yonis2:
In any case the Masalits don't show the highest frequency of E1b1b, the E-V32 could be just 5% 0r 10% of their overall Y-DNA despite it being the highest observed.
Someone could post the whole study to get a clear picture.
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
In any case the Masalits don't show the highest frequency of E1b1b, the E-V32 could be just 5% 0r 10% of their overall Y-DNA despite it being the highest observed.
Someone could post the whole study to get a clear picture.
quote:Even though you ignore direct inferences, you appear to be right in only one aspect..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
In any case the Masalits don't show the highest frequency of E1b1b, the E-V32 could be just 5% 0r 10% of their overall Y-DNA despite it being the highest observed.
Someone could post the whole study to get a clear picture.
quote:Because their is no country called "Borana" which make Somalid full valid.
Sundjata wroe:
There may are more Borana in Somalia than in Kenya, but there are more in Ethiopia than Somalia. This argument will always come full circle since you refuse to acknowledge how this makes your "Somalid" classification defunct.
quote:If "Somalid" isn't based on the indigenous ethnic appellation, but on a modern European social construct, then obviously basing such a designation on genetics is intellectually dishonest since Borana are not Somali, thus your "Somalid" must be a "social construct" as well.. Which of course means that it is NOT [scientifically/practically] valid.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Because their is no country called "Borana" which make Somalid full valid.
Sundjata wroe:
There may are more Borana in Somalia than in Kenya, but there are more in Ethiopia than Somalia. This argument will always come full circle since you refuse to acknowledge how this makes your "Somalid" classification defunct.
quote:I think you may be incorrect. The Oromo had a higher count of M78 simply because the study sampled more people:
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
In any case the Masalits don't show the highest frequency of E1b1b, the E-V32 could be just 5% 0r 10% of their overall Y-DNA despite it being the highest observed.
Someone could post the whole study to get a clear picture.quote:Even though you ignore direct inferences, you appear to be right in only one aspect..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
In any case the Masalits don't show the highest frequency of E1b1b, the E-V32 could be just 5% 0r 10% of their overall Y-DNA despite it being the highest observed.
Someone could post the whole study to get a clear picture.
http://dirkschweitzer.net/E3b-papers/Hassan-Sudan-2008-AJPA.pdf
^See the chart on page 4. Oromos still had the highest frequency of overall e1b1b, though not to distract away from your initial premise, Oromos are not Somali and I say that with strong emphasis. Somali are a distinct ethnic group from the apparent populations with the highest frequencies, including Borana. There may be more Borana in Somalia than in Kenya, but there are more in Ethiopia than Somalia. This argument will always come full circle since you refuse to acknowledge how this makes your "Somalid" classification defunct.
quote:Again.. One of my biggest pet peeves is when people ignore common sense. You keep calling them "watered down", but what does that make Somalis if "Somalid" is defined by the amount of e1b1b a population posseses? You didn't define it by linguistics, didn't define it by phenotype, but by this one marker you keep flaunting. They have it at a higher rate than Somalis, so what does that make Somalis? Watered down "Somalids"?? Please address my question in full without being so evasive and repetitive.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The *FACT* that Masalits don't speak an Afrasian language shows that they are an anamoly, all statistics have outliers and in the somalids case the Masalits are the outliers. E1b1b is associated with Afrasian people not Nilo-saharan speakers. But they are still Somalids,despite being significantly watered down.
quote:Maybe, but the study also found that Nilo-Saharans were Tested positive for M215 at a higher frequency than their Afro-Asiatic counterparts.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The *FACT* that Masalits don't speak an Afrasian language shows that they are an anamoly, all statistics have outliers and in the somalids case the Masalits are the outliers. E1b1b is associated with Afrasian people not Nilo-saharan speakers. But they are still Somalids,despite being significantly watered down.
Btw i don't have pdf reader installed at the computer i'm currently using, so i'll read the study you posted on Masalits later.
quote:^^Thanx for pointing out my error. I read the chart at face value not discerning/observing the sample sizes, which was obviously very neglectful on my part. I rushed judgment though this of course further deflates Yonis' argument to the point of no return. My intent was not to support his quackery and this data clearly does not...
Originally posted by astenb:
quote:I think you may be incorrect. The Oromo had a higher count of M78 simply because the study sampled more people:
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
In any case the Masalits don't show the highest frequency of E1b1b, the E-V32 could be just 5% 0r 10% of their overall Y-DNA despite it being the highest observed.
Someone could post the whole study to get a clear picture.quote:Even though you ignore direct inferences, you appear to be right in only one aspect..
Originally posted by Yonis2:
In any case the Masalits don't show the highest frequency of E1b1b, the E-V32 could be just 5% 0r 10% of their overall Y-DNA despite it being the highest observed.
Someone could post the whole study to get a clear picture.
http://dirkschweitzer.net/E3b-papers/Hassan-Sudan-2008-AJPA.pdf
^See the chart on page 4. Oromos still had the highest frequency of overall e1b1b, though not to distract away from your initial premise, Oromos are not Somali and I say that with strong emphasis. Somali are a distinct ethnic group from the apparent populations with the highest frequencies, including Borana. There may be more Borana in Somalia than in Kenya, but there are more in Ethiopia than Somalia. This argument will always come full circle since you refuse to acknowledge how this makes your "Somalid" classification defunct.
Oromo - 78 people tested / 28 +M78
Masalit - 32 people tested / 23 +M78
It still shows in the Masalit at a higher frequency / % with the only 32 people sampled.
Even with more that double the Oromo individuals Sampled they only add an additional 5 positive M78 Markers that brings them to 28 vs 23 in the Masalit.
If we extrapolate the figures (assuming they would just rise linear) It would come to something like this:
Oromo - 28 (V32 positive)- (78 actual people sampled)
Masalit - 51 (V32 positive) - (example extrapolated for 78 people)
*Almost double that of the Oromo.
Case and Point with so few sampled it could be a sampling error but if the Research stands then:
The Masalit possesses by far the highest frequency of the E-M78 and of the E-V32 haplogroup, suggesting either a recent bottleneck in the population or aproximity to the origin of the haplogroup.
Bolded above for emphasis They have the MOST M78 and nearly all of their M78 is V32.
quote:You egocentric elitist wanna be, he has you strung out and you don't even know it. Just enjoy the spectacle instead of demanding direct answers as he will only come back with more spin and evasions. Kinna like rasolowitz and mindless on Bowcock. lol
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Again.. One of my biggest pet peeves is when people ignore common sense. You keep calling them "watered down", but what does that make Somalis if "Somalid" is defined by the amount of e1b1b a population posseses? You didn't define it by linguistics, didn't define it by phenotype, but by this one marker you keep flaunting. They have it at a higher rate than Somalis, so what does that make Somalis? Watered down "Somalids"?? Please address my question in full without being so evasive and repetitive.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The *FACT* that Masalits don't speak an Afrasian language shows that they are an anamoly, all statistics have outliers and in the somalids case the Masalits are the outliers. E1b1b is associated with Afrasian people not Nilo-saharan speakers. But they are still Somalids,despite being significantly watered down.
quote:I already said earlier in this thread that it's based on nation not tribes, if we based it on tribes/clans then we could probably sample some somali clan that has a frequency of 98% E1b1b, but that would be to redundant. So we stick to country instead, Somalia is still the country with highest frequency.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Again.. One of my biggest pet peeves is when people ignore common sense. You keep calling them "watered down", but what does that make Somalis if "Somalid" is defined by the amount of e1b1b a population posseses? You didn't define it by linguistics, didn't define it by phenotype, but by this one marker you keep flaunting. They have it at a higher rate than Somalis, so what does that make Somalis? Watered down "Somalids"?? Please address my question in full without being so evasive and repetitive.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
The *FACT* that Masalits don't speak an Afrasian language shows that they are an anamoly, all statistics have outliers and in the somalids case the Masalits are the outliers. E1b1b is associated with Afrasian people not Nilo-saharan speakers. But they are still Somalids,despite being significantly watered down.
quote:Somalia is a European invention and by extension so is "Somalid".. And actually E1b1b is more prevalent among Ethiopians. Given the conflict between those two countries I can understand why you are reluctant to acknowledge this.. There are more Oromos in Ethiopia than Somalis in Somalia.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
I already said nation not tribes, if we based it on tribes/clans then we could probably sample some somali clan that has a frequency of 98% E1b1b, but that would be to redundant. So we stick to country instead, Somalia is still the country with highest frequency. [/QB]
quote:On this one occasion, I believe I'll take your advice.. This is getting annoying and deep down, Yonis knows that he doesn't make any sense.
Originally posted by Akoben:
Just enjoy the spectacle instead of demanding direct answers as he will only come back with more spin and evasions.
quote:No, the borders of somalia is a European invention (just like the rest of Africa) but the Somali ethnicity is a Somali invention, unlike the rest of Africa we don't have trillion of tribes, everyone in Somalia are ethnically the same with one language, only divided by clans (except the somali-bantu and the Persian descendant Barwani). The name "Somalia" comes from the Somali ethnicity that streches all the way into Eastern Ethiopia, Djibouti and northern kenya, other African countries are named differently due to wealth of tribes and languages.
Sundjata wrote:
Somalia is a European invention and by extension so is "Somalid".. And actually E1b1b is more prevalent among Ethiopians. Given the conflict between those two countries I can understand why you are reluctant to acknowledge this.. There are more Oromos in Ethiopia than Somalis in Somalia.
quote:^ stormfront traffics in racist fantasy to boost the ego of insecure ethnocentrists.
This is getting annoying and deep down, Yonis knows that he doesn't make any sense.
Stormfront has destroyed the last of your remaining brain cells Yonis, I honestly remember you as being a lot sharper/smarter than this. Oh well..
quote:I'm not going to sell it or make money of it. It was not even photoshop but the lousy MS paintshop, i did it less than a minute
Originally posted by rasol:
ugh. bugbog has no photoshop skill at all.
at least learn to screen rather than scribble when posting homemade fake maps to "illustrate" dumb ideas.
quote:Agreed; there is no way out.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
^^Indeed.. I wouldn't be surprised if he waved the white flag soon. Someone should ask Yonis why the two populations discussed (Borana and Masalit) who have retained the highest traces of E-M78 don't fit the ideal phenotype that his racial schema so desperately depends on. I see no way out of this for him. [/QB]
quote:I see it.
Originally posted by astenb:
The Fur of Darfur were also found to harbor high Frequencies of V32.............Oh yeah, they look like this:
Is that red hair?
quote:Actually the Borana are migrant Oromos, the Borana are one of the most ancient sections of the Oromo people, and represent one of the two halves of the original Oromos (the other half being the Barentu).
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Because their is no country called "Borana" which make Somalid full valid.
Sundjata wroe:
There may are more Borana in Somalia than in Kenya, but there are more in Ethiopia than Somalia. This argument will always come full circle since you refuse to acknowledge how this makes your "Somalid" classification defunct.
quote:Wrong Ethiopia has a much higher percentage of Negrid & Arabid genes than Somalia
Somalia is a European invention and by extension so is "Somalid".. And actually E1b1b is more prevalent among Ethiopians. Given the conflict between those two countries I can understand why you are reluctant to acknowledge this.. There are more Oromos in Ethiopia than Somalis in Somalia.
quote:Get out of here with your pseudo, non scientific genetic terms of "negrid" and "Somalid".
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Wrong Ethiopia has a much higher percentage of Negrid & Arabid genes than Somalia
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:The only reason Greeks are close to these African populations is because they carry this African genetic marker, from Africans.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
DNA evidence is clear Somalians are genetically closer to Southern Greeks than to the Bantu guys near by, just like Afghans are genetically closer to Poland more than Arabia.
Hence, Greeks carrying this derivative from Africa, are just as related to other Africans under the same PN2 clade.
As noted by me here...
quote:If you can't comprehend the above then you definitely have no business discussing anything else.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E1b1a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E1b1b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
All Africans sharing this common ancestor split about 25kya, which is way after the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa.
Wherein, the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa over 60-80 thousand years ago.
Therefore; all non Africans (Europeans, so called near easterners etc..) are extremely far, genetically speaking, from both E1b1a and E1b1b carriers.
Africans carrying E1b1b and E1b1a, are genetically related to eachother, before any other haplogroup, especially a non African lineage.
Unless those said non Africans, carry one of these African lineages; E1b1b or E1b1a.
The only thing that unites any non African to these Africans is the fact that they are carrying an African lineage.
I challenge you to show me another lineage that is closer to this lineage, and diverged as recently from any of these lineages as E1b1a and E1b1b did?
quote:E1b1b is never classified as African, its a Somalid marker. Somalians & their North African genetic brother have it at a very high frequency
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]The only reason Greeks are close to these African populations is because they carry this African genetic marker, from Africans.
quote:According to whom; which geneticist/s?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b is never classified as African, its a Somalid marker.
quote:cosign.
Bye Bye Somalid....
quote:^ a minute of your life, you can never get back.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I'm not going to sell it or make money of it. It was not even photoshop but the lousy MS paintshop, i did it less than a minute
Originally posted by rasol:
ugh. bugbog has no photoshop skill at all.
at least learn to screen rather than scribble when posting homemade fake maps to "illustrate" dumb ideas.
![[Embarrassed]](redface.gif)
quote:For *precision*, I think it would be more accurate to say, they are the ones who carry the highest frequency of certain E1b1b markers. This is one of the reasons I questioned Somalid_V13, Yonis, and Massinissa on their notion of somalid "highest frequency E1b1b" representation, even though they never understood what was being asked of them.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Ethiopians are the ones who carry the E1b1b highest frequency, since Borana are migrant Oromos.
quote:That would be stupid, because it only occurs in Africa. Yes, downstream markers of this lineage has spilled over to the nearby territories to Africa, but that is a given.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b is never classified as African
, is from sitting back & watching him react to a Cruciani citation which implicated higher E-M78 gamma clusters [the most frequent E-M78 marker in Somalis] in the Kenyan Borana than Somalis, and attempt to act as if he was some kind of a 'revelation-purveying' messiah on schooling me what frequency is [which he apparently just learned about on-the-spot at the time], while mangling up what was being directed at him to ironically teach him about the basic concept [frequency]; see...quote:Prey tell, Yonis, what was I doing for years and here, for instance: Link?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Hate to break it to you stormfront neophyte; but yes, frequency has everything to do with "quantity". You'd know this if you were schooled in any degree in molecular genetics, if you weren't such a "perfect" stormfront neophyte.
Also, learn the difference between "frequency" and "quantity".
quote:Thanks for proving my point [above] stormfront neophyte, with this moronic example.
If we have five red apples and remove two red apples from these five, the frequency of red apples would still be 100%, got it Einstein?
quote:What do you mean Borana are migrants? Ethiopia is a nationality not an Ethnicity and it's borders are as recent as any other country in Africa.
Mindovermatters wrote:
Ethiopians are the ones who carry the E1b1b highest frequency, since Borana are migrant Oromos
quote:What do you mean borana show higher frequency than any somalis?
Mindovermatter wrote:
As far as Boranas and your erroneous reference of Somalid is concerned; Boranas do indeed show higher frequency than any Somali population, and hence.....
quote:You learned something new, nothing bad about it, get over it.
Explorer wrote:
I got a similar kick out of meninarmer a few years ago, as he [in a fashion similar to Yonis'] -- upon being introduced to purposefully-given "shockers" [i.e. citations] -- pretended to be schooling me on "frequency"; the "give 'shocker', sit back & watch-the-reaction" approach I take with these characters never seems to fail.
quote:Flawed thinking. No "whole country" sampling has ever been performed on either Somalis or Borana. The point is, the show greater "frequencies" in the samplings that have been undertaken. You do understand the statistical-principle of probability and how that works in demographic census undertakings, right?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
You can't compare sampling a whole country with a small tribe in kenya.
quote:Lol, you are still in the "shock-mode", that you "forgot" to address this part of the post:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:You learned something new, nothing bad about it, get over it.
Explorer wrote:
I got a similar kick out of meninarmer a few years ago, as he [in a fashion similar to Yonis'] -- upon being introduced to purposefully-given "shockers" [i.e. citations] -- pretended to be schooling me on "frequency"; the "give 'shocker', sit back & watch-the-reaction" approach I take with these characters never seems to fail.
quote:They sampled people who didn't come from a single clan but represented multiple clans, while the borana are a concetrated tribe, see the difference?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Flawed thinking. No "whole country" sampling has ever been performed on either Somalis or Borana. The point is, the show greater "frequencies" in the samplings that have been undertaken. You do understand the statistical-principle of probability and how that works in demographic census undertakings, right?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
You can't compare sampling a whole country with a small tribe in kenya.
quote:Nope, what I see is a contradiction. Somalis, which just a moment ago, you professed to be a "single" ethnic group, while implicating actual Borana and Bantu "introgression" therein, now has to be looked at from a "clan" standpoint. You are a trip. It's nonsensical for you to think that geneticist are going to adhere to your moronic standards of 'clan-ship', which doesn't even apply to many ethnic groups. Fact is, no absolute "countrywide" samplings have been performed on Somalis, as any other group. In the samplings that have been undertaken, the Borana outdo you somalis, when it comes to E-M78 frequencies. So, when can we expect that light bulb in your head to start lighting up?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:They sampled people who didn't come from a single clan but represented multiple clans, while the borana are a concetrated tribe, see the difference?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Flawed thinking. No "whole country" sampling has ever been performed on either Somalis or Borana. The point is, the show greater "frequencies" in the samplings that have been undertaken. You do understand the statistical-principle of probability and how that works in demographic census undertakings, right?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
You can't compare sampling a whole country with a small tribe in kenya.
quote:Well somalis ar a single ethnic group, but that doesn't mean we are all completly related. I see alot of difference culturally and in behaviour between NE Somalia and southern somalia, but we are still all somalis.
Explorer:
Nope, what I see is a contradiction. Somalis, which just a moment ago, you professed to be a "single" ethnic group,
quote:Then the matter is settled; they are treated as such. What are you squawking about?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Well somalis ar a single ethnic group,
quote:Also the USA has more diversity in E1b1b phylogeny, what that has to do with anything?
This is one of the reasons I questioned Somalid_V13, Yonis, and Massinissa on their notion of somalid "highest frequency E1b1b" representation, even though they never understood what was being asked of them.
Ethiopia is one of the regions with rich diversity in E1b1b phylogeny in general [/QB]
quote:According to what study?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Also the USA has more diversity in E1b1b phylogeny,
quote:Do you need a study on that
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:According to what study?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Also the USA has more diversity in E1b1b phylogeny,
quote:Yes, I need to see a study that states the United States is rich in E1b1b diversity as one would say about say, Ethiopia. Hint: It's not as obvious as you think.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Do you need a study on that
quote:You should be; you've been confused on day one when I first asked you the question.
quote:I know the concept is entirely new to you. In genetics, we speak of "homelands" of lineages. We can digress and also speak of Ethiopians, East Indians, Japanese, Nigerians, Somalis et al. moving to different countries from their original countries, but that's not necessary, is it?
Ethiopian Americans, North African Americans, Iberian Americans, Somali Americans...etc
quote:Then you must be a dim-witted debater *now*, to make an unlikely predication. Your prediction is akin to saying a dead man now, will be alive a 100 years from now. Totally senseless...but I did already say that you are one confused puppy, did I not?
In 100 years a witty debater like yourself will use this American diversity in E1b1b phylogeny, the same way you used it in Ethiopia
quote:Khoisan are a very old group and they use to live in the Horn of Africa. I once saw a map that showed their hisstorical movement and apparently they used to populated Somalia and kenya thousands of years ago (way before the bantu migration reached East Africa), So it's no wonder that they brought with them these undifferentiated E1b1b markers that are today scattered throughout the whole of Southern Africa. Maybe they are the dwarfs at the murial paintings in Egypt during the 6th dynasty that they saw in the southern red sea coast.
Explorer wrote:
Interestingly, undifferentiated E-M35/E1b1b1 chromosomes reach their frequency peak in southern Africa, with eastern Africa next in line. Multiple studies have relayed the same theme on this frequent occurrence in southern African populations, particularly those that speak "click" languages or are camped with the Khoisan language phylum. Yet, when taken into account along with *downstream* E1b1 markers, diversity isn't as great here as it is found in the more eastern [if not relatively northern] regions.
quote:Yet, if you had your way, these people would be called "somalid", Lol.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Khoisan are a very old group and they use to live in the Horn of Africa. I once saw a map that showed their hisstorical movement and apparently they used to populated Somalia and kenya thousands of years ago (way before the bantu migration reached East Africa), So it's no wonder that they brought with them these undifferentiated E1b1b markers that are today scattered throughout the whole of Southern Africa.
quote:What else would they be, those khoisans are Somalids since they come from the same original lineage
Explorer wrote:
Yet, if you had your way, these people would be called "somalid", Lol.
quote:I think you have enough sense to know that Khoisans are not dwarfs. Africa does have actual pygmy populations in central Africa, you know.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Maybe they are the dwarfs at the murial paintings in Egypt during the 6th dynasty that they saw in the southern red sea coast.
quote:Of course not as Ethiopia. But in united states, there lives more than 100k Ethiopians, 60k Somalis, some 10k Eritreans, with additional of eastern sudanese, southern Egyptians, southern Greeks, southern turks and coastal levantines, then it's not farfetched to say that the Somalid lineage is well represented in United states.
Explorer wrote:
Yes, I need to see a study that states the United States is rich in E1b1b diversity as one would say about say, Ethiopia. Hint: It's not as obvious as you think.
quote:Khoisans are dwarfs in a relative sense. Pygmies have never lived in the red sea coast, their domain is the forests of central africa, they can't possibly have lived in NE Africa, but we know khoisans have lived there, even their genes say so.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:I think you have enough sense to know that Khoisans are not dwarfs. Africa does have actual pygmy populations in central Africa, you know.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Maybe they are the dwarfs at the murial paintings in Egypt during the 6th dynasty that they saw in the southern red sea coast.
quote:What primary evidence do you have that the said Egyptian-invoked foreign land dwarfs lived in the red sea coast?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Khoisans are dwarfs in a relative sense. Pygmies have never lived in the red sea coast, their domain is the forests of central africa, they can't possibly have lived in NE Africa, but we know khoisans have live there, even their genes say so.
quote:Com'n your telling me they went the whole way to central Africa just so to fetch pygmies for the entertainment value of the Egyptian royalties? According to Hatshepsuts scribes the dwarfs were from the land of Punt which is somewhere in the southern red sea coast and we know this area has been inhabitated by khoisans, pygmies would never survive in such environment, they are used to humid forests not dry semi-desert.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:What primary evidence do you have that the said Egyptian-invoked foreign land dwarfs lived in the red sea coast?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Khoisans are dwarfs in a relative sense. Pygmies have never lived in the red sea coast, their domain is the forests of central africa, they can't possibly have lived in NE Africa, but we know khoisans have live there, even their genes say so.
quote:Oh please I been reading DNA-Forums since they started.
I know the concept is entirely new to you. In genetics, we speak of "homelands" of lineages. We can digress and also speak of Ethiopians, East Indians, Japanese, Nigerians, Somalis et al. moving to different countries from their original countries, but that's not necessary, is it?
quote:I'm telling you to deliver this, instead of babbling on:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Com'n your telling me they went the whole way to central Africa just so to fetch pygmies for the entertainment value of the Egyptian royalties? According to Hatshepsuts scribes the dwarfs were from the land of Punt which is somewhere in the southern red sea coast and we know this area has been inhabitated by khoisans, pygmies would never survive in such environment, they are used to humid forests not dry semi-desert.
quote:You do know that the Egyptian named "land of punt" was located somewhere at the african side of the southern red sea coast, right? And the dwarfs of the Egyptian court came from that land, right? What more then do you need?
Explorer wrote:
I'm telling you to deliver this, instead of babbling on:
quote:No, I don't. What were the political boundaries of this "land of punt"?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
You do know that the Egyptian named "land of punt" was located somewhere at the african side of the southern red sea coast, right?
quote:Suppose they did; what of it?
And the dwarfs of the Egyptian court came from that land, right?
quote:What do you mean political boundaries? God damn it, what's wrong with you?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:No, I don't. What were the political boundaries of this "land of punt"?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
You do know that the Egyptian named "land of punt" was located somewhere at the african side of the southern red sea coast, right?
quote:Suppose they did; what of it?
And the dwarfs of the Egyptian court came from that land, right?
quote:I had the same question. What's wrong with you, saying things that you cannot support?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What do you mean political boundaries? God damn it, what's wrong with you?
quote:Which is it, from the above? And as evidenced by what?
This was during ancient times, thousands of years ago, there were no borders or political boundaries just communities, kingdoms, realm of influence etc
quote:In other words, you had no idea of what the "land of punt is". No? Were they nomadic? Or did they have a territory?
, that flactuated depending on current strength, there existed no international organizations that guarded borders and Sovereignty of nations. Countries are a modern construct.
The land of punt was a community somewhere in the southern red sea coast, an area that could have streched as far as the knowledge of this land was known to them, the dwarfs came from this "land of punt".
I thought you were on a roll, trying to beat Marc Washington's "thread on Europeans" in providing an uncontested twilight zone of creepy quack-jargon coupled with quack-ideological redundancy and a sense of endlessness. You are backing down on me, are you?
quote:So, you understand Dynastic Egypt to be a borderless *state*, which did not need to defend its sovereignty. The same goes for ancient Greece, Kush, Rome et al.?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What do you mean political boundaries? God damn it, what's wrong with you?
...
This was during ancient times, thousands of years ago, there were no borders or political boundaries just communities, kingdoms, realm of influence etc
quote:You mean like your twilight zone of six million gassed Jews supported by your "primary document backed" Dawidowicz? lol
Originally posted by The Explorer:
providing an uncontested twilight zone of creepy quack-jargon coupled with quack-ideological redundancy and a sense of endlessnes
quote:Of course Egypt was a borderless community, they had no borders, however they had realm of influence that continuesly fluctuated depending on current strenght. Different Powers advanced their influence and different powers were pushed away from their influence, an endless circle, no real borders, just influence.
Explorer wrote:
So, you understand Dynastic Egypt to be a borderless *state*, which did not need to defend its sovereignty. The same goes for ancient Greece, Kush, Rome et al.?
quote:So, them Egyptians were a bunch of clowns who built militarized fortresses on their borders, oops I meant -- on their "borderless" nowhere, merely for decoration and entertain; ain't that right, Yonis?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Of course Egypt was a borderless community, they had no borders
quote:How do you have a "realm of influence" without a border so as to warrant "fluctuating"?
they had realm of influence that continuesly fluctuated depending on current strenght.
quote:How do they get pushed away from an "influence" that was not territorially marked as their's?
Different Powers advanced their influence and different powers were pushed away from their influence
quote:They were not a bunch of clowns they were a strategic community, why would they not build fortresses when the rulers/elite always faced threat?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:So, them Egyptians were a bunch of clowns who built militarized fortresses on their borders, oops I meant -- on their "borderless" nowhere, merely for decoration and entertain; ain't that right, Yonis?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Of course Egypt was a borderless community, they had no borders
quote:Remember, they were "borderless" and in that context, other than just clowning around, as you ask yourself, what else would they have needed these militarized fortresses for? That's a good question, yonis; how about an answer?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
They were not a bunch of clowns they were a strategic community, why would they not buiild fortresses when the rulers/elite alwys faced threat?
quote:Whoa, whoa; hold on your horse breaks; I thought they had no territory to begin with, as per your somalid logic.
It was about territory of influence depending on the might of the rulers, no borders.
quote:Do i have to repeat myself?
Explorer wroe:
Remember, they were "borderless" and in that context, other than just clowning around, as you ask yourself, what else would they have needed these militarized fortresses for? That's a good question, yonis; how about an answer?
quote:No, you don't have to repeat yourself, as expected of you; remember this:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Do i have to repeat myself?
quote:Your map covers Upper Egypt and Nubia, yet you
Originally posted by Yonis2:
This is how Egypt looked like during the height of it's strenght.
Interestingly all these areas covered by the Ancient Egyptian rulers and the realm of their influence are the exact areas where the somalids are concentrated today in the levant coast.
quote:E1b1b people were naturally allied to Egypt. The coastal Proto-Phoenician towns & Philistines were majority Somalid people on the coasts.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
This is how Egypt looked like during the height of it's strenght.
Interestingly all these areas covered by the Ancient Egyptian rulers and the realm of their influence are the exact areas where the somalids are concentrated today in the levant coast.
quote:Wow, your kidding me right?
Zaharan wrote:
Your map covers Upper Egypt and Nubia, yet you
say these areas are "where the somalids are
concentrated today in the levant coast." I
don't quite get your meaning. If the Somalids
are concentrated on the Levant Coast how
are they exercising influence in Nubia and
Egypt today, as well as in ancient Egypt and
Nubia? Are the Somalids from the Levant? If so
did they migrate to Egypt, Nubia and the Horn
of Africa to exercise said influence? Please
clarify.
quote:Which in turn means you're assigning lineages to phenotypes, and promoting race as a biological entity; is this what you promote yonis?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Yonis, do you promote negrids, Australids, Arabids, Nordids etc; like the ones who came up with the term Somalid?
quote:Like all quacks, Yonis does a good job of posting things that defeat his intentions; though not a nation state, but an empire, the map displays a "bounded"-area for a specific time frame.
Originally posted by zarahan:
quote:Your map covers Upper Egypt and Nubia, yet you
Originally posted by Yonis2:
This is how Egypt looked like during the height of it's strenght.
Interestingly all these areas covered by the Ancient Egyptian rulers and the realm of their influence are the exact areas where the somalids are concentrated today in the levant coast.
say these areas are "where the somalids are
concentrated today in the levant coast." I
don't quite get your meaning. If the Somalids
are concentrated on the Levant Coast how
are they exercising influence in Nubia and
Egypt today, as well as in ancient Egypt and
Nubia? Are the Somalids from the Levant? If so
did they migrate to Egypt, Nubia and the Horn
of Africa to exercise said influence? Please
clarify.
quote:True!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:E1b1b people were naturally allied to Egypt. The coastal Proto-Phoenician towns & Philistines were majority Somalid people on the coasts.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
This is how Egypt looked like during the height of it's strenght.
Interestingly all these areas covered by the Ancient Egyptian rulers and the realm of their influence are the exact areas where the somalids are concentrated today in the levant coast.
Arabids were a minority in the coastal Levant that increased in size with the Mesopotamian & Peninsular invasions of the Coasts for the next 2000years
quote:Not really!
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Which in turn means you're assigning lineages to phenotypes, and promoting race as a biological entity; is this what you promote yonis?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Yonis, do you promote negrids, Australids, Arabids, Nordids etc; like the ones who came up with the term Somalid?
quote:
Originally posted by rasol:
ugh. bugbog has no photoshop skill at all.
at least learn to screen rather than scribble when posting homemade fake maps to "illustrate" dumb ideas.
quote:LMAO
quote:^ stormfront traffics in racist fantasy to boost the ego of insecure ethnocentrists.
This is getting annoying and deep down, Yonis knows that he doesn't make any sense.
Stormfront has destroyed the last of your remaining brain cells Yonis, I honestly remember you as being a lot sharper/smarter than this. Oh well..
not all of whom are white, oh, excuse me -> Aryans.
Or perhaps this isn't the original Yonis, but simply a much less intelligent poseur.
quote:Well, why wouldn't "Negrid" be a well enough term for you, but "Somalid" is?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Not really!
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Which in turn means you're assigning lineages to phenotypes, and promoting race as a biological entity; is this what you promote yonis?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Yonis, do you promote negrids, Australids, Arabids, Nordids etc; like the ones who came up with the term Somalid?
I think a better choice than the term "Negrid" could be applied, other than that i don't see these distinctions deviating from reality.
quote:Since i find "negrid" kind of offensive due to how it's been used by new world Europeans and the oppresed connotation it carries, a better neutral term could fit. Same as i don't like the term "niger-congo", it just sounds somehow racist.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Well, why wouldn't "Negrid" be a well enough term for you, but "Somalid" is?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Not really!
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Which in turn means you're assigning lineages to phenotypes, and promoting race as a biological entity; is this what you promote yonis?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Yonis, do you promote negrids, Australids, Arabids, Nordids etc; like the ones who came up with the term Somalid?
I think a better choice than the term "Negrid" could be applied, other than that i don't see these distinctions deviating from reality.
Both promote the same nonsense, which is biological race.
Btw, what is this reality you speak of, care to elaborate?
quote:Point is Yonis, they both promote biological races, the ones (sf posters) who coined said terms(Negrids, Australids, Somalids, Arabids, Nordids etc..) are promoting biological races; hence, you can't sit there and take the term "Somalid" (because you like it, since you're a Somalian) and run with it, as if its separate from the original racial entity that the term was actually created to promote.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Since i find "negrid" kind of offensive due to how it's been used by new world Europeans and the oppresed connotation it carries, a better neutral term could fit. Same as i don't like the term "niger-congo", it just sounds somehow racist.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Well, why wouldn't "Negrid" be a well enough term for you, but "Somalid" is?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Not really!
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Which in turn means you're assigning lineages to phenotypes, and promoting race as a biological entity; is this what you promote yonis?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Yonis, do you promote negrids, Australids, Arabids, Nordids etc; like the ones who came up with the term Somalid?
I think a better choice than the term "Negrid" could be applied, other than that i don't see these distinctions deviating from reality.
Both promote the same nonsense, which is biological race.
Btw, what is this reality you speak of, care to elaborate?
And as for your question of "reality", well what is there to prove? You just need to check all the accumulated data to find the reality, these distictions fit well with all the current emperical evidence.
quote:Not really, Somalid doesn't promote simplistic "races" based on ulterior bone morphology and phenotype, it promotes 'genetic races', much deeper. A way to track down your basic origin from the male side and the blood structure you carry. Everyone regardless if they look South asian, Siberian or West african and carry NE African lineage can trace their original root to NE Africa as where their ancestors were located from the start. Same goes with the other origins.
Mindovermatter wrote:
Since you already know race doesn't exist biologically; you should have already known Somalid was erroneous.
quote:Curiously enough, mindlessmatter does promote "genetic races" which is why he argues that "African specific" population mated with an "Asian specific" population to create a "hybrid" European. He seems to want to keep both Africa and Asian "pure" so as to label them fundamental units (a race) creating the European hybrid. If the Asian was not a "pure" population but a mixture of African and Asian genes then both Asian and European would owe their existence to something else and not be "fundamental". Both would be in essence "hybrids" under the racial schema.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Not really, Somalid doesn't promote simplistic "races" based on ulterior bone morphology and phenotype, it promotes 'genetic races', much deeper.
quote:This person is "new" to ES yet he knows Jew boy's old posting name. lol
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am new to this forum and belong to e3b1c1
m34 marker i would like to say that soamalid v13
to lump al e1b1b1 as somalids is stupit
as m81 e3b2 isnt somalid and also my clade e3b3
m123 so i would descried e3b as east african instead
to mystery solever yes we are related to e3a
but very far in time in terms of genetic evoulution its and half man
dead sea
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Not really, Somalid doesn't promote simplistic "races" based on ulterior bone morphology and phenotype, it promotes 'genetic races' , much deeper. [/qb]
Mindovermatter wrote:
Since you already know race doesn't exist biologically; you should have already known Somalid was erroneous.
That's biological race kid.
quote:Obviously a troll, a bad one at that, Lol
Originally posted by akoben:
quote:This person is "new" to ES yet he knows Jew boy's old posting name. lol
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am new to this forum and belong to e3b1c1
m34 marker i would like to say that soamalid v13
to lump al e1b1b1 as somalids is stupit
as m81 e3b2 isnt somalid and also my clade e3b3
m123 so i would descried e3b as east african instead
to mystery solever yes we are related to e3a
but very far in time in terms of genetic evoulution its and half man
dead sea
quote:You and your fabricated rants; what a pathetic distraught stalker you are.....
Originally posted by akoben:
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Obviously a troll, a bad one at that, Lol
Originally posted by akoben:
quote:This person is "new" to ES yet he knows Jew boy's old posting name. lol
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am new to this forum and belong to e3b1c1
m34 marker i would like to say that soamalid v13
to lump al e1b1b1 as somalids is stupit
as m81 e3b2 isnt somalid and also my clade e3b3
m123 so i would descried e3b as east african instead
to mystery solever yes we are related to e3a
but very far in time in terms of genetic evoulution its and half man
dead sea
Lol@ naming "Mystery solver", you are new, eh?
"e3b1c1" you've failed miserably...
quote:Phenotypic classification is diff, I think there is atleast 10 Phenotypes in Africa, but thats another subject.
Originally posted by MaximallyAbstract_Faith:
[QB] And where is West Africa in all this?
quote:
"a Mesolithic population carrying Group III lineages with M35/M215 mutation [E3b] expanded northwards from sub-Saharan to north Africa and the Levant" (Underhill et al., 2001, p. 55; see also Bosch et al., 2001; Bar-Yosef, 1987) [Keita, 2005, p. 562]
The M35/M215 sub-clade cluster of haplotypes fragments a lineage (Ht 4) described previously (Hammer et al. 1997). We suggest that a population with this sub-clade of the African YAP/M145/M203/PN2 cluster expanded into the southern and eastern Mediterranean at the end of the Pleistocene...These lineages would have been introduced then from the Middle East into southern Europe (and to a lesser extent northern India and Pakistan) by farmers during the Neolithic expansion. [Underhill et al., 2001, p. 51]
quote:This is how they cluster....
The Levant versus the Horn of Africa: Evidence for Bidirectional Corridors of Human Migrations
A more recent dispersal out of Africa, represented by the E3b-M35 chromosomes, expanded northward during the Mesolithic (Underhill et al. 2001b). The East African origin of this lineage is supported by the much larger variance of the E3b-M35 males in Egypt versus Oman (0.5 versus 0.14; table 3).
Since the E3b*-M35 lineages appear to be confined mostly to the sub-Saharan populations, it is conceivable that the initial migrations toward North Africa from the south primarily involved derivative E3b-M35 lineages.
quote:So Morroco, Algeria, Somalia are the new subsaharan hinterland
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^...hey genius,
E1b1b and E1b1a are both sub Saharan African genetic markers
quote:Morocco and Algeria are both north of the Sahara, but they indeed carry E derivatives which ultimately comes from sub Saharan Africa.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:So Morroco, Algeria, Somalia are the new subsaharan hinterland
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^...hey genius,
E1b1b and E1b1a are both sub Saharan African genetic markers
quote:Lol, didn't you see how your friend massinissa was destroyed trying to erroneously compare the derivatives of IJ which creates I and J (which are like cousins) to that of two derivatives of the same brother E haplogroup PN2 clade derivatives E1b1b and E1b1a?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b & E1b1a were split 30,000 years ago!
The distance between them is the same as J & I, let me guess you also think The Nordid subrace of teh EUropids are also Mideastern because they had a common genetic origin 30,000years ago
quote:
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E1b1a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E1b1b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
quote:Wrong, ancestors of non Africans left Africa over 60,000 yrs ago, and their genome was to become non African lineages. There are indeed non African lineages and post OOA African.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Keep in mind 60,000 yrs ago all genoms were still somewhere in East Africa, so again by your generous classification all markers are simplay East African markers!
quote:Genetics in many cases refutes Phenotypic racial ideology, cultural mythological races...etc
Originally posted by Djehuti:
^ The problem as usual is that some folks' racial ideology hinders their understanding of genetics, and the converse-- genetics refutes racial ideology which is why some choose not to understand it.
quote:Genetics refutes race entirely on a biological level.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Genetics in many cases refutes Phenotypic racial ideology, cultural mythological races...etc
quote:Please make another topic about this subject. That you could narrow Africa to merely 10 phenotypes is laughable. Make sure you include your criteria for identifying what distinguishes one from another.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Phenotypic classification is diff, I think there is atleast 10 Phenotypes in Africa, but thats another subject.
Originally posted by MaximallyAbstract_Faith:
[QB] And where is West Africa in all this?
quote:correct statement, and obliteration of thread premise.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
^ The problem as usual is that some folks' racial ideology hinders their understanding of genetics, and the converse-- genetics refutes racial ideology which is why some choose not to understand it.
quote:Oh Rude Negrids...
Originally posted by Boofer:
quote:Please make another topic about this subject. That you could narrow Africa to merely 10 phenotypes is laughable. Make sure you include your criteria for identifying what distinguishes one from another. [/QB]
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
is right! It's obvious you are one of those Somalis whose minds are weak enough to be warped by the racialist pseudo-science of white supremacists.
quote:Djehu I am not a Somali
Originally posted by Djehuti:
^
quote:Guess what I don't want to get together in one Primate race. Gentically my evolutionary future is in the Somalid genepool.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
Here's a hint, there is no such thing as 'mongoloid' let alond 'somalid' 'bantid' 'alpid' 'nordid' etc. I suggest you read a book on genetics, kid.
quote:Too bad for you there is no such thing, so I guess you basically have no future beyond your own imagination, lol.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Gentically my evolutionary future is in the Somalid genepool.
quote:Look kid, you're European (Sicilian), with recent African admixture plain and simple, in essence how are you not a filthy mongrel yourself?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Leave us alone, if you are a disgusting Mongrelist race denier identify with your genetic race. (each human has Y-DNA marker only) if you hate your own genetic race go commit suicide or wait till you meet your fate on a genetic checkpoint.
quote:LMAO @ an admittedly mixed kid talk about "mongrels" and LOL harder @ his claim of Y-DNA markers as signifiers of "race"!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Guess what I don't want to get together in one Primate race. Gentically my evolutionary future is in the Somalid genepool.
Leave us alone, if you are a disgusting Mongrelist race denier identify with your genetic race. (each human has Y-DNA marker only) if you hate your own genetic race go commit suicide or wait till you meet your fate on a genetic checkpoint. One thing for sre we will have a big genetic war...Genetic nationalists will eventually we will have a war vs the Anti-Evolutionary Mongrelists
quote:Lol @ this character; the guy's blood boils upon being plainly called a Somali, yet argues all day about being a Somalid race. Quack science is irrational.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Djehu I am not a Somali
Originally posted by Djehuti:
^
I am a Sicilian American
quote:So Mr. e3b1c1, e3b is not black therefore it is causcasian according to your own words in which you opposed black to caucasian. E3b is too far separated from E3a for them to be brothers yet it has found its way into the "caucasian" brotherhood. Who would have thunk. How might you explain that Mr. e3b1c1?
yes e3b and e3a are related but as somalid v13 said it it was 30,000 years and some geneticts claim 47,000 years so they are two diffrent race like haplogroup i in europeans and haplogroup j in middle easten both descendents from ij group
haplogroup e3b his found in many caucasians as
oposed to e3a which is found mainly on black people the conection his to far in order to
think of you guys as brothers
quote:Tell me that you are not being serious, and that you are just pulling my legs.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
the source is go to wikpedia
quote:I and J descend from IJ.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
haplogroup i in europeans and haplogroup j in middle easten both descendents from ij group
quote:Very well, you're a proud carrier of an African genetic marker. More power to you.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
iam proud to be e3b
e3b1c1
quote:Speak sensibly. Who do not carry E-M35*?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
they are not e-m35*
quote:The Levant versus the Horn of Africa: Evidence for Bidirectional Corridors of Human Migrations
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
they are not e-m35*
quote:It's not getting through to you. The said populations tested positive for ancestral or the paragroup E-M35* markers period, not subclade E-M293. Understand?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
yes i know about this research but they found the m35* to belong to m293 in research on the tanzanian and kenyan m35* they test positive for
e-m293
e3b1c1
quote:If you know, then why do you insist on misconstruing data, just to fit your personal taste of what reality should be?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
yse i know
quote:Try telling that to the folks on the Arabian peninsula.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
as oposed to e3a who remain al there history in africa
e3b1c1
quote:LOL You just don't realize the non-logic of your claims!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
yes e3b and e3a are related but as somalid v13 said it it was 30,000 years and some geneticts claim 47,000 years so they are two diffrent race like haplogroup i in europeans and haplogroup j in middle easten both descendents from ij group
haplogroup e3b his found in many caucasians as
oposed to e3a which is found mainly on black people the conection his too far in order to
think of you guys as brothers
quote:NO! What you have a hard time understanding is that these haplogroups have NO BEARING on looks at all!! These haplogroups are independent of genes that determine phenotype so you can't tell what lineage someone carries by their look--- that's why the very notion of 'race' (discreet looks based on lineage) is REFUTED!!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
do we agree r1a people and r1b people look diffrent even though they share r1 if you think a russian guy and a british guy look the same
than i dont know
same goes for e3b and e3a they dont look the same all the italian chicks you see its because of the e3b specificly m78 in them beutiful genes
i am not m78 i am m34 you want me and oter caucasians to admit we are blacks while all i see in the miroor is a caucasian middle eastern
are you serious
quote:NO! What you have a hard time understanding is that these haplogroups have NO BEARING on looks at all!! These haplogroups are independent of genes that determine phenotype so you can't tell what lineage someone carries by their look--- that's why the very notion of 'race' (discreet looks based on lineage) is REFUTED!!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
do we agree r1a people and r1b people look diffrent even though they share r1 if you think a russian guy and a british guy look the same
than i dont know
same goes for e3b and e3a they dont look the same all the italian chicks you see its because of the e3b specificly m78 in them beutiful genes
i am not m78 i am m34 you want me and oter caucasians to admit we are blacks while all i see in the miroor is a caucasian middle eastern
are you serious
quote:What determines black or a white persons looks if not whats on the inside?
Again the fact that they are white and have other 'european' looks is NOT determined by the haplogroups they carry.
quote:There is such a thing as "black African"??
Djehuti wrote:
Just deal with the fact that there is no such thing as "Somalids" or "Bantids" or "negrids" or "cacasids" but there IS such thing as black Africans of which you have ancestry from.
quote:At least we finally have an admission from you that the term "Somalid" is quack science. Now that this term has been put in the bucket where it belongs all that's left is to educate you on the validity of the term "black African"
The term "black African" is more quack science than "somalid".
quote:^ lol yeh I saw that one too!
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
At least we finally have an admission from you that the term "Somalid" is quack science.
quote:Nope Somalid is valid, "black african" WTF is that? Sounds like a coffe brand.
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
quote:At least we finally have an admission from you that the term "Somalid" is quack science. Now that this term has been put in the bucket where it belongs all that's left is to educate you on the validity of the term "black African"
The term "black African" is more quack science than "somalid".
quote:^ child you crazy and you know it. lol
Originally posted by Yonis2:
]Nope Somalid is valid
quote:Lol! You're right it does sound like a coffee brand. Maybe Starbucks should name one of their brews "black african"; maybe then you'll drink from it and see what a lift you get. It may even wake you up and dispel the brand of inferiority that the europeans and arabs stamped on your soul.
"black african" WTF is that? Sounds like a coffe brand.
quote:Nope, haplogroups are not equivalent to race.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so are we brothers you want me to admitt that all those e3b in mediterreanean and western asia
are black by the way you say r1b and r1a europeans but if you go back in time you should know they share common ancestor with nativa americans haplogroup q as both derived from haplogroup p native americans look some kind of mongolid certenly not white but you still claim r1b and r1a caucasian dont you the same goes for e3b annd e3a the fact they are related far back in history 30,000 years make them diffrent race
so am i black to you as i am m34 a subclade of e3b ?if iam than you are dreaming and stupit
ithout any doubt do you realy think balkan people many arabians many antolians and many iberians are black?
e3b1c1
quote:Actually, I think even the analogy between the relationship between R1b subclades and that between E3a and E3b is not a better option. You'd have to show me that R1b and R1a share the same immediate ancestor, as is the case between E3a and E3b. Secondly, you can't geographically compartmentalize E3a [E1b1a] and E3b [E1b1b] into West African and East African respectively, as neither are limited to said regions respectively. Take the coastal North areas of West Africa, for instance; E1b1b (E3b) is actually predominant relative to E3a there, and yet, it is still West Africa we are talking about. Then take Southeast Africa of East Africa; E3a is predominant in say, Kenya and possibly Tanzania -- yet, we are still talking about East Africa. In Central Africa, we have varying frequencies of both lineages.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
Second, your analogy of I and J is a bad one. The relationship between E3a and E3b is actually exactly like the relationship between the R1a and R1b! With R1a being representative of Eastern Europeans and R1b representative of Western Europeans. No geneticist denies that R1a and R1b are brothers who descend from R1 and BOTH are indigenous European or at least northwest Eurasian lineages. Again, it's the same with E3a and E3b BOTH brothers descended from E3, and BOTH are representative of indigenous (black) Africans-- with E3a predominant in west Africa and E3b predominant in East Africa. You cannot seperate E3b as non-African or worse "caucasian" without doing the same to E3a, it is just absurd.
quote:The only E1b1a (E3a) Negrids to leave Subsaharan Africa were slaves. Name me one exception
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Actually, I think even the analogy between the relationship between R1b subclades and that between E3a and E3b is not a better option. You'd have to show me that R1b and R1a share the same immediate ancestor, as is the case between E3a and E3b. Secondly, you can't geographically compartmentalize E3a [E1b1a] and E3b [E1b1b] into West African and East African respectively, as neither are limited to said regions respectively. Take the coastal North areas of West Africa, for instance; E1b1b (E3b) is actually predominant relative to E3a there, and yet, it is still West Africa we are talking about. Then take Southeast Africa of East Africa; E3a is predominant in say, Kenya and possibly Tanzania -- yet, we are still talking about East Africa. In Central Africa, we have varying frequencies of both lineages.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
You cannot seperate E3b as non-African or worse "caucasian" without doing the same to E3a, it is just absurd.
quote:Whats your point all Humans carry an African marker & before that a Primate marker, also 20,000years ago is not recent
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by e3b1c1:
[qb]
None of them (Arabians, Anatolian's) are black
quote:^This is begging the question. How can anyone give you such an exception as if to assume that anyone agrees with your crackhead concept of "e3a Negrid"..
The only E1b1a (E3a) Negrids to leave Subsaharan Africa were slaves. Name me one exception
quote:Yes, all humans alive can trace their ancestry back to Africa, but as explained to you over and over again, ancestors of non Africans left Africa over 60,000 years ago.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Whats your point all Humans carry an African marker & before that a Primate marker, also 20,000years ago is not recent
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by e3b1c1:
[qb]
None of them (Arabians, Anatolian's) are black
quote:LMAO. How do you adjudge how much others understand, when you don't understand a thing or two about said issues for starters?
Originally posted by TheAmericanPatriot:
Somalid, Many of the fellows here have just enough knowledge to be dangerous but not enough to really understand all of these complicated issues.
quote:Yes, You should be as confused as that "confused look" you posted; what does your question have to do with what you are citing?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:The only E1b1a (E3a) Negrids to leave Subsaharan Africa were slaves. Name me one exception
Originally posted by The Explorer:
]Actually, I think even the analogy between the relationship between R1b subclades and that between E3a and E3b is not a better option. You'd have to show me that R1b and R1a share the same immediate ancestor, as is the case between E3a and E3b. Secondly, you can't geographically compartmentalize E3a [E1b1a] and E3b [E1b1b] into West African and East African respectively, as neither are limited to said regions respectively. Take the coastal North areas of West Africa, for instance; E1b1b (E3b) is actually predominant relative to E3a there, and yet, it is still West Africa we are talking about. Then take Southeast Africa of East Africa; E3a is predominant in say, Kenya and possibly Tanzania -- yet, we are still talking about East Africa. In Central Africa, we have varying frequencies of both lineages.
quote:Putting your quack science yapping aside, how does affirming the relationship between two major clades amount to "claiming" someone else?
E1b1b (E3b) split 20,000 years ago & they colonized the Med & Balkans. I have nothing to do with Negrids, I feel disgusted with Negrids who have no pride in their own genetic race & instead try to claim me as their own very PATHETIC
quote:It only means one thing to me E1b1a Negrids don't belong anywhere outside Subsaharan Africa, thats why they were taken advanatge off enslaved & improsned wherever they go.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:how does affirming the relationship between two major clades amount to "claiming" someone else?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
]
quote:'Black African' is really not even a scientific phrase (and nobody in here ever said it was) but at least it's a phrase more rooted in valid logic and sound reason than 'Somalid' is.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
There is such a thing as "black African"??
The term "black African" is more quack science than "somalid".
quote:Again, you fail to realize that haplogroups HAVE NO BEARING ON LOOKS! There are Europeans with pale skin, blonde hair, and blue eyes and still carry E3a. Likewise, E3b also originated among black Africans but that doesn't mean their modern descendants in Arabia or even the Balkans would still appear black! That's why haplogroups and other genetics completely debunk and refute the whole notion of 'race' in the first place! If you are not smart enough to understand this, then I feel sorry for you!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so are we brothers you want me to admitt that all those e3b in mediterreanean and western asia
are black by the way you say r1b and r1a europeans but if you go back in time you should know they share common ancestor with nativa americans haplogroup q as both derived from haplogroup p native americans look some kind of mongolid certenly not white but you still claim r1b and r1a caucasian dont you the same goes for e3b annd e3a the fact they are related far back in history 30,000 years make them diffrent race
so am i black to you as i am m34 a subclade of e3b ?if iam than you are dreaming and stupit
ithout any doubt do you realy think balkan people many arabians many antolians and many iberians are black? e3b1c1
quote:And like you do?!!
Originally posted by TheAmericanPatriot:
Somalid, Many of the fellows here have just enough knowledge to be dangerous but not enough to really understand all of these complicated issues.
quote:
Originally posted by Djehuti (many times):
Cranial features:
The human phenotypic trait that holds the greatest diversity is cranial morphology. Because of this fact, cranial features can at times be misleading if not taken into proper context. For example, for a long time features like long narrow faces and narrow noses have been associated with “caucasian” or “caucasoid” people even though such features are present in populations throughout the globe from Africa to the Americas. The same can be said about so-called “negroid” features such as broad faces and noses which are also not just confined to Africans but various peoples in Asia, the Pacific etc.
Which is why we have studies like this:
J. Edwards, A. Leathers, et al.
...based on Howell’s sampling Fordisc 2.0 authors state that "there are no races, only populations," yet it is clear that Howell was intent on providing known groups that would be distributed among the continental "racial" groups.
We tested the accuracy and effectiveness of Fordisc 2.0 using twelve cranial measurements from a homogeneous population from the X-Group period of Sudanese Nubia (350CE-550CE). When the Fordisc program classified the adult X-Group crania, only 51 (57.3%) of 89 individuals were classified within groups from Africa. Others were placed in such diverse groups as Polynesian (11.24%), European (7.86%), Japanese (4.49%), Native American (3.37%), Peruvian (3.36%), Australian (1.12), Tasmanian (1.12%), and Melanesian (1.12%). The implications of these findings suggest that classifying populations, whether by geography or by "race", is not morphologically or biologically accurate because of the wide variation even in homogeneous populations.
And...
Forensic Misclassification of
Ancient Nubian Crania:
Implications for Assumptions
about Human Variation -April 2005, Current Anthropology:
It is well known that human biological variation is principally clinal (i.e., structured as gradients) and not racial (i.e., structured as a small number of fairly discrete
groups). We have shown that for a temporally and geographically homogeneous East African population, the most widely used “racial”
program fails to identify the skeletal material accurately. The assignment of skeletal racial origin is based principally upon stereotypical features found most frequently in the most geographically distant populations. While this is useful in some contexts (for example, sorting
skeletal material of largely West African ancestry
from skeletal material of largely Western European ancestry), it fails to identify populations that originate elsewhere and misrepresents fundamental patterns of human biological diversity.
Jean Hiernaux
The People of Africa(Peoples of the World Series) 1975
The oldest remains of Homo sapiens sapiens found in East Africa were associated with an industry having similarities with the Capsian. It has been called Upper Kenyan Capsian, although its derivation from the North African Capsian is far from certain. At Gamble's Cave in Kenya, five human skeletons were associated with a late phase of the industry, Upper Kenya Capsian C, which contains pottery. A similar associationis presumed for a skeleton found at Olduvai, which resembles those from Gamble's Cave. The date of Upper Kenya Capsian C is not precisely known (an earlier phase from Prospect Farm on Eburru Mountain close to Gamble's Cave has been dated to about 8000 BC); but the presence of pottery indicates a rather later date, perhaps around 400 BC. The skeletons are of very tall people. They had long, narrow heads, and relatively long, narrow faces. The nose was of medium width; and prognathism, when present, was restricted to the alveolar, or tooth-bearing, region......all their features can be found in several living populations of East Africa, like the Tutsi of Rwanda and Burundi, who are very dark skinned and differ greatly from Europeans in a number of body proportions.............
From the foregoing, it is tempting to locate the area of differentiation of these people in the interior of East Africa. There is every reason to believe that they are ancestral to the living 'Elongated East Africans'. Neither of these populations, fossil and modern, should be considered to be closely related to the populations of Europe and western Asia.
claims that Caucasoid peoples once lived in eastern Africa have been
shown to be wrong, - JO Vogel, Precolonial Africa
Fulani (West African)
Somali (East African)
Tutsi (Central African)
Egyptian (North African)
Ironically, another trait all of these people above share in common besides facial features is skeletal structure of their bodies. Their body structure has been called “super-negroid” indicating their extra-tropical adapted bodies compared to stereotypical blacks of West Africa who only have plain “negroid” builds. This is another indication that these people definitely have NO non-African ancestry!
Also, just because someone happens to have the same features as those you consider ‘true blacks (negroes)’ does not mean they are even African. As seen by this Andamanese person below
Southeast Asian
Jean Hiernaux The People of Africa 1975
p.53, 54
"In sub-Saharan Africa, many anthropological characters show a wide range of population means or frequencies. In some of them, the whole world range is covered in the sub-continent. Here live the shortest and the tallest human populations, the one with the highest and the one with the lowest nose, the one with the thickest and the one with the thinnest lips in the world. In this area, the range of the average nose widths covers 92 per cent of the world range:
only a narrow range of extremely low means are absent from the African record. Means for head diameters cover about 80 per cent of the world range; 60 per cent is the corresponding value for a variable once cherished by physical anthropologists, the cephalic index, or ratio of the head width to head length expressed as a percentage....."
So any and all talk of "caucasoid", "negroid", or even "mongoloid" total and utter NONSENSE, let alone trying to divide African populations into such categories!
quote:If it's not a scientific phrase then why are you shoving it on peoples throat?? Who the hell are you to tell people they are black?? Do you see me go and tell indonesians, Burmanese and Philipinos that they are black?? Or koreans and chinese that they are yellow? No, since it's none of my business to tell them what they are.
Djehuti wrote:
'Black African' is really not even a scientific phrase (and nobody in here ever said it was) but at least it's a phrase more rooted in valid logic and sound reason than 'Somalid' is.
quote:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:If it's not a scientific phrase then why are you shoving it on peoples throat?? Who the hell are you to tell people they are black?? Do you see me go and tell indonesians, Burmanese and Philipinos that they are black?? Or koreans and chinese that they are yellow? No, since it's none of my business to tell them what they are.
Djehuti wrote:
'Black African' is really not even a scientific phrase (and nobody in here ever said it was) but at least it's a phrase more rooted in valid logic and sound reason than 'Somalid' is.
You need to respect that some people don't like to be called black regardless of your social definitions in america, period.
I can assure you that if you go to any place in northern sudan, eritrea or ethiopia and call the people their black, you will get slaughtered at the spot, same goes with maghreb and egypt, probably the same in many west african countries who are not anglocised, like Senegal.
quote:DNA tests are here today, taking a quick look at the genetic map of Africa you will see two parts:
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I can assure you that if you go to any place in northern sudan, eritrea or ethiopia and call the people their black, you will get slaughtered at the spot, same goes with maghreb and egypt, probably the same in many west african countries who are not anglocised, like Senegal.
Djehuti wrote:
'Black African' is really not even a scientific phrase (and nobody in here ever said it was) but at least it's a phrase more rooted in valid logic and sound reason than 'Somalid' is.
quote:DNA tests are here today, taking a quick look at the genetic map of Africa you will see two parts:
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:I can assure you that if you go to any place in northern sudan, eritrea or ethiopia and call the people their black, you will get slaughtered at the spot, same goes with maghreb and egypt, probably the same in many west african countries who are not anglocised, like Senegal.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
[qb] [QUOTE]Djehuti wrote:
'Black African' is really not even a scientific phrase (and nobody in here ever said it was) but at least it's a phrase more rooted in valid logic and sound reason than 'Somalid' is.
quote:Care to reproduce us a map?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:DNA tests are here today, taking a quick look at the genetic map of Africa you will see two parts:
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:I can assure you that if you go to any place in northern sudan, eritrea or ethiopia and call the people their black, you will get slaughtered at the spot, same goes with maghreb and egypt, probably the same in many west african countries who are not anglocised, like Senegal.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
[qb] [QUOTE]Djehuti wrote:
'Black African' is really not even a scientific phrase (and nobody in here ever said it was) but at least it's a phrase more rooted in valid logic and sound reason than 'Somalid' is.
A) Predominantly Somalid North Africa
B) Predominantly Negrid SubSaharan Africa
With limited gene flow between both parts:
A) Minimal Negrid presence in North Africa spread by Slavery
B) Moderate Somalid presence in Subsahran Africa, legacy of Adventurous Somalids infiltrating South Africa from the Eastern Coasts.
quote:
Originally posted by T. Rex:
Care to reproduce us a map?
quote:Yonis2 Africans being described as black has nothing to do with social definitions in America. Is Bilad as-Sudan is an American term? The term has been used to describe Africans, East and West, for thousands of years.
You need to respect that some people don't like to be called black regardless of your social definitions in america, period.
quote:You must be on something strong, because almost all your answers have nothing whatsoever to do with what you cite.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:It only means one thing to me E1b1a Negrids don't belong anywhere outside Subsaharan Africa, thats why they were taken advanatge off enslaved & improsned wherever they go.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
how does affirming the relationship between two major clades amount to "claiming" someone else?
quote:Who said I was "shoving" anything "down people's throats"??! 'Black African' may not be scientific in origin but compared to 'Somalid' it sure as hell has alot more science behind it as it, as it is term based on logical observation. 'Black'-- someone with very dark skin. African-- someone from the continent of Africa. You disagree with the meaning of these terms?? Are Somalis not black?? They are overall no lighter than Nigerians. Are Somalis not African as well? They are no less African than Nigerians also. Typological features aside, both peoples are black and African as are Zulu, Tutsi, Teita, Fulani, etc . etc.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
If it's not a scientific phrase then why are you shoving it on peoples throat?? Who the hell are you to tell people they are black?? Do you see me go and tell indonesians, Burmanese and Philipinos that they are black?? Or koreans and chinese that they are yellow? No, since it's none of my business to tell them what they are.
You need to respect that some people don't like to be called black regardless of your social definitions in america, period.
I can assure you that if you go to any place in northern sudan, eritrea or ethiopia and call the people their black, you will get slaughtered at the spot, same goes with maghreb and egypt, probably the same in many west african countries who are not anglocised, like Senegal.
quote:Yes, You should be as confused as that "confused look" you posted; what does your question have to do with what you are citing?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:The only E1b1a (E3a) Negrids to leave Subsaharan Africa were slaves. Name me one exception
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Actually, I think even the analogy between the relationship between R1b subclades and that between E3a and E3b is not a better option. You'd have to show me that R1b and R1a share the same immediate ancestor, as is the case between E3a and E3b. Secondly, you can't geographically compartmentalize E3a [E1b1a] and E3b [E1b1b] into West African and East African respectively, as neither are limited to said regions respectively. Take the coastal North areas of West Africa, for instance; E1b1b (E3b) is actually predominant relative to E3a there, and yet, it is still West Africa we are talking about. Then take Southeast Africa of East Africa; E3a is predominant in say, Kenya and possibly Tanzania -- yet, we are still talking about East Africa. In Central Africa, we have varying frequencies of both lineages.
quote:It's funny. Yonis may well not object to dark Southern Sudanese being called "black", and yet, there are Somalis who approach the same hue.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
quote:Who said I "shoving" anything "down people's throats"??! 'Black African' may not be scientific in origin but compared to 'Somalid' it sure as hell has alot more science behind it as it, as it is term based on logical observation. 'Black'-- someone with very dark skin. African-- someone from the continent of Africa. You disagree with the meaning of these terms?? Are Somalis not black?? They are overall no lighter than Nigerians. Are Somalis not African as well? They are no less African than Nigerians also. Typological features, aside both peoples are black and African as are Zulu, Tutsi, Teita, Fulani, etc . etc.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
If it's not a scientific phrase then why are you shoving it on peoples throat?? Who the hell are you to tell people they are black?? Do you see me go and tell indonesians, Burmanese and Philipinos that they are black?? Or koreans and chinese that they are yellow? No, since it's none of my business to tell them what they are.
You need to respect that some people don't like to be called black regardless of your social definitions in america, period.
I can assure you that if you go to any place in northern sudan, eritrea or ethiopia and call the people their black, you will get slaughtered at the spot, same goes with maghreb and egypt, probably the same in many west african countries who are not anglocised, like Senegal. [/qb]
Again, I ask what is a Somalid exactly??! What is the logical basis or etymology behind such a word??
quote:Correct! Poor Yonis fails to realize that the term or definition of 'black' has NOTHING to do with America!! It has existed long before 'America' even existed, and it was a term even used by African natives themselves. Egyptian Keme= 'black'.
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Yonis2 Africans being described as black has nothing to do with social definitions in America. Is Bilad as-Sudan is an American term? The term has been used to describe Africans, East and West, for thousands of years.
quote:Indeed, many Cameroonians carry R1*.
Cameroonid carriers of R1B1* ought to stake out their own racial claim so that they're not confused with negrids, bantids, and your common Burkino Fasids.
quote:Actually no, bilad al-sudan was what the arab speaking people of northern Sudan and Egypt use to describe the lands of the darfurians and other Sudanese while the Moroccans applied it to the areas controlled by Songhay kingdom, it wasn't the whole of africa only pockets of africa.
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Yonis2 wrote:quote:Yonis2 Africans being described as black has nothing to do with social definitions in America. Is Bilad as-Sudan is an American term? The term has been used to describe Africans, East and West, for thousands of years.
You need to respect that some people don't like to be called black regardless of your social definitions in america, period.
quote:Philipinos have very dark skin, are they black?
Djehuti wrote:
'Black'-- someone with very dark skin.
quote:LOL Well that would depend on which Filipinos! Yes there are black Filipinos, especially aboriginal groups like the Aetas. Of course not all Filipinos are black, as I am not. Your query is a weak strawman nonetheless, because we are talking about aboriginal African groups-- all of which are black.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Philipinos have very dark skin, are they black?
quote:On point as usual Djehuti. The claim that Yonis and Somalid are trying to make of a "somalid e3b race" is entertaining but mad. And don't get thrown off your A game by Yonis's adhominem attacks. He's lacking logical arguments and naturally resorts to name calling.
By the logic of these nitwits, Cameroonians should look entirely different from not only other West Africans but East Africans also as they don't carry E at all! Can you tell the difference between an E3a carrying West African and an R1* carrying West African?? LMAO
quote:Indeed, I was the first to point this out in the previous page-- that Sicilians also carry E3a which is not surprising due to the high frequency of Benin variety of HBS.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
...And do you think say, the E1b1b carriers were the primary co-agents of say, Benin haplotype HbS, which is the predominant HbS condition in European regions near the Mediterranean; or do you think it was transferred by a group with Hg A or Hg B carrying males...possibly E1, E2 or E3? Can you elaborate on this.
quote:
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Somalid your death bed conversion (probably after the returns of a DNA test) to an embrace of your African "e3b brothers" is touching. However, its disingenuous and ludicrous. The absurdity of it is beyond belief.
At least when your hatred of blacks was based upon an assumed white superiority you had some basis to differentiate the objects of your hatred from your cohorts, namely, skin color. Now you're left in the untenable position of having to walk around with a DNA kit and swab to be able to determine with any accuracy your fellow E3b members in Africa. If someone randomly chose say 100 Africans from all over the continent and put them in a room and asked you to pick out your fellow E3b-ers - you wouldn't know where to start.
Additionally Somalid, where was the love for E3b-ers in 1938 when Mussolini promulgated the Manifesto Della Razza forbiding, among other things, marriage between "Aryan" Italians and "inferior" natives in their African colonies? Where was the love when they were committing atrocities against these colonised natives?
Where was the love for "somalids" in 1992 when the Italian army was accused of committing atrocities against Somalians?
Would you really go amongst Italians in Bensonhurst Brooklyn and wave wave your E3b card? Who are we kidding here?
quote:So why did the "northern Sudanese" governments allow their country all these years, to be named after the "other" people?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Actually no, bilad al-sudan was what the arab speaking people of northern Sudan and Egypt use to describe the lands of the darfurians and other Sudanese while the Moroccans applied it to the areas controlled by Songhay kingdom, it wasn't the whole of africa only pockets of africa.
quote:Well played Explorer. Terse but devastating!
So why did the "northern Sudanese" governments allow their country all these years, to be named after the "other" people?
quote:Forgive Somalid and co. for not knowing that Y-DNA genes control or oversee transmission of information on certain sex-traits of males, during reproduction, not on craniofacial morphology.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
Indeed, many Cameroonians carry R1*.
Here are a group of Cameroonian men:
By the logic of these nitwits, Cameroonians should look entirely different from not only other West Africans but East Africans also as they don't carry E at all! Can you tell the difference between an E3a carrying West African and an R1* carrying West African?? LMAO
quote:
Negrid liberation is by returning to their Subsahran genetic nation, as was the case for the last 20,000years
quote:Who gives jack about whether some ideological quack acknowledges fact or not? That's besides the point; and suppose one takes your unverified dating above at face value, as I have asked you before but went on unanswered, how does that have any bearing on the fact that E1b1a and E1b1b are very close phylogenetic siblings, essentially sharing the same immediate ancestor?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
look dejehuti i dont have the pridfe of the european m78 but if you cant realize that e3b and e3a sepreated 30,000 years ago and understant that its a long time in terms of genetics it will never work for you guys the eropean m78 will never admit that they related to negroid and unity
quote:Firstly, you contradict yourself. In one breath, you say that E3a marker never left Africa, and then in the next, you say that it did, only on slave ships. So, this would mean, wherever anybody with E3a appears on the globe, then they must certainly be slaves, according to you, right?
e3a never left africa only on slave ships as oposed to e3b who contribute to the world
e3b1c1
quote:I see that you are just about as competent as Somalid_V13 when it comes to answering questions. How does the above answer this:
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
the answere is yes e3a outside of africa is slave in arabia oman uae it was brought by slave trade and in america you already know the atlantic slave trade
quote:You can't deny it, but you attempt to, by saying that they supposedly separated by "30 ky ago", which even if true, actually is next to worthless in having any bearing on the very close phylogenetic relationship between E3a and E3b. Do you still have trouble understanding what was justed related to you?
iam not denaying e3b is african just that it is related to e3a
quote:That's a lie. You suggested that I google it, and said you've come across the mention in Wiki. Do you seriously take Wiki as a primary source?
30,000 years by the way i gave you the name of the site you didnt want to see the evidence
quote:Nor are you an expert on E3a or E3b for that matter. But since you made a charge that E3a found anywhere must be indicative of slavery, the burden is on you to elaborate on this, no?
i am not expert on hbs so i cant answere you on this subject
e3b1c1
quote:Indeed, it feels like there is a wall between us, since you almost never answer what you were asked.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
talking to you guys is like talking to walls
quote:Is it so hard for you to stop yapping about irrelevant hearsay garb that you'll never back up anyways, and answer the relevant ones that you were asked?
explorere is it so hard to go to google
quote:Nope; I want you to stop running away from questions and coming up with stupid posts like this, and answer questions for once. How about at it?
and type the name of the research i gave you
you guys are funny thts for sure what is your purpose in this site tell me do you want arabians antolians balkan people and iberian swho belong to e3b to leave there lands to admit they are some kind of black and go back to africa to live with you maybe we can bring some cibilization thats for sure
e3b1c1
quote:That's very true, in my rush to get my point across, I was imprecise and committed a faux-pas but the flaw is no fatal. The point remains that the ancestor of Cameroonian R1b1* was in all probability Eurasian.
Actually, R1*-M173 in Cameroonians is absent in European populations; European ones are found to be more downstream phylogenetically.
quote:Well then, perhaps you should be careful when you make statements that you are not prepared to back up, should you not?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
what do you want me to answere i dont know about hbs to answere you again
quote:To teach and learn. What is your purpose at this site, other than your obsession with and knack for dispersing quack about E3b, as some supposed isolated "racial" entity et al.?
tell me what are the purpose of you guys in this site do you want unity with e3b ?
quote:Not that the above makes any sense, but you could have fooled me that you are not racist, with your racist-filled rants.
tell me man again as isaid i am willing to hear you iam not like m78 and m81
which are pride of there balkan and iberian hertige so i am less racist than them
regards e3b1c1
quote:Well, I don't rule out the possibility of a "Near Eastern" origin, but several indicators strongly argue for an African origin, on the other hand. So, its not as established yet, where R1*-M173 emerged. Thus far, it reaches its frequency peak only on the African continent, and in the "Near Eastern" areas where it was located, it co-exists with African markers, so...
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Explorer wrote:quote:That's very true, in my rush to get my point across, I was imprecise and committed a faux-pas but the flaw is no fatal. The point remains that the ancestor of Cameroonian R1b1* was in all probability Eurasian.
Actually, R1*-M173 in Cameroonians is absent in European populations; European ones are found to be more downstream phylogenetically.
quote:It's not me "trying to unit"; it's me relating the fact that E3a and E3b are very closely related. I don't care how people of these lineages feel about this fact; does that help? If you disagree with this position, then please demonstrate to the contrary. I presume that you are not some helpless whino, and that you instead object, loaded with substantial material to the contrary. Tell me that this is not wrong impression of you.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
you said to teach and learn but all i see is you guys tring hard to be united with people who dont feal any close relationship to e3a
quote:This is where the questions above, that you dodged come in. How about less whining, and more fetchy of answers?
whats so ever and even if e3b related to e3a it 30,000
years thats a long time dont you think as i
said e3a stayed in africa alll his history he never had the brain and the guts to leave africa
and do something in the world just chasing tiger in the jungel
e3b1c1
quote:If I'm kidding you, then you should be easily refuting me. Why are you whining instead. Where's your phylogenetic demonstration that disproves what I said?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am queting you : it me relating the fact that e3b and e3a are very closely related .
very closely related are you kidding me
30,000 years its like they splitt and each branch add more mutations and evolutions which effect appearnce look you name it i still think they are completely diffrent race
e3b1c1
quote:Well, what are you waiting for; produce your phylogenetic representation that tells a different story. You are proving to be demonstrating that I indeed had a wrong impression of you; you are proving to be a skirt wearer.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
the e tree change completely
quote:Take note of above request.
go to the issog tree and even ig p2 is the common ancestor
each branch of e3b add more 3-4 mutations each mutations is thousands of years 10,000
quote:Tell me that you are not a failed comedian? What does subclades have to do with the lineages, and the phylogenetic fact presented before you in the last post?
so they very distant if you take v13 which is in european m215 m35 m78 v13 4 mutations thats a lot
if you take my clade m34 m215 m35 m123 m34
again 4 mutations the same goes for m183
m215 m35 m81 m183 again 4 muattations each mutation thousand of years so we rach the 30,000
years again many water in the river
e3b1c1
quote:Hey buddy, I cannot see evidence that does not yet exist; indeed, you had better quit, at the rate you're going. Smart move.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i gave up you dont want to see the evidence
stay in africa that all i can say to you
good luck
e3b1c1
quote:With these matters one is forced, by lack of "proof", to converse in terms of possiblity, probability, competitive plausibilty, and parsimony. The paradox, mentioned in a post above, may be contingent upon further clarification of the origin of R1B1*
Well, I don't rule out the possibility of a "Near Eastern" origin, but several indicators strongly argue for an African origin, on the other hand. So, its not as established yet, where R1*-M173 emerged. Thus far, it reaches its frequency peak only on the African continent, and in the "Near Eastern" areas where it was located, it co-exists with African markers, so...
quote:So what? You kidding? The subclades are offsprings of the lineage, not the lineage "usherer". It's like you saying that your brother and yourself are no longer closely related, just because you each happen to have your own children. Are you that out there to think that idea is logical?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so what if its subclades each mutation
quote:I don't care what rubbish you've told me time and again. I'd like to see something sensible come out of you...for one, like answers to the mounting questions awaiting you.
as i told you is thousand of years
quote:Your "somalid greek" cousin apparently doesn't know that you'd win a gold medal in ignorance, if there was one. Nobody here has yet outwitted you when it comes to ignorance...but there are a few other candidates that come to mind.
maybe my m78 cosuin
somalid greek could show you the truth
but i doubt it even he cant win your ignorence you are ignoring fact we dont look the same we dont feal the smae e3b is completely diffrent race
quote:What have you personally changed in the world? You are relying on a Y-DNA marker for God's sake, to pump up you inferiority complex; a "Y-DNA"...sex chromosome marker. Using your logic, one can point to Benin haplotype HbS, wherein its bearers can say that they changed the world.
we change the world while you e3a guys stayed in africa
quote:Don't know if can say "E3b were never slaves", but I know that it occurred in a region where E3b is dominant. See for instance: Slave Trade
fact alone show you that we are so diffrent then you e3a guys e3b were never slaves
e3b1c1
quote:Notes on R1*-M173:
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
With these matters one is forced, by lack of "proof", to converse in terms of possiblity, probability, competitive plausibilty, and parsimony. The paradox, mentioned in a post above, may be contingent upon further clarification of the origin of R1B1*
quote:See what you're saying. This confused e3b1c fellow is a prime example of that mindset.
But the fallacy that this paradox attacks is that a given Y chromosome pattern is responsible for accomplishment. Since the chromosome pattern itself is claimed to be the engine of accomplishment then possessing it is as important as where it came from. (Basically Europeans are superior. Europeans possess genes X, Y, and Z. There fore X, Y, and Z confers superiority).
Although the point of contention in this thread is E3a vs E3b it is almost axiomatic that any Y-dna associated with western eurasians will be regarded, by racists, as confering superiority.
quote:Well they can think what they want, but it doesn't establish R1*-M173 origin in "Western Eurasia". It is in fact rarer in that region than it is in Africa.
A review of popular websites will easily demonstrate that R1b1* in Cameroon is widely viewed as the result of a back migration from Western Eurasia.
quote:Really? Care to demonstrate where it shows that the slaves in question are "E3a slaves"...
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
the site you gave show what i told e3a is found in oman uae from this slave trades dont try make e3b slaves we are masters in our nature not slaves as you e3a guys
regards e3b1c1
quote:Moron, I didn't post it to argue for your silly notions about E3a vs. E3b and slavery.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
the first site you gave you say that m34 is prevelent in the horn but absent from western and central africa so my clade doesnt exist in slaves great for me
quote:Dissect the citation into pieces and tell us what's not right, and put it right, with your own evidence to the contrary. Should be fairly easy, shouldn't it?
about the site you gave its bulshite most of the slaves were brought to arabia from tanzania were e3a is very high gebetiscts say e3b in arabia is neolithic expension not slavery like e3a who is found there e3a is always conected to slavery its in your blood
e3b1c1
quote:How do you tell other people to read, when you are unread yourself. Enough with the distractions; more on answers, will ya!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i have some reading for you
y cromosome in the gulf of oman
read this paper you will see m78 and m34 in arabia are signals of neolithic expension from eastern africa thourough the levant to arabia
not slaves
regards
e3b1c1
quote:Lol! Too true.
These newbie clowns are something. I suggest *you* read the archives about the said paper, and then laugh at yourself for thinking that you are some revelation-purveying messiah, bringing stuff to attention that's never been heard of. LOL.
quote:With your "explanation" talent, aka lack thereof, you are lucky if you had the wisdom of a child.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am clown your funny tell you the truth i enjoy this forum and talking with you even if its like explaining a little child
quote:If you read what I wrote, then you should consider yourself educated, unless of course, you are uneducable; that the case?
ps i read what you wrote about this paper but you should read it again
regards e3b1c1
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Nope, haplogroups are not equivalent to race.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so are we brothers you want me to admitt that all those e3b in mediterreanean and western asia
are black by the way you say r1b and r1a europeans but if you go back in time you should know they share common ancestor with nativa americans haplogroup q as both derived from haplogroup p native americans look some kind of mongolid certenly not white but you still claim r1b and r1a caucasian dont you the same goes for e3b annd e3a the fact they are related far back in history 30,000 years make them diffrent race
so am i black to you as i am m34 a subclade of e3b ?if iam than you are dreaming and stupit
ithout any doubt do you realy think balkan people many arabians many antolians and many iberians are black?
e3b1c1
None of them (Arabians, Anatolian's) are black if they don't want to be it doesn't matter what they feel, but simple fact is the genetic markers they carry are in fact African markers, indicative of recent African ancestry. Plain and simple.
Btw, all of the genetic examples you're trying to equate E3a and E3b with, make no sense.
Both E3a and E3b descend from the same parent E lineage, which makes them brothers, and their split 25kya does not make them separate "races", as phenotype is an adaptation to the environment, and not correlated with haplotypes.
Note this E3a carrying African (Tutsi) who does not exhibit the "Negroid" features associated with your erroneous E3a "negrid" classification.
The above man and his people were in the past considered to be Caucasian, and thought to be migrants from East Africa carrying E1b1b (E3b), but come to find out these individiuals actually carry E1b1a (E3a) and not E1b1b (E3b).
Destroyed the "Caucasoid" race, destroys "Negrid" and "Somalid".
The following quote from Carelton Coon is talking about the man I posted, and his people, the Tutsi, who have ~80% E3a according to published data, and no outside admixture nada, zilch.
The Story of Man Carleton Coon
p 196-197 Borzoi Books, 1965
Few skeletons have been found in the Sahara, and these are hard to date because of soil erosion. In Arabia prehistoric archaeology has barely been started. Yet we can be reasonably confident, until other evidence upsets the theory, that these deserts were the home of the slender variety of Caucasoid man. In East Africa this type has survived among the slender, narrow-faced Watusi and other cattle people.
Clear example of African diversity from E1b1a(E3a) carrying African, once classified as "Caucasian"....Clear destruction of E1b1a(E3a) "Negrid".
quote:That's pretty much his trademark. His ES legacy. LOL.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
e3b1c1 no response?
quote:Of course it matters. If it didn't, you'd be busy refuting me, not whining after me.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
it doesnt matter
quote:Why not. If I can teach you a thing or two on the matter, that makes me an expert relative to you.
what you wrote who are you a gentecists an expert
quote:And you are a simple man who lives in a desert. So what?
you just a simple man who live in africa
quote:I am impressed that you are able to even dress yourself. That's an amazing feat, don't you think?
i am even immpresed by the fact you have a computer amazing dont you think
regards e3b1c1
quote:Don't you wish you were just as funny; perhaps back in the day, you wouldn't have become a rejected comedian, inspiring you to build an empty legacy of "no response" on ES. No?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
you are funny your great
regards e3b1c1
quote:Well hey, that's life; when you speak gibberish, nobody is inclined to understand you. Try it with the animals and see if they understand you better. Good luck with it.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
it doesnt matter what i will write you insis not to understand guys
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
quote:I see so "negrid" is in fact equivalent to "negroid". What specifically makes him "negroid?"
the man in the picture is negroid and not somalid but it could be when you reach souther algeria you get far from the m81 hot spot and reach the e3a area this draw could done be by legendery m81 person who describe the negrtoids
south of the shara or by negroid e3a himself
e3b1c1
quote:They will never address this critique. At its root the illogical rants of these E3b-nazis is psychological/emotional rather than scientific. Refer to any Frantz Fanon's timeless works on the psychology of racism.
Clear example of African diversity from E1b1a(E3a) carrying African, once classified as "Caucasian"....Clear destruction of E1b1a(E3a) "Negrid".
quote:Nevertheless R1 is a Europid gene & he made a good point R1 proved to be inferior once exposed to the Subsaharan climate.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Actually, R1*-M173 in Cameroonians is absent in European populations; European ones are found to be more downstream phylogenetically.
quote:Genetic Somalids will not be able to survive in a Subsahran climate, unless we mongrelize with maternal Subsharan females & eliminate Negrid males in the process. I don't think any race can change Subsahran Africa without causing serious damage to Nature
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
talking to you guys is like talking to walls
explorere is it so hard to go to google and type the name of the research i gave you
you guys are funny thts for sure what is your purpose in this site tell me do you want arabians antolians balkan people and iberian swho belong to e3b to leave there lands to admit they are some kind of black and go back to africa to live with you maybe we can bring some cibilization thats for sure
e3b1c1
quote:E1b1b V13 Nazi?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
belive me apocalypse i am not nazi maybe it because i am not european i am m34 the other branches of e3b like m78-v13 and m81
are more like nazi because they are european
i am middle eastern so i dont have the european thinking i agree that its emotionaly hard for me
and for other e3b to understand we are all related under the pn2 umbrella
but thats the reality i am just brave enough or
to face it belive me its not easy for me
regards e3b1c1
quote:Genetic nationalist. I've heard it all now.
"Genetic nationalist" lol
quote:Beautiful! You are making fun of his perfect English & then decide to throw in "phoney"
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
even down to e3b1c1's phoney, over the top, trouble with english! Funny stuff!
quote:^^Lol, you're simply a whiteboy with African ancestry get over it kid.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
....
quote:They raided Europe looking for light haired, blue eyed Europids. You can't enslave a V13, we are as feirce & as quick as the Somalid Berber M81 pirates they had no chance against us!
Originally posted by argyle104:
Somalid_V13
HA HA HA HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!
Looks like being a bogus somalid did you no good. Europeans and northern Africans didn't share your sense of brotherhood. LOL!
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=%22slaves+from+italy%22
quote:Right on, preach to them
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:They raided Europe looking for light haired, blue eyed Europids. You can't enslave a V13, we are as feirce & as quick as the Somalid Berber M81 pirates they had no chance against us!
Originally posted by argyle104:
Somalid_V13
HA HA HA HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!
Looks like being a bogus somalid did you no good. Europeans and northern Africans didn't share your sense of brotherhood. LOL!
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=%22slaves+from+italy%22
Also belonging to the same genepool doesn't mean you will live in eternal peace! Preserving your genepool gives you a chance to perfect them via selection without wasting your genes by hybridizing with alien genotypes.
quote:First of all majority of Italians are not E1b1b, second of all its called "War" smartass, that's what people do in war, they kill each other, what do you expect them to do, buy each other Pizza??
Originally posted by Djehuti:
quote:Indeed, I was the first to point this out in the previous page-- that Sicilians also carry E3a which is not surprising due to the high frequency of Benin variety of HBS.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
...And do you think say, the E1b1b carriers were the primary co-agents of say, Benin haplotype HbS, which is the predominant HbS condition in European regions near the Mediterranean; or do you think it was transferred by a group with Hg A or Hg B carrying males...possibly E1, E2 or E3? Can you elaborate on this.
quote:
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Somalid your death bed conversion (probably after the returns of a DNA test) to an embrace of your African "e3b brothers" is touching. However, its disingenuous and ludicrous. The absurdity of it is beyond belief.
At least when your hatred of blacks was based upon an assumed white superiority you had some basis to differentiate the objects of your hatred from your cohorts, namely, skin color. Now you're left in the untenable position of having to walk around with a DNA kit and swab to be able to determine with any accuracy your fellow E3b members in Africa. If someone randomly chose say 100 Africans from all over the continent and put them in a room and asked you to pick out your fellow E3b-ers - you wouldn't know where to start.
Additionally Somalid, where was the love for E3b-ers in 1938 when Mussolini promulgated the Manifesto Della Razza forbiding, among other things, marriage between "Aryan" Italians and "inferior" natives in their African colonies? Where was the love when they were committing atrocities against these colonised natives?
Where was the love for "somalids" in 1992 when the Italian army was accused of committing atrocities against Somalians?
Would you really go amongst Italians in Bensonhurst Brooklyn and wave wave your E3b card? Who are we kidding here?
ROTFL
Of course! Where were the Italians' love for their E3b brothers when they ran over the Ethiopian soldiers with their tanks until the wheels were clogged with bodies, or when Italian soldiers raped Somali women?? Of course to the Italians 'Un nero è un nero' or un selvaggio! It's obvious that even Italians of today couldn't care less about what haplogroup a black people carries.
quote:First you have to understand the diff between an Italian & an Italianized Sicilian. The region my ancestors came from is part of Greater Greece we spoke Greek, prayed Greek & were Greeks for 2000 years.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
Of course! Where were the Italians' love for their E3b brothers when they ran over the Ethiopian soldiers with their tanks until the wheels were clogged with bodies, or when Italian soldiers raped Somali women?? Of course to the Italians 'Un nero è un nero' or un selvaggio! It's obvious that even Italians of today couldn't care less about what haplogroup a black people carries.
quote:Good to know that you finally see that your east African slaves related to your west African slaves. They are brothers.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i thought about what you said explorer
and we are defently conected even if we like it or not our common ancestor is pn2
the common ancestor of west african slaves and many greeks ,romans iberians ,coastal levantines ,souther arabians and many antolians
all united under this damm pn2 common ancestor the damm transition
e3b1c1
quote:Clown, Europeans don't carry R1*-M173; so, it cannot be "Europid".
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Nevertheless R1 is a Europid gene & he made a good point R1 proved to be inferior once exposed to the Subsaharan climate.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Actually, R1*-M173 in Cameroonians is absent in European populations; European ones are found to be more downstream phylogenetically.
R1 became Europids because they enetered Europe -Ural to Atlantic- before the Ice Age.
quote:So what do Somalis speak on the international arena, Somali to non-Somalis? Last time I checked, the Somali state was begging the Arabs to be part of the Arab league, but to no avail. Also, you need to learn the difference between people adopting a language as a lingua franca, as opposed to it replacing their indigenous languages. Most of "the rest of African colonies" you mentioned have not lost their indigenous languages, and in fact, exclusively speak those when not working for international firms or local firms or institutions doing business with international concerns. So, don't know where it takes you, to point out that various African countries adopt foreign languages as official lingua franca. Now, if they lost their languages and local tradition, you might have a point or two, but that is clearly not the case. Also, Libya largely speaks "Arabic", which is a foreign language. Only those who insist on speaking the local Tamazight dialect, are embracing an indigenous tradition; so here, you contradict yourself.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Funnny that all the Italian regions in Africa, Libya, Somalia and Eritrea have no trace of Italian hegemony, almost as if they didn't even come there, none of these nations have italian as official language and none of these nations even speak italian or adopted italian words or catholicism despite numerous campaigns and attempts, while the rest of colonies in africa have all adopted European languages, as if it was their own, complete mental ownage.
You know it's hilarious that you guys try to attribute any presence of E3a outside of Africa to slavery, because when it was first discovered that Europe has a significant frequency of E3b, many Europeans tried to explain its presence as a result of slavery also. Of course such explanations failed as there was no evidence of an ancient or prehistoric African slave trade to Europe or the fact that it happened to be the male supposed 'slaves' who passed these lineages on. What's also funny is that the very word 'slave' is derived from Slav as in the Slavic peoples of Eastern Europe who were the most enslaved group during the Middle Ages by both Muslims as well as their fellow Christian Europeans! These Slavs were predominantly R1a carriers, but again why is it you never hear about 'genetic nationalists' of Western Europe try to separate their R1b selves from their Slave R1a brothers??! quote:Amazing
Originally posted by The Explorer:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by e3b1c1:
Clown, Europeans don't carry R1*-M173; so, it cannot be "Europid".
quote:Mr Paranoia ask admin for an IP Check (I don't use proxies either)
Originally posted by argyle104:
Now I know Somalid_V13 is a Yonis sockpuppet. : )
You need to leave that khat alone boy. LOL
quote:What part of I am not a Europid you don't understand
Originally posted by argyle104:
Somalid_V13 wrote:
------------------------------
------------------------------
You can't beat history, you just can't.
http://www.google.com/search?num=100&hl=en&lr=&as_qdr=all&q=%22slaves+from+italy%22
quote:Cite the piece that says the undifferentiated paragroup of R1*-M173, lacking downstream mutations, has been found in Europeans. All studies later than that provided in the link state that none has been found. Simply linking without understanding what you link or what relevance it has, is meaningless. Get to work, buddy.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Amazing
Originally posted by The Explorer:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by e3b1c1:
Clown, Europeans don't carry R1*-M173; so, it cannot be "Europid".
Studies usually test for R1b & R1* is usually there genius! or R1a & R1*
Check the R1*-M173 on the study below
http://hpgl.stanford.edu/publications/PNAS_2001_v98_p10244.pdf
quote:It has the M343 + P25 mutation = R1b
Originally posted by The Explorer:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Cite the piece that says the undifferentiated paragroup of R1*-M173, lacking downstream mutations, has been found in Europeans. All studies later than that provided in the link state that none has been found. Simply linking without understanding what you link or what relevance it has, is meaningless. Get to work, buddy.
quote:This is for the stupid guy!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
http://hpgl.stanford.edu/publications/AJHG_2002_v70_p1197-1214.pdf
More on the north Cameroonian Genetic Europids for the rude guy! (Read link above)
Haplogroup R1b1* is found at high frequency among the native populations of northern Cameroon, such as the Kirdi, in west-central Africa, which is believed to reflect a prehistoric back-migration of an ancient proto-Eurasian population into Africa.
R1b is also found 40% in Hausa, those are Mesolithic Europids who mongrelized with Subsaharans
quote:Hate to break it to you clown, but R1*-M173 is not R1b.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:It has the M343 + P25 mutation = R1b
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Cite the piece that says the undifferentiated paragroup of R1*-M173, lacking downstream mutations, has been found in Europeans. All studies later than that provided in the link state that none has been found. Simply linking without understanding what you link or what relevance it has, is meaningless. Get to work, buddy.
quote:You mean your bottomless ignorance [like above] which you imagine constitutes "genetics"? Nope, we don't want to change genetics, but we do want to rid you off your ignorance of genetics.
Are we going to change genetics just to suit your mood...
quote:You don't have to be in 'Negrid' forums; you can go join the community of stormfront quacks, where you'll be put in "your rightful place" as a degenerate mediterranean craka, or shall I say, "crakoid"...meaning you have not yet evolved to the fully developed level of a true craka. LOL.
Only on Negrid forums
quote:What are you talking about?? Begging to be a member? To no avail??
Explorer wrote:
Last time I checked, the Somali state was begging the Arabs to be part of the Arab league, but to no avail.
quote:Wow the rude Negrid is still not getting the simple point. R1b P-25 was found in Cameroon & Sudan do you get it?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
[QB] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Hate to break it to you clown, but R1*-M173 is not R1b.
quote:E1b1a was found wherever slave ships landed
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
djehuti where in europe e3a is found ?
quote:...the part where it says R1*-M173 is R1b, you silly crakazoid wop; when will it get through you numb crakazoid skull that the R1*-M173 chromosomes is not R1b, which is a downstream clade? You disagree; point to the moron who said that the Cameroonian R1*-M173 chromosomes has the P-25 downstream mutation, other than the moron being yourself. Time to stop imagining things, and strive to deal with real material in the real world.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Wow the rude Negrid is still not getting the simple point. R1b P-25 was found in Cameroon & Sudan do you get it?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Hate to break it to you clown, but R1*-M173 is not R1b.
quote:It lacks downstream mutations beyond R1b-P25
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:...the part where it says R1*-M173 is R1b, you silly crakizoid wop; when will it get through you numb crakizoid skull that the R1*-M173 chromosomes is not R1b, which is a downstream clade? You disagree; point to the moron who said that the Cameroonian R1*-M173 chromosomes has the P-25 downstream mutation, other than the moron being yourself. Time to stop imagining things, and strive to deal with real material in the real world.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Wow the rude Negrid is still not getting the simple point. R1b P-25 was found in Cameroon & Sudan do you get it?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Hate to break it to you clown, but R1*-M173 is not R1b.
quote:This is a rush post, and so, I'll deal with your post further when I return, but in the meantime, tell me this: Was it the Somali state that took the initiative to get admitted into the Arab League, or did the Arabs come to your doorstep begging Somalia to join? Explain.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:What are you talking about?? Begging to be a member? To no avail??
Explorer wrote:
Last time I checked, the Somali state was begging the Arabs to be part of the Arab league, but to no avail.
As far as i know it *is* a member since 30 years back, infact it's the arab league that's so adament to keep somalia part of the arab league despite many somalis (especially in the north) want to pull out, since somalis don't speak arabic and thus not arabs and also since saudis are sponsoring wahabist in the south through the channel of arab league and causing more wahabi fundamentalist in the south to continue causing troubles with Ethiopia and also the south vowed to make the whole of the horn into an islamic wahabi region. The Northeast however want's nothing to do with the arab league and made that clear and have good relationship with Ethiopia but are kept hostage by the south, it's only the south and the islamic courts that are arab orientated, who also today have the power and even introduced sharia law last week. The two states in the north are prepared to brake away from the south (infact Northwest has already declared it's indipendence) if the warmongers don't cool down and don't stop with the threats causing more instability in the whole fragile horn region.
When we brake away from the bantu influenced south then the Somalid genes will be even higher
quote:Irreversibly confused crakazoid wop, I said post a primary source that says the Cameroonian R1*-M173 chromosomes is R1b, and is defined by P-25 downstream mutation. Name one.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:It lacks downstream mutations beyond R1b-P25
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:...the part where it says R1*-M173 is R1b, you silly crakizoid wop; when will it get through you numb crakizoid skull that the R1*-M173 chromosomes is not R1b, which is a downstream clade? You disagree; point to the moron who said that the Cameroonian R1*-M173 chromosomes has the P-25 downstream mutation, other than the moron being yourself. Time to stop imagining things, and strive to deal with real material in the real world. [/qb]
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Wow the rude Negrid is still not getting the simple point. R1b P-25 was found in Cameroon & Sudan do you get it?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Hate to break it to you clown, but R1*-M173 is not R1b.
Stop being stubborn & go look up P25, its the second mutation into R1b!
R1b in Western Europe has more down stream mutations than R1b in Cameroon due to genetic drift bteween the 2 populations (DuH)
R1b in Kirdi people "N Cameroon"
R1-M173/R1b-M343/R1b-P25
R1b most common in "Western Europe"
R1-M173/R1b-M343/R1b-P25/R1b-P297/R1b-M269
The genetic distance between the two populations shows that R1b in Cameroon entered the region in the 2000s BC
Ofcourse the above is for people who want to learn...
R1b-P25 reported by Wood et al in N Cameroon & R1b* by Hassan et al. in Hausa people
quote:It was the arabs who came to the doorstep, the people were never asked, and no one approached them they persuaded the dictator Siad barre to join in exchange for political support in the region, Siad barre's predecessor the more popular Ali Sharmake didn't want to join and was more into pan-africanism and hd good relationship with Haile sellasie. It was Egypt under Anwar Sadat that demanded Somalia to join and wanted a counter balance against Ethiopia in the horn region, this after Sharmake was killed and Siad Barre took power. Egypt has also worked hard to pull Eritrea in since it got it's independence in 1991 from Ethiopia, but Eritrea due to being a christian dominated state and supporter of the oppresed coptic rights in Egypt has accepted an observer role and not full membership and thus has good relationship with the arab league. Somalia leaders in the Northeastern utonomous state don't want to be part of the arab league, but the country is still a member despite a none-effective central government and the ousting of Siad barre for almost two decades ago and also despite the volatile situation in the south, which the saudis have taken great advantage of by spreading the Wahabi wing of islam into the horn region.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:This is a rush post, and so, I'll deal with your post further when I return, but in the meantime, tell me this: Was it the Somali state that took the initiative to get admitted into the Arab League, or did the Arabs come to your doorstep begging Somalia to join? Explain.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:What are you talking about?? Begging to be a member? To no avail??
Explorer wrote:
Last time I checked, the Somali state was begging the Arabs to be part of the Arab league, but to no avail.
As far as i know it *is* a member since 30 years back, infact it's the arab league that's so adament to keep somalia part of the arab league despite many somalis (especially in the north) want to pull out, since somalis don't speak arabic and thus not arabs and also since saudis are sponsoring wahabist in the south through the channel of arab league and causing more wahabi fundamentalist in the south to continue causing troubles with Ethiopia and also the south vowed to make the whole of the horn into an islamic wahabi region. The Northeast however want's nothing to do with the arab league and made that clear and have good relationship with Ethiopia but are kept hostage by the south, it's only the south and the islamic courts that are arab orientated, who also today have the power and even introduced sharia law last week. The two states in the north are prepared to brake away from the south (infact Northwest has already declared it's indipendence) if the warmongers don't cool down and don't stop with the threats causing more instability in the whole fragile horn region.
When we brake away from the bantu influenced south then the Somalid genes will be even higher
quote:Actually I'm incorrect and The Explorer is correct but have it your way. If as you say r1b1* is "europid" it renders your argument about "superior europid" genes absurd. R1b1* and E3a lived in very close proximity in Cameroon for eons. Yet it was not r1b1* that swept south and west across Africa subduing 2/3 of the continent: it was E3a.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Actually, R1*-M173 in Cameroonians is absent in European populations; European ones are found to be more downstream phylogenetically.
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Nevertheless R1 is a Europid gene & he made a good point R1 proved to be inferior once exposed to the Subsaharan climate.
R1 became Europids because they enetered Europe -Ural to Atlantic- before the Ice Age.
quote:You're quite the comedian. You have no problem expressing racial hatred but take umbrage when I make fun of e3b1c1's english!
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
even down to e3b1c1's phoney, over the top, trouble with english! Funny stuff!
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Beautiful! You are making fun of his perfect English & then decide to throw in "phoney"
There is nothing to debate about the Somalid genetic race. We got scientific studies & scientific stats to prove that we have nothing to do with you. You have Michael Jacksons "remember the time" -nice song but not scientific!-
Finally, please accept that we can't co-exist online let alone in real life, you stay in your Negrid genepool & I stay in my Somalid genepool
quote:Racial hate is a fact thats why I don't liek you & vice versa, because I am a genetic Somalid & you are a genetic Negrid
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Somalid wrote: [QUOTE] quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You're quite the comedian. You have no problem expressing racial hatred but take umbrage when I make fun of e3b1c1's english!
quote:Agreed, you are attempting to humiliate me by saying I am "Black" Negrid thats the greatest humiliation you can inflict on me
Additionally we're not co-existing with you here online we're humiliating you.
quote:Sweety don't jump to conclusions. From my Somalid Eugenic POV Europids are as inferior as Negrids
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Somalid wrote: [QUOTE]Actually I'm incorrect and The Explorer is correct but have it your way. If as you say r1b1* is "europid" it renders your argument about "superior europid" genes absurd. R1b1* and E3a lived in very close proximity in Cameroon for eons. Yet it was not r1b1* that swept south and west across Africa subduing 2/3 of the continent: it was E3a.
quote:Ok ok, so what are you; a black Somalid?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
you are attempting to humiliate me by saying I am "Black" Negrid thats the greatest humiliation you can inflict on me
quote:First of all, Sub-Saharan Africa is not all rainforest. Some of it is savanna, some of it is scrubland, and some of it is even desert (the Kalahari).
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Sweety don't jump to conclusions. From my Somalid Eugenic POV Europids are as inferior as Negrids
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Somalid wrote: [QUOTE]Actually I'm incorrect and The Explorer is correct but have it your way. If as you say r1b1* is "europid" it renders your argument about "superior europid" genes absurd. R1b1* and E3a lived in very close proximity in Cameroon for eons. Yet it was not r1b1* that swept south and west across Africa subduing 2/3 of the continent: it was E3a.
Each genetic race is superior in certain aspects & overall superior in its own genetic nation...I consider the Negrid the Superior genotype in the Subsahran Jungles just as teh Europids are Superior in Europe & Somalids are the lords of the Sea.
I am disgusted by Negrids who want to claim that I am a Negrid
quote:All Humans primitive origin was a Negrid origin & before that the Primates. We evolved
Originally posted by T. Rex:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
[qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Apocalypse:
[qb]
Secondly, no one here is claiming that you are a "Negrid" (I presume you are referring to Africans with thick lips and wide noses). What we are saying is that your "Somalid" ancestors were dark-skinned, tropically adapted natives of Africa---in other words, black Africans.
quote:I don't live in sub-Saharan Africa, nor am I what you'd call a "Negrid". I'm what you would call a "Europid".
Continue your evolution in SubSahran Africa & leave me alone I don't want to do anything with your race!
quote:Is it any different from **your** wacky theories gringo?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^Lol @ this crackajack non African (European), trying to separate Africans from the outside, simply because he has a little African admixture, and so hence wants to downplay the Africanism of this admixture, what a complete joke.
Yonis, do you agree with this nonsense?
quote:Southern Europeans have a big % of Somalid & Arabid genes, Baltid Europeans have a big % of Mongolid genes. The rest of Demographic Europe is native Europid at large
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^Kid, Europeans are genetically Asian and post OOA African derived, get over it already.
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^Kid, Europeans are genetically Asian and post OOA Albino African derived, get over it already.
quote:^ you mean "modern Europids" are genetically hybrids. lol
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^Kid, Europeans are genetically Asian and post OOA African derived, get over it already.
quote:Yes they are native to Europe. But there are no genetic markers which arose in Europe, all haplogruops carried by Europeans, actually arose as derivatives of haplogroups which arose
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Southern Europeans have a big % of Somalid & Arabid genes, Baltid Europeans have a big % of Mongolid genes. The rest of Demographic Europe is native Europid at large
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^Kid, Europeans are genetically Asian and post OOA African derived, get over it already.
quote:If you disagree, then here are haplogroups as follows, feel free to name the non Asian and non African lineages. Feel free to name European specific underived lineages.....
Originally posted by akoben:
.....
quote:You're just like your faggoty friend argyle, talk a lot, but really don't say anything.
Originally posted by akoben:
quote:Personally, I know I am not a Europid
Originally posted by akoben:
Wow, I thought you said you understood OOA like no one else? Lol
And what does "native" mean here? Being born there or having lineages that arose there?
Are the modern Europeans that lived around 30kya "native" Europeans?
Are your Europid hybrids by 40kya or not? Does this makes them native or not?
Are the modern only after incoming Africans or before ap. 30kya?
When do "native" Europeans come into exsistence and when are they hybrid" and are the two related?
More pain gringo...ouch!
quote:Ahh of course, just as I thought...
Originally posted by akoben:
quote:...OUCH!
We understand what you said about Europid lineages being derived but your dates of admixture (hybridisation) and morphological differentiation as well as claims of modern versus an ancient Europid is what we would like an expert on OOA such as yourself to clear up for us. Well:
And what does "native" mean here? Being born there or having lineages that arose there?
Are the **modern** Europeans that lived around 30kya "native" Europeans?
Are your Europid **hybrids by 40kya** or not? Does this makes them native or not?
Are they "modern" only **after** your incoming Africans or before ap. 30kya?
When do "native" Europeans come into existence and **when are they hybrid** and are the two related?
quote:When your maternal forebears, in the near east and Europe, became vessels for E3b the split with E3a was relatively recent.
I only go by my Y-DNA that split from yours 20,000~30,000years ago. Continue your evolution in SubSahran Africa & leave me alone I don't want to do anything with your race!
quote:Listen Somalid I'm certainly a man. I'm assuming you are too. Let's not get into this type of thing.
Sweety don't jump to conclusions
quote:You seem to return regularly for this humiliation. Why?
Agreed, you are attempting to humiliate me by saying I am "Black" Negrid thats the greatest humiliation you can inflict on me
quote:Apocalypse so you are trying to offend me by homosexual insults lol!
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
How did you get your somalid genes? Did you inherit it from your dad or get it anally from your Somali lover? You disgusting bharty man.
!
quote:Your candor is admirable Rupaul. Unfortunately for you however you're both. You're a flaming fag by your own admission and as per Larry Angels your ancestors were what you call negrids.
FYI..If it was forced upon me I rather be a Flaming Fag than a Negrid !
quote:Huh funny. You don't seem to understand the diff between ethnic Somali & genetic Somalid do you?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^Meet your daddy kid, the Somali....
quote:Ahh but I do understand your quack logic, and it's indeed hilarious. Africans, as the man above are original E3b carriers who brought this lineage into Europe, that you proudly carry today.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Huh funny. You don't seem to understand the diff between ethnic Somali & genetic Somalid do you?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
^^Meet your daddy kid, the Somali....
If anything, by your logic, he is a Super Somalid..
quote:Why would he carry a downstream E1b1b lineage such as E-V13?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
but something in the somaly eyes remind me of cat stevens eyes you know the greek singer
i bet is e-v13
quote:Disregarding all the rest of your incoherent babbling.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i dont know it just my fealing i bet that that if would have done dna test he would be e3b
specificly v13
quote:I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and forgive you this time.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
misunderstanding english afcorse it my second language you stupit
i am arabian from oman what do you expect
quote:Please cite your reference of where E-M35* is found....
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
second m35* is found in europe check iberia
northen portugal and asturias in northen spain
do you understand even the root of all e3b is found in iberia
quote:False, what this actually means is people in southern Europe received their features from E1b1b Africans.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i know e-v13 is not found in africa
but e-v13 guys conected to e-v32 which the clade of the somalian in the picture so there could be some facial features which are alike
e3b1c1
quote:Brother don't even bother they are our genetic enemies you have to accept it.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
misunderstanding english afcorse it my second language you stupit
i am arabian from oman what do you expect
second m35* is found in europe check iberia
northen portugal and asturias in northen spain
do you understand even the root of all e3b is found in iberia
i know e-v13 is not found in africa
but e-v13 guys conected to e-v32 which the clade of the somalian in the picture so there could be some facial features which are alike
e3b1c1
quote:The Arabs didn't enslave East Africans?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am from the seafaring omani coastal population
as you said e3b always close to the sea
and sailing on ships is in our blood
and the most important not on slave ships like
e3a
regards e3b1c1
quote:Really. Where is the documentation of this event of Arabs coming to Somali state's doorstep, a government which had no thought or intention whatsoever of joining the Arab League prior to the event, to beg them to join?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
It was the arabs who came to the doorstep
quote:For one, from here:
Don't know where you got the preposterous idea that somalia wants to join the arab league to no avail?
quote:Same here, I read about Omani sailors at one point the practiculary had the best ships & crews in the Indian Ocean
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am from the seafaring omani coastal population
as you said e3b always close to the sea
and sailing on ships is in our blood
and the most important not on slave ships like
e3a
regards e3b1c1
quote:Its impossible to enslave a Somalid. East African Somalids sold Negrids to their slave trade partners in Arabia
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]The Arabs didn't enslave East Africans?
quote:Then confused crakazoid, consider yourself humiliated! You crakazoids carry "Negrid" markers in the form of "Negrid" L mtDNA markers, HLA markers, Benin haplotype, and surely, other atDNA markers.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Agreed, you are attempting to humiliate me by saying I am "Black" Negrid thats the greatest humiliation you can inflict on me
quote:According to whom?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
East African Somalids sold Negrids to their slave trade partners in Arabia
quote:You know M123 is the Mideastern version (I usually assume that any non-V13 Eastern variety came with muslims), the whole island was taken for a while. However, in general in classical times the western quarter of Sicily was Phoenician while the rest of Sicily was Greek.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
yes but m123 is higher in eastern sicily 7%
compared to western sicily 3%
but yes m123 could be pheonician in this island
we dont have to prove our selfs sea faring is in e3b blood no matter which subclade
regards e3b1c1
quote:Well, you did that yourself the moment you labeled markers "Negrid" and so forth. So you should be disgusted by yourself, for being a confused CrakaOreozoid mongrel.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I am disgusted by Negrids who want to claim that I am a Negrid
quote:Read what the city the twin cities of Zinj-Bar mean. Zinj means Negrid (not Somalid), the Arabic word for East African was the Greek word (Berber) or Habashat for the Semitic speaking East Africans.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:According to whom?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
East African Somalids sold Negrids to their slave trade partners in Arabia
quote:Please post your source for such ridiculous claims.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Read what the city the twin cities of Zinj-Bar mean. Zinj means Negrid (not Somalid),
quote:I learned about the split between Somalids & Negrids on DNA forums. I didn't label anybody Negrid, genticists labeled them & Negrids themselves insist on using that term interchangably with "BLACK" to describe their race!
Originally posted by The Explorer:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Well, you did that yourself the moment you labeled markers "Negrid" and so forth. So you should be disgusted by yourself, for being a confused CrakaOreozoid mongrel.
quote:If you had been left alone, you'll still be living in caves. Remember, agriculture and writing are all imports in Europe. None of it is an in loco development.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Continue your evolution in SubSahran Africa & leave me alone I don't want to do anything with your race!
quote:Name one.....? Geneticist that is.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I didn't label anybody Negrid, genticists labeled them
quote:This must be the stormfront "DNA" forum, I gather...or your godfather medi-crakazoid monks at dodona.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I learned about the split between Somalids & Negrids on DNA forums.
quote:Which geneticists in this day and age label genes "Negrid"? Name one.
I didn't label anybody Negrid, genticists labeled them & Negrids themselves
quote:I understand that asking an Arabic speaker to verify my claim is alot of work for you?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Please post your source for such ridiculous claims.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Read what the city the twin cities of Zinj-Bar mean. Zinj means Negrid (not Somalid),
I'll wait.
quote:No cracka, I want your source which says East Africans were not considered as Negroes, and that they also sold E1b1a carrying slaves; can you provide it?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:I understand that asking an Arabic speaker to verify my claim is alot of work for you?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Please post your source for such ridiculous claims.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Read what the city the twin cities of Zinj-Bar mean. Zinj means Negrid (not Somalid),
I'll wait.
So let me help you out, find an Arabic speaker ask him what Zinj'Bar means, he will tell you it means the the Port of the Negrids
quote:Dodona is a joke now huh, this is coming from a guy who was denying that R1b-P25 is R1b
Originally posted by The Explorer:
[QB] your godfather medi-crakazoid monks at dodona.
quote:You dimwitted quack, R1b is not R1*.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
this is coming from a guy who was denying that R1b-P25 is R1b
quote:dodona is more than a joke; it is the butt of jokes. I did tell you earlier to demonstrate how R1*-M173 is defined by the marker that defines R1b, and according to what primary source, but you cowered away, pretending to forget. Well, where is it?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Dodona is a joke now huh, this is coming from a guy who was denying that R1b-P25 is R1b
Just cause they don't buy into the "remmeber the time" theory
quote:Indeed, crakazoid was informed multiple times over about this no-brainer, but it never sank in.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
You dimwitted quack, R1b is not R1*.
R1* is found in Africa, R1* is not found in Europe.
quote:This sounds like a biography of a certain mr arteh more than anything, what's your point?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Really. Where is the documentation of this event of Arabs coming to Somali state's doorstep, a government which had no thought or intention whatsoever of joining the Arab League prior to the event, to beg them to join?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
It was the arabs who came to the doorstep
quote:For one, from here:
Don't know where you got the preposterous idea that somalia wants to join the arab league to no avail?
Mr. Arteh is acknowledged as one of the most outstanding advocates for the liberation of Africa. Africans from Djibouti, Mozambique, Angola, Namibia, Zimbabwe, South Africa, Eritrea, just to mention a few, remember him as a liberator. Acclaimed as the bridge between Africa and the Arab world, he is accredited for making the former Somalia part of the Arab world. He is remembered by Muslims all over the world for his remarkable contribution as a spokesman and secretary-general for the organization of Islamic Countries (OIC)...
Membership in the Arab League, 1974, this historic feat epitomizes his term as head of the Somali Foreign Service. Mr. Arteh is known to be the bridge of Afro-Arab relations. He is credited to have taken Somalia singly into the Arab league, a lifetime achievement. It was his personal friendship with the Arab leaders, in addition to the fact that Somalia has always been part of the Arab world that influenced them to accept Somalia as its newest member.
^Link
Also, guess what else it says...
Mr. Arteh fought hard to keep Arabic, English, and Italian languages as the media of instruction of the University and its faculties. It was, believed by many that the Somalization of the schools affected the standard of Education. In order to assess the situation, Mr. Arteh invited foreign groups to evaluate the standard of Education of Somali students, and expanded the academic program of the University.
Comments?
The topmost piece(s) seem to have some corroboration from another work...
While the second top piece seems to have corroboration in this...
Somalis speak Somali. Many people also speak Arabic, and educated Somalis usually speak either English or Italian as well. Swahili may also be spoken in coastal areas near Kenya...
Somali has adopted many Arabic words, both modern phrases to deal with modern institutions, such as government and finance, and older Arabic terms to discuss international trade and religion. Somali also contains old Qahtani words common to Cushitic and Semitic languages.
Somali had no written form until 1972, when a Somali script, based on the Roman alphabet, was adopted. Until that time, English and Italian served as the languages of government and education. This served to create an elite, since only a small proportion of Somali society who knew these colonial languages had access to government positions or the few managerial or technical jobs in private enterprise. The 1972 decision to introduce a Somali script fundamentally changed the situation. Somali officials were required to learn the script, and a countrywide literacy campaign was launched.
^Link
quote:Just admit that you didn't know what you were talking about instead of trying to circumnavigate your flawed statements and hide your apparent obliviousness. Advice to you is to not comment on issues you have no knowledge of.
Explorer wrote:
Last time I checked, the Somali state was begging the Arabs to be part of the Arab league, but to no avail.
quote:You just proved his point by posting that source, Mogadishu was one of the ports used by the Somali benadirs and Omanis to ship "Zanji slaves" into the arab world. And as for Ethiopia go look up the term "baria/barya" to get an understanding of where exactly in Ethiopia these slaves came from. There is even a river in the borders between southern sudan and southern ethiopia that is litteraly called "barya river" translates as "slave river".
Explorer wrote:
Slaves were usually brought from Mogadishu which was the centre from which slaves were supplied to Aden. On Ethiopian slaves a tax was imposed in Aden of 4 dinars, whilst on women slaves the tax was 2 ¼ dinars.
quote:Well he been hanging around too many Negrids
Originally posted by argyle104:
Grumman wrote:
"The Explorer", how did your mind get to this point?
quote:^It is called the Baros River-slave river. Though I do not think that any Sudanese Nilotic tribe is or has been enslaved by the Habash.
And as for Ethiopia go look up the term "baria/barya" to get an understanding of where exactly in Ethiopia these slaves came from. There is even a river in the borders between southern sudan and southern ethiopia that is litteraly called "barya river" translates as "slave river".
quote:No, not Nuer/dinka but Shanqella, konso, Mursi etc. The Amhara and Tigray used them as domestic slaves and they were the Abyssinan slaves that the Yemenites continuesly recieved. Menelik II's mother was one of these slaves.
Originally posted by sudaniya:
quote:^It is called the Baros River-slave river. Though I do not think that any Sudanese Nilotic tribe is or has been enslaved by the Habash.
And as for Ethiopia go look up the term "baria/barya" to get an understanding of where exactly in Ethiopia these slaves came from. There is even a river in the borders between southern sudan and southern ethiopia that is litteraly called "barya river" translates as "slave river".
The Nuer/Dinka have in the past quite impressively defended themselves against British enroachment.
quote:This is what I keep telling Jew boy.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Advice to you is to not comment on issues you have no knowledge of.
quote:I get the feeling that the somalid race may start experiencing negative growth rate.
but something in the somaly eyes remind me of cat stevens eyes...the greek
quote:E1b1b/E3b the sea faring haplogroup
Somalid-V13 wrote:
In Eastern Sicily most V13 were also Seafaring Greeks, While the West Sicilian E1b1b-M78, E1b1b-M123 were Phoenicians & Barbary Pirates were E1b1b-M81 mainly in the SW
Genoa in North Italy known for its maritime power is also a very high% E1b1b region near ~25% although its all the way in the Northwest of Italy, but its coastal
quote:As emphasized and cited accordingly. It's pretty self-explanatory.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:This sounds like a biography of a certain mr arteh more than anything, what's your point?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Really. Where is the documentation of this event of Arabs coming to Somali state's doorstep, a government which had no thought or intention whatsoever of joining the Arab League prior to the event, to beg them to join?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
It was the arabs who came to the doorstep
quote:For one, from here:
Don't know where you got the preposterous idea that somalia wants to join the arab league to no avail?
Mr. Arteh is acknowledged as one of the most outstanding advocates for the liberation of Africa. Africans from Djibouti, Mozambique, Angola, Namibia, Zimbabwe, South Africa, Eritrea, just to mention a few, remember him as a liberator. Acclaimed as the bridge between Africa and the Arab world, he is accredited for making the former Somalia part of the Arab world. He is remembered by Muslims all over the world for his remarkable contribution as a spokesman and secretary-general for the organization of Islamic Countries (OIC)...
Membership in the Arab League, 1974, this historic feat epitomizes his term as head of the Somali Foreign Service. Mr. Arteh is known to be the bridge of Afro-Arab relations. He is credited to have taken Somalia singly into the Arab league, a lifetime achievement. It was his personal friendship with the Arab leaders, in addition to the fact that Somalia has always been part of the Arab world that influenced them to accept Somalia as its newest member.
^Link
Also, guess what else it says...
Mr. Arteh fought hard to keep Arabic, English, and Italian languages as the media of instruction of the University and its faculties. It was, believed by many that the Somalization of the schools affected the standard of Education. In order to assess the situation, Mr. Arteh invited foreign groups to evaluate the standard of Education of Somali students, and expanded the academic program of the University.
Comments?
The topmost piece(s) seem to have some corroboration from another work...
While the second top piece seems to have corroboration in this...
Somalis speak Somali. Many people also speak Arabic, and educated Somalis usually speak either English or Italian as well. Swahili may also be spoken in coastal areas near Kenya...
Somali has adopted many Arabic words, both modern phrases to deal with modern institutions, such as government and finance, and older Arabic terms to discuss international trade and religion. Somali also contains old Qahtani words common to Cushitic and Semitic languages.
Somali had no written form until 1972, when a Somali script, based on the Roman alphabet, was adopted. Until that time, English and Italian served as the languages of government and education. This served to create an elite, since only a small proportion of Somali society who knew these colonial languages had access to government positions or the few managerial or technical jobs in private enterprise. The 1972 decision to introduce a Somali script fundamentally changed the situation. Somali officials were required to learn the script, and a countrywide literacy campaign was launched.
^Link [
quote:Save face from what; the facts I just cited, which you are not refuting, but rather just making noises?
It's always funny how you go to great length just so to save fave.
quote:You mean the fact of the matter that Somalia joined the Arab league on its own initiative, rather than Arabs coming to your doorsteps to beg you, as I have cited in not one but several different works? Why would would I need to admit something that is not obvious?
This is what you wrote
quote:Just admit that you didn't know what you were talking about instead of trying to circumnavigate your flawed statements and hide your apparent obliviousness. Advice to you is to not comment on issues you have no knowledge of.
Explorer wrote:
Last time I checked, the Somali state was begging the Arabs to be part of the Arab league, but to no avail.
quote:Thanks for lending further proof above that you do in fact know what I said was true, but that you are trying to put unpleasant facts that Somali is no less prone to adopt foreign languages, institutions than any other unnamed "the rest of" African countries that you singled out, under the rug. This is why instead of simply addressing and refuting the citations placed before you, you decided to take a whino's route, making flimsy charges that don't hold water.
Btw the latin script somalia uses today was introduced by siad barre in his socialist program during the 70's, it's certainly not the first script of somalia as your redicoulas sources says.
Somali has been written with four different scripts: an Arabic-based abjad known as Wadaad's writing, a Latin-based alphabet and two native alphabets, the Osmanya script and the Borama script.
Wadaad's writing (Arabic script)
The Arabic script was first introduced in the 13th century by Sheikh Yusuf al-Kowneyn to aid Koranic teaching. In the 19th century Sheikh Uways al-Barawi improved the writing of Somali with the Arabic script and based it on the Maay dialect of Southern Somalia. A Somali linguists, Muuse Xaaji Ismaaciil Galaal, radically altered the spelling conventions for Somali written with the Arabic script and introduced a set of new symbols for the vowels in the 1950s.
http://www.omniglot.com/writing/somali.htm
quote:Maybe I missed something here: how does the post from which you selectively took that extraction, which says "Abyssinian" Slaves [who were specifically singled out from other mentioned slaves] were taken into southern Arabia, prove your wop cousin's point? Elaborate, why the said Abysinians are not "Abyssinians" as the piece says they were, and that Bilal was not one of these "Abyssinians"?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:You just proved his point by posting that source
Explorer wrote:
Slaves were usually brought from Mogadishu which was the centre from which slaves were supplied to Aden. On Ethiopian slaves a tax was imposed in Aden of 4 dinars, whilst on women slaves the tax was 2 ¼ dinars.
quote:No, i'm not saying that real abyssinians/habesha were never slaves, infact they were, but as a result of war during the numerous medevil confrontations between the Horn muslim kingdoms of Ifat, Zeyla, Adal, Harar and Christian Abyssinnian state. These muslim enemies of Habesha were located in modern Northern Somalia, Eastern Ethiopia and Djibouti plus parts of modern Eritrea.
Explorer wrote:
Maybe I missed something here: how does the post from which you selectively took that extraction, which says "Abyssinian" Slaves [who weres specifically singled out from other mentioned slaves] were taken into southern Arabia, prove your wop cousin's point? Elaborate, why the said Abysinians are not "Abyssinians" as the piece says they were?
I'll deal with other clowns here, when I come back.
quote:Then that settles it; you were dead wrong to say I was proving the Sicilian clown's point, which was to say that populations in the African Horn have never been enslaved. The point of my post was to demonstrate the absurdity of this; cherry picking some trivial issue that has no bearing on this fact, does not in any way take away from the point of my posting it, which is what counts here, my friend.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
No, i'm not saying that real abyssinians/habesha were never slaves
quote:Many slaves in Western Africa and the Nile Valley were also generally drawn from captives of intra-regional conflicts. So what? It doesn't diminish the fact that they were slaves.
, infact they were, but as a result of war during the numerous medevil confrontations between the Horn muslim kingdoms of Ifat, Zeyla, Adal, Harar and Christian Abyssinnian state.
quote:A slave is a slave, whether savagely treated or less so; I don't see how that can be interpreted as a sign of respect.
These muslim enemies of Habesha were located in modern Northern Somalia, Eastern Ethiopia and Djibouti plus parts of modern Eritrea.
The Habesha/Abyssinian christian state in the highlands lost alot of men to the muslims in the lowland during these wars. Most of the war captives were shiped through the port of Zeyla in todays northern Somalia, and these Abyssinian captives were highly respected in the Middle east and through out the islamic world and coasted more than any other slaves, some even ruled muslim khalifates like Kafur did Egypt and Syria before the Fatimids grabed power after his death, and Malik Amber india.
quote:Apparently according to the post I cited, they were not rare. You disagree? Tell us where the citation went wrong, why so, and your evidence to the contrary.
However these Abyssinian slaves were only generated during war times and were rare in supply during most of the middle ages.
quote:Your flimsy point is dismissed, as it has no bearing on either anything I've said, or what that citation says. The task ahead of you, is to disprove what the citation says about "Abyssinian" slaves, which you haven't. Any thing less, is irrelevant. Trying to rationalize things in terms of "respected" and "not-so-respected" slaves, or "majority slaves in peace time" and "only slaves who were captivated in war" et al. has no bearing on the citation. Your point of interjecting and acting as a minion for the Sicilian clown, was to downplay the implications of the citations, which you have obviously miserably failed to do.
The overwhelming majority of the slaves during peace times were however supplied by the Habesha themselves and known as "Barya" locally, and almost all came from southeast and interior Ethiopia, although sometimes called Hapshis in the muslim world due to their location of origin and they being handed over by Habesha merchants they had really nothing to do with the Habesha ethnicity of northern Ethiopia and Eritrea. It's important not to confuse these two different entities, that was my point.
quote:And like yourself, they've failed miserably in that attempt. Your disarming by the citation I posted, which you could only cry about but do nothing to rectify it, speaks volumes about this reality. Of course, like any other quack, you are free to fantasize myths that you've generated in your head about the presumed dichotomy between E3a carriers and E3b carriers, which have all been swiftly dismantled here. In the meantime, as a treat...
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
what are they trying to prove e3b are not slaves
never were and never will be
quote:Says the newcomer white man's poodle. I don't have to prove jack to your ass, as anyone whose either been here long enough, or has the brain cell to skim through the archives, knows what I've done to white loons and psychos who come in here insulting Africans and Blacks...unlike you of course, who joins in with these crazies. You are understandably still trying to recover from the mirror of yourself I placed in front you, and still in the "mad" and "denial" phase; in time, you'll move onto to the "sad" phase and then the "acceptance", but it may take time. Healing begins with acknowledgement.
Originally posted by argyle104:
"The Explorer" only said that because he has been called out by me for being passive and docile against white trolls and attacking Africans with racialistic terms that would make some white bigots quezy.
Notice also how passive and docile he is with his insult to the non-African troll. "Crackizoid" vs refering to Africans as apes and slaves.
Why is it that he does not refer to whites as primates and slaves? Is he afraid? Is it a sense of inferiority to whites?
"The Explorer", how did your mind get to this point?
quote:You care, since its the admixture you so proudly carry, just remember its African admixture.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
who cares this africans made it to western asia during the meseolithic and you forget mtdna
which i share with caucasians
e3b1c1
quote:Meet your daddy....
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i gusse my ancestor was handsome thats why he have sucses in yeman and oman in arabia .
quote:Don't think on suicide bombing innocent people, and raping little boys as Arabs are known for.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
dont think on raping again another curecture in e3a nature who rape woman in tanzania .
quote:
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
e3b3 my clade wasnt found in the african american and not in euroipean american as the research that explorere brought
my clade will never be slave
e3b1c1
It will always be indicative of African admixture regardless of how much you try to save yourself or disconnect yourself from Africans.
quote:Don't you carry non African genetic lineages as well? Or do you think you're 100% African like the original E3b carriers were?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so how my look change spo much tell me
if my original e3b ancestor look like that
explain to me that will be intresting
quote:Of course the non African genetic markers you carry altered your appearance the original African E3b carriers went through thousands of years of mixing with Arab and European women of course this would dilute the lineage and appearance of the original carriers.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i dont think only mtdna and autosomal middle eastern genes could change your appearnce so much
e3b1c1
quote:Well kid, what you wish for, and what is actually fact, are two different things.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i think the original carries of e3b looked like egyption meaninag not that dark as the picture of the two guys above
quote:These lineages were originally brought north from sub Saharan Africa, and are also seen in its highest frequencies amongst sub Saharan Africans.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
you forget 7.9% e-m35* in berbers moroco
and was found in northen portugal and northen spain so the original e3b is also found in morroco and some places in iberia its not confined only to subsharan populations
quote:Are you slow? The little African admixture in these non Africans you mention does NOT make them all of a sudden black.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so what you defined me african ? black?
caucasians ? i wonder your answere will applied to all e3b in western asia balkan italy and iberia so think carfuly
e3b1c1
quote:Of course you're not, the point is that this haplogroup was originally carried by blacks, hence indicative of African admixture when seen in non Africans such as yourself.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
at least you admitt that they are not \black i apreciate it since all the e3a guys here say
all e3b in non africans are black
quote:Dinka, Neur have a high % of Prime Negrid genes. However, some of them are also Somalids
Originally posted by sudaniya:
[QB] Yonis:
How would that be possible? Considering that the man is a Nilotic.
The Luo/shilluck, Dinka and Nuer have NO close relations with 'Somalids', rather they are more closely related to each other.
The Anuak, Shilluck/Luo and many others are virtually the same people and congnated from Bahr el Ghazal, the Dinka heartland.
quote:So... to you, all African haplogroups are Negrid, but E3b a derivative of E (E which is negrid, since it's African), is somehow not African or Negrid, but instead is somehow Somalid?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Dinka, Neur have a high % of Prime Negrid genes. However, some of them are also Somalids
Originally posted by sudaniya:
[QB] Yonis:
How would that be possible? Considering that the man is a Nilotic.
The Luo/shilluck, Dinka and Nuer have NO close relations with 'Somalids', rather they are more closely related to each other.
The Anuak, Shilluck/Luo and many others are virtually the same people and congnated from Bahr el Ghazal, the Dinka heartland.
A (Y-DNA) is prime Negrid, not Somalid
Not all Dinka are A (Y-DNA)
quote:
“The presence of E-M78* Y chromosomes in the Balkans (two Albanians) , previously described virtually only in northeast Africa, upper Nile, gives rise to the question of what the original source of the E-M78 may have been. Correlations between human-occupation sites and radiocarbon-dated climatic fluctuations in the eastern Sahara and Nile Valley during the Holocene provide a framework for interpreting the main southeast European centric distribution of E-V13. A recent archaeological study reveals that during a desiccation period in North Africa, while the eastern Sahara was depopulated, a refugium existed on the border of present-day Sudan and Egypt, near Lake Nubia, until the onset of a humid phase around 8500 BC (radiocarbon-calibrated date). The rapid arrival of wet conditions during this Early Holocene period provided an impetus for population movement into habitat that was quickly settled afterwards. Hg E-M78* representatives, although rare overall, still occur in Egypt, which is a hub for the distribution of the various geographically localized M78-related sub-clades. The northward-moving rainfall belts during this period could have also spurred a rapid migration of Mesolithic foragers northwards in Africa, the Levant and ultimately onwards to Asia Minor and Europe, where they each eventually differentiated their regionally distinctive branches.”
quote:
Y-chromosomal evidence of the cultural diffusion of agriculture in southeast Europe.
Battaglia et al. Dipartimento di Genetica e Microbiologia, Università di Pavia, Pavia, Italy.
The debate concerning the mechanisms underlying the prehistoric spread of farming to Southeast Europe is framed around the opposing roles of population movement and cultural diffusion. To investigate the possible involvement of local people during the transition of agriculture in the Balkans, we analysed patterns of Y-chromosome diversity in 1206 subjects from 17 population samples, mainly from Southeast Europe. Evidence from three Y-chromosome lineages, I-M423, E-V13 and J-M241, make it possible to distinguish between Holocene Mesolithic forager and subsequent Neolithic range expansions from the eastern Sahara and the Near East, respectively. In particular, whereas the Balkan microsatellite variation associated to J-M241 correlates with the Neolithic period, those related to E-V13 and I-M423 Balkan Y chromosomes are consistent with a late Mesolithic time frame. In addition, the low frequency and variance associated to I-M423 and E-V13 in Anatolia and the Middle East, support an European Mesolithic origin of these two clades. Thus, these Balkan Mesolithic foragers with their own autochthonous genetic signatures, were destined to become the earliest to adopt farming, when it was subsequently introduced by a cadre of migrating farmers from the Near East. These initial local converted farmers became the principal agents spreading this economy using maritime leapfrog colonization strategies in the Adriatic and transmitting the Neolithic cultural package to other adjacent Mesolithic populations. The ensuing range expansions of E-V13 and I-M423 parallel in space and time the diffusion of Neolithic Impressed Ware, thereby supporting a case of cultural diffusion using genetic evidence. European Journal of Human Genetics advance online publication, 24 December 2008[/qb]
quote:You failed to see that African Americans do carry E3b, even if in low frequencies, which you denied elsewhere, and you failed to see that it destroys your myth about a so-called "slave marker" and that E3b is not one.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so in what i failed
quote:Your master "Yonis", was schooled here on everything he thinks he knows about genetics by myself and others, even though he has proven to be a slow learner, like yourself. Not sure how that helps your hopeless cause.
yonis show you e3b is common in coastal populations an among people as greeks pheonicains berber pirates it is conected to the sea
e3b1c1
quote:Uhh no, the study is stating that Africans migrated directly into Europe during the late Mesolithic, and a sub clade emerged from the E-M78* lineage in Europe.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
yes i know about the research of batgila
supports an european mesolithic origin of these two clades thats the quate so I-m423 and E-v13 is meseolithic european so it even more rrediculs that some people haere claim it african
while this reserach claim e-v13 originated in europe not even in western asia
quote:Errm, if it is a sub-clade of E3b, but of which arose in Europe, would it not then be European?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so what even if e-m78* wa sthe ancestor still e-v13 emerged in europe so e-v13 is not african
quote:As already noted, you do. If you didn't, you wouldn't be busy wasting your time on quack junk to dichotomize PN2 siblings E3a and E3b, whose very close phylogentic ties cannot be undone, no matter how many ways and times you try. Rather, you'd just accept your recent "Black African" ancestry. Remember, they don't call you folks "sand niggas" for nothing.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
who cares this africans
quote:Not that I give a hoot what ancestry you have, but I'm curious to know what mtDNA you are deeming here, of not being "negroid mtDNA L".
mtdna
which i share with caucasians not african e3a
members who have negroid mtdna L .
quote:Then I take that they also raped your Arabian females too, as E3a distribution is considerable in Oman.
dont think on raping again another curecture in e3a nature who rape woman in tanzania .
quote:Are you that obtuse?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
they dont have african ancestery since v13 is not african
quote:Like other clown quacks, he hopes that it pays for him to force himself to be obtuse about the reality of his Black African ancestry.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
Are you that obtuse?
quote:Which following your buffoonery, means that your fellow Omani are of slave ancestry.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
e3a is in nicer number in oman becuase of thge slave trade
quote:Do you know the difference between you being black yourself and you having black ancestry? You mean nothing, in the scheme of things, but your Black African ancestry does.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
I AM NOT BLACK
quote:If that were true, I wouldn't log off and on, to come and see you still here all day typing away, trying to dissociate yourself with your very very Black African ancestry.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
DONT HAVE TO DEAL WITH MODERN LIFE SUCH AS
UNIVERSITY AND GETTING A JOB
quote:Yeap, those that carry Benin haplotype HbS marker, E3a, E3b, A1, L mtDNA markers et al. have recent Black African ancestry.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
explorere so arabians many antolians and balkan people italian and iberians all of them has black ancestery acording to you ?
are you serious do you want them to get back to africa whats your purpose ?
e3b1c1
quote:Why; because they happen to have recent Black African ancestry? Using your rationale, everyone in the world might as well go back to Africa, where it all started, for modern humanity; are you nuts?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
and what do you want them to do to return to africa ?
e3b1c1
quote:Don't know, never took a ancestral genealogical test.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
mind over matter are yo also e3a guy
quote:Why would you think this?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i dont belive you are i think you maybe r1b
quote:Uh yea, and its proven genetically, anthropologically etc..
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
ps. explorere so arabians many antolians and balkan people italian and iberians all of them has black ancestery acording to you ?
quote:Nope, not convincing anyone, rather informing.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so whats your purpose what are you trying to achive in this site by convincing people who loook caucasian that they are black
quote:Certainly not when Africans were in Greece taking those women, of which now Greeks still carry this very same marker.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
go to greece tell them they are black i am sure they will kill tou
e3b1c1
quote:In these days, it's actually more scary to be an "Arab terrorist", which is pretty much all Arabs as far as paranoid "westerners" are concerned, than being Black. And like MindoverMatter noted, Africans took Greek females; why didn't they [Greek males] kill them right then and there?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am sure they will kill tou
e3b1c1
quote:Kid, no one is calling you black/African nothing, how many time must that be relayed to your terrorist ass?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
as i am balck
quote:Well hey, if your stupid diaper head interprets your Black African "ancestry" to mean that you are "Black" too, then knock yourself out. I won't stand in your way.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
as i am balck acording to your stupit head
people tell me that in this forum there are stupit negros e3a but i didnt listen to them
gusse they were right
call me black
an african but i will never be slave lioke e3a
e3b1c1
quote:Damn these stupid Negroes for schooling you; huh?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
people tell me that in this forum there are stupit negros
quote:That somewhere in the past, Africans carrying E3b came and inseminated your Arab female ancestors.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
if you tell me that ihave black ancestery and african linage than what shopuld i understand from that ?
quote:Doesn't matter what numbers there are in the AA sample; the point is E3b is implicated, as other markers were. So, using your buffoonery back at you, this would implicate "E3b" as a slave marker. If you weren't such a clown, you'd realize that this is only a sample, it is not an entire population. It only captures a snapshot of a small section of a larger population. Further more, you never addressed these slaves, going on several days and several pages later...
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
2% to low to call e3b a slave
58% very high defently the slave haplogroup
quote:Well, I wouldn't, if you can prove that I'm one. First, where have you met me in person, to come to that conclusion? I'm not ashamed that Omani are also slave descendant, as per your own logic; are you?
ps. dont be a shame to be slave
quote:Indeed; your boney desert hoping ass would not have stood a chance; but I suspect your Black ancestor would have qualified. No?
the west africans e3a were strong thats why the europeans took them to work in the farms and to whip them
regards e3b1c1
quote:What differences are there?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
but do you think that ther is no diffrence between africans who carry e3a and africans who carry e3b
quote:Of course your Black African ancestor would most likely have qualified, because well, he was a Black man. You skinny towel heads are a far cry from that.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
he will never stood a chance becauser
quote:If that were true, you wouldn't have seen E3b in AA sample and you'd be refuting the post about Abyssinian and eastern African slaves, but you aren't. Why?
he is e3b the haplogroup who didint experience slavery
quote:Exactly. Which means anything you profess to know about me amounts to nothing more than a total lie; back here, we call it horse shyt. In your homeland, they'll probably call it camel shyt.
i never met you in person
quote:So? E3b ancestry is also African. So is Hgs A, B, C, F, R1*, E, et al.
but you talled me you are african
quote:You admit that you are a lying clown; you admit that you go by no facts, other than flimsy guesswork based on buffoonery rationalization.
you live in africa you talled me you are black so i gusse you are e3a and if you are indid than you are a slave genetically
e3b1c1
quote:But it happened to you, forcing you to write in caps. Your own buffoonery criteria where used against you, and even then, your flimsy posts failed to stand. Examples? You tried to dichotomize E3b and E3a in terms of region, which failed the test, as it turns out that there are even some E3b subclades that are predominant in western African than east Africa.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
nothing happen to him
quote:If that were true, I'd be reduced to a whino like you, resorting to nagging in caps and throwing racial pejoratives around proactively, rather than swiftly dismantling your flimsy posts. But as you can see, I'm the one doing the wholesale refuting here. In other words, I act like a man; few whining, and more action.
he know i am right in many subjects
and he know deep in his hourt
quote:You might learn to be a real man, instead of an unwanted whining bitch, reduced to simply nagging about certain posters, but never ever being able to actually refute or challenge them on anything. When was the last time, you actually addressed anything I've said, instead of chasing me around like a bitch slobbering after dick?
Originally posted by craka coon buckwheat:
Isn't it amazing how docile and passive "The Explorer" aka "Ausarian" aka "Supercar" aka "Ma Dick" is to this troll. Little to no racial insults unlike those he hurls at Africans. And the only reason he did use them is because e3b1c1 exposed "The Explorer" as a slave.
Notice also that this is the same way that "The Explorer" talks about Africans. Go look up Ausarian's aka "The Explorer" more recent postings. Another thing that is observable is that "The Explorer" seems to accept and believe that Africans are slaves.
"The Explorer", what in hell happened to your mind?
quote:The Greek V13 that ran the first Marathon was a Somalid Greek, nothing else.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so what even if e-m78* wa sthe ancestor still e-v13 emerged in europe so e-v13 is not african
even though m78*is the v13 clade isnt
the fact that it emerged in europe or western asia make it non african
e3b1c1
quote:It would be interesting to know the origin of the 2% E1b1b sub-clade found in African-americans, if it's of the southern European variety then it can be dismissed as recent admixture (but they are still somalids ofcourse, through proxy) but if it's of the African variety then we could conclude that it's original and arrived with the trans-atlantic horror. Do you have any further information of these Somalid clades found among AA's other than just being E1b1b?
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:And like yourself, they've failed miserably in that attempt. Your disarming by the citation I posted, which you could only cry about but do nothing to rectify it, speaks volumes about this reality. Of course, like any other quack, you are free to fantasize myths that you've generated in your head about the presumed dichotomy between E3a carriers and E3b carriers, which have all been swiftly dismantled here. In the meantime, as a treat...
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
what are they trying to prove e3b are not slaves
never were and never will be
On that note, the frequencies of AA lineages are as follows:
Hg A1 ~ .01%
Hg B* ~ .01%
Hg B2a ~ .01%
Hg E1 ~ .03%
Hg E2 ~ .03%
Hg E3a ~ .58%
Hg E3b ~ .02%
Hg G ~ .01%
Hg I ~ .04%
Hg R (xR1a, R1b) ~ .03%
Hg R1b ~ .23%
Black American NRY and mtDNA
quote:Which "ancient Egyptian" have you tested positive for this marker?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
some of the ancient egyptions
who had civilization carry m34
quote:
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Given that E3b is accompanied by other typical African markers, it is pretty safe to say that E3b came along with these lineages. Of course, you wish to see it as anomaly where none exists, with flimsy reasoning, because doesn't agree with your crackpot political views. E3b is by no means foreign in western Africa, northern, central or southern Africa; so, why can't it come straight from Africa, like all the other African lineages implicated along with E3b above, but which you haven't questioned?
quote:If I had one, which I don't, it'd be a quack...like you. You however seem to have a problem: formulating a coherent thought.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
WTF? What's your problem
quote:You are confused. Refuting and challenging you to prove your crackpot politics is offensive stance, not the whining and bitching stance that you are adopting right now, instead of producing results. Real men take "action", not bitch and moan like you do.
, why are you so god damn defensive all the time??
quote:Why is it legitimate? Did you ask similar questions about the other accompanying typical African markers? Did you not see the other typical African markers represented? Are AA not drawn from Africa? If your answers to the last few questions is "Yes", then why are you too intellectually challenged to grasp that E3b also comes from Africa, and hence, not an anomaly to find it in AAs?
I asked you a legitimate question
quote:E3b is not that high in European populations to begin with. Europeans don't carry the other typical African markers to any considerable degree either. Your question is about as valid as those "flat earth" cultists who question whether the world is round, and ask if it is valid to do so.
since AA's have higher frequency of European lineage than they do african lineage other than E1b1a according to the data you presented, which makes my question very valid.
quote:You do, but it's okay to play dumb...alright; you don't play dumb, you are dumb.
So i don't know what you mean with crackpot political views?
quote:Like your mysterious "somalid" clowns that are across all the globe?
I have no political views, i just try to see things as objectve as possibble.
quote:Word: Well, apparently E-M81 is typically western African and found frequently in Tamazight speaking groups; but do you have an actual study on "medieval" Iberian specimens. We know at least one study has done just that, and this is what was found...
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
yes and who were the moors what markers did theyu carry if not m81 and m35* again a prove that e3b is masters and warriors by blood they slaved the r1b guys alspo many barbay pirates who slaved many europeans were m81 another prove that m81 is not slave in his nature the oposite is the case he slaved other haplogroups like r1b
i am not upset of being m34 becuse even though its african in its not slavish like e3a
e3b1c1
quote:Indeed. It goes with the territory.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i dont know what it mean
quote:It is common in western Africa, much more so than it is in eastern Africa. Unless you are prepared to demonstrate to the contrary, you are hyper delusional to think that this is an "impression" rather than fact. BTW, where is Mauritania, Mali or Niger? Are these not western African countries?
but you need to understand that by clasifying m81 as western african and not north west african like it realy is than you crteat the impresion that m81 is common in the west
quote:Good start. Now answer this:
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
afcorse mauritania mali and niger are west african
quote:1)What objective quantifiers are you going by to make that judgment, aside from wishful-thinking politics?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
io answere question 2
north west africa start in the northen morroco close to gibraltar and ends in southern muaritania in her border
thats north west
quote:E1b1b peaks in the extreme NW of Africa, not "West Africa"!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
afcorse mauritania mali and niger are west african but you didnt tell me the frequencies of m81 in them do you ?
quote:Lol @ this nutty crakazid wop. You cite a basic outline of Africa in a map, and you still managed to get the geography wrong. Kingerdarteners can likely do better. And then you have this crakazid-worshiping rug head clapping after you like a child just given a candy. Hey, e3b1c1, how about you loose the tampons and grow some balls.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b peaks in the extreme NW of Africa, not "West Africa"!
E1b1b
quote:Did your white master take you for your walk today e3b1c1? You servile boot-licking dog. You're the very definition of a slave my friend. You're so inferior and broken as a man that you wet your panties when you look into "Cat Stevens eyes". Why would any man know or care what Cat Stevens's eyes look like you pathetic little dog. Do you remember Abu Ghraib boot-licker?
blacks are more fast in runnig more strong
in body built and more giftedd in any sports
and also music
but white people are more handsome and more smart blacks are ugly i am hansome how can i be black you stupit e3a slave
e3b1c1
quote:Lets see the Typical African markers
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Given that E3b is accompanied by other typical African markers
quote:That's correct that's why East Africans Blacks, especially Kenyans and Ethiopians, as well as Moroccans, dominate marathon races and Blacks in the Western Hemisphere dominate heats. Our Father E must have been quite a guy
blacks are more fast in runnig more strong
in body built and more giftedd in any sports
and also music
quote:I wouldn't say anyone freely typing on their keyboard poking fun at some illiterate Arab wacko from the radical fringe can by definition be considered a "slave"....
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
[QB] call me dog anything you want but at least i am not slave
quote:Funny coming from someone who can't spell "i.n.f.e.r.i.o.r"..
and thats what makes you inferrriour
quote:A camel piss drinking illiterate?
as oposed to me
quote:Because of African influence, input, and ancestry.. Not because said haplogroup is "caucasian" (whatever that means)...
buttom line m78 m123 m81 all the major clades
who found in caucasians
quote:How CAN a segment of DNA be subjected to physical slavery? Your words are nonsensical. e1b1b was never a slave? Is he some mythical founder of the supreme Somalid race?
are not slaves
loser..quote:I believe what mystery solver posted indicated that it was...
and they werent found in african american
quote:
A camel piss drinking illiterate?
quote:Sifting through your gibberish is becoming annoying.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
why should i get out
quote:Are you slow?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am more closer to the egyptions than you are
quote:
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E1b1a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E1b1b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
All Africans sharing this common ancestor split about 25kya, which is way after the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa.
Whereas, the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa over 60-80 thousand years ago.
Therefore; all non Africans (Europeans near easterners etc..) are extremely far, genetically speaking, from both E1b1a and E1b1b carriers.
Africans carrying E1b1b and E1b1a, are genetically related to eachother, before any other haplogroup, especially a non African lineage.
Unless those said non Africans, carry one of these African lineages; E1b1b or E1b1a.
The only thing that unites any non African to these Africans is the fact that they are carrying an African lineage.
I challenge you to show me another lineage that is closer to this lineage(E), and diverged as recently as E1b1a and E1b1b did?
quote:Sorry clown, but I have nothing to do with what any one else said.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
...
quote:
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Sifting through your gibberish is becoming annoying.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
why should i get out
Go take an English class, as well as genetics because you severely lack understanding in both.
quote:Are you slow?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i am more closer to the egyptions than you are
The only thing that unites you to these Africans is the fact that you are carrying an African lineage.
A man like this Somali below mixed with your Arab ancestors to give you the E3B derivative today that you so proudly carry, get over it kid.
quote:
This underscores the common root of PN2 clade Y chromosome as shown....
E1b1a --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M2, P1
and...
E1b1b --- SRV10831.1, M42, M94, M139, M168, P9, M145, M213, Yap, SRY4064, M96, P29, P2, DYS391p, M35
All Africans sharing this common ancestor split about 25kya, which is way after the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa.
Whereas, the ancestors of all non Africans left Africa over 60-80 thousand years ago.
Therefore; all non Africans (Europeans near easterners etc..) are extremely far, genetically speaking, from both E1b1a and E1b1b carriers.
Africans carrying E1b1b and E1b1a, are genetically related to eachother, before any other haplogroup, especially a non African lineage.
Unless those said non Africans, carry one of these African lineages; E1b1b or E1b1a.
The only thing that unites any non African to these Africans is the fact that they are carrying an African lineage.
I challenge you to show me another lineage that is closer to this lineage(E), and diverged as recently as E1b1a and E1b1b did?
quote:It's actually about 25,000 years ago, and when Africans migrated into the near east carrying E3b to become your ancestor, it was during the early Mesolithic about 20,000 years ago, so the split was fairly recent.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
do you think 30,000 years is recently
are you mad
e3b1c1
quote:Ok? They also migrated into the middle east 20,000 years ago and were/are still African so what's your point?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
its still very far back in time 25,000 years isa long time seriously
quote:All of you carry lineages that descend from Africans whom resembled that man, get over it kid.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
ps. the man in the picture is somalian they belong to e3b1 the europeans are more closer to him than i do i belong to e3b3 and the iberians who belong to e3b2 are not the same as this guy thats why i think calling e3b somalian is stupit because e3b2 and e3b3 are not somalians e3b1c1
quote:Okay. Who am I to argue?
yes but easten african ethiopian cant win in short distance and a western african slaves
cant win a marathon you only prove again that e3a
and e3b are diffrent race
e3b is fitt yo the long distance not like e3a
they are diffrent races
quote:Right.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Ok? They also migrated into the middle east 20,000 years ago and were/are still African so what's your point?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
its still very far back in time 25,000 years isa long time seriously
Like I also told you before, genetics do not equal race, I implore you to go and take a basic genetic class if possible.
quote:Look at this moronic wop, bypassing cited African markers, and going onto cite one western Eurasian, and a "sub-Saharan" African marker.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Lets see the Typical African markers
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Given that E3b is accompanied by other typical African markers
4% I
2% E1b1b
quote:Naw, you are much more than just a slave; you are a servile sissy rug head. Your inability to formulate an answer is a good sign of this.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
call me dog anything you want but at least i am not slave and thats what makes you inferrriour
as oposed to me
quote:You have some nerve diaperhead...
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
ps. you didnt answere about the frequencies you think people who read this thread cant see it that you run form the answere
quote:Well, a burqa pussy is entitled to opinion; doesn't make it any less next to meaningless.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i think sissy is better than a slave
my opinion
quote:Arguing with you is like trying to dip water with swiss cheese. You don't retain logic very well. By posting Paul Tergat's photo I was merely being ironic - in response to your claim that East African marathon winners are, ipso facto, e3b somalids.
so apocalypse does paul tergat belong to e3a ?
how do you know ?
quote:E1b1b & E1b1a split 30,000years ago thats the date of the last share mutation.
Originally posted by Freehand:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[qb] [QUOTE]
E1b1a&E1b1b are probably under 10k years apart in terms of split from E1b1*
quote:How when most never left Africa and most were never slaves..? You're talking about every single person who exists now or who has ever exited who possess/possessed this haplogroup. You are nonsensical.. You two are truly brain dead. Never seen anyone on this website perceived to be as dumb as you too.....
E1b1a is confined to Subsaharan Africa they left as Slaves.
quote:And? No one disputed this.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b & E1b1a split 30,000years ago thats the date of the last share mutation.
quote:That's an utterly obvious and unsophisticated lie. Besides the fact that they couldn't have been "confined there" since it's found elsewhere:
E1b1a is confined to Subsaharan Africa they left as Slaves.
quote:- Alicia Cadenaz 2007
"Distribution of E3b1-M35 derivatives
The presence of signature
sub-Saharan African mtDNA lineages in the south Arabian populations has been
attributed to various waves of gene flow to the region, including that
associated with the East African slave trade. This is apparent from the exact
mtDNA haplotype matches between lineages in Yemen and East Africa, including
those associated with the Bantu expansion. The presence of the E3a-M2 lineage
in Oman (7.4%),4 Yemen (3.2%), UAE (5.5%) and Qatar (2.8%) could lead to the
oversimplified conclusion that these chromosomes are also a contribution from
the East African slave trade. Mitochondrial DNA analysis of the Yemen Hadramawt
indicates recent gene flow (2500 yBP) from Africa to the Arab populations in
part through the slave trade, yet an ancient arrival from East Africa is
responsible for the ***Y-chromosome*** haplotypes."
quote:No need to frown, facts are facts.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:I really (and when I say this I mean **reallyy**) don't give a **** about IQ but I am curious as to what I could have said that would entail a lack of comprehension of something on my part.
How deep your IQ can be to not understand simple facts
quote:Its called Arab slave trade
Originally posted by Freehand:
[QB]quote:
The presence of the E3a-M2 lineage
in Oman (7.4%),4 Yemen (3.2%), UAE (5.5%) and Qatar (2.8%) could lead to the
oversimplified conclusion that these chromosomes are also a contribution from
the East African slave trade.
quote:The missing link is your brain.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
pn2 clade the missing link
quote:Quack science contradicts itself. The irony here, is that the crakazid wop "Somalid_V13" and crakazid-worshiping puppy "e3b1c1" tacitly admit that "their" people must also be slaves, as they carry the same markers as both E3a and E3b bearers . Italy has E3b, Benin haplotype HbS, L mtDNA, sub-Saharan HLA et al. markers, and Oman also has these markers, including E3a.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:How when most never left Africa and most were never slaves..?
E1b1a is confined to Subsaharan Africa they left as Slaves.
quote:Not that it's important, but I question it. What is the primary source for this claim?
Originally posted by Freehand:
quote:And? No one disputed this.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b & E1b1a split 30,000years ago thats the date of the last share mutation.
quote:Good observation.
quote:That's an utterly obvious and unsophisticated lie. Besides the fact that they couldn't have been "confined there" since it's found elsewhere:
E1b1a is confined to Subsaharan Africa they left as Slaves.
quote:- Alicia Cadenaz 2007
"Distribution of E3b1-M35 derivatives
The presence of signature
sub-Saharan African mtDNA lineages in the south Arabian populations has been
attributed to various waves of gene flow to the region, including that
associated with the East African slave trade. This is apparent from the exact
mtDNA haplotype matches between lineages in Yemen and East Africa, including
those associated with the Bantu expansion. The presence of the E3a-M2 lineage
in Oman (7.4%),4 Yemen (3.2%), UAE (5.5%) and Qatar (2.8%) could lead to the
oversimplified conclusion that these chromosomes are also a contribution from
the East African slave trade. Mitochondrial DNA analysis of the Yemen Hadramawt
indicates recent gene flow (2500 yBP) from Africa to the Arab populations in
part through the slave trade, yet an ancient arrival from East Africa is
responsible for the ***Y-chromosome*** haplotypes."
quote:Jesus on a Christ
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Meanwhile...
To some's consternation, there's no question about it; E-M81 is predominantly west African in distribution.
quote:Even Jesus can't save you from your African ancestry
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Jesus on a Christ
quote:...whose lineages you carry, who focked your mama in every angle, to produce a hopelessly confused and intellectually stunted mongrel of a wop that you are.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
hopelessly delusional & intellectually inferior Negrids
quote:E1b1b M215 mutation = highly evolved progressive Somalid.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:...whose lineages you carry, who focked your mama in every angle, to produce a hopelessly confused and intellectually stunted mongrel of a wop that you are.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
hopelessly delusional & intellectually inferior Negrids
quote:
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
No one denied the fact that M81 is the NW clade that evolved recently its even more distant from the E1b1a Negrids
@ this hypocritical self-confused wop. You are in fact denying what was just said, by trying to rationalize this into a fake dichotomy of "NW" [Northwestern] vs. plainly "western Africa", and in fact, the post was intended for your clown crakazid-worshiping partner "e3b1c1", whom like yourself just now, tried to fictitiously chop western African into erratic geographical entities, so that he can make himself feel better by lying to himself, and saying that it isn't "western African", but "northwest" African. Meanwhile, he fails to define where North starts and ends in western Africa and presumably on what geographic quantifiers.quote:This is just about a real a concept as the "flat earth" theory, Snow white, Goldilocks & the bears and UFO landings.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b M215 mutation = highly evolved progressive Somalid.
quote:Which would make you part of this "inferior Negrid" family. In fact, if you weren't such a freaking dunce, you'd realize that ca. 99.99%, if not little over, genes that you carry are of sub-Saharan African provenance. In other words, the only way for you to strip yourself off of "Negrid" ancestry, is to stop being a human being. In your case, you might qualify; evolution hasn't progressed you enough.
All Humans carry the Negrid mutation.
quote:Which is why you call it after sub-Saharan folks, namely the Somalis? Is it safe to say that you are too dumb and blind to see that a number posts render you a total idiot for saying that E-M215 is absent in sub-Saharan Africa, where it is supposed have originated? I think it is safe say so. Where did you learn these fairy tale bed time stories; dodona perhaps?
-In my case its M215 which happens to be absent in the Subsahran Negrid that developed his own Subsharan mutations-
quote:Of course it's your fault; you are too obtuse to absorb simple genetics. You confuse relating and schooling your sorry ass with your teachers being not happy with themselves. No? Well, demonstrate that the facts related to you are not so, with primary evidence, and why teaching you facts means that the purveyor of such are not happy with themselves. If I'm relating facts, and you are unable to refute them, but whine and curse like a little bitch, how does that make me the one unhappy with myself, as opposed to you; prey tell?
30,000yrs later & you are not happy with the mutations your ancestors gave you..how is that my fault
quote:^^LOL.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b M215 mutation = highly evolved progressive Somalid.
All Humans carry the Negrid mutation. However, each race perfected itself by adding their own mutation. -In my case its M215 which happens to be absent in the Subsahran Negrid that developed his own Subsharan mutations-
30,000yrs later & you are not happy with the mutations your ancestors gave you..how is that my fault
quote:^It's obvious why this makes them fall apart.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Meanwhile...
To some's consternation, there's no question about it; E-M81 is predominantly west African in distribution.
They think rather counterintuitively of Western Africa not as a reference to direction and the continent Africa but as a discrete region, a "negro reservation". Ideologically and psychologically any people with connections to Middle Passage Africans of the Diaspora are negroes and psychologically for them, negroes just can't possess anything that they value. For us to "dis-obey" their retarded logic, this upsets them, which is why they wet their panties and cry to whiteJesus.quote:Actually, I've never gotten that date [30 kya] from a good source. I've only read it in wiki pedia, (surprise surprise it's probably the only source they've got) and it's actually referenced as the upper limit for when E1b1a derived there. The range is 30-20 kya, and my guess is E1b1a derived towards the more recent end of it.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Not that it's important, but I question it. What is the primary source for this claim?
Originally posted by Freehand:
quote:And? No one disputed this.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
E1b1b & E1b1a split 30,000years ago thats the date of the last share mutation.
quote:The audacity ... why this kid (who seems to feign being foreign and ignorant of the modern English language and who is probably doing it to mask the fact he's some big dufus American flunky or something) thinks i'd even consider one of his "stories" ... isn't really beyond me, actually.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Negrids were transfered by Somalid Ships
. You wish you could do this.
:
quote:Well, an imaginary mind takes imaginary boundaries literally.
Originally posted by Freehand:
Many people really just don't seem care about imaginary borders.
quote:thanx
Originally posted by KING:
Freehand
What you have posted has trumped all the posts of these two somalid warriors.
Peace
quote:I like that, "imaginary mind"
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Well, an **imaginary mind** takes imaginary boundaries literally.
Originally posted by Freehand:
Many people really just don't seem care about imaginary borders.
quote:Upper Egyptians LMFAO!
Originally posted by Freehand:
As far North as possible of the transition line, bad news for Slavid V 13
Upper Egypt
Don't even get me started on Sudan.
quote:No man it doesn't mean you are "Somali", Just like Mongolid doesn't mean you are Mongolian!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i like you man but stop calling e1b1b1 somalid
i already talled you m81 is north west african
and m34 my clade is ethiopian
m78 is somalian not m81 and m34
i am proud to be ethiopian send ethiopian to the moon he will still be ethiopian
the smae example you gave about the somalian who was sent to the moon
regards e3b1c1
)
quote:Damn, how'dja guess I was yo daddeh?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
ancestor
quote:Brace.
The surprise is that the Neolithic peoples of Europe and their Bronze Age successors are not closely related to the modern inhabitants although the prehistoric/modern ties are somewhat more apparent in southern Europe. It is a further surprise that the Epipalaeolithic Natufian of Israel from whom the Neolithic realm was assumed to arise has a clear link to sub-Saharan Africa."
quote:Keep in mind 30,000 years ago; Arabids, Europids & Mongolids still didn't exist because they were still trying to evolve out of the Negrid race
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
do you think 30,000 years is recently
are you mad
e3b1c1
quote:Yes E3b1c thats subclade identification
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
yeh but how does m34 is 13% in ethiopia its common mainly in amhara group
i can accept this term since m34 my clade is common in ethiopia so i am ethiopid thats my race
m34 was also found in arabia and antolia
sicily and cyprus in the mediterreanean
all those people are ethiopid by race since m34 is ethiopid just like m78 is somalid and m81
is berber
e3b1c1
quote:Agreed I just don't think of Genetic Nationalism as blind pride. I think of it as a necessity for better future evoltuion.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
yeh they were basicly chasing tigers in the jungle they never has the guts to take ship and sale and contribute something to this world
almost all the meditereanean civilization
greeks romans pheonicians carthegenians moors
all of them are e3b its not a couincedence
e3b=civilization
regards e3b1c1
quote:Agreed I consider them as Negrids up until 30KYA from that point on climate changed drastically forcing the various mutations.
Originally posted by Freehand:
FYI, 30 kya the first Eurasians had already been in "Eurasia" for about 30,000 years ... and were still Africoid.
quote:^that's nice.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Nordicists (or Supremicsts in general) favor the term Pre-Europid or Caucasoid because it sounds less haunting
quote:She actually is very attractive. Thxs. Maybe you're not a homosexual afterall.
Dear Negrid,
This is your race
Beautiful Negrid Lady
quote:Yes e3b1c1 I do find her very attractive. I wouldn't mind looking into those eyes of hers tonight.
apocalypse does she realy very atractive in your eyes
a girl like her would be perfect for the atlantic slave trade nice black bitch
who can work in the farm
you just prove that negroid is atracted to negroid
quote:To each his own I say. This one's for you.
but something in the somaly eyes remind me of cat stevens eyes you know the greek singer
quote:Naturally every race is beautiful in its own way
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
apocalypse does she realy very atractive in your eyes
a girl like her would be perfect for the atlantic slave trade nice black bitch
who can work in the farm
you just prove that negroid is atracted to negroid
e3b1c1
quote:Of course not since E is a product of the Y-Chromosome, and females do not inherit it! LOL, you are so ridiculously unread in genetics/biology that I haven't the slightest clue why you even get a response other than for purposes of entertainment. Your intelligence is missing.. Go find it.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
but how would you know your female is e1b1b1
descendents i already told you most in your area are r1b and haplogroup I and in middle east in my
area are haplogroup j so most of the chace the white bitch i will score will not be e1b1b1
how can i know if she is descendents of somalian race
regards e3b1c1
quote:e3b1c1, there's some mix-up here. Somebody done lied to you and told you that you ain't a faggot cause he's got CAT in his name. That's just wrong!
at least he is nt negroid as this lady
i could never put him to work in the farm is a
greek v13 in his nature he isnt a slave like that bitch
ps. i am not homosexual but is much more handsome that that black bitch
quote:If you can find an M1 mtDNA you are on the right track, if not then make sure your not mating with a female outside of L3 mtDNA (Ethiopian lineage that gave origin to all Non-Subsahran maternal lineages)
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
but how would you know your female is she is Somalid e3b1c1
quote:Kinky little son of a gun. You like Cat Stevens to discipline you huh? So he makes you wear the little doggie chain around your neck like in Abu Ghraib and make you bark like a bad little doggie?
whats wrong i like the white buity and this man even though is a man is still more handsome than that bitch dont get me wrong i could take her
to a basment of slaves and discplaine her
that would be easy since she is slave in her nature as oposed to cat stevens which isnt .
sunjata yes i knowshe inhaerit mtdna and not ydna but count on me i can recognize a e3b descendents when i see one even if its a female
e3b1c1
quote:Lol! I'm just playing with e3c1b1. He's so feeble minded that I can't possibly take him too seriously. His fantasies of black slaves in the basement not withstanding. I do think he's got a lil sugar in the tank though. Any man who boasts openly about staring into some dude's eyes ain't no way he likes women.
^^Good one, a lot of Arab chics are shy at first but it don't last long (my experience). I bet they put all those clothes back on incase run into E3bcbcbb's or the like!!
quote:Yes a gift from your post OOA recent African ancestor...
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
no it just mean that i got a guift from god that i could identify mameber from my e1b1b1
quote:Cat Stevens ancestors know a lil about slavery..
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
dont get me wrong i could take her
to a basment of slaves and discplaine her
that would be easy since she is slave in her nature as oposed to cat stevens which isnt .
quote:
http://www.crystalinks.com/greekslavery.html
Slavery played a major role in ancient Greek civilization. Slaves could be found everywhere. They worked not only as domestic servants, but as factory workers, shopkeepers, mineworkers, farm workers and as ship's crewmembers.
There may have been as many, if not more, slaves than free people in ancient Greece. It is difficult for historians to determine exactly how many slaves there were during these times, because many did not appear any different from the poorer Greek citizens.
There were many different ways in which a person could have become a slave in ancient Greece. They might have been born into slavery as the child of a slave.
They might have been taken prisoner if their city was attacked in one of the many battles which took place during these times. They might have been exposed as an infant, meaning the parents abandoned their newborn baby upon a hillside or at the gates of the city to die or be claimed by a passerby.
This method was not uncommon in ancient Greece. Another possible way in which one might have become a slave was if a family needed money, they might sell one of the children into slavery.
Usually it was a daughter because the male children were much needed to help out with the chores or the farm. Kidnapping was another fairly common way in which one could have been sold into slavery.
quote:Must be them spagetti-sipping wop thing. Another crazy ass crakazombie wop made the same rationalization. Confusing male sex chromosome into something that them females supposedly carry. Confused crakazombie wops like to talk how uncivilized others are, and yet they cannot even distinguish between a male and a female.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Of course not since E is a product of the Y-Chromosome, and females do not inherit it!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
but how would you know your female is e1b1b1
descendents i already told you most in your area are r1b and haplogroup I and in middle east in my
area are haplogroup j so most of the chace the white bitch i will score will not be e1b1b1
how can i know if she is descendents of somalian race
regards e3b1c1
quote:Very inciteful observations Mind. These guys are delusional however. They dodge facts and dismiss the myriad of inconvenient truths regarding the black African provence of E3b. To come to the conclusion that they don't have recent black ancestry they go through painful mental contortions.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
dont get me wrong i could take her
to a basment of slaves and discplaine her
that would be easy since she is slave in her nature as oposed to cat stevens which isnt .
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cat Stevens ancestors know a lil about slavery..
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.crystalinks.com/greekslavery.html
Slavery played a major role in ancient Greek civilization. Slaves could be found everywhere. They worked not only as domestic servants, but as factory workers, shopkeepers, mineworkers, farm workers and as ship's crewmembers.
There may have been as many, if not more, slaves than free people in ancient Greece. It is difficult for historians to determine exactly how many slaves there were during these times, because many did not appear any different from the poorer Greek citizens.
There were many different ways in which a person could have become a slave in ancient Greece. They might have been born into slavery as the child of a slave.
They might have been taken prisoner if their city was attacked in one of the many battles which took place during these times. They might have been exposed as an infant, meaning the parents abandoned their newborn baby upon a hillside or at the gates of the city to die or be claimed by a passerby.
This method was not uncommon in ancient Greece. Another possible way in which one might have become a slave was if a family needed money, they might sell one of the children into slavery.
Usually it was a daughter because the male children were much needed to help out with the chores or the farm. Kidnapping was another fairly common way in which one could have been sold into slavery.
quote:Oh, so NOW you just want to know how you can become BLACK?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
how can we perfect our own race many people around us at least in middle east are haplogroup j and in europe in your area r1b and haplogroup I
how can we maintain our race we have to mix with those white bitches in order for e1b1b1
to exist dont we ?
regards e3b1c1
quote:"U slave", "me sea faring e3b", "me handsome", "me not from west Africa", "e-M81 not west Afrikan, it be "northwest Afrikan" LOL! Does this sound like some pussey suffering from an imferiority complex? LOL!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
no i just gave example that for basemant of slaves she would fit perfectly since she descendents from slaves so it would be easy
for her to bark like a dog to her arab master such myself
remamber even if i was a faggot it is better than you since iam not an e3a a slave
e3b1c1
quote:Troubled wop, believe me, ya could learn a thing or two from "Negrid"...I don't know, maybe like say...ummm...that FEMALES DON'T carry Y chromosomes. syke!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Good luck explaining this to Negrids though
quote:Well, y'al heard it from the pussey, who think his being a sissy is actually something to more proudly brag about than being a slave who is not considered by any stretch of the imagination to be a sissy, but could well be either a fallen combantant or social rebel victim to captivity.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i think sissy is better than a slave
my opinion
quote:Maybe I am missing something where did I say females carry Y-DNA
Originally posted by Troll Exterminator:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
ya could learn a thing or two from "Negrid"...I don't know, maybe like say...ummm...that FEMALES DON'T carry Y chromosomes. syke!
quote:Yeah; a brain!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Maybe I am missing something
quote:Guess what? The wop is right for the *first* time in this thread; I mixed him up with his mentally-stunted *identical* twin, the other clown. Well, you know how it is: it's easy to mix identical twins up.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I am missing something where did I say females carry Y-DNA
quote:Is it possible that you are not aware of what parallel mutations means in the field of genetics?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
The Somalid M215 mutation is parrallel to these mutations
Arabid M304 J
Europid M17 R1 & M170 I
Mongolid P143 NOP
quote:Its part of evolution species branch out, never merge. Its better for all of us, if we never split we will still all be one weak specie!
Originally posted by ackee:
U RIGHT, CONTINUE TO DROWN IN THIS Stoopidid dividedid and conqurerid thread.peace out.
quote:whoops, typos:
Originally posted by Freehand:
LOL @ Calypso,
E1bc's, we leave to look and gaze, be dazed, amazed by the Y-DNA "eye of truth"!
Kat Stevens: "CCANN YYOUU FFaaATHHOOM mYyyYYYYe TRUUUUUTHH! {gwEuuRP}"
@ ackee: if you were responding 2 me i apologize & meant no ill 2wards anyone and i too continued 2 ride this thread 2 mess with heads. I'm done now.
quote:I am not fake or socky, Come verify me in NYC anytime my dear Negrid
Originally posted by argyle104:
e3b1c1 and Somalid_V13 are the sockpuppets of that fake wolofi character
quote:Sicilians are negros. The whole world knows that!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:I am not fake or socky, Come verify me in NYC anytime my dear Negrid
Originally posted by argyle104:
e3b1c1 and Somalid_V13 are the sockpuppets of that fake wolofi character
I am 100% Sicilian American -unlike the many mixed Sicilian Americans who mixed with Europids or other Italians- I look exactly like NW African Berbers. I even can see myself as a Horn of Africa Oromo or Somali guy just a shade or two lighter.
.....................
quote:And the same is true for American Somali, Ethiopians, etc.. I've been around my fair share of horn/east Africans and by all indication they share absolutely NOTHING in common with Sicilians. Conversely, the ones I've talked with recognize their biological and American social affinity to AAs. You are ridiculous to suggest that Horn/East Africans care anything about you.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
In Contrast;
I feel a big Phenotypic & Genetic gap between me & AA Negrids. I see them everyday & I definitely have little in common with them & vice versa.
quote:Ethiopians do have a 35 % of non Somalid genes:
Originally posted by Sundjata:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I've been around my fair share of horn/east Africans and by all indication they share absolutely NOTHING in common with Sicilians. Conversely, the ones I've talked with recognize their biological and American social affinity to AAs. You are ridiculous to suggest that Horn/East Africans care anything about you.
quote:It's his way of dealing with his African ancestry from a white point of view, and hence he has to separate, and present a new name, for an old false dichotomy amongst Africans, since he possesses this admixture.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
I've never met an east African in my life who shared a closer kinship to Sicilian hitmen than with their fellow African brethren. No one cares about your "Negrid", "Arabid", "Somalid" labels, you made them up. No scientist and no Somalis I've met agree with you. Is this a way to make your obscure and often stigmatized ethnic group seem more significant? Is this why you make up fairy tales that nobody but you and your friend believe in?
quote:You keep saying this yet you keep replying to him. Like I said, sure are dumb.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
No one cares about your "Negrid", "Arabid", "Somalid" labels, you made them up.
quote:The oldest lineages of E1b1b - M215 is found in 2 Amahara & 1 Yemeni (close populations), but thats a rare gene & its related to the geographic origin which is rarely used to classify a race. Otherwise R1 will just be Central Asian!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
glad you realize that he isnt african since v13 originated in western asia
you can call m34 and m81 african but not v13 which most europeans belong
ethiopia mainly m78 and m34 j1 as he said 33% in amhara so m78 and m34 are the so called somalid genes in ethiopia j1 is an outsider probably came from yeman maybe even m34 is outsider who came from yeman but as he said most oromo are m78
e3b1c1
quote:Yes M34 is the older Somalids that adapted to the inland, but still lives close to the coasts.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
thanks for the information so m34 is
the coasts of the middle east and later to the inland like arabia and eastern antolia?
did i understand you ?
you can say m81 is berber and western iberian high frequency in cantabria
western andalusia north west castile and galicia
and in portugal so m81 is berber /western iberian
very nice number in the western half of the iberian pennsula
e3b1c1
quote:Then you are glad too late; you should have been glad the moment this Sicilian clown first showed up. What the heck, you are slow in retaining just about anything. Let me assure you though, it has nothing to do with his recent African ancestry via E3b.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
glad you realize that he isnt african
quote:You don't have to argue with these fascists, its very hard for the Europid or Negrid to accept the fact that North Africa was & still is Somalid not Europid or Negrid.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so what why not taking him seriously
you also have agenda to show e3a and e3b both negros
while we think e3a negros and e3b Somalid
diffrent races which derveloped in diffrent areas
with diffrent brain look and everything that attached to it
proud to belong to the Somalid race thats all
e3b1c1
quote:Wait cunt if you are not racist, then how did you end up here.
Originally posted by Albanian_European:
AS ALBANIANS E3B, R1A AND I2 WE ARE THE SAME WE FOUGHT AGAINST E3B, R1A AND I2 PEOPLE AND OUR IDENTITY IS EUROPEAN ALBANIAN
RACISTS (SOMALID OR NON-SOMALID) **** OFF WITH YOUR RACISM. I WILL NEVER CARE WHAT OTHER PEOPLE DNA IS.
quote:I am actually Olive skinned, I pretty much look like a Berber or Southern Greek (FYI typical Sicilian)...well anything is White to you anyways
Originally posted by argyle104:
e3b1c1 and Somalid_V13 aka sockpuppets of the white boy who has pink blisters on his penis.
LOL
quote:Somalid = African,.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
durka durka durka allah Muhammad jihad somalid
quote:You erroneous troll, why exclude Africa where the lineages deepest root is present, and in its highest frequency? Which is of course Africa.
just to keep our somalid hertige
in europe ,arabia, antolia, maghreb and iberia
thats all
quote:What is a Negro?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
you have an agenda to show e1b1b and e3a as all the same negros
quote:Hey kid, bow down to your Somalid King...
avoding the evidence infront of your eyes that greek roman moors carthegenians pheonician
have high e1b1b element in them
quote:Yup. This is one of those threads that you actually get progressively dumber as you read it... what a waste of 20-50KB of otherwise useful web space...
Originally posted by ackee:
This is one long stupidid thread.and while i am not going to get bog down in this stupidid divide and conqurer argument, most say hat off to my people the slave decendents, you have come a long way in a very short time.we have bend entire nations to our will,created nations where none existed.imperfect thu we maybe we will servive we will stay alive,for we have been thru the fire and thus been forged like no other.blessed are the ancestors who always dreamt of better and never ever faulter. to you i say bigup N Nuff Respect!!
quote:E1b1b African children, just gaze upon your envy, but remember don't hate....
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i have an agenda to show the evidence of the seperation between e3a and e1b1b1
quote:Those are all E1b1b carrying Ethiopian children.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
did you check each one of this kids or you just assume that they are e1b1b1
quote:Are you confused; is it E1b1b or E1b1a?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
the e1b1b1 guy look like e3a slave still just becuase he have a nerrow face that doesnt make him somalid or e1b1b1 in his nature
quote:A is not as dominant as E in Ethiopia, so now you're telling me because they look too African they might be minority A?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
how do you know all these ethiopian children are e1b1b1 i already talled you haplogroup A is also in ethiopia they could belong to it
again you only assume that they are all e1b1b1
the guy in the picture is e3a
quote:Well your erroneous people of the past tried to classify this E1b1a African as a Caucasian who resembled ancient Caucasians from the near east, you know, your ancestors...
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i talled you that just becuse he has nerrow face doesnt make him look like e1b1b1 somalid guy
quote:Oh ok, and that's based on noting but your own ignorance, I get it.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
why is he a slave becuse he has dna which is common among african american which experience slavery whats a negro to me the meaning of negro is to be e3a and a slave to not have civilization to not have the guts and bravery to leave africa thats what negro entail to me
e3b1c1
quote:Don't worry he will eventually be assimilated like all the other southern Somalis who are former Borana like him, no Southern Somalid people have been able so far to resist our expansion, they are all assimilated by our force.
Mindovermatter wrote:
The new king told the BBC that the Somali group was trying to steal his people's land . "Of course if someone tries to snatch my things, I have to stop him," he said.
Gosh darn it I thought "Somalids" were supposed to stick together, you know, that distinct genetic tie....bwahahahaha
quote:As stated: the wop doesn't know what he's talking about. The only people he takes for a ride, are even bigger fools....like yourself, who mistake a male sex chromosome with that of a female.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so what why not taking him seriously
quote:If I had an agenda, you would have refuted any of my posts, but this hasn't been done to date. Care to elaborate on why?
you also have agenda to show e3a and e3b both negros
quote:This is funny coming from a troubled wop. Italians were one of the very people who defined what facists are; remember, your beloved leader Mussolini was Hitler's buddy.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
You don't have to argue with these fascists
quote:They must be in company, because virtually *science* [and common sense] also finds it very hard to accept "your" fact above, let alone lend it any semblance of support.
its very hard for the Europid or Negrid to accept the fact that North Africa was & still is Somalid not Europid or Negrid.
quote:Dumb somalid, your stupidity is as rotten today as when you first displayed it upon joining this board. Why not try renew yourself...like getting a brain.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Explorer your defensive atttitude got boring yesterday, try to renew yourself.
quote:wop's puppet, tell you what: Can you tell me what's dumber than thinking that females carry Y chromosomes, and I'll reconsider the level of your "dumbness". Deal?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i will never be dumb handle this you stupit
quote:Smart move. Silence is gold, especially when you have nothing smart to say. For a moment there, I couldn't help but think about getting you a nice short skirt as a nice birthday present...because of the way you came at me bitching & moaning [defensive], instead of busy refuting [offensive].
Originally posted by Yonis2:
dp
quote:OOOH Explorer is on FIRE, let us all duck, everyone duck before the flame hits you.
Originally posted by The Explorer:
quote:Dumb somalid, your stupidity is as rotten today as when you first displayed it upon joining this board. Why not try renew yourself...like getting a brain.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Explorer your defensive atttitude got boring yesterday, try to renew yourself.
Also, defensive is someone who whines & nags emotionally, like a bitch, rather than refute [offensive]. You disagree? What have you refuted?
quote:"because of the way you came at me bitching & moaning [defensive], instead of busy refuting [offensive]."
Originally posted by Yonis2:
OOOH Explorer is on FIRE, let us all duck, everyone duck before the flame hits you.
quote:True, i'm a bitch and you're the man we all want to become, especially behind the keybord in no one knows land.hahaqqq..kkkk
Explorer wrote:
Smart move. Silence is gold, especially when you have nothing smart to say. For a moment there, I couldn't help but think about getting you a nice short skirt as a nice birthday present...because of the way you came at me bitching & moaning [defensive], instead of busy refuting [offensive
quote:Hey, no need to kill the messenger. If you'd just do less emotional bitching, and engage in the discourse, and trade bitching with refuting [offensive], you wouldn't be appropriately called out as it is. Yonis, this may come as a newsflash to you, but this is a forum. Disagreements can happen and discussions can get heated; it is up to you to be a whiner [as you've displayed just now] or you could chose to be on the offensive at all times [which I displayed throughout this thread, dismembering all your posts]. Can't handle the kitchen, then get out; knitting, as I advised you, could be a very good fit for you.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
True, i'm a bitch and you're the man we all want to become, especially behind the keybord.Haha..qqq..kkkk
quote:Dang. This post just taken you even deeper into the gutter of dumbness/stupidity. Your task was to do just the opposite, remember.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
m34 -william harvey discover the circulation of blood brilighnt related to me as icarry m34 also
e3a like you explorere negro slave damm i never was racist but guys ;like you make me
one you stupit negro
e3b1c1
quote:Exactly!
Explorer wrote:
Disagreements can happen and discussions can get heated; it is up to you to be a whiner
quote:Which is why I go on the offensive. I don't tell people off merely because they disagree, like you do, in a estrogen-packed kind'a way. Instead, I refute people, and understand that this is a forum, where we don't come here to sing kumbaya together. Here, as any normal being would, I expect disagreements to happen quite a bit, and ongoing arguments. Apparently, not being able to defend yourself, has left you in a very weak state. You should reconsider your priorities, when it comes to hanging around forums. You are not that strong yet.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Exactly!
Explorer wrote:
Disagreements can happen and discussions can get heated; it is up to you to be a whiner
quote:And you did a darn good job of completing it. You've shown me that you are dumber than I gave you credit for.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
like you giving me task
quote:Let's put it to test: Does William Harvey confuse males with females as you do? If the answer is "yes", and you can prove it, then you might be onto something.
william harvey the doctor who discover the circulation of blood and one of the first who study embriology we both belong to e-m34
now if i am dumb than he is also dumb
quote:You my little half literate monster are one fucking wop nigger.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
damm you explorere so now the slave negro e3a like you giving me task
i cant do it since i am not slave in nature
the oposite is the case i should give you tasks
as i am the master not the slave here
e3b1c1
quote:You can add your claim that William Harvey must be as dumb as you, or that you must be as smart as he is, presumably because of some Y chromosome, in that growing list of stupid statements you've made. That gets me thinking: If you are such a smart fellow, how come you make all these stupid statements almost to no end?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
so you will hunt me for this statement throught all this forum
even if i made a stupit statement which you
quote:Correct he seems quite proud of being a deviant. Its an Omani thing. E3b1c1 is a Xanith. He's probably been overly abused by the men that bought his services in the market place. That's why he's so obsessed with the master/slave theme.
Well, E3b1c1 did say he is a sissy, and darn it, he is proud of it.
quote:*laughs out loud
Originally posted by IronLion:
He3be1
You are less than a slave. Like Frankenstein monster you threaten the brains that built you.
quote:Exactly. Unfortunately we don't have an active moderator here.
Originally posted by Morpheus:
Can you imagine how much better Egyptsearch would be if we banned all of the fucking trolls?
quote:Unfortunately moderators on this forum can only delete posts. I was on the staff once and it seems like only the Admin of Egyptsearch can ban members.
Originally posted by T. Rex:
Exactly. Unfortunately we don't have an active moderator here.
D: quote:Hey, E3b1c1: gaze into the eye....
Originally posted by The Explorer:
Well, E3b1c1 did say he is a sissy, and darn it, he is proud of it.
quote:I don't see any progress in the stuff that "somalidV13" and "e3b1c1" are posting. Its virulent racism. Racism isn't merely a matter of ignorance and not knowing all the facts. It is a form of psychosis. As such it seeks to protect its own existence. Case in point is Somalid. He is an Italian American form NYC. Italian Americans are possibly the most rabidly racist group in the USA. Just google bias crimes in Howard Beach, Bensonhurst, etc. Look up how Mayor Guiliani, an Italian, defended the cops in the Diallo murder.
I have to admit that even though these people are out there, they are still claiming a lineage that stems from Africans. This is a step in the right direction of people looking past color to claim descent from something.
quote:Assimilated?
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Don't worry he will eventually be assimilated
Mindovermatter wrote:
The new king told the BBC that the Somali group was trying to steal his people's land . "Of course if someone tries to snatch my things, I have to stop him," he said.
Gosh darn it I thought "Somalids" were supposed to stick together, you know, that distinct genetic tie....bwahahahaha
quote:What entails a "Caucasian" morphology?
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
the e3a guy dont look caucasian are you serious
quote:Well kid, that man is a Borana, and they carry E1b1b at its highest frequency.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
haplogrou A is still in ethiopia amhara 14%
and oromo 10% it defently there
quote:Well what you feel is what you feel, and doesn't change what is scientifically true, but just note that this man, and all other elongated Africans (your recent African ancestors) are not any different from Africans who adapted to a hot and humid climate which gave them a broad physiognomy, regardless, they're all every bit as African as the other.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i dont care if they tried to calsify him as caucasin in the past take him to western asia they will treat him as e3a negro without any doubt
e3b1c1
quote:Great and very well analyzing post of the fraudulent'.
Originally posted by Troll Whisperer:
King wrote:quote:I don't see any progress in the stuff that "somalidV13" and "e3b1c1" are posting. Its virulent racism. Racism isn't merely a matter of ignorance and not knowing all the facts. It is a form of psychosis. As such it seeks to protect its own existence. Case in point is Somalid. He is an Italian American form NYC. Italian Americans are possibly the most rabidly racist group in the USA. Just google bias crimes in Howard Beach, Bensonhurst, etc. Look up how Mayor Guiliani, an Italian, defended the cops in the Diallo murder.
I have to admit that even though these people are out there, they are still claiming a lineage that stems from Africans. This is a step in the right direction of people looking past color to claim descent from something.
Somalid's weltanschauung began with a hatred of blacks, all blacks, without nuance. He then found out that his Y-dna is of recent African provenance. Rather than being an object lesson that led him to disavow racist thought: he dug in. As a psychotic, he couldn't possibly accept within his own blood a connection to the thing he hates. (Recall the reaction of the academic community to Natufians: "Professor Smith objected, too, that it was hardly possible that these people had had Negro blood, but Sir Arthur speedily corrected him. By the word Negroid he meant merely Negro-like characteristics") Therefore Somalid had to transform East Africans into something non black, non African, non threatening, non "negroid".
By the same token Somalid had to redouble and justify his hatred for blacks by turning all his venom towards "e3a". They're now the nuanced "other". A barrier had to be thrown up between Africans to defend his psyche from the disturbing "E3a" barbarians knocking at the gates. His ear is closed to all facts that disturb his racist certainties: whether it pertains to the abundant evidence that slavery is a blight that touched many people worldwide; or the inabilty to separate Africans into phenotypic ghettoes.
Be clear however that Somalid has no love for East Africans and, other than in cyber-space, wants nothing to do with them. He's simply pissing on them and calling it rain.
His depravity is evident in his celebration of the enslavement of West Africans - one of the most horrific crimes in the annals of mankind.
quote:I bet you would.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
I'd rather be a sissy.....
quote:Indeed. And *don't* forget this: "as smart as we are".
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i wish i was funny as you are guys
regards e3b1c1
quote:Really?
Originally posted by argyle104:
You have said the same thing that e3b1c1 and Somalid_V13 have said.
What is the difference?
quote:Strawman, is asking you to elaborate on what you're suggesting that is just like the clowns mentioned?
Originally posted by argyle104:
strawman
quote:@Somalid
Be clear however that Somalid has no love for East Africans and, other than in cyber-space, wants nothing to do with them. He's simply pissing on them and calling it rain.
Very lame!
They are my genetic brothers, but like all brothers we don't have to get along hell I don't get along with my immediate brother let alone other Somalids!
That doesn't change the fact that I am an E1b1b Somalid & you are an E1b1a Negrid. Its not a cultural or emotional issue, its facts we belong to 2 diff gene pools.
quote:Okay I've mulled it over and have concluded, based upon your various posts, that you're: a psychopath, a drunk, a sexual deviant, and an illiterate. Additionally, you suffer an infantile disorder. What effect the labor of delicing the hairs, on your hirsuit Siclilian mother's back, may have had on your developmental challenges I'm not able to guage. Your hatred of blacks leads me to believe that African men formed a signifcant percentage of her clientele.
@Somalid
I see major areas of disagreement but I will mull over your post, fair-mindedly, and prepare an answer.
quote:I really don't get insulted but what Negrids say, because I understand we have a genetic barier between us, you consider science & the fact that I am not a Negrid an insult!
Originally posted by Troll Whisperer:
TW posted: [QUOTE]
Okay I've mulled it over and have concluded, a psychopath, a drunk, a sexual, illiterate... delicing the hairs, mother's
Your hatred of blacks
quote:E1b1a subrace = Neo-Negrids
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
remember the pn2 clade
dont forget it
as usual this graphs avoid e1b1b1c
my clade hell with those european my clade very important in western asia why the ignor it
e3b1c1
quote:Subsahran Africa was a better land, than say Arabia or North Africa. (they didn't have maps back then it was luck), Somalids suffered more & had to become Coastal people & cross the seas for better lands.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
thanks but tell me why e1b1a decided to go into subsharn africa ?
quote:They are minority is South Africa, S Africa had the diff races & subraces. E1b1b1e/f in IMO are Somalids.
i dont want to make your life hard buy you forget that m293 a subclade of e1b1b1
is found in southern africa
what do you have to say about it thats show that e1b1b1 isnt mediterreanean some of his branches went to south africa and experienced apherthaide
e3b1c1
quote:Lmao, that's one of the most erroneously labeled maps I've seen.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:I really don't get insulted but what Negrids say, because I understand we have a genetic barier between us, you consider science & the fact that I am not a Negrid an insult!
Originally posted by Troll Whisperer:
TW posted: [QUOTE]
Okay I've mulled it over and have concluded, a psychopath, a drunk, a sexual, illiterate... delicing the hairs, mother's
Your hatred of blacks
Look at the chart all Human races originated from a Negrid ancestor, Somalids are just one group of many that branched out of the Negrid race. The quicker you understand this the less you will feel insulted.
quote:Well maybe you never heard of something called Y-DNA lineages & mutations.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Lmao, that's one of the most erroneously labeled maps I've seen.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Troll Whisperer:
[qb] TW posted: [QUOTE]
Like I told you before genetic lineages can not be assigned fictitious names you make up on your own just so you can feel better about your African ancestry.
quote:All humans have a Negrid ancestory.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
[qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by Troll Whisperer:
[qb] TW posted: [QUOTE] just so you can feel better about your African ancestry.
quote:I've heard of it, and I know uni-parentals, Y-dna and Mtdna, are not given erroneous fictitious names.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Well maybe you never heard of something called Y-DNA lineages & mutations.
quote:According to whom?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
The names are accurate
quote:Your African ancestry I'm referring to here, lies in your carrying of an African E1b1b derivative.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:All humans have a Negrid ancestory.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE] just so you can feel better about your African ancestry.
quote:Yeah 30,000 kya according to this chart E1b1 was Negrid, which is acceptable.
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:I've heard of it, and I know uni-parentals, Y-dna and Mtdna, are not given erroneous fictitious names. Your African ancestry I'm referring to here, lies in your carrying of an African E1b1b derivative.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Well maybe you never heard of something called Y-DNA lineages & mutations.
quote:25, 000 years ago was the split of E1b1b and E1b1a, but this didn't then make E1b1b non African as you wished it did, E1b1b is every bit as African as E1b1a.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Yeah 30,000 kya according to this chart E1b1 was Negrid, which is acceptable.
quote:You mean you share ancient African ancestry which everyone non African has, and also recent E1b1b African ancestry.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I have Negrid ancestory just like every human does...Does that bother you
quote:Today you're a Sicilian with recent E1b1b African admixture.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Today I am a modern Sicilian Somalid.
quote:Nope, never took one of those genealogy tests.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Do you even know your Y-DNA!?
quote:Take a DNA test & we go from there, as of now its safe to call you a Negrid, since thats the only marker we can confirm A (Y-DNA)
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
[qb] Nope, never took one of those genealogy tests.
quote:LOL dude you're white, with recent E1b1b sub Saharan African ancestry, get over it.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Take a DNA test & we go from there, as of now its safe to call you a Negrid, since thats the only marker we can confirm A (Y-DNA)
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
[qb] Nope, never took one of those genealogy tests.
I am not a Negrid or Europid..
I don't recognize African as a racial term, since many North Africans are Arabids & Europids...etc
I am a Sicilian Somalid get used to it. I don't recognize anyborders wherever I sail its my land, your ship is my ship, your wife & daughters are my women...Somalid till the end
quote:You need to get over I am not White?! WTF is white??!
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
[qb] [QUOTE]Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
[qb] LOL dude you're white, with recent E1b1b sub Saharan African ancestry, get over it.
quote:I like the wild part.
Originally posted by Progressive Mediterranean Supra Europe region:
The Wild Negrid Subsahran Africa
yanking our collective chains]
quote:What?!?!? You're delusional.
Freehand wrote:
( (: PS: E1b1a was more common in these ancient populations, and is still more common now in Greece, Israel, Omani, Egyptian, and Sudanese people than it ever was in Somalis)
quote:Posting a map with A, B, D, E, and J on it doesn't make it valid genetics. Don't just make statements. Back them up with peer reviewed evidence from bonafide scientist - other than e3b1c1. (His qualifications are still being vetted by the credentials committee. They're hung up over the tigers don't exist in Africa thing).
I really don't get insulted but what Negrids say, because I understand we have a genetic barier between us, you consider science & the fact that I am not a Negrid an insult!
Look at the chart all Human races originated from a Negrid ancestor, Somalids are just one group of many that branched out of the Negrid race. The quicker you understand this the less you will feel insulted.
quote:You're weirdid.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What?!?!? You're delusional.
quote:Actually, you don't know who or what I am.
stop picture spamming you are not Doug M.
quote:Of course i know who you are, you are the mumbling resident Butler AKA Jeeves.
Freehand wrote:
Actually, you don't know who or what I am.
quote:Bad try actually.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Of course i know who you are, you are the mumbling resident Butler AKA Jeeves.
Freehand wrote:
Actually, you don't know who or what I am.
I like your name "jeeves", first time argyle became usefull. Changing your screen name every week won't wash away these nicks, nice try though.
, I would have created another futile account. It's not hard. possibly slightly annoyed) about the name changes.
quote:Actually, it should be a note as to how far we still are, if ever were close at all.
Originally posted by KING:
Man this thread just opens my eyes to how close we are to unity.
quote:We know kid, we know.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
What?!?!? I'm delusional.
quote:Unity as in Leoards unifying with Jaguars?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Actually, it should be a note as to how far we still are, if ever were close at all.
Originally posted by KING:
Man this thread just opens my eyes to how close we are to unity.
Some people are simply insecure cowards, and will never face a reality that objects to their fantasy.
quote:Yep! Somalid really has no clue what he's talking about. I don't blame the kid. He's got enough on his plate coming to grips with his recent black ancestry. I blame Mathilda for sending out such a poorly prepared Orc on seemingly a suicide mission.
And if you don't see how Jaguars and Leopards aren't comparable to any 2 groups of your -ids, you need to go take biology.
quote:E1b1a Supreme Negrids are the most progressive of all Negrids. I am sure a good % of the people who think they are "Black" actually have Non-Negrid markers.
Originally posted by Ausaru:
What is wrong with E3a and what is wrong with being Black Dont all of u Know u Come From Africa love it or hate it u Guilty and Innocent
quote:Lol! Xanith master is downright dirty! Cat turning you every which way but loose ain't he. Your end must hurt when "tiger" done tearing you up! But just look at all them smiley faces!!!
i get it hope the e3a guys will get it also in the end
quote:R1b-M269 "Blacks" are the offspring of slave owners, there is DNA evidence that the most succesful "pimps" (Modern Enslavers) belong to Europid lineages.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
and if they do have non black african markers than what so they are not slaves ?
the african american who belong to R1b haplogroup or I haplogroup are slaves not less than the e3a
quote:Yep! You're correct. Meet the children of your new King. One of the 2 will be named his heir. Born royalty - its in their genes!
Genes make you who you are
quote:Okay I don't get it are you trying to impress me by posting photos of Borana Children?
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
^Guido Bonobo wrote:quote:Don't give up on Somalid togetherness though. The royal family could definitely use you as their court fool.
Genes make you who you are
quote:They are not caucasian, what's the matter with you? These are native features.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i have to say yonis the guy in the big picture in the middle with the mustachue
his typical eastern african /somalian
and he has vey caucasian features proves that e1b1b1 and e1b1b1a are caucasians at least they look so
reagrds drama
quote:Caucasian is an inaccurate term, even the majority of the Europids have nothing to do with Caucasus! (Never been to the Caucasus or have any distant origin to it...Its just an old outdated Phenotypic theory that the Caucasus was the origin of the Europids & Arabids)
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i have to say yonis the guy in the big picture in the middle with the mustachue
his typical eastern african /somalian
and he has vey caucasian features proves that e1b1b1 and e1b1b1a are caucasians at least they look so
quote:Like I said, SomalidV13 is a European ("white man") and doesn't look like any of those people, assuming that SomalidV13 gave a fair description of himself when he stated that he was of Sicilian descent.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
sundjata how the hell do you know how somalid v13 look like v13 is still related to v32 that
mant of the somalians and ethiopian in the photos belong to so it doesnt matter how he look he is realted to them
and again i ask do you have a photo of him
e3b1c1
quote:I don't know how you look like, but i for sure have the stereotypical NE African look, LOl at broad features.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
^Yonis, I've seen your picture and you don't necessarily conform to the pattern of diversity you try and limit to northeast Africa. I think I've mentioned once before that your features are even broader than mine.
As a European ("white man"), SomalidV13 doesn't resemble any of these people.
quote:Dude, I've seen you.. No you don't.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I don't know how you look like, but i for sure have the stereotypical NE African look
Originally posted by Sundjata:
[qb] ^Yonis, I've seen your picture and you don't necessarily conform to the pattern of diversity you try and limit to northeast Africa. I think I've mentioned once before that your features are even broader than mine.
As a European ("white man"), SomalidV13 doesn't resemble any of these people.
quote:Frankly I don't give a sh!t what you think, i know how i look like, infact unlike many somalis i have the universal Horn african look my phenotype fits well in the whole of NE africa from southern Egypt to northern Somalia.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Dude, I've seen you.. No you don't.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:I don't know how you look like, but i for sure have the stereotypical NE African look
Originally posted by Sundjata:
[qb] ^Yonis, I've seen your picture and you don't necessarily conform to the pattern of diversity you try and limit to northeast Africa. I think I've mentioned once before that your features are even broader than mine.
As a European ("white man"), SomalidV13 doesn't resemble any of these people.
quote:Within your own statement lies proof that there is no universal horn look.
infact unlike many somalis i have the universal Horn african look
quote:No since there have have been alot of admixture with Nilo-saharan women, in particular in Ethiopia and Sudan.
Originally posted by Troll Whisperer:
Yonis wrote:quote:Within your own statement lies proof that there is no universal horn look.
infact unlike many somalis i have the universal Horn african look
quote:Implicit in your statement is an assertion that Nilo-Saharans have a different "look" than Afroasiatic speakers. The Nilo-Saharans are no less native to the region than the Afroasiatics; so, if your assertion is true, we would again logically draw the conclusion that there is no "universal" horn African look.
No since there have have been alot of admixture with Nilo-saharan women, in particular in Ethiopia and Sudan.
quote:Well didn't i just say "NO" there is no universal horn african look, what exactly are you nagging about?
Originally posted by Troll Whisperer:
Yonis wrote:quote:Implicit in your statement is an assertion that Nilo-Saharans have a different "look" than Afroasiatic speakers. The Nilo-Saharans are no less native to the region than the Afroasiatics; so, if your assertion is true, we would again logically draw the conclusion that there is no "universal" horn African look.
No since there have have been alot of admixture with Nilo-saharan women, in particular in Ethiopia and Sudan.
quote:We are talking genetics not phenotypes!
As a European ("white man"), SomalidV13 doesn't resemble any of these people. [/QB]
@ Tuareg; "diaspora...". Didn't know the Tamasheq left their native continent. Try telling this to a Tamasheq in his face, and watch what happens. Matter of fact, try taking the Tamasheq out of their West African home. You'll know then and there, that you are a naive Somali in Sweden who has been *thoroughly* brainwashed by the "western" propaganda machine.
quote:Yonis, you are more of a dummy than I had thought. Diaspora applies to those who have left their traditional homeland. You must be out of your mind, if you think Tamasheq fit that profile. Furthermore, they are still in their native continent. It's serious, that in this day and age, I have to school a continental African on this no-brainer.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Diaspora doesn't necessery mean over seas, it can mean dispersion of populations on the same landmass.
quote:Well fool, you just called them "diaspora". If you know the matter you just posted, why did you call Tamasheq's "diaspora"? Were you in your right mind?
BTW i don't think anyone want's or can take away Tuaregs from their environment, they are completly adapted to the sahara desert in western africa. It's their home and will continue to be so. Stop with your assumptions.
quote:Tell me, if you say things that are constantly foolish, what does that make you? As for calling me names, knock yourself out, but just understand that I'm not the "turn the other cheek" kinda guy.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
Don't call me "fool" unless you want me to call you names back.
quote:Whatever white boy...
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Keep in mind Not all Sicilians are Somalid
50% are Europid
25% are Arabid
25% are Somalid
So you get an idea how some "Europeans" might look similar to East Africans
quote:Nope; CrakacoonCunt, you are just astonishingly fucked in the head to understand that Tamasheq is not a "diaspora" group.
Originally posted by craka coon buckwheat:
People, isn't it odd that The Explorer aka "MA DICK" became upset that Tuaregs were apart of the African diaspora?
quote:I see e3b1c1 and Somalid_V13 gave no response to the above. How can they, with their total idiocy??
Originally posted by Djehuti:
LMAO @ "genetic nationalist"! You write of genetic anything yet you obviously don't know what you're talking about!
First of all, E3a and E3b didn't split 30,000 years ago but 24-27,000 years ago as cited by Cruciani et. al. and others. And even if it was 30,000 years ago or more, it still does NOT change the fact that E3a and E3b are siblings who descend from a common parent! You cannot separate E3a Africans from E3b Africans and say they are not related because their lineages split many millennia ago! It's absurd!
If that is the case then why not do the same with your European kin who do carry lineages associated with indigenous Europeans namely R1a and R1b. R1a which is common among Eastern Europeans and R1b which is common among Western Europeans are also sibling lineages which split from the common parent R1. It is this split which occurred 30,000-35,000 years ago, yet why is there no notion from you or other Europeans to segregate these two European lineages into two different races??!! Why is that??
You also make the claim that the only E3a found outside of Africa is a result of slavery, however Explorer posed questions to you to prove such a claim. I am not Explorer so I'll just tell you idiots straight up that there is an ancient presence of E3a in Europe that predates slavery and has nothing to do with slaves! As I have stated pages ago, E3a is also found in Sicily as well as other parts of Italy and southwestern Europe such as France and especially the Iberian peninsula-- Spain and Portugal. The presence of E3a in these areas highly correspond to the presence of Benin variety of sickle cell anemia!
^ There are four forms of HBS (sickle cell gene). Only one type is Eurasian in origin (Arab-Indian) the other three are African-- Senegal, Benin, and Bantu. So guess which type of E3 carriers brought the Benin form into the Mediterranean?? As it pertains to the subject of this forum-- Ancient Egypt-- notice also that the Benin form is also found in the lower Nile areas of Africa, specifically Egypt which is not surprising since genetics also show that E3a carriers also comprised the ancient Egyptian population! So despite what you think the ancient Egyptians and other Nile Valley groups responsible for civilization were NOT solely E3b carriers!
And yet we are suppose to take you European, non-African morons seriously about separating E3a Africans from E3b Africans, or any type of Africans?!! LMAO
quote:I'm not filthy or foreign and no I have never said anything like what e3b1c1 and Somalid_V13 have said, you nutjob!
Originally posted by argyle104:
Djehuti,
Hasn't your filthy foreign depraved self said the exact same thing that e3b1c1 and Somalid_V13 have been saying throughtout this thread?
quote:LOL Really? Then please by all means provide these links!! I've been asking you for links or examples of these accuasations but you never provide any.
You have been saying the same thing about sub-saharan bantu black negroid slaves. There are links to these statements.
quote:Correction. YOU are a sick (both mentally and physically from STDs) son of a bitch that derives from a group of people that will eat any d*ck in the planet.
You're a sick son of a bitch that derives from a race of people that will eat anything on the planet.
quote:Lol, perhaps you mean Arab?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
So you get an idea how some "Europeans" might look similar to East Africans
quote:e3b1c1 is a person who receive his information from stormfront^
i have to say yonis the guy in the big picture in the middle with the mustachue
his typical eastern african /somalian
and he has vey caucasian features proves that e1b1b1 and e1b1b1a are caucasians at least they look so reagrds drama
quote:Stop being ridiculous as if Somalid is not as erroneous as Caucasian.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:They are not caucasian, what's the matter with you? These are native features.
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
i have to say yonis the guy in the big picture in the middle with the mustachue
his typical eastern african /somalian
and he has vey caucasian features proves that e1b1b1 and e1b1b1a are caucasians at least they look so
reagrds drama
quote:Arabid genotypes are also found in Sicily, but Somalid genes are found in a similar ratio bot about 25%
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Lol, perhaps you mean Arab?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
So you get an idea how some "Europeans" might look similar to East Africans
quote:Sorry kid, but he looks Arabic, but not like there is anything wrong with that.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Arabid genotypes are also found in Sicily, but Somalid genes are found in a similar ratio bot about 25%
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Lol, perhaps you mean Arab?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
So you get an idea how some "Europeans" might look similar to East Africans
Arabids have more oriental details (mainly semitic smile) which is absent n the photo I posted, which still doesn't mean he can't be a genetic Arabid or Europid...
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
quote:Indeed, the very map you presents shows the different lineages that stem from a *common ancestor* in Africa, only that it has ridiculous racial labels attached to each lineage. If as you say, you cannot put color to each lineage, what sense does it make putting labels like "Sibirid" and "Syrid"?!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
I don't see a White or Black Y-DNA?
Evolve! accept science we are complex species not Black or White sheep
LMAO
quote:
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
most berbers dont look like that is he a tuareg
berber but he represnt the berber look befor they mixed with european females
e3b1c1
quote:Most Berbers look the Somali guy above just with less fuzzy hair. E1b1b Italians/Sicilians have thinner faces...ofcourse phenotypes vary due to admixture from mtDNA
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
most berbers dont look like that is he a tuareg
berber but he represnt the berber look befor they mixed with european females
e3b1c1
quote:WRONG as usual! First of all the Berber man I showed is NOT Tuareg but SIWA!! The Siwa people are the indigenous Berber speaking people of Western Egypt!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
Most berbers don't look like that is he a tuareg
berber but he represnt the berber look befor they mixed with european females
e3b1c1
quote:And again NON of these genetic lineages have any effect on physical appearance or looks, idiota!
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Most Berbers look the Somali guy above just with less fuzzy hair. E1b1b Italians/Sicilians have thinner faces...ofcourse phenotypes vary due to admixture from mtDNA
In mtDNA:
South Europeans & North Africans hare similar % of H & UK
North African & Horn Africans share similar % of M1 & specific U6
quote:Correct, but the point is that the lineage arose in Africa among blacks and Southern Europeans carry the lineage because of blacks that migrated to southern europe in ancient times!!
In Y-DNA E1b1b is the male common ancestor in the majority of the Horn Africans & North Africans & a sizeable minority of the Southern Europeans
quote:LOL Of course you and your "cousin" are too stupid to get anything which is why you cling to nonsense beliefs of "genetically distant" (even when E3a is sibling of E3b) or a repetition of Nazi propaganda as "genetic enemies"!
Ofcourse this is in reply for my cousin E1b1b1c, not expecting a "I got it" reaction form the genetically distant or the outright genetic enemeies of my people!
LOL Both of you guys are not only stupd but crazy as well and need professional help!
quote:Wait wait, did you really just say a Somali looks more like a "Berber" than an actual Berber?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Most Berbers look the Somali guy above just with less fuzzy hair.
quote:Lmao @ genetic enemies of my people, kid, you're not black, and never will be, so they (E1b1b carriers) can never be "your people", your people are white, most of which don't carry this African marker, and the sooner you accept this, and realize that you have black ancestry, the better off you will be Tanino.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Ofcourse this is in reply for my cousin E1b1b1c, not expecting a "I got it" reaction form the genetically distant or the outright genetic enemeies of my people!
quote:Correct, though I agree he looks like many "Arabids".
Arabid genotypes are also found in Sicily, but Somalid genes are found in a similar ratio bot about 25%
Arabids have more oriental details (mainly semitic smile) which is absent n the photo I posted, which still doesn't mean he can't be a genetic Arabid or Europid...
quote:Also notice how paraphyletic his "Europids" are.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
Oh, I forgot to say a while back that when I first saw the chart above I was
ROTFLOL
I mean, who came up with all that sh*t??! Somalid?!! Just look at "Neo-Negrid", or notice that E1b1a (E3a) is called "Supreme Negrid"!! LMAO So E3a carriers are "supreme" why the denigration against such a lineage. LOL I see everything "Adamid" to "Atlantid" and "Mongolid". So why is "Caucasid" seperated out into G?? Also why are R1a and R1b as sibling lineages stemming from thier parent lineage the same color but not E1b1a (E3a) and E1b1b (E3b)?? How did E1b1b become non-negrid in contrast to its sibling and parent??
quote:Its called evolving!
Originally posted by Djehuti:
why is the parent lineage (E1b1) "negro" and the brother lineage (E1b1a) "negro" but not E1b1b??!! Can you make any sense of this discrepancy??
quote:Damn it, evolution took place by geogrphic population movements.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
^ You are correct. He groups I and R as the same 'race' when they are distinct lineages deriving from two different parents, yet he sperates E1b1a and E1b1b as different 'races', even though they are siblings deriving from the same parent!!
So the morons want us to believe E1b1a and E1b1b are "distantly" related to each other but not R1 and I?!
Again, the hypocrisy and very non-logic of his claims!
quote:Whatever makes you happier Sundjata facts are facts you better get used to them. Everyday that passes means we are splitting in diff directions. Accept it & focus on your own race!
Originally posted by Sundjata:
^You are a clown..
quote:
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Everyday that passes means we are splitting in diff directions.
quote:The above has an overemphasis on physical appearance, and this next one is more interesting:
Ultimately, such determination depends upon what you mean by "races" and how many you think there are in a global (as opposed to a U.S.) sense. For example, if you see just three global "races" (as does the U.S. judiciary), then you conflate Indonesians and Manchurians, who are less similar in physical measurements than, say, Europeans and sub-Saharan Africans. If you define four "races" by splitting Asians into northern (sinodont) and southern (sundadont) branches then you solve one problem, but now you conflate !Xoisan, Watutsi, and Bantus, peoples whose measurements are not even similar. If you define six global "races," then your measurements are more consistent, but still not replicable. Twelve "race" gives better results. A hundred "races" gives better yet, a thousand "races" improves measurement replicability, ten thousand is even better, and so forth.
In other words, if you divide humanity into the three U.S. "races," then the differences between any two of those "races" (Whites and Blacks, say) are far less replicable, obvious, measureable, or reliable, than the differences between sub-groups (sinodonts and sundadonts, say) within any of the three "races". This non-replicability problem is lessened if you go with six "races". Replicability improves even more if you define ten thousand "races". But (with one exception, explained below) the problem never goes away.
Obviously, any definition of "races" that results in the different "races" (Black and White, say) being more similar than subgroups within each of the "races" is not persuasive to a scientist. And so, finding clusters of traits that define human groups objectively has been the holy grail of physical anthropology for over two centuries. It is still being pursued.
In mathematical terms, the question is: "Is it possible to categorize H. sapiens into groups such that inter-group variation (physical differences between groups) is greater than intra-group variation (differences between sub-groups within the groups)?" Hundreds of scientists have sought to do this. All of those investigators, without exception, found that the more "races" you define, the more objective and replicable the measurements get. But (with one exception) you never reach a point where inter-group variation exceeds intra-group variation.
...
Noah A. Rosenberg offers a present-day example of the same doomed grail-chase. See http://backintyme.com/admixture/rosenberg01.pdf . Rosenberg used meticulous statistical mapping programs in powerful computers to analyze hundreds of DNA markers in many thousands of subjects worldwide. He proved that if you tell the computer to indentify three clusters ("races") in humankind, the results are better than if you tell it to find two clusters. Assuming four clusters is better yet, five is even better, and six is best of all.(Rosenberg quit at six.) The statistical trend found by the computer is unmistakeable. There is no end to this chase (with one exception).
In short, even if you divide our species into millions of tiny "races," you will always find that there is more variation between sub-groups within each of those millions of "races" than there is between the "races" themselves.
The exception? You will reach the holy grail of "racial" definition if you divide humankind into 6.5 billion "races" of one individual each. Only then does inter-group variation exceed intra-group variation.
In conclusion, you can show objectively, replicably, mathematically, that our species comprises only one "race" of 6.5 billion individuals. Or you can show that we comprise 6.5 billion "races" of one individual each. But no one has ever found anything in between.
quote:I would note that the connection between "Saharans" and Ethiopioids is closer than that between Ethiopioids and "Eurasians", cladistically speaking, 9/10 + Saharans descend from E* P2 which originates in E Africa after the dispersals of most Eurasians' ancestors.
There is no "Negroid" race, nor a "Caucasoid" race.
Humans break down as follows. This is the science, not the social constructs created by Eurimperialist racists.
I. Khoisan-Twa (oldest type still living on earth)
II. Saharans (W African-Bantu)
III.A. Ethiopioids (E African)
III.B. Eurasians (descended from two groups of Ethiopioids which entered Eurasia, then mixed and diversified in complex patterns.
This is the biology of it. Ethiopioids are not "white". Whites are a subset of Ethiopioids, cladistically speaking.
Eurasians are all more related to each other than to Africans. They left Africa 60,000 years ago. Tamil, Australian, Melanesian...the are in the same group with Mideasterners, Europeans, Siberians, Native Americans, E Asians, SE Asians, etc.
Traits which are visible (skin, hair, lips, nose, etc.) are trivial, involving relatively few genes. These trivial resemblances can NOT be used to classify humans into meaningful categories.
The idea of a "black (Negroid) race" and a "white (Caucasoid) race" and a "yellow (Mongoloid) race" are BOGUS concepts created by racist Euroimperialists who also thought that mice spontaneously generated from wet straw and that sea monsters would eat ships who strayed too far from land.
WHY do people still use their bogus racial categories in the scientific age? I suggest everyone read an introductory Physical Anthropology text regarding this.
quote:This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen..
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Well Duh, its 100% scientific...ofcourse it has no place in your mindset.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen..
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Ofcourse I am not Black
Originally posted by Sundjata:
^You're not Black you creep...
quote:It's 100% bullsh*t along with its arbitrarily placed/labeled sub-race nonsense.
It's 100% scientific
quote:No, it's slang for "get off Africa's nuts, you weird European"..
I am assuming Black is slang for Negrid?
quote:Freehand you have to understand that the only thing that matters to me as a Genetic nationalist is the lineage, it shows me common ancestory.
Originally posted by Freehand:
Interesting quotes and pictures
quote:Meaning that you're a white man with African DNA..
As a Sicilian
quote:I don't know maybe your still literally left behind in SubSaharan Africa
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:Meaning that Don't give me that bullcrap about them migrating to Europe because E and its derivatives never left Africa. So why isn't all that which is under E considered "Africanid"?
As a Sicilian
20% of the Balkans & Italy! Turkey, Syria, lebanon thats also Africa?
quote:
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:Maternal lineages don't define race, because they are shared by the Neolithic men who killed the males & took new females. Thus wiping out any maternal identity.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
Why do you ignore MtDNA lineages?? What does this lineage say about your overall genetic make-up given that it was likely due to one admixture episode in your genealogy with the vast majority of your ancestors being white European such as yourself?
Subsahran Africa was the last region were races
had female lineages, up until the Neo Negrid conquest of Subsaharan Africa fathering the females of the Paleolithic Negrids today mtDNA lineages are split into 2 to 4 subgroups depending on who you are speaking 2...
[/QB]
quote:50% of Southern Greece is Nil
Originally posted by Freehand:
Incorrect, E1b1b underived is near nil outside of Africa.
quote:All haplogroups originated in Africa at some point, Y-DNA is classified by the current distribution.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
why is it not called Africanid?? There is an abundance of e1b1a from America to Brazil, but that doesn't change its point of origin.
quote:Not true, all haplogroups [which are merely clusters of related haplotypes] do not have an African origin as they developed into said haplogroups after the people who carried said haplotypes left the continent. E never left. Neither has e1b1b or e1b1a, which both originate in Africa.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
All haplogroups originated in Africa at some point, Y-DNA is classified by the current distribution.
quote:So why do you call it Medit?? That it stupid as fu*k..
Add to that E1b1b is already pretty much classified as African
quote:Whatever, but you label e1b1b as medit yet it did not emerge in the "Med Sea" or anywhere near it, but in sub-Saharan east Africa (in the general area of Ethiopia-Somalia), as is universally confirmed.
Meditid Race in relation to the Med Sea (North Africa)
quote:But "Somalian" isn't a "race" and "Somalia" as a country is arbitrary with its borders colonially defined by your Italian ancestors. In addition, this only means that some time in the past, an east African man had sex with one of your female ancestors. That does not make you an east African but rather a white boy with Black ancestry Andy Milonakis.
** Somalid subrace in relation to the Somali people (East Africa)
quote:I understand the stupid concepts, point being that they're made up. A lineage does not define a race, especially a sub-lineage which only separates from its parent lineage by a few mutations. A few damn mutations man, and you're making entirely separate races out of them! This is a weird slippery slope.
** Beberid subrace in relation to the Berber people (Northwest Africa) [/QB]
quote:Go **** yourself already man.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Somalid E1b1b-M78 Distribution
quote:I am not as endowed as the equatorial Negrid Sudanid, but I think Somalids are similar in size to Neo Negrids, not an expert on this subject I have to ask my mom or your mom
Originally posted by akoben:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
[qb] Somalid E1b1b-M78 Distribution
^ they are ribbed esp. for Somalids. lol
, may be they confirm or dismiss the correlation between size & genotype
quote:Well? you get subraces that become races & eventually new species.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
A lineage does not define a race, especially a sub-lineage which only separates from its parent lineage by a few mutations. A few damn mutations man, and you're making entirely separate races out of them! This is a weird slippery slope.
quote:or maybe you can ask E3bcBBs, i've heard he's an expert on the subject
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
quote:I am not as endowed as the equatorial Negrid Sudanid, but I think Somalids are similar in size to Neo Negrids, not an expert on this subject I have to ask my mom or your mom
Originally posted by akoben:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
[qb] Somalid E1b1b-M78 Distribution
^ they are ribbed esp. for Somalids. lol
quote:Where does a "race" begin and end and what about mtDNA?? Also, again, why do you label e1b1b "Medit" when it has nothing to do with the Mediterranean sea (it originated and is most abundant in Africa)? Why is the entire E-haplogroup then, not "Africanid"?
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Well? you get subraces that become races & eventually new species.
What do you get from locking us up in the same gene pool? If you made $ out of it I can understand! Nothing, its better for all of us to accelerate our evolution & split into new races.
Isolation along the genetic lines is a necessity for a progressive evolution, a progressive evolution for me, you & everybody
Peace
quote:-- S.O.Y Keita. Exploring northeast African metric craniofacial variation at the individual level: A comparative study using principal component analysis. Am. J. Hum. Biol. 16:679–689, 2004.
"Recall that the Horn–Nile Valley crania show, as a group, the largest overlap with other regions. A review of the recent literature indicates that there are male lineage ties between African peoples who have been traditionally labeled as being ‘‘racially’’ different, with ‘‘racially’’ implying an ontologically deep divide. The PN2 transition, a Y chromosome marker, defines a lineage (within the YAPþ derived haplogroup E or III) that emerged in Africa probably before the last glacial maximum, but after the migration of modern humans from Africa (see Semino et al., 2004). This mutation forms a clade that has two daughter subclades (defined by the biallelic markers M35/215 (or 215/M35) and M2) that unites numerous phenotypically variant African populations from the supra-Saharan, Saharan, and sub-Saharan regions."
quote:I don't know maybe you can Expalin why the people of Med Sea;
Originally posted by Sundjata:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
why do you label e1b1b "Medit" when it has nothing to do with the Mediterranean sea (it originated and is most abundant in Africa)? Why is the entire E-haplogroup then, not "Africanid"?
quote:He keeps ignoring this question...
Originally posted by Freehand:
And what about the female lineages?
quote:The Heartland of Sudan -South- has little E1b1b comapred to Somalia & big % of Archaic A-M91 (Dinka, Nuer, Silhuk & West Ethiopia Equatorian region)
Originally posted by Freehand:
[QB] Actually, they are share derivations at high frequencies.
If anything, E1b1b1a should be Sudanid
quote:They classify 5 groups, most people classify 2 to 5 subgroups. mtDNA is shared by all people its hard to classify it more than that.
Originally posted by Sundjata:
quote:He keeps ignoring this question...
Originally posted by Freehand:
And what about the female lineages?
quote:I didn't understand
Originally posted by argyle104:
Interesting to see which posters avoid arguing with the braindead trash from that website that "The Bass" or whatever the dummy's name is this month.
You losers are wasting your life with dodona dung. : )
quote:Certainly not as high as the amount of dicks that penetrated your mothers dusty pussy.
are Somalis the dumbest people on the planet? What is the IQ of Somalis? LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL : )
quote:Phenotypic evolution yes, but what does this have to do with haplogroups who evolve or diverge in the same geographic locales??!
Originally posted by Shmulid_V13:
Damn it, evolution took place by geogrphic population movements.
quote:So if you admit that the label 'Europid' is essentially geographic in nature, so why attach them to specific genetic lineages that are not??
No cheetos I & R1 are both Europid from diff lineages, even a kid knows this! They became EUropids cause they frooze their ass in Europe back in the Ice Age. Even Europids have distant Negrid origin, at the end all Humans have a Negrid ancestor, but most evolved & added Non-Negrid mutations.
quote:But the vast majority of E1b1b carriers are NOT coastal! Also, you still fail to explain how E1b1b all of a sudden becomes non-negrid when its sibling lineage does not, when they both evolved or diverged at the same time and in the same area (Africa)! How do different lineages like R1 and I from different clades become the same 'race' by their carriers "freezing their asses" off in Europe as you say, but E3a and E3b which are not only born from the same parent but carried by guys who burned their asses off in Africa but not quite because of their black-skins all of a sudden divided racially??! Again, you offer NO logical let alone scientific explanation for this! You are aware that E1b1b is also predominant in Sub-Saharan East Africa. You should also be aware that many E1b1a carriers are also pastoralists as well as carriers of the parent lineage (E3*) underived and even non-E carriers are pastoralists. The Khoin-khoin pastoralists of South Africa for example, are coastal pastoralists who live in climatic zone non unlike the Mediterranean and don't carry E3b at all. Why are they not 'Meditids' but inland agriculturalist Siwa are??
E1b1b evolved out of the Supreme Negrid Lineage by migrationg North & adopting a Coastal Pastrolist lifestyle. Supreme Negrids continued to dominate SubSaharan Africa, becoming the prevailing male lineage (Neo Negrids)
quote:E-V13 did not arise in Africa, much less the "blacks" in the horn.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
E-V13 may be downstream but it still does not negate the fact of its origins-- among blacks of Africa! This is the ugly truth E3bc does not want to face.
quote:LOL, I've always found it funny that the when the "Nordics" in southern Europe were flourishing, the Nordics in the North were Illiterate. Surely the "Nordic" Element was higher in the North than the South yes?
Originally posted by Nordic Machine:
All this proves is that modern Greeks are mongrels. The ancient Greeks were mostly blue eyed Nordic Indo-Europeans.
quote:I know. It arose in Southwest Asia and the Aegean among peoples who descend from blacks of North Africa (E-V12), hence the rather African features of Neolithic Greeks!! And I notice you put the word blacks in quotes as if it is some loose or specious term like your "Negroids" which you still have not defined! You still deny the FACT that 'black' is not some loose political term of U.S. origin but is rather a concise description of very dark skin color used by many people around the world and not just the U.S. and that such a description was used millennia before the U.S. existed! You're Greek, so tell us what does the word melanos mean?? That was the word your ancient ancestors used to describe the Egyptians.
E-V13 did not arise in Africa, much less the "blacks" in the horn.
quote:But what is 'caucasoid'?? See, your problem like Somalid-V13 and SirInflame is that you like to toss words like "negroid" or "caucasoid" without ever specifying what they mean. Also, it still does not change the fact that the original E-V13 carriers were BLACKS of African descent just like the rest of their E1b1b carrying brethren the majority of whom are still in Africa!
Originally posted by e3b1c1:
correct
and dejuti i dont care i care if the person look caucasoide or black
and v13 carries look white so doe sm81 carries from magrheb and so does antolian m34 my clade found in them
e3b1c1
quote:I'd rather look like a monkey (even though I don't) than look like smeagol (whom must be your twin brother
Originally posted by argyle104:
Hey Yonis, Somalis not only resemble monkeys, but after watching a documentary on baboons I noticed a striking resemblance they also had with Somalis.
Yonis are those monkeys and baboons that are mirror images of Somalis, somalids also?
a wala wala, a walaheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!!
axixixuulicxcailiucil!!!
LOL!
). Wow I can't believe I missed this thread as I returned to this forum. This thread was started in February and it's 26 freakin' pages long!!!!!!!!! ) When will you realize that non-whites that are self hating HELP the White man and that the White man is not SUPERMAN and can do this on his own!!! When will you clowns realize that the White man can never do anything on his own he ALWAYS needs help to destroy non-whites. . I guess I can see why he believes this. ) cutting your mustache to look *Indian* and berating Afro Americans that visit Sweden under your breath as they give you an exorbitant amount of cash for your tip!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
quote:^^ INSANE!!! But he NEEDS this to cope with the reality that he is worthless lol.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
quote:Somalid is a unique profile of blood, everyone who carries this blood is a "Somalid", E1b1b is the scientific name of this blood. They all come from a single Northeast-African root, some more bastardized than others. Southern Greeks/Albanians/Anatolians and coastal levantines are watered down Somalids, northern Egyptians are also relatively watered down Somalids compared to cenral and southern Egyptians, same with kabyle and Riffian Berbers. 500 years from now if my male descendants continue living in northern Europe, they will all be watered down Somalids, but will still retain their Somalid signiture.
Originally posted by carambolas:
quote:There needs to be a definition of exactly what 'Somalid' is..
Originally posted by azkanasi ju:
Are there also "Somalid" Bantus, since Somalians are everywhere?
quote:LOLOLOLOL that was child-like cute I have to admit. Why do you keep winking in all your posts. This is all flame bait and the dumb nig nogs on here fall for it.
Originally posted by Yonis2:
We the Somalids can never be compared to any other people or group, our ancestors have laid seeds that flourished in three continents, Africa, Europe and Asia, we are a proud people, inprinted in our minds since we got borned, we inherently know that without us the human species would be nothing. And our ethnical base is NorthEast Africa.
All haters can go aside.
How can I blame White people or their sychophants for making fun of Blacks if they fall for it every time *shrugs*
quote:Why is it that Puerto Ricans always copy Afro Americans why do you keep posting what Rasol and others have posted for years as if this is something new?
Originally posted by MindoverMatter718:
quote:Listen kid,
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
There is no specific father for E1b1b!
E is great grandfather of all E lineages
E3 is one of the sons of E - E1 and E2 are other sons.
E3a and E3b are both sons of E3, E1 and E2 would therefore be uncles of E3
E3b1, E3b2, and E3b3 all are sons of E3b, E3a would therefore be and 'uncle' of E3b1, E3b2, and E3b3.
quote:Yet you just hate the *your words* (dark type-women there) and love EVERY other woman around the world because of their "light skin"
Originally posted by Herukhuti:
quote:To the contrary, I don't see African Americans as slaves, therefore there is no connection between them being 97% western African (genetically) and west Africa being a "slave resource". Again, to the contrary, I don't see west Africa as a "slave resource" but rather as a magical place, the most beautiful and satisfying place to be and be-from on earth. And it's the people that make it so.
Originally posted by argyle104:
Anyone who designates as you do that his people were the world's slave resource definitely has mental issues.
quote:
Originally posted by Apocalypse:
Somalid your death bed conversion (probably after the returns of a DNA test) to an embrace of your African "e3b brothers" is touching. However, its disingenuous and ludicrous. The absurdity of it is beyond belief.
At least when your hatred of blacks was based upon an assumed white superiority you had some basis to differentiate the objects of your hatred from your cohorts, namely, skin color. Now you're left in the untenable position of having to walk around with a DNA kit and swab to be able to determine with any accuracy your fellow E3b members in Africa. If someone randomly chose say 100 Africans from all over the continent and put them in a room and asked you to pick out your fellow E3b-ers - you wouldn't know where to start.
Additionally Somalid, where was the love for E3b-ers in 1938 when Mussolini promulgated the Manifesto Della Razza forbiding, among other things, marriage between "Aryan" Italians and "inferior" natives in their African colonies? Where was the love when they were committing atrocities against these colonised natives?
Where was the love for "somalids" in 1992 when the Italian army was accused of committing atrocities against Somalians?
Would you really go amongst Italians in Bensonhurst Brooklyn and wave wave your E3b card? Who are we kidding here?
quote:LOLOL!!!!!!!!!!1
Originally posted by argyle104:
bwaaahahahahahahahaa
Damn what happened Jeeves? Some infamous stock market baron lose his fortune, so he had to let you go?
hohohohhohaaaaaaahahahahahaaha!
quote:Evergreen Writes: The interesting thing is E-M78* dervived in NE Africa at a time when NE Africans resembled modern West Africans more than modern Horn of Africa populations. This makes sense within an evolutionary framework because both Eastern and Western African men derive from the common PN2 clade that derived in tropical Africa after the OOA migration of Eurasians.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Somalid E1b1b-M78 Distribution
quote:What does "resembling West Africans" mean? It's interesting when you see that when the so called AFricanists on this site address the crazy race dichotomy expressed on this site it's almost as if they respond because internally they believe what the crazy people say.
Originally posted by Evergreen:
quote:Evergreen Writes: The interesting thing is E-M78* dervived in NE Africa at a time when NE Africans resembled modern West Africans more than modern Horn of Africa populations. This makes sense within an evolutionary framework because both Eastern and Western African men derive from the common PN2 clade that derived in tropical Africa after the OOA migration of Eurasians.
Originally posted by Somalid_V13:
Somalid E1b1b-M78 Distribution
quote:Evergreen Writes: I didn't understand most of what you were trying to express. But to the point above, resembling modern West Africans means that in terms of phenotype or how they looked, they were closest to a Modern West African modal phenotype. Cranial and dental analysis was conducted on the skulls and they plotted nearest to modern West African populations. This same affinity was noted in the Natufians whose ancestors migrated out of NE AFrica and also some early neolithic Anatolian and SW European specimens.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
What does "resembling West Africans" mean?
quote:How is this important or paramount if West Africans come from East Africans? This "round faced" West Africa diatribe sounds like a new for of the "true negro" mythology. Do you see this or is it just me Evergreen?
Originally posted by Evergreen:
quote:Evergreen Writes: I didn't understand most of what you were trying to express. But to the point above, resembling modern West Africans means that in terms of phenotype or how they looked, they were closest to a Modern West African modal phenotype. Cranial and dental analysis was conducted on the skulls and they plotted nearest to modern West African populations. This same affinity was noted in the Natufians whose ancestors migrated out of NE AFrica and also some early neolithic Anatolian and SW European specimens.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
What does "resembling West Africans" mean?
quote:Evergreen Writes: It is important to apply a rigorous scientific approach to all of our research.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
[QUOTE]How is this important or paramount if West Africans come from East Africans?
quote:Evergreen Writes: Just the opposite. It is now recognized that there was a range of indigenous phenetic diversity within Africa dating to the early Upper Paleolithic period and that all humans within this range are equally African.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
[QUOTE] This "round faced" West Africa diatribe sounds like a new for of the "true negro" mythology.
quote:Ok cool, sounds good but then why did you say "stereotypical West African" it just doesn't make any sense to me I am not trying to be difficult I do respect your contributions Evergreen don't take this the wrong way
Originally posted by Evergreen:
quote:Evergreen Writes: It is important to apply a rigorous scientific approach to all of our research.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
[QUOTE]How is this important or paramount if West Africans come from East Africans?
quote:Evergreen Writes: Just the opposite. It is now recognized that there was a range of indigenous phenetic diversity within Africa dating to the early Upper Paleolithic period and that all humans within this range are equally African.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
[QUOTE] This "round faced" West Africa diatribe sounds like a new for of the "true negro" mythology.
quote:Evergreen Writes: Fair enough. I put "stereotypical West African" in quotes because people seem to have a preconcieved notion of what a West African should look like. There are definite trends which can be quantified and plotted for statistical analysis purposes. However, underneath these averages and modalities there is great variability in hair texture, melanin intensification, cranio-facial form etc.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
[QUOTE]Ok cool, sounds good but then why did you say "stereotypical West African" it just doesn't make any sense to me I am not trying to be difficult I do respect your contributions Evergreen don't take this the wrong way
quote:I do have a question though, how much melanin does one have to have to be black if they found a body that's been buried for thousands of years.
Originally posted by Evergreen:
quote:Evergreen Writes: Fair enough. I put "stereotypical West African" in quotes because people seem to have a preconcieved notion of what a West African should look like. There are definite trends which can be quantified and plotted for statistical analysis purposes. However, underneath these averages and modalities there is great variability in hair texture, melanin intensification, cranio-facial form etc.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
[QUOTE]Ok cool, sounds good but then why did you say "stereotypical West African" it just doesn't make any sense to me I am not trying to be difficult I do respect your contributions Evergreen don't take this the wrong way
quote:Evergreen Writes: When you say Black what do you mean? Based upon your definition what makes a person Black?
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
[QUOTE]I do have a question though, how much melanin does one have to have to be black if they found a body that's been buried for thousands of years.
Like, if a filipino died today and was dug up in a field 4000 years from now, save for lineage could it be possible for him to be mistaken for black considering they are dark skinned?
quote:Evergreen Writes: Please don't answer a question with a question.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
Since I started coming to this site I have asked for the definition of what "black" is and no one ever answers lol.
Can you tell me what "black" means, quantified and measured.
quote:Evergreen Writes: Who said the term Black was a racial term? It has never been used that way by Black Americans.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
Also, you do realize that "black" is a racial term and if you say you don't believe in "Race" then what happens to the term "black"?
quote:It was never coined by black Americans either Evergreen
Originally posted by Evergreen:
quote:Evergreen Writes: Please don't answer a question with a question.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
Since I started coming to this site I have asked for the definition of what "black" is and no one ever answers lol.
Can you tell me what "black" means, quantified and measured.
quote:Evergreen Writes: Who said the term Black was a racial term? It has never been used that way by Black Americans.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
Also, you do realize that "black" is a racial term and if you say you don't believe in "Race" then what happens to the term "black"?
It was coined by Europeans, but I see you as well will not answer my question so nevermind SMH.
quote:Evergreen Writes: You must be unfamiliar with the "Black Power Movement" when Blacks began to take on this name for themselves having formerly been refered to as "Negroes", etc. by Whites.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
quote:It was never coined by black Americans either Evergreen
Originally posted by Evergreen:
quote:Evergreen Writes: Please don't answer a question with a question.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
Since I started coming to this site I have asked for the definition of what "black" is and no one ever answers lol.
Can you tell me what "black" means, quantified and measured.
quote:Evergreen Writes: Who said the term Black was a racial term? It has never been used that way by Black Americans.
Originally posted by The_Killer_Wolofi:
Also, you do realize that "black" is a racial term and if you say you don't believe in "Race" then what happens to the term "black"?
---It's only a matter of time Negros, only a matter of time SMH---
quote:^^ His point still stands. Phenetic characteristics can still be passed from father to daughter.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
^ LOL Whatbox, you do realize that as fine as those lovely girls you posted are there is NO way they can carry E1b1 or any E lineages because of the simple fact that such lineages are carried on the Y-chromosome of males.
quote:lol, i don't believe in a person being an E1b1b or anything like that which is i wrote it like that (e.g. "an E1b1b", lol): purposely to poke fun at the way E3bsbs and xyy say things like "i'm somalid" or "I'm an E1b1a", as if it constitutes more than 0.1% of anyone's biological makeup if that (females -- i'm usually reminding everyone that haplotypes make up abysmal to nil percentages of anyone's DNA -- there use is to date and map population affinities, and possibly geographic origins for mutations).
Originally posted by Djehuti:
^ LOL Whatbox, you do realize that as fine as those lovely girls you posted are there is NO way they can carry E1b1 or any E lineages because of the simple fact that such lineages are carried on the Y-chromosome of males.
quote:LOL Indeed, you continue to project. Calling me a fabricator when it is YOU who continually lies and attributes false claims to others! And again no Mary Lefkowitz here, only Djehuti to strike your ass with his foot, but not his d*ck like your male clients.
Originally posted by assopen:
LOL it seems Mr Fabricator Mary Lefkowitz strikes again.
quote:Of course! I was just adding why it is nonsense to say that these luvlies have any E lineage. Also E or any SNPs of the Y-chromosome have NOTHING to do with phenetics anyway so even males who carry the lineages don't have any looks based upon the lineages.
Originally posted by Evergreen:
^^ His point still stands. Phenetic characteristics can still be passed from father to daughter.
quote:This is an Indonesian man, LMAO@ Jeeves not being able to tell the difference between indonesian man and African meanwhile trying to sound clever and enlighted
Whatbox wrote:
an "E1b1b" a "pirate"
quote:Correct. It is completely absurd and utterly ridiculous to not only assign 'race' to haplogroup which is independent of phenotype but to even seperate a haplogroup as non-black when it clearly originated in Africa! The morons who insist on calling E1b1b "caucasoid" fail to explain why that is or why the parent lineage and sibling lineage are not "caucasoid"!
Originally posted by Whatbox:
the insidious thing about the E1b1b E1b1a ideologically emphasized dichotomy, is that the focus is usually on de-Africanizing and Europeanizing the former while isolating the latter with the main focus being African Americans.
a.) that there actually are many genetic relationships accross the continent
b.) the NRY haplotypes we discuss are less than 0.1% of what makes anyone anyone -- and 0% for some (females don't usually carry Y chromes).
c.) the E1b1b "Europe-Africa" connection that people only want to even imply and emphasize in light of autocthronous ancient African contact with Europe and only to the purpose of watering the history down, only happens with offshoots of a derivative of a downstream lineage which is brother to E1b1a in the first place. And instead of affecting Southern Europe (w/ respect to Northern) this somehow is made out to have implications for West and East Africa, other than African ancestry in Europe!
d) In Europe R1a & R1b aren't treated this way. Nor either of those and I. Nor is J treated this way. J is J is J.
quote:Actually that name was given to you by your former pimp great jew, don't you remember? What about this..."the resident Asian fake ass wannabe who uses no less than the name of an African deity and the deity of all-knowledge at that" Thats him also, not me.
Originally posted by Djehuti:
quote:LOL Indeed, you continue to project. Calling me a fabricator
Originally posted by assopen:
LOL it seems Mr Fabricator Mary Lefkowitz strikes again.
