quote:Originally posted by Doug M: Mr Winters you know what you said doesn't even make sense. Blacks are not limited to Africa. You know that right? I mean this is silly.
You are right Blacks are not limited to Africa. There are the Melanesians, and pygmy groups that formerly lived in Eurasia. But these Tibetans are dark skinned but they lack African phenotypical features. They represent the mongoloid phenotype, large heads, and round faces.
You are naive. As a naive person you associate dark skin with negro heritage. This is a stupid idea, when you can look at a Tibetan and compare him to an African, Melanesian or Dravidian you can see that they do not look alike.
As a laymen you believe that just because people have dark skin they must be Black. This is a false analogy. There are features associated with different races that identify their racial origins.
This does not mean that Dravidian and Mande speaking people did not live in these lands before they were settled my mongoloid groups. .
Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
In 1300's many Malians sailed to the Americas. Although, most Malians settled in Brazil, Mexico and built the mounds along the Mississippi River, some Malians settled in Florida.
Some of the Malians were Muslims. The best evidence of Muslims in North America were the Jamassee/Yamassee. In the picture below we see many Muurs wearing Turbans and Kufic hats fighting the British.
The Muurs of Brazil and the American Carolinas also wore similar headgear in addition to Turbans.
Here we see the Malian ruler compared to the leader of the Yamassee soldiers fighting the British. Both indivuduals wear the headgear associated with Malian marines.
This can not be a coincidence. It is further proof of the Muurs in Brazil and the United States.
The picture of Nobel Drew Ali, founder of the Moorish Scientists continued the tradition of wearing Muurish military garb going back to the Colonial period of the United States.
The Indian on horseback is a negro or Black Native American. A negro is a person with:
1) Direct African or Black Asian ancestry
2) Brown to yellow complexion
Note the difference in skin tone between the mother, father and children.
3) Long limbs
4) shape of the head and face varies
5) flat to semi pointed nose ( traditionally some Negro/Black people like to pinch the noses of their children )with dark skin
Here is a picture of several Wolof engaged in a conversation. Note the individuals in the picture the person in the center facing you appears to have a flat nose; whereas the person facing the center person has a nose which appears to be semi-pointed.This highlights the various nose types found among negroes.
6) curly to straight hair
7) round to slanted eyes depending on the Negro group
Note the varying shape of the eyes evident in these negroes.
8) thick or thin lips
Some people believe that Filipino and other Asian people can be classified as Negroes because of their dark color. But a careful examination of the two clearly demonstrates differences between both group in facial features eventhough the shape of the eye may be the same.
Tanzanian
Filipino
Look at differences in the form of the head, forehead and mouth. Note both have flat noses but they are clearly different in how they are established.
Both children are hansome and well proportioned . Note also the color both are brown but the African has a more richer brown complexion.
Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
The Dravidians and Fijians claim they are related to Africans and came from Africa. This claim is supported by African haplogroups, place names, linguistic cognition, and phenotypical features.
The Tibetans do not make this claim.
Doug M let me ask you a question. Why do you maintain that Tibetans and Mongolians are Black when they don't acknowledge this fact?
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-------------------- C. A. Winters Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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The Indian on horseback is a negro or Black Native American. A negro is a person with:
1) Direct African or Black Asian ancestry
2) Brown to yellow complexion
Note the difference in skin tone between the mother, father and children.
3) Long limbs
4) shape of the head and face varies
5) flat to semi pointed nose ( traditionally some Negro/Black people like to pinch the noses of their children )with dark skin
Here is a picture of several Wolof engaged in a conversation. Note the individuals in the picture the person in the center facing you appears to have a flat nose; whereas the person facing the center person has a nose which appears to be semi-pointed.This highlights the various nose types found among negroes.
6) curly to straight hair
7) round to slanted eyes depending on the Negro group
Note the varying shape of the eyes evident in these negroes.
8) thick or thin lips
Some people believe that Filipino and other Asian people can be classified as Negroes because of their dark color. But a careful examination of the two clearly demonstrates differences between both group in facial features eventhough the shape of the eye may be the same.
Tanzanian
Filipino
Look at differences in the form of the head, forehead and mouth. Note both have flat noses but they are clearly different in how they are established.
Both children are hansome and well proportioned . Note also the color both are brown but the African has a more richer brown complexion.
Clyde you are contradicting yourself. First you say that blacks in Asia aren't black if they are Mongols but Asian blacks are blacks.... And then that any range of features with dark skin are black features, even slanted eyes. But not the mongols with dark skin and slanted eyes.
And of course those blacks are all "Muurs". Even though there is nothing in Malian history where the Malians called themselves Moors. Let alone any evidence that dark skin in the Americas came directly from Africa and not through Asia. You are simply making up facts to present a garbage argument.
And you compare Negroes from Africa with Afros with black Natives in America with straight hair.... None of those Africans look like a native American. Yet you persist with that nonsense.
And the retarded part about this is that the recent invasion of Mali by lighter skinned populations and Al-Qaeda have been labelled as Moors. And YOU want to identify with that?
You are way off the path.
All human facial features come from aboriginal black populations, including European features. It is that simple. And that is true all over the planet.
Posts: 8897 | Registered: May 2005
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The Indian on horseback is a negro or Black Native American. A negro is a person with:
1) Direct African or Black Asian ancestry
2) Brown to yellow complexion
Note the difference in skin tone between the mother, father and children.
3) Long limbs
4) shape of the head and face varies
5) flat to semi pointed nose ( traditionally some Negro/Black people like to pinch the noses of their children )with dark skin
Here is a picture of several Wolof engaged in a conversation. Note the individuals in the picture the person in the center facing you appears to have a flat nose; whereas the person facing the center person has a nose which appears to be semi-pointed.This highlights the various nose types found among negroes.
6) curly to straight hair
7) round to slanted eyes depending on the Negro group
Note the varying shape of the eyes evident in these negroes.
8) thick or thin lips
Some people believe that Filipino and other Asian people can be classified as Negroes because of their dark color. But a careful examination of the two clearly demonstrates differences between both group in facial features eventhough the shape of the eye may be the same.
Tanzanian
Filipino
Look at differences in the form of the head, forehead and mouth. Note both have flat noses but they are clearly different in how they are established.
Both children are hansome and well proportioned . Note also the color both are brown but the African has a more richer brown complexion.
Clyde you are contradicting yourself. First you say that blacks in Asia aren't black if they are Mongols but Asian blacks are blacks.... And then that any range of features with dark skin are black features, even slanted eyes. But not the mongols with dark skin and slanted eyes.
And of course those blacks are all "Muurs". Even though there is nothing in Malian history where the Malians called themselves Moors. Let alone any evidence that dark skin in the Americas came directly from Africa and not through Asia. You are simply making up facts to present a garbage argument.
And you compare Negroes from Africa with Afros with black Natives in America with straight hair.... None of those Africans look like a native American. Yet you persist with that nonsense.
And the retarded part about this is that the recent invasion of Mali by lighter skinned populations and Al-Qaeda have been labelled as Moors. And YOU want to identify with that?
You are way off the path.
All human facial features come from aboriginal black populations, including European features. It is that simple. And that is true all over the planet.
You write stupid stuff. I made it clear that the Yamassee and some other Back Native Americans were Muurs. I didn't say all Black Native Americans were Muurs. You act as if Black and African people don't have various types of hair.
There is no contradiction I explained what make a person a negro. The Tibetans and Mongolians are not Black or negro people except in your mind.
Granted man originated in Africa, but certain populations: SubSaharan African, Western Europeans and Mongoloid people have specific phenotypical features which allows us to differentiate each population into different races. As a result, you can not make Asians, SubSaharan Africans, or a Chinese man into an African.
quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol # Ish Gebor:
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,:
quote:Originally posted by Troll Patrol # Ish Gebor: [qb]
quote:Originally posted by the lioness,: [qb] The idea that Moors taught the American Indians how to farm and write is stupid and an insult to native Americans
Yes, it is an insult, you've been supporting when it comes to Africa/ Africans.
The idea that Moors taught the American Indians how to farm and write is stupid and an insult to Native Americans
and is an insult to Native Americans which I have NOT been supporting. fool Read it again
Yes, it is an insult, you've been supporting when it comes to Africa/ Africans. Read it again.
The idea that Moors taught the American Indians how to farm and write is stupid and an insult to Native Americans
and is an insult to Native Americans and that idea I have NOT been supporting. fool Read it again
As for Africans, it does not support Africans to make up false stories of how moors introduced civilization to the "Mongoloids"
That is racist colonial thinking
So basically you're telling me that you're a racist colonial thinker. I always suspected this, but now I am certain.
Posts: 22243 | From: האם אינכם כילדי הכרית אלי בני ישראל | Registered: Nov 2010
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posted
Adam is the 1st Son of God, His Mission was Probably to teach the peoples a better way of knowing God the Father. They Were Probably Black There were Probably Peoples on the earth Before Adam and Eve.
Why I write this because of what is said in Genesis 4:15 Read:
quote: Genesis 4:15 But the LORD said, Not so anyone who kills cain will suffer vengeance seven times over
^^So there were Peoples on Earth Before Adam and Eve.
The People have been One from the beginning and All Features belong to ALL People.
Look at these Pics to understand:
Mulu Solomon Ethiopian Chamber of Commerce
Nikki, Philipino Writer
Will Post More later
Posts: 9651 | From: Reace and Love City. | Registered: Oct 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Child Of The KING: Adam is the 1st Son of God, His Mission was Probably to teach the peoples a better way of knowing God the Father. They Were Probably Black There were Probably Peoples on the earth Before Adam and Eve.
Why I write this because of what is said in Genesis 4:15 Read:
quote: Genesis 4:15 But the LORD said, Not so anyone who kills cain will suffer vengeance seven times over
^^So there were Peoples on Earth Before Adam and Eve.
The People have been One from the beginning and All Features belong to ALL People.
Look at these Pics to understand:
Mulu Solomon Ethiopian Chamber of Commerce
Nikki, Philipino Writer
Will Post More later
You are right there were people before Adam. Remember that's why Cain was afraid someone would kill him after he left Adam. Genesis 4 :
quote:
11And now art thou cursed from the earth, which hath opened her mouth to receive thy brother's blood from thy hand;
12When thou tillest the ground, it shall not henceforth yield unto thee her strength; a fugitive and a vagabond shalt thou be in the earth.
13And Cain said unto the LORD, My punishment is greater than I can bear.
14Behold, thou hast driven me out this day from the face of the earth; and from thy face shall I be hid; and I shall be a fugitive and a vagabond in the earth; and it shall come to pass, that every one that findeth me shall slay me.
15And the LORD said unto him, Therefore whosoever slayeth Cain, vengeance shall be taken on him sevenfold. And the LORD set a mark upon Cain, lest any finding him should kill him.
16And Cain went out from the presence of the LORD, and dwelt in the land of Nod, on the east of Eden.
It is interesting that new races or populations have claims that they originally lived in the mountains. The Hua or Chinese refer to the Tien Shan, the Caucasians recall a homeland in the Caucasas Mountains, and the Egyptians mention the Mountains of the Moon.
It appears to me that God shelters new populations in the higlands and after a catastrophe, they leave their mountain homes to replace populations that may have been wiped out due to extreme floods and mega-eartquakes.
Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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The Indian on horseback is a negro or Black Native American. A negro is a person with:
1) Direct African or Black Asian ancestry
2) Brown to yellow complexion
Note the difference in skin tone between the mother, father and children.
3) Long limbs
4) shape of the head and face varies
5) flat to semi pointed nose ( traditionally some Negro/Black people like to pinch the noses of their children )with dark skin
Here is a picture of several Wolof engaged in a conversation. Note the individuals in the picture the person in the center facing you appears to have a flat nose; whereas the person facing the center person has a nose which appears to be semi-pointed.This highlights the various nose types found among negroes.
6) curly to straight hair
7) round to slanted eyes depending on the Negro group
Note the varying shape of the eyes evident in these negroes.
8) thick or thin lips
Some people believe that Filipino and other Asian people can be classified as Negroes because of their dark color. But a careful examination of the two clearly demonstrates differences between both group in facial features eventhough the shape of the eye may be the same.
Tanzanian
Filipino
Look at differences in the form of the head, forehead and mouth. Note both have flat noses but they are clearly different in how they are established.
Both children are hansome and well proportioned . Note also the color both are brown but the African has a more richer brown complexion.
Clyde you are contradicting yourself. First you say that blacks in Asia aren't black if they are Mongols but Asian blacks are blacks.... And then that any range of features with dark skin are black features, even slanted eyes. But not the mongols with dark skin and slanted eyes.
And of course those blacks are all "Muurs". Even though there is nothing in Malian history where the Malians called themselves Moors. Let alone any evidence that dark skin in the Americas came directly from Africa and not through Asia. You are simply making up facts to present a garbage argument.
And you compare Negroes from Africa with Afros with black Natives in America with straight hair.... None of those Africans look like a native American. Yet you persist with that nonsense.
And the retarded part about this is that the recent invasion of Mali by lighter skinned populations and Al-Qaeda have been labelled as Moors. And YOU want to identify with that?
You are way off the path.
All human facial features come from aboriginal black populations, including European features. It is that simple. And that is true all over the planet.
You write stupid stuff. I made it clear that the Yamassee and some other Back Native Americans were Muurs. I didn't say all Black Native Americans were Muurs. You act as if Black and African people don't have various types of hair.
There is no contradiction I explained what make a person a negro. The Tibetans and Mongolians are not Black or negro people except in your mind.
Granted man originated in Africa, but certain populations: SubSaharan African, Western Europeans and Mongoloid people have specific phenotypical features which allows us to differentiate each population into different races. As a result, you can not make Asians, SubSaharan Africans, or a Chinese man into an African.
You stil haven't answered my question
.
Clyde if you dont get it by now you are denying that the first populations of the US came from Asia and that they were of primarily aboriginal Asian stock, meaning dark. So what you are saying is you can distinguish between those Aborigines bsed on "features" but as we have said before, ALL the PaleoAmericans had those features. That is what I mean by aborigine. So if those blacks were already here the how did some Africans introduce those features later? You don't undrstand diversity and you are oversimplifying the issue. If ALL humans came from Africans then the further you go back the MORE they look African. So you are contradicting yourself. Early Asians may have looked African but they were still Asians.
Perfect example of what I mean.... Nagaland North India:
quote:Originally posted by Doug M: Clyde if you dont get it by now you are denying that the first populations of the US came from Asia and that they were of primarily aboriginal Asian stock, meaning dark. So what you are saying is you can distinguish between those Aborigines based on "features" but as we have said before, ALL the PaleoAmericans had those features. That is what I mean by aborigine. So if those blacks were already here the how did some Africans introduce those features later? You don't undrstand diversity and you are oversimplifying the issue. If ALL humans came from Africans then the further you go back the MORE they look African. So you are contradicting yourself. Early Asians may have looked African but they were still Asians.
Perfect example of what I mean.... Nagaland North India:
These Naga Asians only recently came to India. The original Naga were Ethiopians. They have nothing to do with India. Stop talking about places whose history you know nothing about.
What evidence do you have that the paleoamericans came from Asia. The first paleoamericans lived in Brazil 65kya. How did they get here with Ice covering the Beringa Straits?
You're stupid. You make comments without checking the literature. The Paleoamericans were phenotypically African or Australian. They are not phenotypically Asian. The first Asians do not appear until 6kya.
Due to the Ice Age, the Blacks had to have come directly from Africa 65kya.
As I said,"How are dark mongoloids , Blacks?"
Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Doug M: Clyde if you dont get it by now you are denying that the first populations of the US came from Asia and that they were of primarily aboriginal Asian stock, meaning dark. So what you are saying is you can distinguish between those Aborigines based on "features" but as we have said before, ALL the PaleoAmericans had those features. That is what I mean by aborigine. So if those blacks were already here the how did some Africans introduce those features later? You don't undrstand diversity and you are oversimplifying the issue. If ALL humans came from Africans then the further you go back the MORE they look African. So you are contradicting yourself. Early Asians may have looked African but they were still Asians.
Perfect example of what I mean.... Nagaland North India:
What evidence do you have that the paleoamericans came from Asia. The first paleoamericans lived in Brazil 65kya. How did they get here with Ice covering the Beringa Straits?
You're stupid. You make comments without checking the literature. The Paleoamericans were phenotypically African or Australian. They are not phenotypically Asian. The first Asians do not appear until 6kya.
Due to the Ice Age, the Blacks had to have come directly from Africa 65kya.
As I said,"How are dark mongoloids , Blacks?"
Clyde Australians are aboriginal Asians or do you know what on earth you are talking about? That is what I said earlier "Aboriinal Asians". The Australians are just ONE GROUP of Australian aboriginal types and there were others all over Asia, including your precious Mongolians. That is the problem with you and your arbitrary identification of populaions with Africa. Technically what you are referring to is a specific subset of tropical adapted features which arose first in Africa but also spread around the world. But just like Australian Aborigines and Papua Aborigines are not "African" as in just recently left Africa, neither were the dark PaleoAmericans.
I am totally still waiting for serious proof of direct African contact between the Americas and Africa, which I know for sure is a fact. However, with you mixing up apples and oranges it is hard to get to the bottom of this because of your insistence on going off on wild tangents and not sticking with the core facts......
Don't you understand that 20,000 years ago most Asians looked more like PaleoAmericans, as in Aboriginal/Africans? Or don't you understand what paleo means?
Posts: 8897 | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Doug M: Clyde if you dont get it by now you are denying that the first populations of the US came from Asia and that they were of primarily aboriginal Asian stock, meaning dark. So what you are saying is you can distinguish between those Aborigines based on "features" but as we have said before, ALL the PaleoAmericans had those features. That is what I mean by aborigine. So if those blacks were already here the how did some Africans introduce those features later? You don't undrstand diversity and you are oversimplifying the issue. If ALL humans came from Africans then the further you go back the MORE they look African. So you are contradicting yourself. Early Asians may have looked African but they were still Asians.
Perfect example of what I mean.... Nagaland North India:
What evidence do you have that the paleoamericans came from Asia. The first paleoamericans lived in Brazil 65kya. How did they get here with Ice covering the Beringa Straits?
You're stupid. You make comments without checking the literature. The Paleoamericans were phenotypically African or Australian. They are not phenotypically Asian. The first Asians do not appear until 6kya.
Due to the Ice Age, the Blacks had to have come directly from Africa 65kya.
As I said,"How are dark mongoloids , Blacks?"
Clyde Australians are aboriginal Asians or do you know what on earth you are talking about?
Correct. And Australians are considered Negroes, not dark skinned mongoloids.
quote:Originally posted by Doug M: Clyde if you dont get it by now you are denying that the first populations of the US came from Asia and that they were of primarily aboriginal Asian stock, meaning dark. So what you are saying is you can distinguish between those Aborigines based on "features" but as we have said before, ALL the PaleoAmericans had those features. That is what I mean by aborigine. So if those blacks were already here the how did some Africans introduce those features later? You don't undrstand diversity and you are oversimplifying the issue. If ALL humans came from Africans then the further you go back the MORE they look African. So you are contradicting yourself. Early Asians may have looked African but they were still Asians.
Perfect example of what I mean.... Nagaland North India:
What evidence do you have that the paleoamericans came from Asia. The first paleoamericans lived in Brazil 65kya. How did they get here with Ice covering the Beringa Straits?
You're stupid. You make comments without checking the literature. The Paleoamericans were phenotypically African or Australian. They are not phenotypically Asian. The first Asians do not appear until 6kya.
Due to the Ice Age, the Blacks had to have come directly from Africa 65kya.
As I said,"How are dark mongoloids , Blacks?"
Clyde Australians are aboriginal Asians or do you know what on earth you are talking about?
Correct. And Australians are considered Negroes, not dark skinned mongoloids.
.
.
Clyde you do know that the first so called mongoloids were dark skin aboriginal type people or don't you get it? But this is where you and I disagree because you seem to be stuck on the artificial racial characteristics created by Europeans. There are today and have always been dark mongolians/Tibetans. And 20,000 yeas ago there were a lot more of them and it is from that population that you get the original Americans....
quote:Originally posted by Doug M: Clyde if you dont get it by now you are denying that the first populations of the US came from Asia and that they were of primarily aboriginal Asian stock, meaning dark. So what you are saying is you can distinguish between those Aborigines based on "features" but as we have said before, ALL the PaleoAmericans had those features. That is what I mean by aborigine. So if those blacks were already here the how did some Africans introduce those features later? You don't undrstand diversity and you are oversimplifying the issue. If ALL humans came from Africans then the further you go back the MORE they look African. So you are contradicting yourself. Early Asians may have looked African but they were still Asians.
Perfect example of what I mean.... Nagaland North India:
What evidence do you have that the paleoamericans came from Asia. The first paleoamericans lived in Brazil 65kya. How did they get here with Ice covering the Beringa Straits?
You're stupid. You make comments without checking the literature. The Paleoamericans were phenotypically African or Australian. They are not phenotypically Asian. The first Asians do not appear until 6kya.
Due to the Ice Age, the Blacks had to have come directly from Africa 65kya.
As I said,"How are dark mongoloids , Blacks?"
Clyde Australians are aboriginal Asians or do you know what on earth you are talking about?
Correct. And Australians are considered Negroes, not dark skinned mongoloids.
.
.
Clyde you do know that the first so called mongoloids were dark skin aboriginal type people or don't you get it? But this is where you and I disagree because you seem to be stuck on the artificial racial characteristics created by Europeans. There are today and have always been dark mongolians/Tibetans. And 20,000 yeas ago there were a lot more of them and it is from that population that you get the original Americans....
Your comments are ludicris. Please cite the paper that says the first mongoloids were negroes. How can a negro be a negro and a mongoloid at the say time.
The oldest Asian skeletal remains are of Negroes not mongoloid people.
quote:Originally posted by Doug M: Clyde if you dont get it by now you are denying that the first populations of the US came from Asia and that they were of primarily aboriginal Asian stock, meaning dark. So what you are saying is you can distinguish between those Aborigines based on "features" but as we have said before, ALL the PaleoAmericans had those features. That is what I mean by aborigine. So if those blacks were already here the how did some Africans introduce those features later? You don't undrstand diversity and you are oversimplifying the issue. If ALL humans came from Africans then the further you go back the MORE they look African. So you are contradicting yourself. Early Asians may have looked African but they were still Asians.
Perfect example of what I mean.... Nagaland North India:
What evidence do you have that the paleoamericans came from Asia. The first paleoamericans lived in Brazil 65kya. How did they get here with Ice covering the Beringa Straits?
You're stupid. You make comments without checking the literature. The Paleoamericans were phenotypically African or Australian. They are not phenotypically Asian. The first Asians do not appear until 6kya.
Due to the Ice Age, the Blacks had to have come directly from Africa 65kya.
As I said,"How are dark mongoloids , Blacks?"
Clyde Australians are aboriginal Asians or do you know what on earth you are talking about?
Correct. And Australians are considered Negroes, not dark skinned mongoloids.
.
.
Clyde you do know that the first so called mongoloids were dark skin aboriginal type people or don't you get it? But this is where you and I disagree because you seem to be stuck on the artificial racial characteristics created by Europeans. There are today and have always been dark mongolians/Tibetans. And 20,000 yeas ago there were a lot more of them and it is from that population that you get the original Americans....
Your comments are ludicris. Please cite the paper that says the first mongoloids were negroes. How can a negro be a negro and a mongoloid at the say time.
The oldest Asian skeletal remains are of Negroes not mongoloid people.
.
.
Clyde you don't understand what I said. I said that 20,000 years ago the so called Mongoloids were much darker on average than now with similar features and that they are the population from which native Americans derive....
Period.
You are simply trying to avoid this FACT by denying it and pretending that dark so-called Mongoloids don't or haven't existed not because of any biology but because you are stuck on trying to prove that black native americans were Africans and not Aboriginal black Asians which included black "mongoloid" type Asians.
Which is nonsense.
Australian Aborigines left Australia over 60,000 years ago. They are Asians not Africans. Similarly other black Asian aborigines whether from New Guinea, Fiji or anywhere else are also Asians and not Africans.
posted
A good example of the Malians in the North America are the Nanticokes. The Nanticokes were described by B.S Barton as very dark. This tribe of Black Native Americans formerly lived in the Chesapeake Bay and Delaware. They later settled in Wyoming, Oklahoma and Canada.
During the Revolutionary War, the Nanticoke sided with the British and many Nanticoke migrated to Canada, while others went into hiding or moved out West. By 1867, the Nanticoke moved to Kansas with the Lenape. There chiefdoms were called Monie, Wicomoco and Manokin (,Mandekan ?).
In 1741-51, J.C. Pyrlaeus collected the Numerals of the Nanticoke. This was before the Revolutionary War. Around this time the Conoy people joined their tribe.
The numerals collected by Pyrlaeus when they were compared to other numerals by Murray in 1873, they did not match numerals in any known Indian language. Brinton found that they were identical to Malinke-Bambara numerals.
These numerals make it clear the Nanticoke were descendants of the Malian explorers.
Below are Nanticoke at the Lenape-Nanticoke annual celebration.
posted
^^^Credit Clyde Winters for Posting the Picture of the Youngsta that looks exactly like this Elder from 1896
Otoe man - 1896 Otoe or Oto are a Midwestern Native American tribe. The Otoe language, Chiwere, is part of the Siouan family and closely related to that of the related Iowa and Missouri tribes.
Posts: 9651 | From: Reace and Love City. | Registered: Oct 2005
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Around 25,000 Mande speakers set sail for the Americas in the 1300’s from the Mali Empire of West Africa. Some of these Mande speakers may have been the ancestors of the Nanticoke.
In A.D. 1312, Emperor Abubakari Muhammad , of Mali gave his throne to Mansa Musa and embarked with his fleet into the Atlantic Ocean in search of the continent opposite Africa. Archaeological and epigraphic evidence indicates that Abubakari, and or members of his expedition settled in pre-Columbian Brazil.
The Indians have a tradition that Mansar Akban was the leader of another tribe which discovered the Cunan people.This Mansar Akban, may be a reference to Mansa Abubakari, who led the Malian voyagers to the Americas.
The Manding lived in mounds along the Niger rivers. The mound cultures of ancient America were built by Africans primarily Manding. The people of the Niger Delta formed river riverine communities which were partly vegetation with some aquatic animals were eaten.
The ancient Manding built several types of homes. In ancient times they built masonry houses and cliff dwellings identical to those found in the American Southwest. In Medieval times they lived on mounds in the most watery areas in their circular huts made a stone and wood on the top and their fields in front of the mounds tilled each day.
The Malian people introduced their technology to the Americas. The Manding built dwellings depending on the topography . Near rivers they lived on mounds. In semi-arid regions they lived in cliff houses, like those found in the Southwest. Today the Dogon who trace their descent to the Mande live in identical dwellings as those found in Colorado ,where Manding inscriptions dating to the A.D. 1000 's have been found related to the Pueblo culture.
According to Cadamosto the Mali marines wore white caps on their heads and a white tunic. On the side of the skull-caps worn by the Malian martines, a white wing decoration was emblaxoned, and a feather was stuck in the middle of the skull cap.
On board each naval vessel stood a marine with a round leather shield on the arm and a short sword. Other marines were armed with bows and arrows .
Murphy reported that the Malian military wore a uniform consisting of sandles, loose fitting cotton breeches reaching down to the knees, a sleeveless tunic, and a white headdress of either cotton or leather, decorated with one or more feathers .
The major weapons of the Malian soldier included iron-pointed spears, daggers and short swords, wooden battle-clubs and the bow and arrow .
The Malians left many inscriptions in the United States and elsewhere after they arrived in the Americas. These inscriptions are of two kinds. One group of inscriptions were meant to warn the Manding expeditionary force not to camp in certain areas.
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Daniel G. Brinton, in On Certain Supposed Words, Shown to be of African Origin (Am. Antiquarian and Oriental Journal (1887) ), argues that the Mande numerals recorded by J.C. Pyrlaeus, were probably the numerals of a run away slave, because they were of Mande origin. This was pure speculation on Brinton’s part because there were many Black Native American tribes on the Eastern coast of North America.
This was speculation on Brinton’s part, because he acts as if Pyrlaeus would have been unfamiliar with the Indians where he lived. Also, because the Nanticokes were very dark Brinton due to emphasis on Blacks being mainly slaves just assumed that the Nanticoke could not be Indian, since they were dark skinned. Although this is Dr. Brinton’s opinion there are a number of historical events relating to the Nanticoke
This list of words comes from a certain Mrs. Mulberry. Below is a comparison of the original Nanticoke numerals collected by J.C. Pyrlaeus, and the vocabulary collected by Murray
If you make a perusal of the comparison of the Murray Nanticoke and Lanape the numerals are just about the same.
Pyrlaeus collected the numerals in 1741, this was 50 years before Murray collected his vocabulary. By this time the Nanticoke had been separated. They originally lived in Delaware See: map
By this time most Nanticoke had moved to Wyoming, Pennsylvania and even New York. Because the Nanticoke fought with the Bristish during the Revolutionary War, many were resettled in Canada. Mrs. Mulberry lived along the Choptank River. As a result , of the Revolutionary War and European encroachment of Nanticoke land the Nanticoke, had joined the Lenape tribe. It is obvious from this word list and numerals collected by Murray by 1792, many Nanticoke were mainly speaking Lenape. This would explain the similarity between the Murray Nanticoke numerals and the Lenape numerals.
The Nanticoke numerals collected by Father Pyrlaeus indicate that Mande speakers lived in the Chesapeake Bay and Delaware, and contributed to the rise of the Nanticoke Nation. The Murray list of Nanticoke in no way means that the Nanticoke did not originally speak a Mande languages. It just shows that after 50 plus years of the Nanticoke living among the Lenape, most of the Nanticoke were speaking Lenape instead of their native language.
-------------------- C. A. Winters Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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The Mongoloid Indians adopted many Muurish traditions such as wearing Turbans and using the Mande/Vai writing system to write their language. Here is a picture of Sequoyah to show this reality.
It is ironic. The Cherokee learned to farm , write and other elements of their culture from the Black Native Americans, yet today they claim, the only Black Indians, were their African slaves.
People will do anything to steal the history of Afro-American and Black people. Especially the history of the Muurs....
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Clyde why are you lying and trying to steal from the Native Americans? Turbans related to the Islamic moors of North Africa are not Native American and the Moors did not introduce farming to the Native Americans, that is complete foolishness
The Cherokee Turban came to be from the fact that, in the 1600's, a group of Englishmen took a small group of Cherokee chiefs and warriors to England to meet the king. Just before they were to enter the throne room, the Englishmen decided that the Cherokee warriors were not dressed properly to be presented to the king. So, in looking around for something more appropriate to dress the Cherokee in, they found some old linen shirts from the time, and some turbans that were left over from some officials from India. They dressed the Cherokee in this attire to meet the king. They were allowed to keep these items when they were brought back to their village. Since then, other Cherokee, Choctaw, Shawnee, Seminole, and Chickasaw began wearing this type of head gear for ceremonies and Special functions. Since east of the Mississippi was a vast forest, it was not practical for the feathered war bonnets like the plains tribes had to be worn in this area. The turban was close to the head and light to wear. It also helps keep the head warm in Winter!
_________________
This is bs. Carolina Indians who were not Muslim inspired wore feathers,as did Africans in Africa. The Yamassee were not taken to visit the English crown. They were mainly at war with the Europeans so they did not adapt this custom from the English.
You expect soembody to believe that the Yamassee and other Black tribes adopted this from the British, when they did not recognize the English culture as superior to their own.
You are the one lying. Islam was already here as proven by the Yamassee fighting the British. This Muurs, did not respect the British.
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\
Clyde
Thanks for spreading truth and wisdom.
Guys take a look at this picture. Observe the pendant on his necklace.... The star and the crescent.... and the scimitar.
The symbols of the Muurs of Muuritania!
MUURZ! Posts: 7419 | From: North America | Registered: Mar 2009
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The Mongoloid Indians adopted many Muurish traditions such as wearing Turbans and using the Mande/Vai writing system to write their language. Here is a picture of Sequoyah to show this reality.
It is ironic. The Cherokee learned to farm , write and other elements of their culture from the Black Native Americans, yet today they claim, the only Black Indians, were their African slaves.
People will do anything to steal the history of Afro-American and Black people. Especially the history of the Muurs....
.
Clyde why are you lying and trying to steal from the Native Americans? Turbans related to the Islamic moors of North Africa are not Native American and the Moors did not introduce farming to the Native Americans, that is complete foolishness
The Cherokee Turban came to be from the fact that, in the 1600's, a group of Englishmen took a small group of Cherokee chiefs and warriors to England to meet the king. Just before they were to enter the throne room, the Englishmen decided that the Cherokee warriors were not dressed properly to be presented to the king. So, in looking around for something more appropriate to dress the Cherokee in, they found some old linen shirts from the time, and some turbans that were left over from some officials from India. They dressed the Cherokee in this attire to meet the king. They were allowed to keep these items when they were brought back to their village. Since then, other Cherokee, Choctaw, Shawnee, Seminole, and Chickasaw began wearing this type of head gear for ceremonies and Special functions. Since east of the Mississippi was a vast forest, it was not practical for the feathered war bonnets like the plains tribes had to be worn in this area. The turban was close to the head and light to wear. It also helps keep the head warm in Winter!
_________________
This is bs. Carolina Indians who were not Muslim inspired wore feathers,as did Africans in Africa. The Yamassee were not taken to visit the English crown. They were mainly at war with the Europeans so they did not adapt this custom from the English.
You expect soembody to believe that the Yamassee and other Black tribes adopted this from the British, when they did not recognize the English culture as superior to their own.
You are the one lying. Islam was already here as proven by the Yamassee fighting the British. This Muurs, did not respect the British.
.
\
Clyde
Thanks for spreading truth and wisdom.
Guys take a look at this picture. Observe the pendant on his necklace.... The star and the crescent.... and the scimitar.
The symbols of the Muurs of Muuritania!
MUURZ!
Despite its theme, the Shriners are not connected to Arab culture or Islam. It is a men's fraternity rather than a religion or religious group. Its only religious requirement is indirect: all Shriners must be Masons (with the exception being in the State of Arkansas), and petitioners to Freemasonry must profess a belief in a Supreme Being.
Fleming created the ritual, emblem and costumes. Florence and Fleming were initiated August 13, 1870, and initiated 11 other men on June 16, 1871
Walter Millard Fleming was a prominent physician and surgeon. Born in 1838, he obtained a degree in medicine in Albany, N.Y., in 1862. During the Civil War, he was a surgeon with the 13th New York Infantry Brigade of the National Guard. He then practiced medicine in Rochester, New York, until 1868, when he moved to New York City and quickly became a leading practitioner. He was also co-founder of the Shriners, a Masonic Order along with William J. Conlin. Fleming is listed as member #1 in the 1904 Report of Mecca Temple, NY, NY.
The emblem on the front of the fez, the crescent and scimitar, is an important part of the fraternity’s theme, and is representative of the characteristics embodied by the Shriners.
The scimitar stands for the backbone of the fraternity, its members.
The two claws are for the Shriners fraternity and its philanthropy.
The sphinx stands for the governing body of the Shriners.
The five-pointed star represents the thousands of children helped by the philanthropy each year.
The emblem also bears the phrase “Robur et Furor,” which means “Strength and Fury.”
I believe that there may be some truth to Clyde Winters statement about Tibetans being negroid or African.
One of the observations which led me to take Mike's theories seriously was seeing a picture of a man with the hair type Khoisan of man clearly labelled as Tibetan. He was a Tibetan, the picture was taken in Tibet and he was clearly dressed in Tibetan clothes.
The relation between Tibet and black people is that Jarawa people (ie Andaman Islanders) have a gene which is found among Tibetan people so the idea may not be that farfetched.
Don't forget Guatama Buddha too, who was from Nepal, who is also portrayed with peppercorn hair as well.
-------------------- The Habsburg Agenda - Defending Western Christian civilization Posts: 890 | From: London | Registered: Apr 2014
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posted
^ No. Supposedly, the history of freemasonry is said to date back to Egypt and the time of the Pharaohs. Thus, it is not strange that Freemasonry is religion agnostic, since it's evolution per-dates Christianity, Judaism, and Islam.
The star and crest do not represent Islam in this instance, but rather esoteric & exoteric eastern (African) philosophy.
In the case of African American Masons, or Prince Hall Masons, it is tied to Scottish and English Freemasonry and only a poor form of the entire eastern movement.
As I recall, to become a Shriner, you must first advance in the highest levels of Freemasonry.
-------------------- Selenium gives real life and true reality Posts: 4693 | From: Saturn | Registered: Apr 2012
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Tukuler
multidisciplinary Black Scholar
Member # 19944
posted
NrY D-M174 is the 'black connection' for * Andamans * Tibetans * Japanese
quote:Originally posted by Habsburg: Point of note:
I believe that there may be some truth to Clyde Winters statement about Tibetans being negroid or African.
One of the observations which led me to take Mike's theories seriously was seeing a picture of a man with the hair type Khoisan of man clearly labelled as Tibetan. He was a Tibetan, the picture was taken in Tibet and he was clearly dressed in Tibetan clothes.
The relation between Tibet and black people is that Jarawa people (ie Andaman Islanders) have a gene which is found among Tibetan people so the idea may not be that farfetched.
Don't forget Guatama Buddha too, who was from Nepal, who is also portrayed with peppercorn hair as well.
Posts: 8179 | From: the Tekrur straddling Senegal & Mauritania | Registered: Dec 2011
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Despite its theme, the Shriners are not connected to Arab culture or Islam. It is a men's fraternity rather than a religion or religious group. Its only religious requirement is indirect: all Shriners must be Masons (with the exception being in the State of Arkansas), and petitioners to Freemasonry must profess a belief in a Supreme Being.
.....
The emblem on the front of the fez, the crescent and scimitar, is an important part of the fraternity’s theme, and is representative of the characteristics embodied by the Shriners.
.....
MUURZ!
The Fez hat is Muurish, from the city of Fez Muurocco, one of the Muurish capitals.
Candidates for induction into the Shriners are greeted by a High Priest, who says:
“By the existence of Allah and the creed of Mohammed; by the legendary sanctity of our Tabernacle at Mecca, we greet you.”
The inductees then swear on the Bible and the Koran, in the name of Mohammed, and invoke Masonry's usual gruesome penalties upon themselves:
“I do hereby, upon this Bible, and on the mysterious legend of the Koran, and its dedication to the Mohammedan faith, promise and swear and vow … that I will never reveal any secret part or portion whatsoever of the ceremonies … and now upon this sacred book, by the sincerity of a Moslem's oath I here register this irrevocable vow … in willful violation whereof may I incur the fearful penalty of having my eyeballs pierced to the center with a three-edged blade, my feet flayed and I be forced to walk the hot sands upon the sterile shores of the Red Sea until the flaming sun shall strike me with livid plague, and may Allah, the god of Arab, Moslem and Mohammedan, the god of our fathers, support me to the entire fulfillment of the same. Amen. Amen. Amen."
With this oath, Christians swear on the Koran, and declare Allah to be “the god of our fathers.”
Excerpt from The Origins and Influence of Masonry by Lee Penn, SCP Journal Vol. 25:2-25:3 2001 P0 Box 4308, Berkeley, CA 94704 Jesus People www.mission.org/jesuspeople
MUUUURRRRZZZZ!
Posts: 7419 | From: North America | Registered: Mar 2009
| IP: Logged |
The Mongoloid Indians adopted many Muurish traditions such as wearing Turbans and using the Mande/Vai writing system to write their language. Here is a picture of Sequoyah to show this reality.
It is ironic. The Cherokee learned to farm , write and other elements of their culture from the Black Native Americans, yet today they claim, the only Black Indians, were their African slaves.
People will do anything to steal the history of Afro-American and Black people. Especially the history of the Muurs....
.
Clyde why are you lying and trying to steal from the Native Americans? Turbans related to the Islamic moors of North Africa are not Native American and the Moors did not introduce farming to the Native Americans, that is complete foolishness
The Cherokee Turban came to be from the fact that, in the 1600's, a group of Englishmen took a small group of Cherokee chiefs and warriors to England to meet the king. Just before they were to enter the throne room, the Englishmen decided that the Cherokee warriors were not dressed properly to be presented to the king. So, in looking around for something more appropriate to dress the Cherokee in, they found some old linen shirts from the time, and some turbans that were left over from some officials from India. They dressed the Cherokee in this attire to meet the king. They were allowed to keep these items when they were brought back to their village. Since then, other Cherokee, Choctaw, Shawnee, Seminole, and Chickasaw began wearing this type of head gear for ceremonies and Special functions. Since east of the Mississippi was a vast forest, it was not practical for the feathered war bonnets like the plains tribes had to be worn in this area. The turban was close to the head and light to wear. It also helps keep the head warm in Winter!
_________________
This is bs. Carolina Indians who were not Muslim inspired wore feathers,as did Africans in Africa. The Yamassee were not taken to visit the English crown. They were mainly at war with the Europeans so they did not adapt this custom from the English.
You expect soembody to believe that the Yamassee and other Black tribes adopted this from the British, when they did not recognize the English culture as superior to their own.
You are the one lying. Islam was already here as proven by the Yamassee fighting the British. This Muurs, did not respect the British.
.
\
Clyde
Thanks for spreading truth and wisdom.
Guys take a look at this picture. Observe the pendant on his necklace.... The star and the crescent.... and the scimitar.
The symbols of the Muurs of Muuritania!
MUURZ!
This is what is wrong with this thread.
Celebrating thieves and frauds like they are the originators of the symbols they wear. Identifying black folks with foreign customs brought by rapists and murderers as if black folks are one of them....
Totally inane nonsense.
Point of note, folks like King Leopold and the royalty of Europe are the pinnacle of this masonic system and they have their origins in the crusades among the knightly orders. From these orders came secret societies based around pillage and plunder, with the use of signs, symbols and secrecy to cover their tracks. Leopold and the French famously had African troops who killed their own people wear the fez as a sign of colonial armies and police.
The Fez as worn by the shriners is a symbol of empire....
And lets not forget the Grand Master of the Masons and the Ku Klux Klan, the Golden Bough and the Knights of the Golden Circle is none other than Albert Pike....
If you have read Robinson's Born In Born, The English beginnings of Freemasonry he proposes that Freemasonry came to England by way of the Knights Templars who were forced to go underground once the crown decided tp prosecute the Templars and confiscate all their gold and properties. However, they also acknowledge that the beginning of Freemasonry began in Egypt. The myth of Solomon, the temple, and Hirem Abiff or Hiram king of Tyre is an integral story in freemasonry.
In the wish to get the best information that I could on these matters, I made a voyage to Tyre in Phoenicia. . . .
Herodotus 2:44
By now all Syria and all Phoenicia except Tyre were under Macedonian control, and Alexander [the Great] was encamped on the mainland which was separated from the city of Tyre by a narrow strait.
Quintus Curtius Rufus
The History of Alexander 4.2:1
In Tyre, quantities of Phoenician pottery from very disturbed levels were recovered in 1970. . . .
Bikai, Pottery of Tyre p.1
Next, we know that Hiram was king of Tyre during the time of King David and King Solomon, as pointed out in the Jewish Tanakh and the Old Testament of the Bible.
And Hiram king of Tyre sent his servants unto Solomon; for he had heard that they had anointed him king in the room of his father; for Hiram was ever a [great admirer] of David.
And Solomon sent unto Hiram saying . . . "I purpose to build an house unto the name of the LORD my God . . . therefore command thou that they hew me cedar trees out of Lebanon. . . ."
1 Kings 5:1-6
Upon the death of Abibalus, his son Hirom took the kingdom. This king . . . joined the temple of Jupiter Olympius, which stood before in an island by itself, to the city, by raising a causeway between them. . . . They say further, that Solomon, when he was king of Jerusalem, sent problems to Hirom to be solved, and desired he would send others back for him to solve. . . .
Josephus, Contra Apionem 1:17
Which brings us to Hiram Abiff, the master builder, who was described to us this way.
And king Solomon sent and fetched Hiram out of Tyre. He was a widow's son of the tribe of Naphtali, and his father was a man of Tyre, a worker in brass; and he was filled with wisdom, and understanding, and cunning to work all works in brass. And he came to king Solomon, and wrought all his work.
1 Kings 7:13-14
The Kemetic Origin of Freemasonry: The Signs and Symbols Do not Lie
The signs and symbols of ancient and modern Freemasonry are rooted in Kemet (Egypt) and the evidence is overwhelmingly obvious that Freemasonry borrowed its allegorical myths and ideological metaphors from more ancient societies that were well advanced in the philosophical mysteries. (Reference: Manly P. Hall; "The Secret Teachings of All Ages"). It all began in Cush (Abyssinia or Ethiopia) were perhaps some of the wisest Nubians toiled and where civilization originated. Thus transmitting their enlightenment in compliment with how the Nile River flows from south to north. Reference Sterling Means in his book titled, "Ethiopia and the Missing Link in African History" and John G. Jackson work titled, "Ethiopia and the Origin of Civilization" .
Leopold and the French famously had African troops who killed their own people wear the fez as a sign of colonial armies and police.
The Fez as worn by the shriners is a symbol of empire....
And lets not forget the Grand Master of the Masons and the Ku Klux Klan, the Golden Bough and the Knights of the Golden Circle is none other than Albert Pike.... ...
Another Dog barking.
No, the Fez is an ancient symbol of the African Muurs. Everywhere you find the ancient Muurs you find their Fez. The shriners are jonny just come to wearing Fez.
Here, I gonna help you:
Igbos Muurs of Nigeria:
African American Muurs:
A Berber Muur in Fez: Jean Discart (1856 - 1944) ~ A Berber in a fez
The "tallest" Muur Posts: 7419 | From: North America | Registered: Mar 2009
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Leopold and the French famously had African troops who killed their own people wear the fez as a sign of colonial armies and police.
The Fez as worn by the shriners is a symbol of empire....
And lets not forget the Grand Master of the Masons and the Ku Klux Klan, the Golden Bough and the Knights of the Golden Circle is none other than Albert Pike.... ...
Another Dog barking.
No, the Fez is an ancient symbol of the African Muurs. Everywhere you find the ancient Muurs you find their Fez. The shriners are jonny just come to wearing Fez.
Here, I gonna help you:
Igbos Muurs of Nigeria:
African American Muurs:
A Berber Muur in Fez: Jean Discart (1856 - 1944) ~ A Berber in a fez
The "tallest" Muur
Sorry. These folks who wore fezzes were primarily colonial forces and Africans killing their own people under the control of the colonists. Yes they were imitating the traditional costume of the Africans, especially the Muslims but this was a war against African culture not promoting it. Just like those native Americans were not "brothers" with the Europeans, they were at war with them and lost.
posted
These are great post. They will help us write a true history of African people in America. This is more proof that Afro-Americans are the result of three groups: Black Native Americans, Black Europeans and Sub-Saharan Africans.
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[ 03. June 2015, 11:57 AM: Message edited by: ausar ]
Posts: 13012 | From: Chicago | Registered: Jan 2006
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quote:Originally posted by IronLion: Dog, tell me more about the history of how your white people invented the fez.
I am all ears. Go ahead.
And please save me the spamming...
And the oversized pictures.
The origin of the fez is uncertain it could be Greek. There are similar hats of earlier times with the Assyrians who defeated the Egyptians
Ashurnasirpal II Assyrian King
And there is Modius hat in Egypt a type crown of in Egypt, usually worn by Queens such as Nefertiti but also by kings such as Huni or Userkaf Uerkaf, 5th dynasty, Egypt
However while similar it's debatable whether or not to call these Fezes
This however is definitely a Fez >>
Nobel Drew Ali. founder of Moorish Science Temple
The red felt Fez sometimes with a tassel is assocated with the Ottomans and we can see the symbols of the Turkish flag here
^^^ So obviously if you wanted to associate with similar ancient Near Eastern hats you would not choose the red felt Ottoman version. That is the one the Shriners chose
The minutes of the Lodge of Edinburgh (Mary's Chapel) No. 1 in Scotland show a continuity from an operative lodge in 1598 to a modern speculative lodge. It is reputed to be the oldest Masonic lodge in the world
Obviously this doesn't add to the case that the Native Americnas were Moors
However The wide acceptance of the fez stems from the Ottoman Empire extending its influence (never to Morocco however) in the early 19th Century.
Ironically in Morocco the fez is a symbol of nationalism; it was worn historically as a protest against the French occupation in the early 20th century (1911) It is now associated with the Moroccan royal court.
Posts: 42939 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
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