quote:

---

Originally posted by Troubles101:

As for the good half, Do you think they shouldn't speak up when seeing someone's rights are being abused ? is that what the victim needs or the abuser?

Your understanding of freedom and tolerance seems very immature and contradicting to me

---

Everyone should speak up for himself/herself. it keeps the world harmony whereby we all get from life what we deserve (mostly). No trying to jump them over their shadows, Troubles, just beause you happen to be a bit forward (mut maybe also backward, you never know about developments exactly in which direction they go, until later)

If anything, it discredits future complaints.

quote:

---

Originally posted by nevermind:
Everyone should speak up for himself/herself. it keeps the world harmony whereby we all get from life what we deserve (mostly).

---

This is no difference than knowing that a specific dark street has a big hole in, yet I would not warn anyone about it and just say they will get what they deserve? but even if this true then none should speak in the first place even the one who got his/r rights abused as their complain wont help them in anyway but will only serve to help those who don't know and this according to you is not okay, so at the end we will be left with the bad thing happining and none doing a thing about it which happen to be the reason of many negative things in my country, you see this thing about "it's not my business" or " let them learn by themselves" everyday, you get hit but you wont say anything because it wont be any of your business anymore to complain and at then end no one complain and the abusing contuinue though none like it.

Take the girl here for example why should she speak for herself when things happned already and she may not even come back to Egypt, if she complain it will serve only to help others.

quote:

---

What i seem to you depends of you more than me

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by ExptinCAI:
Actually, the person who posted this said she's already written to the hotel. I don't think it's his place to contact the hotel and complain unless he's asked permission and gotten the details FIRST. I mean, if you were hotel management and discovered this complaint was based on a story you saw in an internet forum which you cannot even validate -- what would you think?

If anything, it discredits future complaints.

Good intentions, bad execution.

---

I agree , I would rather complain when i see it with my eyes or know about it from a person I trust and once I'm sure I become responsible to complain or advise about it.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Troubles101:
:D

---

Good to see smiling faces now and then.. :).

U almost make a point here but there are two reasons why I disagree. The first is that even if you take to camp beside a hole in a dark street for the rest of your life it is not a very efficient way because you cannot possibly cover all dark holes in the world (plus I actually think you might have brain potential for a more useful life somewhere). The second is that there will always be new holes appearing somewhere, so the best idea still is to train everyone watch out for holes and defend themselves. U do not do it if you act as a guardian angel (or maybe war angel) and by trying to protect people actually keep them what they need best: the will and stamina to defend themselves.

I've already sent an email to the same address h1715@accor.com (over a week ago, the day after I came home). Haven't heard anything.... but I'm starting to forget the whole episode.

Before I went to Egypt I thought that muslims were very respecful about the female body, guess I was a little naiv, they are also men..I should have told the massage guy Sherif then and there to ... off but I have only my self to blame for that I didn't!

I read on my travel agency's internetpage before I went to Egypt that they warned tourists to bring egyptians to their hotel room because it was against the law or something and it could lead to serious consequenses. So, I remember I thought that Egypt must be a very strict country and different from Greece, Spain etc. where the men are always hitting on tourist girls, (and the girls sometimes are into it as well of course). Not that I had anything of this in mind since I was there with my boyf (and because it's not my style anyway), but point is that I thought things were different in Egypt.

So I was very surprised when this happened! I don't think I would have taken massage from a man in fex. Greece, because they have this reputation etc. BUT- again, I was wrong , and a little naiv!! Of course I understand that all men in Egypt are not as sleezy as the massage guy, but I only had this naiv idea that muslims were more decent or something... Guess that only goes for the muslims girls, not the men! That is really provoking by the way, but that is another discussion:-)

Anyway, I wouldn't have the slightest interest to get my massage down by an Egyptian man. I lived too long in the country to understand their mentality.

It was nice of you to contact the hotel. But I don't know why they answered you and not me, it is the same address. I have deleted the email I send to them (as I have to delete my "sent mails" box quite often because of pressure on the mailbox). I could write a new complaint, but I'm not going to give it to you over this forum, and I have already tried the H1715@accor.com address!
Why does the hotel write "dear Sherif" by the way? Is your name Sherif too? The massage guys name was Serif.

quote:

---

Originally posted by ExptinCAI:
..... I mean, if you were hotel management and discovered this complaint was based on a story you saw in an internet forum which you cannot even validate -- what would you think?

If anything, it discredits future complaints.

Good intentions, bad execution.

---

Expat, I'm not sure I agree 100%. I think you are thinking like a westerner, and if that hotel were in Europe they might discredit the complaint because of the Internet connection, but I am not so sure they will here in Egypt, for a couple of reasons.

First, Egyptians love gossip. You have to remember that. They live on loving to pass on anything juicy they can get that makes a good story. Remember all the rumors that get passed on, even in the newspapers here, that you have to verify....like the Christian girls that are being held captive until they convert.... or the child at Carrefour that was abducted.... or the girls that were being killed and chopped up by some taxi driver in Cairo. Come on...they LOVE it and it's the Gods Honest Truth in their minds until proven otherwise... so the fact that this story comes from the Internet has nothing to do with the validity of it at all, I'd bet.

Second, the probability that it is true is way over 50% given the town it is coming from. If it is true, the hotel has probably had complaints in person about this guy from other guests and a written complaint from someone saying they heard this and he won't be staying at the hotel in the future because of it, may actually mean something. If you have a hotel and you care about this sort of thing getting out, then your employees need to be above reproach.
In anycase, I bet the hotel has a feeling whether the story is true or not, and actually it just comes down to if they will do something about it or not.

Unfortunately, for the OP, it is uncommon for *"nice" women to live and work in Sharm, so finding female employees for this kind of work isn't easy for the hotel, yet customers want massage now and then, so what can the hotel do? Plus normally a westerner wouldn't be put off by having a man do the work. Seems the boys in Sharm have turned the massage business into what it was in the states about 30 years ago....maybe it is still the same in the states....at least in certain areas of any large city it would be a wink-wink situation if a man were to say he wanted to go get a massage.

There are a large number of *nice* Egyptian women living and working in Sharm. They work in the schools, the hospitals, the hotels and have their famililes living in Sharm with them. Likewise there are many many good Egyptian men working there. Why do people seem to always forget that a place like Sharm has all the infrastructure of government, business, police, hospitals, schools etc just like any other large town. All these institutions need staff and workers to run them.....can we have some perspective please, not everybody is a tourist ******.

My husband is egyptian and the massages he gives seem less mechanical than those given in American physical therapy offices.

I wonder if becuase you felt an attraction and noted his appealing looks if your body gave of pheremones that were overwhelming and the massaeus picked up on it.

I don't intend to blame you because you were clearly victimized. But our bodies and spirits do operate in other realms.

Had you not have had a boyfriend would your response differ?

Remember you pondered the situation with confusion. He may have been confused by the mixed messages your body was sending.

Now before you go losing your cool, let me say that this "masseuse" did act unprofessionally and he was out of bounds. Ok?... OK.

What has me laughing are all the knickers in a twist here. I've kind of been enjoying nevermind's little out-of-box play and I must say she does have a few valid points.

But I guess it's human nature to climb on the ole soap box (just as I just did). This forum is a riot sometimes.

because you accepted what he did.
so the women they let the man to do it then after they enjoy they say "help, Police"