to show a photograph of yourself use the following BBcode:

[img]insert link to photo[/img] Just follow those steps.

I met an Egyptian girl lighter than her. She told me she was African/Black. I was surprised. I thought she was Hispanic. She was proud to be African/Black and explained that amalgamation with the many conquerors of Egypt was the reason why she and some modern Egyptians were light.

If you have more pictures, plesse share. :-)

God Bless America

quote:

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Originally posted by tdogg:
Cute, but she is wearing too much make-up. She needs to take off about 2 layers of make-up then she's good to go.

I met an Egyptian girl lighter than her. She told me she was African/Black. I was surprised. I thought she was Hispanic. She was proud to be African/Black and explained that amalgamation with the many conquerors of Egypt was the reason why she and some modern Egyptians were light.

If you have more pictures, plesse share. :-)

God Bless America

[This message has been edited by tdogg (edited 28 June 2005).]

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Welcome to Egyptsearch and thanks for sharing your point of view with us.

The other side of the coin, is that a large number of Egyptians, can actually pass for Italians, Greeks, Arabs, Hispanics, Iranians, Indians, and many other Non-Black peoples from around the world.

Most native Egyptains don't consider themselves "white", but there are some exceptions, but the vast majority would NEVER CONSIDER THEMSELVES BLACK AFRICANS, even the darker people from ASWAN and Upper Egypt, as far as I know.

In the US, all Egyptians are considered one racial group, that is legally defined as "white" or better yet "caucasian". So, you may consider yourself socially black in America, but the US government does not define you as a Black Person, legally.

My question for you is this: how do people in Aswan feel about their brothers and sisters in Lower Egypt, in terms of social domination of the country, is there some form of resentment or envy?

Shoukran ya gamilla!

quote:

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Originally posted by ElQahiralilly:

Here...I am from the South of Egypt...near the Aswan area...and I just wanted to show you that over here in America...I am black...according to the Americans definition of "black" but when I go to Egypt...no one questions my ethnicity....there is a good percentage of Egyptians that can pass for blacks in America....but when people start saying that an Egyptian born and raised in Egypt is not REALLY egyptian because he is light skinned is ridiculous...you are then attacking his nationality and culture....anyways....just lighten up on the Egyptians from the Lower Egypt region...were all real Egyptians no matter where you are from in Egypt...

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Just for the record, you look very ITALIAN to me.

You picture actually tells us a lot about you, by the way you have chosen to wear your makeup, blue tinted contact lenses, and lighter shade of your hair.

ElQahiralilly YOU ARE A SHAME AND YOU BRING DISHONUR TO THE EYGEPTIAN PEOPLE AMD TO THE MUSLIMS ALL OVER. PLEASE DRESS MODASTLY.

I SUJEST YOU BRING SOME ISLAM TO YOUR LIFE.

quote:

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Originally posted by fareed:
Lilly,

My question for you is this: how do people in Aswan feel about their brothers and sisters in Lower Egypt, in terms of social domination of the country, is there some form of resentment or envy?

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AN EGYPTIAN IS AN EGIPTIONS WORST ENAMY.

SO WHAT ABOUT ISREAL....

quote:

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Originally posted by COBRA:
AN EGYPTIAN IS AN EGIPTIONS WORST ENAMY.

SO WHAT ABOUT ISREAL....

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quote:

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Originally posted by zulu:
what's the matter with her dress attire? african women have been going bear breasted for eons. so, give that imported conservative dress code crap for women back to the arabs and or europeans.

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ElQahiralilly........look!!!

THIS MAN IS OBVIOUSLY IS A PERV. HE PREFERS WOMEN TO DRESSED TO THE SKIN. WOULD YOU DRESS UP FOR HIS SATISFACTION?

quote:

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Originally posted by Jizan:

You look hispanic not black to me.

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I agree with Jizan, I would not have considered this person to be Black. I have met many Egyptians that were indeed Black but this is not an example. This person looks like a Mulatoo, perhaps Puerto Rican. There is certainly some Black influence but I would not refer to this person as a Black person unless they themselves claimed to be.

At the same time, this forum has nothing to do with modern day Egyptians who are not good representations of Ancient Egypt due to Asiatic and European admixture and settlement.

You don't look like an Aswani Egyptian. Aswani Egyptians are much darker than the women in the picture. Unless they have Turkish or Arab admixture.

I know this because my family comes from villages in Luxor and Aswan both. You might find the following type in Middle Egypt,but not within Aswan. You even find some Aswanis who look like Western Africans.

Aswan is the exteme south of Egypt. In historical times it was called Swene[which means trade] and an area where Nubians and Egyptians both traded with each other. Unfortunately, on my computer I have no pictures of Aswani people.

I have one picture I scanned from a book but this is not a fair representation.

Aswani people typically look like the following people:

Some people that look like this:

Here is a map of Aswan:

[This message has been edited by AMR1 (edited 28 June 2005).]

Your picture is not showing up.

quote:

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Originally posted by ausar:

Aswani people typically look like the following people:

Some people that look like this:

Here is a map of Aswan:

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Unfortunately Amr, my computer will not allow me to download and upload the picture to my computer. What you should do is just to insert your photo is some photo sharing program like photobucket or image shack and post the link to it.

Zulu, you can definately marry an Aswani girl. However you have to convert to Islam because Christian/non-Muslim males cannot marry Muslim women unless they convert.

http://www.kodakgallery.com/PhotoView.jsp?&collid=27788838105&photoid=26920190703

Here is a picture of Amr. Just click on the link:

quote:

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Originally posted by ausar:

http://www.kodakgallery.com/PhotoView.jsp?&collid=27788838105&photoid=26920190703

Here is a picture of Amr. Just click on the link:

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quote:

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Originally posted by Super car:
Here are some photos of the person (ElQahiralilly) in the opening topic, but without as much makeup:
http://myspace-949.vo.llnwd.net/00141/94/99/141529949_l.jpg?SSImageQuality=Full
http://myspace-421.vo.llnwd.net/00141/12/47/141517421_l.jpg?SSImageQuality=Full

There are two people here, which one is the notorious "Amr"?

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I AM THE ONE ON THE LEFT, THE ONE ON THE RIGHT IS MY AFRICAN AMERICAN BROTHER IN LAW. wHO i HAVE THIS HEATED DEBASTES WITH BUT I DON'T THINK HE HATES ME.

Regards,

quote:

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Originally posted by ausar:

http://www.kodakgallery.com/PhotoView.jsp?&collid=27788838105&photoid=26920190703

Here is a picture of Amr. Just click on the link:

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Let add this that many people might not know about pictures on the internet. Sometimes the light exposure on a digital camera or general picture can make a person look more lighter than they really are. In the same it can also make some people appear more darker than usual.

She looks more like an Aswani Egyptian know.

As far as Amr I have no idea which is him. He told me this was during a Ramadan celebration and one of the people in the picture is African-American;while the other is him.

the girl is beautiful so let us bring her beauty into our heart and celebrate its warmth.

As you can tell, Rumi is my teacher!

quote:

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Originally posted by AMR1:
I AM THE ONE ON THE LEFT, THE ONE ON THE RIGHT IS MY AFRICAN AMERICAN BROTHER IN LAW. wHO i HAVE THIS HEATED DEBASTES WITH BUT I DON'T THINK HE HATES ME.

Regards,

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Stop trying to find the differences and find relatedness, and the debates will stop. Debates are soley due to pride and most pride is false.

quote:

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Originally posted by Super car:
Here are some photos of the person (ElQahiralilly) in the opening topic, but without as much makeup:
http://myspace-949.vo.llnwd.net/00141/94/99/141529949_l.jpg?SSImageQuality=Full
http://myspace-421.vo.llnwd.net/00141/12/47/141517421_l.jpg?SSImageQuality=Full

There are two people here, which one is the notorious "Amr"?

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Okay, I might call her Black or mixed. As for Amr, I can see why he doesn't call himself Black. Cleary he is part Black but that is not the handle for his kind. It is like with Hawiian or Pacific Island people, there is what appears to be Black influences in their appearance but they are not considered black due to their apparent admixture (which in the case of Pacific island people is not actually admixture at all).

Race debats are giving me a headache.

amr,
your color is a little darker than mine. i have three brothers and two sisters the color of your brother in law. i have one sister who's halle berry's complexion. brother, let go of being arabized and embrace your history that goes back thousands of years before islam and christianity for that matter.

quote:

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Originally posted by ausar:

Aswani people typically look like the following people:

Some people that look like this:

Here is a map of Aswan:

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quote:

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Originally posted by osirion:

Okay, I might call her Black or mixed. As for Amr, I can see why he doesn't call himself Black. Cleary he is part Black but that is not the handle for his kind. It is like with Hawiian or Pacific Island people, there is what appears to be Black influences in their appearance but they are not considered black due to their apparent admixture (which in the case of Pacific island people is not actually admixture at all).

Race debats are giving me a headache.

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Actually modern pacific islanders, like Hawaiians are very mixed, due to influences from mainly from Asia and Europe.

A hawaiian king:

The Kamehameha IV

The great King Kamehameha

Hawaiian Royalty list: http://starbulletin.com/1999/06/16/millennium/story3.html

quote:

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Originally posted by AMR1:
I AM THE ONE ON THE LEFT, THE ONE ON THE RIGHT IS MY AFRICAN AMERICAN BROTHER IN LAW. wHO i HAVE THIS HEATED DEBASTES WITH BUT I DON'T THINK HE HATES ME.

Regards,

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Lol, don't lie, that's not An African American. I can directly see he's either from Sudan, Somalia or Ethiopia. That guy is definetly from East Africa so don't even try an6y bulshit. He's dark but his phenotyp is clearly East African. And you yourself don't look that much different from alot of Somalis, Infact i would say 30% of the Somali and 60% of the Eritrean population are lighter than you, but that is only skin colour, from a morphological point of view and facial bone sructure you and Eritreans look more west African than Somalis. I really don't understand why you chose one side of your heritage against the other. I myself look more Arab than you, but still would never ever disown my real heritage which is Somali to fit into others, regardless of the conditions.

quote:

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Originally posted by Yonis:
Lol, don't lie, that's not An African American. I can directly see he's either from Sudan, Somalia or Ethiopia. That guy is definetly from East Africa so don't even try an6y bulshit. He's dark but his phenotyp is clearly East African. And you yourself don't look that much different from alot of Somalis, Infact i would say 30% of the Somali and 60% of the Eritrean population are lighter than you, but that is only skin colour, from a morphological point of view and facial bone sructure you and Eritreans look more west African than Somalis. I really don't understand why you chose one side of your heritage against the other. I myself look more Arab than you, but still would never ever disown my real heritage which is Somali to fit into others, regardless of the conditions.

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"La hawla wala quata illa billah"

Why should I lie in such an UNimportant issue, the person on the right is my African American brother in law, he has distant red indian blood in him, mixed with whites, may be that is why there is confusion.

I NEVER SAID I AM AN ARAB AND THAT IS ALL.

I always said that we in North Sudan especially, I have both Egypt and Sudan citizenship, we tend to say we are Arab and forget the other part of our genetic make up, which in my case is Nubian and native Egyptian.

I always said and still maintain that no Egyptian escaped that mix, if North Sudanese have not escaped IT. I assure U Southern Egyptians have not escaped it either.

WE in the North of the nile valley are a mix race and the descendants of the phoroahs and let us face it also descendants of immigrants, invaders, missionaries etc..

No Egyptian or Nubian have left his land, so no one else is genetically directly connected to those ancients.

Islam plays a big role in that part of the world. We are not ARABS WE ARE CONFUSED FOR ARABS BECAUSE OF OUR RELIGION AND SINCE WE SPEAK ARABIC and partly Arab. This confusion I won't blame others for it but we ourselves call ourselves Arabs , instead of saying Arabized, confusing ourselves and increasing the confusion.

AND I AM NOT ASHAMED FROM BEING ARABIZED, IT MADE IT EASIER FOR ME TO READ THE KORAN.

quote:

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Originally posted by AMR1:

"La hawla wala quata illa billah"

Why should I lie in such an UNimportant issue, the person on the right is my African American brother in law, he has distant red indian blood in him, mixed with whites, may be that is why there is confusion.

I NEVER SAID I AM AN ARAB AND THAT IS ALL.

I always said that we in North Sudan especially, I have both Egypt and Sudan citizenship, we tend to say we are Arab and forget the other part of our genetic make up, which in my case is Nubian and native Egyptian.

I always said and still maintain that no Egyptian escaped that mix, if North Sudanese have not escaped IT. I assure U Southern Egyptians have not escaped it either.

WE in the North of the nile valley are a mix race and the descendants of the phoroahs and let us face it also descendants of immigrants, invaders, missionaries etc..

No Egyptian or Nubian have left his land, so no one else is genetically directly connected to those ancients.

Islam plays a big role in that part of the world. We are not ARABS WE ARE CONFUSED FOR ARABS BECAUSE OF OUR RELIGION AND SINCE WE SPEAK ARABIC and partly Arab. This confusion I won't blame others for it but we ourselves call ourselves Arabs , instead of saying Arabized, confusing ourselves and increasing the confusion.

AND I AM NOT ASHAMED FROM BEING ARABIZED, IT MADE IT EASIER FOR ME TO READ THE KORAN.

[This message has been edited by AMR1 (edited 28 June 2005).]

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quote:

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Originally posted by Yonis:
Lol, don't lie, that's not An African American. I can directly see he's either from Sudan, Somalia or Ethiopia. That guy is definetly from East Africa so don't even try an6y bulshit. He's dark but his phenotyp is clearly East African...

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Yonis, how can you be sure?!! The fact is I've seen plenty of African Americans that have the same features as Somalis. In fact, I've actually witnessed African Americans being mistaken for Somalis by real Somalis!!

quote:

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Originally posted by ausar:

Aswani people typically look like the following people:

Some people that look like this:

Here is a map of Aswan:

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quote:

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Originally posted by Yonis:
Lol, don't lie, that's not An African American. I can directly see he's either from Sudan, Somalia or Ethiopia. That guy is definetly from East Africa so don't even try an6y bulshit. He's dark but his phenotyp is clearly East African. And you yourself don't look that much different from alot of Somalis, Infact i would say 30% of the Somali and 60% of the Eritrean population are lighter than you, but that is only skin colour, from a morphological point of view and facial bone sructure you and Eritreans look more west African than Somalis. I really don't understand why you chose one side of your heritage against the other. I myself look more Arab than you, but still would never ever disown my real heritage which is Somali to fit into others, regardless of the conditions.

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Agreed Yonis, Amr looks like a bantu who mixed with Arabs, actually I know a lot of Arab Sudanese,they look like mixed Arabs and bantus. By the way Yonis if you say you look like an Arab...it means you are probably from northern Somalia...because Southern Somalis, Boranas, Rendille are less mixed than you guys...people from Northern Kenya are the original Elongated Eastern Africans...small nose...very dark...we don't have your big noses (Arab or European nose) and mixed skin(light skin)...Do you consider yourself as Black African??
Relaxx

Tdogg-I will take your "too much" makeup for consideration....I appreciate your opinoin...

Fareed-maashi Hal habibi...to answer your question about the lower egyptians...From personal experience upper Egyptians do feel somewhat resentful...because of the economic status of the lower Egyptians...upper egyptians are usually not that well off...so of course it leads to jealousy...also...to Muslim upper egyptians..they sort of look down at Egyptians that are from the cities because they feel that are too "loose" with their morals....I think you know that already....Upper Egyptians are very conservative...But nonetheless they look at them as brothers and sisters and will treat them with respect and like family..it is said that the Aswanis are that most friendly in Egypt ....Alhamdulilah

Cobra-I am sorry that you are offended by my way of dress...I do not need Islam in my life...I have Jesus...and he is all I need...so how dare you impose your religious intolerance on me...just because someone acts or dresses differently does not mean that you have the right to judge...God is the only judge...

And I think there was a question on whether I was Muslim or Coptic....Yes I am Coptic..

Ausar-I think your perception of what an Aswani should look like is confined on how your family looks like...I have read numerous posts on this forum and it always seems to me that if someone is not dark enough...then their REALLY not an Egyptian....thats crap...My family is from Aswan...some of them lighter and considerablly darker than I am....but they are all Aswani...so it is a insult to me that you did say that I didn't look Aswani....then please tell me.. wallah...are all Aswani supposed to look exactly the same? If you are truly Aswani you will then remember that even in the South of Egypt our color of skin ranges...

anywho...I agree with most of you that the orignial Egyptians were dark...not black per se...as in central black africans...but more East african looking...but be careful how you display your opinions...because to the native Egyptians it is insulting to say that one is not really egyptian because of the color of their skin...that they are too light or dark...they are all Egyptian...just realize that there are different definitions on what the term dark skinned or black is....for gosh sake...I got latino..to mulatto to Italian...goes to show you that our perceptions are quite different...

quote:

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Originally posted by ElQahiralilly:

...because to the native Egyptians it is insulting to say that one is not really egyptian because of the color of their skin...

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Thought Writes:

I am not certain why MODERN Egyptians would be insulted about stating the FACT that the ANCIENT Egyptians were indigenous Black Africans. Ancient and Modern Egyptians, two different groups....

quote:

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Originally posted by Thought2:
Thought Writes:

I am not certain why MODERN Egyptians would be insulted about stating the FACT that the ANCIENT Egyptians were indigenous Black Africans. Ancient and Modern Egyptians, two different groups....

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Don't waste your time, many of them are lost...they are mixed...it's not like in America..they don't know who they are...Don't go further than the Horn Africa...They view me as their brothers because we share the same features...but my people can tell that they are mixed...I'm called habash or brother when I go in North Eastern Africa...but I can tell we are a little bit different because of the skin tone...they are confused...that's why some of them just write stupid satements...the real Eastern Elongated Africans are in Northern Kenya, Southern Somalia and Southern Ethiopia, and in the Great Lake regions...please note that some don't share the same genes but have the same features: they tend to be tall, many are very dark, they have smaller nose and lower nose bridge than Arabs or Europeans. But I need to say that again, people from Southern Somalia look more like regular Eastern Elongated African than other Somalis: very tall, very dark, very small nose, and long face....
Relaxx