quote:Originally posted by Nehesy: This guy posts lot of bullshit (argyle) and he thinks that he is smart...
A wise person will avoid debate with a fool. __Proverbs
You see how you, a wise person, have been angered into a debate with a fool that is totally irrelevant, at this point, to the flow of this topic.
Here's my opening statement:
African Americans: A Pan-African people
The north western slave port at Goree Island, Senegal was only one of several points of departure for Africans being taken to the United States. There were other points as well, stretching as far southward as the present state of Angola. These ports of departure were used for transporting Africans from the African interior - a vast interior; this was the standard method of European colonialism to move African resources from the interior to the ports, where roads and rail routes were built expressly for this purpose.
The ethnic origin of African Americans includes, but is not limited to, the following African peoples:
In everything, there is both positive as well as negative elements. One of the positive elements of the African slave trade to the United States, was that it created the first contemporary Pan-African ethnic group; a group with a common language and culture and separated only by class distinctions.
...African Americans have the unique distinction of being historically-genetically related to a vast majority of African ethnic-linguistic groups. In this sense, the African American identification to all African cultures is not merely a philosophical one, as in the case of a European Swede identifying with a European ancient Greece; The African Americans' identification with all African cultures, including and especially, the ancient Nile valley cultures, is both historically and genetically authentic and valid.
(*Fulani are Pel from Nigerien areas & Fulbe are Pel from Senegambian areas...
Posts: 3344 | From: Berkeley | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
The appellation 'red' in African American is used to describe light-skinned Blacks who have reddish skin and hair color; the classic examples are “Chicago Red” which referred to Redd Foxx and “Detroit Red” which was Malcolm X.
This is a natural inheritance from Africa; in general Red is a symbol of mourning, death, evil, blood, the devil...but it can also be used to objectively describe someone like the Himba people of Namibia who are called the Red People because they use a hematite mixture to paint their skins red.
It is also an African appellation used to describe “White people”
In the Mtau Ntr it comes in this form:
Tamhu – a non-pejorative which merely means “Red people”; this word is derived from “Tamh” which means “hematite”
Dereshou – a pejorative which also means “Red people” but also carries with itself the implication of evil, bad, devil...this is used as a counterpoise to Kememou or “Black people” - good, proper, holy...
Addendum: a similar appellation, without any use of color, is the one used for “Asiatics”:
Aamu - “Asiatics”; however this word is derived from Aamu, which means “peasant (fellaheen), coarse...”
posted
This topic was beaten to death many times. Of course African Americans as people of African descent are related to the ancient Egyptians and if European Americans want to claim Ancient Greeks why can't African Americans claim Ancient Egypt??
Although it was explained ad-naseum that the Wolof are entirely different people and are NOT direct descendants of Egyptians.
Posts: 26239 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: ...it was explained ad-naseum that the Wolof are entirely different people and are NOT direct descendants of Egyptians.
Indeed? Where can we find these ad-nauseam "explanations"?
Posts: 3344 | From: Berkeley | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
Stupid Djehuti, Europeans are related to Greeks because the Greeks are part of the Indo Europeans invasion of the area and were caucasians. Some of you folks need to be locked up for your own protection.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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I dont' know this DOUG, as you can read on my posting , I'm from Paris/ France. You're a joke man ! You ask a lot of question but give no answers...I guess it's because you don't have any Scholarship...
@ Wally
Don't worry bro ! I'm not angry, just chilling from my workplace. Speaking with you guys is a pleasure. And your research is 100 % right for me. African-American have links with Ancient Egypt through their African ancestors.
The Wolof are straight from Egypt [See the west family african names who are genetic prints in Africa: DIOP, KA ,BA, SANKHARE, KAMARA, LY, SY, KANE etc ], the first who said it wasn't Pr Cheikh Anta DIOP , but the French governor and scholar of Dakar: Maurice Delafosse.
Ancient Egypt had links with Mali, for instance the French Scholar René Caillié said that Djenné monuments reminded him the monuments of Kemet (see "Journal d'un voyage à Temboctou et à Jenné dans l'Afrique centrale" 1830 and reprinted in 1996 under the following title "Voyage à Tombouctou "). The Askias of songhai were buried in small Pyramids. The Mummification was practised by the Akans of Ivory coast, and Ghana.
And as I told you before I'm Wolof/Fulani. I speak wolof and it's very close to the Medu Neter.Even Sir Alan Gardiner in his Egyptian Grammar acknowledge that Ancient Egyptian language was very close to African languages...It wasn' a semitic language. The Afro-Asiatic theory can't stand because it's ONLY African languages spoken in Africa and Asia. But the speakers were African. Christopher EHRET made very clear (and history also) that the first SEMITES were BLACKS. This is why SUMERIANS were black people, European scholars said it in the past : Marcel dieulafoy, François Lenormant, Higgins.
Marcel Dieulafoy acknowledge that there was aboriginal black persians and Cambyse had some of them into his army.(see his book "Acropole de Suse" 1890, you cand find it on the website internet archives).
The Natufians of Palestine had African Bantu features and it is said by the Canadian Donald B Redford.
The best book that you can find about the links between Ancient Egypt and African contemporary people is Pr Aboubacry Moussa Lam : "Les chemins du Nil : les relations entre l'Egypte ancienne et l'Afrique noire", 1997 .
I'll translate some parts of this book when I have some time at home.
-------------------- The wise man knows he knows nothing, the fool thinks he knows all Posts: 70 | From: Paris / France | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
...until we can get Nehesy's translations from the book:
The paths of the Nile. The relationship between ancient Egypt and Black Africa by Aboubacar Moussa Lam, Ed-Khepera Presence Africaine, 1997, 223 pp.
I have been able to glean some of the basics of its theme from reviews...
quote:Lam writes:
Egyptian civilization comes not only from within the continent but with the desertification of the Sahara, African populations have ebbed in the Nile Valley... ---
...the fineness, the number and variety of observed similarities that give the valley of the Nile this privileged status (cradle), and by eliminating the multiple smoke screens raised between Egypt and Black Africa ... ---
the accumulation of these facts must allow unrestricted recognition of the Nilotic origin of the overwhelming majority of black African populations of the interior of the continent.
This is consistent with Diop's theory that Blacks, at one time, formed a cluster within the ancient Nile Valley...
Posts: 3344 | From: Berkeley | Registered: Oct 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Hammered: Stupid Djehuti, Europeans are related to Greeks because the Greeks are part of the Indo Europeans invasion of the area and were caucasians. Some of you folks need to be locked up for your own protection.
And how am I stupid?! Have I ever denied Europeans being related to Greeks?? Of course Greeks are Europeans also!! Indo-European is a linguistic phylum by the way, and one does not necessarily have to speak closely related languages to be closely genetically related.
So the question is, why do YOU deny Africans' relation to ancient Egyptians who are also equally African?? Are you aware that there are even West Africans in Sub-Sahara who speak Afrasian languages related to Egyptian??
Seriously professor, you can keep drinking your Texan liquor but lay off the meth, okay.
Posts: 26239 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
The wolof surname came from the Egyptian Medu neter : DB , who is vocalized as JOOB by Sir Alan Gardiner ( see his grammar page 469).
In wolof DIOP is said : DJOB or JOOB, when senegalses praised the DIOP family ( and by the same way) their ancestors, they say : DJOBEU DJOUBEU.
The clan in general is called : DJOBENE. The single family surname is DJOB
The wolof DJOB is the Egyptian JOOB.
And one fantastic thing is about their totemic animal clan who is the Huppe (Upupa epops).
The old generation of the DJOB family (those born in the late 50' and their forefathers), specially the children (until puberty) and women wore this huppe as a Hairstyle like the young Ramses II or Ramessu.
Six migrations from Egypt went to Senegal are from Egypt they left the country when the persians conquered Egypt. Our elders gave to the French the exact serekh name of the Persian king who persecuted the native Egyptians. Many fled in Africa (West , central, east), in Asia, Arabia, Ethiopia, Somalia etc.
It is written in Aboubacry Moussa Lam's book ! Balandier and Mercier 2 french scholars have shown in 1952 (before cheikh anta diop) that the lebus of senegal were from the nile valley.
White scholars know our true story this is why they lie and reverse the positions. We were the kings and they know it.
If you read Marcel Dieulafoy "Acropole de suse" , he says that the first inhabitants of Suse 'Susiana' in Persia were blacks. They were civilized ( palaces, scriptures, agricultural) and guess what ? Savages whites of the zagros mountains were their enemies and the Susians ruled them.
This is a story they won't tell you anymore !
-------------------- The wise man knows he knows nothing, the fool thinks he knows all Posts: 70 | From: Paris / France | Registered: Dec 2009
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The wolof surname came from the Egyptian Medu neter : DB , who is vocalized as JOOB by Sir Alan Gardiner ( see his grammar page 469).
In wolof DIOP is said : DJOB or JOOB, when senegalses praised the DIOP family ( and by the same way) their ancestors, they say : DJOBEU DJOUBEU.
The clan in general is called : DJOBENE. The single family surname is DJOB
The wolof DJOB is the Egyptian JOOB.
And one fantastic thing is about their totemic animal clan who is the Huppe (Upupa epops).
The old generation of the DJOB family (those born in the late 50' and their forefathers), specially the children (until puberty) and women wore this huppe as a Hairstyle like the young Ramses II or Ramessu.
Six migrations from Egypt went to Senegal are from Egypt they left the country when the persians conquered Egypt. Our elders gave to the French the exact serekh name of the Persian king who persecuted the native Egyptians. Many fled in Africa (West , central, east), in Asia, Arabia, Ethiopia, Somalia etc.
It is written in Aboubacry Moussa Lam's book ! Balandier and Mercier 2 french scholars have shown in 1952 (before cheikh anta diop) that the lebus of senegal were from the nile valley.
White scholars know our true story this is why they lie and reverse the positions. We were the kings and they know it.
If you read Marcel Dieulafoy "Acropole de suse" , he says that the first inhabitants of Suse 'Susiana' in Persia were blacks. They were civilized ( palaces, scriptures, agricultural) and guess what ? Savages whites of the zagros mountains were their enemies and the Susians ruled them.
quote:Nehesy wrote: Balandier and Mercier 2 french scholars have shown in 1952 (before cheikh anta diop) that the lebus of senegal were from the nile valley.
There are a people living in Senegal called the Lebou and whose name means "fishermen or people who live by the sea."
So what do we have in Mdu Ntr?
"r" or "l" is a preposition meaning for example - to;against;at "bo" in Mdu Ntr and in Coptic means "canal" or "stream" "l_bo" means "at the stream" "l_bou" means "those at the stream" Lebou - "Those at the stream"
Thus it is accurate to state that Lebou in the Mdu Ntr language would mean and be consistent with "people who live by the sea (water)."
posted
(update...per 2 additional contributions by Nahesy)
The genetic relationship (descent from a common ancestor) between two languages is determined by examining the basic vocabulary of the two languages. When there is systematic correspondence between the two languages in a large number of basic words, such as body parts, lower numerals and natural objects, the existence of a genetic relationship cannot be in doubt.
Pharaonic Egyptian - Wolof; (Wolof meaning)
aam - aam : seize (take this)
aar - aar : paradise (divine protection)
Aku - Aku : foreigners (Creole descendants of European traders and African wives)
anu - K.enou : pillar
atef - ate : a crown of Osiris, judge of the soul (to judge)
ba - bei : the ram-god (goat)
bai - bai : a priestly title (father)
ben ben - ben ben : overflow, flood
bon - bon : evil
bu - bu : place
bu bon - bu bon : evil place
bu nafret - bu rafet : good place
da - da : child
deg - deega : to see, to look at carefully (to understand)
deresht - deret : blood
diou - diou rom : five
djit - djit : magistrate (guide, leader)
Djoob - Djob : a surname
dtti - datti : the savage desert (the savage brush)
Etbo - temb : the 'floater' (to float)
fei - fab : to carry
fero - fari : king
iaay - yaay : old woman (mother)
ire - yer : to make
itef - itef : father
kat - kata : vagina (to have sexual intercourse)
kau - kaou : elevated, above (heaven)
kau - kau : high, above, heaven
kaw - kaw : height
kef - kef : to seize, grasp
kem -khem : black (burnt, burnt black)
kemat - kematef : end of a period, completion, limit
khekh - khekh : to fight, to wage war, war
kher - ker : country (house)
kwk - kwk : darkness
lebou - Lebou : those at the stream, Lebou/fishermen Senegal
maat - mat : justice
maga - mag : veteran, old person
mer - maar : love (passionate love)
mun - won : buttocks
nag - nag : bull (cattle)
nak - nak : ox, bull (cow)
NDam - NDam : throne
neb - ndab : float
nen - nen : place where nothing is done (nothingness)
nit - nit : citizen
Ntr - Twr : protecting god, totem
nwt - nit : fire of heaven (evening light)
o.k. - wah keh : correct, right
onef - onef : he (past tense)
ones - ones : she (past tense)
onsen - onsen : they (past tense)
pe - pey : capital, heaven (King's capital)
per - per : house (the wall surrounding the house)
pur - bur : king
ram - yaram : body, shoulder (body)
rem - erem : to weap, tears (compassion)
ro - ro : mouth (to swallow)
sa - sa : wise, educated, to teach
seh - seh : noble (dignitary)
seked - seggay : a slope
sen - sen : brother
sent - san : sister
set - set : woman (wife)
shopi - sopi : to transform
sity - seety : to prove
sok - sookha : to pound grain (sokh - to strike, beat)
ta - ta : earth, land (inundated earth)
ta tenen - ten : first lands (clay of first humans)
tefnit - tefnit : to spit
tem - tem : to completely stop doing something
tn.r - dener : to remember (to imagine)
top - bop : top of head
twr - twr : libation
uuh - uuf : carry
wer - wer : great, trustworthy
Posts: 3344 | From: Berkeley | Registered: Oct 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Stupid Djehuti, Europeans are related to Greeks because the Greeks are part of the Indo Europeans invasion of the area and were caucasians. Some of you folks need to be locked up for your own protection.
Have you ever been to Greece? It's obvious the group is part of a continuum that includes Africa and Asia. Most native Greeks would understand that if all of us were in the same room. Having even lived with these populations, I even get to hear their medi-centrist racial classifications as well.
I think discussion here is often poor due to limited American exposure to regions outside Greater America. That really limits cultural understanding, especially when we're dealing with a giant melting pot. In fact, most "Italians" I've met in US tend to be mixed (check out their high inter-ethnic rates) often being identical to Anglos.
Most young "Italians" in US, who look visibly "ethnic", can't even speak their ancestral tongue, which is obviously central to the Italian experience. Luckily, I have been fortunate enough to live with various southern Europeans, born/raised populations in their respective nations.
Saying that, there is a thin line between ignorance and stupidity. You know clearly well why white Americans used to (or still do) call Southern Europeans: Guineas. This term was not used against Jews, or Northern Europeans who lived in the once backward sun belt. Much of the high standard of living in those parts are quite recent, remember.
The term to anyone sane obviously refers to that groups proximity with Africans. That is, African-admixture. The darker skin tone, near-black hair, predominantly black eyes, doesn't require scholarly assessments. Most laymen were able to point that one once these migrants moved into the United States and elsewhere.
Italians and Greeks, to most would cluster much closer to Africa than the Dutch, English or the Irish. The last shared a history of struggle with Blacks, and only became "white" recently. However the Irish were never suggested to have a high racial proximity with Blacks.
Having been to Europe, Southern Europe is visibly part of a continuum that includes Africa and Europe. It's backed with genetic and epidemiological data as well. Those populations feature numerous biological traits that developed amongst recent, non-OOA, populations.
On the other hand, the variability present in Africa is largely indigenous. Genetic data suggests that the overwhelming majority of diversity present developed within the continent. Since Africa is central point of human variation, diversity would be much more limited within Europe.
Don't get me wrong, that doesn't mean Africans are "pure". No one is (simply due to genetic recombination). That is especially apparent within an intra-continental context, where Africa is isolated and genetic differentiation is given a larger weight. Regardless of scale used, to remove random "noise", humans still continue to fall under a genetic and phenotypic continuum.
Human differentiation is gradual rather than abrupt. If we were to just isolate the intra-African clusters, use classifiers or fictions (that is what haplotypes are), we'd still see high level of admixture. Populations within Africa did not remain "pure" within a continental context. That is why genetic traits common amongst "West Africans" (i.e. E1b1a, Benin sickle cell, etc) are found amongst modern Egyptians as well. In the case of Southern Egyptians, at higher levels (obviously), than Horner populations. Geography obviously played a role in that case.
Having said that, I wouldn't argue that Greeks aren't "European". The term is political and is not scientific. Greece, as a nation, is part of NATO and thus part of the Western sphere. However these population represent an intermediate population between the highly differentiated (vs. Africans) Northern Europe and Africans. That is understood at a universal level outside of the sciences as well. Remember, "guinea".
Last point: The term "Caucasian" is as scientific as "Hobbit" and ultimately does not amount to anything in this discussion. Modern [Northern] Europeans, having been isolated in Caucasia and then Europe, have certainly differentiated heavily. However, the distance isn't great enough to form its own "race". That population is merely an extension of Africans.
On the other hand, the more, recent within-Africa developments, that does NOT involve the Caucasus mountains, are found in the Southern-most parts of Europe decreasing as one goes North. This migration has been continuous throughout history and we even see populations akin to half-Egyptian/ Greek individuals in the Fayum Portraits present throughout modern Southern Europe. Posts: 1080 | Registered: Aug 2008
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quote:Originally posted by Wally: (update...per 2 additional contributions by Nahesy)
The genetic relationship (descent from a common ancestor) between two languages is determined by examining the basic vocabulary of the two languages. When there is systematic correspondence between the two languages in a large number of basic words, such as body parts, lower numerals and natural objects, the existence of a genetic relationship cannot be in doubt.
Pharaonic Egyptian - Wolof; (Wolof meaning)
aam - aam : seize (take this)
aar - aar : paradise (divine protection)
Aku - Aku : foreigners (Creole descendants of European traders and African wives)
anu - K.enou : pillar
atef - ate : a crown of Osiris, judge of the soul (to judge)
ba - bei : the ram-god (goat)
bai - bai : a priestly title (father)
ben ben - ben ben : overflow, flood
bon - bon : evil
bu - bu : place
bu bon - bu bon : evil place
bu nafret - bu rafet : good place
da - da : child
deg - deega : to see, to look at carefully (to understand)
deresht - deret : blood
diou - diou rom : five
djit - djit : magistrate (guide, leader)
Djoob - Djob : a surname
dtti - datti : the savage desert (the savage brush)
Etbo - temb : the 'floater' (to float)
fei - fab : to carry
fero - fari : king
iaay - yaay : old woman (mother)
ire - yer : to make
itef - itef : father
kat - kata : vagina (to have sexual intercourse)
kau - kaou : elevated, above (heaven)
kau - kau : high, above, heaven
kaw - kaw : height
kef - kef : to seize, grasp
kem -khem : black (burnt, burnt black)
kemat - kematef : end of a period, completion, limit
khekh - khekh : to fight, to wage war, war
kher - ker : country (house)
kwk - kwk : darkness
lebou - Lebou : those at the stream, Lebou/fishermen Senegal
maat - mat : justice
maga - mag : veteran, old person
mer - maar : love (passionate love)
mun - won : buttocks
nag - nag : bull (cattle)
nak - nak : ox, bull (cow)
NDam - NDam : throne
neb - ndab : float
nen - nen : place where nothing is done (nothingness)
nit - nit : citizen
Ntr - Twr : protecting god, totem
nwt - nit : fire of heaven (evening light)
o.k. - wah keh : correct, right
onef - onef : he (past tense)
ones - ones : she (past tense)
onsen - onsen : they (past tense)
pe - pey : capital, heaven (King's capital)
per - per : house (the wall surrounding the house)
pur - bur : king
ram - yaram : body, shoulder (body)
rem - erem : to weap, tears (compassion)
ro - ro : mouth (to swallow)
sa - sa : wise, educated, to teach
seh - seh : noble (dignitary)
seked - seggay : a slope
sen - sen : brother
sent - san : sister
set - set : woman (wife)
shopi - sopi : to transform
sity - seety : to prove
sok - sookha : to pound grain (sokh - to strike, beat)
ta - ta : earth, land (inundated earth)
ta tenen - ten : first lands (clay of first humans)
tefnit - tefnit : to spit
tem - tem : to completely stop doing something
tn.r - dener : to remember (to imagine)
top - bop : top of head
twr - twr : libation
uuh - uuf : carry
wer - wer : great, trustworthy
Interesting. Did you isolate the terms from any potential non-African languages? I ask that, because OK could refer to "Ola Kala" which in Greek means, "okay". Is this genetic relation seen in other Niger-Congo languages such as those belong to the Benue-Congo family?
PS: Also, sorry about the long reply that I made to Hammer. Felt that it had to be made, but damn, I didn't think it'd be that long.
Posts: 1080 | Registered: Aug 2008
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I already told you that you got the so-called African Americans words wrong. Those words aren't African American but plain english and you spelled "SOCK" wrong. It is spelled 'SOC.' The word 'SOC' means to pass to... or to hand to... If someone says "Soc it to me" they are literally saying pass it to me or give it to me or hand it to me. That is where the word 'soccer' comes from. It means a person or something that passes to or give to...in this case it is the soccer ball that is being pass to. And the word O.K. is an acronym for Okay. There are true African American words that comes from Africa like the word 'tote' means to carry; the word 'goober' which became the misnomer "peanut"; the word 'ninny' which means breast.
Posts: 2088 | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
Wally keep posting fake connections of African American words to find some link to ancient egyptian language but it is not there. The word nappy is Germanic and it comes from the word 'nap' which means tightly coiled or wiry. Nappy is an english word Germanic in origin to describe any surface including hair that forms a nap. It is not African American in origin. The word 'Jam' can be either a noun or verb and it has no relation to African American language. Neither do the word 'dig'. These are words that are relatively spoken in the english language and does not come from African-Americans. "Boo-Boo" and "Boo" are slangs used differently by different people and its context gives its meaning. Boo also means to scare or give scare or means to frighten or be frighten. BooBoo can mean buttocks. It depends how the individual use it.
Posts: 2088 | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
I can agree with his contentions on "boo" as not traceable to an African language, but you are mistaken on JAM, DIG and NAP. I don't think Nap is traceable to Egyptian however. I have already given the resources on where the other terms come from in the Niger-Congo languages.
Posts: 853 | From: Houston | Registered: Nov 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: I can agree with his contentions on "boo" as not traceable to an African language, but you are mistaken on JAM, DIG and NAP. I don't think Nap is traceable to Egyptian however. I have already given the resources on where the other terms come from in the Niger-Congo languages.
You're still wrong. The word nappy which is an adverb or adjective comes from the word Nap which means to knot; or something that is wiry or tightly coiled. Nap and knot can be used interchangeably. The word Jam can be either a verb or noun and it is just another english word; it has nothing to do with black Americans and neither does the word dig. "dig" is an english word and relatively used to mean understand or getting to the crux or core of something...another way to comphrehend or analyze. It doens't have anything to do with black english. The british used it in that same context before African American slaves.
Posts: 2088 | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
I won't argue with someone who doesn't know basic linguistic principles or history. We've given you the resources and this has been covered already. So this is my last post on this aspect of the discussion.
Posts: 853 | From: Houston | Registered: Nov 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: I can agree with his contentions on "boo" as not traceable to an African language, but you are mistaken on JAM, DIG and NAP. I don't think Nap is traceable to Egyptian however. I have already given the resources on where the other terms come from in the Niger-Congo languages.
...Bou is not traceable to an African language??? Look carefully at the first entry, the Coptic equivalent would be 'Bou' - right there in Mdu Ntr!
In West Africa 'Boubou' retains its meaning in the sense that the Boubou garment is "magnificent, dazzling, glamorous..." --This has already been remarked upon by a poster on this topic...
BOO; BOO BOO (COPTIC - BOU BOU)
You have also inadvertently been sidetracked by the rantings of bettyboo who is obviously debating with herself! The word is 'Napy' and NOT 'nap'; you swallowed the bait...
quote:Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: I won't argue with someone who doesn't know basic linguistic principles or history. We've given you the resources and this has been covered already. So this is my last post on this aspect of the discussion.
I feel the same. What is the sense of arguing with an afronut who thinks everything must be or has to be of African origin even the simplest forms of the english language. You people keep stretching.
Posts: 2088 | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
When a mukala (An African-American) calls their significant other their "boo," it is just another form of the word "baby" like that's my baby. More women say this than men. It is short of a reduplication of "boo boo."
Some will say "baby boo" or "boo bear" and it is in relation to the affection and love a mother would have for her child as this is the "baby" language spoken to infants. This term has nothing to do with being shiny or brilliant. This is not an Egyptian cognate.
Posts: 853 | From: Houston | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
Does boo have any historical continuity in the USA black community or is it a recent intro?
I don't think boo has any sensible cognate in any parts of Africa that the majority of BAs hail from, or if it does I haven't seen any presentation of actual word and usage derivation.
Current slang should not be interpretted as an actual Africanism. So-called Ebonics, though an English variant used by blacks, does not have the status or connected relationship to an African language as does Gullah or Pidjin or the like, does it?.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
I don't think so. Irish are and always have been white both in the USA and in the British Isles. One white group oppressing another doesn't make the oppressed one any less white than the one doing the oppressing.
There is no historical unity of struggle involving Africans and Irish in any of the Americas. The Irish when able to have kept themselves aloof from the Africans forming Red Leg communities where despite their poverty and illiteracy proudly proclaimed a superiority to blacks because as Irish they were white.
I am in agreement with you about the Greeks and Italians. In a sense, Greeks are "Arabs in pants." There is much the two share in cuisine and music. Many Italians, though recognizing themselves as "Caucasian" in the USA sense of the term, will say "I'm not white I'm Italian." Perhaps this remains from imperial Rome where they distinguished themselves from the lighter barbarians to their north and the darker folk south of the Mediterranean. See Aristotle, Martial, and Manilius.
quote:Originally posted by Bob_01:
... the Irish. The last shared a history of struggle with Blacks, and only became "white" recently. However the Irish were never suggested to have a high racial proximity with Blacks.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote: Asar wrote: When a mukala (An African-American) calls their significant other their "boo," it is just another form of the word "baby" like that's my baby. More women say this than men. It is short of a reduplication of "boo boo." Some will say "baby boo" or "boo bear" and it is in relation to the affection and love a mother would have for her child as this is the "baby" language spoken to infants. This term has nothing to do with being shiny or brilliant. This is not an Egyptian cognate.
...you have just provided additional evidence that it is a Mdu Ntr cognate...thanks...
COGNATE(S): --IN LINGUISTICS ARE WORDS THAT HAVE A COMMON ETYMOLOGICAL ORIGIN --WORDS WITH A COMMON ANCESTOR --A WORD RELATED TO ANOTHER WORD IN ORIGIN AND/OR MEANING
THE MDU NTR IS THE WORLD'S OLDEST RECORDED LANGUAGE KNOWN TO MANKIND. EX: THE WORD O.K. (CORRECT, RIGHT) OCCURS IN THE MDU NTR, AND IS THEREFORE, THE OLDEST/FIRST RECORDING OF THIS WORD IN HUMAN LANGUAGES - THUS, THE ETYMOLOGY OF O.K. IS MDU NTR - SIMPLE...
BW (BWBW) = BOU (BOUBOU)
BOU: TO REGARD WITH WONDER AND DELIGHT; TO LOOK UPON WITH AN ELEVATED FEELING OF PLEASURE, AS SOMETHING WHICH CALLS OUT APPROBATION, ESTEEM, LOVE OR REVERENCE
quote:Originally posted by Wally: Zar in Egypt and in America
quote: ausar wrote; Zar rituals are mostly practiced in lower class Sai'idi and Baladi communities throughout Egypt. The reason why many are practiced is either to heal or caste out evil spirits.
Most of the major participants are females. Very few males lead these ceremonies,and it tends to be an outlet for women in a male dominated society.
If you are at all familiar with Voodoo or Voudum, you know what Zar is...
quote: "Zar, in the sense of possession, is usually, though not exclusively, inherited. It is also contagious and may strike at any time. Diriye Abdullahi, a native of Somalia, says that the zar is basically a dance of spirits, or a religious dance - kind of leftover from the old African deities, a variant of what we describe in the west as "voodoo". The old African deities were headed by two figures; Azuzar (the male, assoc. with Osiris) and Ausitu (the female, known in the west as Isis). Ausitu (or Aysitu in Somalia) is still celebrated and given offerings by pregnant women so that she will provide them with a safe birth. He describes it as a ritual dance which is mostly observed by women, especially older women. This corresponds to the practice of older African religions, in which older women were the priestesses. He maintains that younger women, especially unmarried women, are not generally thought to be "worthy of a visit by the spirit of Zar, who chooses domicile or residence in the person who is his choice." Traditionally, women are carriers of the Zar tradition. A Zar is a spirit. Some Ethiopians and Yemenis have their own Zar, like a guide of guardian angel. The dance ritual, Zar, like other traditional healing ceremonies, as for instance practiced by the !Kung of Southern Africa, is done to regain a sense of balance and harmony in one's life and in tandem with the community. The word Zar is thought by some to be a corruption of Jar which in the Cushitic language of the Agaw people is the word for Waaq the sky god. The Rastafarians call god Jah. And Yah is a very old Ancient Egyptian word for God. See also: The Zar: Women's Theatre in the Southern Sudan,"Women's Medicine: Zar Cult in Africa and Beyond, ed. by Ioan Lewis, Edinburgh: Edinburgh University Press, 1991
from my own experiences... As an African American, born in (Voodoo) Louisiana... One of the first things you learn as a Black youngster is that when you go to church on Sunday, DO NOT SIT NEXT TO A WOMAN, especially a middle-aged one. When this "zar spirit" hits one of these women (it usually affects several women almost simultaneously), they begin to gesticulate and shout out loud. They then, usually, make their way to the church's aisle where they begin to dance themselves into a trance like frenzy, eventually feinting or becoming rigid, where they have to be fanned and literally carried out of the auditorium. And your biggest fear is that this spirit might also hit you! ...we call this 'the Holy Ghost' in (Voodoo) Louisiana.
The only thing missing is some formalized ritual, which obviously isn't necessary.
and from EW Budge on Ancient Egyptian Voodoo
quote: It was well known in Egypt and the Sudan at a very early period that if a magician obtained some portion of a person's body, e.g., a hair, a paring of a nail, a fragment of skin, or a portion of some efflux from the body, spells could be used upon them which would have the effect of causing grievous harm to that person. --Legends of the Egyptian Gods, EW Budge, p.xxxiv
...and my mama would always make sure that clipped nails or cut hair was always flushed down the toilet!
How interesting i'm Yoruba and my mum would tell me the exact same thing, the same thing happens in Yoruba Mythology.
confirmation - interesting
Posts: 951 | From: where rules end and freedom begins | Registered: Jun 2004
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quote:Originally posted by argyle104: Clyde Winters wrote:
quote: What you don't understand is that the slave trade has shifted from one part of the African coast to another overtime. The vast majority of American slaves came from the Senegambia before 1800. After 1800 due to the internal slave trade these Senegambian people were distributed throughout the early colonies.
As America expanded and took over former French and Spanish colonies Bantu speaking slaves entered the mix.
On what do you base this on Clyde? Why would so called "west" Africans or so called "bantus" be the exclusive people used as slaves?
Clyde do you believe that slavery was based on a phenotype like your white owners have brainwashed you to believe?
We're waiting for your answers Clyde. Don't run away, if you do, it will confirm everyone's suspicions that you are a fake non-degreed scholar.
You know nothing about slavery nor can you read. If you could read you would remember that I said the location of slaves changed over time.
The first slaves came from Northwest Africa, then the Guinea coast, and finally the Gold Coast and Angola. Stupid, Bantu lived in Angola --not the Senegambia--so they would have been the last tribal group to become slaves.
What I am trying to explain to you is that Europeans took slaves from different parts of Africa at different times, As a result, most slaves in the U.S., came from the Senegambia the major area for slaves sold in the U.S., prior to 1800.
After 1800, many slaves sold in Africa were Yoruba or Bantu speakers. American slave traders had "stopped" bringing in slaves at this time directly from Africa, and slaves of Senegambian origin were redistributed in the U.S. through the interstate slaves trade. Most Bantu speakers became "American "slaves after the U.S., got land from the French and Spanish.
Ignorant ass study history.
.
quote:One of the value-adds from this paper is that the authors explored how African Americans related to disparate African populations. The historical records indicate that American slaves arrived disproportionately from the regions to the west of the Bight of Bonny. In other words, black Americans derive predominantly from the non-Bantu populations of West Africa, from Senegal down to Nigeria. This is in contrast to Brazil, where the black population was reputedly of more diverse origin, including many Bantu speakers from Angola as well as West Africans. This study was done 12/23/2009
I don't know if this study helps in this particular thread and I don't know if it has been posted yet. Either which way its a good little read.
Posts: 951 | From: where rules end and freedom begins | Registered: Jun 2004
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Mdu Ntr: Bou.i (My.Bou) = "My admiration", "My delight", "My esteemed (one)"... African Americanism: My boo = (see above)
Real world experience A girlfriend of mine had this cat, and she called it "sukari", so I asked her where did she get this name. She looked at me, giddily perplexed, and said "I don't know...I just made it up." So she had, and so she thought. "Sukari" is the Kiswahili word for "sugar" or "sweet" - an appropriate name for a cat. Was this sheer coincidence or something more sublime?
Posts: 3344 | From: Berkeley | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
How ironic (or should I say hypocritical), you went over board to show how kosher your "black" mesopotamian Jews (who are obviously white) are in terms of a commonality of struggle with blacks, but you don't do the same for white gentile Irish....you Jews are so insidious...
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: I don't think so. Irish are and always have been white both in the USA and in the British Isles. One white group oppressing another doesn't make the oppressed one any less white than the one doing the oppressing.
There is no historical unity of struggle involving Africans and Irish in any of the Americas. The Irish when able to have kept themselves aloof from the Africans forming Red Leg communities where despite their poverty and illiteracy proudly proclaimed a superiority to blacks because as Irish they were white.
quote:Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: I can agree with his contentions on "boo" as not traceable to an African language, but you are mistaken on JAM, DIG and NAP. I don't think Nap is traceable to Egyptian however. I have already given the resources on where the other terms come from in the Niger-Congo languages.
You're still wrong. The word nappy which is an adverb or adjective comes from the word Nap which means to knot; or something that is wiry or tightly coiled. Nap and knot can be used interchangeably. The word Jam can be either a verb or noun and it is just another english word; it has nothing to do with black Americans and neither does the word dig. "dig" is an english word and relatively used to mean understand or getting to the crux or core of something...another way to comphrehend or analyze. It doens't have anything to do with black english. The british used it in that same context before African American slaves.
I would like to know when and where English used the word "Nap" as "to knot" in Britain or America in the English dialects. From what I understand the word as a verb in English has always meant to sleep for a short period, but that is just maybe something American English dictionaries are unaware of. Furthermore, it would be of importance to discovery that "to jam" is or was used in the same way British used it.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
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posted
I would also like to learn of an African descended family in America that didn't once have an aunt or son or father or mother that has been called or nicknamed Boo, Booboo, Bubba, Boobie, Bootsie. This is a very common and early black American "nickname" that was most definitely derived from the Africans.
-------------------- D. Reynolds-Marniche Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
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quote:Originally posted by dana marniche: ...I would like to know when and where English used the word "Nap" as "to knot" in Britain or America in the English dialects...
dana, unlike me, you have the patience of a school teacher; I envy that...
You are questioning this 'pupil' in order to, I suspect, get her to re-examine her concepts...me, I have no patience in dealing with these folk who spew such idiotic nonsense.
a) The English (Germanic) language is barely 1600 years old
b) The Mdu Ntr is at least 7000 years old!
c) To seek a source (etymology) in a 'child' language when the actual source already exists in the 'parent' language is patently absurd!
These are but a few words whose etymology can be traced to Mdu Ntr:
Sir - a title of rank Napy - a lock of Egyptian hair Re - the sun, daylight Sok, Sokh - to pound, beat, strike Sak - bag, sack O.K. - correct, right Jam - to throw up arms/hands in gladness Bou - to shine, be bright Bou - to regard with wonder, delight, love BouBou - (see above) BouBou - splendour, magnificent appearance Deg - to see, understand Okre - green pod plant ...
P.S. - My cousin-in-law is nicknamed "Bootsie"
Posts: 3344 | From: Berkeley | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
Yes Wally - I agree with all you said and I also suspect because of the apparently strong connection that Dravidian, African, African American and European scholars have found between Dravidian (Tamil,Telegu, etc.) and African dialects that this language must be, at the very least, 7000 years old with roots in a shared culture.
-------------------- D. Reynolds-Marniche Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
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posted
Nap is used in quality of wool or fabrics with a pile like terrycloth. Brits call diapers nappies. Smooth and nappy are juxtaposable terms.
quote:Woolens are often brushed to raise the ends of the wool fibers in a soft, fluffy nap above the surface of the cloth. Naps range from the lightly brushed surfaces of a flannel to the deep-pile of fleecy coatings. Deep naps are produced by passing the fabric over cylinders covered with fine metal wires and small hooks. These hooks pull fiber ends to the surface to create the nap.
Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary Main Entry: nap [tertiary entry] Function: noun Etymology: Middle English noppe, from Middle Dutch, flock of wool, nap Date: 15th century : a hairy or downy surface (as on a fabric)
quote:Originally posted by dana marniche:
quote:Originally posted by Bettyboo:
quote:Originally posted by Asar Imhotep: I can agree with his contentions on "boo" as not traceable to an African language, but you are mistaken on JAM, DIG and NAP. I don't think Nap is traceable to Egyptian however. I have already given the resources on where the other terms come from in the Niger-Congo languages.
You're still wrong. The word nappy which is an adverb or adjective comes from the word Nap which means to knot; or something that is wiry or tightly coiled. Nap and knot can be used interchangeably. The word Jam can be either a verb or noun and it is just another english word; it has nothing to do with black Americans and neither does the word dig. "dig" is an english word and relatively used to mean understand or getting to the crux or core of something...another way to comphrehend or analyze. It doens't have anything to do with black english. The british used it in that same context before African American slaves.
I would like to know when and where English used the word "Nap" as "to knot" in Britain or America in the English dialects. From what I understand the word as a verb in English has always meant to sleep for a short period, but that is just maybe something American English dictionaries are unaware of. Furthermore, it would be of importance to discovery that "to jam" is or was used in the same way British used it.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
Bubba and Bootsie aside, thanks for the dope on Boo.
quote:Originally posted by dana marniche: I would also like to learn of an African descended family in America that didn't once have an aunt or son or father or mother that has been called or nicknamed Boo, Booboo, Bubba, Boobie, Bootsie. This is a very common and early black American "nickname" that was most definitely derived from the Africans.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:alTakruri wrote: Nap is used in quality of wool or fabrics with............
What's with this Nap crap??
The word is "Nappy", not the "follow the yellow brick road" word "Nap"
Its 'formal' etymology is, of course, restricted to Europe:
quote:nappy (adj.) "downy," 1499, from nap (n.). Meaning "fuzzy, kinky," used in colloquial or derogatory ref. to the hair of black people, is from 1950.
posted
...The 'formal' etymology is, of course, restricted to Europe:
quote:ray "beam of light," c.1300, from O.Fr. rai (nom. rais) "ray, spoke," from L. radius "ray, spoke, staff, rod" (see radius). Not common before 17c.; of the sun, usually in reference to heat
Mdu Ntr c2500 - 5000 b.c. Re (ray) - the sun, daylight
quote:sir c.1300, title of honor of a knight or baronet (until 17c. also a title of priests), variant of sire, originally used only in unstressed position. Generalized as a respectful form of address by mid-14c.; used as a salutation at the beginning of letters from early 15c.
Mdu Ntr c2500 - 5000 b.c. Sir - a title of rank
Ah, the exception which proves the rule, this one eked out all the way back to Africa - Semitic - Hebrew...
quote:sack "large bag," O.E. sacc (W.Saxon), sec (Mercian), sæc (Old Kentish) "large cloth bag," also "sackcloth," from P.Gmc. *sakkiz (cf. M.Du. sak, O.H.G. sac, O.N. sekkr, but Goth. sakkus probably is directly from Gk.), an early borrowing from L. saccus (cf. O.Fr. sac, Sp. saco, It. sacco), from Gk. sakkos, from Semitic (cf. Heb. saq "sack").
posted
Yellow brick road? You better leave that poppy s h i t alone son
But on the for real side, Dana asked about nap so I dug it up for her.
Now as for you, did you read your own supplied definition of nappy where it says nappy derives from nap.
Sheesh, pay a little attention (to yourself even).
And me, I love my nappy, notty, kinky, coily, wooly, hair. And describing it as what it is will never be deragatory as long as I love myself and the way nature blessed me with hair of the helix. I reject the idea that Euros label all to do with my phenotypical features as deragatory or bad. I don't seek their approval or kowtow to their value system. Too bad for those of you who do. No crap just serious nap.
quote:Originally posted by Wally:
quote:alTakruri wrote: Nap is used in quality of wool or fabrics with pile ...
What's with this Nap crap??
The word is "Nappy", not the "follow the yellow brick road" word "Nap"
Its 'formal' etymology is, of course, restricted to Europe:
quote:nappy (adj.) "downy," 1499, from nap (n.). Meaning "fuzzy, kinky," used in colloquial or derogatory ref. to the hair of black people, is from 1950.
...Oh, really?...and derogatory, my...
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
...of course I read and included this rote use of 'nap' in this standard etymology definition...I regard this in the same manner in which I regard 'ray' being derived from O.Fr 'Rais' (incomplete, often questionable)...
Language, like DNA, is an effective research tool that can be used to explain human origins. At least one linguist has suggested that, using the standard set of commonly used source words, it would be possible to trace the human language to its original source. This, of course, is possible but NOT if one restricts this study to Europe, with the north Mediterranean being the limit of research...it would suffer the same flaws suffered by DNA research - ideological coloring...Posts: 3344 | From: Berkeley | Registered: Oct 2003
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quote:BABE LATE 14c, SHORT FOR BABAN (EARLY 13c), WHICH PROBABLY IS IMITATIVE OF BABY TALK, HOWEVER IN MANY LANGUAGES THE COGNATE WORD MEANS "OLD WOMAN", SUPERSEDED BY BABY
BABY - FIRST BORN (SON OF OSIRIS, THE GREAT ANCESTOR; NTERWER)
...MOVES TO EUROPE AND BECOMES IN GREEK BEBON
quote:BABY LATE 14c., BABI, DIM. OF BABAN (SEE BABE)
ALA, ALI, OL, ALAL - HIGH, EXALTED
MDU NTR: ALA_WA = EXALTED ONE
YORUBA: OBAT_ALA, FATHER OF ALL THE ORISHAS AND ALL OF HUMANITY
YORUBA: OLU_WA = OUR GOD
ARABIC: ALLAH = GOD ...
Posts: 3344 | From: Berkeley | Registered: Oct 2003
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posted
If you please, produce the borrowings that show English nap derives from Egyptian napy, not that it in anyway detracts from the fact that nappy from nap is a word most commonly used for the wooly hair of African populations so blessed.
You and some others may be gullible enough to wistfully imagine that suddenly, bam, in the 15th century Germanic speakers adopt a word from directly from Egyptic but I need a bit more than New Age spookism cfedulity.
And really, you need to stop immediately resorting to condescension when addressing me. It makes you not me look like the simple foolish one.
But if you insist on acting flippant I see no need seriously assess your opinion and query its foundation.
quote:Originally posted by Wally: ...of course I read and included this rote use of 'nap' in this standard etymology definition...I regard this in the same manner in which I regard 'ray' being derived from O.Fr 'Rais' (incomplete, often questionable)...
Language, like DNA, is an effective research tool that can be used to explain human origins. At least one linguist has suggested that, using the standard set of commonly used source words, it would be possible to trace the human language to its original source. This, of course, is possible but NOT if one restricts this study to Europe, with the north Mediterranean being the limit of research...it would suffer the same flaws suffered by DNA research - ideological coloring...
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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