Western historians attempt to offset their own role in slavery by inditing Arabs of the same atrocities they are clearly guilty of.
Yet there are hundreds of books on the Trans Atlantic slave trade and numerous movies. On the Arab slave trade, about four or five books. And slavery still exists
quote:Originally posted by ausar:You are ignorance of my stance on Arabs and also get too emotionally involved in discussion.
One of the issues here is "are the Arabs black?" If they are blacks then your stance would be on blacks
Posts: 42925 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
I am reffering to modern day Arabs and not the ones of antiquity. I don't believe Arabs could be categorized into one specific group because of their ability to absorb other ethnicities and still retain their culture. This means the original phenotype of the Arabs is hard to pin down. Depending on which school of thought you subscribe to concerning the origins of Afro-asiatic languages its possible they were ''black'' or at least the founding population was.
Posts: 8675 | From: Tukuler al~Takruri as Ardo since OCT2014 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
we find the person featured on the front of the homepage as an example of a "true Arab" is not even an Arabian but an African Sultan of Zanzibar endorsed by the British. Zanzibar is not even in the horn, it's much further down near Central East Africa. If you want to say "true Arab" at least put up a photo of someone who lived in Arabia !
Sayyid Ali bin Hamud Al-Busaid
.
Qaboos bin Said Al Said (Arabic: قابوس بن سعيد آل سعيد Qābūs ibn Sa'īd Āl Sa'īd; born 18 November 1940[1]) is the Sultan of Oman and its Dependencies. He rose to power after overthrowing his father, Sa‘id ibn Taymur, in a palace coup in 1970. He is the 14th-generation descendant of the founder of the Al Bu Sa'idi dynasty.
Sayyid Ali bin Hamud Al-Busaid (June 7, 1884 - December 20, 1918) (Arabic: علي بن حمود البوسعيد) was the eighth Sultan of Zanzibar. Ali ruled Zanzibar from July 20, 1902 to December 9, 1911, having succeeded to the throne of the death of his father, the seventh Sultan. He served only briefly as sultan because of illness. In 1911 he abdicated in favour of his brother-in-law Sayyid Khalifa bin Harub Al-Busaid
The Al Bu Said Dynasty
sub section- Overview Stone Age 4000 BC 3000 BC 2000-1000 BC Dawn of Islam Oman's Rulers Al Bu Said Dynasty H.M. Sultan Qaboos
Imam Ahmed bin Said bin Ahmed bin Mohammed Al-Busaidi (founder of the Al Busaidi state) was subsequently elected Imam in 1744. He was a popular and well-respected leader. Despite having to reconcile the warring factions after the civil war, Ahmad bin Said developed and built up the Oman navy into a fierce task force, which assisted in the expulsion of the Persians from Basra. He died in 1783 in Rustaq. Ahmad bin Said's son, Said, was elected Imam but he was omitt an please choice and replaced by his son, Hamad. With Hamad's sudden death in 1792, Sayyid Sultan bin Ahmed assumed power until 1804 when, upon his demise, his son, Sayyid Said bin Sultan acceded to the throne. Sayyid Said nurtured his country's economy and commercial activities. He made Zanzibar Oman's second capital and established diplomatic relations with Europe and the United States. Oman thus prospered and held colonies in East Africa and across the Gulf. During the First World War, Oman's economy and trade links declined and the country was left in relative isolation until 1970, when His Majesty, Sultan Qaboos bin Said took to the throne
THE AL BUSAIDI DYNASTY
1 Imam Ahmed bin Said bin Ahmed bin Mohammed Al-Busaidi(founder of the Al Busaidi state) 2 Imam Said bin Ahmed bin Said 3 Sayyid Sultan bin Ahmed bin Said 4 Sultan Said bin Sultan bin Ahmed 5 Sayyid Thuwaini bin Said bin Sultan 6 Sayyid Salim bin Thuwaini bin Said 7 Imam Azzan bin Qais bin Azzan 8 Sultan Turki bin Said bin Sultan 9 Sultan Faisal bin Turki bin Said 10 Sultan Taimour bin Faisal bin Turki 11 Sultan Said bin Taimour bin Faisal 12 His Majesty Sultan Qaboos bin Said
Middle East Kingdoms Arabic States
Sultans of Oman & Zanzibar AD 1754 - 1856
The Âl Bu Said dynasty, of Muscat (in modern Oman), Zanzibar (a large island off the East African coast), and Oman, essentially exercised Arab sea power in the Indian Ocean until the domination of Europe became overwhelming. Initially, they ruled Oman and Zanzibar as a single entity.
1698
Zanzibar becomes part of the holdings of the Sultanate of Oman. The Portuguese are expelled, losing their slave trade to the sultans after having made the island part of the Portuguese empire in 1503.
c.1754 - 1783
Ahmad ibn Said
1783 - 1786
Said ibn Ahmad
1786 - 1792
Hamid ibn Said
1792 - 1806
Sultan ibn Ahmad
1798
A treaty is signed with the British East India Company.
1806 - 1821
Salim ibn Sultan
1806 - 1856
Said ibn Sultan
1856
Zanzibar is ruled separately by a branch of the Omani sultans.
Sultans of Oman AD 1856 - Present Day
From 1856 the sultans ruled in Oman only, while Zanzibar was now ruled separately.
1856 - 1866
Thuwaynu ibn Said
1866 - 1868
Salim ibn Thuwayni
1868 - 1870
Azzan ibn Qays
1870 - 1888
Turki ibn Said
1888 - 1913
Faysal ibn Turkî
1913 - 1932
Taymur ibn Faysal
1932 - 1970
Said ibn Taymur
1967
The British Protectorate is ended.
1970 - Present
Qabus ibn Said
Omani Sultans of Zanzibar AD 1856 - 1964
From 1856 these sultans ruled in Zanzibar only, while Oman was now ruled separately.
1856 - 1870
Majid ibn Said
1870 - 1888
Barghash ibn Said
1888 - 1890
Khalifa ibn Barghash
1890
A British Protectorate is created for Zanzibar under the terms of the Helgoland-Zanzibar Treaty in which Germany undertakes to avoid becoming involved in British interests in the area.
1890 - 1893
Ali ibn Said
1893 - 1896
Hamid ibn Thuwayni
1896
Seyyid Khalid bin Bargash
Son of Barghash ibn Said. Usurper.
1896
Seyyid Khalid seizes the throne against the wishes of the British, so Royal Navy ships are sent to oust him on 27 August. A 45-minute bombardment and fierce firefight follows until Khalid flees to the German Consulate, and the rightful Vizier is enthroned in his place. The bombardment subsequently became known as The Shortest War in History.
1896 - 1902
Hammud ibn Muhammad
1902 - 1911
Ali ibn Hammud
1911 - 1960
Khalifa ibn Kharub
1960 - 1963
Abdallah ibn Khalifa
1963 - 1964
Jamshid ibn Abdallah
Overthrown.
1963
Zanzibar achieves independence from Britain on 10 December. The sultan is overthrown in a coup on 12 January 1964.
1964 - Present
Zanzibar is merged with Tanganyika to form the modern Republic of Tanzania.
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
If you weren't so ignorant of Arab history, you would know from his family name that he is an Arab from the Al Busaid family of Oman. The same family as the current ruler of Oman Sultan Qaaboos. If you weren't so ignorant of Arab history, you would know that the sultans of Oman and the sultans of Zanzibar are from the same family. [/QB]
The Omanis intermarried with people native to Zanzibar
The Sultan of Oman 2011. Qaboos bin Said al Said
His father:
Said Bin Taimur: Sultan of Muscat and Oman from February 10, 1932 to July 23, 1970.
Sayyid Majid bin Said Al-Busaid First Sultan of Zanzibar rule 1856 to 1870.
His reign was infamous in that he consolidated his power around the East African slave trade.
^^^^^ what do you have to say about his infamous role in the East African slave trade were women were made into sex servants and men were killed or castrated, worked to death in salt mines, or made into household servants. Most died, as much as 80% in transit
Posts: 42925 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
The trans-atlantic slave trade was better documented with meticulous record keeping unlike the Arab Islamic slave trade. This is why more information exists on the trans-atlantic slave trade.
Posts: 8675 | From: Tukuler al~Takruri as Ardo since OCT2014 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
we find the person featured on the front of the homepage as an example of a "true Arab" is not even an Arabian but an African Sultan of Zanzibar endorsed by the British. Zanzibar is not even in the horn, it's much further down near Central East Africa. If you want to say "true Arab" at least put up a photo of someone who lived in Arabia !
Sayyid Ali bin Hamud Al-Busaid
.
Do you see Ali bin Hamud on this family tree? Do you see Qaboos on the same tree?
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
If you weren't so ignorant of Arab history, you would know from his family name that he is an Arab from the Al Busaid family of Oman. The same family as the current ruler of Oman Sultan Qaaboos. If you weren't so ignorant of Arab history, you would know that the sultans of Oman and the sultans of Zanzibar are from the same family.
The Omanis intermarried with people native to Zanzibar
The Sultan of Oman 2011. Qaboos bin Said al Said
His father:
Said Bin Taimur: Sultan of Muscat and Oman from February 10, 1932 to July 23, 1970.
Sayyid Majid bin Said Al-Busaid First Sultan of Zanzibar rule 1856 to 1870.
His reign was infamous in that he consolidated his power around the East African slave trade.
^^^^^ what do you have to say about his infamous role in the East African slave trade were women were made into sex servants and men were killed or castrated, worked to death in salt mines, or made into household servants. Most died, as much as 80% in transit [/QB]
The Al Busaid family are from Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi Al-Yemeni Al-‘Omani Al-Azdi, Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar. Do you know the meaning of Al-Azdi? It means from the tribe of Al-Azd and this is a famous Yemeni tribe from Kahlan known for their blackness. SO DON'T COME WITH THAT GARBAGE ABOUT INTERMARRYING WITH NON-ARABS.
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
awlaadberry - In responding to Lioness ignorant stupidity you have disorganized the appearance of the thread. Ordinarily it is wrong to respond to her, but if you must, just tell her stupid ass that they originally came from Oman and Yemen.
Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Mike111: awlaadberry - In responding to Lioness ignorant stupidity you have disorganized the appearance of the thread. Ordinarily it is wrong to respond to her, but if you must, just tell her stupid ass that they originally came from Oman and Yemen.
Sayyid Majid bin Said Al-Busaid First Sultan of Zanzibar rule 1856 to 1870.
His reign was infamous in that he consolidated his power around the East African slave trade.
^^^^^ what do you have to say about his infamous role in the East African slave trade were women were made into sex servants and men were killed or castrated, worked to death in salt mines, or made into household servants. Most died, as much as 80% in transit
This is his father:
Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan bin Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi Al-Yemeni Al-‘Omani Al-Azdi, Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar
Read what it says about him (his father):
"Signed the Moresby Treaty with the British in 1822, in which he made the sale of slaves to Christian powers illegal throughout his dominions. Removed his residence to Zanzibar in 1832 (permanently in 1840). Established permanent diplomatic relations with the USA in 1836, and the UK in 1840. Recognised as Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar, by virtue of the Hamerton Treaty of 2nd October 1845, in which he outlawed the export of slaves from his African empire."
"He also maintained over seventy-five sarari (concubines), including (a) Najm us-Sabah (d. in childbirth, at Muscat, Oman, 1817), an Assyrian lady. m. (b) Khurshid, an Indian lady from Malabar. m. (c) Madina (d.s.p.), a Circassian. m. (d) Sarah (d. at the Bait al-Sahel, Stone Town, Unguja, ca. 1849), a Circassian. m. (e) a sister of Sarah, a Circassian. m. (f) Jilfidan (d. from cholera, at the Bait al-Tani, Zanzibar, 1859), daughter of a Circassian farmer and captured in a raid by Albanians. m. (g) Fatala, an Ethiopian. m. (h) Taj, a Georgian. m. (i) Nur us-Sabah.
Circassians, Albanians, Georgians... Is the picture becoming clearer to you Lioness et al?
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
Ausar you are ignorant and have this ego like you know everything ya hayawan. Dont worry about eritrea ethiopia or the nile it doesnt belong to you. I have mention this fucking 100 times i am from eritrea and egypt more original than any of your families born and raised in Aswan when i was young i use to beat the **** out of Sa3eedi kids everyday. My Father is Amir Saeed Abu Amna from the great Bishari tribe of Egypt My Mother is Samra Al-Dajani who is a jeberti of yemeni/tigre origin.
I have no problem with Nubians they are actually my brothers but Sa3eedi and arabs are the same bullshit no matter what you say Ausar you know they have the same mentality.
Awlaaad who are you? Are you one of those Slave Trading Arabs Kids.
Posts: 410 | From: Al-Ard | Registered: Jun 2009
| IP: Logged |
posted
Awlaaad please those are fake sultans and kings of slave traders.
Zanzibar had great african kings who never wore turbans before this bullshit arab Yemeni Omani garbage muslims came to the island of Zanzibar.
This Faggot Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan bin Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi actually had He also maintained over seventy-five sarari (concubines) you want to support and be part of this faggot arabs muslims family.
All these arab Sultans need to get there heads chopped of I dont care if he is Hadaramout black or Al-Azd black desert camel riders they are still the children of Abu Jahl they get No Love
Posts: 410 | From: Al-Ard | Registered: Jun 2009
| IP: Logged |
If you weren't so ignorant of Arab history, you would know from his family name that he is an Arab from the Al Busaid family of Oman. The same family as the current ruler of Oman Sultan Qaaboos. If you weren't so ignorant of Arab history, you would know that the sultans of Oman and the sultans of Zanzibar are from the same family.
The Omanis intermarried with people native to Zanzibar
The Sultan of Oman 2011. Qaboos bin Said al Said
His father:
Said Bin Taimur: Sultan of Muscat and Oman from February 10, 1932 to July 23, 1970.
Sayyid Majid bin Said Al-Busaid First Sultan of Zanzibar rule 1856 to 1870.
His reign was infamous in that he consolidated his power around the East African slave trade.
^^^^^ what do you have to say about his infamous role in the East African slave trade were women were made into sex servants and men were killed or castrated, worked to death in salt mines, or made into household servants. Most died, as much as 80% in transit
The Al Busaid family are from Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi Al-Yemeni Al-‘Omani Al-Azdi, Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar. Do you know the meaning of Al-Azdi? It means from the tribe of Al-Azd and this is a famous Yemeni tribe from Kahlan known for their blackness. SO DON'T COME WITH THAT GARBAGE ABOUT INTERMARRYING WITH NON-ARABS. [/QB]
The father of the sultan of Oman is a descendant of the Arab and non- Arab Turkish/Persian inhabitants of that country. The mother of this Sultan Qabus was a dark brown pure Arab woman from the Dthufar mountains. The original Azd of course who occupied Oman and Zanzibar didn't look like this sultan or his father.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
Sayyid Majid bin Said Al-Busaid First Sultan of Zanzibar rule 1856 to 1870.
His reign was infamous in that he consolidated his power around the East African slave trade.
^^^^^ what do you have to say about his infamous role in the East African slave trade were women were made into sex servants and men were killed or castrated, worked to death in salt mines, or made into household servants. Most died, as much as 80% in transit
This is his father:
Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan bin Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi Al-Yemeni Al-‘Omani Al-Azdi, Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar
Read what it says about him (his father):
"Signed the Moresby Treaty with the British in 1822, in which he made the sale of slaves to Christian powers illegal throughout his dominions. Removed his residence to Zanzibar in 1832 (permanently in 1840). Established permanent diplomatic relations with the USA in 1836, and the UK in 1840. Recognised as Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar, by virtue of the Hamerton Treaty of 2nd October 1845, in which he outlawed the export of slaves from his African empire."
"He also maintained over seventy-five sarari (concubines), including (a) Najm us-Sabah (d. in childbirth, at Muscat, Oman, 1817), an Assyrian lady. m. (b) Khurshid, an Indian lady from Malabar. m. (c) Madina (d.s.p.), a Circassian. m. (d) Sarah (d. at the Bait al-Sahel, Stone Town, Unguja, ca. 1849), a Circassian. m. (e) a sister of Sarah, a Circassian. m. (f) Jilfidan (d. from cholera, at the Bait al-Tani, Zanzibar, 1859), daughter of a Circassian farmer and captured in a raid by Albanians. m. (g) Fatala, an Ethiopian. m. (h) Taj, a Georgian. m. (i) Nur us-Sabah.
Circassians, Albanians, Georgians... Is the picture becoming clearer to you Lioness et al?
I am glad you posted this Tariq. Unfortunately because of some of the racist comments made toward fair-skinned Middle Eastern peoples on these threads some people can't take seriously the fact that many of these sultans and nobles of the Gulf and Arabia are the descendants of Circassians (Turks) and other non-Arab concubines. Meanwhile the texts mention large numbers of Iranian settlers descendants of Carmathians and MJawali also in these south Arabian areas.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by ausar: I am reffering to modern day Arabs and not the ones of antiquity. I don't believe Arabs could be categorized into one specific group because of their ability to absorb other ethnicities and still retain their culture. This means the original phenotype of the Arabs is hard to pin down. Depending on which school of thought you subscribe to concerning the origins of Afro-asiatic languages its possible they were ''black'' or at least the founding population was.
Actually a lot of what is considered Arab today is not Arab, but influenced by Arabs. Poetry, astronomy and certain music for example, was greatly influenced by Afro-Arabians, hunting with hawks, horse and camel breeding/ racing, etc..
However, the veil was not originally Arab but came in with cultures and peoples from the north.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
Sayyid Majid bin Said Al-Busaid First Sultan of Zanzibar rule 1856 to 1870.
His reign was infamous in that he consolidated his power around the East African slave trade.
^^^^^ what do you have to say about his infamous role in the East African slave trade were women were made into sex servants and men were killed or castrated, worked to death in salt mines, or made into household servants. Most died, as much as 80% in transit
This is his father:
Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan bin Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi Al-Yemeni Al-‘Omani Al-Azdi, Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar
Read what it says about him (his father):
"Signed the Moresby Treaty with the British in 1822, in which he made the sale of slaves to Christian powers illegal throughout his dominions. Removed his residence to Zanzibar in 1832 (permanently in 1840). Established permanent diplomatic relations with the USA in 1836, and the UK in 1840. Recognised as Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar, by virtue of the Hamerton Treaty of 2nd October 1845, in which he outlawed the export of slaves from his African empire."
"He also maintained over seventy-five sarari (concubines), including (a) Najm us-Sabah (d. in childbirth, at Muscat, Oman, 1817), an Assyrian lady. m. (b) Khurshid, an Indian lady from Malabar. m. (c) Madina (d.s.p.), a Circassian. m. (d) Sarah (d. at the Bait al-Sahel, Stone Town, Unguja, ca. 1849), a Circassian. m. (e) a sister of Sarah, a Circassian. m. (f) Jilfidan (d. from cholera, at the Bait al-Tani, Zanzibar, 1859), daughter of a Circassian farmer and captured in a raid by Albanians. m. (g) Fatala, an Ethiopian. m. (h) Taj, a Georgian. m. (i) Nur us-Sabah.
Circassians, Albanians, Georgians... Is the picture becoming clearer to you Lioness et al?
I am glad you posted this Tariq. Unfortunately because of some of the racist comments made toward fair-skinned Middle Eastern peoples on these threads some people can't take seriously the fact that many of these sultans and nobles of the Gulf and Arabia are the descendants of Circassians (Turks) and other non-Arab concubines. Meanwhile the texts mention large numbers of Iranian settlers descendants of Carmathians and MJawali also in these south Arabian areas.
Yes Dana. And when I have time inshaAllah I'll post a longer list of those with non-Arab mothers.
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by AswaniAswad: Awlaaad please those are fake sultans and kings of slave traders.
Zanzibar had great african kings who never wore turbans before this bullshit arab Yemeni Omani garbage muslims came to the island of Zanzibar.
This Faggot Sayid Sa’id bin Sultan bin Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi actually had He also maintained over seventy-five sarari (concubines) you want to support and be part of this faggot arabs muslims family.
All these arab Sultans need to get there heads chopped of I dont care if he is Hadaramout black or Al-Azd black desert camel riders they are still the children of Abu Jahl they get No Love
Wow! You are sick! And you just said that your mother is from Yemen and now you are saying that Yemeni people are garbage. What's up with that???
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
I dont are if they are from Yemen or I am from Yemen A Slave Master is a Slave Master Period.
Of course the history of the bastard child in arabia always align themselves with there fathers side who is in power.
YEAH AWLAAAD ALL SLAVE MASTER ARABS ARE GARBAGE EVEN IF I AM THE SON OF A YEMENI THEY ARE STILL GARBAGE FOR SLAVING AFRICANS PERIOD.
You Hold Allegiance to Bloodlines no matter what evil they Do. Im sorry but im different i always tell my mother arabs are a bunch of slave traders black or white arabs both are wicked.
Posts: 410 | From: Al-Ard | Registered: Jun 2009
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by the lioness: dana, below is a list of Islamic historical periods prior to the Ottomans, there are numerous Caliphs associated with these periods
1 Rashidun Caliphs (632-661) 2 Umayyads Caliphs (661-750/1031) 2.1 Caliphs of Damascus (661-750) 2.2 Emirs of Córdoba (756-929) 2.3 Caliphs of Córdoba (929-1031) 3 Abbasid Caliphs (750-1258/1517) 3.1 Caliphs of Baghdad (750-1258) 3.2 Caliphs of Cairo (1261-1517) 4 Other Caliphates (910-1269) 4.1 Fatimid Caliphs (910-1171) 4.2 Almohad Caliphs (1145-1269)
If one takes the position that the Arabs were black and later foreigners changed the "pure" black complexion of Arabia, naturally one would wonder:
1) at what period of time did Arabia become majority non-black?
2) were any of the Caliphs prior to the Ottomans not black?
3) (assuming that all Arabs are black) given that Egypt was conquered in 639 and North Africa was conquered in 652, captives taken into Arabia, this during the Rashidun period and given the fact that that African slaves were imported into Arabia if you look at blacks who have been living in Arabia for hundreds of years from the aforementioned backgrounds, how can you tell them apart from indigenous Arabs?
4) is an historical approach the best approach in dealing with racism against blacks in Saudi Arabia?
OK - I will take your questions seriously even if they are not meant to be.
From what i understand the earliest Ummayad rulers were pure Arabs i.e. of Arabian descent.
It looks like by the second century after Muhammad the rulers of the Umayyads were intermarrying with foreign women. I know some of these were Berber i.e. black women, but of course their other women.
“ While the caliphs of the Umayyad dynasty had prided themselves on the purity of their Arab lineage through marriage with noble Arab women, by the second century of Islamic history many of the caliphs of the Abbasid dynasty were the sons of slave concubines.” Pierce, L. (1993). The imperial harem: Women and sovereignty in the Ottoman Empire New York, Oxford University Press. Leslie Pierce 1993, p. 38.
"The Umayyad caliphate of the Arabs began to dissipate when the ruler Mu’tasim (833 – 842 AD), afraid of the strength of his own Arab military guard replaced them with Turkish slave troops..." after this time the Turkish soldiers became the kingmakers in the early Abbasid Middle East.
The 9th century Abbasids unquestionably possessed a contempt for not only the real Arabs and other blacks as a result of how they had been treated by the blacks from Hijaz and Yemen (the real Arabs) - as an underclass or slave class.
Hence when these early Abbasid rulers like Thalibi who said you best go back to Hijaz and "resume eating your lizards" as mentioned by (Wesley in his article) they were expressing ethnic contempt, just like the Umayyad's had expressed toward them and their people's whiteness.
In the same century a part Iranian part Byzantine poet named al Rumi meaning "the Byzantine", expressed his disdain for these non-Arabs mocking the blackness of the prophets clan writing "you've insulted them because of their blackness (b-il- sawad) while there are still the pure blooded deep black Arabs around" (Abu al-Faraj al-Isbahani, Maqatil al-tăalibiyyin, 759)
Thus in this same century Al Mubarrad "al Azdi" ( a probable Arab) was supposed to have written "The Arabs used to take pride in their brown and black complexion (al-sumra wa al-sawd) and they had a distaste for a white and fair complexion (al-humra wa al-shaqra), and they used to say that such was the complexion of the non-Arabs.’[ Ibn Abi al Hadid, Sharh nahj al-balaghah, V:56]
Members of the Hashemites or Banu Hashim Qurayshites - wrote to the Abbasids. This is the importance of Tariq's site and his talking about individual Arabs wrote. One whose son was called father of tar because of his skin color said "I am descended from the Prophet (SAWS) from my mother's side and my father's side. I am the purest of Bani Hashim...no non-Arab blood flows through my veins, and I AM NOT RELATED TO SLAVE GIRLS.
He is expressing his contempt for their ethnicity. He said you may be on top and look like you do, but I am not descended from concubines like yourself.
Thus the change came fairly early in the middle east among the ruling dynasties there. Also of course the earliest Arabians in Syria ann Arabia were taking many concubines from the Byzantines noted for their blondness and thought to epitomize femininity. Somewhat like today. At the same time stereotyped as promiscuous being non-circumcized. “I am afraid that if I see a Byzantine woman that I won’t be able to control myself” said a Banu Salim to the Prophet supposedly. See Byzantium Viewed by the Arabs. p. 124.
Of course Jahiz also in the 9th c. writes of the tribes of the volcanic al Harra region each of whom were "black" "as the lava there" and taking their concubines from the Byzantines. These included clans of the Sulaym, the Hawazin, Kinanah and Azd.
It also should be remembered that 9th century Persian Al-Baladhuri stated there were more Arabs in Iraq than in Syria.
And Arabs never became a major part of Syria. The bedouins like the Anaeza and Shammar who make a large part of north Arabian desert and Syrian desert are largely Arabized Syrians who long ago had some Arab men infuse blood. They claim descent from the well known once purely black clans of Arabia Bakr bin Wa'il of the Hawazin, Azd, etc.
These tribes have come southward only since the 17th century into the Arabian peninsula. The descendants of the Shammar and Anaeza who have never left Arabia tend to be closer to dark skinned Yemenites. Those in Syria or of Syrian origin look Syrian.
Now Andalusia was a completely different story the regimes of Cordoba being mainly Arab or Berber
According to Muslim Conquest and Settlement of North Africa and Spain p. 228 of the texts, Fath al Andalus and Akhbar Majmu’a, in the 8th century Spain, the Qays clans of Ghatafan, Hawazin and Sulaym bin Mansour, including Ka’b, Uqayl, Qushayr, al-Harish, Kilab and Muharib, were fighting amongst themselves “over the leadership of al-Andalus”.
These are the names of the black tribes of the Harra and the clans of Hawazin also known as Banu Amir bin Szaza'a moved north from south Central Arabia (Yemama) after the 9th c. settling Iraq and Khuzestan. They are the still "black" Arabs including Muntafiq, Ka'b Uqayl,Kilab Khaza'el. in the 18th c. they are described as the most powerful people in Babylonia by the colonialists. Today these Hawazin complain about the treatment they are getting from Iraqis. They are among the new "abid".
By the tenth century Cordoba was a slave state or society. At the court of Cordoba there was a palace harem of six thousand women and many more men. Norman, E. R., (2007). The Roman Catholic church: An illustrated history, University of California Press. p. 67.
At the turn of the 10th century a Mahdi named Al Qitt possessed an army of 60,000 Berber men in Andalus. See Pierre Guichard’s, “Social History of Muslim Spain.
These early men were of Masmuda and Zenata both black Africans according to all descriptions in Arabic long after the 10th century. Yaacov Lev also wrote in, “Army Regime and Society in Fatimid Egypt” (1987) about the 20,000 Masmuda men that made up part of the Fatimid troops in Egypt saying, “Masamida were Berbers from the Western Maghreb. Nasir-i Khusrau, however, says that they were blacks and characterized them as infantry who used lances and swords” . Most Masmuda and Zenata like the rest of the Berbers remain dark brown in color although they have been modified by the white slave trade in some areas as well as the last two centuries of the Ottoman black one.
I guess we can see what goes around comes around. But I think the time is up and much of the knowledge of who was Arab is coming out for a reason.
The Almuwahhid/Almohade dynasty were Masmuda Berbers and we already know what they looked like in that time. The Syrian Abu Shama 13th century and Persian adventurer Nasir Khusroes of the 11th mention them as "blacks".
Before that the Almoravide dynasty ruled in Cordoba with the Sanhaja and Massufa (Lamta and Lamtuna or Kel Aulemidden), Masmuda, Banu Joddala or Fulani, Haratin, Wangara or Gnawa and AFricans of Mali taking part. This was of course before they mixed with Europeans and became the tawny Moors or Africani Bianci of Leo Africanus 16th c.. One of the Iberian Alfonsos in Primera Cronica mentions the Sanhaja women taking part in a siege of Valencia referring to their leader Nugaymath al Targiyya (the Tuareg) as a black Moorish Amazon.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Props to you my Egyptian African brother!!! Salute to you, sickening to see people who sold Africans being touted with respect on E.S...
Respect brother, remember your ancestors were building stone temples while these Arabs were pissing in tents made of goat skin!!!
quote:Originally posted by AswaniAswad: I dont are if they are from Yemen or I am from Yemen A Slave Master is a Slave Master Period.
Of course the history of the bastard child in arabia always align themselves with there fathers side who is in power.
YEAH AWLAAAD ALL SLAVE MASTER ARABS ARE GARBAGE EVEN IF I AM THE SON OF A YEMENI THEY ARE STILL GARBAGE FOR SLAVING AFRICANS PERIOD.
You Hold Allegiance to Bloodlines no matter what evil they Do. Im sorry but im different i always tell my mother arabs are a bunch of slave traders black or white arabs both are wicked.
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Fool the Arabs did not defeat the Romans alone. the Rushidun army had signifigant numbers of non Arabs. That the thing about you Alwaad you want to equate Muslim with Arabs and that does'nt fly with me...
quote:Originally posted by awlaadberry:
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: Come on Alwaadberry, that was just a warm up. Lets go for round two....
Answer Mike's question...what can the Arabs point too??
Mike is right...why should we help the Pure Arabs, they got themselves into their situation, even you yourself claim White slaves flooded Arabia and changed the phenotype of the original Arabs so why should we care, What have the Arabs done??
Don't run, that was just a warm up.... MUH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
I answered Mike's question. Now, out of curiosity, I want you to answer a question for me. In your dream world, who won the battle of Yarmouk and who led the Arabs - an Arab our a non-Arab? And the overwhelming majority of the soldiers in the Arab army were Arab or non-Arab? And how did the Arab begin to occupy and rule the Eastern Roman territories? Were they just given to them by the Romans or did they get them by DEFEATING the Romans?
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
| IP: Logged |
What gets me is people will talk about the white man for his slavery, but give the Arab a pass. Trying to glamorize Arabic slavery saying they were treated kindly etc.
Lets be clear Aswani, Africans had civilization far greater than any Arab could muster. From the Kingdom of Yam, Kmt, Kush, Merowe, and Axum Annexed and enslaved and defeated the Arabs.
You are right no matter what color the Arab will never be seen on par with Africans, they are barbarics!!!
More power to you brother!!! Black Unity!!!!
quote:Originally posted by AswaniAswad: Awlaad the arabs didnt defeat the romans and persians by themselves most of those fighters were non arabs.
Anyone trying to say arabs didnt take slaves is a fool. Arabs didnt bring islam to africa inorder to better the life and righteousness of africans please.
UNESCO had a conference on slavery in eastafrica and the indian Ocean. They invited 50 arab scholars and not a single one showed up little kaffir bitches.
Ausar,Awlaaad,and Dana you seem to be hiding from the question that arabs inslaved many africans. Ausar even rambling about how arabs treated there slaves kindly and made them part of the family shut the **** up please.
I have no respect for arabs at all even Coptic christians in egypt are a bunch of racist idiots.
Im getting tired of this arabs black bullshit they aint black and never will be black they are a bunch of kaffirs period.
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Now as to the question of slavery among other parts of Africa. One great book on indigenous black AFrican slave masters and slavery is "A History of Indigenous Slavery in Ghana: From the 15th to the 19th Century" by Akosua Adoma Perbi.
Of course among the largest of the slave traders were the Central AFrican kingdoms and West African kingdoms of the Sudan. Whole states were made up of slaves as in Borgou controlled by the Wangara or Songhai- related people who had adopted Mande. Blacks took other blacks as slaves and of course slavery still thrives in sub-Saharan Africa in Ghana and in Central AFrica.
In Senegambia, in Ghana, among the Ashanti, Yoruba, Kanem, Chad up to a third of the inhabitants were thought to have been slaves. Slavery was outlawed in Nigeria only in 1936 a few decades before it was in Saudi Arabia. Slavery wasn't always about prisoners of war and hereditary slavery thrived in societies across the Sudan. Human trafficking of course continues as a major problem in Ghana especially child trafficking.
Unfortunately there has been an equally tremendous neglect of the part slavery played in African societies for centuries. There was a continuation of this very ancient indigenous tradition into east Africa including that part known up until two centuries ago as the Hijaz and Arabia.
Slavery of course is also found among the blacks of ancient Egypt and Nubia long before the arrival of Iranians, Turks and Syrians in Arabia or North AFrica.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Black Africa of course as in the past has a tremendous reliance on slavery which for some reason is neglected by partisan African nationalists who hold up Africa as the continent that can do no wrong.
" An estimated 2-million child-slaves work from sunrise to sunset to dig coltan by hand from the soil – and it is traded on the black market for US $400 a pound. – digitaljournal.com
With my feed reader overflowing with thousands of articles to sift through about modern slavery, I’ve recently turned to Twitter to find the stories that are moving others to speak out. The quote above came from a post cited by Chris Hogg in his twitter stream.
Slavery today, specifically child slavery, is being driven by the same motivation as it always has – profits. Coltan (Columbite-tantalite), it turns out, is ONLY in existence in the Eastern Congo and a small region of Tanzania. It doesn’t exist anywhere else. It is used in the production of capacitors.
Every day HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS of Congolese child-slaves are forced to crawl into underground mines on their hands and knees to dig for the essential raw material make electronic gadgets like cell phones, iPods, laptop computers, play stations, wireless systems, DVD players, blackberries and pagers possible."
-------------------- D. Reynolds-Marniche Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Of course the African Nubians, Beja and Tibbou have all played major roles in enslaving people as much as some of the peoples of Nubia have been enslaved. The cruelty of the jet black Tibbu traders is legendary raping of young girls is also well documented by colonialists.
In Beja society the name TeGerhae or Tigre means slave. They are now the agriculturalists of Eritrea. Slavery among the African Arabians and West Africans often involved the subjection of agricultural peoples and those who work with metals. Hence the black African allegory of the Shemran or overlords and the Hamran or Ham.
And of course like the Africans of Arabia we can not neglect one of our most famous slave trading people of the world - the Africans of Egypt who like the Arabian made the surrounding peoples into slaves. Nubians, Libyans, Euro-Mediterraneans or Asiatics of various sorts were all found in Egypt which was a civilization many thousands of years old.
The Swahili slave trade was also a well documented trade run by Africans.
"Ivor Wilks, a leading historian of Ghana, observed that Akan purchases of slaves from Portuguese traders operating from the Congo region augmented the labor needed for the state formation that was characteristic of this period. Unlike the Akan groups of the interior, the major coastal groups, such as the Fante, Ewe, and Ga, were for the most part settled in their homelands."
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by dana marniche: Of course the African Nubians, Beja and Tibbou have all played major roles in enslaving people as much as some of the peoples of Nubia have been enslaved. The cruelty of the jet black Tibbu traders is legendary raping of young girls is also well documented by colonialists.
In Beja society the name TeGerhae or Tigre means slave. They are now the agriculturalists of Eritrea. Slavery among the African Arabians and West Africans often involved the subjection of agricultural peoples and those who work with metals. Hence the allegory of the Shemran or overlords and the Hamran or Ham.
And of course like the Africans of Arabia we can not neglect one of our most famous slave trading people of the world - the Africans of Egypt who like the Arabian made the surrounding peoples into slaves. Nubians, Libyans, Euro-Mediterraneans or Asiatics of various sorts were all found in Egypt which was a civilization many thousands of years old.
The Swahili slave trade was also a well documented trade run by Africans.
"Ivor Wilks, a leading historian of Ghana, observed that Akan purchases of slaves from Portuguese traders operating from the Congo region augmented the labor needed for the state formation that was characteristic of this period. Unlike the Akan groups of the interior, the major coastal groups, such as the Fante, Ewe, and Ga, were for the most part settled in their homelands."
Many great black AFrican kingdoms seem to have thrived or prospered to some extent on the backs of slaves. This is seen not only in Egypt and Nubia but probably in ancient Sumer and early Mesopotamia.
Black Africans exported other black Africans to the Americas
"The institution of slavery existed in Africa long before the arrival of Europeans and was widespread at the period of economic contact. Private land ownership was largely absent from pre-colonial African societies, and slaves were one of the few forms of wealth-producing property an individual could possess. Additionally, rulers often maintained corps of loyal, foreign-born slaves to guarantee their political security, and would encourage political centralization by appointing slaves from the imperial hinterlands to positions within the royal capital. Slaves were also exported across the desert to North Africa and to western Asia, Arabia, and India."
Black Africans exported Africans to North AFrica and the Middle East just like black Africans and African Arabians had exported Europeans to North AFrica.
AFrica for the Africans - Greatest of all land masses!? Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Aswani, I have no beef with you. I simply donot like the fact you lump me in with arabophiles. I don't like Arabs any more than you do. Arabs donot like fellahin or sa3eedi people either. I like the Ababda and Bisharin but I donot care for the Arabized ones like the Gi'afra or Ababda.
I think you misread my post. I mention quite clearly that horrible pratices existed for the Arab slave trade. However, its still a fact that Quranic law did attempt to protect slaves. This does not excuse Arabic slavery!!!!!!!!!! This was definately a law but it was not always practiced.
Also before you point the finger at Sa3eedi people being prejudice I invite you to tell Bejas that that have to intermarry with people like the Dinka, Massai and Luo. What about Bantus? You will not get a good responce to this declaration. You cannot claim to be a Pan-African and gloss over your own people's prejudice.
I am no longer going to debate in this thread except to say I am sorry if my words were twisted and misunderstood. I donot endorse Arab slavery. I really wish Egypt and the Sudan was not under Arab control.
I am not an Arabophile. I don't care if the ancient Arabs were black or not. I want to study and learn about the Nile Valley!!!!
Posts: 8675 | From: Tukuler al~Takruri as Ardo since OCT2014 | Registered: Feb 2003
| IP: Logged |
posted
Aswani and Ausar you two get my 100% respect. Both of you are children of the Nile Valley Kings and Queens who built Waset, Ineb-hedj, Yam, Saqqa-ra, Dendah-ra, Abu Simbel etc. years before the Greeks and Arabs knew how to put on lioncloths...
Aswani and Ausar you two are Africans who were raised in Egypt and have expressed your love for Africans.
Aswani Ausar has never endorsed Arabs or pan Arabism or even Islam for that matter. You are proably more Muslim and Arab than Ausar is Aswani.
Ausar, Aswani Egyptsearch need more people like you...
Remember that it was the Unity of the African Nile Tribes that created Km.t.
I second Ausar's motto!!!!!!
I DONT CARE IF THE ARABS OR BLACK OR NOT..... I WANT TO STUDY THE NILE VALLEY AFRICANS
Out with the Arab, in with Africa!!!
quote:Originally posted by ausar: Aswani, I have no beef with you. I simply donot like the fact you lump me in with arabophiles. I don't like Arabs any more than you do. Arabs donot like fellahin or sa3eedi people either. I like the Ababda and Bisharin but I donot care for the Arabized ones like the Gi'afra or Ababda.
I think you misread my post. I mention quite clearly that horrible pratices existed for the Arab slave trade. However, its still a fact that Quranic law did attempt to protect slaves. This does not excuse Arabic slavery!!!!!!!!!! This was definately a law but it was not always practiced.
Also before you point the finger at Sa3eedi people being prejudice I invite you to tell Bejas that that have to intermarry with people like the Dinka, Massai and Luo. What about Bantus? You will not get a good responce to this declaration. You cannot claim to be a Pan-African and gloss over your own people's prejudice.
I am no longer going to debate in this thread except to say I am sorry if my words were twisted and misunderstood. I donot endorse Arab slavery. I really wish Egypt and the Sudan was not under Arab control.
I am not an Arabophile. I don't care if the ancient Arabs were black or not. I want to study and learn about the Nile Valley!!!!
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Fact is most civilizations inside and outside ancient Africa practiced slavery some more brutal than others,some cases slaves had upward mobility and could become the head of a clan, family,tribe or even nation most of these types were of military back ground,others remained slaves and their children's children remained slaves add to that the contempt most slave masters have for their enslaved or potential slaves,so it was regrettable that the Arab states passed up an opportunity for self examination and possibly lanced a festering wound that harbored hatred in the hearts of many for if history is like a pendulum they shouldn't want that hate looking them in the face when the pendulum swing back..and it will maybe not today or the day after but it will and those kind of folks have long memories,case in point http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lpY8_mKvjk&playnext=1&list=PL9D0CE03F5BC8C8F6 Warning !!! not very pretty to look at but this what happens when festering wounds go un-checked.
Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
| IP: Logged |
Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan bin Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi Al-Yemeni Al-‘Omani Al-Azdi, Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar
Read what it says about him (his father):
"Signed the Moresby Treaty with the British in 1822, in which he made the sale of slaves to Christian powers illegal throughout his dominions. Removed his residence to Zanzibar in 1832 (permanently in 1840). Established permanent diplomatic relations with the USA in 1836, and the UK in 1840. Recognised as Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar, by virtue of the Hamerton Treaty of 2nd October 1845, in which he outlawed the export of slaves from his African empire."
"He also maintained over seventy-five sarari (concubines), including (a) Najm us-Sabah (d. in childbirth, at Muscat, Oman, 1817), an Assyrian lady. m. (b) Khurshid, an Indian lady from Malabar. m. (c) Madina (d.s.p.), a Circassian. m. (d) Sarah (d. at the Bait al-Sahel, Stone Town, Unguja, ca. 1849), a Circassian. m. (e) a sister of Sarah, a Circassian. m. (f) Jilfidan (d. from cholera, at the Bait al-Tani, Zanzibar, 1859), daughter of a Circassian farmer and captured in a raid by Albanians. m. (g) Fatala, an Ethiopian. m. (h) Taj, a Georgian. m. (i) Nur us-Sabah.
Circassians, Albanians, Georgians... Is the picture becoming clearer to you Lioness et al? [/QB]
Yes the picture is clear Omani Sultan, Sa’id bin Sultan had many non-Arab concubines and this seems not to help your position, nor does this painting of him have much resemblance to some of the later Sultans of Zanzibar. He was pressured by the British to sign a treaty and also pressured by the Governor of Mauritius to abolish the lucrative Omani slave trade and despite several such treaties slavery was not abolished in Zanzibar until 1907.
The Moresby treaty distinguished between "internal" and "external" aspects of the Omani slave trade. One was permitted the other prohibited. From the point of view of the enslaved Africans the treaty was not worth the paper on which it was written.
The Moreby treaty said nothing about the Omani slave trade to Muslim lands contiguous to the Omani empire. Still the The Moreby treaty was coldly recieved in Oman though it was only a mild compromise of their slave trading, a concession to te British.
After Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan's his son Sa’id Majid the first Sultan of Zanzibar rejected the later more restrictive Hamerton treaty saying that Muslim countries could not do without slaves being exported from Africa.
20-30,000 slaves were imported to Zanzibar annually from there smuggled into Arabia, the Red Sea area and elsewhere.His reign was infamous in that he consolidated his power around the East African slave trade. His descendants would later follow this practice. Barghash bin Said claimed to halt the slave trade, but he continued this until the United Kingdom gained protectorate over the colony. This is the legacy of the Omanis in Zanzibar, spice and slave exporters, the legacy on down to later Sultans you have pictured on your website as "true Arabs" Slaves were used for the cultivation and harvesting of cloves, and the Sultan occupied so many plots that by his death in 1856, he had 45 plantations. Plots were also acquired by his children, and many concubines and eunuchs from the royal harem. Slaves, spices and ivory provided the basis of considerable prosperity, and Zanzibar became the most important entrepôt in the Western Indian Ocean. All other East African coastal centres were subject to it and almost all trade passed through it.
Trade contacts between the Arab world and east Africa go back 2000 years. There were trade links as far as India and Asia trading in slaves, gold, ivory, wood. who organised caravans into the interior of East Africa. The trade was largely financed by the Indians living in Zanzibar working for Bombay firms. Slaves were used for the cultivation and harvesting of cloves or were shipped to other parts of Africa, Persia and India. The Slaves were shipped to Zanzibar through the port of Bagamoyo. The greatest development of the slave trade was when Sugar and clove plantations Mauritius and reunion were established in the 18th century.
A remblance to the current Sultan
Slave Master legacy chart
^^^^Maternal side not shown, only the names of the most "prominant" family members are given
Posts: 42925 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan bin Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi Al-Yemeni Al-‘Omani Al-Azdi, Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar
Read what it says about him (his father):
"Signed the Moresby Treaty with the British in 1822, in which he made the sale of slaves to Christian powers illegal throughout his dominions. Removed his residence to Zanzibar in 1832 (permanently in 1840). Established permanent diplomatic relations with the USA in 1836, and the UK in 1840. Recognised as Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar, by virtue of the Hamerton Treaty of 2nd October 1845, in which he outlawed the export of slaves from his African empire."
"He also maintained over seventy-five sarari (concubines), including (a) Najm us-Sabah (d. in childbirth, at Muscat, Oman, 1817), an Assyrian lady. m. (b) Khurshid, an Indian lady from Malabar. m. (c) Madina (d.s.p.), a Circassian. m. (d) Sarah (d. at the Bait al-Sahel, Stone Town, Unguja, ca. 1849), a Circassian. m. (e) a sister of Sarah, a Circassian. m. (f) Jilfidan (d. from cholera, at the Bait al-Tani, Zanzibar, 1859), daughter of a Circassian farmer and captured in a raid by Albanians. m. (g) Fatala, an Ethiopian. m. (h) Taj, a Georgian. m. (i) Nur us-Sabah.
Circassians, Albanians, Georgians... Is the picture becoming clearer to you Lioness et al?
Yes the picture is clear Omani Sultan, Sa’id bin Sultan had many non-Arab concubines and this seems not to help your position, nor does this painting of him have much resemblance to some of the later Sultans of Zanzibar. He was pressured by the British to sign a treaty and also pressured by the Governor of Mauritius to abolish the lucrative Omani slave trade and despite several such treaties slavery was not abolished in Zanzibar until 1907.
The Moresby treaty distinguished between "internal" and "external" aspects of the Omani slave trade. One was permitted the other prohibited. From the point of view of the enslaved Africans the treaty was not worth the paper on which it was written.
The Moreby treaty said nothing about the Omani slave trade to Muslim lands contiguous to the Omani empire. Still the The Moreby treaty was coldly recieved in Oman though it was only a mild compromise of their slave trading, a concession to te British.
After Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan's his son Sa’id Majid the first Sultan of Zanzibar rejected the later more restrictive Hamerton treaty saying that Muslim countries could not do without slaves being exported from Africa.
20-30,000 slaves were imported to Zanzibar annually from there smuggled into Arabia, the Red Sea area and elsewhere.His reign was infamous in that he consolidated his power around the East African slave trade. His descendants would later follow this practice. Barghash bin Said claimed to halt the slave trade, but he continued this until the United Kingdom gained protectorate over the colony. This is the legacy of the Omanis in Zanzibar, spice and slave exporters, the legacy on down to later Sultans you have pictured on your website as "true Arabs" Slaves were used for the cultivation and harvesting of cloves, and the Sultan occupied so many plots that by his death in 1856, he had 45 plantations. Plots were also acquired by his children, and many concubines and eunuchs from the royal harem. Slaves, spices and ivory provided the basis of considerable prosperity, and Zanzibar became the most important entrepôt in the Western Indian Ocean. All other East African coastal centres were subject to it and almost all trade passed through it.
Trade contacts between the Arab world and east Africa go back 2000 years. There were trade links as far as India and Asia trading in slaves, gold, ivory, wood. who organised caravans into the interior of East Africa. The trade was largely financed by the Indians living in Zanzibar working for Bombay firms. Slaves were used for the cultivation and harvesting of cloves or were shipped to other parts of Africa, Persia and India. The Slaves were shipped to Zanzibar through the port of Bagamoyo. The greatest development of the slave trade was when Sugar and clove plantations Mauritius and reunion were established in the 18th century.
A remblance to the current Sultan
Slave Master legacy chart
^^^^Maternal side not shown, only the names of the most "prominant" family members are given [/QB]
Yes, there is a resemblance and that's why I posted the picture - to show that Qaboos's complexion is not inherited from some "African slave". Instead it is inherited from his Arab ancestors. And I mentioned what I mentioned about his ancestor's concubines to show that it is the light complexioned ones in his family tree who inherited their complexion from slaves - not the dark ones as yoh seem to be suggesting. And I mentioned the fact that his ancestors are descended from the Al-Azd tribe to show that his distant ancestors were darker than all of the people in the pictures above - including Ali bin Hamoud.
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
Sayyid Sa’id bin Sultan bin Al-Imam Ahmad bin Sa’id Al-Busaidi Al-Yemeni Al-‘Omani Al-Azdi, Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar
Read what it says about him (his father):
"Signed the Moresby Treaty with the British in 1822, in which he made the sale of slaves to Christian powers illegal throughout his dominions. Removed his residence to Zanzibar in 1832 (permanently in 1840). Established permanent diplomatic relations with the USA in 1836, and the UK in 1840. Recognised as Sultan of Muscat, Oman and Zanzibar, by virtue of the Hamerton Treaty of 2nd October 1845, in which he outlawed the export of slaves from his African empire."
"He also maintained over seventy-five sarari (concubines), including (a) Najm us-Sabah (d. in childbirth, at Muscat, Oman, 1817), an Assyrian lady. m. (b) Khurshid, an Indian lady from Malabar. m. (c) Madina (d.s.p.), a Circassian. m. (d) Sarah (d. at the Bait al-Sahel, Stone Town, Unguja, ca. 1849), a Circassian. m. (e) a sister of Sarah, a Circassian. m. (f) Jilfidan (d. from cholera, at the Bait al-Tani, Zanzibar, 1859), daughter of a Circassian farmer and captured in a raid by Albanians. m. (g) Fatala, an Ethiopian. m. (h) Taj, a Georgian. m. (i) Nur us-Sabah Circassians, Albanians, Georgians... Is the picture becoming clearer to you Lioness et al?
Yes the picture is clear Omani Sultan, Sa’id bin Sultan had many non-Arab concubines and this seems to not help your position.
A remblance to the current Sultan
Slave Master legacy chart
^^^^Maternal side not shown, only the names of the most "prominant" family members are given [/QB]
How does it seem to not help my position? And who are you looking for on the maternal side in the family tree?
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Brada-Anansi: Fact is most civilizations inside and outside ancient Africa practiced slavery some more brutal than others,some cases slaves had upward mobility and could become the head of a clan, family,tribe or even nation most of these types were of military back ground,others remained slaves and their children's children remained slaves add to that the contempt most slave masters have for their enslaved or potential slaves,so it was regrettable that the Arab states passed up an opportunity for self examination and possibly lanced a festering wound that harbored hatred in the hearts of many for if history is like a pendulum they shouldn't want that hate looking them in the face when the pendulum swing back..and it will maybe not today or the day after but it will and those kind of folks have long memories,case in point http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lpY8_mKvjk&playnext=1&list=PL9D0CE03F5BC8C8F6 Warning !!! not very pretty to look at but this what happens when festering wounds go un-checked.
posted
The slave trade out of Zanzibar was so important to Black history, that I thought a basic history of Oman and Zanzibar should have it's own thread. It's strictly cut-n-paste, and not personally researched, but it's better than nothing. Hope I didn't step on any toes.
Posts: 22721 | Registered: Oct 2005
| IP: Logged |
Slavery was common practice in Africa before interaction with Colonial Europeans ever took place. The kings like that of the Asanti and Dahomey were barbaric in war, and waged endless war against their neighbors. Survivors of conquered villages were brought back as slaves. They began selling these slaves to the Europeans in return for muskets and other goods. As recent as the 1890s, slaves were more a commodity in trading than even gold. This new market caused an explosion in the conquest practice across the region, and continued long after the Europeans abandoned participation in it. These kingdoms were adamant against ending the trade, and even into 1840, King Gezo of the Dahomey would do anything the British requested, save end the slave trade, saying “The slave trade is the ruling principle of my people. It is the source and the glory of their wealth…the mother lulls the child to sleep with notes of triumph over an enemy reduced to slavery…”Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
His father Turki bin Abdullah bin Muhammad (ترکي بن عبدالله) (1855-1834) was the founder of the Second Saudi State and ruled the area of Najd during the period from 1821-1834 following administration by the Ottoman Empire.
Once agin the first state of Saudi Arabia:
the founder Ibn Saud:
This thread is not what did the Arabs look like. They had been mixing for enturies and "Arab" is not a race. All contemporary Arabs were considered as descended from two ancestors, Qahtan and Adnan.
Omanis and others are of the Southern branch, Qahtan. Prophet Muhammad was of the Northern branch Adnan. They can be distinguished by genetics and Arabin historical records and geneology. Yet both groups are Arabs.
You wish to steer this thread into "how did the early Arabs look"
But you avoid the topic of Arab slavery which included large numbers of Africans and Eurasians brought into Arabia and some slavery still goes on today. Instead of men who lived in Arabia being posted on your website as "true Arabs" you have Sultans of Zanzibar, who were not involved in the slavery of Eurasians into the empire. Zanzibar was the transfer point for Africa, far off form Asia a coastal import export point for ensalved Africans. Some of the harshest comnditions for slaves of the Arabs are related to theis place, the Zanj who were exported to the salt mines of Iraq to be worked to death. African slaves worked the spice planations for which Zanzibar was also famous for. Who could forget their cloves? These Sultans of Zanzibar only changed their ways becasue of pressure from the British and they continued to violate treaties as much as they could.
Posts: 42925 | From: , | Registered: Jan 2010
| IP: Logged |
posted
I think Lioness should get credit for exposing Alwaadberry, He puts up Zanzibari Sultans as proof of "Black Arabs" or True Arabs despite Zanzibar's Sultans enslavement of Africans. I think Alwaad's credibility should be questioned...
On a side not I think the British deserve Credit for ending slavery and forcing the Arab and Africans to end slavery...
Posts: 8804 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
| IP: Logged |
His father Turki bin Abdullah bin Muhammad (ترکي بن عبدالله) (1855-1834) was the founder of the Second Saudi State and ruled the area of Najd during the period from 1821-1834 following administration by the Ottoman Empire.
Once agin the first state of Saudi Arabia:
the founder Ibn Saud:
This thread is not what did the Arabs look like. They had been mixing for enturies and "Arab" is not a race. All contemporary Arabs were considered as descended from two ancestors, Qahtan and Adnan.
Omanis and others are of the Southern branch, Qahtan. Prophet Muhammad was of the Northern branch Adnan. They can be distinguished by genetics and Arabin historical records and geneology. Yet both groups are Arabs.
You wish to steer this thread into "how did the early Arabs look"
But you avoid the topic of Arab slavery which included large numbers of Africans and Eurasians brought into Arabia and some slavery still goes on today. Instead of men who lived in Arabia being posted on your website as "true Arabs" you have Sultans of Zanzibar, who were not involved in the slavery of Eurasians into the empire. Zanzibar was the transfer point for Africa, far off form Asia a coastal import export point for ensalved Africans. Some of the harshest comnditions for slaves of the Arabs are related to theis place, the Zanj who were exported to the salt mines of Iraq to be worked to death. African slaves worked the spice planations for which Zanzibar was also famous for. Who could forget their cloves? These Sultans of Zanzibar only changed their ways becasue of pressure from the British and they continued to violate treaties as much as they could.
I didn't leave his name out. His name is in the family tree. Duh! And do you seriously think that he is the Faisal bin Turki from the Al Saud??? Come on Lioness. Stop being so ignorant. The Faisal bin Turki from the Al Saud has nothing to do with Qaboos's great grandfather Faisal bin Turki. I don't know why I'm wasting my time with your ignorance.
And "Arab" IS a race.
And again don't talk about genetics because you don't know anything about what an "Arab gene" is.
You keep saying that this thread isn't about the appearance of the Arabs, but about Arab involvement in the slave trade. And I keep asking you WHAT ABOUT ARAB INVOLVEMENT IN THE SLAVE TRADE??? What's your point? Which people on this earth didn't have slaves. Tell me.
You keep saying that the sultans that I have on my website are from Zanzibar and not Arabs and I keep telling you that they are Omanis from the same family as the ruling family in Oman. By saying stupid things like that, you force me to talk about the appearance of the pure Arabs though you claim that this isn't the topic of this thread.
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: I think Lioness should get credit for exposing Alwaadberry, He puts up Zanzibari Sultans as proof of "Black Arabs" or True Arabs despite Zanzibar's Sultans enslavement of Africans. I think Alwaad's credibility should be questioned...
On a side not I think the British deserve Credit for ending slavery and forcing the Arab and Africans to end slavery...
And I think that you are either on drugs or have mental problems. What do you think about what I think?
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
His father Turki bin Abdullah bin Muhammad (ترکي بن عبدالله) (1855-1834) was the founder of the Second Saudi State and ruled the area of Najd during the period from 1821-1834 following administration by the Ottoman Empire.
Once agin the first state of Saudi Arabia:
the founder Ibn Saud:
This thread is not what did the Arabs look like. They had been mixing for enturies and "Arab" is not a race. All contemporary Arabs were considered as descended from two ancestors, Qahtan and Adnan.
Omanis and others are of the Southern branch, Qahtan. Prophet Muhammad was of the Northern branch Adnan. They can be distinguished by genetics and Arabin historical records and geneology. Yet both groups are Arabs.
You wish to steer this thread into "how did the early Arabs look"
But you avoid the topic of Arab slavery which included large numbers of Africans and Eurasians brought into Arabia and some slavery still goes on today. Instead of men who lived in Arabia being posted on your website as "true Arabs" you have Sultans of Zanzibar, who were not involved in the slavery of Eurasians into the empire. Zanzibar was the transfer point for Africa, far off form Asia a coastal import export point for ensalved Africans. Some of the harshest comnditions for slaves of the Arabs are related to theis place, the Zanj who were exported to the salt mines of Iraq to be worked to death. African slaves worked the spice planations for which Zanzibar was also famous for. Who could forget their cloves? These Sultans of Zanzibar only changed their ways becasue of pressure from the British and they continued to violate treaties as much as they could.
Tell us how the northen Adnan look today Lyin__ tell us how the Kenaanah, Quraysh, Muharib, Abs, Sulaym and Hawazin bin Mansour Utaybah, looked and look. Please I am begging you. LOL!
Just name one group of these people that were not described as black. I have asked this a dozen times about the Berbers now I would like to here about the Arabs of Adnan and his Mudar descendants!
We are now waiting!
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by awlaadberry: Lioness et al,
Do you care to speak a little about this:
Slavery was common practice in Africa before interaction with Colonial Europeans ever took place. The kings like that of the Asanti and Dahomey were barbaric in war, and waged endless war against their neighbors. Survivors of conquered villages were brought back as slaves. They began selling these slaves to the Europeans in return for muskets and other goods. As recent as the 1890s, slaves were more a commodity in trading than even gold. This new market caused an explosion in the conquest practice across the region, and continued long after the Europeans abandoned participation in it. These kingdoms were adamant against ending the trade, and even into 1840, King Gezo of the Dahomey would do anything the British requested, save end the slave trade, saying “The slave trade is the ruling principle of my people. It is the source and the glory of their wealth…the mother lulls the child to sleep with notes of triumph over an enemy reduced to slavery…”
ARE YOU GOING TO TALK ABOUT THIS LIONESS OR NOT?
Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: I think Lioness should get credit for exposing Alwaadberry, He puts up Zanzibari Sultans as proof of "Black Arabs" or True Arabs despite Zanzibar's Sultans enslavement of Africans. I think Alwaad's credibility should be questioned...
On a side not I think the British deserve Credit for ending slavery and forcing the Arab and Africans to end slavery...
And I think that you are either on drugs or have mental problems. What do you think about what I think?
Don't mind Uncle Jari Alwaad he is a hidden descendant of Uncle Tom who has just said he doesn't like perenially tent dwelling black people like the Beja and Tuareg - ancestors of Aswani and Ausar - and other people that the name Qahtan, Falaj, Suwar (Thawr), Fenikha, Hajar, Punt, Cutha'a, Hadoram, Kush, Mazikha, Seba, YaArab and Misra/Imazurah came from.
He doesn't like these people even though they these same people also built the civilizations of Himyar, Makkoria, the Sabas of Arabia and AFrica, Qataban, Akkad,Kush, Tihama and the three Irams/Yams of Arabia and Africa and even Egypt an originated the three religions that the west has plagiarized for 2 thousand years.
He's a delusional Euronut history lover, expecting real black people to give up claiming these civilizations just because he doesn't like the yellowish mulatto people now living in the Middle East. Something is truly wrong with him. LOL!
He is truly SICKENING! Everytime he opens his mouth he kicks his own (so he says) black people ( like he did with Ausar's mothers ancestors and Aswani's Beja ones) in the rear end, as is usually the case with ignorant, no-nothing, think they no everything Ni_ _ _ _ s!
I would just ignore him and his inferiority complex, like he has ignored the indigenous black african slave trade.
Posts: 4226 | From: New Jersey, USA | Registered: Mar 2007
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by -Just Call Me Jari-: I think Lioness should get credit for exposing Alwaadberry, He puts up Zanzibari Sultans as proof of "Black Arabs" or True Arabs despite Zanzibar's Sultans enslavement of Africans. I think Alwaad's credibility should be questioned...
On a side not I think the British deserve Credit for ending slavery and forcing the Arab and Africans to end slavery...
And I think that you are either on drugs or have mental problems. What do you think about what I think?
Don't mind Uncle Jari Alwaad he is a hidden descendant of Uncle Tom who has just said he doesn't like perenially tent dwelling black people like the Beja and Tuareg - ancestors of Aswani and Ausar - and other people that the name Qahtan, Falaj, Suwar (Thawr), Fenikha, Hajar, Punt, Cutha'a, Hadoram, Kush, Mazikha, Seba, YaArab and Misra/Imazurah came from.
He doesn't like these people even though they these same people also built the civilizations of Himyar, Makkoria, the Sabas of Arabia and AFrica, Qataban, Akkad,Kush, Tihama and the three Irams/Yams of Arabia and Africa and even Egypt an originated the three religions that the west has plagiarized for 2 thousand years.
He's a delusional Euronut history lover, expecting real black people to give up claiming these civilizations just because he doesn't like the yellowish mulatto people now living in the Middle East. Something is truly wrong with him. LOL!
He is truly SICKENING! Everytime he opens his mouth he kicks his own (so he says) black people ( like he did with Ausar's mothers ancestors and Aswani's Beja ones) in the rear end, as is usually the case with ignorant, no-nothing, think they no everything Ni_ _ _ _ s!
I would just ignore him and his inferiority complex, like he has ignored the indigenous black african slave trade.
Yeah Dana. It's very clear to me that he's got serious issues. And like you said, he's truly sickening, but I'm going to try to ignore him. Posts: 895 | Registered: Feb 2010
| IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
Something is truly wrong with him. LOL! 
Printer-friendly view of this topic