posted
many western men are flexible, if i talk to them about islam and convince them they can listen and change their beleifs, if they did something and i told them thats wrong they will listen and think and if they are convinced they will change it. egyptian men their mind is v hard is i talked from now until 2222 they will not change, even if they are convinced of what i say and they know that i have reason they will still object and dont change.
Posts: 23 | From: alexandria | Registered: Aug 2009
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: And i am repeating my question : Why an Egyptian man asks his girl friend or fiancee or wife to put on the veil while he is not even praying and praying is the main thing in islam and the veil is an order but not one of the 5 main things?!
Becasue an Egyptpian man wants the best for his wife. He want her to be pious and protect her from sins. He doesn't pray, but he doesn't wish you harm. He doesn't pray but he doesn't want to see you using drugs, he deosn't pray but he doesn't want you getting drunk, he doesn't pray but he doesn't want you to steal. Do you get the point, the two are not mutually exclusive. He know he should be praying but that doesn't mean he's lost all his faith.
Why did you brother marry a Russian, why did your uncle (I think it is your uncle) married a western woman?
Oh please! You are trying to tell us that a non practicing man is telling his woman to wear a veil to protect her and keep her pious??!!
He is telling her to do it because he knows how silly some people are in Egypt that they will look at him as a 'good man' (because some people in Egypt are under the impression its the mans duty to get his wife to wear a veil!), he couldn't care less what else she does behind closed doors, as long as she looks the part outside, this bit is just for show, and its all about HIM!
And pinkmoon is right, why should she, or other women listen to a hypocrite? Didn't God warn us about hypocrites?
The problem is: They do. They know he is hypocrite and they know it's wrong, but they obey. Just like society expects them to do. And if she doesn't the familymembers will remind her that she has to...In fact they are keeping this practices alife...
Just for the record only in attempt to make one thing clear,,Sure there could be lot of families and men demading the hijab from the woman,,but in return I'd like to say there are also loaaaaadsssssss of women who do wear it because they want to,,I mean not every woman's hijab or niqab have a man or a family behind it.
It's structural, Misho. Girls and women are raised up in the believing that they have to obey men. From one side there is a universal call for more independancy, from the other side they keep themselves dependant by obeying. If there is an imaginary scale in obedience from 1 to 10, the men are on 10 and the women on 1, while in Europe they are like 3 and 6. Count the social pressure next to it, with the television preacher(S) claiming that wearing a hijab is THE most important fron an Islamic woman, and she has no other choice anymore...yeah sure, she can take it off while going out secretly, but in fact that is as hypocrite as wearing it because somebody else is ordering you to do so, because it should make them pious.
Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: And i am repeating my question : Why an Egyptian man asks his girl friend or fiancee or wife to put on the veil while he is not even praying and praying is the main thing in islam and the veil is an order but not one of the 5 main things?!
Becasue an Egyptpian man wants the best for his wife. He want her to be pious and protect her from sins. He doesn't pray, but he doesn't wish you harm. He doesn't pray but he doesn't want to see you using drugs, he deosn't pray but he doesn't want you getting drunk, he doesn't pray but he doesn't want you to steal. Do you get the point, the two are not mutually exclusive. He know he should be praying but that doesn't mean he's lost all his faith.
Why did you brother marry a Russian, why did your uncle (I think it is your uncle) married a western woman?
you are like most egyptian men are waisting your time in finding excuses for all the wrong things you do in life instead of trying to do the right things...
Believe me I don't need excuses, I know exactly what I'm doing. I'm just clarifying for you and other that you have no clue where the problems truly lie. You want to be faithful to Islam, find yourself a religious guy and have a wonderful life. You want western guy for his western ways, forget about religion and again have a wonderful life.
You and pinkmoon had a flawed argument from the outset. You did not only criticize Egyptian men for their behavior but you wanted a western man's lifestyle while keeping to Islam. Now that's what I disagree with. pinkmoon ,specifically, clearly wants to do at least some of what Egyptian men do just with out the backlash.
you are not right.. off course we critisize the egyptian men for their behaviour which is so so far from what the religion says.
there was one man went to the west and he made a quote saying : "i found there muslims without islam and i found here islam without muslims"
he said this because he found the poeple there in west honest, direct, dont break their promises, respect others privacy... and so other many things, and those poeple have the behaviour of the islam our religion but they are not muslims.
and he found the poeple here liers, has double faces or maybe many faces, cheat, steel, dont respect other privacy, talk bad about each other, .., and so other many bad things, and those poeple doesnt have the behaviour of islam but they are muslims.
now another question why the egyptians worry about what the other poeple think of them and dont worry about what god think of them?
why they like to look perfect in front of the poeple while they are not perfect from inside?
why the girls put hijab for the sake of poeple not for the sake of god?
why the poeple go home early for their neighbours not think bad of them while they are doing during the day all the wrong things when they are away from home?
why the poeple fear from poeple and not fear from god?
why egyptian men go dance with us in club and tell us that we are good girls and when they are turning their backs they say about us bad girls because we go dancing in disco?
why egyptian men go to pray on friday and go to dance in the night the same day and when we pray and go to dance with them they tell us "how come u pray and u dance in the disco , god will not take ur pray"? what do they mean by this?
why when i am at work some managers steel money from the hotel and when i have a respectful talk with foreigner guy in the lobby of the hotel they say i dont allow u to do so because i am conservative? how he can be a theif and be conservative?
why the 7ashish ,the cigaretes, the sex .. are for men?
why being polite, religious, conservative... should be the behaviour of the woman only?
why when the men cheat a woman we say he is clever and when he do sex we clap for him?
why the egyptian woman canot walk in confort way in the street? why she has to put hijab to protect herself from men instead of do it for the sake of god?
if i keep writing why why why from here till next month i will not finish
Then we are back to the "what is more important : believing or behaving" topic. THE BIGGEST difference, as I have expierenced it, is that in Egypt tend to act out of their religion -whilethey don't- and Europeans tend to act out of their personality. When we take 'sex outside a marriage' as an example, it is forbidden in christian religion. We know that, nevertheless majority doesn't take it as a rule of life. We have another opinion about it, we are open to discuss that openly, and we don't pretend to be followers of our religion in a strict way. We try to live our lifes in the way WE think it's good. The ones who believe in God and a life afterwards, don't fear the judgement of God because they are convinced about they had good intentions, and that's what counts...
Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: I always refused to get married with the traditional way to go meet a man i don't know who is looking for a wife but few years ago a relative called my mom and told her there is a good man and she wants me to meet him so i was curious i said ok i will give it try. I went and we met and he has a good job he was looking nice but he asked me a very silly stupid question which is : Do u know how to cook? I said yes but i asked him the same : Do know how to cook? he said : " hehe i know how to eat? "
Immediately i considered this man as ignorant Why they think a woman= cooking, cleaning, taking care of the kids? Why he asks me if i know how to cook? Stupid way of thinking
I LOVE YOU PINKMOON. Strong independent woman. Your parents has done a great job. ts people like y who could change Egypt for the better.
Y should have asked him: Do y know how to work hard and make a good a salery?? Do y know how to go straight home from work insted of hanging in the streets starring at forign women??? Do y know how to rub my feet after a hard days work?? Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: I always refused to get married with the traditional way to go meet a man i don't know who is looking for a wife but few years ago a relative called my mom and told her there is a good man and she wants me to meet him so i was curious i said ok i will give it try. I went and we met and he has a good job he was looking nice but he asked me a very silly stupid question which is : Do u know how to cook? I said yes but i asked him the same : Do know how to cook? he said : " hehe i know how to eat? "
Immediately i considered this man as ignorant Why they think a woman= cooking, cleaning, taking care of the kids? Why he asks me if i know how to cook? Stupid way of thinking
I LOVE YOU PINKMOON. Strong independent woman. Your parents has done a great job. ts people like y who could change Egypt for the better.
Y should have asked him: Do y know how to work hard and make a good a salery?? Do y know how to go straight home from work insted of hanging in the streets starring at forign women??? Do y know how to rub my feet after a hard days work??
...do you know how to massage after I have been slaving away in the kitchen all day? ...do you THINK you know how to make ME happy??
quote:Originally posted by Dzosser: حرام عليك يا عم أحمد...دانا حاجيت من خمس سنوات و طبعاَ كان عيد الأضحى و لازم يكون الوقوف بعرفة يوم الوقفة لامؤاخذة..عقبال حجك يا باشمهندس
يا عم زوسر الست الهانم بتقول ان قريبها حج عقبالك حج في عيد الفطر "8 Eid-al Fitr " مش عيد الأضحى Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Hesham': Just for the record only in attempt to make one thing clear,,Sure there could be lot of families and men demading the hijab from the woman,,but in return I'd like to say there are also loaaaaadsssssss of women who do wear it because they want to,,I mean not every woman's hijab or niqab have a man or a family behind it.
thank you so much ,even women go go to the end of the way just as the Doctor who were killed in Germany becuase of Her Hijab
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: And i am repeating my question : Why an Egyptian man asks his girl friend or fiancee or wife to put on the veil while he is not even praying and praying is the main thing in islam and the veil is an order but not one of the 5 main things?!
Becasue an Egyptpian man wants the best for his wife. He want her to be pious and protect her from sins. He doesn't pray, but he doesn't wish you harm. He doesn't pray but he doesn't want to see you using drugs, he deosn't pray but he doesn't want you getting drunk, he doesn't pray but he doesn't want you to steal. Do you get the point, the two are not mutually exclusive. He know he should be praying but that doesn't mean he's lost all his faith.
Why did you brother marry a Russian, why did your uncle (I think it is your uncle) married a western woman?
you are like most egyptian men are waisting your time in finding excuses for all the wrong things you do in life instead of trying to do the right things...
Believe me I don't need excuses, I know exactly what I'm doing. I'm just clarifying for you and other that you have no clue where the problems truly lie. You want to be faithful to Islam, find yourself a religious guy and have a wonderful life. You want western guy for his western ways, forget about religion and again have a wonderful life.
You and pinkmoon had a flawed argument from the outset. You did not only criticize Egyptian men for their behavior but you wanted a western man's lifestyle while keeping to Islam. Now that's what I disagree with. pinkmoon ,specifically, clearly wants to do at least some of what Egyptian men do just with out the backlash.
you are not right.. off course we critisize the egyptian men for their behaviour which is so so far from what the religion says.
there was one man went to the west and he made a quote saying : "i found there muslims without islam and i found here islam without muslims"
he said this because he found the poeple there in west honest, direct, dont break their promises, respect others privacy... and so other many things, and those poeple have the behaviour of the islam our religion but they are not muslims.
and he found the poeple here liers, has double faces or maybe many faces, cheat, steel, dont respect other privacy, talk bad about each other, .., and so other many bad things, and those poeple doesnt have the behaviour of islam but they are muslims.
now another question why the egyptians worry about what the other poeple think of them and dont worry about what god think of them?
why they like to look perfect in front of the poeple while they are not perfect from inside?
why the girls put hijab for the sake of poeple not for the sake of god?
why the poeple go home early for their neighbours not think bad of them while they are doing during the day all the wrong things when they are away from home?
why the poeple fear from poeple and not fear from god?
why egyptian men go dance with us in club and tell us that we are good girls and when they are turning their backs they say about us bad girls because we go dancing in disco?
why egyptian men go to pray on friday and go to dance in the night the same day and when we pray and go to dance with them they tell us "how come u pray and u dance in the disco , god will not take ur pray"? what do they mean by this?
why when i am at work some managers steel money from the hotel and when i have a respectful talk with foreigner guy in the lobby of the hotel they say i dont allow u to do so because i am conservative? how he can be a theif and be conservative?
why the 7ashish ,the cigaretes, the sex .. are for men?
why being polite, religious, conservative... should be the behaviour of the woman only?
why when the men cheat a woman we say he is clever and when he do sex we clap for him?
why the egyptian woman canot walk in confort way in the street? why she has to put hijab to protect herself from men instead of do it for the sake of god?
if i keep writing why why why from here till next month i will not finish
Yes of course this is wrong and it must be very frustrating for you, but the men you are talking about are the ones in the clubs, or the ones stealing, or womanising, so you know from the outset that you are talking to hypocrites.
I have heard that quote before about there being more muslims in the west, but to be fair, I DO think it depends where you look. I could give you a long list of things wrong with western men if I look at a certain type, but there are all sorts of men everywhere.
I agree that its good to stick up for equality and womens rights etc. But I dont think this has to be all on our terms. How many Egyptian women are getting married with the idea in their mind that once they have a baby they will need to go straight back out to work, and if grandma is also out working, and auntie, are they prepared to send their children to childcare? Are they prepared to have all their money paid into keeping the family? Are they prepared to go halves on providing a house to live in and go halves on the furniture?
If yes then great, go ahead, I am sure there are some Egyptian men out there that would rather not have this financial burden.
If an Egyptian woman wants to go clubbing and have no one judge her because she went to the masjid, then she needs to find her guy there.
It just seems to me that women here are saying 'yeah-go girl' 'equality rulz'... but have you really thought about this all of you?
I agree with what someone said about massage and feet rub but for all the 'equal hypocrisy' 'equal roles' I have to disagree, and I dont believe its the way forward for men OR Women.
But hey, I hope all those that are single find the one who fits their way of thinking Posts: 140 | From: UK | Registered: Aug 2009
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: most of the Egyptian men aren't virgin
Excuse me but this is not true with my all respect to your opinions,
What do y think the young (and not so young) egyptian guys in Sharm, Hurghada, Cairo, Luxor ect. are doing with the turist women?? Playing monopoly????? Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: most of the Egyptian men aren't virgin
Excuse me but this is not true with my all respect to your opinions,
What do y think the young (and not so young) egyptian guys in Sharm, Hurghada, Cairo, Luxor ect. are doing with the turist women?? Playing monopoly?????
And what % of the male population of Egypt is this?
And lets remember that they dont lose their virginity on their own, it takes a women too
If women want to change this then they need to all stop sleeping with each other dont they? Can we put all the blame on a man?
Posts: 140 | From: UK | Registered: Aug 2009
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: most of the Egyptian men aren't virgin
Excuse me but this is not true with my all respect to your opinions,
What do y think the young (and not so young) egyptian guys in Sharm, Hurghada, Cairo, Luxor ect. are doing with the turist women?? Playing monopoly?????
And what % of the male population of Egypt is this?
And lets remember that they dont lose their virginity on their own, it takes a women too
If women want to change this then they need to all stop sleeping with each other dont they? Can we put all the blame on a man?
Have no idea about the % but there are lots of willing/horny guys everywhere y go in Egypt. Havent met an egyptian guy yet that doesnt look at women like a steak during ramadan. There are lots and lots of horny/willing guys everywhere y go in thoose places.
Why should people stop to sleep with each other before marriage???
I look at it this way: I dont buy an expensive car without seing and testdriving it.
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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posted
I like your view, Vesuvius. We know an expression that Coln and Aken aren't build at the same day... (I rellay don't know why they took German cities as an example, but it means that when you want big changes, a lot of time is needed... I think majority of Egyptian women wouldn't even like to live like Western women, simply because it is too much different as what they are used to. Changes are going step by step...
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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posted
يا جماعة ربنا أما اتكلم عن اليهود و النصارى فى القران وصفهم انهم أهل الكتاب ما وصفهمش انهم مشركين لكن لما سئلوا سيدنا عمر عن المسيحين فال"لا أرى شركا أكبر من أن تقول ربي عيسى
وبعدين صراحة من الأخر في حديث عن الرسول صحيح بيقول" "نتزوج نساءأهل الكتاب ولا يتزوجون نسائنا الحديث دا رفم <2\378>"
في الطبري وكان الصحابة بيتجوزا من اليهود نفسهم و الرسول منهاش عن كده والاية صريحة "الحصنات من أهل الكتاب" لكن سيدنا عمر كان بيدايق أوي لما يشوف الصحابة بيتجوزوهم لدرجة انه بعت لأبو حذيفة لما اتجوز يهوديه قالوا طلقها ٌام أبو حذيفة أقوله اللي أنل عملته مش حرام قام سيدنا عمر قاله أنا خايف ان المسلمين يزهدوا في المسلمات
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by ** Ahmad**: يا جماعة ربنا أما اتكلم عن اليهود و النصارى فى القران وصفهم انهم أهل الكتاب ما وصفهمش انهم مشركين لكن لما سئلوا سيدنا عمر عن المسيحين فال"لا أرى شركا أكبر من أن تقول ربي عيسى
وبعدين صراحة من الأخر في حديث عن الرسول صحيح بيقول" "نتزوج نساءأهل الكتاب ولا يتزوجون نسائنا الحديث دا رفم <2\378>"
Ja min røv klør også....
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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Why should people stop to sleep with each other before marriage???
Because that is according to their religions, and that is what the poster is saying 'why is it ok for men to sleep with women but not the other way around' or 'most Egyptian men aren't virgins'
So sure, if someone wants to have sex before marriage then there is nothing stopping them, they just need to find someone else who is willing, but then they cant complain when men are not virgins, AND it goes against their societies expectations and their religion.
You are talking about this one act as being a small thing, but it is actually HUGE and would change the whole fabric of society. If it became acceptable for people to start to 'test drive' each other you are inviting more problems, not solving any...you will just bring the problems that come from this (unwanted pregnancies, std's, terminations of pregnancy) into a country ill equipped to deal with it, so it will pile more problems up for the women...
Do you think this will bring equality for women? OR a better lifestyle?
Who do you think will suffer more through having sex before marriage? Why go far, look around you, who has it harder in YOUR society?
Posts: 140 | From: UK | Registered: Aug 2009
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quote:Originally posted by pinkmoon: most of the Egyptian men aren't virgin
Excuse me but this is not true with my all respect to your opinions,
What do y think the young (and not so young) egyptian guys in Sharm, Hurghada, Cairo, Luxor ect. are doing with the turist women?? Playing monopoly?????
it is your problem that you give generalization based on what you see in tourists places,even in such places not all of them lose virginity not all of the egyptians men do work in tourism ,90% of egyptians live in Delta and upper Egypt noy in Hurgada and charm and to be frank but not rude to any of the women here western women seduce young egyptians and I know stories about germans come to Egypt just to get pregnant and get back to germany I am not faking this ,one of my freinds father is the director of A hotel in Sharm and he tells us that
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by ** Ahmad**: I know stories about germans come to Egypt just to get pregnant and get back to germany I am not faking this ,one of my freinds father is the director of A hotel in Sharm and he tells us that
Yeah right..... so is it right to assume that all German men are in general impotent then??
Listen you get to hear only one half of the stories. Now let me give you the other part to balance your biased judgement:
Many of these Egyptian guys lure Western women into relationships, take their money and have sex, sex, sex.... what do you think how are babies made. IMHO if most of the Egyptian men are indeed virgins how come these women become pregnant? From the swimming pools??? LOL!!
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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Why should people stop to sleep with each other before marriage???
Because that is according to their religions, and that is what the poster is saying 'why is it ok for men to sleep with women but not the other way around' or 'most Egyptian men aren't virgins'
So sure, if someone wants to have sex before marriage then there is nothing stopping them, they just need to find someone else who is willing, but then they cant complain when men are not virgins, AND it goes against their societies expectations and their religion.
You are talking about this one act as being a small thing, but it is actually HUGE and would change the whole fabric of society. If it became acceptable for people to start to 'test drive' each other you are inviting more problems, not solving any...you will just bring the problems that come from this (unwanted pregnancies, std's, terminations of pregnancy) into a country ill equipped to deal with it, so it will pile more problems up for the women...
Do you think this will bring equality for women? OR a better lifestyle?
Who do you think will suffer more through having sex before marriage? Why go far, look around you, who has it harder in YOUR society?
I dont ever want a husband/boyfriend that is a virgin. Most women like when men can "handle" a woman..... We dont expect our partners to be virgins where i come from (unless your 15 years old...) The avergae person has 9 sexual partners during their life time in my country. Im up to 4 now so i have a bit of a way to go yet but im also only 30 Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Tigerlily: so is it right to assume that all German men are in general impotent then
I did not say that !!! I just was replying to tibe,I know Germany and every place has good people and bad people and Religion has nothing to do with it,Islam is not responsible for his followers ,his followers mess up ,then this is their fault not Islam nor it is the fault of the whole Egyptians
quote:Many of these Egyptian guys lure Western women into relationships, take their money and have sex, sex, sex....
I know that Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Vesuvius: And lets remember that they dont lose their virginity on their own, it takes a women too
So if a man loses his virginity to another man - that doesn't count??
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by ** Ahmad**: I know stories about germans come to Egypt just to get pregnant and get back to germany I am not faking this ,one of my freinds father is the director of A hotel in Sharm and he tells us that
Yeah right..... so is it right to assume that all German men are in general impotent then??
Listen you get to hear only one half of the stories. Now let me give you the other part to balance your biased judgement:
Many of these Egyptian guys lure Western women into relationships, take their money and have sex, sex, sex.... what do you think how are babies made. IMHO if most of the Egyptian men are indeed virgins how come these women become pregnant? From the swimming pools??? LOL!!
Or atleast all germans will in a couple of years have braun eyes and black hair
And how does they foreign women get pregnant in Egypt when all of the country is full of either married men or virgins???? :
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by ** Ahmad**: I know Germany and every place has good people and bad people
So if a girl becomes pregnant before marriage she's a bad person or what are you trying to point out?
Listen, it's the norm here these days. Many couples don't feel anymore the need to get married even when offspring comes along.
I had my daughter before we got married.... does that make me a bad person? You really have to stop being so judgemental. IMHO the most important thing is that the child is brought up by loving parents regardless if they signed a marriage contract or not.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Tibe still working: And how does they foreign women get pregnant in Egypt when all of the country is full of either married men or virgins???? :
Good point, Tibe. I tell you there must be something in the air.
"Come to Egypt and get pregnant!!!" (new slogan by the Egyptian Tourism Authority)
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Tigerlily: So if a girl becomes pregnant before marriage she's a bad person
in Egypt ,yes of course and their family will shoot her with no doubt
quote: what are you trying to point out?
I wanna say that every place has good people and bad people and Mjority of Egyptians are excellent and nice people
quote:does that make me a bad person?
I do not judge others based on my traditions and habits ,I know this is norm in the west but it is catastrophe in Egypt,
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Vesuvius: And lets remember that they dont lose their virginity on their own, it takes a women too
So if a man loses his virginity to another man - that doesn't count??
of course not! same as if a girl has anal sex she is still a virgin, that doesnt count. Posts: 15090 | From: http://www.egyptalk.com/forum/ | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by ** Ahmad**: And how does they foreign women get pregnant in Egypt when all of the country is full of either married men or virgins???? :
this question you should ask yourself not me Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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posted
Surely this would have happened once - a woman who travels to another country to get pregnant- but you don't believe this is normal, isn't it, Achmad? If that father of your friend made it look like this is normal behaviour for an European woman, perhaps you can ask him once...
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Tigerlily: So if a girl becomes pregnant before marriage she's a bad person
in Egypt ,yes of course and their family will shoot her with no doubt
yes, even if she was raped and got pregnant.
Is shooting a girl 'Islamic' Akmad?? I cant find it in Quran, is it because mine is English??
Wouldnt they have been better just sticking to burying the baby girls alive at birth like before?? That would stop all this pre-marrital sex. Posts: 15090 | From: http://www.egyptalk.com/forum/ | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Tigerlily: So if a girl becomes pregnant before marriage she's a bad person
in Egypt ,yes of course and their family will shoot her with no doubt
What a sh!t place you come from. Stupid and intolerant even to its own kids. No way would i ever kill any offspring of mine if she got pregnant outside marriage. I would nurse her and look forward to becoming a larger family and becoming granny. I feel sorry for y that y have to live in such an evil place where "honour" matters more than love.
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Surely this would have happened once - a woman who travels to another country to get pregnant- but you don't believe this is normal, isn't it, Achmad? If that father of your friend made it look like this is normal behaviour for an European woman, perhaps you can ask him once...
no he did not say it is norm ,I mentioned that to say we have bad people and you too(from our viewpoint),I replied to tl before about that
quote:by Ayisha yes, even if she was raped and got pregnant.
this is not true Aycha,because some women are married and and still get raped even some girls get raped but people help them to get through this propblem,I do not know where do you get theses opinions!
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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-------------------- If you don't learn from your mistakes, there's no sense making them. Posts: 15090 | From: http://www.egyptalk.com/forum/ | Registered: Jul 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Tibe still working: What a sh!t place you come from. Stupid and intolerant even to its own kids
I wish I could reply to you,but I could npt lower myself to your level and your country which likes to insult every thing,those who killed not because of rape but because this is against the traditions of the society both muslims and copts will kill any and severl;y punish any girl who get pregnant without being married ,you can not impose your traditions on us nor do we want to impose ours on yours ! I wish I could reply to you ,this is Ramadan
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Tibe still working: What a sh!t place you come from. Stupid and intolerant even to its own kids
I wish I could reply to you,but I could npt lower myself to your level and your country which likes to insult every thing,those who killed not because of rape but because this is against the traditions of the society both muslims and copts will kill any and severl;y punish any girl who get pregnant without being married ,you can not impose your traditions on us nor do we want to impose ours on yours ! I wish I could reply to you ,this is Ramadan
If killing is part of your tradition and y show understanding for it then your lower than i actually though you was. Luckily sticks and stones cant break any bones. In Denmark we dont have tradion in killing young people or our own kids especially for a thing like "honour" What a sh!t country with sh"i traditions!
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Surely this would have happened once - a woman who travels to another country to get pregnant- but you don't believe this is normal, isn't it, Achmad? If that father of your friend made it look like this is normal behaviour for an European woman, perhaps you can ask him once...
no he did not say it is norm ,I mentioned that to say we have bad people and you too(from our viewpoint),I replied to tl before about that
quote:by Ayisha yes, even if she was raped and got pregnant.
this is not true Aycha,because some women are married and and still get raped even some girls get raped but people help them to get through this propblem,I do not know where do you get theses opinions!
Okay, so European women who travel to Egypt in order to get pregnant is not the norm, as -in your opinion- having double standards and behaving in a bad way is also not the norm in Egypt. You are talking to -mainly- women who all got their expierences by bad behaving men who are calling themselves Islamic. Their expierences are coloured, and you know another side of the Egyptian society; the side they don't know, or think it's minor. It's difficult to convince somebody from an opinion that is total contrary to what they have expierenced, and perhaps they never will expierence something different, because their visits stay limited to the ones who are - in your opinion- NOT representing Egypt. You are looking to a subject by your expierence and your opinion, and they are doing the same. It's very difficult to see a subject through different glasses, knowing you perhaps may be right, but that other person - looking from the other side- also is right.
Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Tibe still working: What a sh!t place you come from. Stupid and intolerant even to its own kids
I wish I could reply to you,but I could npt lower myself to your level and your country which likes to insult every thing,those who killed not because of rape but because this is against the traditions of the society both muslims and copts will kill any and severl;y punish any girl who get pregnant without being married ,you can not impose your traditions on us nor do we want to impose ours on yours ! I wish I could reply to you ,this is Ramadan
You kill your children because of 'traditions' which are the same 'traditions' that used to bury the girls alive before Islam. These 'traditions' are against Islam and you speak of Ramadan??
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Okay, so European women who travel to Egypt in order to get pregnant is not the norm, as -in your opinion- having double standards and behaving in a bad way is also not the norm in Egypt.
yes of course
quote: It's very difficult to see a subject through different glasses, knowing you perhaps may be right, but that other person - looking from the other side- also is right
of course both of us right but you people make unbelievable judges about egyptians simply the persopn who is looking from the other side away from me is looking through the fog so he can not see well
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Tibe still working: What a sh!t place you come from. Stupid and intolerant even to its own kids
I wish I could reply to you,but I could npt lower myself to your level and your country which likes to insult every thing,those who killed not because of rape but because this is against the traditions of the society both muslims and copts will kill any and severl;y punish any girl who get pregnant without being married ,you can not impose your traditions on us nor do we want to impose ours on yours ! I wish I could reply to you ,this is Ramadan
You kill your children because of 'traditions' which are the same 'traditions' that used to bury the girls alive before Islam. These 'traditions' are against Islam and you speak of Ramadan??
Hypocrite
Exactly my thought but he will have his punishment 1 day before god. He could have ramadan from today and until he die, - god would look at him with compationate eyes as he shows no compations for others either. He believe killing god creatures is okay. He will be punished on his last day.
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Ayisha: You kill your children because of 'traditions' which are the same 'traditions' that used to bury the girls alive before Islam. These 'traditions' are against Islam and you speak of Ramadan??
actually if you know islam well ,then both of them if they are married should be killed and if they are not married should be lashed ,the killing part in Arab and Islamic countries are not done by the government but people SOMETIMES do it and they kick the girls AND THE BOYS out of the family
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by ** Ahmad**: you people make unbelievable judges about egyptians
you have made unbelievable judgements about non-Egyptians and non-muslims, but thats ok is it?? Thats fine because you're an 'Egyptian man' so what you say is right?
quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Okay, so European women who travel to Egypt in order to get pregnant is not the norm, as -in your opinion- having double standards and behaving in a bad way is also not the norm in Egypt.
yes of course
quote: It's very difficult to see a subject through different glasses, knowing you perhaps may be right, but that other person - looking from the other side- also is right
of course both of us right but you people make unbelievable judges about egyptians simply the persopn who is looking from the other side away from me is looking through the fog so he can not see well
Fact is that all people inhere (except Tina ) has been to Egypt and therefore have experience with egyptians, culture and Egypt. And fact is that most egyptians inhere has never been outside their own country and therefore has no real experience with other cultures except their own. So all the "information" and "knowledge" y have is based on the typical egyptian slander "my friend says..." "i once saw a german woman...." blablabla
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Ayisha: ]you have made unbelievable judgements about non-Egyptians and non-muslims, but thats ok is it?? Thats fine because you're an 'Egyptian man' so what you say is right?
[/QB]
I did not !
Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Ayisha: You kill your children because of 'traditions' which are the same 'traditions' that used to bury the girls alive before Islam. These 'traditions' are against Islam and you speak of Ramadan??
actually if you know islam well ,then both of them if they are married should be killed and if they are not married should be lashed ,the killing part in Arab and Islamic countries are not done by the government but people SOMETIMES do it and they kick the girls AND THE BOYS out of the family
Nice families.... Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Okay, so European women who travel to Egypt in order to get pregnant is not the norm, as -in your opinion- having double standards and behaving in a bad way is also not the norm in Egypt.
yes of course
quote: It's very difficult to see a subject through different glasses, knowing you perhaps may be right, but that other person - looking from the other side- also is right
of course both of us right but you people make unbelievable judges about egyptians simply the persopn who is looking from the other side away from me is looking through the fog so he can not see well
Fact is that all people inhere (except Tina ) has been to Egypt and therefore have experience with egyptians, culture and Egypt. And fact is that most egyptians inhere has never been outside their own country and therefore has no real experience with other cultures except their own. So all the "information" and "knowledge" y have is based on the typical egyptian slander "my friend says..." "i once saw a german woman...." blablabla
Well, Tibe each and everyones expierences are coloure and limited. I think majority of the wetsern women has no expierences in several social classes, several ages, several thinking levels etc. If you are entering Danamrk and you start a conversation with a professor from a university and his family, then you will get a different opinion as when you start to talk with Joe the Plummer and his family! To get a real view on a society, you have to know all these levels...
Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Questionmarks: Okay, so European women who travel to Egypt in order to get pregnant is not the norm, as -in your opinion- having double standards and behaving in a bad way is also not the norm in Egypt.
yes of course
quote: It's very difficult to see a subject through different glasses, knowing you perhaps may be right, but that other person - looking from the other side- also is right
of course both of us right but you people make unbelievable judges about egyptians simply the persopn who is looking from the other side away from me is looking through the fog so he can not see well
Fact is that all people inhere (except Tina ) has been to Egypt and therefore have experience with egyptians, culture and Egypt. And fact is that most egyptians inhere has never been outside their own country and therefore has no real experience with other cultures except their own. So all the "information" and "knowledge" y have is based on the typical egyptian slander "my friend says..." "i once saw a german woman...." blablabla
Well, Tibe each and everyones expierences are coloure and limited. I think majority of the wetsern women has no expierences in several social classes, several ages, several thinking levels etc. If you are entering Danamrk and you start a conversation with a professor from a university and his family, then you will get a different opinion as when you start to talk with Joe the Plummer and his family! To get a real view on a society, you have to know all these levels...
I know there are lots of women from both sides inhere. And we have a lot of western women living i Egypt or have been living in Egypt - more or less do we all have the same views so more or less we must have experienced nearly the same things.
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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posted
I do not agree. We are discussing a few views, not all. To get reliable statistics we have to do reliable research. On different levels, by different respondents, etc. A collection of women who all claim te same is not a reliable research as also a collection Egyptian men isn't.
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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posted
This is an open forum with "normal" people. If people wants facts and statistics they should look elsewhere. Here people write how they see and experience things and that dont have to sientific.
Posts: 1325 | From: For tooti http://www.csa.gov.uk/ | Registered: May 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Tibe still working: This is an open forum with "normal" people. If people wants facts and statistics they should look elsewhere. Here people write how they see and experience things and that dont have to sientific.
yes why not? I can insult denmark and its people because I have wrong ideas about them! why not? Posts: 2417 | From: Cairo | Registered: Jun 2009
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posted
Haha, but try to think abit further. It's often used in politics: the loudest or biggest voice is what majority speaks. They don't have to be right, but it has to be loud, big and overwelming other voices. Just collect a group of people who talk alike, and the minority has no voice anymore. Imagine Hitler: He was wrong, but he had a loud voice. Because of that voice the people followed him and he even got democratically elected. Majority represented HIS opinion. After years it became clear that he was wrong...
-------------------- “Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing, there is a field. I will meet you there.” Posts: 7202 | From: EU | Registered: Nov 2006
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What a sh!t country with sh"i traditions!
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) has been to Egypt and therefore have experience with egyptians, culture and Egypt. And fact is that most egyptians inhere has never been outside their own country and therefore has no real experience with other cultures except their own. So all the "information" and "knowledge" y have is based on the typical egyptian slander "my friend says..." "i once saw a german woman...." blablabla
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