Well so much for Tut being R1b! I wonder what the Euronuts have to say now. Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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Also there are actually (at least) two different scenes which show peaks from entirely different persons. At 1 minute and 18 seconds they show apparently a full set of (blue, green, black, red) traces which is most likely a control sample from haplogroup R. My best guess for the haplotype would be DYS456 15 DYS389I 13? (additional bin) DYS390 23? (additional bins) DYS389II 30? (additional bins) DYS458 16 DYS19 14 DYS385 11-14 DYS439 10 DYS438 12 DYS437 13 or 14 (additional bins) Y-GATA-H4 11 (NIST nomenclature) DYS393 13 DYS391 11 No warranty for any of the values! This could possibly be the 007 control DNA that comes with the ABI Yfiler kit. At least it looks similar.
posted
I smell a rat!!! all of this could be a well orchestrated controversy to keep folks guessing and keeping fingers crossed..interest in the Boy-King will rise folks will talk more about ancient Kemet and some will even decide to travel to Egypt to see the King himself.. Ka-Chiing ..if that,s the case then bravo and well played.. Posts: 6546 | From: japan | Registered: Feb 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Yonis2: It's funny how usually afrocentrics are being labeled as attempting to "steal" egyptian history, but it's now crystal clear since the DC promotional footage was released, which in reality represented test results of the lab technicians themselves and not the remains of the 18th dynasty (as if they were clumsy and dumb enough to release the actual results before discovery channel cashed in from it's advertising, if ever allowed to reveal the haplogroup results, we all know the egyptian authority and their strict stance when it comes to investigating modern population relationship with those of ancient egypt), it's anyways now obvious who the real culprits are when it comes to "stealing" egyptian history. It has been really pure entertainment to witness how all these fantasies of European Ancient egyptian elites suddenly exploding throughout forums and blogs based on a small unvalidated stock footage, lol. That short clip cleverly revealed how some otherwise percieved sane people can get completly frentic and get intoxicated by oppressed fantasies of some elite ancestors as far back as early antiquity. I hope that footage was orchestered for this very purpose, a genious approach at revealing the true die hard fanatics.
I agree, its sad really. So where is the Cocroach Bitch Mathilda condeming them for stealing Egypt?? You see they only have a problem when Egypt is put into its African context.
Posts: 8805 | From: The fear of his majesty had entered their hearts, they were powerless | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
Noby on planet earth believes Egypt was black african except a few arfonuts who promote this nonsense. You have the same thing in other fields. Big Foot, atlantis, UFO's etc all are the same lind of demented thinking as this black Egypt. A great anology would be "Caesar must have invaded America because some Roman coins were found buried in Kansas."
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
Noby(is he from Lord of the Ring?) on planet earth indeed!! He! He! He!
Sounds like you are falling apart Hammer.
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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Well so much for Tut being R1b! I wonder what the Euronuts have to say now.
Krahn posted that on rootsweb a long time ago (postmarked Feb 18th), hence "Euronuts" have still been saying a lot since then because at this point, everything is speculation until we can receive some type of confirmation or disconfirmation from DSC or the authors of the study. Though Krahn does point out some striking inconsistencies from the screen shots which leads to the near certainty that it is stock footage, as normal some still choose to ignore it.
quote:Astrid and I have also spent an hour on interpreting the electropherograms from the video yesterday. Unfortunately it's not as easy as counting the gray bars (bins) from the Genemapper software because the lab technicians have added additional bins by themselves for some alleles that don't show up in the ladder.
Also there are actually (at least) two different scenes which show peaks from entirely different persons. At 1 minute and 18 seconds they show apparently a full set of (blue, green, black, red) traces which is most likely a control sample from haplogroup R. My best guess for the haplotype would be DYS456 15 DYS389I 13? (additional bin) DYS390 23? (additional bins) DYS389II 30? (additional bins) DYS458 16 DYS19 14 DYS385 11-14 DYS439 10 DYS438 12 DYS437 13 or 14 (additional bins) Y-GATA-H4 11 (NIST nomenclature) DYS393 13 DYS391 11 No warranty for any of the values! This could possibly be the 007 control DNA that comes with the ABI Yfiler kit. At least it looks similar.
The more interesting scene starts at 1:22 where a couple of black traces are compared with each other. This could possibly be the real traces from the mummies. Due to a bug in the Genemapper software the bins are not displayed correctly. Note that some of the peaks are far off from the bins. So the only way to investigate this is to use the actual fragment sizes on the bp scale. We have measured and calculated the peak positions with a ruler on the monitor screen and then assigned the alleles based on experimental data from runs on our own instruments. Of course the instrument results vary and there is again no warranty that my guesswork is correct. My call of the NED labeled markers may be something like: DYS393 9 DYS439 11 DYS391 12 DYS635 23 DYS392 13 or 14 (resolution not good enough for a trinucleotide repeat)
In an earlier scene at 1:12 in the blue trace we can definitely read allele 16 for the marker DYS458 and as discussed in the article itself we know about Y-GATA-H4 being 11 in NIST nomenclature. Yet another scene at 1:30 shows DYS389I in the blue trace which is most likely allele 13 I'll leave it to the experts to predict a haplogroup for this profile. Without the rare DYS393 allele 9 it matches multiple haplogroups. With the DYS393 = 9 allele I have no matches in the FTDNA database.
Again this could still be a wrong sample and I could still have made errors with my analysis. In any case I hope this helps.
Thomas
Posts: 4021 | From: Bay Area, CA | Registered: Mar 2007
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posted
Tut is R1b and his ancestors are European farmers. This shell game you guys play will not stand up.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Tut is R1b and his ancestors are European farmers. This shell game you guys play will not stand up.
Why are you attempting to steal Egyptian history? shame on you. Stick to your celtic/saxon whatever history. Your attempt is shamefull and disgusting to say the least, where is your honour and pride of the northern european ancestors? Were they not flashy enough so you target ancient Africans as part of your ancestors instead?
Posts: 1554 | Registered: Jul 2006
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posted
^ That's the exact problem with white supremacist nutcases like Hammered-- they are not satisfied with their own European culture and try to steal the credit of other ancient cultures.
quote:Originally posted by Hammered: Tut is R1b and his ancestors are European farmers. This shell game you guys play will not stand up.
Yes, keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better 'professor'.
Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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We know that Tut and his family were native Egyptians from Waset (Thebes), southern Egypt.
We know how he and his family look like from actual portraits made when they were alive.
Tut's Grandparents
Tut's Parents
^ We just aren't certain who the identities of his parents are. His father is in all likelyhood Akhenaten although sarcophagus is unmarked and his mother is full sibling of Akhenaten.
As for haplogroup, he definitely wasn't R1b...
quote:Originally posted by Sundjata: Krahn posted that on rootsweb a long time ago (postmarked Feb 18th), hence "Euronuts" have still been saying a lot since then because at this point, everything is speculation until we can receive some type of confirmation or disconfirmation from DSC or the authors of the study. Though Krahn does point out some striking inconsistencies from the screen shots which leads to the near certainty that it is stock footage, as normal some still choose to ignore it.
quote:Astrid and I have also spent an hour on interpreting the electropherograms from the video yesterday. Unfortunately it's not as easy as counting the gray bars (bins) from the Genemapper software because the lab technicians have added additional bins by themselves for some alleles that don't show up in the ladder.
Also there are actually (at least) two different scenes which show peaks from entirely different persons. At 1 minute and 18 seconds they show apparently a full set of (blue, green, black, red) traces which is most likely a control sample from haplogroup R. My best guess for the haplotype would be DYS456 15 DYS389I 13? (additional bin) DYS390 23? (additional bins) DYS389II 30? (additional bins) DYS458 16 DYS19 14 DYS385 11-14 DYS439 10 DYS438 12 DYS437 13 or 14 (additional bins) Y-GATA-H4 11 (NIST nomenclature) DYS393 13 DYS391 11 No warranty for any of the values! This could possibly be the 007 control DNA that comes with the ABI Yfiler kit. At least it looks similar.
The more interesting scene starts at 1:22 where a couple of black traces are compared with each other. This could possibly be the real traces from the mummies. Due to a bug in the Genemapper software the bins are not displayed correctly. Note that some of the peaks are far off from the bins. So the only way to investigate this is to use the actual fragment sizes on the bp scale. We have measured and calculated the peak positions with a ruler on the monitor screen and then assigned the alleles based on experimental data from runs on our own instruments. Of course the instrument results vary and there is again no warranty that my guesswork is correct. My call of the NED labeled markers may be something like: DYS393 9 DYS439 11 DYS391 12 DYS635 23 DYS392 13 or 14 (resolution not good enough for a trinucleotide repeat)
In an earlier scene at 1:12 in the blue trace we can definitely read allele 16 for the marker DYS458 and as discussed in the article itself we know about Y-GATA-H4 being 11 in NIST nomenclature. Yet another scene at 1:30 shows DYS389I in the blue trace which is most likely allele 13 I'll leave it to the experts to predict a haplogroup for this profile. Without the rare DYS393 allele 9 it matches multiple haplogroups. With the DYS393 = 9 allele I have no matches in the FTDNA database.
Again this could still be a wrong sample and I could still have made errors with my analysis. In any case I hope this helps.
Thomas
You know, this reminds me about the first time that DNA tests were done on Egyptian mummies to find population relations years ago in the late 90s but Hawass and the Egyptian government attacked it, saying the results were inaccurate. Their reasoning was that it was done and perverted by Zionists! Now, what genetic lineage could possibly associated with 'Jews' except J derived ones which are also associated with Arabs! Anyway, the actual findings were not published at all, but flash forward about a decade with more accurate DNA assessing technology and curious how the only thing the Egyptian SCA will release is info on family relations but not population ones. I seriously don't think the testings this round were tainted by 'Zionist' Jews.
You would think that if Tut's haplogroup were something connected to Europeans, the results would have been published the first day! But no it hasn't, which leaves Euronuts like Hammered frothing at the mouth and coming to wild conclusions that Tut had European derived lineage.
Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
What are European farmers? No such archaeology or anthropology term.
Neolithic farmers of hgs E and J spread their industry to Europe.
Farming was introduced into Europe by people from the Levant some of whom had African derived E hgs.
I invite sourced cited references of any such entity as "European farmers" or a sourced cited reference of Zahi Hawass stating anything about supposed "European farmers" in relation to Ancient Egypt.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
Old news for old dogs incabable of new tricks.
Earliest European Farmers Left Little Genetic Mark On Modern Europe
ScienceDaily (Nov. 13, 2005)
The farmers who brought agriculture to central Europe about 7,500 years ago did not contribute heavily to the genetic makeup of modern Europeans, according to the first detailed analysis of ancient DNA extracted from skeletons of early European farmers.
he passionate debate over the origins of modern Europeans has a long history, and this work strengthens the argument that people of central European ancestry are largely the descendants of "Old Stone Age," Paleolithic hunter-gatherers who arrived in Europe around 40,000 years ago rather than the first farmers who arrived tens of thousands of years later during the Neolithic Age.
This paper appears in the 11 November 2005 issue of the journal Science published by AAAS the nonprofit science society.
The researchers from Germany, the United Kingdom and Estonia extracted and analyzed DNA from the mitochondria of 24 skeletons of early farmers from 16 locations in Germany, Austria and Hungary. Six of these 24 skeletons contain genetic signatures that are extremely rare in modern European populations. Based on this discovery, the researchers conclude that early farmers did not leave much of a genetic mark on modern European populations.
"This was a surprise. I expected the distribution of mitochondrial DNA in these early farmers to be more similar to the distribution we have today in Europe," said Science author Joachim Burger from Johannes Gutenberg Universität Mainz in Mainz, Germany.
"Our paper suggests that there is a good possibility that the contribution of early farmers could be close to zero," said Science author Peter Forster from the University of Cambridge in Cambridge, UK.
To get at questions surrounding the ancestry of modern Europeans, the researchers studied mitochondrial DNA from early farmers in Central Europe. Mothers pass mitochondrial DNA to their offspring primarily "as is," without mixing or recombination with mitochondrial DNA from fathers. Mitochondrial DNA, therefore, provides a way for researchers to piece together how closely members of a species are related, using maternal lineages as a guide, explained Burger.
In the new study, the researchers attempted to extract mitochondrial DNA from the skeletons of 56 humans who lived in various parts of Central Europe about 7500 years ago. These ancient humans all belonged to well known cultures that can be identified by the decorations on their pottery -- the Linearbandkeramik (LBK) and the Alföldi Vonaldiszes Kerámia (AVK). The presence of these cultures in Central Europe marks the onset of farming in the region. These farming practices originated in the "Fertile Crescent" of the Near East about 12,000 years ago.
From bones and teeth of these 56 skeletons, the researchers extracted mitochondrial DNA sufficient for analysis from 24 of the skeletons. Six of the 24 early farmers belonged to the "N1a" human lineage, according to genetic signatures or "haplotypes" in their mitochondrial DNA that the researchers studied. These six skeletons are from archeological sites all across central Europe. Few modern Europeans belong to this N1a lineage, and those that do are spread across much of Europe.
The other 18 early farmers belonged to lineages not useful for investigating the genetic origins of modern Europeans because their genetic signatures from the scrutinized region of mitochondrial DNA are widespread in living humans, according to the authors.
Using the tools of population genetics and a worldwide database of 35,000 modern DNA samples, the researchers investigated the genetic legacy of early European farmers based on the fact that six of the 24 early European farmers are from a lineage that is now extremely rare in Europe and around the world.
At least 8 percent of the early farmers belonged to the N1a lineage, according to the researchers who estimate the range was between 8 and 42 percent.
Even this conservative estimate of 8 percent stands in stark contrast to the current percentage of central Europeans who belong to the N1a lineage -- 0.2 percent. This discrepancy suggests that these early farmers did not leave much of a genetic mark on modern Central Europeans, the authors say.
"It's interesting that a potentially minor migration of people into Central Europe had such a huge cultural impact," said Forster.
Small pioneer groups may have carried farming into new areas of Europe, the authors suggest. Once farming had taken hold, the surrounding hunter-gatherers could have adapted the new culture and then outnumbered the original farmers, diluting their N1a frequency to the low modern level. A range of archeological research supports different aspects of this hypothesis, the authors say.
Alternatively, a different population may have replaced the early farmers in Central Europe, eliminating most of the N1a types, but archaeological evidence for this scenario is scant, according to the authors.
###
Wolfgang Haak, Barbara Bramanti, Guido Brandt, Marc Tänzer, Kurt Werner Alt and Joachim Burger at Johannes Gutenberg Universität Mainz in Mainz, Germany; Peter Forster, Shuichi Matsumura and Colin Renfrew at University of Cambridge in Cambridge, UK; Richard Villems at Tartu University in Tartu, Estonia; Detlef Gronenborn at Römisch-Germanisches Zentralmuseum in Mainz, Germany. This study was supported by the Bundesministerium für Bildung und Forschung (BMBF)
Story Source:
Adapted from materials provided by American Association for the Advancement of Science, via EurekAlert!, a service of AAAS.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
These are the only Euro farmers related to Texans failing their attempt to crackerize ancient history.
quote: COPA (European Farmers) first started out with 13 member organisations from the then six Member States. Today COPA (European Farmers) is made up of 60 organisations from the countries of the European Union and 36 partner organisations from other European countries. The broad membership allows COPA to represent both the general and specific interest of farmers in the Member States and since its inception, it has been recognised by the Community authorities as the spokesman for the agricultural sector as a whole. Padraig Walshe was elected President of COPA on 23 April 2009. He is the first Irishman to hold this post.
quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: What are European farmers? No such archaeology or anthropology term.
Neolithic farmers of hgs E and J spread their industry to Europe.
Farming was introduced into Europe by people from the Levant some of whom had African derived E hgs.
Yes and the Hammered one should know this as he's seen the evidence for the above all too many times before.
quote:I invite sourced cited references of any such entity as "European farmers" or a sourced cited reference of Zahi Hawass stating anything about supposed "European farmers" in relation to Ancient Egypt.
Indeed. Not that I take Hawass that seriously anyway, I would like to know when he actually said that. Or is this another made up rumor that Hammered brains has bought.
Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
So we should not take hawass seriously but we SHOULD take you seriously?? The man who dreams of african armies taking the middle east?
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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quote:Originally posted by alTakruri: Old news for old dogs incabable of new tricks.
Earliest European Farmers Left Little Genetic Mark On Modern Europe
ScienceDaily (Nov. 13, 2005)
The farmers who brought agriculture to central Europe about 7,500 years ago did not contribute heavily to the genetic makeup of modern Europeans, according to the first detailed analysis of ancient DNA extracted from skeletons of early European farmers.
he passionate debate over the origins of modern Europeans has a long history, and this work strengthens the argument that people of central European ancestry are largely the descendants of "Old Stone Age," Paleolithic hunter-gatherers who arrived in Europe around 40,000 years ago rather than the first farmers who arrived tens of thousands of years later during the Neolithic Age.
This paper appears in the 11 November 2005 issue of the journal Science published by AAAS the nonprofit science society.
The researchers from Germany, the United Kingdom and Estonia extracted and analyzed DNA from the mitochondria of 24 skeletons of early farmers from 16 locations in Germany, Austria and Hungary. Six of these 24 skeletons contain genetic signatures that are extremely rare in modern European populations. Based on this discovery, the researchers conclude that early farmers did not leave much of a genetic mark on modern European populations.
"This was a surprise. I expected the distribution of mitochondrial DNA in these early farmers to be more similar to the distribution we have today in Europe," said Science author Joachim Burger from Johannes Gutenberg Universität Mainz in Mainz, Germany.
"Our paper suggests that there is a good possibility that the contribution of early farmers could be close to zero," said Science author Peter Forster from the University of Cambridge in Cambridge, UK.
To get at questions surrounding the ancestry of modern Europeans, the researchers studied mitochondrial DNA from early farmers in Central Europe. Mothers pass mitochondrial DNA to their offspring primarily "as is," without mixing or recombination with mitochondrial DNA from fathers. Mitochondrial DNA, therefore, provides a way for researchers to piece together how closely members of a species are related, using maternal lineages as a guide, explained Burger.
In the new study, the researchers attempted to extract mitochondrial DNA from the skeletons of 56 humans who lived in various parts of Central Europe about 7500 years ago. These ancient humans all belonged to well known cultures that can be identified by the decorations on their pottery -- the Linearbandkeramik (LBK) and the Alföldi Vonaldiszes Kerámia (AVK). The presence of these cultures in Central Europe marks the onset of farming in the region. These farming practices originated in the "Fertile Crescent" of the Near East about 12,000 years ago.
From bones and teeth of these 56 skeletons, the researchers extracted mitochondrial DNA sufficient for analysis from 24 of the skeletons. Six of the 24 early farmers belonged to the "N1a" human lineage, according to genetic signatures or "haplotypes" in their mitochondrial DNA that the researchers studied. These six skeletons are from archeological sites all across central Europe. Few modern Europeans belong to this N1a lineage, and those that do are spread across much of Europe.
The other 18 early farmers belonged to lineages not useful for investigating the genetic origins of modern Europeans because their genetic signatures from the scrutinized region of mitochondrial DNA are widespread in living humans, according to the authors.
Using the tools of population genetics and a worldwide database of 35,000 modern DNA samples, the researchers investigated the genetic legacy of early European farmers based on the fact that six of the 24 early European farmers are from a lineage that is now extremely rare in Europe and around the world.
At least 8 percent of the early farmers belonged to the N1a lineage, according to the researchers who estimate the range was between 8 and 42 percent.
Even this conservative estimate of 8 percent stands in stark contrast to the current percentage of central Europeans who belong to the N1a lineage -- 0.2 percent. This discrepancy suggests that these early farmers did not leave much of a genetic mark on modern Central Europeans, the authors say.
"It's interesting that a potentially minor migration of people into Central Europe had such a huge cultural impact," said Forster.
Small pioneer groups may have carried farming into new areas of Europe, the authors suggest. Once farming had taken hold, the surrounding hunter-gatherers could have adapted the new culture and then outnumbered the original farmers, diluting their N1a frequency to the low modern level. A range of archeological research supports different aspects of this hypothesis, the authors say.
Alternatively, a different population may have replaced the early farmers in Central Europe, eliminating most of the N1a types, but archaeological evidence for this scenario is scant, according to the authors.
###
Wolfgang Haak, Barbara Bramanti, Guido Brandt, Marc Tänzer, Kurt Werner Alt and Joachim Burger at Johannes Gutenberg Universität Mainz in Mainz, Germany; Peter Forster, Shuichi Matsumura and Colin Renfrew at University of Cambridge in Cambridge, UK; Richard Villems at Tartu University in Tartu, Estonia; Detlef Gronenborn at Römisch-Germanisches Zentralmuseum in Mainz, Germany. This study was supported by the Bundesministerium für Bildung und Forschung (BMBF)
Story Source:
Adapted from materials provided by American Association for the Advancement of Science, via EurekAlert!, a service of AAAS.
There is evidence that suggests mitochondrial haplogroup N1a is of African origin. If that is so, then it is likely the female correspondence of E1b1b that also migrated to Europe.
So considering that Africans or those of African descent introduced agriculture to Europe, why would Europeans migrate to Africa and settle not in the coasts but travel all the way up the Nile to Thebes Upper Egypt and create the 17th and 18th dynasty?? Why are there no traces of a European language or culture but only African? Perhaps these ancient 'Afrikaaners' wanted to be accepted by the natives, no? LMAOPosts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Baloney. What it does do is wipe out your silly black Greece idea. What about the roman coins in Kansas? Give us one of your stupid theories to explain that?
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
^ What is baloney? The genetic findings pointing to N1a origins in Africa or the previously known findings that its definitely not indigenous to Europe, or perhaps your own silly notion of European farmers settling the African Nile Valley?! LOL
Who said anything about black Greece or Roman coins? Stick to the topic please.
quote:Originally posted by Hammered: So we should not take hawass seriously but we SHOULD take you seriously?? The man who dreams of african armies taking the middle east?
First of all, unlike Hawass, I don't contradict myself. Secondly, where did you get the idea that I "dream of African armies taking the Middle East"??!
Seriously 'professor' the only dreaming here is YOU with your white Egypt nonsense. Wake up to reality already! Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
I was not talking about you Djehuti. Takruri is the one who dreams about the black srmies, you simply dream about everything. That is why academics all over the country think you guys are wackos.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
^ Really? And where do we get all of our info from if not from academics?? Do you think we make this stuff up?
Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Much of what you post are assumptions. Much of it is faulty logic. Commonly, if it is possible it must be true. In addition you take a piece of information and draw conclusions that do not exist. We have been all through that a hundred times. The problem stems from the fact that you are looking for information to build up a position you already have instead of seeking truth.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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I invite sourced cited references of any such entity as "European farmers" or a sourced cited reference of Zahi Hawass stating anything about supposed "European farmers" in relation to Ancient Egypt.
No polka, just comply with the above request.
quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Tut is R1b and his ancestors are European farmers. This shell game you guys play will not stand up.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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I invite sourced cited references of any such entity as "European farmers" or a sourced cited reference of Zahi Hawass stating anything about supposed "European farmers" in relation to Ancient Egypt.
No polka, just comply with the above request.
quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Tut is R1b and his ancestors are European farmers. This shell game you guys play will not stand up.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
I know I'm your master but quit begging me.
You're not playing with your usual led-by-the-nose fool.
You don't know the meaning of "source cited reference."
And, I repeat my three pronged challenge to you Hammer-skin.
What are European farmers?
I invite sourced cited references of any such entity as "European farmers" or a sourced cited reference of Zahi Hawass stating anything about supposed "European farmers" in relation to Ancient Egypt.
Stop polka dancing and comply with the above request. Nothing else of mindless device will satisfy or suffice.
quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Tut is R1b and his ancestors are European farmers. This shell game you guys play will not stand up.
quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Don't pull that crap on me takruri. I answered your question.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
Quit pressuring the Texas vocational school welding teacher. Thats asking too much of him.
Posts: 4254 | From: dasein | Registered: Jun 2009
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posted
Takruri, Tell us more about that african army that you want to see invade the middle east. Tell us how a people who cannot feed themselves are going to morph into a global power?
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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posted
Tell us anything about your make believe Euro-farmers. How could Hawass make a statement about some folk you invented?
You're not playing with your usual led-by-the-nose fool.
You don't know the meaning of "source cited reference."
And, I repeat my three pronged challenge to you Hammer-skin.
What are European farmers?
I invite sourced cited references of any such entity as "European farmers" or a sourced cited reference of Zahi Hawass stating anything about supposed "European farmers" in relation to Ancient Egypt.
Stop polka dancing and comply with the above request. Nothing else of mindless device will satisfy or suffice.
quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Tut is R1b and his ancestors are European farmers. This shell game you guys play will not stand up.
quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Don't pull that crap on me takruri. I answered your question.
quote:Originally posted by Hammer: Takruri, Tell us more about that african army that you want to see invade the middle east. Tell us how a people who cannot feed themselves are going to morph into a global power?
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
^ I doubt he'll ever provide what you want, Takruri. Hell, I asked him to explain his "European farmers" theory here without requesting any source cited references, making it easier on him. Yet of course he still hasn't replied.
Here it is again Hammered.
quote:Originally posted by Djehuti: Can you please explain to us how a group of European "farmers" as you put it, end up in Africa and establish themselves as an elite family not on its coasts but farther south in the Nile Valley??
Also explain why such a group would discard their own European culture for that of the supposedly 'inferior' native Africans they ruled over such as the fantasy portrait of Tetisheri above shows?-- A white woman wearing African braided hairpiece, African beaded jewelry, complete with African style topless dress exposing her breasts. Hell, why are their names African --- names like 'Tetisheri', 'Sekenenra', 'Tiye', 'Tutankhamun' etc. are etymologically African, and what of their written langauge?
Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Of course he can't post what he's incapable of producing. He has no academic background thus doesn't even know what source cited referencing is less lone how to go about gathering it.
Exposure is what it was all about from the start and that mission has been accomplished successfully.
His frauds have been exposed on every front, in fact, on each and every front he's fronted.
posted
Maybe he can expalin this? Check these facts Contrary to popular imagination, the vast majority of terrorists in the world are white males. The most destructive wars in history were(and are still) waged by whites, resulting in the deaths of hundreds of millions. The most destructive weapons are made by whites. Pornography is manufactured exclusively by whites. They are slowly but surely destroying the environment. Whites are more likely to be sexual predators, child molesters, rapists, stalkers and mass murderers. Why? The problem lies in their own nihilistic belief of racial superiority and the lack of a real sustainable culture based on higher principles of tolerance and respect. The white race must be pacified and civilized for the betterment of the planet. This will become a reality as enlightened whites shed their racist heritage and rejoin the human race as equals.
This is sooo sad read on. This is why the European is so smart,look how they experiment firsthand to come up with some of their analysis.
OWENSBORO, Ky., March 8 – Police in Kentucky said a woman arrested for public intoxication faces an additional charge for squirting breast milk on a deputy at the jail.
Daviess County sheriff’s deputies said Toni Tramel, 31, of Owensboro, was arrested Thursday on a misdemeanor count of public intoxication and while changing into a jail uniform she allegedly sprayed a stream of breast milk into the face of a female deputy, WYMT-TV, Hazard, Ky., reported Monday.
The sheriff’s office said the deputy went through a biohazard decontamination process and Tramel was booked on an additional charge of third degree assault on a police officer, a felony. She was being held in lieu of $10,000 bail.
Who will protect these poor animals from white perverts? How long will it be before animals show up at rape survivor meetings?
Edinburgh, Scotland – John Kerr, a 30-year-old Edinburgh man pleaded guilty Tuesday to charges he used a mobile phone to record himself having sex with a dog.
According to the Edinburgh Sheriff’s Office, Kerr used a mobile phone camera to record videos of himself sexually abusing a Staffordshire Terrier.
Investigators say the alleged acts came to light when Kerr’s friend found a phone behind his couch and looked to see who the phone belonged to.
When he saw two video clips showing Kerr engaged in sex acts with the dog, he first contacted the dog’s previous owner. They then contacted police and the Scottish Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals.
“He told police that those video clips were the only occasions in which he had an unnatural connection with the dog,” said Fiscal depute Aidan Higgins. “But he said he could not really say why it was he made the recordings – it was only for himself.”
Kerr admitted in court to sexually abusing the dog – allowing it to lick his private parts between April 1 and Nov. 22 of this year.
Queen’s Court deferred sentencing in the case until background reports have been completed and returned to the court. Kerr is free on bail until his sentencing resumes.
Lock up your dogs..and your children.
SARASOTA COUNTY — A woman videotaped herself having sex with two dogs and watching child pornography with a friend, authorities say.
Caroline Willette, 53, gave a CD with the images to an acquaintance, who turned it over to police. Willette has been charged with three counts of possessing child porn and remained Wednesday in the Sarasota County Jail.
Willette admitted to detectives that she had sex with the animals in her home and watched young girls perform sex acts on the Internet, an arrest report says.
What is this white obsession with having sex with animals? There will be plenty of time practice doggie style with his cell mate.
Farmington, W. Va. – Christopher Bagwell, a 26-year-old West Virginia man was arrested after breaking into home, having sex with home owner’s dog.
Bagwell allegedly broke into a home in the area and raped an Australian shepherd/border collie mix dog. The owner was away at work, according to a witness’ report.
The witness, Sierra Hayhurst, arrived at the house on the afternoon of July 8th to return items she had borrowed from the owner. She claims that while standing in the doorway, she spotted the suspect having sexual intercourse with the male dog, which “was making an awful sound.”
She then shouted at Bagwell, calling him a “sick bastard” until he pulled up his pants and dismounted the dog. He then started toward her in a threatening manner, according to police reports.
“His pants were down around his ankles and the dog was making an awful sound,” stated the witness in the arrest complaint.
At this point, Hayhurst called Farmington Police, who soon arrived and promptly arrested Bagwell on felony burglarly and animal cruelty charges. Police allege Bagwell also damaged property in the home while looting it for an undisclosed reason.
Bagwell was booked into the local jail but quickly bonded out.
Whhites should really be proud of their intelligent race.
Warrant out for Horse sex accused in Leicester Just when you think the kuffar couldn’t get any worse…
An arrest warrant has been issued for a Leicester man accused of having sex with a horse and a donkey, after he failed to turn up to court.
Joseph Squires, 66, of Overpark Avenue, is charged with buggery of a donkey between February and April 1999 and buggery with a horse in March 2004.
He is also accused of criminal damage to the animals during the same dates.
He was due to appear at Leicester Crown Court earlier for a plea and case management hearing.
Mr Squires did not attend court and it was heard he had lost touch with his solicitors.
Judge Michael Pert QC issued a bench warrant for his arrest.
Posts: 416 | From: Solar System | Registered: Mar 2010
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posted
Phew!! These people were diseased. They make a good case for the need for genetic diversity.
Only eight(8) markers are shown. Is this right?
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
Based on the Official release these are typical indigenous Africans
two independent labs
To authenticate DNA results, analytical steps were repeated and independently replicated in a second ancient DNA laboratory staffed by a separate group of personnel.
only eight data sets??? yielded complete data sets for all 8 markers in 7 mummies (Thuya, Yuya, Amenhotep III, Tutankhamun, KV55, and both female mummies from KV35) but only partial data for both KV62 fetuses and the KV21A and KV21B mummies (Figure 1). Repeated attempts to complete the profiles in the 4 latter mummies were not successful; however, we were able to replicate some of the results for the previous mummies more than 4 times in the second, independent laboratory (Figure 1). Moreover, because these profiles differed from those of the laboratory staff and were not identical to the ones established for the control group, the data were considered authentic.
no longer used as race indicator. . .but Yuya is black and Tut white. yeah right. What about the women?? Not measured. One of the obvious features of Marfan syndrome is dolichocephaly.17-19 With the exception of Yuya (cephalic index, 70.3), none of the mummies of the Tutankhamun lineage has a cephalic index of 75 or less (ie, indicating dolichocephaly). Instead, Akhenaten has an index of 81.0 and Tutankhamun an index of 83.9, indicating brachycephaly. From the control group, Thutmose II and the TT320-CCG61065 mummy show dolichocephaly, with cephalic indices of 73.4 and 74.3, respectively
More than 55 bone biopsies were used to elucidate the individual relationships of 18th-dynasty individuals, with the result that several of the anonymous mummies or those with suspected identities are now able to be addressed by name.
It is unlikely that either Tutankhamun or Akhenaten actually displayed a significantly bizarre or feminine physique.
fake bust - so who put the fake face on. Was AE or the German "discoverer"? A recent radiographic examination of the Nefertiti bust in the Berlin Museum illustrates this clearly by showing that the original face of Nefertiti, present as a thin layer beneath the outer surface, is less beautiful than that represented by the artifact.3
Sickle Cell Trait? Malaria - This means either that the infection took place quite late in their lifetime, that they enjoyed strong genetic fitness ***code for resistant***, or that they aquired a partial immunity against the pathogen during their lives. Not every person infected with P falciparum becomes gravely ill, and this is especially true in populations that have been exposed to malaria pathogens over long periods.52 If Yuya and Thuya spent much of their time living in malaria-endemic areas close to the marshes of the Nile River, partial immunization may have contributed to their survival.
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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quote: Instead, Akhenaten has an index of 81.0 and Tutankhamun an index of 83.9, indicating brachycephaly.
Where did you get that from? That goes against everything I've read about KV55 and Tut.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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posted
Read the JAMA paper brother. All of the quotes are from the JAMA paper.
-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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I agree with you brother but I am only critiquing what is written in JAMA. But it doesn't really matter does it?
The JAMA paper demonstrate that CI is basically meaningless. Yuya 70.3 but his Grandson and great grandson is . . brachycephaly. In other words based on what they wrote the feature is NOT inherited.. . .along the male line.
By the old belief Yuya(the great grand father) is a true negro. Along with other members of the Dynasty eg Thutmose II.
Notice no mention of the CI of the female line of Tut. Neither Amenhotep III. So Grandfather and great grandfather are typical "negro" but the Father and Tut is not. What does tell you?
Maybe they are back to spinning a multi-ethnic AE.
Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
None of the 18th dynasty Kings are negroes. the 25th dynasty is the olny Egyptian dynasty thought to be nubian. Our guy here that does ancient stuff tells me that upper Egypt was 5% negroid, lower egypt 1%.
Posts: 2036 | From: Texas | Registered: Sep 2009
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Ok, did not mean to counterexample you, just thought I correct that before some ''anatolian egypt'' supporting douchebag seizes this wishful oppertunity to support his case.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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-------------------- Without data you are just another person with an opinion - Deming Posts: 12143 | From: When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable | Registered: Jun 2007
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You know, I did a write up on it but in the end a few words is really all that's needed. Cephalic index isn't even worth a rack to hang a hat on.
posted
why? Boaz work is discredited according to some, I'd like to know more about this. Where is this piece you wrote.
Posts: 8785 | From: Discovery Channel's Mythbusters | Registered: Dec 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Kalonji: Dolicho and brachycephalic crania below
Tut and his father below
Obviously, the author is wrong
Which looks exactly like the artwork of ancient Egypt showing princesses and others with elongated crania, very much like those produced from head binding in other African cultures.
posted
Head shape is unrelated to skin colour or continental origin.
Do you suppose the blacks of Africa are the only dolichocephalics or that each and every black in Africa is dolichocephalic?
Have you looked into cephalic index and noted, for instance, the change in cephalic index for native Iranis or Japanese?
What major physical anthropologists of the 20th century have you read and examined their report on cephalic indices worldwide?
If one hasn't then why rely on and repeat second hand information implying dolichocephaly as being universal among and exclusive to blacks of Africa or brachycephaly not being found in Africa's blacks?
quote:Originally posted by Kalonji: why? Boaz work is discredited according to some, I'd like to know more about this. Where is this piece you wrote.
Posts: 8014 | From: the Tekrur in the Western Sahel | Registered: Feb 2006
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^ Indeed, chepalic index is just one of a number cranial features that vary among populations. While one type may be common among certain populations it is not exclusive to those populations. I don't know about all of the claims of Boaz, but I am sure he was the first prominent anthropologist to use evolutionary perspectives on populations and thus dynamics and change among population traits, and not the stereotyped static view of his predecessors
As for the JAMA paper, I've only read the genetic reports but not the craniometrics data, as I and I'm sure everyone else are all to familiar with that. That said, I'm in disbelief that they would state that Tut or anyone in his family is brachycephalic since ALL craniometric studies on the 18th dynasty and perhaps all Egyptian dynasties for that matter classify them as having pronounced dolichocephaly!
quote:Originally posted by Hammered: None of the 18th dynasty Kings are negroes. the 25th dynasty is the only Egyptian dynasty thought to be nubian...
First of all, Nubians and Egyptians are closely related peoples both culturally and physically. Secondly, all craniometric studies especially those done by Harris and Wente show that the 18th dynasty bears a striking resemblance to contemporary Nubians especially the founding father Sekenenra Tao of the 17th dynasty so your baseless protests are in vain.
quote:..Our guy here that does ancient stuff tells me that upper Egypt was 5% negroid, lower egypt 1%.
We're not interested in what "your guy" that does "ancient stuff" (whatever that means) who is likely a product of your imagination has to say. Unless this guy of yours is real and has some real studies to prove this claim, you might as well not bring him up. By the way, can you please point out where in the JAMA paper did it say Tut carried R1b? The results of the genetic analysis were quite clear and they mentioned NOTHING about haplogroup let alone R1b. No doubt your R1b claims are another product of your silly imagination as is your "European farmer" origins of the Egyptian dynasties. Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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quote:Originally posted by xyyman: fake bust - so who put the fake face on. Was AE or the German "discoverer"? A recent radiographic examination of the Nefertiti bust in the Berlin Museum illustrates this clearly by showing that the original face of Nefertiti, present as a thin layer beneath the outer surface, is less beautiful than that represented by the artifact.3
This info can be found right here!
Posts: 26285 | From: Atlanta, Georgia, USA | Registered: Feb 2005
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