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Author	Topic: Nefertiti an EAST-AFRICAN??
mali Member Posts: 182 Registered: May 2005	posted 26 May 2005 02:34 AM quote: Originally posted by Super car: Whatever Somalis think of themselves, doesn't change the fact that they are indigenous sub-Saharan Africans, and I hope they don't need a 'western' media to tell them this. I personally don't see any of the photos presented here, as being unusual, nor would they stand out, with regards to Somalis, for I have myself been to that part of the continent. I however, noticed some xenophobia (towards various foreigners) among Somalis, and even Ethiopians living in the capital city. It could be the result of a mixture of ignorance and socio-economic problems. [This message has been edited by Super car (edited 26 May 2005).] Its unfortunate the 'west' can't come to that conclusion with AE. AEs were indiginious africans. The ignorance of the west that block-cades there thought of Africans paramounting to such glory they envy.. I strongly doubt AEs and society in terms of race was a 'melting pot'. Ironically as they too saw foreigners threat to thre society..Its funny how the 'west' can acknowledge AEs as africans..blacks..but the catch...there society was diverse..blacks.whites....melting pot..and resultenly were admixtured throughout!!!! WHEN WILL THIS STEROTYPE of A AE END??? DOESNT look near..but modern science... has benefit!!!!!!!! IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 26 May 2005 05:05 AM [QUOTE]Originally posted by Waryaa: [B]"Relaxx, no need to post the darkest Somalis to prove your belief of Somalis being African" ----------------- ...I googled, went on BBC news web site for few minutes...I don't have time to pick pictures like some people on this forum...They look like people in the capital city...Come on...I met a lot of Somalis in Africa and I don't see any difference with the guys above unless you have a hidden agenda...By the way, mali is quite clear on the subject: he's African...If you had to pick between the Arab League and the African Union, what would you pick? mali, please save the brother, I think he either grew up abroad or is doing some soul searching...Anyway I don't think he's a real Somali... Relaxx Relaxx [This message has been edited by relaxx (edited 26 May 2005).] IP: Logged
Waryaa Member Posts: 72 Registered: May 2005	posted 26 May 2005 05:47 AM As I wrote earlier, Somalis do not give a hoot what others think of them exactly. That was even recorded by the so-called Burtons, etc. There is no reason to choose a two well-timed multiple choice question of Arab League and African Union. If you want an honest answer from me, I would choose Somalia itself anyday since you didn't give me a third choice. Or perhaps United Nations, which, again, Somalia is a member of too. Or perhaps Nonaligned Movement, which again Somalia was a founding member. You need to expand your multi-choice questions. Who labels whom, by the way? Who exactly classsifies 'races'? Perhaps the same conspiracial West some are crying about, no? The thing is there is no such thing called racial or sub-racial. Is a Siberian an "Asian?" What about the wandering Sami of Northern Scandinavia? Are they "Asian" or "European?" The Inuit of North America, Iceland and Greenbay? Who are they? Is an Aboriginal Australian an African? Why aren't Tamils of Sri Lanka considered African if 'race' is the skin of your colour? What do an Omani living in Oman and a Vietnamese have in common? "Asian?" Ahahahahah It isn't that easy to bunch together humans, really simple. Like history, races are propagated by the those who seem to allege to know human physical diversity (with their limited minds) in a way, or those with the biggest mouths with unproven scientific classifications. A mellennia ago race was unheard of; people might have classified themselves with ethnicity or otherwise, but not categories a bunch of grouping of racial categorization. People should differentiate continental categorization and so-called 'racial' classification. PS, African Union is a brainchild project behind by Libya's Khadaafi, a so-called part-time Arab, full-time African, vice versa, and changing his unpredictable political shirt like an underwear. IP: Logged
Atheist Member Posts: 270 Registered: May 2005	posted 26 May 2005 06:33 AM It is funny how suddenly race doesn't mean a thing. I think it's too late to pretend there is no such thing as a race. Today's Egyptians that have dark complexion are left out in the society and are ruled out by the lighter whiter people of Egypt who basically had nothing to do with the foundation of the real Ancient Egypt. I have heard that except for Cairo where social elites live most other places are full of people of dark complexion that is what we called the black Africans. What’s so hypocritical about all this it’s suddenly nothing about race (in here in US if you look even little bit dark you are automatically categorize as minority) when it comes to the claim of the great Ancient Egyptian culture and that it had nothing to do with the darker brown people who started one of the first civilizations of mankind. While still up to this date people with darker skins are still discriminated at a social level. Whether it’s minor or major it’s still a flawed society where skin color still matters at a social level. I have friends of all colors and all race. I'm not going to pretend that we are all of one race and it's mainly due to the current society we live in. What I can do is make sure I'm fair to people of all races. P.S. Relaxx, I agree I first thought the discussion was going toward Africans diverse looks but I think it's slanting toward Somalis being different than other Africans. I'm going to accept that black people come in different faces but have seen Somalis myself many of them I have also seen in other parts of Africa. Good point. [This message has been edited by Atheist (edited 26 May 2005).] IP: Logged
mali Member Posts: 182 Registered: May 2005	posted 26 May 2005 08:57 AM quote: Originally posted by relaxx: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Waryaa: [B]"Relaxx, no need to post the darkest Somalis to prove your belief of Somalis being African" ----------------- ...I googled, went on BBC news web site for few minutes...I don't have time to pick pictures like some people on this forum...They look like people in the capital city...Come on...I met a lot of Somalis in Africa and I don't see any difference with the guys above unless you have a hidden agenda...By the way, mali is quite clear on the subject: he's African...If you had to pick between the Arab League and the African Union, what would you pick? mali, please save the brother, I think he either grew up abroad or is doing some soul searching...Anyway I don't think he's a real Somali... Relaxx Relaxx [This message has been edited by relaxx (edited 26 May 2005).] lol...relaxx im suprise ur asking that question... if u google it....Somalis part of Arab/african league/union .....youll get an answer it shouldent take less then 5 secs on 28.8 kbp modem.... short and simple.... SOMALIS PART OF...AU AND ARAB LEAGUE.... irrelavant Question to ask.... as is why is Nigeria Part of OPEC????? lol IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 26 May 2005 05:41 PM quote: Originally posted by mali: lol...relaxx im suprise ur asking that question... if u google it....Somalis part of Arab/african league/union .....youll get an answer it shouldent take less then 5 secs on 28.8 kbp modem.... short and simple.... SOMALIS PART OF...AU AND ARAB LEAGUE.... irrelavant Question to ask.... as is why is Nigeria Part of OPEC????? lol Well Mali, I googled:"Arab League Somalia", this is the very first record I got: Does Somalia belong to the Arab League? Fri. May 06, 2005 01:42 pm. Saudi Arabia government beheaded six Somali nationals last month for stealing cars. No one was ever killed by these young men’s actions, yet they were beheaded. Some of them were said to be guilt just because they were at the house when the police raided but never participated in any carjacking. What most people don’t know is that the men had already been lashed and served five-year prison term for the 1999 crime. They were expecting to be released, and they or their families were not told about the planned public beheadings. This action by the Saudi government left permanent scars on Somalis around the world. Some show their frustrations by staging peaceful demonstrations at Saudi embassies in western countries. Yesterday, a group of Somalis gathered in front of Saudi embassy in Hague, Holland. They showed their deep sympathy for the families of beheaded young men who died terribly without any legal representation in the hands of the Saudis. Amin Amir, Somalia’s most popular artist showed his grief in this artistic cartoon. The caption says it all. The new Somali government has its hands tied behind its back. It is expecting financial help from Saudi Arabia and they think it is not the right time to criticize publicly. Although Somalia belongs to the Arab League, Somalis who escaped the civil war to this country often get harsh treatment including long jail terms for staying in the country illegally. Saudi Arabia is not alone. Somali Internet discussion boards show many Somalis in oil rich Arab countries would rather stay in war-torn Somalia had they known what awaited them in these countries. Basically they have no rights whatsoever while their siblings who made to the west are treated like anyone else in their host countries. One exception is the United Arab Emirates (UAE) where Somalis have many businesses and Somali owned airline companies are allowed to land. The irony is Somalia belongs to the Arab League, which is hard to sell to the average Somali. Somalia now seems to be heading the right direction. After two years of reconciliation conference in Nairobi Kenya, a national parliament and government were setup last year. The government still operates out of Nairobi and is preparing to relocate to Somalia. East African nations pledged troops to help the government establish and train national armed forces. IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 26 May 2005 05:46 PM quote: Originally posted by Waryaa: As I wrote earlier, Somalis do not give a hoot what others think of them exactly. That was even recorded by the so-called Burtons, etc. There is no reason to choose a two well-timed multiple choice question of Arab League and African Union. If you want an honest answer from me, I would choose Somalia itself anyday since you didn't give me a third choice. Or perhaps United Nations, which, again, Somalia is a member of too. Or perhaps Nonaligned Movement, which again Somalia was a founding member. You need to expand your multi-choice questions. Who labels whom, by the way? Who exactly classsifies 'races'? Perhaps the same conspiracial West some are crying about, no? The thing is there is no such thing called racial or sub-racial. Is a Siberian an "Asian?" What about the wandering Sami of Northern Scandinavia? Are they "Asian" or "European?" The Inuit of North America, Iceland and Greenbay? Who are they? Is an Aboriginal Australian an African? Why aren't Tamils of Sri Lanka considered African if 'race' is the skin of your colour? What do an Omani living in Oman and a Vietnamese have in common? "Asian?" Ahahahahah It isn't that easy to bunch together humans, really simple. Like history, races are propagated by the those who seem to allege to know human physical diversity (with their limited minds) in a way, or those with the biggest mouths with unproven scientific classifications. A mellennia ago race was unheard of; people might have classified themselves with ethnicity or otherwise, but not categories a bunch of grouping of racial categorization. People should differentiate continental categorization and so-called 'racial' classification. PS, African Union is a brainchild project behind by Libya's Khadaafi, a so-called part-time Arab, full-time African, vice versa, and changing his unpredictable political shirt like an underwear. So much confusion...anyway long life to Somalia...or Somaliland...or Puntland? I wouldn't want to be in your shoes man... [This message has been edited by relaxx (edited 26 May 2005).] IP: Logged
Djehuti Member Posts: 1544 Registered: Feb 2005	posted 26 May 2005 06:03 PM From what I've heard, some Arabs still insult and call Somalis names like "black" or "slave" in Arabic! quote: One exception is the United Arab Emirates (UAE) where Somalis have many businesses and Somali owned airline companies are allowed to land. Ironically I have a friend whose family is from the UAE and his father seems to love Somalis, considering most of his friends are Somalis. IP: Logged
Djehuti Member Posts: 1544 Registered: Feb 2005	posted 26 May 2005 06:11 PM Anyway, you guys have gone way off topic for a while now! The point is Nefertiti here is Egyptian. Egypt is technically in the eastern side of the African continent, thus it's no surprising that the Egyptians proper are related to Eastern Africans of "Sub-Sahara" like Ethiopians and Somalis! End of Story!! [This message has been edited by Djehuti (edited 26 May 2005).] IP: Logged
multisphinx Member Posts: 371 Registered: Feb 2004	posted 26 May 2005 07:31 PM quote: Originally posted by Djehuti: Anyway, you guys have gone way off topic for a while now! The point is Nefertiti here is Egyptian. Egypt is technically in the eastern side of the African continent, thus it's no surprising that the Egyptians proper are related to Eastern Africans of "Sub-Sahara" like Ethiopians and Somalis! End of Story!! [This message has been edited by Djehuti (edited 26 May 2005).] And many egyptians still look like East Africans IP: Logged
ausar Moderator Posts: 4733 Registered: Feb 2003	posted 26 May 2005 08:29 PM Djehuti and Relaxx, most immigrants in Saudi Arabia get treated bad. I am sure you have heard how bad Saudis often treat their Filipina maids. Often using them for nothing more than sex toys. I also hear about the traffic of Ethiopian women across the various Arab countries. Have you not heard about these things. You know that Egyptian immigrants don't do too much better either. Since the oil boom in many Gulf Arab countries, Egyptian fellahin[both in the Delta and Upper Egypt] have migrated to various countries in the Gulf. Most complain about how badly they are treated. So much for Arab unity,huh? Emratis are not so bad of people compaired to Saudis,Kuwaits,and other rich snobby Gulf Arabs. The big fat Gulf Arabs spend most of their time trying to aquire wealth or young blonde white American/European concubines. Saudi Arabian men especially like to seduce young Egyptian women with their money. Did you hear about that incident of this Nigerian man that was paddled for having sex with a camel. This might have been a bogus charge just like the Somali incident. IP: Logged
mali Member Posts: 182 Registered: May 2005	posted 26 May 2005 08:38 PM quote: Originally posted by Djehuti: From what I've heard, some Arabs still insult and call Somalis names like "black" or "slave" in Arabic! Ironically I have a friend whose family is from the UAE and his father seems to love Somalis, considering most of his friends are Somalis. You are correct..djeh....its called...abid..slave...in arabic they use that word to there advantage..since somalis have never been the slaves of the arabs or any other... lol...the so called benadirs..the arab settlers were enslaved by the SOMALIS... Wooow...6 men beheaded..injustice...out of 10 million ppl.. relax....as optomistic as u r i am too... since No somali calls an arab his FRIEND.... and theyd rather befriend a KAFRE..non-believer or a Galoo...Westerner.... oo...and the comic..somalis know of him worldwide..famous journalist/activist...hes in the twin cities.... The war in somali has pushed somalis to flee..any where...and the arab nations are the last a somali wants to be..... ...as you know of there injustice towards non arabs or muslims....many somalis flee to Israel claiming there Yibir jewish decent..and the jewish community in ottawa have befriend the somalis....im not Pro israel....but the arabs have nobody....they sell out there own ppl..fellow arabs..what do you expect of them to treat any1 else..... currently somalia is building a stable infrustracture...and somalis will enjoy prosperity ....unlike the east... oil in the WRONG hands are Truly a Curse... unlike the arabs...saudi..somalia enjoys the liberalistic views ....brought about pre/islamiclly...and injustice as such the arabs have done among there own and to others is unheard of.... suffering from no debt..well 480 mill. included interest..compare to other nation..is the lowest..and somalia with the right management...will and has display there hunger for prosperity..even in anarchism...hunger is non-existant and commerce is water!! unlike there neighbors who have a full function governement...thank good for clanship...if it wasnt so it would be every man for himself...and death by war and famine seen by neighbors...would show... hopefully the gov will realize somalia needs no1 but the support of there own to succeed.. end of politics... bck to topic IP: Logged
Waryaa Member Posts: 72 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 03:07 AM I think the little 'league of anti-Arabs' joined themselves in this very thread. I am no fan of Arabs, neither of Africans, just in case you were wondering too. Speaking of that, Arabs welcomed Somalis to their lands for decades until they succumbed to the unfortunate civil war. It was Arabs who contributed their economy heavily in GDP by buying exclusively camels and other wildlives. Arabs invested in Somali lands some considerable investment. Somalis, being nomads by nature, used to wander around a lot of Arabs countries bilaa fiisa (without visa); even without a recognized central government, some Arab countries still do welcome with their almost non-recognized passports, especially Syria and sometimes Egypt, Sudan and Yemen. (Plus the non-Arabs Pakistan and Malaysia.) If it wasn't Arabs who spearheaded the failed UNISOM of early '90s, Somalia and her citizens would have starved to death, unbeknowst to internationally. That was led by fearlessly the then UN Secretary-General Boutros Boutros-Ghali, an Egyptian and the special UN envoy to Somalia Mohamed Sahnuun, an Algerian. Arab countries themselves didn't have substantial contribution the UN peacekeepers (for example Saudi Arabia only had a few hundred arms that never left from their compounds), however it was their financial. Also noted are Malaysia, Pakistan and Turkey, contributing heavily on their peacekeeping efforts. There are an increasing Somalis who are becoming anti-Arab for whatsoever reason, including the secessionist part of the country. If it wasn't Arabs, Somalia would have been a yester-year news and country--separated into small pieces of competing fiefdoms, exactly what some so-called African countries want to see and achieve, mainly Ethiopia and Kenya. That is why they are protagonists of current civil war, prolonging it to further that cause of tearing down Somalia like Soviet Union. They fear Somalia becoming once again a force to recon in the region and demanding the annexed Somali territories of Kenya and Ethiopia. They are wary and timid of this. For this, people can be fed with a people without a recognized government that can be deported to their respective countries, especially if the intended deportee is a citizen of that country. Somalia didn't--and still doesn't--have a central government for 15 years, her citizens now found widest of the world. The legacy of sad, unnecessary civil war. That is a bit fact most of you outsiders do not know (one even doubting my Somaliness, ). Our friend Djehuti (does it relate 'yahuud'? lol) said some Arabs call Somalis names like 'cabiid' (the Somali spelling of abiid), etc. Do you know what Somalis call Arabs? I won't say on this board, but to each to his own ignorant insulting. PS, the indigenous Somalis call the Somali Bantus (those are who originally hailed from Eastern African countries of Tanzania, Mozambique and others) jareer and adoon--nappy-haired and slave, respectively. This just demonstrated how each community insults one another with no respect to humanity and brotherhood. "Racism" or my-people-are-good-and-yours-aren't is a human nature. It will always be. [This message has been edited by Waryaa (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
mali Member Posts: 182 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 04:40 AM quote: Originally posted by Waryaa: I think the little 'league of anti-Arabs' joined themselves in this very thread. I am no fan of Arabs, neither of Africans, just in case you were wondering too. Speaking of that, Arabs welcomed Somalis to their lands for decades until they succumbed to the unfortunate civil war. It was Arabs who contributed their economy heavily in GDP by buying exclusively camels and other wildlives. Arabs invested in Somali lands some consierable investment. Somalis,b being nomads by nature, used to wander around a lot of Arabs countries bilaa fiisa (without visa); even without a recognized central government, some Arab countries still do welcome with their almost non-recognized passports, especially Syria and sometimes Egypt, Sudan and Yemen. (Plus the non-Arabs Pakistan and Malaysia.) It wasn't Arabs who spearheaded the failed UNISOM of early '90s, lead by fearlessly the then UN Secretary-General Boutros Boutros-Ghali, an Egyptian and the special UN envoy to Somalia Mohamed Sahnuun, an Algerian. Arab countries themselves didn't have substantial contribution the UN peacekeepers (for example Saudi Arabia only had a few hundred arms that never left from their compounds), however it was their financial. Also noted are Malaysia, Pakistan and Turkey, contributing heavily on their peacekeeping efforts. There are an increasing Somalis who are becoming anti-Arab for whatsoever reason, including the secessionist part of the country. If it wasn't Arabs, Somalia would have been a yester-year news and country--separated into small pieces of competing fiefdoms, exactly what some so-called African countries want to see and achieve, mainly Ethiopia and Kenya. That is why they are protagonists of current civil war, prolonging it to further that cause of tearing down Somalia like Soviet Union. They fear Somalia becoming once again a force to recon in the region and demanding the annexed Somali territories of Kenya and Ethiopia. They are wary and timid of this. For this, people can be fed with a people without a recognized government that can be deported to their respective countries, especially if the intended deportee is a citizen of that country. Somalia didn't--and still doesn't--have a central government for 15 years, her citizens now found widest of the world. The legacy of sad, unnecessary civil war. That is a bit fact most of you outsiders do not know (one even doubting my Somaliness, ). Our friend [b]Djehuti (does it relate 'yahuud'? lol) said some Arabs call Somalis names like 'cabiid' (the Somali spelling of abiid), etc. Do you know what Somalis call Arabs? I won't say on this board, but to each to his own ingorant insulting. PS, the indigenous Somalis call the Somali Bantus (those are who originally hailed from Eastern African countries of Tanzania, Mozambique and others) jareer and adoon--nappy-haired and slave, respectively. This just demonstrated how each community insults one another with no respect to humanity and brotherhood. "Racism" or my-people-are-good-and-yours-aren't is a human nature. It will always be. [This message has been edited by Waryaa (edited 27 May 2005).][/B] I agree with you for the most part... Definetly ill stricken infested Ethiopia and kenya want choas and destruction as the British colonist gave land to them as gifts that belong to Somalia!!! AU and the UN....are laughable fools....come on sending 15000 troops from Sundan(genocide in dafur) and couple thousand from ethiopia and get this Tanzania....Tanziania unlike kenya insists on sending there troops...forcefully....While there same troops Are butchering and raping there own....I certainly dont want to see fellow somalis butchered and raped as the Egyptians during the station of turkish troops and others...... I was disgusted and lol at the list that the AU soldiers must clear before deploying to somalia... HIV- was #1.... sonomous with Sub sahara africa....Except for SOMALIA.... Absolutely prior to war...and if it wasnt for the war...to no suprise Somalia toppal South Africa and be a Democracy to be reckin with.... kenya is playing around with somalia so too ethipia....15 attempts at installing a gov... a puppet gov...cabinets are war lords... its unfortunate but with the dictatorship...while who knows what it would have evolved to....life in Somalia was easy...and the funny thing he was building an arms...to take BACK the territories given as Gifts by the Colonisers....but failed at the Russians hands..... IP: Logged
mali Member Posts: 182 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 05:00 AM quote: Originally posted by Waryaa: Our friend [b]Djehuti (does it relate 'yahuud'? lol) said some Arabs call Somalis names like 'cabiid' (the Somali spelling of abiid), etc. Do you know what Somalis call Arabs? I won't say on this board, but to each to his own ingorant insulting. PS, the indigenous Somalis call the Somali Bantus (those are who originally hailed from Eastern African countries of Tanzania, Mozambique and others) jareer and adoon--nappy-haired and slave, respectively. This just demonstrated how each community insults one another with no respect to humanity and brotherhood. "Racism" or my-people-are-good-and-yours-aren't is a human nature. It will always be. [This message has been edited by Waryaa (edited 27 May 2005).][/B] i didnt see that...waryaa. i was thinking and i was like "thats a familar name" and then you spelt it out...and that was it.....yahuud but since you pointed out bantus.... We Are familiar on this forum of where the INHABIT africa...and since the bantus are not the inhabitors of eastern africa..somalia...it makes perfect sense why people would seperate from them..sense somali ports were a place where they shiped slave from the interior of east africa tanz kenya and so on to arab nations and elsewhere.....and then slaver being abolished and leaving all of them in a foreign land where indiginous have never seen or lived among expect what.....They were dropped in Juba area...where the raagnhwin live.. as obvious and distinct people as they were...they were a threat since all where animist and Distinct....Somalis did not slave them un like the west...So its blasphimy to point finger at the somalis..since the want to preserve there clan family culture and religion...Yes they were Slaves ...since the Arabs not only enslaved them unfortunate..but dropped them off in the middle of Somalia!!!They were not harmed...but stigmatized...they were segragated and alienated and the somalis wanted nothing to do with them....Since it is the land of Somalis....and they tried there best to assimilate into the somali culture...losing there language culture and history all in short as 300 yrs!!!!its amazing how ppl go about there ways to lose there own identity so they an fit in the dominate 1 and at they end and from the beginning being rejected...lastly the word jareer..means hard hair..which isnt false...and adoon means slave..which wasnt at that point false...lets not forget that somali refer to all including arabs as adoon.... glad that somalis universaly are proud as individuals and will never reject there own identity to be part of another... IP: Logged
Waryaa Member Posts: 72 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 05:48 AM quote: ...lets not forget that somali refer to all including arabs as adoon.... Saaxiib, Somalis don't call Reer Banaadiri adoon. This word is exclusively referred to Jareerweyne people (they reclaimed this word 'jareer' and now call themselves jareerweyne to make it less offending, which obviously is working). Speaking of slavery, I wonder why the Somalis were never enslaved themselves. Did the slave-traders try to enslave them and weren't as successful? I believe they tried, and as I know Somalis, a Somali would rather die and buried than be sold as a person. IP: Logged
mali Member Posts: 182 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 06:09 AM quote: Originally posted by Waryaa: Saaxiib, Somalis don't call Reer Banaadiri adoon. This word is exclusively referred to Jareerweyne people (they reclaimed this word 'jareer' and now call themselves jareerweyne to make it less offending, which obviously is working). Speaking of slavery, I wonder why the Somalis were never enslaved themselves. Did the slave-traders try to enslave them and weren't as successful? I believe they tried, and as I know Somalis, a Somali would rather die and buried than be sold as a person. slavery...occupation.colonialism...ect are all networks.... you need a backbone for all.... im definetly sure arab or any othere traders..portugees greeks indians persians and chinese..could not enslave the indiginous people that had traded with them...population was greater...and as you do have the mentality other then africans they werent willing to sell there fellow clansmen to other even if the didnt agree.. somalia..theres so many factors involved making it nearly impossible unless raided by otheres to enslave a town/village...As the Portugees burned down Mogduisho!! As the arabs centralized trade in the east....somalis delt with the arabs for over a milliniea...we expect nothing of them... The benadiir are a ..MINority..and are NOT YEMINI...but more decendents of Persian traders....as well as the brawain...from BRAVA..who are the decendants of the portugees...and are distict from benadiirs and somalis because of there multi color eyes and skin color... There were many indians and arabs from Yemen and the gulf that settled in somalia..but they were a minority 1% IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 06:13 AM quote: Originally posted by Waryaa: Saaxiib, Somalis don't call Reer Banaadiri adoon. This word is exclusively referred to Jareerweyne people (they reclaimed this word 'jareer' and now call themselves jareerweyne to make it less offending, which obviously is working). Speaking of slavery, I wonder why the Somalis were never enslaved themselves. Did the slave-traders try to enslave them and weren't as successful? I believe they tried, and as I know Somalis, a Somali would rather die and buried than be sold as a person. -------------------- If you read the thread about the Arab invasion of Egypt you will understand that nomad cattle herders are better prepared to fight than regular farmers...please read the thread...even in the Great Lake region there was no slavery because their kingdoms were ruled by cattle herders and warriors and I believe Somalis are warriors themselves. By nature cattle herders travel in many dangerous areas whereas sedentary people don’t realize the danger that is surrounding them and are not always prepared. That’s why many West African farmers and Bantus were more vulnerable. By the way some guys from Brava told me that Arab sailors used to raid Somali coasts to kidnap children and rape them. Relaxx [This message has been edited by relaxx (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
Waryaa Member Posts: 72 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 11:00 AM The majority Banaadiris today are descendants of Yemenis. That is no question about that. They were two kinds of Banaadiris: the recent arrivals and a long-time settlers. The recent arrival group used to dwell a district called "Bilaajo Carab" and they themselves were distinguished from others, calling themselves 'Camuudi.' The Camuudis were minuscule, and were not more than a few tens thousand people. They held dual citizenship--Somali and Yemeni. The government of Siad Barre regime expelled those few upon learning the communist South Yemen supported their communist fellow country Ethiopia on Somalia and Ethiopia war of 1977. After that few Camuudis remained. However, on the other hand, the real Banaadiris, who were the founders of what is known Muqdisho (Mogadishu), resided that peninsula for hundred years were left alone and contributed heavily to Somali arts and history. They aren't the descendants of Persians. That is a myth, if it is possible at that only a few Persions were among them. Also Baraawanis (Bravenese) weren't Portuguese, another perpuated myth found along Somalis. No body knows for sure can ascertain their history, but they are grouped together with Banaadiris since they intermingled with them. The raiding Portuguese never stayed more than a day or two on the raided towns, because the native used to attack them at the most vunerable times--nights, so they used to burn the towns and retreat to their boats. IP: Logged
Djehuti Member Posts: 1544 Registered: Feb 2005	posted 27 May 2005 12:09 PM quote: they use that word to there advantage..since somalis have never been the slaves of the arabs or any other... Actually it is a very big misconception that the Somalis were never enslaved, and it is not true!!! Even today many Somalis would claim as proof their supremacy over other black Africans is that they were never slaves while other Africans were. This is one of the excuses they use to degrade and enslave Africans like their Bantu neighbors who, I believe they call "adoon". This is also why some look down on African Americans who are descended from slaves. The truth is that Somalis were enslaved!! It was when the Arabs first encountered Somalis. Of course Somalis were not Muslim and became so when the Arabs introduced Islam. The Somalis were also of a different 'race' from the asiatic Arabs, as blacks from Africa. It is no surprise that the Arabs did enslave Somalis as well as peoples in Ethiopian and Eritrea. The slaves were called 'Abasi' or 'Habashi' and were sold back to Arabia, especially Yemen and Oman, or Persia, and some were sold as far east as India! In fact many Indian Rajas prized Habashi slaves as 'fit' strong workers. The slavery only ended when Islam became more prevalent, and I'm not sure but I think the Benadir had something to do with it. [This message has been edited by Djehuti (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
Djehuti Member Posts: 1544 Registered: Feb 2005	posted 27 May 2005 12:12 PM ... IP: Logged
ausar Moderator Posts: 4733 Registered: Feb 2003	posted 27 May 2005 01:12 PM Actually, most of the slaves going in and out of Arabia from Ethiopia were either Oromo,or they were Nilotic types that lived in southern Ethiopia. You know the Amharan elite have a history of exploiting these people and seeing themselves superior to them. Infact, many Amharan still today see theselves as superior ''red skinned'' Africans over other so-called ''black'' African groups. Most outsiders understand very little of this,and it does predate European intervention in the Horn of Africa. Somalis have never been slaves,but the same cannot be said for their Cushic cousins like the Beja or the Oromo who have been slaves both to the Amharan and to the Peninsula Arabs. Even my ancestors during the Middle Ages were made slaves and people who revolted were sold into slave markets across such exotic areas as Iraq. The bedouin Arabs raided our villages and were like virtual parasites. Cushic Ethiopian women still today are traded like slaves across countries like Libya,Saudi Arabia,Kuwait,and even Lebanon. Most are used as sex toys by wealthy and elite Arabs. This is sort of the secret kind of slave trade that still exist across the so-called Middle East. The irony of this all is that many people around the Gulf Arab countries have Bantu heritage. Some might even have a distant relative that was Cushic. Many populat customs in places like Oman have both Bantu and Cushic origins. Once such example is the zar ceremony that modern Omanis pratice. Zar is a Cushic custom. Know not all Bantus in Somalis actually came as slaves. The Swahili people actually have ports around parts of Somali. The Swahili themselves are mostly Bantu people. Somalis seem to forget this about the Somali Bantu. You know I tell people in Western countries about the complex of the Somalis but few believe me. Somalis consider themselves their own unique people. However, I think Somalis should acknowleadge they are Africans,because the Western world sees them as no better than the Bantus they disdain. To a Western no matter you are no less an African. IP: Logged
Super car Member Posts: 1717 Registered: Jan 2005	posted 27 May 2005 02:33 PM quote: Originally posted by ausar: Actually, most of the slaves going in and out of Arabia from Ethiopia were either Oromo,or they were Nilotic types that lived in southern Ethiopia. You know the Amharan elite have a history of exploiting these people and seeing themselves superior to them. Infact, many Amharan still today see theselves as superior ''red skinned'' Africans over other so-called ''black'' African groups. Most outsiders understand very little of this,and it does predate European intervention in the Horn of Africa.... Would make sense, considering how a lot of these Amharas and Somalis behave towards foreigners, especially those from other African countries. In Addis Ababa, Ethiopia, for example, people simply assumed other black Africans came from Ghana. They would call any black African they encounter, "Ghana" or something pronounced as "tookoor" (meaning black or very dark). I suppose the word "Ghana" took prominence in their vocabulary, during Nkrumah's time, who as an influential leader at the time, paid a visit to Ethiopia. [This message has been edited by Super car (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
bandon19 Member Posts: 149 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 04:09 PM i am answering for are somailis are raly africans and they are. they look just like my people in america and they might not be a 100 percent african but majority of blood is and where not a hudred percent to. If COULD I WOULD SHOW U A PICK OF MY MOTHER AND GRANDMOTHER AND SOME OTHER OF MY FAMILY MEMBERS AND THEY I LIGHTER THE THOSE GIRLS ON THAT PICTURE BUT THE HAVE AFRICAN FEATURES.but i can say the same for itailin and siccilans that there darker the russians cuasue italins are not one hundred percent europeans cause egypt and north africans mixed up with those people and north sudans are more africans then arabs. IP: Logged
lamin Member Posts: 376 Registered: Nov 2004	posted 27 May 2005 04:59 PM What is surprising is that despite the scientific analyses offered by posters like Rasol, Thought 2, SC, et al. the folkloric beliefs about the peoples of East Africa in terms of their genetic heritages seem impervious to change. It's either that such discussions are above those who post about East Africa or they just don't read them. And these seemingly interminable one-upmanship debates all remind one of what the European psychiatrist Freud called "the narcissism of minor differences". IP: Logged
Super car Member Posts: 1717 Registered: Jan 2005	posted 27 May 2005 05:28 PM As Ausar pointed out, the complex among these East Africans in question, goes way back. The Amharan elites have been known to spew propaganda that their presence in that region predates that of Cushitic speakers like the Oromo, while at the same time, claiming ties to the Arabian Peninsula, i.e., Sheba and all. This was of course used, to justify the Amhara elite's political leverage over the larger Oromo group. There are others, such those among the Somalis, who think that affiliation with Arabs, somehow strengthens their bond with the Prophet Muhammad. It is safe to say, that some of these folks handle these folklores with such religious intensity, that no rationality will be allowed to come in the way. In other words, it doesn't matter how much linguistic and genetic reality one throws at them! It is almost like trying to tell someone of a particular faith/religion, to accept scholarly or scientific facts over what his/her religious text states. [This message has been edited by Super car (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 06:38 PM quote: Originally posted by Super car: As Ausar pointed out, the complex among these East Africans in question, goes way back. The Amharan elites have been known to spew propaganda that their presence in that region predates that of Cushitic speakers like the Oromo, while at the same time, claiming ties to the Arabian Peninsula, i.e., Sheba and all. This was of course used, to justify the Amhara elite's political leverage over the larger Oromo group. There are others, such those among the Somalis, who think that affiliation with Arabs, somehow strengthens their bond with the Prophet Muhammad. It is safe to say, that some of these folks handle these folklores with such religious intensity, that no rationality will be allowed to come in the way. In other words, it doesn't matter how much linguistic and genetic reality one throws at them! It is almost like trying to tell someone of a particular faith/religion, to accept scholarly or scientific facts over what his/her religious text states. [This message has been edited by Super car (edited 27 May 2005).] Well this is a pattern I observe especially among people of the Horn of Africa...like this brown thing...I might offend some people...but except the Sans, you will never find non mixed African people who are uniformally brown...among non mixed Africans, there are dark skinned people, light skinned people, and tones between dark and light, but without foreign admixture like in Cap Verde, some parts of Eastern Africa, Dominican Republic, Madagascar,Guadeloupe, Martinique and other places, you can't find people uniformally brown. But I think the same people who view themselves as brown realize when they mingle with other nationalities that mixed people have the same skin tone.... Relaxx. IP: Logged
rasol Member Posts: 4255 Registered: Jun 2004	posted 27 May 2005 08:46 PM quote: I might offend some people...but except the Sans, you will never find non mixed African people who are uniformally brown... Relaxx.[/B] That's not offensive but it's also not true. First it's not true because literally there are virtually no black, or white or red or yellow people on earth. Second the idea of being uniforming brown as proof of being mixed is an oxymoron. That implies that 'non-uniformly' brown people [virtually all africans] are 'less mixed'. But how would 'less mixture' result in less uniformity? Well intended and bright people nevertheless remain trapped intellectually by outdated race concepts that they usually learned ultimately from 17th century Europeans like Blumenbach. Modern biology has moved along: We recognise that skin color is an adaptation to solar radiation levels and varies around the world with latitude and always has. One way in which skin color in ancient peoples can be hypothesised is by measuring limb ratios of skeletal remains - beyound the scope of this post, but suffice it to say that there is evidence that Africans varied in skin color from lighter brown [like the san] to very dark brown like the shilluk, since before there were ANY people living ANYWHERE except Africa. This notion is also supported by the fact that the humane genome is mostly African and humans have lived almost exclusively in Africa for most of our history - If Homo-sapiens-Africanus....ie modern man, did not have the ability to vary skin color in adaptation to climate you would not have all the variety that we see today. Neither racial purity nor racial mixture can be 'proven' by skin color. http://anthro.palomar.edu/adapt/adapt_4.htm * btw: notice that Somalia is NOT significantly different in ave. skin tone from the rest of tropical Africa - notwithstanding whitewashing propaganda, self delusions and highly selective pics meant to 'prove' otherwise. Skin color [This message has been edited by rasol (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
lamin Member Posts: 376 Registered: Nov 2004	posted 27 May 2005 09:10 PM Obviously the "Color Distribution Map" reflects what he had before the era of the "Expansion of Europe". I say this beacuse of the colours assigned to the map of Australia. Havig said that I am puzzled by the Northern European pigmenatation assigned to a relatively large swath of South West Africa(the tip) and North West Africa. Morrocans are generally olive-yellow in colour--with significant numbers of darker colours. IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 09:16 PM quote: Originally posted by rasol: That's not offensive but it's also not true. First it's not true because literally there are virtually no black, or white or red or yellow people on earth. Second the idea of being uniforming brown as proof of being mixed is an oxymoron. That implies that 'non-uniformly' brown people [virtually all africans] are 'less mixed'. But how would 'less mixture' result in less uniformity? Well intended and bright people nevertheless remain trapped intellectually by outdated race concepts that they usually learned ultimately from 17th century Europeans like Blumenbach. Modern biology has moved along: We recognise that skin color is an adaptation to solar radiation levels and varies around the world with latitude and always has. One way in which skin color in ancient peoples can be hypothesised is by measuring limb ratios of skeletal remains - beyound the scope of this post, but suffice it to say that there is evidence that Africans varied in skin color from lighter brown [like the san] to very dark brown like the shilluk, since before there were ANY people living ANYWHERE except Africa. This notion is also supported by the fact that the humane genome is mostly African and humans have lived almost exclusively in Africa for most of our history - If Homo-sapiens-Africanus....ie modern man, did not have the ability to vary skin color in adaptation to climate you would not have all the variety that we see today. Neither racial purity nor racial mixture can be 'proven' by skin color. http://anthro.palomar.edu/adapt/adapt_4.htm * btw: notice that Somalia is NOT significantly different in ave. skin tone from the rest of tropical Africa - notwithstanding whitewashing propaganda, self delusions and highly selective pics meant to 'prove' otherwise. Skin color [This message has been edited by rasol (edited 27 May 2005).] Rasol, At least 70% of Africans don't have foreign admixture...African skin tone vary from dark to very light, however I haven't seen African people who are uniformly brown except among Sans and Pygmies who are very light. By the way Bantus tend to be lighter than non Bantu Africans from West Africa, the Sahel or cattle herders from other parts of Africa. I travelled a lot in Eastern Africa, and mingled with people from the Horn of Africa. The first thing that you notice is the skin tone which shows some foreign admixture: red brown skin tone...You can't deny it and genetics confirm it...Feel free to elaborate... Relaxx [This message has been edited by relaxx (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
Super car Member Posts: 1717 Registered: Jan 2005	posted 27 May 2005 10:21 PM This was posted earlier: Relaxx, how would you describe this Nigerian's skin tone, in terms of color? And what about the following Borana, clearly with varying skin tones; do you consider this variation due to admixture or non-admixture? [This message has been edited by Super car (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 27 May 2005 10:48 PM quote: Originally posted by Super car: This was posted earlier: Relaxx, how would you describe this Nigerian's skin tone, in terms of color? And what about the following Borana, clearly with varying skin tones; do you consider this variation due to admixture or non-admixture? [This message has been edited by Super car (edited 27 May 2005).] My friends Super car and Rasol, in Africa there are very light skinned people, dark and people in the middle, but beside the Sans and Pygmies, the only place you find people with uniform skin is in the Horn of Africa. Personally when I observe that skin tone, it's very similar to a mixed person's skin tone. Let me be clearer, I lived many years in th Great Lake region and I noticed that when Tutsis or Himas mix with Russian women, Greek women or other Eurasian woman, their daughters or sons look like Ethiopians or Somalis… Relaxx IP: Logged
Super car Member Posts: 1717 Registered: Jan 2005	posted 27 May 2005 11:01 PM quote: Originally posted by relaxx: ... Let me be clearer, I lived many years in th Great Lake region and I noticed that when Tutsis or Himas mix with Russian women, Greek women or other Eurasian woman, their daughters or sons look like Ethiopians or Somalis… Relaxx Are you suggesting all Ethiopians and Somalis are a product of admixture? This goes back to that Borana photo, on which, I posed a question. [This message has been edited by Super car (edited 27 May 2005).] IP: Logged
multisphinx Member Posts: 371 Registered: Feb 2004	posted 27 May 2005 11:01 PM quote: Originally posted by relaxx: My friends Super car and Rasol, in Africa there are very light skinned people, dark and people in the middle, but beside the Sans and Pygmies, the only place you find people with uniform skin is in the Horn of Africa. Personally when I observe that skin tone, it's very similar to a mixed person's skin tone. Let me be clearer, I lived many years in th Great Lake region and I noticed that when Tutsis or Himas mix with Russian women, Greek women or other Eurasian woman, their daughters or sons look like Ethiopians or Somalis… Relaxx Actually i would say they would look egyptian. Many mixed ppl black and white ppl here in US can be mistaken for egyptian. They can fit right in the delta region. IP: Logged
lamin Member Posts: 376 Registered: Nov 2004	posted 27 May 2005 11:15 PM To Relaxx You are talking at cross purposes with Rasol et al here. They are talking scientifically--data collection, bioanthropological data, large sample analysis discussed in peer reviewed journals, etc.-- not casual, subjectively impressionistic opinion based on ideologically nurtured pseudo-racial and folkoric beliefs. Obviously genuine facts--as distinct from folkloric mythography--are more compatible with the scientific and sober approach. Constant talk of "mixed" versus "unmixed" unfortunately reflects a certain amount of naivete of the principles of bio-anthroplogy and molecular genetics. IP: Logged
truelight Member Posts: 86 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 02:47 AM quote: Originally posted by Djehuti: [b]The truth is that Somalis were enslaved!! It was when the Arabs first encountered Somalis. Of course Somalis were not Muslim and became so when the Arabs introduced Islam. The Somalis were also of a different 'race' from the asiatic Arabs, as blacks from Africa. It is no surprise that the Arabs did enslave Somalis as well as peoples in Ethiopian and Eritrea. The slaves were called 'Abasi' or 'Habashi' and were sold back to Arabia, especially Yemen and Oman, or Persia, and some were sold as far east as India! In fact many Indian Rajas prized Habashi slaves as 'fit' strong workers. The slavery only ended when Islam became more prevalent, and I'm not sure but I think the Benadir had something to do with it. [This message has been edited by Djehuti (edited 27 May 2005).][/B] What a big lie bisinka....says who the Somalis where slaved? joking right yea the joke is over slaved kulaha. Today most Ethiopians and Eritrea’s call themselves habash...and are know for it too not the Somalis.... on the other hand they seem to be proud of that wonder why if habash means slave i won't see the motive to be proud of that...you won't go to Somalia and hear the word habash that is used only for the Ethiopian’s and the Eritrea’s and for Arabs slaving somalis that is preposterous....so please don't let the lies fly around like that.......because all the things you said maybe correct but make sure to take out Somalia out of slavery...... Somalia and slavery just don’t go together. my ancestries where nobody’s slave nor will they ever be owned by a human being.. Naaaan…you must be kidding me about that part…don’t say that again seriously. IP: Logged
truelight Member Posts: 86 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 03:00 AM [This message has been edited by truelight (edited 28 May 2005).] IP: Logged
truelight Member Posts: 86 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 03:04 AM quote: Originally posted by truelight: [QUOTE]Originally posted by multisphinx: [b] Actually i would say they would look egyptian. Many mixed ppl black and white ppl here in US can be mistaken for egyptian. They can fit right in the delta region. relaxx do you mean by skin-tone or the features it is the features that make the people different....a person could be any color and not look like a egyptian or even any other race so skin-tone is nothing to compare with the features...blacks and whites mix don't look nothing like the egyptains..they are light skinned people with negroid featuers 90% of the mix black and white in america look like that.never seen a mixed person that could be mistaken for a egyptain thou. i could tell a somalia person with their features not the the color of their skin-tone. so relaxx why does the skin-tone matter if you have different features that don't go with your skin-tone....[/B][/QUOTE] IP: Logged
Waryaa Member Posts: 72 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 03:28 AM quote: The truth is that Somalis were enslaved!! Really? What proof do you have to validate this hearsay? One opinion that is universally agreed is that Somalis, to date, were never enslaved. Not in a day. Arabs tried, but weren't successful obviously, then moved to Swazili (which itself is an Arabic word) lands, readily enslaving the local people without a little resistance. Arabs did not leave Somalis because they were Muslim, no, boy. Swahili people, and increasingly the emerging Bajuni (after Arabs married Bantus, their offspring were called Bajunis) were becoming Islaminized and still enslaved. Somalis are not Habasho, never were. Their forefathers never were Habasho. In fact, Somalis are taken aback and insulted at the faint suggestion of Habash. To call them a habash, which later acquired the negative denotation of 'slave,' which further validates they knew the Habash people of Ethiopia's slave history. And to other people believing Somalis are the result of a 'mass admixture,' you aren't alone. Certainly, you aren't the first to suggest that. Others have come up with peculiar suggestions and non proved to be too true, including this recycled suggestion. Have you seen how Bajunis look like, the result of inter-marriage between Arabs and Bantus for hundred of years? Did they produce a "Somali" feature? Have a look. [img]http://pro.corbis.com/images/BV008661.jpg?size=67&uid={839ac8f7-0132-4d36-a891-5a1959546b87}[/img[ To those who aren't familiar with Bajuni people. Bajuni people live coastal and island towns of East Africa. From Brave and Kismaayo of Somalia, to Mombasa, Lamu and Malindi of Kenya to Zanzibar, and sometimes to all the way Mozambique. Mali, the Portuguese never burned Mogadishu. It was, on the contrary, the town of Brave (Baraawe), which they tried to take and they didn't. IP: Logged
multisphinx Member Posts: 371 Registered: Feb 2004	posted 28 May 2005 03:40 AM quote: Originally posted by truelight: relaxx do you mean by skin-tone or the features it is the features that make the people different....a person could be any color and not look like a egyptian or even any other race so skin-tone is nothing to compare with the features...blacks and whites mix don't look nothing like the egyptains..they are light skinned people with negroid featuers 90% of the mix black and white in america look like that.never seen a mixed person that could be mistaken for a egyptain thou. i could tell a somalia person with their features not the the color of their skin-tone. Well if you go to Egypt you know what i mean. African Americans even the ones that are not mixed get mistaken for native egyptians when they visit egypt, but thats mostly in Upper Egypt. Mixed African Americans can be mistaken for egyptians in the Delta Region. Many African Americans have experianced this even some on this forum whom went to visit Egypt. IP: Logged
truelight Member Posts: 86 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 03:49 AM good point waryaa and they say we have arab blood ....somalis are basiclly somalis we don't need white or arab blood to look like the ordinary somalis....seems like the arab bloob is no help to the bajun people mix of arab and buntu and you get bajun people... aren't brava people buntu and Portuguese mixed...that is one of the reason that they are light skinned and in a way have nappy hair they are sometimes called jareer caad IP: Logged
truelight Member Posts: 86 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 04:00 AM quote: Originally posted by multisphinx: Well if you go to Egypt you know what i mean. African Americans even the ones that are not mixed get mistaken for native egyptians when they visit egypt, but thats mostly in Upper Egypt. Mixed African Americans can be mistaken for egyptians in the Delta Region. Many African Americans have experianced this even some on this forum whom went to visit Egypt. are you serious with this beacuse i have been to arizona and to california san diego and in my 8 years living in the state never have i seen a african american that is not even mixed that looks like a egyptian.... most of then look like they are from south africa even the ones that are mixed as well look like a mixed south african rather then a egyptian.don't worry i know how a egyptains person looks like too.i seen them. i would love to see some pitures of this african americans that look like egyptains. also did you go to egypt. IP: Logged
multisphinx Member Posts: 371 Registered: Feb 2004	posted 28 May 2005 04:12 AM quote: Originally posted by truelight: are you serious with this beacuse i have been to arizona and to california san diego and in my 8 years living in the state never have i seen a african american that is not even mixed that looks like a egyptian.... most of then look like they are from south africa even the ones that are mixed as well look like a mixed south african rather then a egyptian.don't worry i know how a egyptains person looks like too.i seen them. i would love to see some pitures of this african americans that look like egyptains. also did you go to egypt. Give u some exp of famous mixed ppl, Rick Fox, Shemar Moore, Tony Parker of Spurs(from france but is mixed black white), Taimak Guari, etc... And yes i ve been to egypt. And thier is a differance between the elite class of Egypt and the Felahien. Many of the Egpyptians you seen in US are from elite class, ask they tell you either thier from Ciaro or Alex. [This message has been edited by multisphinx (edited 28 May 2005).] IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 07:22 AM quote: Originally posted by lamin: To Relaxx You are talking at cross purposes with Rasol et al here. They are talking scientifically--data collection, bioanthropological data, large sample analysis discussed in peer reviewed journals, etc.--[b] not casual, subjectively impressionistic opinion based on ideologically nurtured pseudo-racial and folkoric beliefs. Obviously genuine facts--as distinct from folkloric mythography--are more compatible with the scientific and sober approach. Constant talk of "mixed" versus "unmixed" unfortunately reflects a certain amount of naivete of the principles of bio-anthroplogy and molecular genetics.[/B] Lamin, with all due respect, please look at any genetical map of Africa and you will be able to understand what I mean...The ancient Asian Y chromosome gene among people from North Cameroon can be excluded, since it was a very old admixture, and they represent a very small fraction of the African people. Relaxx IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 07:30 AM quote: Originally posted by Super car: Are you suggesting all Ethiopians and Somalis are a product of admixture? This goes back to that Borana photo, on which, I posed a question. [This message has been edited by Super car (edited 27 May 2005).] That's why I mentioned the Tutsis and Himas, since they have the same phenotype but are isolated from non African people. What I meant is you can see some form of admixture among people from the Horn of Africa, which is logical since there are always gene flows between neighbouring regions... Relaxx Relaxx IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 07:32 AM quote: Originally posted by truelight: It's multisphynx who wrote that. Relaxx [This message has been edited by relaxx (edited 28 May 2005).] IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 07:40 AM quote: Originally posted by truelight: good point waryaa and they say we have arab blood ....somalis are basiclly somalis we don't need white or arab blood to look like the ordinary somalis....seems like the arab bloob is no help to the bajun people mix of arab and buntu and you get bajun people... aren't brava people buntu and Portuguese mixed...that is one of the reason that they are light skinned and in a way have nappy hair they are sometimes called jareer caad I don't think they have nappy hair....usually nappy hair tend to disappear when someon mix with an Arab or a European. Rellaxx [This message has been edited by relaxx (edited 28 May 2005).] IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 28 May 2005 09:45 AM [QUOTE]Originally posted by Waryaa: [B] And to other people believing Somalis are the result of a 'mass admixture,' you aren't alone. Certainly, you aren't the first to suggest that. Others have come up with peculiar suggestions and non proved to be too true, including this recycled suggestion. Have you seen how Bajunis look like, the result of inter-marriage between Arabs and Bantus for hundred of years? Did they produce a "Somali" feature? Have a look. ---------------------------- You will understand what I mean, if you read my intervention in the thread:"Erroneous E behold your biggest nightmare". Relaxx IP: Logged
Super car Member Posts: 1717 Registered: Jan 2005	posted 28 May 2005 02:45 PM quote: Originally posted by relaxx: That's why I mentioned the Tutsis and Himas, since they have the same phenotype but are isolated from non African people. What I meant is you can see some form of admixture among people from the Horn of Africa, which is logical since there are always gene flows between neighbouring regions... Relaxx Relaxx You still haven't answered my question, which was, are you suggesting that all Cushitic speakers and Semetic speakers of the African horn are the product of admixture? IP: Logged
relaxx Member Posts: 460 Registered: May 2005	posted 30 May 2005 06:21 PM quote: Originally posted by lamin: Obviously the "Color Distribution Map" reflects what he had before the era of the "Expansion of Europe". I say this beacuse of the colours assigned to the map of Australia. Havig said that I am puzzled by the Northern European pigmenatation assigned to a relatively large swath of South West Africa(the tip) and North West Africa. Morrocans are generally olive-yellow in colour--with significant numbers of darker colours. Many Sans live in South West Africa and they are sometime as light as some mulatto, I always say that Africans don't know themselves, since we have a very large continent and people are scattered...Many Africans wouldn't recognize the Sans as Africans, especially uneducated people. Even people from West Africa or Central Africa view people like the Fulani or Tutsi as people who are not real Africans, although genetics show that they have the same genes as other Africans. However my point is that foreign admixture among some people of the Horn of Africa can be seen through their skin tone. Many still do have an African skin tone, especially among the Oromos, Somali, and even more among the Afars and the Borana. Maybe my previous post was too vague. Relaxx IP: Logged

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