quote:Originally posted by Dzosser: It was the first time in my entire fvcking 60 + yrs. for me to ever see such an organised crowd of Egyptians patiently waiting in a queue to vote for anything.
I went past everyone (senior citizenship has finally paid me back), got some dirty looks from folks in their fifties who looked older than myself, some elderly folks were too old to climb up those idiotic stairs taking us to the polling hall, they were on crutches and volunteers (young tahrir-like ppl.) were helping them up and down again.
It was really quite an experience for all of us to be back to life.
I voted nay..I don't want to please the Salafis nor do I ever want to see them in power.
I took my 80 year old mother in law and her 88 year old sister. I tried to usher her to the head of the queue as did the 'shabab' in the men's queue. She refused, saying she was shabab like them! Actually over 50% of the women were over 60. Fortunately the queue moved fast and everyone was very good humoured. Many mutterings of 'first time' from the old people, possibly last for many of them!
Posts: 1039 | From: Cairo | Registered: Sep 2002
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I voted Yes. It was an easy job. I voted at 9:30 AM. I managed to remove the red ink in my finger.
Posts: 277 | Registered: Aug 2010
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"This Elbaradei" did nothing wrong trust me.
You just have animals living in your country. It doesn't matter which path Egypt will take you will always have to deal with uncivilized folks, their mentality won't change. And now that everyone is free and able to voice his opinion - rocks are flying. Great accomplishment to try to hurt a respected 68-year-old scientist and diplomat.
I am sure that Mubarak thugs will be blamed for doing this like for everything else too. Yeah just stick your heads in the Egyptian sand and believe everything you want to believe .....
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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We have animals here.. Animals feel, Love and hate ..
My Analysis for this incident is that there was a clash between the bodyguards of This Elbaradei and the crowd who comes to vote..
This Elbaradei has no popularity here in Egypt. He will not be a strong candidate. I believe Our next president is Amr Moussa.( thumb up to him)
Posts: 277 | Registered: Aug 2010
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quote:Originally posted by tigerlily_misr: "This Elbaradei" did nothing wrong trust me.
You just have animals living in your country. It doesn't matter which path Egypt will take you will always have to deal with uncivilized folks, their mentality won't change. And now that everyone is free and able to voice his opinion - rocks are flying. Great accomplishment to try to hurt a respected 68-year-old scientist and diplomat.
I am sure that Mubarak thugs will be blamed for doing this like for everything else too. Yeah just stick your heads in the Egyptian sand and believe everything you want to believe .....
Tigerlily, whether or not it was Mubarak's thugs today, it was certainly Mubarak's thugs in elections, referendums and protests for the last 30 years, and El Baradei was a victim along with any other opposing voices. That is historical, recorded fact.
And regarding animals... is your country - or any other - free of violent disruptive elements? What happened today was horrible, especially as everyone was so pleased at how respectful and organised the queuing crowds were in every area. This incident was an exception, and hopefully these exceptions will become fewer as time goes on.
Your perspective is difficult to understand. Do you believe that some peoples are genetically incapable of ruling themselves?
Posts: 1039 | From: Cairo | Registered: Sep 2002
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I am wondering what is the reason for that? This Albaradei must have made something wrong. Oh Tareq, think what you just wrote. Last year, when I spoke to Egyptian friends about the killing, by police, of that poor guy in Alex, they said exactly the same thing.
Maybe now in the coming years [or maybe decades?] people here will instinctively think that maybe a person is 'innocent until proven guilty'. BTW I think many countries in the world would be proud to have a [real] Nobel peace prize winner as a presidential candidate. Or would you rather have a man who thinks that if someone is attacked, they must have made something wrong... ???
Posts: 1399 | From: alexandria | Registered: Jan 2002
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I fully believe that there is no reason for such attack except if there is a mistake done by albaradei.
And not because he had a nobel prize, he get the full respect if he violates some lines of egyptian culture.
and I will feel respect and sympathy for him if he went to another place to vote. but albaradei left voting. Is that logic? He is supposed to be a president and he was weak and escaped and did not vote or tried to vote in other place. He could call the armed force to allow him to vote but he did not. What kind of a president is that?
This makes me think It is an organized incident done by albaradei himeself to draw attention..
I do not know really. These are the things I think of. you may agree or disagree.
Posts: 277 | Registered: Aug 2010
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I can only speak as an outsider, as an Egyptian, your attitudes will carry more weight than mine in the future of your country; but in the time I have lived here and witnessed or heard about some pretty bad things, it has disturbed me that there really is a tendency to try to justify physical violence against fellow Egyptians on the grounds that 'they must have done something bad..' [Assaulting an old genleman in public is NOT bad?] If hurting people is ok, without any explanation is ok with you, fine, bring back the security police, legalise police brutality. He could call the armed force to allow him to vote ????? Or in fact, do not allow these 'bad?' people to take part in elections, imprison them, and bring back the old regime.
Posts: 1399 | From: alexandria | Registered: Jan 2002
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Back in my youth when I did hands-on politics, the old people voting for our party used to phone up the opposition and use their free transport to the polling station and then vote for us (so limiting amount of transport available for the other side's old ladies)
Posts: 5593 | From: Egypt | Registered: Dec 2005
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The up side of a Yes win is that all the people who voted yes for stability and progress will hopefully shut up and stop complaining in fear of being mocked.
Posts: 1044 | Registered: Nov 2009
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I don't think the Yes vote had much to do with the MB. A lot of people who do not want the MB still voted Yes for reason of fear and most of them had no clue what the amendments were and what they meant. The amendments remind me of Mubarak's first and second speeches after Jan25, pure insult to our intelligence.
Posts: 1044 | Registered: Nov 2009
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Honestly I don't care who is in power in six months. If the MB will have a huge influence in Egypt's future politics, society, life in general so be it. Really it does not matter - what matters is what the majority of Egyptians want .
Mubarak and inside stability which incl. suppression of the MB wasn't right so see what you are getting now. Let the Islamists take over the country. Good luck with that.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Tareq: This makes me think It is an organized incident done by albaradei himeself to draw attention..
You are really something I have to tell you..... Creating some conspiracy theory here, aren't we????
I bet you don't even trust your own mother.
quote:Originally posted by Tareq: I do not know really. These are the things I think of. you may agree or disagree.
I fully disagree. The attack on El Baradei was such a nasty and unacceptable thing to do.
You know I - and I am not even Egyptian - sent an apology off to ElBaradei via Twitter. He probably will never read it but anyway. I actually apologized for some Egyptian dumbasses who think it's cool to attack an elderly man with rocks because of different political views.
Is this how democracy is supposed to start in your country? If so you will never have it, no democracy for all, no human rights, no freedom etc. it will all only be kalam.
And honestly I don't believe in any change at all in the Egyptian mentality. As I said before perhaps after two generations. Actually it will get even harder before it will get easier. Just remember that.
Oh and another thought before I log off for today: Your own people are deeply devided which hinders any possibility of a true democratic society in which all people will live equally. Unity is the key and unfortunately it's just not there.
Posts: 30135 | From: The owner of this website killed ES....... | Registered: Feb 2004
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When one looks at the number of people who participated in the revolution and the number of people who voted it becomes very clear that large majority of the population has zero influence. All that is needed is a strong minority to make things happen.
Posts: 1044 | Registered: Nov 2009
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quote:Originally posted by this: When one looks at the number of people who participated in the revolution and the number of people who voted it becomes very clear that large majority of the population has zero influence. All that is needed is a strong minority to make things happen.
I noticed this as well. And what about the illiterate, the ones who can't read. I've seen some of the ballots, they must've had at least a couple of thousand words.
So who do you think are the people who are actually voting?
Posts: 2275 | Registered: Dec 2009
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I've always belonged to a miniscule minority, so what the heck, may the MB rule. Posts: 3219 | From: Wisdom comes with age, but sometimes age comes alone. | Registered: Nov 2005
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quote:Originally posted by this: When one looks at the number of people who participated in the revolution and the number of people who voted it becomes very clear that large majority of the population has zero influence. All that is needed is a strong minority to make things happen.
I noticed this as well. And what about the illiterate, the ones who can't read. I've seen some of the ballots, they must've had at least a couple of thousand words.
So who do you think are the people who are actually voting?
I read about an incident where voters were seriously confused and messed up their ballots because they could not find the Crescent and Camel symbols that they were used to. The NDP had always used those symbols and illiterate people just looked for them.
It appears that there are mix of reasons why people went out to vote and I personally thin it was mostly because it is different this time. They believe this time their vote will mean something but I think the vast majority of the voters had no clue what the issues were. That was not limited to illiterate people as I know of highly educated men and women who voted on gut feeling. There wasn't enough time to engage in debates and not enough time to correct misinformation. The logic that some government official used was just laughable.
Posts: 1044 | Registered: Nov 2009
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If 1 million people vote for A and 1million+1 vote for B, then B wins and you could say maybe 2 million person's votes made no difference - but who is to say which 'the one' was that did?
In fact Isaac Asimov who wrote a science fiction story published in 1955 called "Franchise" set in some future where 'they' had figured out a way of identifying 'the one' whose vote was the one that counted for a given election so only one vote would be cast.
“Franchise” is a short story about election polling in the future by the grandmaster of science fiction, Mr. Isaac Asimov. Originally published in If, the Science Fiction Magazine in 1955, this story was almost certainly inspired by the correct prediction of the 1952 presidential election by one of the original computers, the UNIVAC, designed by J. Presper Eckert and John Mauchly.
This concept was the inception point of Asimov's Multivac, the powerful Big Brother style computer that is featured for the first time in Franchise but makes many more appearances in Asimov's literature. In essence, Multivac is such a powerful computing device that it can filter through information fed to it and make decisions based on very limited inputs that factor in all available data.
In the Franchise the concept of electoral polling is taken to a new height (or low) by means of this awesome computing power. In essence, Multivac has taken away the necessity of voting by its constant interaction with social networks (far before such intractive media networks actually existed, another innovative Asimov concept) and demographic needs that make it understand what the people want and how to best decide who should be elected, from local school boards to the President of the United States.
That last piece of information that Multivac must utilize is the human element which emphasizes the randomness of the human mind. Inexplicably, Multivac apparently can gather enough of that data from a brief survey of one individual, and so that individual in essence through their input decides every election nation-wide. As it is explained each campaign season Multivac picks out one representative sample, and then the election is forever after known by that individual's name. So if John Smith was the selection, that year became the Smith Election and all things good or bad are then assigned to Smith.
Posts: 5593 | From: Egypt | Registered: Dec 2005
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1-Not all yes voters are illiterate. and not all illiterate are uncultured and ignorant.
2-Not all Yes voters got flour and oil from MB
3- 25 jan youth do not represent the majority of Egyptian. We have a common target which to drop Mubarak oppression. But We do not agree on All what the 25 jan youth say and declare.
4- I fully disagreed to take one from each party to rule Egypt. This is just an insane stupid idea. It must be only one party to Rule.
Thankfully, We had a vote and we had a say.
Posts: 277 | Registered: Aug 2010
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Our TV said 40% didnt vote....to me that doesnt sound a good start...what is the turn out in previous elections/referendums?
Posts: 314 | From: australia | Registered: Jul 2010
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Absolutely disgusting. This guy hasn't done nothing wrong to his country or his people.
Some Egyptians just need to be kept on a fUcking leash.
Did you really just say that? Really??!!
I don't agree with her "Some Egyptians just need to be kept on a f*cking leash" rhetoric.
But stoning el-baradei should be investigated, suspects need to be arrested and tried in court.
Keep in mind tigerweed's recent comments don't fall to far from this type of "keeping Egyptians on a leash" comment. And this is from a person who's sig line is "left my heart in Egypt". Possibly tigerweed gets off on being leashed and whipped. Posts: 2280 | Registered: Oct 2009
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Well Australia has compulsory voting and manages over 90%...I can remember people even going to the old peoples home so they could make a vote even if they were too sick to get there. Seems a high amount of abstainers to me....I thought seeing whats happened it would be a high turnout.
Posts: 314 | From: australia | Registered: Jul 2010
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quote:Originally posted by tigerlily_misr: Mind you the original article which was published by the Washington Post was removed.
Which is why I post the entire article. WHen they publish articles and then get negative feedback from the "powers that be" whomever they might be, conservatives end up asking to have articles filled with comment and facts pulled from the internet.
Posts: 2280 | Registered: Oct 2009
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just been reading about voter turnout in Wiki....lol...seems it may be genetic!!!!
'In addition to the twin study method, scholars have used gene association studies to analyze voter turnout. Two genes that influence social behavior have been directly associated with voter turnout, specifically those regulating the serotonin system in the brain via the production of monoamine oxidase and 5HTT.'
posted
One of my friends said she didn't vote because the queues were too long. Another niqabi friend believes that governments are chosen by God and voting is unislamic. Maybe there are a fair few who genuinely couldn't make up their mind and are leaving it up to those who could? 60% turnout is on a par with the US presidential elections and 60-70% seems to be the going rate for non-compulsory democracies (India being the world's largest I believe and possibly most comparable with Egypt in terms of socio-economic factors (unresearched comment by me)) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Turnout.png
PS Other friends did vote, some yes, some no. Most of those that did commented on how good it felt do feel that they did have a genuine choice.
Posts: 5593 | From: Egypt | Registered: Dec 2005
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Yes Shanta...but turnout is pretty low in US...on that list in Wiki they were at the bottom....
Posts: 314 | From: australia | Registered: Jul 2010
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The numbers released would not add up to 80%.
The total number of voters 18 million and five hundred and thirty seven thousand and nine hundred and four.
Posts: 1044 | Registered: Nov 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Glassflower: Well Australia has compulsory voting and manages over 90%...I can remember people even going to the old peoples home so they could make a vote even if they were too sick to get there. Seems a high amount of abstainers to me....I thought seeing whats happened it would be a high turnout.
Enabling elderly voters to vote will be costly and will invade their privacy. Australia has the budget to pay for this, and the respect and safeguards for privacy and civil rights. Egypt has not shown the same respect for privacy and protection of civil rights, therefore I'd be against this arrangement.
I don't know many Egyptians who would enjoy an agency of the government arriving at their door for any reason.
Posts: 2280 | Registered: Oct 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Glassflower: Yes Shanta...but turnout is pretty low in US...on that list in Wiki they were at the bottom....
US doesn't have compulsory voting. why bother comparing the US to Australia?
Voter turn out in national elections in my state is over 75%, thats non-compulsory voting.
This thread is on Egypt, you can chose to compare Egypt to your nation, but please don't drag your views of America into the discussion. You don't have the numbers.
Posts: 2280 | Registered: Oct 2009
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quote:Originally posted by Shanta Gdeeda: 60% turnout is on a par with the US presidential elections and 60-70% seems to be the going rate for non-compulsory democracies (India being the world's largest I believe and possibly most comparable with Egypt in terms of socio-economic factors (unresearched comment by me)) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Turnout.png
Yup non-compulsary voting is the key indicator.
At the same time that wikipage doesn't indicate where they got the data from, data methodology or anything.
junk statistics, is junk without showing how those stats came to be.
Posts: 2280 | Registered: Oct 2009
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Well dearest Metinoot this site points to poor voting rates in US too...http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763629.html... You are right I dont want to get into a row with u about America,that would be stupid, but I think the point is that if voter turn outs arent high enough is a democracy viable and how many people even understand on what they are voting about? Id almost say from what we see here, America isnt much of a democracy anymore...and Id hate for Egypt to go down corrupt path America has where a president can get in on about 20% and then blow up heaps of countries like Bush...(shudders even at the thought of the creep)
If there wasnt compulsory voting here I dont reckon half the country would bother to vote...seems like thats about the same in lots of countries.
Posts: 314 | From: australia | Registered: Jul 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Glassflower: Well dearest Metinoot this site points to poor voting rates in US too...http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763629.html... You are right I dont want to get into a row with u about America,that would be stupid, but I think the point is that if voter turn outs arent high enough is a democracy viable and how many people even understand on what they are voting about? Id almost say from what we see here, America isnt much of a democracy anymore...and Id hate for Egypt to go down corrupt path America has where a president can get in on about 20% and then blow up heaps of countries like Bush...(shudders even at the thought of the creep)
If there wasnt compulsory voting here I dont reckon half the country would bother to vote...seems like thats about the same in lots of countries.
Wow, thats predictable.
the infoplease website doesn't state how it compiled its data, the data sample, the data methodology, or anything.
and what infoplease uses as a source doesn't even compile voting data: http://www.fec.gov/
The FEC is for "administrating and enforcing federal campaign finance laws" not compiling statistical data on how many people vote.
Right now I am not making any vicious comments on Australia, nor quoting crap sources of the wrong statistical information.
Most of what you stated in the quoted post has nothing to do with voter turnout and everything to do with "Anti-Americanism".
Yet I take the high road! Why are Americans expected to turn the other cheek when Anti-Americanism raises its ugly head? Because Americans improved themselves over the land of our ancestors. Posts: 2280 | Registered: Oct 2009
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ok then darlin' is there a site or statistic you do find acceptable? A Metinoot Certified site? If your state is up to about 75% (but no link) shows there must be some pretty poor voting states.
Posts: 314 | From: australia | Registered: Jul 2010
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quote:Originally posted by Glassflower: ok then darlin' is there a site or statistic you do find acceptable? A Metinoot Certified site? If your state is up to about 75% (but no link) shows there must be some pretty poor voting states.
You are the one who made the assertion. I know the voting statistics of my state.
I didn't bother investigating the "90% compulsary voting" stat for australia because I am not out to tar and feather your nation.
Why don't you take the time to apologize for your anti-american remarks and I'll dig up the voting stats for my state.
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